Negative Nancy Posted November 7, 2011 Posted November 7, 2011 (edited) I'm also all for women who expect the father to share parenting duties... and refusing to start a family with men who won't do that. Trotting off to work all day and dumping all of the parenting duties on the woman = bad father. that would be me. i don't expect the father to share 50/50 duties just for the sake of it or for so-called "everything's gotta be equal", though. my reason is that i'd love the dad to spend time with his kid, to be involved and thus having just as much an influence on the child like the mother. there's so many things only a father can teach his son or his daughter, so many male-bonding things and father-daughter stuff. a dad from 6pm to 8pm and on the weekends is not enough in my opinion, but i also understand that not all families have the opportunity to spend an equal amount of time with the kid. but ideally they would - a well-rounded healthy child needs both parents in my opinion. i see it with my little half-brother, he's 10, the baby-of-the-bunch, and such a cute little man, i love him to death and was fortunate enough to accompany his upbringing and he's turned out so well. my mother stayed home a while and my stepdad worked, but so did my stepfather and then my mother worked while he stayed home with him. they both chose to spend time with the child, and that's how it should be. why the ffff else would you have kids if you don't wanna spend time with them? he could almost be my kid, age-wise, that's why i'm kinda on the fence about own kids right now. maybe in a couple years. so my bf and i are living the DINK-lifestyle right now and maybe in a couple years when we have travelled some more and have experienced more of the finer things life has to offer, we're gonna settle down and start a family. Edited November 7, 2011 by Negative Nancy
ThsAmericanLife Posted November 7, 2011 Posted November 7, 2011 I'm envious that you are able to have a friendly relationship with your ex. I sometimes miss my ex terribly because he was my best friend for 8 years. Now I don't have that. It stinks, but with what he did, I can't ever be friends with him. He wanted to remain friendly, but I did not. And I always feel like the "lets be friends" and "let me see the dog" was his way of keeping tabs on me and of keeping me as a backup plan. If we were on good terms he might win me back if he wanted to. I couldn't allow myself to be put in that position. So it's just me and puppy-boy and I'm ok with that. I'm looking at my puppy-boy right now. We're gonna go for a little urban hike to the post office... it's a beautiful day up here in Upstate NY, isn't it? If you aren't too far away, maybe we can get the 'kids', ooops... I mean, dogs together.
ShannonMI Posted November 7, 2011 Posted November 7, 2011 I'm looking at my puppy-boy right now. We're gonna go for a little urban hike to the post office... it's a beautiful day up here in Upstate NY, isn't it? If you aren't too far away, maybe we can get the 'kids', ooops... I mean, dogs together. Yes that would be nice. I live near Cooperstown.
xxoo Posted November 7, 2011 Posted November 7, 2011 A lot of men won't date single mums because they are worried that their vagina is too loose after giving birth. Wow. I think that's a misnomer, really. I used to think I was super weird for being "I could have kids or not have kids and still be just as happy," but a lot of my friends seem to be the same way (some have extreme feelings, of course). I wonder if it's really all that weird, or if society just tells us we SHOULD feel strongly so many people pretend they feel strongly sure of their choice. I think you feel more strongly about your choice once you actually choose it anyway. I wonder if some people are more certain of their best path than others. emilia may genuinely feel that certain about her path. I had to weigh out the options to decide. I don't think it is so rare to feel initially equivocal about the choices, and go on to be happy with a well-considered decision.
zengirl Posted November 7, 2011 Posted November 7, 2011 I wonder if some people are more certain of their best path than others. emilia may genuinely feel that certain about her path. I had to weigh out the options to decide. I don't think it is so rare to feel initially equivocal about the choices, and go on to be happy with a well-considered decision. I think some people are. For me, I see a lot of great paths I could go down. What I don't do is regret the path I choose or spend time worrying about having so many paths. Instead, I enjoy the path I'm on!
