stripper/strip club in Vegas bothers me now

[SincereOnlineGuy]

You are right I don't frequent titty bars unlike you. So maybe I don't know what I'm talking about. All I know is from what I hear from male friends and from this particular thread. I'd imagine you frequent them quite a bit so you would know what goes on.

 

Anyways....for the right price touching would be allowed as in the case of OP's story. Usually strip clubs do not allow touching, but if you are paying the big bucks apparently it's OK. Also head is OK in certain circumstances. Like I said before, a male friend of mine went to a bachelor party and received head from a stripper. As did all the other men at the party, including the groom. Perhaps he was lying. Why he would feel the need to do that, I'm not quite sure.

 

I live in NY. My friend went to a nice strip club in Albany. It wasn't a run down, seedy place. The girls were attractive. Not white trash women. The men went into a private room, got their private dances and received HEAD. They paid a fair amount of money to do so. It's all about money with strip clubs. If you only have dollar bills, you ain't getting sh*t. No touching, no private dances or anything else. You pull out the Benjamins and you can do quite a bit more. I guess in Vegas it's different. There is no oral sex but with enough cash you can grope tits and ass.

 

So that is why I have two different views on strip joints. Touching is NOT allowed, but with enough dough it is. And yes other things go down as well. At least from the stories I've heard.

 

 

We don't have a problem with your not knowing much about strip clubs. Nor do we have a problem with this line of yours:

 

"Some strippers will give blow jobs"

 

 

(only a fool would argue that very fair statement of yours)

 

 

Where you went afoul was in using words like "probably" and "usually" to suggest that m-m-m-m-m-m-m-m-MOST patrons of strip clubs are GETTING HEAD while visiting those clubs.

 

It is extremely inappropriate of you to be putting grossly erroneous visions and thoughts like those in the minds of (every woman partnered with a guy who has been invited to a bachelor party, OR, even, to a night out at a strip club with the guys from work). To say nothing of adventuresome, innocent female partners who may otherwise consider tagging along to such a place.

 

And it is exactly impossible for "head" to be given without "touching", which, per your understanding, "is not allowed" (at strip clubs).

[taiko]

 

And it is exactly impossible for "head" to be given without "touching", which, per your understanding, "is not allowed" (at strip clubs).

 

Well in some jurisdictions "no touching" means the man can not touch while the dancer touches and grinds. It is to prevent him from hold her hips down when she would try to relax her grind to prevent his climax and keep the PL on the line to buy another song instead of tipping out after he exploded.

 

The story about the entire bachelor party going to whatever the VIP room in her local strip club is called to get something from a single dancer in a club does not sound true. Perhaps if the best man ran across a prostitute's outcall stripper ad and not her massage ad or escort ad it might happen at a private party in a hotel suite.

[musemaj11]

This guy can touch all the strippers he wants if he doesnt get married. What a stupid. Marriage is for dummies.

[xxoo]

This guy can touch all the strippers he wants if he doesnt get married. What a stupid. Marriage is for dummies.

 

Marriage is not for men who want to touch strippers!

 

OP, it sounds like he has a whole lot of growing up to do. If he is already past 30, it is probably hopeless :/

[ShannonMI]

We don't have a problem with your not knowing much about strip clubs. Nor do we have a problem with this line of yours:

 

"Some strippers will give blow jobs"

 

 

(only a fool would argue that very fair statement of yours)

 

 

Where you went afoul was in using words like "probably" and "usually" to suggest that m-m-m-m-m-m-m-m-MOST patrons of strip clubs are GETTING HEAD while visiting those clubs.

 

It is extremely inappropriate of you to be putting grossly erroneous visions and thoughts like those in the minds of (every woman partnered with a guy who has been invited to a bachelor party, OR, even, to a night out at a strip club with the guys from work). To say nothing of adventuresome, innocent female partners who may otherwise consider tagging along to such a place.

 

And it is exactly impossible for "head" to be given without "touching", which, per your understanding, "is not allowed" (at strip clubs).

How many times do I have to say it? WITH THE RIGHT AMOUNT OF MONEY YOU CAN TOUCH AND GET A BLOW JOB!!!!! And there are times the men CANNOT touch but the stripper can. Come on. When they grind on you, they are touching you. How stupid to say that. I'm over arguing this f*cking point with you. I know you know a lot more about strip clubs then I do. Are you happy? I don't have any idea what I'm talking about. Does that make you feel better? Now leave me the f*ck alone dude.

[ShannonMI]

Well in some jurisdictions "no touching" means the man can not touch while the dancer touches and grinds. It is to prevent him from hold her hips down when she would try to relax her grind to prevent his climax and keep the PL on the line to buy another song instead of tipping out after he exploded.

 

The story about the entire bachelor party going to whatever the VIP room in her local strip club is called to get something from a single dancer in a club does not sound true. Perhaps if the best man ran across a prostitute's outcall stripper ad and not her massage ad or escort ad it might happen at a private party in a hotel suite.

