TheBigQuestion Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 It's interesting to me that you aren't able to make your points without childish put downs BigQuestion. YOu continue to carry on with name calling as the main event to your posts. I'm fine with you disagreeing with my opinion. But you can't seem to do it without a lot of name calling being your filler as you attempt to pass it off as intellectually insightful discussion. You only make yourself look bad. Disagree with me if you disagree with me. But do so in the "intellectually honest" and mature way you seem to pride yourself. Because I have to tell you, none of your responses in this tread currently reflect that. I already explained everything I had to say in my previous post to you. Choose to ignore it all you want. The orginal question to this post didn't have anything to do with asking men about what type of bodies they liked. It was about sexy underwear. A few men took this "oppurtunity" to highlight the importance a woman's body plays over any other factors. By the way, you ignored my question. If a man and woman where to the point of her wearing sexy underwear for him, doesn't that imply that he already finds her sexy? Suggestions in this thread about getting gym memberships and eating right were not done in the spirit of really caring about women and their "health". It was done in the spirit of attempting to motiviate/manipulate women (mind you women that the men here don't even know the shape of their bodies or if they already work out or eat right) into working on their bodies not because it would enhance a woman's life but because of what men want out of women and what men want women to be. Lets not pretend anything differently. We both know that the comments here made about women's bodies weren't made because the men here are thinking about women first. They were made because men are thinking about themselves first. And since the original question of the OP had nothing to do with what men thought of women's bodies, only if sexy underwear was nice to them, I find you pretty darn hypocritical to attack me for only commenting on something where other men decided to take it. BigQuestion, I don't have much of an issue with you disagreeing with me. I have an issue with your continued put downs while pretending your responding intellectually. Learn to have a conversation, even one you might disagree with, without feeling like you need to make the majority of your post about put downs instead of conversation. Your opinion will be much more respected that way. That's a hell of a lot to assume just from a few sentences that other men posted. I'll let them speak for themselves as to whether they agree with you. There was a time that I tried disagreeing with you without questioning your intelligence or whether you have an agenda. Nothing was different back then. You still took incredible offense to most of what I said, whether to you personally or to women in general. Just as you did to others in this thread, you would make wild inferences about what my motivations were in posting something. You would continuously claim that I had said a whole bunch of things that I clearly did not, you would continuously assert nonexistent facts, all to the point where it was virtually impossible to have any sort of discussion with you that didn't end with your proverbial kicking and screaming. You DID have all sorts of issues with me disagreeing with you, however mildly, without me asking you about how many screws you are missing. I don't post here to have my opinions "respected" by you or anyone else. I don't seek that type of validation on message boards.
Disenchantedly Yours Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 I can't really speak for tman, but geesh, DY, I honestly think you completely misappropriated his (completely fine) statement of personal opinion. If you genuinely want to argue with men spouting misogynist stuff, tman is not the guy to go after. Which comments did I misappropiate? His statements wheren't just personal opinion. He put me down repeatidly. I said it before. I don't mind him disagreeing with me. But no one here deserve to be repeatidly called stupid and variations of stupid. Which he repeatidly engaged in.
Wolf18 Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 Hahahahahaha I don't wear panties too often so I can't contribute to your charity.[/Quote] Do you wear a gimp mask when you write these genital torturing messages on your computer?
Disenchantedly Yours Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 TheBigQuestion That's a hell of a lot to assume just from a few sentences that other men posted. I'll let them speak for themselves as to whether they agree with you. I think my assumptions are probably more honest then what some men might admit. There was a time that I tried disagreeing with you without questioning your intelligence or whether you have an agenda. Nothing was different back then. You still took incredible offense to most of what I said, whether to you personally or to women in general That's not how I remember it BigQuestion. Since it's my word vs yours and your talking about past history, maybe it's best to leave it in the past. In the present, you not so subtley referred to me several times now as being varying levels of stupid. Just as you did to others in this thread, you would make wild inferences about what my motivations were in posting something. Yes, I made an inference about your motivations on posting to *me* specifically when most of your post to me was to mock my intelligence. But didn't you make your own inferences Big? t's okay for you to make inferences about me and my motivations when you say things like, "Your sole purpose on this board is to stir the pot regarding women's body issues." But it's not okay for me to say that the only reason you responded to me was to put me down? Especially since a good chunk of your responses to me involve calling me stupid in some way? You would continuously claim that I had said a whole bunch of things that I clearly did not' Directly qouted from you: "Well, you're either an intellectual lightweight, or you're intellectually dishonest. " "The only people out there who are as dense as you are, who continuously warp everything to fit into the lens of their wildly preconceived notions, are usually either idiots or they have agendas that blind them from being able to accept anything others say at face value." "you would continuously assert nonexistent facts, all to the point where it was virtually impossible to have any sort of discussion with you that didn't end with your proverbial kicking and screaming." And yet, I haven't once called you stupid or "intellectually lightweight" but I'm the one kicking and screaming. By the way, your choice of using "kicking and screaming" is just another way you attempted to put me down. Do I need to point out any more examples of the words you used to allude to what you consider my lack of intelligence? I don't post here to have my opinions "respected" by you or anyone else. I don't seek that type of validation on message boards. Respecting what others write and having your own comments respected isn't a matter of seeking validation on a message board.
