Why is casual so complicated?

[Celestine]

So, I've been having this thing with a guy for 2 1/2 months now. All felt very good like the casual relationship with some boundaries that I wanted to have. Until one night he had to kiss a friend of his when I was standing right by his side. I confronted him and we had a long talk about where we stand what we want. He apologized for what had happened and told me he had broken up with his ex just a month before he met me. He said he wasn't able to invest anything, though he did before. He wants super-casual, I want boundaries. My minimum boundary would be that he doesn't sleep with other girls which I assume he does.

Anyways after two weeks and some space, I saw him yesterday. The conversation was quite nice, we caught up on the time we hadn't seen each other, had a couple of drinks and things started to get physical. So we went back to his place. I wanted some sex, I know this guy, I've been there with him, better than random I guess.

Anyways he stopped it and repeated to me that he didn't want anything serious. I said I didn't know if it was ok for me and that I would have to figure it out by trying and would let him know if it wasn't. He kept saying the usual stuff, you know I like you a lot but I can't invest in this. He said he was such a mess after his last break up, he is just too afraid of the risk of being hurt.

I spent the night at his place because it was too late to get home. He was super affectionate like he usually is. Holding me, kissing my face, back, hands, arms etc. but he would refuse to kiss me on the mouth and he didn't want to sleep with me. Go figure, usually he woke up during the night asking me for some attention, this time when I tried he said let's just sleep. It felt weird but I didn't have a chance to talk to him about it as I had to leave at 7 am to go to work.

 

So I really don't understand this, he wants a casual thing with me but no sex? That's kinda pointless. Usually I wouldn't do casual like this but I'm leaving the country at the end of January, so basically I would do it for the fun of it if it feels good.

 

His behaviour just doesn't make sense to me. Any takes, any advice?

[phineas]

Your terms were he can't sleep with anyone else if he sleeps with you. correct?

 

That's not really casual, that's exclusive.

 

So either that's scaring him off or he's got someone else he likes sleeping with who isn't going to be leaving in a few months & he doesn't want to burn that bridge by being exclusive with you.

 

Or, you are coming off as clingy & he senses you want more than just fun & isn't going to sleep with you because of that.

 

The fact that he's turning down sex makes me think he isn't a complete jerk & really can't handle the thought of anything exclusive with someone.

[Celestine]

Your terms were he can't sleep with anyone else if he sleeps with you. correct?

 

That's not really casual, that's exclusive.

 

So either that's scaring him off or he's got someone else he likes sleeping with who isn't going to be leaving in a few months & he doesn't want to burn that bridge by being exclusive with you.

 

There is another girl which I know of, not sure if there are more. That were the terms I had when I met him in September. I've gotten to know another guy that I'm attracted to, been out with him once, so I'm not sure yet where it's going to lead. This is why I reconsidered "my terms". In other words, I don't care if he sleeps with other girl, when I'm sleeping with another guy too. Needs to balanced for me.

Btw, he's also leaving for another country in March.

 

Or, you are coming off as clingy & he senses you want more than just fun & isn't going to sleep with you because of that.

He definitely knows that I'm not sure if I can deal with this situation. But I also told him there is no other way than trying for me to figure this out.

 

The fact that he's turning down sex makes me think he isn't a complete jerk & really can't handle the thought of anything exclusive with someone.

Completely agree with this one. Edited December 6, 2011 by Celestine

[Quiet Storm]

When women have sex and orgasm, a hormone called Oxytocin is released. This hormone is called the "bonding" hormone because it is also released during breastfeeding and helps to bond us to our babies.

 

When you are in a FWB situation, many women feel in the beginning that they can handle it because they don't have "feelings" for the guy. However, every time they have sex with him, they bond a little bit more. And soon there are feelings, on her side.

 

This often confuses the guy because men don't always work like that. Men sometimes label women. These labels may "One Night Stand", F*ck buddy, FWB, relationship material, "the one", potential wife, side dish, etc. I think that once men label a girl and decide where she is going to fit in his life, they don't generally change her assignment. Feelings won't "grow" because they don't see her in that way. In other words, they won't allow themselves to bond emotionally with a FWB.