Exactly. The stripper can touch, but the men cannot. But with the right amount of money touching is allowed. Case in point, OP's story. And when did I say one stripper gave head to all of the men? It was a number of strippers. Sorry I didn't clarify that before.

[mtber75]

Yes but he could have had some self control. He's not a kid. There should be no peer pressure. He's a grown man. Just because his boys were doing it and telling him to do it, doesn't mean he had to. If he has a SO back home he shouldn't be groping tits and ass at a strip club. You are right. He should have never gone in the first place.

 

First of all the gf should of been pissed that he blew all that money on a private lap dance secession. Those are not cheap and for that kinda of money, a guy expect to touch and/or be touched. So you have every right to be upset!

[ShannonMI]

First of all the gf should of been pissed that he blew all that money on a private lap dance secession. Those are not cheap and for that kinda of money, a guy expect to touch and/or be touched. So you have every right to be upset!

Yeah ya think? I bet it was a lot. He could have saved his money, stayed home and groped his girl. She might have even put out. Winning!!

[mtber75]

How many times do I have to say it? WITH THE RIGHT AMOUNT OF MONEY YOU CAN TOUCH AND GET A BLOW JOB!!!!! And there are times the men CANNOT touch but the stripper can. Come on. When they grind on you, they are touching you. How stupid to say that. I'm over arguing this f*cking point with you. I know you know a lot more about strip clubs then I do. Are you happy? I don't have any idea what I'm talking about. Does that make you feel better? Now leave me the f*ck alone dude.

 

Its rare that any strippers will go that far...Unless you are Mr. Money bags or she knows you (as a regular customer). Handjobs are more common because it can be more discreet. There are no touching on the stage! That's why guys do private lap dances. More tips/money mean more touching! Also a lot of strippers masks as escorts so with the right price you can go home with them.

 

So cut the crap guys about trying to justify strip joints as clean, wholesome fun!

[ShannonMI]

Its rare that any strippers will go that far...Unless you are Mr. Money bags or she knows you (as a regular customer). Handjobs are more common because it can be more discreet. There are no touching on the stage! That's why guys do private lap dances. More tips/money mean more touching! Also a lot of strippers masks as escorts so with the right price you can go home with them.

 

So cut the crap guys about trying to justify strip joints as clean, wholesome fun!

Blow jobs, hand jobs. Whatever. The dick is being touched by either a mouth or a hand. If the dude has a chick, he should not be getting either. And he shouldn't be touching a woman that isn't his chick.

 

Yeah shady sh*t goes down in strip clubs. It's not innocent by any means.

[Ariadne]

I know you know a lot more about strip clubs then I do.

 

It's not then I do, it's than I do.

[ShannonMI]

It's not then I do, it's than I do.

Oh sorry about my grammar. You really had to post that? Funny:laugh:

[LoveAshley]

I haven't read all of the replies, but I think the two of you should have talked about the terms and conditions of the whole stripper thing beforehand.

 

A lot of guys will do whatever they think they can get away with, even if it hasn't been discussed. If you haven't told him your boundaries, he will think is is fair game. So a lot of them will touch a strippers ass and boobs on and off for an hour unless you specifically tell him you are uncomfortable with that.

 

Whenever I have a boyfriend and he talks about going to a strip club, I strictly tell him - and maybe even mention it more than once, just in case - what I am and I am not comfortable with. I am not his boss or his mom, so this is not "telling him what he can/cannot do" it's just telling him my personal boundaries in a relationship, and that is something that every person has a right, and a responsibility to do in any relationship.

 

That way, there are no questions, concerns, problems, or ifs, ands, or buts about anything.

 

Edit: Also, my roommate is a stripper and she tells me all the ins and outs. Its her job to hustle as much money out of a guy that she can. Some will go as far as sex, depending on the club and the girl. Often guys who are weak to pressure will be talked about their money and go further than what they intended to do. And since your guy has no clear boundaries to go by, he didn't see a big reason to stop at any certain point.

 

I find it gross how much money men will blow in these things. Strippers are probably one of the most overpayed people. I'll never fully understand the business.

Edited November 29, 2011 by LoveAshley

[Jynxx]

I think the two of you should have talked about the terms and conditions of the whole stripper thing beforehand.

 

Exactly. Telling your partner it's ok to go to a stripclub and freaking out when you find out he got a lapdance doesn't make sense. It would be like allowing your girlfriend to go to starbucks, then freaking out when you hear she ordered a coffee. Keeping in mind it's someones bachelor party and presumably they both got an OK from their partner to go there, what did she think was gonna happen? Them drinking some beers, seeing some dancers around a pole and saying "no thanks" when a girl approaches them? Also, like Ashley said, keep in mind these girls are trained professionals who have ways of talking guys into spending money on them.

