Should men who are average looking, settle, or should they wait around for a love..?

[ThsAmericanLife]

Variations of this thread have come up more than once from this OP... and many times by other people (usually men).

 

It comes across as quite passive-aggressive to even ask this question.

 

... the OP isn't getting super-'hot' whats-er-face (we'll leave out the definition of what is 'hot' for the moment) and then he decides to trash so-called 'average' looking girls.

 

... as if, their 'looks' immediately qualifies him for a relationship with them.

 

tsk, tsk...

[fortyninethousand322]

Most people are missing the point of this thread. OP feels like if he goes after the gorgeous women he'll be turned down since he's not attractive enough in their eyes so he might as well go after the type of women who might be more at his level of attractiveness. You could call that "settling", or you could call it "being realistic". Your choice of course.

 

OP's mistakes are equating attraction to love and vice versa, and assuming that average looking women can't be just as attractive (if not more so) than their "super model hot" peers. Attraction is not just about looks, as odd as that sounds.

[Mme. Chaucer]

It's just so wildly off base. Yep, fabulous looks do not equal love. Just don't.

[grkBoy]

Attraction is not just about looks, as odd as that sounds.

 

I agree.

 

All those hot club women I used to be into were shallow, empty, and vapid. They could never fathom the idea of a night at home, or going to some new/interesting thing. For them, they only wanted lavish dinners out and bottle service at some fashionable spot...preferably with a narcissistic yuppie that works out regularly.

 

It's amazing how many hot women I've seen and known who are chronically single. Part of it is their choices in men, but the other part is most of the guys who come on to them only want to bang them.

 

Beauty is only skin deep...but a b***h will always be a b***h, and an a******e will always be an a*****e. The looks fade, but you're still stuck with someone who never makes you feel ideal.

 

I'm not saying ALL hot people are horrible, but merely pointing out that good looks alone isn't the best way to find Mr or Ms Right...especially if you don't fit the lifestyle those people want.

[Els]

I know, it's absurd to think that greater physical attractiveness will equal greater love!

 

You fall in love with a person--not a face, or a body. And when you fall in love with a person, you fall in love with their face, and body, and voice, and mannerisms, and smell, and, and, and.....

 

There is no settling when you are in love. Even for the most average among us

 

Precisely. Besides, it just seems silly to me to call someone 'average' purely by virtue of their physical appearance, when there are a hundred other aspects to a person.

[somedude81]

I think everybody here is missing the meaning of what settling really means to an inexperienced, lonely guy.

 

Lets use this example.

 

Joe is nearly 30 years old, a virgin, never dated, even though he's wanted to. Women always turn him down. He's an average looking dude with an average job.

 

One day Joe meets Suzy. Although she's a nice girl, Joe is not attracted to Suzy at all. (Fill in your reasons why you think not)

 

Suzy starts to like Joe and starts to flirt with him. One day she asks Joe out.

 

What should Joe do?

 

Here it is, finally a woman is interested. But he doesn't like how she looks at all.

 

If he accepts her offer, he knows he would be settling.

 

Would that be fair to Joe? Would it be fair to Suzy?

[Els]

I think the OP specifically equated 'going after an average-looking' girl as 'settling', in his opening post, and others responded from there. I responded that for some of us 'average-looking folk', being with other 'average-looking people' does not necessarily mean settling.

[somedude81]

Yeah, I think she shot himself in the foot by using average. Though he did say chubby which probably means he's talking about an overweight woman with an average face.

 

Even then, what about the guy in the scenario I wrote?

[Els]

I have never supported settling, SD. But as I said in my very first response to this thread, learning about what one truly wants and needs out of a relationship is not akin to settling. So if the guy has done a lot of introspection and genuinely feels he does not like the girl, then he should not be with her. If he's just afraid that people will look down on him for not having a trophy gf or such, he may want to rethink things if that is not getting him anywhere.

 

IME when people say chubby they usually don't mean literally overweight, just heavier than the average 'ideal', which is usually model-sized. Then again, that's an entirely personal opinion.

[xxoo]

I think everybody here is missing the meaning of what settling really means to an inexperienced, lonely guy.

 

Lets use this example.

 

Joe is nearly 30 years old, a virgin, never dated, even though he's wanted to. Women always turn him down. He's an average looking dude with an average job.

 

One day Joe meets Suzy. Although she's a nice girl, Joe is not attracted to Suzy at all. (Fill in your reasons why you think not)

 

Suzy starts to like Joe and starts to flirt with him. One day she asks Joe out.

 

What should Joe do?

 

Here it is, finally a woman is interested. But he doesn't like how she looks at all.

 

If he accepts her offer, he knows he would be settling.

 

Would that be fair to Joe? Would it be fair to Suzy?

 

Don't settle for Suzy if there is no attraction. That isn't fair to either.