Els Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 Which comments did I misappropiate? His statements wheren't just personal opinion. He put me down repeatidly. I said it before. I don't mind him disagreeing with me. But no one here deserve to be repeatidly called stupid and variations of stupid. Which he repeatidly engaged in. I didn't see tman call you stupid at all. Are you perhaps mistaking him for the poster you're arguing with currently? Regardless, not interested in getting into a page-long debate with you, DY, simply putting it out there that I think there's nothing wrong with tman's preference. He is a huge fitness nut himself, so it isn't even hypocritical of him to want his gf to be athletic.
Disenchantedly Yours Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 I didn't see tman call you stupid at all. Are you perhaps mistaking him for the poster you're arguing with currently? Regardless, not interested in getting into a page-long debate with you, DY, simply putting it out there that I think there's nothing wrong with tman's preference. He is a huge fitness nut himself, so it isn't even hypocritical of him to want his gf to be athletic. My bad. Yes, I am mistaking Tman for TheBigQuestion. I thought "tman" was a nickname you had for BigQuestion. Yes, Tman never called me stupid. I think in most cases, men aren't advocating gym memberships and eating right for women because they care so much about women's health.
Wolf18 Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 I think in most cases, men aren't advocating gym memberships and eating right for women because they care so much about women's health. So what? Is it really so much to ask women not to be fat? It's the only physical standard most men have, and most American women can't even do that You think women like men with high paying jobs for their "ambition" like some girls on here say ? You think women like men with abercrombie and fitch bodies because it shows dedication and will? You think women like famous people for their "confidence"? Women aint any different. I'm not going to sit here and argue that men want women to be physically active just for their health, but you better concede that women do it too.
xxoo Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 I think in most cases, men aren't advocating gym memberships and eating right for women because they care so much about women's health. What is wrong with being attracted to people who look healthy, strong, and active? These seem like good criteria to me.
OnyxSnowfall Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 What's wrong is that people are incapable of monogamy.
Art_Critic Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 Anybody remember the OP ? Guys do you even notice sexy underwear ?
Els Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 My bad. Yes, I am mistaking Tman for TheBigQuestion. I thought "tman" was a nickname you had for BigQuestion. Yes, Tman never called me stupid. I think in most cases, men aren't advocating gym memberships and eating right for women because they care so much about women's health. I'm sorry that your experience with men has demonstrated this. I am perfectly sure that some men genuinely are interested in the health aspect, however - and yes, some do like the aesthetic aspect of it as well. The entire topic of this thread is sexy lingerie - something women spend time and money on solely for aesthetic benefits. Tman is saying that to him, that time and money is better spent in a gym because in his opinion it confers more aesthetic benefits than sexy lingerie. That's entirely his personal preference, and he is completely entitled to it given that he himself is athletic, which is a huge step up from the overweight men clamoring for model-like gfs. Why flame him for it?
Els Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 That's affirmative. The better the quality and style, the less likely they are to come off, too. That's part of the beautiful agony thing Damnit. Mine must have been very poor in quality and style, then!
Disenchantedly Yours Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 I'm sorry that your experience with men has demonstrated this. I am perfectly sure that some men genuinely are interested in the health aspect, however - and yes, some do like the aesthetic aspect of it as well. The entire topic of this thread is sexy lingerie - something women spend time and money on solely for aesthetic benefits. Tman is saying that to him, that time and money is better spent in a gym because in his opinion it confers more aesthetic benefits than sexy lingerie. That's entirely his personal preference, and he is completely entitled to it given that he himself is athletic, which is a huge step up from the overweight men clamoring for model-like gfs. Why flame him for it? Except the question wasn't about where money was better spent. It was simply if men liked lingerie. Then a few men decided to chime in and talk about the quality of woman's body over actually answering the question about lingerie. Which wasn't what the OP asked. The OP doesn't care what Tman likes concerning women's bodies. Further, it's presumpitous of the men here to assume that the OP isn't fit to begin with. She didn't ask for advice on her health. Suggestion women are better off spending their money on gym memberships and healthy food because of what *he* as a man finds attractive is the same thing as women suggestion men are better off working late nights to make more money so they are more attractive. And we no how well statements about men and their money go over around here.