 

edit: and ofcourse he spent more money than he calculated he would. Vegas was built on people spending more than they thought they were gonna.

Edited November 29, 2011 by Jynxx

[Disenchantedly Yours]

dasein

Keep whatever you want in mind, my advice in this thread would be identical to a male OP.

 

Based on previous advice I have seen you give, I highly doubt that.

 

 

Stop rationalizing.

 

Okay, I will stop rationalizing. I will think more like you. Irrationally.

 

Giving permission for one's SO to go to a strip bar includes permission to do whatever normally goes on in a strip bar unless otherwise discussed. Touching happens in a strip bar and someone who doesn't want their SO touching strange women should either establish that limit or tell their SO not to go.

 

Once again Dasein, you must think men are not able to operate under any intelligence, accountability or self reasoning to come to conclusions of their own without their wives and girfriends having to dictate every choice to them. If a man is unable to get into certain situations and make choices on his own, without his women having to instruct him like a child for every choice he should make, you’re saying something about male intelligence that is rather degrading. Men are able to make right choices. Without their women having to be responsible for what a grown adult male decides to do. Clearly the Op's boyfriend knew his choices wheren't the right ones. Lets not play dumb or insinuate that men are not accountable for the choices they make that are distructive to their personal relationships. Which is all you are doing.

 

Some of us are actually interested in helping OP to feel better and move past this, and that was why I made the comparison of a Vegas strip bar to Disneyland when compared with other possible types of bachelor parties. Doesn't surprise me that you don't get that.

 

Do you really think sharing with people that you have been to parties for friend where they have cheated on their partners shows that your a man of sound mind and respect for women? What it says is that you keep company with men that actively disrespect their partners.

 

You’re interested in telling her that she should be happy with what her boyfriend did because you have friends that treat their partners like dirt and disrespect their relationships. That’s plain illogical.

 

Colossal wad of non sequitur and irrelevance. She gave permission. He went and got conned into spending more money than he intended. He fessed up. Simple as that. Up to OP whether she wants to take this misunderstanding as a learning experience and get past it, or extrapolate in an unwarranted way like the above quote and make some crusade out of it. My advice remains the former.

 

She agreed with him going. Women don't give men "permission". Men aren't children. She agreed that him going was acceptable in the relatoinship. Period. Just because she didn't point out every situation that could possibly happen there doesn't make his actions right or justifiable. Unless he is mentally handicapped in some way. Most men understand that them getting lap dances and paying money for lap dances while in a relationship is potenially very hurtful for their female partners. But why would you care about the female partner? After all, you keep company with men that cheat on their partners at strip clubs.

 

...we wouldn't try to blameshift this all to the man by attributing superhuman powers of foresight to him, while allowing the woman to escape all accountability (as usual) for her basic, rather naive oversight.

 

Huh? Superhuman powers of foresight? come on. Most men understand how intimidating the strip club situation is for women in committed relationships. Most men understand the potential for their partner to be hurt by him engaging in strip club activities. This isn't rocket science for most people. Perhaps it is for you, but not for most people.

 

He’s the one that went too far. Now we aren’t suppose to hold him accountable for what he actively took part in? Stop pretending to yourself that men are children unable to understand their actions. The OP’s boyfriend knew enough about what he was doing that he knew it wasn’t right.

 

You have proven over and over again on LS that responding to the words that people actually post is beyond you, and that you'd rather make up something that they didn't say, and attribute intent that they didn't express, for the purpose of building your absurd straw men.

 

That's behavior *you* engage in.

 

When I posted "let's look at the facts and circumstances," what was the thought process that got you to the above straw man? Do you honestly believe that someone who posts "facts and circumstances" is somehow prohibited from posting their opinion thereafter? Do you know what the word "circumstances" means?

 

You attempted to make your post look like 'fact" when it was really your personal twisting of the facts to make it seem like she should be happy with what her boyfriend did and she should suck it up. But I am not surprised after the bit of information you shared about how your friends conduct themselves at strip joints.

 

As far as not knowing about the extent of the touching, we don't know much as matters of absolute certainty...

 

We know enough about the situation to know that the OP's own boyfriend knew the behavior wasn't entirely right because of his desire to confess what happened. If he even confessed everything that happened which I am personally doubtful of.

 

What I do know is that based on my personal experience with strip bars, especially in Vegas, experience that you likely have exactly 0 of, if a guy says he paid extra to touch a woman, two things follow 1) he's just another one of 1000 guys a day who get suckered in the exact same way, and 2) whatever touching he got to do is much less exciting than what the imagination can conjure.

 

Oh okay. Then that makes touching other women and paying for it while in a relationship okay. Since it's probably less exciting and that poor man was suckered into touching a pretty naked girl while his girlfriend was at home waiting for him. Yeah, you're right, lets feel bad for the guy. But again, I refer your own experience where you said you've been to parties where your friends have cheated on their own partneres for strippers.