 

But---this example is NOT average! Joe may be average in appearance, and average in income, but his dating experiences are far from average. Something else is going on. It is not his average appearance and income that is holding him back from finding love.

[somedude81]

Don't settle for Suzy if there is no attraction. That isn't fair to either.

 

But---this example is NOT average! Joe may be average in appearance, and average in income, but his dating experiences are far from average. Something else is going on. It is not his average appearance and income that is holding him back from finding love.

You're right, in terms of dating experiences, Joe is not average. But that doesn't mean that it isn't something that happens to men and there are many reasons why that could be.

 

If Joe doesn't settle for Suzy, there is a chance he will be alone forever. It's taken this long for a woman to be interested, who knows if it will happen again.

 

That's the dilemma.

[fortyninethousand322]

You're right, in terms of dating experiences, Joe is not average. But that doesn't mean that it isn't something that happens to men and there are many reasons why that could be.

 

If Joe doesn't settle for Suzy, there is a chance he will be alone forever. It's taken this long for a woman to be interested, who knows if it will happen again.

 

That's the dilemma.

 

Precisely. Although, I would have this caveat: neither of them is required to marry and have children with the other. I mean as long as they're both having fun and not viewing this as some sort of mercenary arrangement, I think it could work. Besides, maybe Joe ends up falling in love with Suzy or discovering some part of her than he previously didn't see attractive but now does.

 

This is far from the crime people are making it out to be.

[grkBoy]

I think everybody here is missing the meaning of what settling really means to an inexperienced, lonely guy.

 

Lets use this example.

 

Joe is nearly 30 years old, a virgin, never dated, even though he's wanted to. Women always turn him down. He's an average looking dude with an average job.

 

One day Joe meets Suzy. Although she's a nice girl, Joe is not attracted to Suzy at all. (Fill in your reasons why you think not)

 

Suzy starts to like Joe and starts to flirt with him. One day she asks Joe out.

 

What should Joe do?

 

Here it is, finally a woman is interested. But he doesn't like how she looks at all.

 

If he accepts her offer, he knows he would be settling.

 

Would that be fair to Joe? Would it be fair to Suzy?

 

The problem with that is if Joe came to me one day complaining how hot women won't talk to him and the only women he can find are bland ugly women...I'd simply tell him he's no prize and it's clear the "hot" women don't want what he's offering.

 

I'd ask him how he feels about growing old and dying alone.

 

If he says he can die alone and be happy rather than marry someone he's not horny for...then he's "settling" by getting with Suzy.

 

However, if he's lamenting on how much he wants to find love, marry, have a family, etc...and loathes the idea of growing old alone...then I'll tell him he's got to pick from his available dating pool. It's not "settling", but being REALISTIC.

 

It's funny how many men and women tell the opposite gender to lower their standards, but they won't do it on themselves. Yet, to hear "you should lower your standards" by their own gender and you're accused of preaching "settling". Look how many women lashed out at Lori Gottleib for her book.

 

Your available dating pool is just that. It's what you have to choose from. If being alone is not an option for you, then either choose from your pool, or widen it. Go pay money to bring a hot Eastern Bloc village girl to the US to marry and take care of. Go long distance and find a hot girl somewhere in the country who will be with you. Go do self-improvement to become the guy the hot women want.

 

I just think it's ridiculous for men or women to complain that they can't get an "upper echelon" mate when they have plenty of great options they should look into. It's like the movie Teen Wolf where Scott is hot for the manipulative b***h Pamela when the average-looking girl next door Boof would love him unconditionally...even if he's a werewolf.

[fortyninethousand322]

I just think it's ridiculous for men or women to complain that they can't get an "upper echelon" mate when they have plenty of great options they should look into. It's like the movie Teen Wolf where Scott is hot for the manipulative b***h Pamela when the average-looking girl next door Boof would love him unconditionally...even if he's a werewolf.

 

I think you're barking up the wrong tree in regards to SD81 (or myself for that matter). SD has repeatedly stated his reasonable standards. It's not like he has a girl next door loving him unconditionally, so it's really a false choice.

[grkBoy]

I think you're barking up the wrong tree in regards to SD81 (or myself for that matter). SD has repeatedly stated his reasonable standards. It's not like he has a girl next door loving him unconditionally, so it's really a false choice.

 

I'll be honest. I live in a major city, but I was looking to other states and even Canada at one point and was serious about trying a LDR. I expanded my pool simply because I wanted to find someone I liked, and was willing to do more for it.

 

I dunno what else to advise. This topic has spun into a "why can't average guys have a hot woman?" and the question of "what is settling?" I can only tell what I feel and what I've seen. I also want to make sure the women are not off the hook. Both genders at times hold strange standards and thus it keeps both sides from finding one another.

