Women who get persnickity when you like them for their appearance

[Els]

You clearly have no understanding of the power and the control a male sex drive can exert over a young man. At the age of 30, a woman is susceptible to the irrational craving for a baby. Is this not the reason for many of the unwanted births? What would you do if you had to endure at least 2 decades of feeling a desire for motherhood, but a thousand times stronger than what women usually experience?

 

Yeah, so... you feel that women who give in to those cravings without thought for whether or not they can actually support and take care of the child, are justified in doing so simply because of their cravings? Could we then extrapolate and say that it is not an overweight woman's fault that she is overweight, because by golly, she craves sweet food, how is she supposed to stop? And what about a kleptomaniac's stealing, a pyromaniac burning buildings down, a man raping a little girl because he's a pedophile? Should we all excuse any sort of behaviour and remain guiltless of any blame because we have 'biological urges'?

 

This 'oh I'm so helpless, I'm a man riddled with testosterone, I'm the victim in everything and women USE me for attention, the evil bitches' mentality is just really laughable. How would one even get anywhere in life with such a victim mentality?

[Disenchantedly Yours]

Quiet Storm

DY, I get what you are saying and you are correct, men have self control just like women do.

 

However, what is it that prompts us to have self control? It's usually because we don't want the negative consequence. We don't overeat because we will gain weight. We don't drive 100 mph because we don't want to crash or get a ticket. We don't charge up our credit cards because we don't want the debt.

 

The negative consequences are what prompts us to exert self control. If we could eat whatever we want with no consequences, we probably would.

 

I get that you feel that men objectify women and you are upset by that...but what is their negative consequence for their behavior?

 

Well first, men objectifying women is a sperate issue from what is being discussed here Quite Storm. What's being discussed here is men dually enjoying sexualizing women while also holding it against them and blaming women and claiming they have no self control over themselves when it happens.

 

I also don't think people are so blanket that the only reason they don't do things is because of negative consequences. Some people do things because they want to follow their own code of conduct because of their simple own morals. Some people have the oppurtunity to cheat without any consequences and those people still may choose not to cheat based on their own code of conduct.

 

 

So far, their only consequence is that women may occasionally get pissed off about it. So what? Do they really care?

 

Apparently they do since men label women based on how they dress such as has been expressed in this thread.

 

I don't think most men have this pressing need to change their behavior so that it is more palatable to women.

 

Men like looking at hot women. IMO, they always will. Some are obvious about it. Some are subtle. Some are sneaky.

 

Wel actually, that's why both genders change their behavior. So they are more palatable to the other gender. Both men and women do it.

 

Yes, we all understand men like looking at hot women. However, you seem to believe then men are no better then this fact. But I think they are.

 

I don't think they'll ever stop unless they face major negative consequences. Like getting a zap to the eye every time they look or something, lol.

 

They don't have self control about objectifying because they don't want to stop. It is a postive part of life for them. Hot women make their days interesting.

 

Clearly it's not alawys that positive for them. Displayed by the number of men that get pissed at women if they don't want their attention or just outright call women belittling names to deman their sexuality.

 

I think there are many good men out there aiming to be better men for themselves, for their families, for their wives, for their children. Men that don't want to settle for the status quo of their lives and reflect and justify all their actions on their hormones. You should check out a site called Good Man Project. It's a wonderful site and many men struggling with many issues trying to figure out what it means to be a good man in this day and age. Discussing things their fathers probably didn't. Are all of them clamering to not treat women objectified? Nope. But it's certainly a regular topic dicussion and many of the articles present a wide view point and good thoughts. It really shows men who don't want the extent of their existance to be sheepish smiles and happy dumbfounded shrugs for their inability to control themselves.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

Women's bodies are attractive to men.

 

This should be a source of great pleasure for both women and men. DY and Elysian make it sound like some sort of torture for both women and men.

 

What's up with that??

 

DY, don't you enjoy being a woman, attractive to men?

 

Elysian, don't you enjoy being attracted to women?

 

Where did I say that men were not allowed to be attracted to women's bodies? Sheesh. Please read my posts again XXOO. I said that a woman posting pictures of her in a bikkini isn't all the time meant in the spirit of sex. And I further said to Elysian who said he couldn't exercise self control because of "being a man" speach, that he could.

