jobaba Posted November 19, 2011 Posted November 19, 2011 So, over the years, I've discovered much to my chagrin, and finally conceded that the 1) vast majority of people cannot date someone they have no physical attraction to and 2) what most people find physically attractive is pretty narrow. So, the next time I meet a single woman who might in any form be a potential, I'm just going to straight up ask, as early as possible, 1) Can you date someone you don't find particularly physically attractive? If it's the very rare bird that says yes, then continue to keep as an option. If no, then... 2) Do you find me physically attractive? If yes, then keep as an option, if no, keep as a friend. It's ballsy, but in theory the approach makes sense. Thoughts?
oaks Posted November 19, 2011 Posted November 19, 2011 What if she says "Maybe" or "it depends" or "I'm not sure" or "I don't know" to either question? Or just refuses to answer?
dasein Posted November 19, 2011 Posted November 19, 2011 That's not the best way to go IME. Too analytical. Women want to be seduced, not quizzed, and if she responds well to flirty attempts to seduce, and then to physical overtures, it's a relatively safe assumption that she finds the guy attractive enough.
Author jobaba Posted November 19, 2011 Author Posted November 19, 2011 (edited) That's not the best way to go IME. Too analytical. Women want to be seduced, not quizzed, and if she responds well to flirty attempts to seduce, and then to physical overtures, it's a relatively safe assumption that she finds the guy attractive enough. Yea, but women want to be seduced and romanced by men they are attracted to, not random chumps. And I've misinterpreted those signals bad. I hate going the back/forth flirting playing games route, is she into me/is she not route. It's never worked for me. I don't understand why if people are so steadfast about a thing like physical attraction that they just won't come out and say it. If you don't like black men, then just come out and say it to the world. Edited November 19, 2011 by jobaba
Author jobaba Posted November 19, 2011 Author Posted November 19, 2011 What if she says "Maybe" or "it depends" or "I'm not sure" or "I don't know" to either question? Or just refuses to answer? Yea. Maybe it won't work that well. But it's worth a try. Let you know how it goes.
Leegh Posted November 19, 2011 Posted November 19, 2011 (edited) I believe men are either physically attracted to someone or not, but with women I believe we can BECOME physically attracted to someone over time. To be honest, if I met someone who was short, fat and bald, and found out he was the President of a multi-million dollar company, and was very wealthy, I could become physically attracted to him, and really be physically attracted to him because of his status, (but he would have to be a good person, too). When you find a girl you like, if she gives you the green light that she will go out with you, then you are in the running. That one date at a time, and see where it leads. Little things can turn the tables and make girls become attracted to someone, for instance, showing kindness to animals, etc. Edited November 19, 2011 by Leegh typo
dasein Posted November 19, 2011 Posted November 19, 2011 I don't understand why if people are so steadfast about a thing like physical attraction that they just won't come out and say it. If you don't like black men, then just come out and say it to the world. Well maybe one day we will have completely mechanical methods of signaling attraction that depersonalize the process (I kinda hope not, quite enough depersonalization as it is). Until then, seducing them is the way to go. Women are generally fairly obvious with signals that they find a man attractive or not, it's not exactly mindreading.
mammamia1 Posted November 19, 2011 Posted November 19, 2011 To me (a woman), those questions just show your lack of confidence in your look. You shouldn't ask or deduce anything from the answer. And physical attraction is not all about what you're born with. I met quite many men who could be much more attractive if they took care of messy hair/long beard, wore more proper clothes etc. And Leegh has some good points. I may not be attracted to a man at the beginning, but then little things may draw me in. Such as later I learn that he loves children --> big plus! Women care less about physical parts in their potential mate than men do.