xxoo Posted November 7, 2011 Posted November 7, 2011 Have you heard, "she let herself go after having kids"? A lot of that is not "letting herself go" but the natural effects of child bearing, including stretch marks, the loose tummy skin, breast changes, etc. I've NEVER heard it used in that context. In my communities, a mom who works out, stays fit, and dresses current is considered a MILF. The expected soft boobs and belly are part of what makes her a MILF. Signed, MILF
findingnemo Posted November 7, 2011 Posted November 7, 2011 I have 3 lovely kids, I would move mountains, take a bullet, catch a grenade but... Women should have the right to NOT WANT KIDS and not be made to feel bad about it. In Biology 101, they should learn about the physical toll having kids has on them (some more than others). In Economics 101, they should teach young people how to fund private schools and college for their kids. In Sociology 101, teach people about Ms and Ds and the growing trend of single parenthood. Explain to them the high probability that they'll be single and be solely responsible for their offspring. Teach them how to demand a pre-nupt detailing how much money should be set aside for the children and not waste time in courts defending the amount of child support required. Give them the information to help them make an informed choice whether they even want to have kids. There is a bloody conspiracy!!! No one really tells us what weird biological things happen to our bodies during pregnancy. It can be hilarious when you rush to the doctor wondering whether you're growing a tumor out of your bum and are told "Oh, that's normal in pregnant women". And the change in body shape? If anyone had told me that spending 2 hours/6 days a week in the gym would not get me a flat belly post-birth...? Who tells you about the sleep deprivation sometimes made worse by colic that can last anywhere from 6 months to a year? For G's sake, it's akin to Chinese torture. No one told me that my DH would turn out to be a selfish a** who would abandon all parental duties to me and that every single day I would know deep inside that I'm the Alpha and Omega when it comes to my kids. I want to go back to school. I want to go to Harvard, do a JD and a Masters. But how? I have 3 kids under the age of 8. I want to go to France and do the Camino de Santiago. I want to go to India to an Ashram for a month. I desperately need a tummy tuck but when will I have the time to do it? I love my kids and I wouldn't give them up for anything. But I wonder if I knew then what I know now: would I have had any? If you are sure you don't want kids, please please DO NOT HAVE THEM.
Wolf18 Posted November 8, 2011 Posted November 8, 2011 Sorry FindingNemo, enough of this feel-good 'nobody's ever wrong' mentality. Individual decisions impact everyone, period. Maternity is a woman's rite of passage. All these people that argue "well the world's overpopulated duuuuuudddee" are wrong. The Third World is overpopulated but not America and Europe. Virtually every policy maker is forecasting a complete collapse of our infrastructure by the time us 20 somethings get older , simply because there will be no young people! People are so plastic, petty and soulless, in this case both men and women. You don't want to reproduce, so what is your purpose in life then? To buy a second Lexus? To have perfect looks? You know what, let other people, virile people inherit this planet. Beneath the glamor and glitter of my Western civilization is an ugly mindset that hopefully I will in my lifetime get to see brought down with an iron fist.
MaxNoob Posted November 8, 2011 Posted November 8, 2011 All these people that argue "well the world's overpopulated duuuuuudddee" are wrong. The Third World is overpopulated but not America and Europe. Virtually every policy maker is forecasting a complete collapse of our infrastructure by the time us 20 somethings get older , simply because there will be no young people! Japan has a major problem with this, but North America's population is expected to continually increase due to immigration. People are so plastic, petty and soulless, in this case both men and women. You don't want to reproduce, so what is your purpose in life then? To buy a second Lexus? To have perfect looks? The time and money spent on raising 1 kid could instead be used to save the lives of thousands of people. You could give out gas masks to miners in Africa so they don't have to die 30 years earlier than they should. Disease carrying mosquitoes kill 2 million people each year; you could hand out $2 nets to help stop this. Construct irrigation canals to help out some of the 800 million people who don't have access to clean drinking water. Simply buy food locally and give it to the starving; 1 billion people don't have enough food because they can't afford it and 35 million people die each year from starvation.
aj22one Posted November 8, 2011 Posted November 8, 2011 Sorry FindingNemo, enough of this feel-good 'nobody's ever wrong' mentality. Individual decisions impact everyone, period. Maternity is a woman's rite of passage. All these people that argue "well the world's overpopulated duuuuuudddee" are wrong. The Third World is overpopulated but not America and Europe. Virtually every policy maker is forecasting a complete collapse of our infrastructure by the time us 20 somethings get older , simply because there will be no young people! People are so plastic, petty and soulless, in this case both men and women. You don't want to reproduce, so what is your purpose in life then? To buy a second Lexus? To have perfect looks? You know what, let other people, virile people inherit this planet. Beneath the glamor and glitter of my Western civilization is an ugly mindset that hopefully I will in my lifetime get to see brought down with an iron fist. "individual decisions impact everyone, period"- so who I date, what I decide to eat for breakfast, those decisions impact "everyone"? How were you impacted by me eating scrambled eggs this morning? On children, dude, not everybody should have kids. I mean in your fantasy world, irresponsible people who can't take care of children should be forced to have and raise children, because their decisions would destroy your life. Lol "iron fist". Little melodramatic don't ya think?