 

 

No whatever you post on any topic is generally the "worse (sic) argument of all."

 

What a logical argument.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

LoveAshley

A lot of guys will do whatever they think they can get away with, even if it hasn't been discussed

 

No..not a lot of guys..A certain type of guy certainly will. But no man worth really being with will behave like that.

 

Because men that do what they can get away of are more children then men. Because that's what children do. Not grown adults.

 

I am sincerely amazed by how many people here think men need everything explained to them in detail for the right or wrong way for them to behave. Are we saying men are unable to make their own choices? Logical ones that are good for their relationships? That seems entirely demeaning toward men. It's the idea that "boys will be boys" and it's actually very limiting of men.

 

Men don't need their wives and girlfriends to dictate every term and choice in their life. Men should be able to be in certain situations and make choices using logica and reason for the well being of their relationship. Putting that resonsibility on their partners and saying "well you didn't tell him this or that.." is completely ignorant. If I justified everything negative I did for my relationship because my boyfriends did or didn't tell me to do it, I would be pretty stupid. Sometimes I get into situations and I have to ask myself is this if the health of my relationship or the harm. Even if it would bring *me* personal pleasure.

 

If some women and men want to keep coddling men and buying into the idea that men are unable to make their own choices, they can. But we are not helping relationships or men and women by having that mentality.

 

 

OP, do you want to give us an update on teh situation?

[Woggle]

If I could refrain from going to a strip club all the way in New Orleans while my ex was in NJ surely a man can refrain from doing it this time. I could have cheated and she never would have found out but I still didn't do it. Looking at what happened afterwards sometimes I feel like a sucker for being a faithful and loving man but that is another thread.

[Jynxx]

...

Because men that do what they can get away of are more children then men. Because that's what children do. Not grown adults.

...

 

What? You're turning it around. There's absolutely no harm done by looking at strippers or getting a lapdance, nor is it morally wrong. Yet you are saying the boyfriend is immature for not mindreading OP and thus not realising she would find it uncomfortable when he gets a lapdance and thus not abstaining from it, while if he would abstain from it it would not be because of his own morality but to not make her uncomfortable (reread that if you need to).

 

Let's look back at the situation:

OPs fiancee cared enough about her to ask if she was comfortable with him going to a stripclub. When she specifically said she was ok with it and didn't mention disliking him getting lapdances or being touched by a stripper, he went and got a lapdance. Now OP is upset.

 

The only thing remotely immature about it is him asking for permission to go in the first place, but I assume he did that because he didn't want to hurt her feelings. Only the worst doormats are whipped enough to not do things they don't see anything wrong with for fear their girlfriend might dislike it eventhough she didn't mention or even hint at it in their conversations about the subject.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

What? You're turning it around. There's absolutely no harm done by looking at strippers or getting a lapdance, nor is it morally wrong. Yet you are saying the boyfriend is immature for not mindreading OP and thus not realising she would find it uncomfortable when he gets a lapdance and thus not abstaining from it, while if he would abstain from it it would not be because of his own morality but to not make her uncomfortable (reread that if you need to).

 

I actually do think there is harm done by looking at strippers and getting lapdances while your in a relationship with a woman. But that's not what my comments are addressing in this case. My comments are addressing the idea that men are unable to make intelligent choices and need their wives and girlfriends to dictate all the terms to them for them to be able to. A man and a woman are in a relationship together as equals. Both men and women either make choices that make their relationships stronger or weaken them. Most men are intelligent to know that potential of harming his partner when he places himself in a highly sexual environment.If he knows he is placing himself in such a situation, it would be wise for him to seriously talk about the potential of the situation to his partner. Alot of people keep saying that she didn't do this or that. She wasn't the one putting herself in a sexual situation. He was. It was his responsibility to think about how it was going to affect his partner. And if he needed detailed instructions on how to act, then he should have talked about that with her. Clearly this was a man that knew his actions wheren't 100% right. He is clearly not mentally handicapped in anyway. This isn't about having to mind read anyone either. This is about men thinking about their actions and choices in partnership to the relationship they claim they want and respect. Instead of shifting the blame on their partners and making the woman accountable for not treating him liek a chlid and giving him details on how he should conduct himself in every situatoin he encounters.

 

Do you know how many men have said sexual things to me or hit on while I had a boyfriend? Now, is it logical for me to justify going off and doing sexual things with other men because my boyfriend and I never talked about what should happen in that case..after all, he never said I couldn't do those things. Or would the more logical and healthy response to realize that I can make choices on my own when certain situations accure and either ask myself if this situation would be for the health of my relationsihp or the harm? Are we not all adults that make choices like that everyday to protect our relationships?

