A Duck's Dilemma.

[Duckduckgoose]

The main reasons she likes this man is his attitude, stability and career. Aren't you unemployed and living at home or am I confusing you with someone else?

 

Umm... no. I have a full time job in my degree field, and I have my own apartment. I'm not rich, but I'm not broke

 

Well, attitude stability career, and common interests. We're both very adventurous, witty, and outdoorsy.

[FitChick]

You're confusing me.

 

I got my own apartment, have a job and go to college.

The only thing I don't have is relationship experience.

 

I apologize. Easy mistake to make on this forum.

[FitChick]

Umm... no. I have a full time job in my degree field, and I have my own apartment. I'm not rich, but I'm not broke

 

Well, attitude stability career, and common interests. We're both very adventurous, witty, and outdoorsy.

 

In my previous post I was addressing somedude, not you. That's why I quoted him. I confused him with one or more other self-pitying whiners on here who want women to save them from themselves.

[somedude81]

You're forgiven FitChick.

 

Want to spot me? I'm doing squats

[Teknoe]

The main reasons she likes this man is his attitude, stability and career.

 

 

Don't forget, stability is about more than just career. Sure, the two go hand in hand, but stability is also about ATTITUDE.

 

I know plenty of career men, but who are extremely instable with their dozens and dozens of insecurities.

 

Working toward becoming a well-rounded, as complete as possible person is never a bad idea.

[Duckduckgoose]

Well I'm gonna type out what really bothers me about him. For all the progress we've made in the relationship... there are just a few things really bugging me, and I don't know if it's making me unconsciously sabotage things.

 

First off, I am pretty moderate as far as politics go. He is quite conservative. I've seen a lot of things in life, a lot of people hurting, and I think that helping people is the way to go. He comes off as far more selfish in that regard. We are both Christian and I have shown him in the Bible where Jesus says we should help the poor. Its not a political issue to me it's a command. I try showing him the Bible where it has lots of verses on social justice, etc. But he gets wrapped up in his politics... part of me thinks maybe on that level he is not living in the real world. He will bash candidates he does not agree with, he refuses to see the other side of issues (I look at issues from both sides before making a decision)...

 

...and part of me thinks he may be pretty misogynistic. Not because he has treated me badly... he treats me pretty well. But sometimes I think things he says are pretty underhanded and demeaning. I don't know if he's intentionally coming off that way, or just what... I am kinda paranoid in that regard.

 

It started when he was watching the debates... he favors the conservative candidates obviously... but they are against women for the most part, from what I'm seeing. Against women and the poor. The contraceptive issue seems to bring it to a head. I took a contraceptive in college not only to prevent pregnancy but also because my period was messed up pretty bad. I take what is considered a contraceptive now because I have a hormonal imbalance (which was what was throwing my period out of whack back in college). Well I was putting myself through college and I had to pay more for my BC pills then I did for food a month. When I tell him this it's like he doesn't care... I struggled and a lot of other women struggled... but to him it's all about the "Reds" winning against the "Blues". He said he agreed that medically necessary pills (like the ones I'm on now) should be covered... but part of me thinks he's lying?

 

Also, something else that REALLY REALLY bothered me... he was talking about an aunt that cheated on her husband with her boss, and made the comment that if women stayed at home then they wouldn't have the opportunity to cheat. I said that if any person, man OR woman wanted to cheat, nothing would hold them back... I also said that I had had plenty of opportunity to cheat on my exH when my marriage was going downhill, but I didn't. I stayed faithful despite the fact that I wasn't getting any sex...when he said that it felt like a slap in the face to the fact that I've been loyal to every man I've been with... including him. It was ****ing insulting. If a person is going to cheat then nothing is going to stop them. If a person isn't going to cheat then nothing is going to change that.

 

But when he said that, part of me felt like if we got married he would try to lock me away from society... and at what point would he stop? Would just not working be enough? Would he try to ban Facebook or keep me on a GPS tracker at all times? His mom is stay-at-home but that's prolly because his dad is a millionaire and his mom has her hands full with their house and other properties, and she didn't get a degree... she seems happier at home maybe?