El Brujo Posted November 8, 2011 Posted November 8, 2011 I read about some insane statistic that one child from birth to 18 cost it's parents $225,000+. That's only ONE KID!! Criminy!!! WTF does that kid eat??? Caviar??? This guy OTOH seems to have the right answer: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5AI3U5ZxsHI
ShannonMI Posted November 8, 2011 Posted November 8, 2011 Sorry FindingNemo, enough of this feel-good 'nobody's ever wrong' mentality. Individual decisions impact everyone, period. Maternity is a woman's rite of passage. All these people that argue "well the world's overpopulated duuuuuudddee" are wrong. The Third World is overpopulated but not America and Europe. Virtually every policy maker is forecasting a complete collapse of our infrastructure by the time us 20 somethings get older , simply because there will be no young people! People are so plastic, petty and soulless, in this case both men and women. You don't want to reproduce, so what is your purpose in life then? To buy a second Lexus? To have perfect looks? You know what, let other people, virile people inherit this planet. Beneath the glamor and glitter of my Western civilization is an ugly mindset that hopefully I will in my lifetime get to see brought down with an iron fist. Shut the f*ck up. Honestly:rolleyes: Your arguments are ridiculous. Some people don't want kids. So does that mean that those particular people should all be shot because they have no purpose in life? That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. Go smoke your pipe and zip it.
norajane Posted November 8, 2011 Posted November 8, 2011 People are so plastic, petty and soulless, in this case both men and women. You don't want to reproduce, so what is your purpose in life then? To buy a second Lexus? To have perfect looks? Why must we have a purpose? More importantly, why must we have a purpose that pleases you? We're all just making our way through life as best as we can. That doesn't make us petty and soulless. That makes us human.
Nexus One Posted November 8, 2011 Posted November 8, 2011 You don't want to reproduce, so what is your purpose in life then? To buy a second Lexus? To have perfect looks? One of the greatest scientists that ever lived, Nicola Tesla, never had any kids. He lived for his science. Pretty much all the electronics in your house has technology in it that he invented. Was his life without purpose? Granted though, not everyone is a Nicola Tesla. When you ask "what is the purpose of life", what answer holds more truth do you think from a human perspective? 1. The purpose of life is to reproduce. 2. The purpose of life, is life itself. I think that from a human's perspective the latter makes more sense.
thatone Posted November 8, 2011 Posted November 8, 2011 people want what will make them happy and is attainable. to put it very bluntly, most people will never have a profession that they completely enjoy. most people never have the big house or the ferrari or the freedom and means to do the things they really want to do. what EVERYONE can have is a marriage and kids. it doesn't take any money or status or personal success to get a girl pregnant. everyone can do it. all that said, there's nothing wrong with people whose only goal in life was/is to get married and have children. that's fine. but people who want something different aren't somehow damaged or strange, they're just different. i'm not trying to brag, i fully admit that my professional success was largely due to luck, right place/right time. but i have the big historic house, and the luxury car, and the time/freedom/money to travel whenever i want, and i don't want to give all that up for children. i don't owe my parents grandchildren, and i don't owe the future another populated generation, and i don't owe our economy a future of new workers. the world doesn't do me any favors, why should i feel like i owe the world something?
ThsAmericanLife Posted November 8, 2011 Posted November 8, 2011 (edited) Sorry FindingNemo, enough of this feel-good 'nobody's ever wrong' mentality. Individual decisions impact everyone, period. Maternity is a woman's rite of passage. All these people that argue "well the world's overpopulated duuuuuudddee" are wrong. The Third World is overpopulated but not America and Europe. Virtually every policy maker is forecasting a complete collapse of our infrastructure by the time us 20 somethings get older , simply because there will be no young people! People are so plastic, petty and soulless, in this case both men and women. You don't want to reproduce, so what is your purpose in life then? To buy a second Lexus? To have perfect looks? You know what, let other people, virile people inherit this planet. Beneath the glamor and glitter of my Western civilization is an ugly mindset that hopefully I will in my lifetime get to see brought down with an iron fist. Well, I guess those policy makers in America and Europe better get on it and make it worth our while to reproduce. The reason why women reproduce in developing countries so much more is for the same reasons American and European families used to reproduce alot more 100 years ago. It makes sense for them... and they had no choice. Any suggestions? What iron fist would that be? Locking 20-30 something aged women in baby-making concentration camps? I believe someone has thought of that before. A Canadian author if memory serves. The religious right would like to remove access to birth control... access to education... and lots of other things that have improved our overall health. Although, I see they don't offer much for children AFTER they are born... so I'm not really convinced they care about women or children much... they just care about getting more white babies born... somehow, someway. Edited November 8, 2011 by ThsAmericanLife
Woggle Posted November 8, 2011 Posted November 8, 2011 If America stopped being such a dog eat dog anti-family society people might feel better about having kids.