 

I think when you got jealous of him kissing his friend, he realized that you were developing feelings. Although you may not realize it yet, you are slowing bonding to him. If you weren't, the kiss wouldn't have bothered you.

 

In his mind, your feelings and emotions will complicate his life, and he doesn't want that. By refusing sex, he is keeping you at arms length. He is making his boundaries clear. He doesn't want you to be emotionally bonded to him. He is physcially attracted to you and likes hanging out with you, but that's it. It sounds like he doesn't want to hurt your feelings by leading you on, so he obvioiusly cares about your feelings.

 

He made his intentions clear from the start. Spending time with him, having fun together and having great sex will not make him fall in love with you. Even if you aren't expecting love, he senses you want more than he can give. By admitting your jealously and expecting exclusivity, he is feeling like you want more from him.

 

Since your emotions are already involved, I would distance myself from him. The more that you are involved physically, the more emotionally bonded you will become. He is telling you what he wants- BELIEVE HIM. Many guys would take advantage of the regular sex and use you as a placeholder. He is being upfront and not stringing you along. Be grateful for that.

 

Many women think they can handle being FWB, but sometimes their emotions take over. If this happens to you, you should steer clear of FWB and look for someone more relationship minded.

 

If you don't want a relationship, and just sex...be logical about it. Realize that hormones released during sex are designed to bond you to that man. Knowledge is power, and realizing what is happening gives you power over the emotions. If you feel a twinge of "love" tell yourself "Don't go there". If you feel a twinge of jealousy, tell yourself "He's not mine".

 

If you find yourself feeling hurt by FWB relationships, recognize that these types of relationships may not be healthy for you. Figure out what kinds of things/people/relationships bring positivitey to your life.

Edited December 6, 2011 by Quiet Storm

[insertnamehere]

Casual is difficult because women -- including the OP -- are dishonest about it. Women will tell a guy it's casual when that's not what they're shooting for.

 

Look at this discussion of her wanting him to be exclusive. I mean, WTF?!

 

Women use "casual" to loosen men up and ease them into a serious relationship. Then, when women have an opportunity outside the relationship, they think they have the right to violate the exclusivity agreement. After all, they're women and are therefore only accountable to their most recent emotion.

 

Casual doesn't work because women are full of **** when they say it.

[Celestine]

Casual is difficult because women -- including the OP -- are dishonest about it. Women will tell a guy it's casual when that's not what they're shooting for.

 

Look at this discussion of her wanting him to be exclusive. I mean, WTF?!

 

Women use "casual" to loosen men up and ease them into a serious relationship.

 

If in this scenario anyone is misusing the terms 'casual', it's him. I got a new perspective yesterday night when I saw him at a bar with this other girl. He doesn't want a casual fling, he doesn't even want to hook up with random girls, he just wants two relationship-style things, one with me and one with her. That's not casual that's wanting a relationship but being unable to decide with whom. Explains his boyfriend behaviour when I'm alone with him or rather in any siatuation where she's not around. Pretty sure it's the same for her when she's with him.

 

Whatever I hate competitions, I'm out. He can have her but I don't want to play this game.

[insertnamehere]

Rolls eyes. Gives up.

[lululucy]

An easy boundary that shouldn't even have to be outlined is "don't kiss someone in front of another person I like kissing". I'd write him off on that alone (not because he is a bad guy but he's hurt and he's doing whatever he can to make himself feel better). But continuing with the rest,.

 

If in this scenario anyone is misusing the terms 'casual', it's him. I got a new perspective yesterday night when I saw him at a bar with this other girl. He doesn't want a casual fling, he doesn't even want to hook up with random girls, he just wants two relationship-style things, one with me and one with her. That's not casual that's wanting a relationship but being unable to decide with whom. Explains his boyfriend behaviour when I'm alone with him or rather in any siatuation where she's not around. Pretty sure it's the same for her when she's with him.

 

Whatever I hate competitions, I'm out. He can have her but I don't want to play this game.