 

YOu're placing blame on the OP when she wasn't the one that put herself in the sexual situation. He never asked her what was okay within in their relatinship but he knew enough about what he had done that it had the potenial to hurt their relationship.

 

Again, please stop acting like me nare children that can't make their own choices and need their gfs or wives to hold their hands so that they make the choice for them. That is just so lame.

 

 

The only thing remotely immature about it is him asking for permission to go in the first place, but I assume he did that because he didn't want to hurt her feelings.

 

Yeah, he was real concerned about her feelings. Which is why he blew money to feel up another woman's body. Gosh he was a real sweartheart. Aren't men nice like that?

 

Only the worst doormats are whipped enough to not do things they don't see anything wrong with for fear their girlfriend might dislike it eventhough she didn't mention or even hint at it in their conversations about the subject.

 

Actually, making choices based on knowing your partner and the potential to not want to hurt them with your actions is called being in a mature relationship. Calling men "whipped" that think about their partners seems rather immature. But hey, he wins. He gets to feel up strippers AND have a loving girlfriend there for him at the end of the day. And that is apparently waht is important to men. After all..we wouldn't want men to display some foresight and kindness to their female partners by thinking about them when they can feel up strippers and get grinded on. That's really waht is most important.

[Jynxx]

I actually do think there is harm done by looking at strippers and getting lapdances while your in a relationship with a woman. But that's not what my comments are addressing in this case. My comments are addressing the idea that men are unable to make intelligent choices and need their wives and girlfriends to dictate all the terms to them for them to be able to.

Have to agree with you. He made a decision based on his morals, her perceived morals and his intelligence. Can't blame him there.

 

Clearly this was a man that knew his actions wheren't 100% right.

Disagree. The fact he told her straight away shows he didn't realize she could have an issue with it. He did something that wasn't wrong according to his moral compass, he assumed she would agree with him.

 

He is clearly not mentally handicapped in anyway. This isn't about having to mind read anyone either.

It is. I'm repeating myself, but he clearly didn't realize she would have a problem with it, because she didn't communicate well about it. Look at this thread. The word stripper is mentioned and half the people start talking about giving head in a club. Obviously getting head is cheating, that's not the point. But it shows it's common knowledge that watching strippers at a stage is less than the standard treatment a guy entering receives, especially at a bachelor party. So if she knows her boyfriend is likely to be offered a lapdance, and she isn't sure what his moral compass would tell him if it happens, she should have asked and if she didn't like his answer she should have had a talk about it.

This is about men thinking about their actions and choices in partnership to the relationship they claim they want and respect. Instead of shifting the blame on their partners and making the woman accountable for not treating him liek a chlid and giving him details on how he should conduct himself in every situatoin he encounters.

Once again, you seem to think the guy should think about what his girlfriend might dislike and err on the side of caution. I strongly dislike this way of thinking.

Do you know how many men have said sexual things to me or hit on while I had a boyfriend? Now, is it logical for me to justify going off and doing sexual things with other men because my boyfriend and I never talked about what should happen in that case..after all, he never said I couldn't do those things.

I can't comment on your relationship, but the sexual things you keep on mentioning vary too much to even compare. Playful flirting is sexual. Touching a strippers boobs is sexual. Giving head in a bathroom is sexual. Each couple needs to draw the line somewhere, and agree where that line is.

He never asked her what was okay within in their relatinship but he knew enough about what he had done that it had the potenial to hurt their relationship.

I call bs on this one. Having a guy grind on you in a club has that potential. Having a guy buy you a drink and you not refusing has that potential. Talking with an opposite sex person about his or her personal problems has that potential. Should you avoid all of those without explicit permission? Imo that would bring a couple to the dreaded treating like a child with a ton of explicit rules, which you dislike as much as I do. You should use your best judgement in all these cases, and with judgement come miscalculations.

 

Yeah, he was real concerned about her feelings. Which is why he blew money to feel up another woman's body. Gosh he was a real sweartheart. Aren't men nice like that?

This is a non argument. You know nothing about their financial situation.

 

He gets to feel up strippers AND have a loving girlfriend there for him at the end of the day. And that is apparently waht is important to men. After all..we wouldn't want men to display some foresight and kindness to their female partners by thinking about them when they can feel up strippers and get grinded on. That's really waht is most important.

 

Dramaqueen much?

[Imageiko]

@Disenchantedly Yours

 

There is absolutely nothing wrong with your opinion or your morals in this case. But you are basically saying that everybody including op should subscribe to them. You're saying over and over that op got cheated on and that any guy going to a strip club is disrespecting/cheating on his gf. That is your opinion and would be your boundaries in your relationship. That is not true for all couples out there...

 

The problem in this op's case is as a couple the boundaries weren't clear as she thought she was setting one boundary and he thought there was another one completely different.

