alexandria35 Posted October 5, 2011 Posted October 5, 2011 I've been cheated on, and I've been snooped on, and I assure you that the feeling is the same. I find the above very difficult to believe. I've been snooped on and it pissed me off and yes I felt somewhat disrespected. It didn't devastate me the way infidelity devestates and destroys a person. I didn't lose 15 pounds in a week because I felt sick to my stomache everytime I tried to eat. I didn't have to take time off work because I couldn't concentrate, I wasn't bursting into tears several times a day. I didn't have to seek counselling or enlist the help of antidepressants to help me cope with the knowledge that I had been snooped on.
melenkurion Posted October 5, 2011 Posted October 5, 2011 I've been cheated on, and I've been snooped on, and I assure you that the feeling is the same. You're obviously telling the truth there, but that is not the same for everyone. I've also had both happen to me. The cheating bothered me much, much more than the snooping. I raged about the snooping, I yelled a lot when I worked it out, but I was totally over it in about a week. Perhaps I shouldn't have been, I don't know. The cheating... Well it's a year so far, I'll keep you posted.
Wandaland Posted October 5, 2011 Posted October 5, 2011 a few months later, she went to use the family computer, and her husband had forgotten to sign out of his email. She was about to log out when she noticed an email from a girl he worked with a subject line that was something to the effect that she had something awful to tell him. She was worried about him, so she read the email. turned out that he had slept with this girl while he was away, and she was emailing him to tell him she had found out she had an STD ( syphilis). He'd read the email, so he knew about it, but had said nothing to her. She had confronted him, and he turned it around and tried to make HER feel guilty for reading his email. That's terrible. Did she also get STD? Is she still with her husband?
Buck Turgidson Posted October 5, 2011 Posted October 5, 2011 Buck's been snooped on, and he's been cheated on. But he doesn't clarify whether or not the reason he's been snooped on is because he was suspected of cheating, himself. Buck actually sounds like someone who's cheated himself, has been cheated on, doesn't trust anyone anymore, and wants to leave himself freedom/secrecy to cheat again in a future relationship--you know, so no other woman can ever cheat on him, first, ever again. Incorrect answer. You don't know me. I have never, EVER cheated, EVER, period, end of story. I'm just a dude who doesn't believe he owns his wife as his slave, or that she owns him, and that claiming rights of ownership over another human being--- one that you claim to love, no less--- is wrong. Betrayal of trust, no matter how minimal you see it, is wrong. The minute you do that, you lose all moral high ground. You're projecting. Owl, as much as I disagree with it, I respect your point of view, and I hope you find someone who shares those values, as I have someone who shares mine. You're right--- you will never convince me, and I don't really want to convince you. I'm just answering your questions. My main objective was to answer the OP's questions as I see them. You ask how I suggest the OP learn the truth. I answer again that the detailed truth is irrelevant. There are three honorable courses of action: (1) accept that her partner is a cheater, and continue in the relationship with that knowledge, (2) reject his cheating ways and divorce, or (3) if she absolutely must "Verify the Truth," then get his permission to rifle through his **** at will and verify away. Her choice, but me, I'd rather live alone than in a police station as somebody's parole officer.
Summer Breeze Posted October 5, 2011 Posted October 5, 2011 So your expectation would be that everyone who's ever been in a position where they sense something wrong and suspect that their spouse may be lying about infidelity (or something else) should immediately seperate, divorce, and never look back, based entirely on an unsubstantiated feeling (at that point)? I've never thought about it that way but since you've stated it in black and white. Yes. If I didn't trust the person I was supposed to be closest to enough to be able to ask them a question and be sure I was getting an honest answer then I wouldn't stay with them. Why would you want to be around someone you felt you couldn't trust. If you're concerned you ask and you get an answer and react from that. If I chose to stay it would be with enough conviction that I wouldn't snoop. When you're to the point of snooping you're to the point you're allowing that the worst can be a reality and you have to disprove it. I don't want to be with someone that does something that would let me feel that way.