 

When there is attraction between men and women it has the ability to be positive and bring pleasure to both. I totally agree! However, lets not pretend that men or women don't abuse their position in this game and over exploit the other gender.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

Elysian Powder - it might benefit you to talk to a counselor. Your views are heavily unbalanced regarding women and men.

[Els]

People attempt to manipulate people all the time, Mircea. There has been many a man who manipulated a woman for sex and then vanished. One can complain about it all day... or one can do some introspection into HOW exactly one let the manipulator through, and change one's actions appropriately.

[xxoo]

Where did I say that men were not allowed to be attracted to women's bodies? Sheesh. Please read my posts again XXOO. I said that a woman posting pictures of her in a bikkini isn't all the time meant in the spirit of sex. And I further said to Elysian who said he couldn't exercise self control because of "being a man" speach, that he could.

 

When there is attraction between men and women it has the ability to be positive and bring pleasure to both. I totally agree! However, lets not pretend that men or women don't abuse their position in this game and over exploit the other gender.

 

Sorry if I misinterpreted. I "hear" a lot of disgust in your posts regarding men's attraction to women. I don't think sexual attraction is at all comparable to wanting a frapucchino (or whatever).

 

Of course some men and women abuse their position--but these are undesirable men and women. THey may be physically or financially desirable, but the are not desirable from a standpoint of being a good partner. Leave them to their own game, trying to exploit each other. Not everyone is playing that game.

[Quiet Storm]

Yes, we all understand men like looking at hot women. However, you seem to believe then men are no better then this fact. But I think they are.

 

 

 

I just don't think it's a bad thing.

 

I think men can be great fathers, sons, husbands, neighbors, citizens, etc. and still objectify women in some ways (looking or porn). Although it bothers some women, it doesn't bother me. You say men can be "better" than this, I say there's nothing wrong with it. I don't take it personally.

 

However, men have to understand that women aren't here just for their viewing enjoyment. Most of us aren't walking around intentionally teasing men with our body. Most of us go about our day not even realizing that we may be the subject of the mailman's fantasies or the target of the UPS guy's anger.

 

I developed early. I'm real short and curvy, with a tiny waist so I was like an eleven year old Jessica Rabbit. I had no idea that the boys were watching my boobs bounce and ass shake when I walked across the playground. I wasn't trying to tease...I was just minding my business.

 

As an adult, even dressing conservatively, my curves show and men look. So just by walking around going about my business, some men think I am teasing them? Like I am saying "Nanny nanny boo boo! You can't have me?"

 

That is a very wrong assumption to make.

 

Sorry guys, not everything is about YOU. Most of us aren't maliciously taunting you with our lady lumps.

 

If some men get angry & can't handle sharing a world with women, including hot ones with T&A, that's on them. Men shouldn't take that personally, just like women shouldn't take porn personally.

 

JMO.

Edited November 17, 2011 by Quiet Storm

[Disenchantedly Yours]

Sorry if I misinterpreted. I "hear" a lot of disgust in your posts regarding men's attraction to women. I don't think sexual attraction is at all comparable to wanting a frapucchino (or whatever).

 

Of course some men and women abuse their position--but these are undesirable men and women. THey may be physically or financially desirable, but the are not desirable from a standpoint of being a good partner. Leave them to their own game, trying to exploit each other. Not everyone is playing that game.

 

XXOO, could you point out something that I've said that lead you to believe I have disgust about male attraction toward women? You said that you hear it a lot, one example would be nice so I could see what your taking in from my words. It might be helpful in bridging any misinterpretation that either of us are experiencing.

 

I am inclined to believe that you don't really read my posts that well especially because you mistakingly took my example and made it into a frapuchhino when I used latte as an example. I don't point this out to be petty but just to signature that perhaps it's a matter of not really reading and retaining things as they were stated.

 

Now I would agree that sexual desire might not be 100% equal to a desire for a latte. I personally believe that lack of control over sexuality is even more of an issue then food or drink is. Since it doesn't show up as obviously as food or drink over consumption does, it's harder to detect. But it was an example on desire and how I control myself despite a craving.