 

But what about me? I'm an intelligent college graduate, with a good job and a lot to offer to society? I'm also learning nursing because there is such a shortage of them and it will only get worse as the population gets older. I'm almost afraid to ask him... and I think I'm being more than a little paranoid. His words and actions do not match... his words can be cutting in the little ways... but his actions... well he treats me well? He's very sweet. Just yesterday he said he was going to the store did I need anything? Well no... but he got me chocolate anyway.

 

So yes, I'm confused.

[Imageiko]

Seems like it'll say irreconcilable differences on your divorce papers...

[fortyninethousand322]

There's a difference between not wanting to help the poor and being against government programs for the poor. I'm for the former but generally against the latter because they usually don't work. There's also a difference between being for birth control and being for government mandates regarding it.

 

If he's generally against women being able to buy and use birth control and he's just against poor people no matter what that's a bad sign.

 

Then again, look at Carville and Matlin. You never know...

[FitChick]

I am pretty moderate as far as politics go. He is quite conservative....andpart of me thinks he may be pretty misogynistic. Not because he has treated me badly... he treats me pretty well. I think things he says are pretty underhanded and demeaning. I don't know if he's intentionally coming off that way, or... I am kinda paranoid in that regard.

 

I had to pay more for my BC pills then I did for food. He said he agreed that medically necessary pills (like the ones I'm on now) should be covered... but part of me thinks he's lying?

 

He made the comment that if women stayed at home then they wouldn't have the opportunity to cheat. ..when he said that it felt like a slap in the face to the fact that I've been loyal to every man I've been with...

 

His mom is stay-at-home ... she seems happier at home maybe?

 

... but his actions... well he treats me well? He's very sweet. Just yesterday he said he was going to the store did I need anything?

 

What were your ex's political views?

 

I thought feminism was supposed to give women a choice or do you think your choices are better than other women's which are different? His mother was happier working for her family instead of a stranger. He sees his parents happy in their marriage so it's reasonable he'd like to duplicate that but not inevitable. What if his parents were divorced? How do you think that would have changed his attitude toward marriage?

 

Unless one of you is planning to run for office, politics should be at the bottom of your list of priorities.

 

Have you heard the expressions "talk is cheap" or "actions speak louder than words?" How he treats you is more important than what he says. Over time you can probably have a big influence on him if he loves you.

 

I'm wondering if you are ready for a relationship. It sounds like he is triggering your unresolved issues with your ex, interpreting everything he says in a negative way. I also think that you like having control now and are afraid you will lose it as he becomes more confident and invested.

 

I agree that if Carville and Matalin can stay married, no one else can use politics as an excuse. If you start arguing, agree that politics is one subject you will not discuss with each other.

 

By the way, when I was in college I got my BC pills from planned parenthood. They were either free or very inexpensive.

Edited March 17, 2012 by FitChick

[thatone]

Well I'm gonna type out what really bothers me about him. For all the progress we've made in the relationship... there are just a few things really bugging me, and I don't know if it's making me unconsciously sabotage things.

 

First off, I am pretty moderate as far as politics go. He is quite conservative. I've seen a lot of things in life, a lot of people hurting, and I think that helping people is the way to go. He comes off as far more selfish in that regard. We are both Christian and I have shown him in the Bible where Jesus says we should help the poor. Its not a political issue to me it's a command. I try showing him the Bible where it has lots of verses on social justice, etc. But he gets wrapped up in his politics... part of me thinks maybe on that level he is not living in the real world. He will bash candidates he does not agree with, he refuses to see the other side of issues (I look at issues from both sides before making a decision)...

 

...and part of me thinks he may be pretty misogynistic. Not because he has treated me badly... he treats me pretty well. But sometimes I think things he says are pretty underhanded and demeaning. I don't know if he's intentionally coming off that way, or just what... I am kinda paranoid in that regard.