serial muse Posted October 5, 2011 Posted October 5, 2011 (edited) Incorrect answer. You don't know me. I have never, EVER cheated, EVER, period, end of story. I'm just a dude who doesn't believe he owns his wife as his slave, or that she owns him, and that claiming rights of ownership over another human being--- one that you claim to love, no less--- is wrong. Betrayal of trust, no matter how minimal you see it, is wrong. The minute you do that, you lose all moral high ground. You're projecting. Owl, as much as I disagree with it, I respect your point of view, and I hope you find someone who shares those values, as I have someone who shares mine. You're right--- you will never convince me, and I don't really want to convince you. I'm just answering your questions. My main objective was to answer the OP's questions as I see them. You ask how I suggest the OP learn the truth. I answer again that the detailed truth is irrelevant. There are three honorable courses of action: (1) accept that her partner is a cheater, and continue in the relationship with that knowledge, (2) reject his cheating ways and divorce, or (3) if she absolutely must "Verify the Truth," then get his permission to rifle through his **** at will and verify away. Her choice, but me, I'd rather live alone than in a police station as somebody's parole officer. I understand what you're saying...but I honestly don't think this addresses many cases. Because in many cases, it's not a question of obtaining "detailed" truth so much as ANY truth...when there is long-term gaslighting and undermining of one's judgment and even sense of justification in asking questions AT ALL...it really isn't a matter anymore of just trusting one's gut and walking. It becomes an imperative to KNOW - and much of that has to do with needing to know whether you are, in fact, as paranoid as you have been told - by the person who is supposedly closest to you and knows you best. It's hard not to think that in that case, perhaps you are wrong, are paranoid, are responsible for any marital distance due to your suspicions. It's not so cut and dried as "if you want to snoop, clearly something is very wrong in the marriage, so just walk." That's how it might be in an ideal world, but judging from these boards, it very rarely plays out that way. People are uncertain, worried that they are paranoid, they're being lied to and undermined...knowing something for certain can become the most important thing. It was for me. I agree with what freestyle wrote, for that reason. When the gaslighting begins in earnest is when snooping becomes justifiable. It shouldn't be a regular part of the relationship. But there is a turning point past which I think it is both reasonable and fair. And...I've been snooped on as well as cheated on, too. Snooping was annoying and hurtful in its way...but there is really no comparison when it comes to the fallout and the depth of the pain caused by cheating. I still find myself triggered by things, even many years later - and I've long since divorced the man who cheated on me. Edited October 5, 2011 by serial muse
PhoenixRise Posted October 5, 2011 Posted October 5, 2011 OP If you are still reading this thread....SNOOP. Snoop until you are sure you have enough of the truth to make a sound decision. Snoop until you know as much as you want to know no matter how much that is. Snoop until you get tired of snooping. It is very clear that everyone has different ideas about what the honorable thing to do is. It is very clear that everybody has different ideas about how you should react to feeling distrust in the marriage. Here is the thing, it is your life. It is your sanity. It is your family at stake. Snoop. Without guilt, without worrying about hurting his feelings. Snoop. And find out what YOU need to know to make informed decisions about your life. Some here have said that having the feeling of mistrust is enough for you to leave. Some here have said that snooping (to them) is the equivalent of cheating and would be a dealbreaker (to them). Those are very valid ways of looking at things....for them. YOU do whatever you need to do to get some peace of mind for yourself. As for me, I reconciled with my husband and I snooped. Whenever I wanted to or felt like I needed to I snooped. Now I would not have let snooping become a way of life for me (and really I don't need to now as we are both transparent), but immediately after dday and even for awhile right after we reconciled I snooped. I have never regretted it and I never felt a nano second of guilt for it. AND when my husband found out I was snooping all he said was "I am so sorry I ever did anything to break your trust and I hope I earn it back one day" He has earned it back and I no longer snoop. But bottom line, somewhere between the advice to immediately dump the cheater and the advise to try try again there is a grown-a$$ woman who needs to figure out who she is and what she believes in light of the bomb that has gone off in her marriage. Figure out what actions you can take that you can OWN without apology. Good luck with everything, no matter what you decide to do.