 

In our culture, food does prove to be something that people often have a hard time controlling their desire for. To the extent that we both have a high amount of people that are overweight and some people that are underweight in their fear to control appropiate food consumption. If I ate ice cream everytime I craved it, I would be grossly overweight. How come then, when it comes to sex, we justify pretty much anything under the scope of it for usually men only? Phrases like "well he is a man, he likes sex", don't do anything to really benefit men or women. Yes, men and women both like sex. Men and women both like food. Only you are responsible for how you handle these honest facets of life. In the context of the example that was previous used by Elysian Powder who said that when he sees a visual image of a woman, he can't be expected to control himself, I in turn related to to visuals I see that suggest messages to me about what I desire. If I ran to Red Lobster everytime I saw a commerical for their juicy and fatty seafood, I'd be over weight. Am I saying commericals that appeal to men on a purely sexual level are right? Nope. But a man has the strength and ability to turn himself away from it if he doesn't like his desire exploited.

 

Attraction between men and women can be an awesome and exciting thing. When it's not over abused or exploited. Or not when either gender uses such things as means to justify poor behavior toward the other gender. In this culture, it's often over abused and exploited.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

Mircea

His base arguments are more or less valid (i'd say more than less).

 

What is wrong with him is that he is in the anger phase of coming to this realization.

 

Sexual manipulation is a very real thing and many women have inadvertantly done it. I say this as someone on the receiving end and as someone who has seen other men fall for it (2 of them miserably married now).

Worse than sexual manipulation though is emotional manipulation.

 

I totally acknowledge that sexual maniuplation is a very real thing. But he made it sound like every 12 year old girl was a man eater just hoping to tease boys. When more realistically, 12 year old girls are just as ackward as 12 year old boys and trying to figure out what to do with all these new feelings they have and hoping that they are "pretty" enough to be liked since even young boys place an importance on a girls looks. I don't condone a woman using sexual manipulation but how are we going to define sexual manipulation? Is it any girl that wears a low cut top? Is it a girl that makes sexual promises specific to a man for a means to an end? Where does "sexual manipulation" begin and just being an attractive and perhaps even sexual woman end?

 

You also seem to forget that while sexual manipulation is a real thing for women, that emotional manipulation is just as easily a game boys/men play to get a woman to sleep with them. Such as telling her that he cares more deeply for her then he does and the millions of lines guys can use that make a girl feel special and cared for when he just wants to sleep with her.

 

We crave sex, but let's face it ... you do too. We can last through a dry-spell maybe better than you do.

 

Of course we all crave sex. However, you are not controlled by your body. You have the ability to make choices for better or for worse. Yes or no?

 

What we can't handle is lack of affection. When a woman wants a man to do something, be it propose, buy her something, move the relationship to the next level, enforce a rule of hers she turns to sexual manipulation ... we can weather that, but she also withdraws her affection which truly hurts because we need female affection.

 

That's an interesting statement and might be worthy of a whole seperate thread.

 

 

Bottom line though, women use sex and affection to manipulate men. Not all do, but enough do that to be a problem. These same women will also blame those men for their unhappy marriage decades later

.

 

I do agree that there are women that use sex and affection to maniuplate men. But that wasn't exactly what Elysian Powder was talking about. He was talking about his inability to contorl himself with visuals of women and how his lust, is apparently their responsibility. So the question is, how much is female responsibility and how much is male responsibility. Can you answer that?

 

PS: DY ... if men could give themselves blowjobs, women would be out of luck. You would be crying on these forums about it.

 

I would very much miss male companionship. Heck, I very much miss it right now because I am not in a relationship. But I would hope that men are with us for more then bjs. I know that I need men for more then just sex. And actually, this statement contradicts the statement you said before about men needing emotional support too. So maybe you aren't doing men any favors by reducing their need for women to bjs but expecting women to treat men with emotional responsibility.

[xxoo]

I am inclined to believe that you don't really read my posts that well especially because you mistakingly took my example and made it into a frapuchhino when I used latte as an example. I don't point this out to be petty but just to signature that perhaps it's a matter of not really reading and retaining things as they were stated.

 

This is really funny to me, because I knew frapucchino was wrong, couldn't remember your exact example (read it yesterday), scrolled back but couldn't view your example without clicking to view the entire thread, and decided "frapucchino (or whatever)" was good enough. Obviously not!