 

Hun, your idea of casual is skewed. Casual doesn't get to dictate who the other person is seeing or not seeing just because you aren't. You don't get to say "Okay, I'm seeing Brian and Carl next week so you can sleep with two girls too". That's just ridiculous. Casual means you don't know what/who he's doing and vice versa. There are basic boundaries that are about respect that should be followed but otherwise, no. Once you start monitoring activities, it is no longer casual.

 

He likes playing house with people, that has nothing to do with whether or not it's casual. When I was younger, I dated a guy for a long time and we both played house together, cooking and hanging out and shopping as if we were a couple. Neither of us wanted the restraints but we wanted the comfort. He isn't undecided -- he has quite easily DECIDED that this is the kind of set-up he wants.

 

Casual doesn't mean rough sex with no phone call after, it can just as easily mean tender encounters with huge amounts of emotional sharing.

[Celestine]

Hun, your idea of casual is skewed. Casual doesn't get to dictate who the other person is seeing or not seeing just because you aren't. You don't get to say "Okay, I'm seeing Brian and Carl next week so you can sleep with two girls too". That's just ridiculous. Casual means you don't know what/who he's doing and vice versa. There are basic boundaries that are about respect that should be followed but otherwise, no. Once you start monitoring activities, it is no longer casual.

 

He likes playing house with people, that has nothing to do with whether or not it's casual. When I was younger, I dated a guy for a long time and we both played house together, cooking and hanging out and shopping as if we were a couple. Neither of us wanted the restraints but we wanted the comfort. He isn't undecided -- he has quite easily DECIDED that this is the kind of set-up he wants.

 

Casual doesn't mean rough sex with no phone call after, it can just as easily mean tender encounters with huge amounts of emotional sharing.

 

Well I don't know. I agree with what you've said about casual. But let's face it, there's no such thing as a textbook casual relationship. They are all different.

 

I think it's a good thing for me to end this because even though I'd like to not know when he meets her, it is simply impossible. We are in the same wider circle of friends, so is she. She's actually in his inner circle of friends. We go out to the same place at least once a week. Problem is he doesn't stand by what he's doing.

It goes like this, he thinks I'm not going because I was sick the day before. He walks into the bar, holding hands with her. He sees me, I smile, in his face I can see shock, amazement and guilt. So he let's her hand go, keeps his distance. He comes over to say hi, tries to explain himself and I have to tell him there's no need to do this because I already know, I'm not the only girl in his life.

A little later I leave the room, he follows me and starts some silly conversation, wants to have a drink with me and can't keep his hands of me. He kisses my cheek, my hair, my forehead, well you get the picture. I tell him to back off. He tries to convince me to come with him. I tell him no.

Later I dance with some guy, he gets jealous, stares at us, passes several times accidentally shoving me. I'm annoyed by his behaviour, this guy starts kissing me, he grabs her, chooses the friend of his that is dancing closest to me and screams "We are going home now!". they go.

 

You see to me this isn't a casual relationship, that's a big game. And I think I'm partly playing with cards that are not in my hands. More importantly it keep spinning around my head and doesn't make me happy.

That's a sign to get out quick, I guess!

[Disenchantedly Yours]

If in this scenario anyone is misusing the terms 'casual', it's him. I got a new perspective yesterday night when I saw him at a bar with this other girl. He doesn't want a casual fling, he doesn't even want to hook up with random girls, he just wants two relationship-style things, one with me and one with her. That's not casual that's wanting a relationship but being unable to decide with whom. Explains his boyfriend behaviour when I'm alone with him or rather in any siatuation where she's not around. Pretty sure it's the same for her when she's with him.

 

Whatever I hate competitions, I'm out. He can have her but I don't want to play this game.

 

I think this is best. It doesn't really matter what he thinks or what his motivations are. His actions are causing you more problems then not. So to me, this is simple. Stop interacting with him. Then you won't have these problems. Good luck Celestine.

[joystickd]

Casual is only complicated if you make it complicated. I know for me I just bang and go. Beautiful women are in abundance but men like me are rare so they are getting a prize with me.