Summer Breeze Posted October 5, 2011 Posted October 5, 2011 This is just an expression of your lack of true commitment then. "Oh the going's getting tough, I think I'll get going." It's absurd to assume that the appropriate reaction to feeling a lack of trust is just to leave, that either you have to accept what someone is telling you with complete faith or it's time to leave, no middle ground at all, no ambiguity. It's like you've never been in a real relationship, have you? No it's like when I feel like I can't trust the word of my partner I think I'll get going. Why would I want to feel like snooping is the way to go forward? If his word isn't clear enough or I'm in some sort of gaslight fog and he can't be reasonable enough to explain the things that are confusing me then why would I want to be with him? Why is it absurd to think that a lack of trust is justification to leave? As I said, if there are issues you talk about them. If there are any doubts you make your decisions. I wouldn't snoop-I'd leave first. You're right. Once you hit what you're calling middle ground or ambiguity then you get the answers that cover all of your questions or you don't. Then you decide to stay or you decide to leave. I would leave before I would snoop. No, you're right. I've never been in a real relationship. That's sarcasm you see dripping off these words.
alexandria35 Posted October 5, 2011 Posted October 5, 2011 For those saying anyone who thinks their partner is lying to them should either just stay and suck it up or leave and move on, I don't quite get how you would expect somebody in a longterm marriage, possibly with children, to just end the marriage at the first sign of dishonesty. That sounds crazy to me. Divorce is a lifechanging event that can be long and complicated, not to mention the impact it has on children. I would be msystified at anyone who brought that upon their family just because they thought their spouse maybe, might be, possibly lying about something. I'm not a BS but I've been lied to. When you ask a liar if they're lying they don't say 'well yes, as a matter of fact I am' they usually swear they are not lying, just like someone who isn't lying might. Whenever I have found out for sure that someone I thought was lying to me was in fact for sure lying to me, it has always come as a huge relief. Because when I thought maybe they were lying but they said they weren't and I didn't know for sure, I was confused and wondering if there was something off with me. Like maybe I'm the one causing the problems with my distrust or there is something wrong with my thinking, etc..And I've been wrong too. There have been times when I thought maybe somebody wasn't being honest and it turns out they were. Since I have been both wrong and right in terms of truth I would think it would be difficult to completely end a relationship based on suspicion and not fact. How could I move on in a healthy way, not ever knowing for sure if my distrust was founded or unfounded. Wouldn't I always be questioning my reality? Wondering, did they ruin our relationship by lying or did I ruin it by not trusting?
nyrias2 Posted October 6, 2011 Posted October 6, 2011 And, how about this? People who have nothing to hide, hide nothing. If he is serious about restoring his marriage, HE should be handing over all his passwords to email and cell phone accounts to PROVE to his wife that what he says is true. He should be working to restore the trust he destroyed by any means available to him, even having conversations about his feelings with his wife, not his brother so she once again, feels betrayed by his lies to her. That is what intimacy is: Sharing all your feelings with each other, not just the ones you choose and pick. Sparing your spouse's feelings is a very neat justification to engage in an affair and keep it secret. Secrets KILL intimacy. How about this? Snooping is a kind of mistrust, and it is ALSO a kind of betrayal. Tell me snooping on an INNOCENT NON-CHEATING spouse does not hurt. It may not hurt as much as a A, but it still does. So snooping on a cheating spouse (and unless you already confirm it, should suspicion grounds to BETRAY your spouse???) is at best using a SMALLER betrayal to fight a bigger one. By that logic, is a revenge A ok? It is not about having anything to hide. It is all about betrayal.