 

It started when he was watching the debates... he favors the conservative candidates obviously... but they are against women for the most part, from what I'm seeing. Against women and the poor. The contraceptive issue seems to bring it to a head. I took a contraceptive in college not only to prevent pregnancy but also because my period was messed up pretty bad. I take what is considered a contraceptive now because I have a hormonal imbalance (which was what was throwing my period out of whack back in college). Well I was putting myself through college and I had to pay more for my BC pills then I did for food a month. When I tell him this it's like he doesn't care... I struggled and a lot of other women struggled... but to him it's all about the "Reds" winning against the "Blues". He said he agreed that medically necessary pills (like the ones I'm on now) should be covered... but part of me thinks he's lying?

 

Also, something else that REALLY REALLY bothered me... he was talking about an aunt that cheated on her husband with her boss, and made the comment that if women stayed at home then they wouldn't have the opportunity to cheat. I said that if any person, man OR woman wanted to cheat, nothing would hold them back... I also said that I had had plenty of opportunity to cheat on my exH when my marriage was going downhill, but I didn't. I stayed faithful despite the fact that I wasn't getting any sex...when he said that it felt like a slap in the face to the fact that I've been loyal to every man I've been with... including him. It was ****ing insulting. If a person is going to cheat then nothing is going to stop them. If a person isn't going to cheat then nothing is going to change that.

 

But when he said that, part of me felt like if we got married he would try to lock me away from society... and at what point would he stop? Would just not working be enough? Would he try to ban Facebook or keep me on a GPS tracker at all times? His mom is stay-at-home but that's prolly because his dad is a millionaire and his mom has her hands full with their house and other properties, and she didn't get a degree... she seems happier at home maybe?

 

But what about me? I'm an intelligent college graduate, with a good job and a lot to offer to society? I'm also learning nursing because there is such a shortage of them and it will only get worse as the population gets older. I'm almost afraid to ask him... and I think I'm being more than a little paranoid. His words and actions do not match... his words can be cutting in the little ways... but his actions... well he treats me well? He's very sweet. Just yesterday he said he was going to the store did I need anything? Well no... but he got me chocolate anyway.

 

So yes, I'm confused.

 

a) he's stupid. that's why he gets so into the 'red vs blue' thing. they prey on stupid, that's their target market. and yeah, they don't care about the details of the issues you're 'discussing' with them. they deal in generalizations that other people feed to them. without someone to tell them what to think, they don't think at all.

 

b) yeah, he meant all that stuff about men being in control of women. you can see that all over the faces of religious conservatives in america. i've heard the same story from female friends who have dated and then broken up with religious conservatives, only to find out later that the women they wind up marrying are completely subservient and controlled by those men. that's what those men want.

 

c) at what point would he stop? never. he has a few hundred people to get dressed up and sit with every sunday that tell him he's right and everyone else is wrong, no matter how f*cking crazy he is.

 

take the lesson for what it is, a lesson. get rid of him and don't date religious conservatives in the future.

[26.2]

Duck, I think you sound like a really sweet person. I think there is a problem with someone who doesn't naturally pick up on affection. I'm not sure about the Asperger... Have you two been intimate sexually?

 

I'm actually wondering if he may have some issues with his sexuality that he is repressing due to his religious upbringing and views. He seems rather hostile toward women...

[dreamingoftigers]

Duck....

 

You KNEW that this was going to be a conflict from the first few times you met him.....

 

Weigh it out and see how much these battles are worth compared to the bigger picture.....

[Emilia]

a) he's stupid. that's why he gets so into the 'red vs blue' thing. they prey on stupid, that's their target market. and yeah, they don't care about the details of the issues you're 'discussing' with them. they deal in generalizations that other people feed to them. without someone to tell them what to think, they don't think at all.

 

b) yeah, he meant all that stuff about men being in control of women. you can see that all over the faces of religious conservatives in america. i've heard the same story from female friends who have dated and then broken up with religious conservatives, only to find out later that the women they wind up marrying are completely subservient and controlled by those men. that's what those men want.

 

c) at what point would he stop? never. he has a few hundred people to get dressed up and sit with every sunday that tell him he's right and everyone else is wrong, no matter how f*cking crazy he is.

 

take the lesson for what it is, a lesson. get rid of him and don't date religious conservatives in the future.

 

This. Word for word. You sound like a lovely lady Duck and I think you should have more .... confidence perhaps to find a likeable, gentle, positive man instead of this one.