somedude81 Posted November 19, 2011 Posted November 19, 2011 I believe men are either physically attracted to someone or not, but with women I believe we can BECOME physically attracted to someone over time. To be honest, if I met someone who was short, fat and bald, and found out he was the President of a multi-million dollar company, and was very wealthy, I could become physically attracted to him, and really be physically attracted to him because of his status, (but he would have to be a good person, too). When you find a girl you like, if she gives you the green light that she will go out with you, then you are in the running. That one date at a time, and see where it leads. Little things can turn the tables and make girls become attracted to someone, for instance, showing kindness to animals, etc. So by finding out somebody you can suddenly become attracted to him? And yes, men can and do fall for girls they were not initially attracted to at first. We do it because we fall for their personality, and her appearance becomes less important and or, we find things about it that we start to like.
Leegh Posted November 19, 2011 Posted November 19, 2011 So by finding out somebody you can suddenly become attracted to him? And yes, men can and do fall for girls they were not initially attracted to at first. We do it because we fall for their personality, and her appearance becomes less important and or, we find things about it that we start to like. To answer your question, I would at least be impressed by someone who was extremely wealthy, if they weren't arrogant, and if they were a decent, kind person, as well. I'm glad to hear that men can fall for girls they are not initially attracted to at first.
Author jobaba Posted November 19, 2011 Author Posted November 19, 2011 And Leegh has some good points. I may not be attracted to a man at the beginning, but then little things may draw me in. I dunno. I rode that path for a long time and never got anywhere. And I'm really a good dude. I volunteer and play guitar and sing and am well educated. Never any points for that stuff. The success I've had has been from dating women who have hooked up with me with mostly just a snapshot of my personality and at least once, virtually no common background or interests. Take it for what it's worth.
Poppydog Posted November 19, 2011 Posted November 19, 2011 OK. Can you make me laugh? I dont want to spend the next 10 - 20 years laughing at my own jokes whilst you yawn in boredom. Can you cook, or at least appreciate good food when it is put in front of you? Are you able to hold your own in a debate, put forward an opinion and have faith in your own viewpoint without disrespecting my viewpoint (however naiive or stupid) or putting me down? Are you able to respect me, be nice to me, not hit me or become abusive, laugh with me and not at me, do the little things like hold doors open and remembering that I dont take milk in my coffee? Or are you none of the above, self conceited, arrogant, selfish but insanely good looking...... Hmm, wonder which one I would be most attracted to? By the way, most people turn off the lights at night, so as to your good looks, they can't be appreciated when they matter the most.
Wolf18 Posted November 19, 2011 Posted November 19, 2011 Guys , girls are different and better people than us. They don't care about looks, as long as you're the CEO of a big corporation with millions and your own jet plane Oh yeah, and a "kind" person, because you know the kind of gentle spirit becomming the head of a multi-million dollar corporation requires.
Author jobaba Posted November 19, 2011 Author Posted November 19, 2011 My two sisters had guys lined up at the door. After their teenage years, they dated nice guys rather than good looking guys. bottom line, if you are in decent shape and well groomed, I doubt if most women weigh your looks as a deal breaker. Man oh man. Sometimes I shake my head when I meet guys like you. It's like you never encountered any of the rejection that the rest of us do. And being dumped over and over in the friendzone. Which is good for you. Maybe you guys are a really good looking family and raised with non-shallow values, but I guarantee you if you stick around this forum and peruse the real world a bit more, you might change your opinion. Thanks for the advice though.
Wolf18 Posted November 19, 2011 Posted November 19, 2011 Man oh man. Sometimes I shake my head when I meet guys like you. It's like you never encountered any of the rejection that the rest of us do. And being dumped over and over in the friendzone. Which is good for you. Maybe you guys are a really good looking family and raised with non-shallow values, but I guarantee you if you stick around this forum and peruse the real world a bit more, you might change your opinion. Thanks for the advice though. The guys who are most idealistic about women are the ones who barely know any or are so dumb and gullible that they'll believe anything they say. The guys who get the most chicks are always the ones who have the most disdain for them.