Feelsgoodman Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 What is wrong with being attracted to people who look healthy, strong, and active? These seem like good criteria to me. I'm guess that DY herself does not fall in the "healthy, strong and active" category, which is why she's got her victoria secret panties up in a bunch
Mme. Chaucer Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 Men ALWAYS notice sexy underwear, as long as it's all a woman is wearing when she's walking down the street in the middle of the day. Always.
xxoo Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 Except the question wasn't about where money was better spent. It was simply if men liked lingerie. Then a few men decided to chime in and talk about the quality of woman's body over actually answering the question about lingerie. Which wasn't what the OP asked. The OP doesn't care what Tman likes concerning women's bodies. Further, it's presumpitous of the men here to assume that the OP isn't fit to begin with. She didn't ask for advice on her health. Suggestion women are better off spending their money on gym memberships and healthy food because of what *he* as a man finds attractive is the same thing as women suggestion men are better off working late nights to make more money so they are more attractive. And we no how well statements about men and their money go over around here. I wonder if the OP thought that the responses presumed anything about her body. I didn't read it that way. Men's opinions about lingerie sometimes depend on the body of the wearer. Some say it is a waste of money if she is fit, others say it is a waste of money if she is not fit. Basically, it depends on the guy. Still, this is good information. I wasted some money at VS before I understood that my guy doesn't appreciate lingerie, assuming that "all" men like it. My money is better spent on running skirts!
Disenchantedly Yours Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 (edited) I'm guess that DY herself does not fall in the "healthy, strong and active" category, which is why she's got her victoria secret panties up in a bunch I work out anywhere from 4-6 times a week. I take weight barring classes, yoga and do a lot of cardio..from the eliptical, to the bike or treadmil. I eat Bob's Redmill whole wheat oatmeal just about everyday with different fruit. Sometimes I break it up by eating an egg. I regularly eat tuna fish, salad, veggie soup or Applegate Organic Turkey slices on whole wheat bread for lunch. For dinner I reguarly eat fish and chicken with veggies. I rarely eat beef. I do like the occasional mexican food which is usually when I eat beef. My body is far from perfect but I do the best I can. Do you want to take any other cheap shots about my body Feelsgoodman? Is that what makes you feel good? Perhaps you could understand why comments about how women should spend money on gym memberships and good food come off as not really about caring about woman's health but have more to do with what men want women to be regarding their bodies then caring about anything else. I again ask the question, if you are getting to the point where you are going to see a woman in sexy underwear, doesn't a man already like something about it? Find her sexy? Why are we automatically assuming that woman's body isn't up to par in a question about sexy underwear? To the point where men think they need to make suggestions about how women can improve their bodies? Not because they care about wome nbeing healthy but because they care about what they can get fro ma woman's body. Why would we discourage women that want to make things more interesting for their partners by spicing it up with sexy underwear? Edited December 9, 2011 by Disenchantedly Yours
xxoo Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 I again ask the question, if you are getting to the point where you are going to see a woman in sexy underwear, doesn't a man already like something about it? Find her sexy? Why are we automatically assuming that woman's body isn't up to par in a question about sexy underwear? To the point where men think they need to make suggestions about how women can improve their bodies? Not because they care about wome nbeing healthy but because they care about what they can get fro ma woman's body. Why would we discourage women that want to make things more interesting for their partners by spicing it up with sexy underwear? DY, do you think it is possible that men might find a woman's body very sexy, and at the same time not think it is the type of body that looks great in lingerie? I think that's possible. Ask women what they think about guys in tight shirts, or speedos I love a guy in a tight shirt IF he has the body for it. But I am also attracted to guys who are too big too pull off a tight shirt, or speedo.