Spark1111 Posted October 6, 2011 Posted October 6, 2011 How about this? Snooping is a kind of mistrust, and it is ALSO a kind of betrayal. Tell me snooping on an INNOCENT NON-CHEATING spouse does not hurt. It may not hurt as much as a A, but it still does. So snooping on a cheating spouse (and unless you already confirm it, should suspicion grounds to BETRAY your spouse???) is at best using a SMALLER betrayal to fight a bigger one. By that logic, is a revenge A ok? It is not about having anything to hide. It is all about betrayal. Snooping is a natural response to questioning your reality. You may be the sweetest, kindest, most trusting, loving person in the world, but something has set your internal compass to pull up short and wonder, "What the hell is going on here?" Something is very wrong, but you cannot put your finger on what it is. You may question the person you love and trust most in the world and get a resonse of: "Just tired. This new job is kicking my azz." OR "What are you talking about? How DARE you question me, my actions, my work schedule, my emotional distance. Don't you love me? Stop it." OR "Nothing is wrong. Just tired and stressed. Stop asking me. Everything is fine." But it is not, and you are unsure why or what has caused this sudden shift in your reality. Snoop until you find the answers you are not receiving from your SO, the person you love and trust most on the planet. If your gut instinct is steering you correctly, you will find something to explain it all: An affair A substance abuse and possible addiction A gambling addiction A porn addiction A job loss AN UNDISCLOSED SECRET OD SOME SORT. Where there is a secret, there is no healing, no growth, no venue to support, no change. Snoop away. If you love the person, there is no way to help, or walk away, when everyone is in limboland. You have a right to respectful privacy in a marriage, but truly, why do you need it with the person you are most intimate with on the planet? You have no right to secrecy in a marriage. There is a huge difference between the two and if you do not understand that, DO NOT get married. Snoop away. Better yet Nyrias, what would you deem private from a spouse? I could care less what my spouse wanted to know about me, about anything I do or say anywhere. I have nothing to hide. There is nothing I would not share with him if he wanted to know. Snoop away. I am not scared by it at all. That is why I espouse 'People who have nothing to hide, hide nothing.' Understand it. Live it. What is your beef with that?
Spark1111 Posted October 6, 2011 Posted October 6, 2011 No it's like when I feel like I can't trust the word of my partner I think I'll get going. Why would I want to feel like snooping is the way to go forward? If his word isn't clear enough or I'm in some sort of gaslight fog and he can't be reasonable enough to explain the things that are confusing me then why would I want to be with him? Why is it absurd to think that a lack of trust is justification to leave? As I said, if there are issues you talk about them. If there are any doubts you make your decisions. I wouldn't snoop-I'd leave first. You're right. Once you hit what you're calling middle ground or ambiguity then you get the answers that cover all of your questions or you don't. Then you decide to stay or you decide to leave. I would leave before I would snoop. No, you're right. I've never been in a real relationship. That's sarcasm you see dripping off these words. SB, I respect that you realized immediately you could never trust your spouse again after infidelity and ended the marriage. You are not alone in that decision. BUT, what is you had discovered a substance abuse, or gambling or porn addiction....would you have felt as strongly about divorcing? Or, would you have snooped to determine the issue and tried to support a remorseful spouse through the process of becoming whole again and detoxing from the addiction? Would you have given the marriage a shot IF your spouse had done everything neccessary to overcome the weakness? Or, would the breach of trust in these areas force you to file for divorce immediately because the trust was broken? Not meaning to put you on the spot, but many put a much higher premium on infidelity as a dealbreaker to a marriage than porn or drugs or gambling addiction. It is because we attach our moral and romantic views to it and our egos can't take the hit, YET the biochemistry is the same. Would you have moved to divorce if snooping had discovered your xH had the other issues instead of the affair?
silic0ntoad Posted October 6, 2011 Posted October 6, 2011 I'm just a dude who doesn't believe he owns his wife as his slave, or that she owns him, and that claiming rights of ownership over another human being--- one that you claim to love, no less--- is wrong. Incorrect answer. Buck, no one is claiming ownership of another person here- in this skewed perception you have, you're misinterpreting. Snooping may seem like a big deal to you - but guess what? They normally wouldn't give a **** if they had nothing to hide. Ever are the treacherous distrustful. Treacherous because they are hiding the truth. Distrustful because they'll be the first to question you - long before you're onto their little game. I disagree with the mindset you have - privacy may be a right, but you give up that right when you become my wife/long term gf, when it comes to my feelings. If I feel you're not being honest, I own the right to make sure you're being honest. I admire blind trust; but it also gets you hurt. Please, stop these transhumanist new age hippie arguments. We all know snooping isn't anywhere near as bad as downright being unfaithful, and we all also know that a loving, caring partner won't hide their phone or get angry at you for looking at it.