 

One example of a post I interpreted as disgust include these, and more on the porn threads:

 

Today's men don't know much about women because they don't take pride in themselves enough to get to know women. They start looking at porn at very young ages, they spend their childhood and teen years looking at it reinforcing beliefs about themselves and women that are false. Then they hope to magically turn 18 and score with a super fox. They don't want to put real time or effot into really getting to know and experience life with real women. Not computer images that serve their every whimsy and fancy. Again, not women's fault that men rather spend their time doing that then getting to know what it takes to be with a real woman.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

Quiet Storm

I just don't think it's a bad thing.

 

I think men can be great fathers, sons, husbands, neighbors, citizens, etc. and still objectify women in some ways (looking or porn). Although it bothers some women, it doesn't bother me. You say men can be "better" than this, I say there's nothing wrong with it. I don't take it personally.

 

I don't think being sexually attracted to women is a bad thing either. I think the sexual objectification is. I think that fathers, sons, hubands and neighbors will encounter situations where they are attracted to other women. It's what that man decides to do with that that says something about him. I think both men and women respect the other gender a heck of a lot more when they practice self control out of respect for one another. Most men don't want to be used for just their money and most women don't want to be used for sex. I don't think most men want to see women lustfully pursue them for money any more then the reverse. Just look at this board for the amount of men that feel worried about a woman just using him for money. Now, it doesn't bother you, and that's fine. Then why comment either way? If you don't care?

 

My comment about how men can be "better" then this is to point out that men are ever evolving, just like women. Men of my father's generations where completely different father's then men today. Is that to imply men of my father's generations where bad? Not at all. They came from a different world. Today's men are much more likely to take the kids to little league and be more active in things women were more known to do. So reducing men to caveman cliches about what they are or aren't capable of seems to be rather negative toward what men are capable of and the role that many men do seem to want to take on today. There are so many men here with a wealth of emotion and feeling and a desire for women to understand them. There are men that want to be good husbands and fathers. Does that mean that all sexual desire for anyone but their partner gets cancelled out? Nope. But it certainly means that these ideas are also ever evolving.

 

I use to work in advertising. And in advertising, how products are marketed toward men, has drastically changed. Where beer commericals of women in little tiny bikkinis use to do the trick, these commericals alone no longer sell products. Today's man wants something a little more evolved and isn't looking to be pandered to through his sexuality. It's the reason why we no longer see the same kind of beer commericals we use to. Sure, there are still beautiful women in beer commericals but the conversation in the commerical and how women are presented in these commericals have changed.

 

When we hold onto the idea that men are no better then neanderthals, we aren't doing men any favors. Especially when we come here and see all the feelings and thoughts men are capable of.

 

Men shouldn't take that personally, just like women shouldn't take porn personally.

 

Considering that porn isn't just about "lady lumps" , and that alot of the themes in porn are quite misogonstic while you just walking by a man isn't, it's really not even close to the same thing.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

XXOO

One example of a post I interpreted as disgust include these, and more on the porn threads:

 

DY: Today's men don't know much about women because they don't take pride in themselves enough to get to know women. They start looking at porn at very young ages, they spend their childhood and teen years looking at it reinforcing beliefs about themselves and women that are false. Then they hope to magically turn 18 and score with a super fox. They don't want to put real time or effot into really getting to know and experience life with real women. Not computer images that serve their every whimsy and fancy. Again, not women's fault that men rather spend their time doing that then getting to know what it takes to be with a real woman.

 

XXOO, thanks for providing a qoute! I'm glad because it helps me to better understand your perspective. However, is anything I said not true? The first sentence of mine is a little too passionate and all encompassing. But I do believe that are many boys/men out ther today that don't take time or pride in learning about real women. That they think that they can look at porn from early ages but still be able to healthily interact with women.

 

There are growing numbers of men, raised in a generation that never knew life before a computer, that have them sitting behind their computers learning about women from porn. Is this not just a fact? Statistically, the average age a man starts looking at porn is 11. Is that not just a fact? Do young men and boys not spend their childhoods looking at ideals about women and men through porn absorbing these messages in key developmental years? Is this not just a fact? How many men prize super hot women over regular ones? Again, is this not just a fact? How many young boys or men are putting in time to get to know *real* girls/women? Do not these computer images serve their every little whim and fancy?

 

Can you please point out where the disgust is in any of that? It seems that my issue is more with porn and how susceptible men are to it. Being open about how men and women and the problems they face or their weaknesses does not equate to "disgust".