Disenchantedly Yours Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 DY, do you think it is possible that men might find a woman's body very sexy, and at the same time not think it is the type of body that looks great in lingerie? I think that's possible. Ask women what they think about guys in tight shirts, or speedos I love a guy in a tight shirt IF he has the body for it. But I am also attracted to guys who are too big too pull off a tight shirt, or speedo. Is that what these guys are saying XXOO? That they find women's bodies sexy but not when they were lingerie? It's funny but being skinny alone doesn't mean someone is healthy. Sure, sometimes it does. But I know thin girls that are only that way because they smoke or don't eat. I know women at my gym who are very active but are chubby. They can keep up with fit people but their bodies don't look fit.
tman666 Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 Wow, this thread took off (in many interesting directions)! I'd like to take a moment to clarify my opinion statement. I believe that attraction is not entirely a choice. I happen to be attracted (like many men) to athletic women. Nobody sat me down one day and told me "Son, someday you're going to be a grown-ass man, and you're going to want to make-sexy-time with athletic females". I couldn't begin to tell you how my turn-ons (of which there are many, but I'll keep it narrowed down to an "athletic look" for simplicity's sake) developed, because I don't know. I can only report the honest truth of my reality. Other guys' realities may differ. Some guys like fat girls. Some guys like short girls only. Some guys like tall girls only. Some guys like other guys. It is truly endless (ever heard of Rule 34?). I believe that our sexual preferences aren't something that are will or choice driven. It's something that is ingrained into a person's biology. As such, my original statement holds true, at least for me personally. I was not trying to make a dig at anyone's body or tie their worth as human beings to their body. However, sexual preferences are neither objective nor equal opportunity.
azsinglegal Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 A third and most likely possibility is that she's both. That would explain why she comes across as so astonishingly obtuse. And the other poster was 100% correct. Ladies, spend your lingerie money on a gym membership and your shopping time on a treadmill. Lace panties from Victoria Secret will not make up for a flabby body. I agree with this. I don't buy lingerie, but I do bust my ass in the gym so no matter what I'm in I try to look good. If that's yoga pants and a tank, or a sexy slip nighty...45 min on the treadmill does me better then $45 on a pair of panties that are going to come off in 30 seconds anyway. Women who take offense to this are the ones NOT at the gym or working on their bodies. You can be 100lbs or 200lbs, if you bust your ass to look good you'll naturally feel good about yourself and men see that over a lacy nighty. Why not exercise for yourself? Why when a man suggests it is it insulting and rude? Because men are visually stimulated? If you take offense to FGMs comment then it's probably because it's directed at you.
xxoo Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 Is that what these guys are saying XXOO? That they find women's bodies sexy but not when they were lingerie? It's funny but being skinny alone doesn't mean someone is healthy. Sure, sometimes it does. But I know thin girls that are only that way because they smoke or don't eat. I know women at my gym who are very active but are chubby. They can keep up with fit people but their bodies don't look fit. A skinny guy doesn't look great in a speedo either, but can still be extremely sexy "like Jagger" I think some men are saying that they only appreciate lingerie on a certain body type. Just like women only like some items on men with a certain body type.
Disenchantedly Yours Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 I believe that our sexual preferences aren't something that are will or choice driven. It's something that is ingrained into a person's biology. As such, my original statement holds true, at least for me personally. I was not trying to make a dig at anyone's body or tie their worth as human beings to their body. However, sexual preferences are neither objective nor equal opportunity. Sexual preferences aren't entirely biologically driven. Some are manifested through popular social trends. I'm not saying what portion of that is true for you, I would have no idea of knowing. But I do know that what we are attracted to isn't just merely a discussion of biology. But again, the orginal OP didn't really ask for men's opinions on a woman's body. Just if men liked lingerie or not.
Disenchantedly Yours Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 I agree with this. I don't buy lingerie, but I do bust my ass in the gym so no matter what I'm in I try to look good. If that's yoga pants and a tank, or a sexy slip nighty...45 min on the treadmill does me better then $45 on a pair of panties that are going to come off in 30 seconds anyway. Women who take offense to this are the ones NOT at the gym or working on their bodies. You can be 100lbs or 200lbs, if you bust your ass to look good you'll naturally feel good about yourself and men see that over a lacy nighty. Why not exercise for yourself? Why when a man suggests it is it insulting and rude? Because men are visually stimulated? If you take offense to FGMs comment then it's probably because it's directed at you. I took offense AND I work out regularly and eat right. As I pointed out, I know skinny good looking girls who are only that way because they don't eat of they drink. That's not healthy but men still like them a lot. I don't see comments about what women should do with their bodies from men any different then comments what men should do with their money from women. And we know how well those comments are received around here. Lets not pretend that suggestions about health and fitness for women from men is about men caring about their real health. That's all I'm saying.
Disenchantedly Yours Posted December 9, 2011 Posted December 9, 2011 A skinny guy doesn't look great in a speedo either, but can still be extremely sexy "like Jagger" I think some men are saying that they only appreciate lingerie on a certain body type. Just like women only like some items on men with a certain body type. Lets see if any man agrees with you XXOO. My comments about skinny women was to point out that men can be very attracted to them despite the fact that the way they achieved skinniness had nothing to do with being healthy.
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