[Duckduckgoose]

There's a difference between not wanting to help the poor and being against government programs for the poor. I'm for the former but generally against the latter because they usually don't work. There's also a difference between being for birth control and being for government mandates regarding it.

 

If he's generally against women being able to buy and use birth control and he's just against poor people no matter what that's a bad sign.

 

Then again, look at Carville and Matlin. You never know...

 

I asked him for clarification. He is not against birth control, he is against the government mandates. He also thinks that if it's medically necessary it should be covered... this was after I explained to him about PCOS and stuff like me being hormonally imbalanced and needing contraceptive to "balance" me out... I can get pretty depressed-ish without it. I knew there was something with my hormones when I was with my exH, I just wasn't sure what it was. Now I know I'm a little out of whack (pun intended).

 

He's pretty ambiguous on helping the needy. He does pay tithes and it's a good chunk of money every year ($7000), and our church helps the poor, I guess he figures that covers it?

 

I asked him all these things on Saturday when we had some time alone. He was saying I didn't listen, which I know is a legit problem because my exH brought it up a lot. So I asked him "What can I do that will show you I'm listening?" He told me "Let me finish and don't cut me off". Fair enough.

 

I've also mentioned several times to him that politics is gonna have to be an "agree to disagree" area with us, and that it's best for us to find the common ground in what we both believe (I'm moderate socially and fiscally conservative so it's not difficult)... so he did some of that. Usually when he presents his opinion he comes across as reasonable. And sometimes it's really easy to show him the other side and make him think, sometimes not.

[Duckduckgoose]

Seems like it'll say irreconcilable differences on your divorce papers...

 

Kinda like with my exH? This made me lol

[Duckduckgoose]

What were your ex's political views?

 

I thought feminism was supposed to give women a choice or do you think your choices are better than other women's which are different? His mother was happier working for her family instead of a stranger. He sees his parents happy in their marriage so it's reasonable he'd like to duplicate that but not inevitable. What if his parents were divorced? How do you think that would have changed his attitude toward marriage?

 

Unless one of you is planning to run for office, politics should be at the bottom of your list of priorities.

 

Have you heard the expressions "talk is cheap" or "actions speak louder than words?" How he treats you is more important than what he says. Over time you can probably have a big influence on him if he loves you.

 

I'm wondering if you are ready for a relationship. It sounds like he is triggering your unresolved issues with your ex, interpreting everything he says in a negative way. I also think that you like having control now and are afraid you will lose it as he becomes more confident and invested.

 

I agree that if Carville and Matalin can stay married, no one else can use politics as an excuse. If you start arguing, agree that politics is one subject you will not discuss with each other.

 

By the way, when I was in college I got my BC pills from planned parenthood. They were either free or very inexpensive.

 

My exH was more liberal than I am, by a good margin. We didn't agree on everything and I oftentimes pushed my opinion on him and would get mad when he didn't agree... it's something I am trying to learn not to do. No two people have the same political views... not even the most liberal or most conservative on earth. I didn't respect my exH's opinion even though it was close to mine. That was my fault and I know it pushed him away. I decided that whatever the political opinion of the next person I would do my damndest to respect it... and yeah it's not easy. I have to fight that urge to be like "YOU'RE WRONG AND HERE'S WHY!!" I have had to really soul search to come to the conclusion that it's an opinion, and there are facts on both sides of the debate to support those both kinds of opinions.

 

Also, if things get heated in the political department I'm gonna ask him flat out, "Who invited (name said politician) into our relationship? This is between you and me; not you, me and (said scumbag)". And that's the truth of it. When he gets opinionated I have said in the past "Look, I'm on your side. I disagree with you but I'm on your side. Please don't push me away like this". I guess that kind of goes with the politician in the relationship kinda thing.

 

If his parents were divorced I'm not sure I'd consider him. The parents level of happiness in a relationship can reflect directly on how the child wants a relationship. My exH's parents hate each other, they live separately... it's not a good situation. He brought some of that into our marriage. I say "can reflect" because my dad's parents were divorced and remarried 3 times, and my dad saw that... chose to not be that sort of man, and has been married to my mom for 32 years.