Owl Posted October 6, 2011 Posted October 6, 2011 Owl, as much as I disagree with it, I respect your point of view, and I hope you find someone who shares those values, as I have someone who shares mine. You're right--- you will never convince me, and I don't really want to convince you. I'm just answering your questions. My main objective was to answer the OP's questions as I see them. Thanks BT. And the beauty of this is (for me) that I have indeed found someone who shares my values. The same wife I snooped on, in my case. Interestingly enough, DURING her affair and for a while afterwards, she was indeed livid that I snooped, got the proof, and confronted her. I heard the "violated privacy" and "controlling" comments for quite sometime. The funny thing is...her stance and song changed over time. On the rare occasion that all of this comes up in discussion, she's adamant about how glad she is that I fought for our marriage, and that I didn't back down. The funny thing is...last year when she got ready to go on a trip, she wanted to make sure all of her email accounts/etc...were secure. She made sure I had all the info I needed to make sure our bills were covered while she was gone...and then asked me to help her redo all of her passwords on all of her IM/email/gaming accounts. What a turn around from way back when. The other funny thing about it is...I don't remember what we changed those passwords to now. No need to snoop...because she's once again restored trust and demonstrated to me over time that she's indeed trustworthy. I'm sure I COULD get into her accounts...but there's no desire or need to do so. I don't advocate snooping "for no reason". But to me, it makes sense to get the info you need to make the decisions you face via that means if your partner has given you sufficient reason to believe that they're NOT being honest or trustworthy with you.
Owl Posted October 6, 2011 Posted October 6, 2011 I've never thought about it that way but since you've stated it in black and white. Yes. If I didn't trust the person I was supposed to be closest to enough to be able to ask them a question and be sure I was getting an honest answer then I wouldn't stay with them. Why would you want to be around someone you felt you couldn't trust. If you're concerned you ask and you get an answer and react from that. If I chose to stay it would be with enough conviction that I wouldn't snoop. When you're to the point of snooping you're to the point you're allowing that the worst can be a reality and you have to disprove it. I don't want to be with someone that does something that would let me feel that way. I can see your viewpoint, but in all honesty don't find it to be very realistic. Most people simply cannot/will not end a relationship...especially not a long term relationship, especially not one where others (children) will be impacted by that choice...based solely on a suspiscion. No matter how "founded" that suspiscion may be, it's unrealistic to truly expect that most people will "walk away" without some actual 'proof' of what's been going on. It also ignores the fact that many people (like myself) don't just use that information to decide to leave, but also to directly address the issues and problems. Most WS's will deny, minimize, and lie about the affair...sometimes even PAST the point where the "proof" has been provided. It's impossible to try to deal with that issue until it's proven and out in the open. Had I not snooped...my wife would have continued to deny, and our situation would have continued to deteriorate and undoubtedly ended differently than it did. I DID snoop...got the proof...confronted...and having all of that out in the open actually prevented her from denying it...which let us ADDRESS it instead. Which was impossible to do while it was being denied. Given four kids and 17 years of marriage at the time...it didn't make sense to just end the marriage on the gut feeling that something was wrong, without addressing or dealing with anything first.
reboot Posted October 6, 2011 Posted October 6, 2011 Here's the bottom line. I had a right to know, and she wasn't about to tell me. Maybe she had a right to privacy, but she had no right to secrecy. Not after she promised to love and honor and forsake all others and every other piece of bs she promised. Do you think I really cared if it offended her for me to snoop?