 

I think by having honest conversations about what type of things are ok/not ok in certain situations is the right way to avoid situations exactly like this. It also goes both ways. Some guys have no problem with a girlfriend who is flirty or dances with other guys when they are out at a bar and others would have a major problem with that. You can't just assume that your morals and boundaries are the same as your partner. That's the best way to get into unnecessary arguments.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

QUOTE]Jynxx

He made a decision based on his morals, her perceived morals and his intelligence. Can't blame him there.

 

Yeah, why blame the guy that bought an extra private hour with a stripper for him and his buddy despite having a fiance at home. That's just silliness. We wouldn't want to hold him accountable for his actions or anything. Especially when he was purshasing sexual time with other women. That's perfectly accetable behavior while in a relationship! Every woman and man in relationship know that.

 

I don't think morals played much of anything into his decision. He made a decision about what would feel best for him. With no regard to his partner. Men don't get private lap dances because they are thinking about what is best for his relationship with his partner. Or you are trying to sell the idea that they do now.

 

Disagree. The fact he told her straight away shows he didn't realize she could have an issue with it. He did something that wasn't wrong according to his moral compass, he assumed she would agree with him.

 

Do you know what the intonation he used when he told her? The Op doesn't really say. Was it "oh hey babe, I got a private lap dance with this really bleeping hot strippper. Man, that was freaking awesome. I love strippers!" or was it, "So things went a little too far and I paid for private time with a stripper". One would indicate that he was completely obtuse about women and his own partner the second would indicate that he knew what he did wasn't really fair to his partner but he still did it because it felt good mainly for him. Neither indicate that he "assumed" she would agree with him. My bet is that he didn't even think much about her. Men aren't exactly looking to think about their partners when they want to go to strip clubs now are they.

 

Take a look at the OP's original post Jynxx. It doesn't appear to be the situation you want to insinuate it is. It speaks for itself. Getting a lap dance is bad enough. But this wasn't even just a lap dance. It was a hour for him and his buddy alone in a private room with a stripper. What a nice way to treat you future fiance. What happens when he has his own bachelor party?

 

It is. I'm repeating myself, but he clearly didn't realize she would have a problem with it, because she didn't communicate well about it. Look at this thread.

 

No, there is no "clear" view about what he thought she would be okay with or not. She was okay with him going. That's about all we know. He took an inch and turned it into a mile. We can't even 100% say that he was completely honest in what happened. Realistically, he could be leaving out details because every man knows someone that has gone to far when it comes to other women and sex.

 

I don't think most men are so dimwitted that they don't understand that potenially getting a private lap dance in a strip club might be hurtful their female partners. A female partner not dictating every possible scenario that could happen in a strip club and what is or isn't acceptable is not a reason enough alone on why it's okay for a man with a partner to act a certain way. Under that logic we could infact excuse a man getting a blow job if his partner didn't specifically tell him not to get them. It's not fair to say "well she didn't say this or that". He isn't two years old and she isn't responsible for how he behaves and for every choice HE makes. Sometimes a man needs to man up and make choices that are best for his partner when she isn't there to hold his hand. Unless you want to be the kind of man that needs his partner to hold his hand to make choices.

 

The word stripper is mentioned and half the people start talking about giving head in a club. Obviously getting head is cheating, that's not the point

 

Well, there were some men on here that talked about their own experiences and men going too far and cheating and desrespecting their partners. We all know it happens. Lets not pretend otherwise.

 

Maybe oral is cheating to you but maybe it's not to other people. Just like getting lap dances is cheating to some and not cheating for others. Above you said that she didn't say that certain things weren't out of the question so it was okay that he did what he did. So by your own logic, since she didn't clearly say bjs where out of the questoin, those might as well have been on the table too for all he knew because apparently men aren't able to make choices without their gfs/wives/fiances holding their hands to make them for them.

 

 

But it shows it's common knowledge that watching strippers at a stage is less than the standard treatment a guy entering receives, especially at a bachelor party. So if she knows her boyfriend is likely to be offered a lapdance, and she isn't sure what his moral compass would tell him if it happens, she should have asked and if she didn't like his answer she should have had a talk about it.

 

I personally think going to strip joints is a form of cheating *shrug. So no, it's not common to me. But it wasn't just a lapdance (although that's bad enough). He paid for a private dance in a private room for not only himself, but his buddy. Real good man there.

 

If he wanted to get a private dance, HE could have mentioned it to her and talked about it. But he didn't did he. He just went and got it because it felt good for him. Yes or no?

 

Once again, you seem to think the guy should think about what his girlfriend might dislike and err on the side of caution. I strongly dislike this way of thinking.

 

I think when someone is in a relationship, they should think about their partner. But my bet is when men go to strip clubs, they don't much care about their partners at home while they are being entertained by other naked women. So you strongly dislike the idea that men should be held accountable for thinking about their partners and relationships in tough spots. And I dislike the idea that the men here seem to think men are unaccountable for the poor choices they make that end up hurting their partners. But again, why think about the actual woman at home when you can see other women breasts and get lap dances. This is what is important to men clearly by the choices they make in the face of their own girlfriends or wives.