 

So it's really a question of what any of you guys are willing to do to find Ms Right? I ask the same of the women looking for Mr Right.

[fortyninethousand322]

I'll be honest. I live in a major city, but I was looking to other states and even Canada at one point and was serious about trying a LDR. I expanded my pool simply because I wanted to find someone I liked, and was willing to do more for it.

 

I dunno what else to advise. This topic has spun into a "why can't average guys have a hot woman?" and the question of "what is settling?" I can only tell what I feel and what I've seen. I also want to make sure the women are not off the hook. Both genders at times hold strange standards and thus it keeps both sides from finding one another.

 

So it's really a question of what any of you guys are willing to do to find Ms Right? I ask the same of the women looking for Mr Right.

 

I wasn't trying to be vitriolic or anything, and I definitely don't think it's a male vs female thing either (unlike the newly resurrected "male virginity vs prostitution" topic). But it does strike me as extremely odd that the men who want relationships are only finding women who want to be friends with them and the women who want relationships are only running into players. I mean you would think with the dating market more expanded (with online dating and the like) than ever that we'd be able to get the supply and the demand better coordinated. There seems to be a great plethora of people dissatisfied with the dating market, why aren't they dating each other? Is the human race just screwed?

[somedude81]

I wasn't trying to be vitriolic or anything, and I definitely don't think it's a male vs female thing either (unlike the newly resurrected "male virginity vs prostitution" topic). But it does strike me as extremely odd that the men who want relationships are only finding women who want to be friends with them and the women who want relationships are only running into players. I mean you would think with the dating market more expanded (with online dating and the like) than ever that we'd be able to get the supply and the demand better coordinated. There seems to be a great plethora of people dissatisfied with the dating market, why aren't they dating each other? Is the human race just screwed?

 

I think the problem now is actually women.

Now keep on pining for a RLship it will not happen the way you want it to until you are much older. Young women these days have no reason to hang it up and get serious with anyone until they think that if they wait too much longer they won't be able to have a marriage and children. (The social pressure to do so dose not kick in until close to 30 now a days.)

Women changed, and now they are their own worst enemy.

 

I just think it's ridiculous for men or women to complain that they can't get an "upper echelon" mate when they have plenty of great options they should look into.

I've explained man times how I'm not going for the top women. Just everyday normal girls.

 

BTW, I had the chance to be Joe when I was 23.

 

She was 18, 5'2 and about 200lbs. I wasn't attracted to her at all. But desperation causes people to do stupid things.

 

She wasn't stupid and figured out that I wasn't attracted to her and was only with her because she was a girl. And she ended it soon afterward.

[oaks]

I think the problem now is actually women.

 

Should we get rid of them?

[Sanman]

It is funny because most of the men I know 'settled' for their current mate. The usual trade-off that I have seen was looks for personality. Three of my closest friends were recently married. I can tell you for a fact that all three had their reservations about these women when they first met. However, over time, they realized that they enjoyed the company of these girls and it became more than about looks. That is life. The truth is that no one is the bad guy for asking a girl out even if he is not physically attracted. You neve know how you will feel about her unless you give it a go.

[Els]

Should we get rid of them?

 

ROFL. :lmao:

 

Nah, both men and women have changed, simply because society has. Society is now about instant gratuition, no commitments, free-flying life. This is shown both in the women who don't want relationships to 'hold them back', and also in the men who only want to be FWBs and nothing else. Back in the olden days, relationships were considered important things to women, more so than career, and men knew they had to marry a woman before they could get sex from her. This has changed completely. It is not necessarily a bad thing, but it has sort of led to the demise of LTRs, and is not the fault of one gender in particular.

[somedude81]

Back in the olden days, relationships were considered important things to women, more so than career, and men knew they had to marry a woman before they could get sex from her.

Want to guess why the belief that men had to marry a woman before they could get sex from her changed?

 

Or how about the more modern belief that a man had to at least be in a serious relationship with a woman before he could get sex from her.

[mn311601]

Attraction is not just about looks, as odd as that sounds.

 

attraction may not be all about looks, but if you don't find your SO physically attractive what's the point?

[AHardDaysNight]

attraction may not be all about looks, but if you don't find your SO physically attractive what's the point?

 

Exactly. What's the point?

 

If I didn't find a girl at least "cute", why would I want to date her? She's be friendzoned.

[mn311601]

Exactly. I'm sorry, but a woman could have the nicest personality in the world. Be extremely fun to be with, etc. but if I don't want to see her naked, I'm not going to date her.

[verhrzn]

And frankly, it's cruel to the girl to keep her around because you hope you might become attracted to her because of her personality.

 

I've been that girl several times, and each time it takes a bigger dent out of my self-esteem, because eventually the guy DOES find a girl who he actually does find physically attractive, and dumps the "settled for" girl.