Spark1111 Posted October 6, 2011 Posted October 6, 2011 I wanted to reiterate what Owl said. There is no reason to snoop on an innocent spouse. One merely has to admit to feeling vulnerable or insecure or jealous and a devoted spouse will go OUT OF THEIR WAY to reassure you by whatever means necessary to make you feel secure, including handing over passwords and cell phone codes. For the innocent, this is not a big deal or invasion of privacy if it helps reassure your spouse that you are totally trustworthy and above board.
PhoenixRise Posted October 6, 2011 Posted October 6, 2011 How about this? Snooping is a kind of mistrust, and it is ALSO a kind of betrayal. Tell me snooping on an INNOCENT NON-CHEATING spouse does not hurt. It may not hurt as much as a A, but it still does. So snooping on a cheating spouse (and unless you already confirm it, should suspicion grounds to BETRAY your spouse???) is at best using a SMALLER betrayal to fight a bigger one. By that logic, is a revenge A ok? It is not about having anything to hide. It is all about betrayal. Wait, isn't this the infidelity forum? Isn't the OP about a woman dealing with her cheating spouse? Bringing up the issue of an innocent non cheating spouse is just a strawman. That isn't the situation this forum is designed to discuss and it isn't the situation anyone is posting about. In the context of infidelity, doing whatever you need to to find out the truth about YOUR OWN life and making sure you are making your life changing decision while in possession of all the pertinent facts is the polar opposite of betrayal. It is just the intelligent choice. Will you have agree to go off birth control and have the 2nd child your spouse has been asking for? Will you quit your job to move across the country away from your family and support system to help advance your spouse's career? Will you agree to purchase a new house? Will you agree to take money out of your retirement funds to help finance a new family business? Will you go back to school for your advanced degree now or will you wait? Will you take the promotion that requires you to work longer hours and travel out of state that allows you to make more money or will you stay in your present position that allows you to be home when the kids get home from school? Will you carry health insurance for yourself or will you be carried on your spouse's insurance? Will you agree to be the sole support of the family while your spouse returns to school for his/her advanced degree? Will you be a stay at home parent? Major life changing decisions are made by married people every day. For a BS to make good decisions about their life they need to know the truth about their marriage. IF you think your spouse is not telling you the truth about the fundamental foundation of your marriage then you should do whatever you need to do to find out the truth. There is much more than just your relationship at stake.
Owl Posted October 6, 2011 Posted October 6, 2011 Also...how, specifically, would reviewing an "INNOCENT NON-CHEATING spouse's" emails/IMs/texts hurt them? If there was nothing wrong found...how did the act itself of viewing that information injure them? How did that act damage them? I'm of the other mind on this...if there was nothing damaging there...why would they even care if their spouse viewed that information or not? I couldn't care less if my wife looked at my phone, my email, my IM's, or anything. Wouldn't care if she did so and told me, or did so and didn't tell me. Where's the damage?
Buck Turgidson Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 Also...how, specifically, would reviewing an "INNOCENT NON-CHEATING spouse's" emails/IMs/texts hurt them? If there was nothing wrong found...how did the act itself of viewing that information injure them? At the risk of belaboring the debate, I'm interested in seeing if I can explain it by turning the question around, and inserting "cheating" everywhere you have "snooping." "How, specifically, would having sex with someone else hurt your wife? If there were no STDs transmitted, how did the act of sex itself injure them?" If you have an answer to that question about cheating, you have my answer to yours about snooping. ...why would they even care if their spouse viewed that information or not?"Why would they even care if their spouse had had sex with someone else or not?" It's unfair to ask "where's the damage" in snooping as if there is some physical harm that has to happen in order for it to be wrong. It's not a physical damage in cheating either. It's a psychological damage, which arises from violating a trust. Sexual fidelity is not the only bond of trust between people.
reboot Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 At the risk of belaboring the debate, I'm interested in seeing if I can explain it by turning the question around, and inserting "cheating" everywhere you have "snooping." "How, specifically, would having sex with someone else hurt your wife? If there were no STDs transmitted, how did the act of sex itself injure them?" If you have an answer to that question about cheating, you have my answer to yours about snooping. "Why would they even care if their spouse had had sex with someone else or not?" It's unfair to ask "where's the damage" in snooping as if there is some physical harm that has to happen in order for it to be wrong. It's not a physical damage in cheating either. It's a psychological damage, which arises from violating a trust. Sexual fidelity is not the only bond of trust between people. If you honestly can't see the difference, there's absolutely no point in discussing it.