Author jobaba Posted November 19, 2011 Author Posted November 19, 2011 The guys who are most idealistic about women are the ones who barely know any or are so dumb and gullible that they'll believe anything they say. The guys who get the most chicks are always the ones who have the most disdain for them. Well. I can see where he's coming from a little. I know at least one really good looking guy who never really had to face much rejection. He's always met nice, pretty girls in a friends first setting and he's never been into the player/quantity thing. So, of course they like him because he's a nice guy and really good looking. So, in his perspective, it seems that women might not care about looks much and like him because he's a nice guy. But he probably has no idea how many average and mediocre looking guys his girlfriends have rejected.
Wolf18 Posted November 19, 2011 Posted November 19, 2011 Well. I can see where he's coming from a little. I know at least one really good looking guy who never really had to face much rejection. He's always met nice, pretty girls in a friends first setting and he's never been into the player/quantity thing. So, of course they like him because he's a nice guy and really good looking. So, in his perspective, it seems that women might not care about looks much and like him because he's a nice guy. But he probably has no idea how many average and mediocre looking guys his girlfriends have rejected. There are many males who are very physically attractive to women but just don't know it, they just assume women treat everyone like they do them, true. This is where the guys who tell the virgins here "I just do what I love, don't think about it and women magically appear!" are usually coming from.
insertnamehere Posted November 20, 2011 Posted November 20, 2011 Guys, just remember this: you don't have to lie about status. How? I dress well enough that people just assume I own the club when I go there. I literally have people come up to me, shake my hand and tell me how good my club is. Last I checked, I don't own a club. Point being? Status is easy to put out there. Let everyone else fill in the blanks with whatever theory their fevered brains wish to concoct.
somedude81 Posted November 20, 2011 Posted November 20, 2011 No you still don't get it. you have a neegative chip on your shoulder. You are clueless what most woman want from a guy. Showing up well groomed, helping her on with her coat and opening the door for her will more than compensate for a crooked nose, big ears and a funny nose. Women want to be respected and treated as special (and for you to mean it) The vast majority of guys are average looking and most of them have girlfriends or wives. Most guys learn the secret...be a decent guy. No great mystery. Sure, she will think you're a decent guy, then complain to you about the guy who's cheating on her, who never treats her right.
Negative Nancy Posted November 20, 2011 Posted November 20, 2011 Guys , girls are different and better people than us. They don't care about looks, as long as you're the CEO of a big corporation with millions and your own jet plane Oh yeah, and a "kind" person, because you know the kind of gentle spirit becomming the head of a multi-million dollar corporation requires. that doesn't make us "better", but it sure as hell doesn't make us "worse" than you shallow guys who place an insanely amount of importance on looks, looks, and, oh did I mention looks.
Negative Nancy Posted November 20, 2011 Posted November 20, 2011 No you still don't get it. you have a neegative chip on your shoulder. You are clueless what most woman want from a guy. Showing up well groomed, helping her on with her coat and opening the door for her will more than compensate for a crooked nose, big ears and a funny nose. Women want to be respected and treated as special (and for you to mean it) The vast majority of guys are average looking and most of them have girlfriends or wives. Most guys learn the secret...be a decent guy. No great mystery. i can attest to this. my ex (the one who wasn't what i'm usually attracted to, the one with long hair & potbelly) was new in my area and we had met up as just friends for the first time, we met in a coffee shop, he was already there and when i arrived, he was already standing in the room and greeting me so politely (as opposed to most men who have their nose in the coffee or a magazine and don't even bother to look up and hardly manage to mumble a "hi"), i still remember it to this day he was also funny and charming, i guess you could say he just rolled with what he had and made the best of it. i indeed felt special with him. if a woman senses that (excuse my crass language) "any hole" will do, it doesn't make us feel like you really mean US. and unfortunately many desperate men give off the vibe that they want a woman, just ANY woman just to end their sexlessness/loneliness/whatever. it would be the same if you had a fat bank account (let's assume the bank acc is the equivalent to beauty in a woman) and a woman complains to you: "i just wish i could find a rich man, just any rich man would do." i doubt YOU would feel very flattered by that. for instance i agree with a couple posters here who say wolf for example isn't a bad looking guy, but I bet his cynical attitude (and lack of confidence? or rather, lack of success) is shining thru in real life too, and that can be a turn -off... i don't know if men would REALLY like to be on a date with a woman who would just sit there with a scowling and frowning face and complain, complain, complain...oh wait, i forgot a woman just has to look good, that's all that's needed, my bad...