 

I looked at his parents' relationship... his mom seems to run things, she's not bossy but she gets things done. His dad treats his mom VERY WELL, and is very polite, calm, and kind of mischievous. Not what I expected from millionaires I guess. I thought they would be stuck up, better-than-thou... quite the opposite. I recently had surgery and she brought me food... AT WORK... how's that for awesome? They are very generous and friendly... his siblings are pretty cool, they remind me of when I was younger, I get on with his family/extended family pretty well... I've met most all of them.

 

I do have some unresolved issues... the only way to get them to surface I think is probably in the context of a relationship, that way I can see them, own them, and be rid of them. It won't be simple as that I know. But once I recognize them for what they are then I can work on them.

 

When I was in college I lived in a state where the closest Planned Parenthood was about 200 miles away. I live in the southeastern USA, and those kinds of places tend to be few and far between. The city I live in now had a PP clinic that shut down the month I moved here

 

Thank you for the input

[Duckduckgoose]

I also think that you like having control now and are afraid you will lose it as he becomes more confident and invested.

 

This resonates. I know I have control issues to some extent. I've taken the back seat to the boyfriend in a lot of things, I give my opinion but I expect to be respected and taken into account when I ask him things.

 

Instead sometimes it seems like if I didn't do what he wanted to do we wouldn't do anything at all... he will get my input and we will come to a compromise (we travel every weekend basically), but if I suggest something he will pretty much fall all over himself to NOT do it. Just today it was the same thing: I suggested something for date night tomorrow, something he had suggested last week but I was unable to do because of a prior commitment. This week I suggested it, and he starts in with his routine that pretty much tells me "nope not gonna do it". It was a ride on a bike path... and instead he takes off early today to take a ride on the SAME bike path. So tomorrow I'm wondering if his excuse is gonna be "I have a meeting at work; I'm tired from riding yesterday, or ; I rode that path yesterday".

 

And he's done it before, just different situations. I've talked to him about it, but I don't see much improvement. I haven't told him how it makes me feel, but I might well do that tomorrow. When he suggests things I'm pretty cool with it, unless it's life-threatening or too time consuming... when I suggest things, even things well within the realm of things he likes (I wouldn't expect him to want to paint toenails with me) it's like he falls all over himself to NOT do it.

 

I don't like being the critical one, but these are things I know I need to bring to his attention. Its not healthy for me to feel like my opinion isn't respected.

 

Also, I do things to try and build him up. I tell him he looks nice, I tell him he's a good boyfriend (he is, he's not perfect, but he's good for where he started at), I thank him for things he does; I tell him I appreciate when he does things...and I don't get much of that in return. I don't think he's EVER complimented me on how I look... I'm not a beauty queen but I'm far from ugly too. He's never told me I'm a good girlfriend... he does say "Please" and "Thank You" now, and "I appreciate"... so I don't know if he's learning these things and they are learned behaviour or if it's supposed to come naturally?

 

Either way, I don't feel like he's doing much to build me up, and I try to build him up with compliments, respect, and affection. I should tell him this too, but one thing at a time... phew.

[Duckduckgoose]

a) he's stupid. that's why he gets so into the 'red vs blue' thing. they prey on stupid, that's their target market. and yeah, they don't care about the details of the issues you're 'discussing' with them. they deal in generalizations that other people feed to them. without someone to tell them what to think, they don't think at all.

 

b) yeah, he meant all that stuff about men being in control of women. you can see that all over the faces of religious conservatives in america. i've heard the same story from female friends who have dated and then broken up with religious conservatives, only to find out later that the women they wind up marrying are completely subservient and controlled by those men. that's what those men want.

 

c) at what point would he stop? never. he has a few hundred people to get dressed up and sit with every sunday that tell him he's right and everyone else is wrong, no matter how f*cking crazy he is.

 

take the lesson for what it is, a lesson. get rid of him and don't date religious conservatives in the future.