Wolf18 Posted November 9, 2011 Posted November 9, 2011 I agree with the sentiment that the government should help people that want to have children, particularly the most creative and productive elements of our society who unfortunately do not have many children. i don't owe my parents grandchildren, and i don't owe the future another populated generation, and i don't owe our economy a future of new workers. the world doesn't do me any favors, why should i feel like i owe the world something? [/Quote] If the world didn't do you any favors, how were you born? Someone did you a favor by conceiving you, rearing you, then taking care of you. Any suggestions? What iron fist would that be? Locking 20-30 something aged women in baby-making concentration camps? I believe someone has thought of that before. A Canadian author if memory serves. [/Quote] The Iron Fist is going to be when virile/fertile nations like Mexico or China conquer a selfish, materialistic and elderly America and enslave you If America stopped being such a dog eat dog anti-family society people might feel better about having kids. [/Quote] I agree. Capitalism, consumerism, and social Marxism/feminism have gotten together to destroy the family for a variety of alien political and economic interests. Don't worry though, such an unnatural system is doomed to collapse. To defy nature is an abomination, and mother nature always sets arrogant humans straight in the end.
Woggle Posted November 9, 2011 Posted November 9, 2011 I am not saying that everybody should have children or their own family but society sure does not make it easy for those who do.
findingnemo Posted November 9, 2011 Posted November 9, 2011 Well, I guess those policy makers in America and Europe better get on it and make it worth our while to reproduce. The reason why women reproduce in developing countries so much more is for the same reasons American and European families used to reproduce alot more 100 years ago. It makes sense for them... and they had no choice. Any suggestions? What iron fist would that be? Locking 20-30 something aged women in baby-making concentration camps? I believe someone has thought of that before. A Canadian author if memory serves. The religious right would like to remove access to birth control... access to education... and lots of other things that have improved our overall health. Although, I see they don't offer much for children AFTER they are born... so I'm not really convinced they care about women or children much... they just care about getting more white babies born... somehow, someway. True, true. In developing countries like mine, women still believe that getting married AND having kids is a status symbol. Those that find they are barren suffer untold shame. Although we have some of the highest population growth in Africa, the more girls get educated the lower the number of kids they have. It is really about stages of development. The more educated you are, the more you are able to get a well paying job. The more income you have, the ability to acquire luxury goods increases. But to live a certain lifestyle, you must continually work and focus on generating that income. This also means private schools, holidays etc. This will inevitably impact your concept of family and help determine how many kids you want. More money = less kids in general. There are too many kids abandoned by their parents. Those are luckier than the kids who live with mothers who never wanted them and basically torture them throughout their childhoods. Everybody has a right to a happy life and no one can determine what happy is for an individual. So why this conspiracy to force people to have children? It doesn't make the world a better place. It is only beneficial for economists who see the kids as the future labour force and the future market.
coffeeaddict Posted November 9, 2011 Posted November 9, 2011 One of the greatest scientists that ever lived, Nicola Tesla, never had any kids. But his parents did.
Emilia Posted November 9, 2011 Posted November 9, 2011 The reason why women reproduce in developing countries so much more is for the same reasons American and European families used to reproduce alot more 100 years ago. It makes sense for them... and they had no choice. They reproduce in high numbers because there is a high infant/child mortality rate in the developing world still and there is no social security, ie you need a larger number of children to ensure there are enough hands in the family for labour and to support elderly parents. In the developed world we don't have these pressures anymore and as a result individuals have more choices, you don't have to adhere to what your immediate family or the larger community want.
Pierre Posted November 9, 2011 Posted November 9, 2011 But his parents did. Tesla's kid could have cured cancer. Who knows??
Pierre Posted November 9, 2011 Posted November 9, 2011 Pierre and his 1,751 posts, has nothing better to do than give advice on some random forum to random people. He thinks he is the wise man whose wisdom is needed around the world. Pathetic does not even begin to describe this loser. Go play in the real world you wanker! we are all tired of your bull crap! A troll:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:!
stillafool Posted November 9, 2011 Posted November 9, 2011 If the world didn't do you any favors, how were you born? Someone did you a favor by conceiving you, rearing you, then taking care of you. Did they do us a favor or did we do them a favor? No one asks to come here. Parents have kids because they want them or they made a mistake. There is no favor in being born into this cold, hard world.
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