[Disenchantedly Yours]

Women tend to be more more relationships pro-active then men. Where they read articles and books they think will help them in their relationships and educate themselves on these things because of their desire of a fulfilling relationship.

 

Sincerely,

The filthy whore with her double standards that can go lick a dirty di ck!

[xxoo]

XXOO, thanks for providing a qoute! I'm glad because it helps me to better understand your perspective. However, is anything I said not true? The first sentence of mine is a little too passionate and all encompassing. But I do believe that are many boys/men out ther today that don't take time or pride in learning about real women. That they think that they can look at porn from early ages but still be able to healthily interact with women.

 

There are growing numbers of men, raised in a generation that never knew life before a computer, that have them sitting behind their computers learning about women from porn. Is this not just a fact? Statistically, the average age a man starts looking at porn is 11. Is that not just a fact? Do young men and boys not spend their childhoods looking at ideals about women and men through porn absorbing these messages in key developmental years? Is this not just a fact? How many men prize super hot women over regular ones? Again, is this not just a fact? How many young boys or men are putting in time to get to know *real* girls/women? Do not these computer images serve their every little whim and fancy?

 

Can you please point out where the disgust is in any of that? It seems that my issue is more with porn and how susceptible men are to it. Being open about how men and women and the problems they face or their weaknesses does not equate to "disgust".

 

I don't necessarily agree with your stated facts, especially men valuing super hot women over regular ones. The fact that men pay to see photos of super hot women in magazines does NOT convince me that they value those women more than regular women.

 

Maybe disgust is a projection, because I would be disgusted if I believed men valued hot women over regular women.

 

Boys and men want real girls and women, DY. I'm around high school boys. They are a horny bunch, wildly attracted to the real girls around them of all shapes and sizes. I have no fear that they are losing their drive to pursue real girls.

[aj22one]

Women tend to be more more relationships pro-active then men. Where they read articles and books they think will help them in their relationships and educate themselves on these things because of their desire of a fulfilling relationship.

 

Sincerely,

The filthy whore with her double standards that can go lick a dirty di ck!

 

You could probably say the same thing about men too. Neither gender is more "relationship oriented" than the other. Since everyone is biased, everyone thinks their own gender is more virtuous than the other.

[the wizard]

OP I wouldn't sweat it. The woman sounds rather idiotic, if she doesn't want that kind of attention then maybe she shouldn't flaunt her looks. You called her out on it which was the right thing to do. She wants to be more than a pretty face? Heh, she sounds like a blatant moron, I guess she's out of luck.

[Quiet Storm]

I use to work in advertising. And in advertising, how products are marketed toward men, has drastically changed. Where beer commericals of women in little tiny bikkinis use to do the trick, these commericals alone no longer sell products. Today's man wants something a little more evolved and isn't looking to be pandered to through his sexuality. It's the reason why we no longer see the same kind of beer commericals we use to. Sure, there are still beautiful women in beer commericals but the conversation in the commerical and how women are presented in these commericals have changed.

 

I disagree totally with this. You must not watch any Ravens games.

 

Men shouldn't take that personally, just like women shouldn't take porn personally.

Considering that porn isn't just about "lady lumps" , and that alot of the themes in porn are quite misogonstic while you just walking by a man isn't, it's really not even close to the same thing.

I think it's comparable because they are both taken personally, by SOME members of the opposite sex, which is results in anger & feeling disrespected.

 

To me, a man that get's angry because a hot woman doesn't want him, is taking it personally. To me, a woman that get's angry because men want to watch women in porn, is taking it personally.

 

As women, we aren't intentionally offending men by looking sexy. And men aren't intentionally offending women by watching porn. If the opposite sex gets offended by either scenario, that's on them. It's related to their own insecurities, IMO. They can feel offended and whine and cry about how unfair it is, but to expect other's to change their behavior because some people are too sensitive? I say toughen up. I'm not going to dress in a frumpy long dress because some guy can't get laid, and I don't expect men to stop watching porn because some women think it's wrong.

When we hold onto the idea that men are no better then neanderthals, we aren't doing men any favors. Especially when we come here and see all the feelings and thoughts men are capable of.

 

 

 

But why is men objectifying women (by looking at them or commenting on their body) neanderthal behavior? I think modern men do exert control. A neaderthal wouldn't just look, he would touch and take it.