 

This is a good point, and one I've considered. I've debated breaking up with him and will, should I find out that he really thinks women should be subservient (which isn't the attitude in our church and we both attend the same church, and his mom isn't subservient at all really). My parents are both religiously conservative and they are 50/50 on stuff. Both of my parents worked, and still work, they tackle chores pretty equally... my dad treats my mom well (and he cooks sometimes haha). So some religiously conservative types are that way, and my boyfriend may or may not be. I am scared that he is, because that WILL spell the end of the relationship. I am far more than chattel, and even our preacher mentioned this is a sermon that the boyfriend wanted me to watch with him.

 

Thank you for bringing this up though. If I do dump my boyfriend I want concrete evidence to bring to him as to why. This helps me gather my thoughts. I'd prefer to work things out, but I would NOT stand for being treated like a second class citizen, especially considering I am just as intelligent as he is.

[fortyninethousand322]

This resonates. I know I have control issues to some extent. I've taken the back seat to the boyfriend in a lot of things, I give my opinion but I expect to be respected and taken into account when I ask him things.

 

Instead sometimes it seems like if I didn't do what he wanted to do we wouldn't do anything at all... he will get my input and we will come to a compromise (we travel every weekend basically), but if I suggest something he will pretty much fall all over himself to NOT do it. Just today it was the same thing: I suggested something for date night tomorrow, something he had suggested last week but I was unable to do because of a prior commitment. This week I suggested it, and he starts in with his routine that pretty much tells me "nope not gonna do it". It was a ride on a bike path... and instead he takes off early today to take a ride on the SAME bike path. So tomorrow I'm wondering if his excuse is gonna be "I have a meeting at work; I'm tired from riding yesterday, or ; I rode that path yesterday".

 

And he's done it before, just different situations. I've talked to him about it, but I don't see much improvement. I haven't told him how it makes me feel, but I might well do that tomorrow. When he suggests things I'm pretty cool with it, unless it's life-threatening or too time consuming... when I suggest things, even things well within the realm of things he likes (I wouldn't expect him to want to paint toenails with me) it's like he falls all over himself to NOT do it.

 

I don't like being the critical one, but these are things I know I need to bring to his attention. Its not healthy for me to feel like my opinion isn't respected.

 

Also, I do things to try and build him up. I tell him he looks nice, I tell him he's a good boyfriend (he is, he's not perfect, but he's good for where he started at), I thank him for things he does; I tell him I appreciate when he does things...and I don't get much of that in return. I don't think he's EVER complimented me on how I look... I'm not a beauty queen but I'm far from ugly too. He's never told me I'm a good girlfriend... he does say "Please" and "Thank You" now, and "I appreciate"... so I don't know if he's learning these things and they are learned behaviour or if it's supposed to come naturally?

 

Either way, I don't feel like he's doing much to build me up, and I try to build him up with compliments, respect, and affection. I should tell him this too, but one thing at a time... phew.

 

This just totally baffles me here. I think if I were in his shoes I'd be the total opposite. I'd probably be too willing to do stuff the girl wanted to do, be too complimentary, etc.

 

I don't think his behavior has much to do with being a late bloomer in and of itself.

[Duckduckgoose]

This. Word for word. You sound like a lovely lady Duck and I think you should have more .... confidence perhaps to find a likeable, gentle, positive man instead of this one.

 

My confidence was shot after my exH divorced me. TBH I've kept at least half an eye open in case things don't work out with this guy. But I am putting a lot of effort into this because if it doesn't work I want to know I tried my best, like at least I did more to work this out then the total lack of opportunity I had to remedy things once my exH told me he wanted a divorce. I guess there goes another issue there.

 

I pray about my relationship daily. I also have a "work things out" mentality. Whether that's a benefit or a bane I don't know yet. I didn't have the chance to use it to save my marriage

 

Plus, I realize if we can get through the worst of the kinks early in this relationship there will be something strong there.

[Duckduckgoose]

This just totally baffles me here. I think if I were in his shoes I'd be the total opposite. I'd probably be too willing to do stuff the girl wanted to do, be too complimentary, etc.

 

I don't think his behavior has much to do with being a late bloomer in and of itself.

 

I agree. It comes off as self-centered and shows a lack of empathy. I think empathy is a learned behaviour, since I see it a little bit in him sometimes, but it's a slow road.