Owl Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 At the risk of belaboring the debate, I'm interested in seeing if I can explain it by turning the question around, and inserting "cheating" everywhere you have "snooping." "How, specifically, would having sex with someone else hurt your wife? If there were no STDs transmitted, how did the act of sex itself injure them?" If you have an answer to that question about cheating, you have my answer to yours about snooping. "Why would they even care if their spouse had had sex with someone else or not?" It's unfair to ask "where's the damage" in snooping as if there is some physical harm that has to happen in order for it to be wrong. It's not a physical damage in cheating either. It's a psychological damage, which arises from violating a trust. Sexual fidelity is not the only bond of trust between people. Thoughtful question. The obvious answer is as you surmised...it damages trust. Whwre i think we disagree is that the damage from the snooping compared to the damage caused by the cheating is minuscule in comparison...in my experience and opinion. From what I've seen in my long time posting here and on other sites is that it takes comparitivly far, far less for the WS to recover from the apparent loss of privacy than it doea for the marriage to recover from the damaafe caused by infidelity. They are nowhere near the same scale of issues.
Buck Turgidson Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 If you honestly can't see the difference, there's absolutely no point in discussing it. The difference is only one of degree. If you don't want to discuss it, then I am certain there are other, more productive things you could be doing with your time than announcing that you're not discussing it.
reboot Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 The difference is only one of degree. There is a ridiculously large difference for many of us. I was an open book. When my wife would pick up my cell phone and use it, look through it, read my text messages, whatever, it never even occurred to me to become offended. I had nothing to hide and never thought about hiding anything. What did I care if she looked at my cell phone? Same with my email. I never took any calls behind closed doors. I never got mail she couldn't open. I was never out somewhere and she didn't know where I was or about what time I would be home. And for many years all this was true for her also. We were MARRIED. We didn't have SECRETS. That all eventually changed, but at that point the problem wasn't privacy, the problem was SECRECY.
Summer Breeze Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 SB, I respect that you realized immediately you could never trust your spouse again after infidelity and ended the marriage. You are not alone in that decision. BUT, what is you had discovered a substance abuse, or gambling or porn addiction....would you have felt as strongly about divorcing? Or, would you have snooped to determine the issue and tried to support a remorseful spouse through the process of becoming whole again and detoxing from the addiction? Would you have given the marriage a shot IF your spouse had done everything neccessary to overcome the weakness? Or, would the breach of trust in these areas force you to file for divorce immediately because the trust was broken? Not meaning to put you on the spot, but many put a much higher premium on infidelity as a dealbreaker to a marriage than porn or drugs or gambling addiction. It is because we attach our moral and romantic views to it and our egos can't take the hit, YET the biochemistry is the same. Would you have moved to divorce if snooping had discovered your xH had the other issues instead of the affair? My xH did have other issues. He's an alcoholic and we struggled with it for quite some time. I've been very candid that we didn't handle it perfectly and I was to share in the blame of him being in a position where he wanted to look outside the M. I don't look at a spouse with an alcohol or drug addiction as anything remotely close to one who has cheated. The disease of addiction is much different than the choice to cheat. To answer your question as to if I'd have stayed if he'd done everything he could to get over things. No. No matter what he did to recover from the affair, I could not trust him. There wasn't a thing he could do to change that. He did everything he could do at the time to stop drinking but it didn't help him stop at that time. I may have needed a break from the M due to the situation of the alcoholism but it is not what broke the M. He cheated. Simple. I didn't snoop about the alcohol. I lived my life. I didn't try and find which bar he was at or chase him away from friends I knew precluded him to weakness. I don't snoop and I wouldn't no matter what.
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