 

Men can be emotional and sweet and have feelings and love their wives...and still objectify women. It's not so black & white.

 

I have no doubt that men are capable of controlling their "looking". When I am out alone, I get tons of looks. When I am out with my husband...I get no looks. They can control it, they just choose not to.

 

I think people can evolve, and culture can change...but I think a man's physical attraction to the female body will always be constant across all cultures and generations. Just like most women will always think babies are cute.

Edited November 17, 2011 by Quiet Storm

[Disenchantedly Yours]

xxoo

I don't necessarily agree with your stated facts...

 

Care to share the other points I made that you disagree with?

 

 

...especially men valuing super hot women over regular ones. The fact that men pay to see photos of super hot women in magazines does NOT convince me that they value those women more than regular women.

 

Why not?

 

If they wanted to see regular relateble women, that's what they would be happy to pay for. But that's not really want they want. They might settle for a more average girl in their real life, but they will probably spend a good chunk of their time throughout their life going back to those super hot images of super hot women inbetween interactions with their own mate. Maybe then it's not that they value super hot women over regular women (although I do believe men do) but put women in compartments to use based on their own lives. Super hot women for fantasy because they probably couldn't get the super hot woman they really wanted, and average regular girls they settle for, come to love, but at the end, still need the fantasy of the super hot women to sustain themselves through their parternship with their own partner.

 

How many posts on here to do we see about how important women's looks are? How a man doesn't like it when a partner gains weight? How much more value younger women have then older women? How much in men's media focuses mostly on a narrow type of women. Maxim, Playboy, Music Videos, Football games with cheerleaders...young, slim, pretty, big breasts...

 

Maybe disgust is a projection, because I would be disgusted if I believed men valued hot women over regular women.

 

Thank you for being honest about your projection.

 

Boys and men want real girls and women, DY. I'm around high school boys. They are a horny bunch, wildly attracted to the real girls around them of all shapes and sizes. I have no fear that they are losing their drive to pursue real girls.

 

High school boys aren't exactly known for being discriminating. If a girl is willing, they will probably pretty much go for it. But it doesn't say much about his real level of attraction or even respect for her XXOO. I think porn has really changed men. Do I think it's going to stamp out real live sex? Nope. But i certainly think it affects ideals about what sex is for both young boys and young girls that do turn into men and women. There are a lot of good articles out there about the affect it's having and the things boys will ask teenage girls to do because they saw in a porn. In most high schools, it's the "hot" girls that get the most attention and who the boys most want to be with. Do you really deny that?

 

There was a thread on here a long time ago where a young woman of 20 was talking about fear about her breasts sagging. Alot of guys where actually shocked that a 20 year old girl's breasts could sag. Because all they've ever seen are these perfectly photoshopped images, or girls that are weeded to show only perky breasts or girls that had work done. Even some guys on here would agree with me on this.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

You could probably say the same thing about men too. Neither gender is more "relationship oriented" than the other. Since everyone is biased, everyone thinks their own gender is more virtuous than the other.

 

No,I don't think women are more virtuous at all. I think they are more relationships minded and define themselves more through the positive relatoinships they have then men do. Which is why they are more inclined to seek answers to questions about relationships or ask other people for advice then men normally are.

[Ruby Slippers]

She sent me a message stating even though she appreciates the compliments and me "liking" her pictures, that she would like to be thought of more than just a pretty face.

Then maybe she should post something that reveals her intelligence, compassion, or other interior qualities, instead of pictures of herself in a bathing suit. I would message her back and tell her this.

[joystickd]

This men like this and women like that stuff is stupid. Everyone has something they are insecure its crazy when you try deny someone something because you are insecure. I know I look at porn if I'm with someone that is insecure about it and talks about it objectifying or some other argument like that constantly I would tell her to get on like she got sh*t on. There is too many other women out here to deal with one insecure. She can talk that craziness to her next man. Women if you deal with an insecure man tell him to get on like he got sh*t on. Life is too short for unecessary drama.

[Negative Nancy]

what this whole thread boils down to is this: men are "visual" creatures, i mean they always say it on here. and while women do like compliments on their looks, it doesn't mean we're happy when we sense that our looks are the only thing that you value in us. because women age, and men putting a huge emphasis on looks don't give us the feeling of security that you will stay with us when we get older.