Author jobaba Posted November 20, 2011 Author Posted November 20, 2011 if a woman senses that (excuse my crass language) "any hole" will do, it doesn't make us feel like you really mean US. and unfortunately many desperate men give off the vibe that they want a woman, just ANY woman just to end their sexlessness/loneliness/whatever. it would be the same if you had a fat bank account (let's assume the bank acc is the equivalent to beauty in a woman) and a woman complains to you: "i just wish i could find a rich man, just any rich man would do." i doubt YOU would feel very flattered by that. Some guys don't have any other options, so they may come off as desperate. A good looking guy is always going to have multiple women interested in him and thus appear less desperate. Catch 22. No you still don't get it. you have a neegative chip on your shoulder. You are clueless what most woman want from a guy. Showing up well groomed, helping her on with her coat and opening the door for her will more than compensate for a crooked nose, big ears and a funny nose. Women want to be respected and treated as special (and for you to mean it) The vast majority of guys are average looking and most of them have girlfriends or wives. Most guys learn the secret...be a decent guy. No great mystery. Yea. They want it if and after the physical attraction is there. If it's not there, I don't care how decent of a guy you are. You're dead/done/buried. I think your opinion of women (as a whole) is admirable, but a bit naive. I really think my opinion is a lot closer to the target.
AD1980 Posted November 20, 2011 Posted November 20, 2011 that doesn't make us "better", but it sure as hell doesn't make us "worse" than you shallow guys who place an insanely amount of importance on looks, looks, and, oh did I mention looks. Yes because we all know looks dont matter to women:laugh: I must be seeign things when i go online and see strict physical requirements from women including must be 5'10 or over from 99% of the women
Wolf18 Posted November 20, 2011 Posted November 20, 2011 (edited) for instance i agree with a couple posters here who say wolf for example isn't a bad looking guy, but I bet his cynical attitude (and lack of confidence? or rather, lack of success) is shining thru in real life too, and that can be a turn -off... i don't know if men would REALLY like to be on a date with a woman who would just sit there with a scowling and frowning face and complain, complain, complain...oh wait, i forgot a woman just has to look good, that's all that's needed, my bad... -I don't lack any confidence what so ever. -I obviously dont wear my "cynical attitude" on my sleeve. - I had any women I wanted for years when I was obsessed with working out and had a 6 pack. My attitude was far worse (particularly towards women), since I was a very troubled teenager mixed up in drugs, etc. I would make girls cry for fun and treat women like property. Now that I'm not like that any more and am ready to love, I find that nobody wants it, because my shoulders aren't as broad as they used to be, I don't have a car and I'm like 2 inches under the average height. you'll deny it to death, but I know for a fact it's because of those stupid reasons women just don't see me, even the most intelligent women who have things in common with me don't like me for the same reasons other women dont. You're not going to convince me that being a nice guy is all you need to get a girl, because it's a blatant lie. The superficial stuff comes first. Edited November 20, 2011 by Wolf18
Negative Nancy Posted November 26, 2011 Posted November 26, 2011 My attitude was far worse (particularly towards women), since I was a very troubled teenager mixed up in drugs, etc. I would make girls cry for fun and treat women like property. Now that I'm not like that any more and am ready to love, I find that nobody wants it maybe it's karma?
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