 

I can't comment on your relationship, but the sexual things you keep on mentioning vary too much to even compare. Playful flirting is sexual. Touching a strippers boobs is sexual. Giving head in a bathroom is sexual. Each couple needs to draw the line somewhere, and agree where that line is.

 

Agree with that. But saying that because she didn't specifically point out every potenial situation that could happen in a strip club is a good enough reason for him to act any sexual way he wants with other women is really just crappy. And shows a lack of unaccountability.

 

I call bs on this one. Having a guy grind on you in a club has that potential. Having a guy buy you a drink and you not refusing has that potential. Talking with an opposite sex person about his or her personal problems has that potential. Should you avoid all of those without explicit permission? Imo that would bring a couple to the dreaded treating like a child with a ton of explicit rules, which you dislike as much as I do. You should use your best judgement in all these cases, and with judgement come miscalculations.

 

I never liked strange guys grinding on me in a club. And I certainly don't let guys buy me drinks or grind on me while I am in a relationship. Talking to someone about their personal problems is a far cry from getting lap dances. But yes, certain situations should be avoided out of respect for your partner. How many men do you think would be okay with their girlfriends wanting to "once in awhile" be a stripper..go out and dance naked for other men..even let other men touch her..just for fun you know. I bet hardly any men would like this. yet men are always talking about how going to see and touch strippers is perfectly okay. Frankly, its like men don't give a crap about their partners in teh face of strippers and other women. They want their cake and to eat it too and they want their partners to still love them and think they are good men at the end of the day even when they aren't acting like good men are even acting very lovable. Yes, "miscalculations" happen they mess up feelings in a relationship and a man should be prepared that his choices have the potential to hurt the woman he is in a relationship with otherwise he shouldn't be in a relationship if he doesn't want to think about her.

 

This is a non argument. You know nothing about their financial situation.

 

The OP mentioned the money he wasted for private lap dances for him and his friend. Clearly it was a concern of hers.

 

 

DY: He gets to feel up strippers AND have a loving girlfriend there for him at the end of the day. And that is apparently waht is important to men. After all..we wouldn't want men to display some foresight and kindness to their female partners by thinking about them when they can feel up strippers and get grinded on. That's really waht is most important.

 

Jynxx: Dramaqueen much?

 

What is so drama queen about it? is that not what happeend? He felt up strippers and got a private dance while his loving gf was home for him at the end of the day? That it was infact what was important to him at the time to have the lap dance and private dance? Did he display any kind of foresight or kindess twoard his partner when he was feeling up strippers and having fun? What did he display was the most important to him? Drama? Or how about just straight up honest.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

@Disenchantedly Yours

 

There is absolutely nothing wrong with your opinion or your morals in this case. But you are basically saying that everybody including op should subscribe to them. You're saying over and over that op got cheated on and that any guy going to a strip club is disrespecting/cheating on his gf. That is your opinion and would be your boundaries in your relationship. That is not true for all couples out there...

 

The problem in this op's case is as a couple the boundaries weren't clear as she thought she was setting one boundary and he thought there was another one completely different.

 

I think by having honest conversations about what type of things are ok/not ok in certain situations is the right way to avoid situations exactly like this. It also goes both ways. Some guys have no problem with a girlfriend who is flirty or dances with other guys when they are out at a bar and others would have a major problem with that. You can't just assume that your morals and boundaries are the same as your partner. That's the best way to get into unnecessary arguments.

 

Imageiko, I never said the OP got cheated on. Not once. I said his behavior was derespectful and selfish but I didn't say he cheated. So no, I am not applying my morals on other people.

 

I'm am sorry but most men aren't so dense that they don't stop and think that private dances might not be the best idea. And if he had a question he could have stepped out of the club, called her up, and asked. She can't be reponsible for setting up every possible situation he has the potential to get into and being told that it's her fault for not being " clear" enough when there are two people in the relatoinship that have a responsibility toward each other. If a situation came up and he had a question about it, and I don't believe there isn't a man that wouldn't think twice about getting a private lap dance if he had a partner at home, he should have called and talked to her and kept the communication open. But he didn't. He took an inch and turned it into a mile. He abused his position and got a little extra pleasure out of it while basically leaving her feeling hurt in the aftermath.

 

My issue is more with the idea that men aren't accountable for the choices they make. That they need their partnesr to hold their hands when they encounter situations. When the truth is that when I have a boyfriend, I have choices I need to make everyday without him standing by myside that are either good or bad for our relatoinship. How many men really believe getting private lap dances for them and their buddies is for the health of their relationship? Men are able to make choices without their partners dictating the entire terms of their relatoinship. It's called being an adult and taking responsibility for yourself.