 

it is the same as a woman who turns her head for men that flash status symbols. i.e. you're driving a ****ty bike or maybe a crappy old piece of junk, and she turns her head for a man who's drving a Porsche, and she just can't stop looking. Or for a man that is bigger than you, taller than you, more muscular...men always pretend they are so "above" things and claim we women have an incredible amount of unreasonable insecurities. but men are just as insecure, just about different things. imagine a man was on a trip to a casino and took a picture of himself at the black jack table, surrounded by tons of money on the table, maybe holding some notes or chips he's won in his hands. if a woman had posted "i like the view" how many men would have posted here "bro she sounds like a golddigger, stay away from her". yet men show no understanding for when women do the same? women don't want to be wanted for looks alone cos we know men are fickle. men don't want to be wanted for money, or why else do so many men on here complain about having to pay for a date?

 

we all know men value looks. that's why, personally i'm careful to invest my heart into a person who might one day fall out of love with me because I, in the future, will not longer be young. My boyfriend gives me no indication now that he is that type of man. On these boards, though, I see this left and right. Many people say this isn't the case, but the actions of many posters here say otherwise.

 

soserious said that her ex-husband didn't like growing and waking up to her aging face was a reminder that he was and cheated on her and left her for a woman 20 years younger. these are the kind of examples that understandably make women wary of men who openly value just her looks (like the original poster with his stupid comment).

[joystickd]

No,I don't think women are more virtuous at all. I think they are more relationships minded and define themselves more through the positive relatoinships they have then men do. Which is why they are more inclined to seek answers to questions about relationships or ask other people for advice then men normally are.

 

Not necessarily. A lot of times men don't have other people to ask for advice about relationships sometimes and primarily they want to have sex but not really for the sake of just having sex all the time. They mainly ask about advice to transition into sex. That doesn't make them less relationships minded. Women like emotional connections that how they guage interest. Men like physical connection and that is how they guage interest. The thing is women say all a man wants is sex but a lot want more. The thing is they don't want to invest in something risky and the same thing is for women too.

[xxoo]

Care to share the other points I made that you disagree with?

 

 

 

 

Why not?

 

If they wanted to see regular relateble women, that's what they would be happy to pay for. But that's not really want they want. They might settle for a more average girl in their real life, but they will probably spend a good chunk of their time throughout their life going back to those super hot images of super hot women inbetween interactions with their own mate. Maybe then it's not that they value super hot women over regular women (although I do believe men do) but put women in compartments to use based on their own lives. Super hot women for fantasy because they probably couldn't get the super hot woman they really wanted, and average regular girls they settle for, come to love, but at the end, still need the fantasy of the super hot women to sustain themselves through their parternship with their own partner.

 

How many posts on here to do we see about how important women's looks are? How a man doesn't like it when a partner gains weight? How much more value younger women have then older women? How much in men's media focuses mostly on a narrow type of women. Maxim, Playboy, Music Videos, Football games with cheerleaders...young, slim, pretty, big breasts...

 

 

 

Thank you for being honest about your projection.

 

 

 

High school boys aren't exactly known for being discriminating. If a girl is willing, they will probably pretty much go for it. But it doesn't say much about his real level of attraction or even respect for her XXOO. I think porn has really changed men. Do I think it's going to stamp out real live sex? Nope. But i certainly think it affects ideals about what sex is for both young boys and young girls that do turn into men and women. There are a lot of good articles out there about the affect it's having and the things boys will ask teenage girls to do because they saw in a porn. In most high schools, it's the "hot" girls that get the most attention and who the boys most want to be with. Do you really deny that?

 

There was a thread on here a long time ago where a young woman of 20 was talking about fear about her breasts sagging. Alot of guys where actually shocked that a 20 year old girl's breasts could sag. Because all they've ever seen are these perfectly photoshopped images, or girls that are weeded to show only perky breasts or girls that had work done. Even some guys on here would agree with me on this.

 

We have very different points of view, probably stemming from very different experiences.

 

I disagree with your perceptions of men, and their desires, on the whole. In fact, I find your characterizations of men offensive, as if they do not appreciate the women in their life. I think that is bull, and insulting to men and boys.

[joystickd]

I always laugh when men talk about golddiggers because 80% of “golddiggers” are not successful because they are too thirsty for money. Its kind of like a guy desperate for sex having trouble because he can't keep his dick in his pocket.