 

Things won't change overnight, he's had 30 years to get the way he is. But I expect effort even when it's hard. He knows how hard this is for me... I've told him that it takes a lot of patience and effort on my part, but I am willing to show him and guide him because I care for him. Just so long as he's willing to learn.

 

Being stubborn or selfish is a losing situation. For everyone involved.

[Duckduckgoose]

Duck....

 

You KNEW that this was going to be a conflict from the first few times you met him.....

 

Weigh it out and see how much these battles are worth compared to the bigger picture.....

 

 

Absolutely, and I'm trying to work around it. There are other issues too which make me wonder if it's worth fighting this uphill battle.

 

Things weren't this difficult with my exH, but that's because he backed down too much probably... maybe he was too avoidant or whatever. The first year or so of dating my exH was easy like Sunday morning.

 

This relationship tends to bounce between wiping with Charmin and wiping with a pinecone. Some are my issues some are his.

[fortyninethousand322]

I agree. It comes off as self-centered and shows a lack of empathy. I think empathy is a learned behaviour, since I see it a little bit in him sometimes, but it's a slow road.

 

Things won't change overnight, he's had 30 years to get the way he is. But I expect effort even when it's hard. He knows how hard this is for me... I've told him that it takes a lot of patience and effort on my part, but I am willing to show him and guide him because I care for him. Just so long as he's willing to learn.

 

Being stubborn or selfish is a losing situation. For everyone involved.

 

I know it's an unwritten rule never to speak ill of fellow late bloomers but, maybe his lack of success in this arena is because of his inability to show any empathy or selflessness and not just because a long rash of bad luck.

 

As a side note I really do appreciate people like you who are willing to put a little work in to try to make things work with an inexperienced guy. Too many people would be quick to just run away as fast as possible and not have to deal with it. So, even if things don't work out with him, I tip my hat to you.

[thatone]

This is a good point, and one I've considered. I've debated breaking up with him and will, should I find out that he really thinks women should be subservient (which isn't the attitude in our church and we both attend the same church, and his mom isn't subservient at all really). My parents are both religiously conservative and they are 50/50 on stuff. Both of my parents worked, and still work, they tackle chores pretty equally... my dad treats my mom well (and he cooks sometimes haha). So some religiously conservative types are that way, and my boyfriend may or may not be. I am scared that he is, because that WILL spell the end of the relationship. I am far more than chattel, and even our preacher mentioned this is a sermon that the boyfriend wanted me to watch with him.

 

Thank you for bringing this up though. If I do dump my boyfriend I want concrete evidence to bring to him as to why. This helps me gather my thoughts. I'd prefer to work things out, but I would NOT stand for being treated like a second class citizen, especially considering I am just as intelligent as he is.

 

straying into politics but whatever, this is my opinion...

 

my family is catholic, i have given up on the church entirely. don't believe in it, won't ever be a part of it again.

 

the reason is their political dabbling. i think i as a non believer know more about these people's religion sometimes than they do.

 

yeah it's internet cliche but WWJD?

 

would jesus rail against charity for the poor if it took away from corporate tax breaks?

would jesus condemn other people to lesser status because they didn't agree with him?

would jesus call a woman a whore for having a means of birth control like limbaugh is doing lately?

would jesus joke about killing people in another country because they were of a different lifestyle/religion?

would jesus consider a right to own a gun more important than educating children or caring for the poor elderly?

 

these people aren't christians, they're just evil and selfish.

 

sounds like you need to make political views a deal breaker. i have, for the above reasons.

[Emilia]

But I am putting a lot of effort into this because if it doesn't work I want to know I tried my best, like at least I did more to work this out then the total lack of opportunity I had to remedy things once my exH told me he wanted a divorce. I guess there goes another issue there.

 

 

I do understand this and also what you said about fixing bigger issues early makes a relationship stronger. Successful conflict resolution can bind people together yes.

 

You do have to learn to recognise incompatibility though (I know you know that) and I think you pick up signs earlier with more practice - rather than view it as 'giving up'. I suppose what I don't understand is why you have been friends with this person in the first place. I agree pretty much 100% with thatone because his views on the hypocrisy of so called Christians are the same as mine but I do hope this works out the best way for you Duck.