[Imageiko]

Imageiko, I never said the OP got cheated on. Not once. I said his behavior was derespectful and selfish but I didn't say he cheated. So no, I am not applying my morals on other people.

 

humm for whatever reason I thats how I read your posts.

 

I'm am sorry but most men aren't so dense that they don't stop and think that private dances might not be the best idea. And if he had a question he could have stepped out of the club, called her up, and asked. She can't be reponsible for setting up every possible situation he has the potential to get into and being told that it's her fault for not being " clear" enough when there are two people in the relatoinship that have a responsibility toward each other. If a situation came up and he had a question about it, and I don't believe there isn't a man that wouldn't think twice about getting a private lap dance if he had a partner at home, he should have called and talked to her and kept the communication open. But he didn't. He took an inch and turned it into a mile. He abused his position and got a little extra pleasure out of it while basically leaving her feeling hurt in the aftermath.

 

Is this practical in real life when you're out drinking absolutely not. There is no doubt op's finance got carried away while drinking and bears some responsibility for that. They both have a responsibility to communicate to each other and in this case they weren't on the same page.

 

My issue is more with the idea that men aren't accountable for the choices they make. That they need their partnesr to hold their hands when they encounter situations. When the truth is that when I have a boyfriend, I have choices I need to make everyday without him standing by myside that are either good or bad for our relatoinship. How many men really believe getting private lap dances for them and their buddies is for the health of their relationship? Men are able to make choices without their partners dictating the entire terms of their relatoinship. It's called being an adult and taking responsibility for yourself.

 

Can't say I disagree here, unfortunately a lot of guys secretly want a mother instead of a girlfriend/wife.

[Jynxx]

Typed out a huge reply, but the site disconnected, I lost it and don't feel like doing it all again. In short:

 

I'm am sorry but most men aren't so dense that they don't stop and think that private dances might not be the best idea. And if he had a question he could have stepped out of the club, called her up, and asked. She can't be reponsible for setting up every possible situation he has the potential to get into and being told that it's her fault for not being " clear" enough when there are two people in the relatoinship that have a responsibility toward each other. If a situation came up and he had a question about it, and I don't believe there isn't a man that wouldn't think twice about getting a private lap dance if he had a partner at home, he should have called and talked to her and kept the communication open.

You're absolutely right. Every man who asks his girlfriend if she has a problem he goes to a stripclub at his buddies bachelor party and gets an OK from her should know the normal boundries of the relationship don't count once inside a club, and they should go out, call her and ask for permission for everything they do. That's why at night you see the streets before a stripclub entrance crowded with men on the phone with their girlfriend, explaining her a stripper suggested he could buy her a drink and if he was allowed to do so, or explaining a stripper suggested a lapdance and asking how he should react to that.

 

In all seriousness, and I've told you this a couple times before, you can't have it both ways. You can't say she shouldn't clarify rules because he's an adult and he should make his own decisions, then expect him to call her and ask if he's allowed to do something if he's not completely sure. You trust on someones intelligence to judge a situation and you accept it, even if it will not always go the way you want.

 

 

 

I personally think going to strip joints is a form of cheating *shrug. So no, it's not common to me.

...

Real good man there.

OP thinks otherwise. Obviously you judge OPs boyfriend as a cheater, but that is moot because to OP it wasn't cheating.

 

I think when someone is in a relationship, they should think about their partner. But my bet is when men go to strip clubs, they don't much care about their partners at home while they are being entertained by other naked women. So you strongly dislike the idea that men should be held accountable for thinking about their partners and relationships in tough spots. And I dislike the idea that the men here seem to think men are unaccountable for the poor choices they make that end up hurting their partners. But again, why think about the actual woman at home when you can see other women breasts and get lap dances. This is what is important to men clearly by the choices they make in the face of their own girlfriends or wives.

 

...

 

Did he display any kind of foresight or kindess twoard his partner when he was feeling up strippers and having fun? What did he display was the most important to him? Drama? Or how about just straight up honest.

 

...

 

Men don't get private lap dances because they are thinking about what is best for his relationship with his partner. Or you are trying to sell the idea that they do now.

People tend to have a life outside of their relationship. Is windowshopping with your girlfriends good for your relationship? Is your partner the first thing you think off when doing that? Is getting drunk at your friends place when watching the game good for your relationship? Probably not, but a relationship is a small part of your life, and while you should avoid doing things, it's important to have a life on your own.

 

The OP mentioned the money he wasted for private lap dances for him and his friend. Clearly it was a concern of hers.

 

My ex paid 200 EUR for a pair of shoes. My ex wasted 200 EUR at a pair of shoes. I ordered a 50 EUR bottle of whine in a restaurant. I wasted 50 EUR at a bottle of whine at a restaurant. OPs fiance wasted alot of money on strippers. Let's just say he spent quite a lot of money and leave the judgementalisme out of it, shall we?