Civility

[NoIDidn't]

As many others have pointed out, sometimes the truth is not so pretty. There were a few posters here who seemed to have a standard response, no matter what the topic of the thread. It was those few posters to whom I was referring. As I mentioned, it only takes one to destroy a board.

 

What truth are you referring to?

 

Name-calling isn't "truth". Saying people deserve to have jabs thrown their way is not "truth".

 

What is the "truth" that you are referring to?

[pureinheart]

Again...the only person that anyone can truly control (and many fail here from what I've seen) is themselves.

 

I can decide if Owl is going to be civil or not...whether or not anyone else will be is quite simply outside of my scope of influence and control.

 

IF I encounter someone on this site that I feel is NOT being civil (one of the knuckleheads you described, perhaps), THEN the ONLY POSSIBLE METHOD I HAVE TO ATTEMPT TO CORRECT THIS ISSUE IS TO PLACE IT IN THE HANDS OF THE MODERATOR.

 

He's the one charged with enforcing the TOS, and has the tools (and more importanly, the authority) to do so.

 

From my perspective...it's a waste of time trying to convince others to be more civil.

 

Those that aren't civil, aren't BECAUSE THEY CHOOSE NOT TO BE.

 

Let the authority designated to manage those situations handle them appropriately.

 

There's no value in complaining, or attempting to change or chastize those that don't conform to your perception of civility. You have no authority or ability to change them...you can only change yourself.

 

I don't get it...what's really left to say on the subject?

 

*raising hand* I have one thing left to say:D

 

When coming back to LS in 2009, I saw that there was something very wrong. Long story short- in the process of sincerely wanting to help those who were still in A's and those who had left their A's and those who were severely hurting and very rejected, wading through the abusive posts I decided to engage the posts.

 

There were many times that it really got to me as I was dealing with my own stuff as well. In reality who would really care if I laid my emotional and physical life on the line, so I wondered why...now I know why.

 

Through all of it, this stuff actually healed me in many areas. I thought I was addressing a bunch of uncool words here, BUT I was also addressing all of the uncool things and words that had been spoken to me in my life.

 

Being able to see it for what it was here caused me to understand what I had dealt with and was dealing with.

[SoMovinOn]

What truth are you referring to?

 

Name-calling isn't "truth". Saying people deserve to have jabs thrown their way is not "truth".

 

What is the "truth" that you are referring to?

 

How about, in the interest of being civil, we boil it down to this. I have asked people here to try to be a bit more civil to each other. I have asked people here to remember the purpose of this section of the forum is "Support and discussion for those who find themselves involved with a committed partner."

 

If you would like to do those things, please do. If would would prefer not to do one or the other, feel free to do so also.

 

I've posted everything I need to say on the point you are trying to beat to death. You've clearly made your point each time you have restated it. I said a bad thing. I called bad people a bad name. You didn't like it. I get that. I got it every time you said it. I'm over it.

Edited September 27, 2011 by SoMovinOn

[woinlove]

As many others have pointed out, sometimes the truth is not so pretty. There were a few posters here who seemed to have a standard response, no matter what the topic of the thread. It was those few posters to whom I was referring. As I mentioned, it only takes one to destroy a board.

 

Ahh, a very tiny pack of rabid wolves. Hardly a pack at all.

 

I've seen some tendency for swipes against groups of posters to be exaggerated. Sometimes worded so it seems like it might apply to many. And like others, I don't see calling other posters "rabid wolves" as truth telling.

[Silly_Girl]

Yes. And there are forums specifically for BS's, where they can get all the sympathy and support they wish. There are even forums where BS's can vent their anger and spend their lives berating the evil "hoorz" that forced their H into an affair with them. There are forums where Corvette enthusiasts can talk about how much they love Corvettes and hate Mustangs. There are forums for pretty much anything you can imagine.

 

This forum, however, particularly, this section of this forum is for;

"The Other Man / Woman The other side of the story: Support and discussion for those who find themselves involved with a committed partner."

 

There are other sections of this forum appropriate for those dealing with other potential aspects of affairs, such as;

 

"Infidelity - In an affair or suspect your significant other? Share your experiences and concerns here."

 

"Breaks and Breaking Up - It happens to most everyone at some point in life! Share your experiences!"

 

"Separation and Divorce - Considering ending your marriage? Going through a divorce? Let us know!"

 

"Second Chances - Called it off but doubting the decision now? Someone wants you back? Let us know about it!"

 

"Coping - Learning to deal with one's emotions and loss."

 

Clearly, it makes no sense for one who is not interested in "Support and discussion for those who find themselves involved with a committed partner." to spend time in this section of the forum. It makes even less sense for anyone who finds such support and discussion offensive.

 

I wish this could be pinned at the top of the board.

[SidLyon]

How about, in the interest of being civil, we boil it down to this. I have asked people here to try to be a bit more civil to each other. I have asked people here to remember the purpose of this section of the forum is "Support and discussion for those who find themselves involved with a committed partner."

 

If you would like to do those things, please do. If would would prefer not to do one or the other, feel free to do so also.

 

I've posted everything I need to say on the point you are trying to beat to death. You've clearly made your point each time you have restated it. I said a bad thing. I called bad people a bad name. You didn't like it. I get that. I got it every time you said it. I'm over it.

 

As far as I can see nobody has outright disagreed that posting in a civil manner is a good thing.

 

However a few have managed to convey this in a somewhat uncivil manner, which is a bit of a feat really.

 

Your implication (bolded) that anyone who disagrees with what you have posted is either, not being civil, or going against the purpose of this forum is simply being disingenuous because many posters who disagreed with you were neither uncivil not going against the purpose of this forum. It's one of those argument/debate fallacies.

 

Also IMO you have been telling people how to post. I don't see a great deal of difference between telling people how to post and telling people how you think they ought to post.

 

It stands to reason that civility is desirable on a forum such as this.

[jthorne]

*sigh* This thread reminds me of the ones a now-banned poster used to start every 2-3 weeks or so. Nothing changed then, and nothing is likely to change now, even though it's being repeated by a new name.

 

Frankly, I find someone so arrogant to decide that they own the OW board and know how everyone should post to be decidedly uncivil, but my displeasure obviously isn't going to stop it.

 

Actually, thinking a bit more about it, LS has been here for years, as have the TOS and Community Guidelines. To think that one's OW status makes them deserving of a TOS/CG above and beyond what's already established just seems so...childish. If one is going to be grown up enough to have an affair, then be grown up enough to accept that not everyone is going to be supportive of it. Yes, even on a "support" board.

 

Carry on...

Edited September 27, 2011 by jthorne

[Silly_Girl]

*sigh* This thread reminds me of the ones a now-banned poster used to start every 2-3 weeks or so. Nothing changed then, and nothing is likely to change now, even though it's being repeated by a new name.

 

Frankly, I find someone so arrogant to decide that they own the board and know how everyone should post to be decidedly uncivil, but my displeasure obviously isn't going to stop it.

 

 

Completely agree. Sssoooo frustrating!

[donnamaybe]

As many others have pointed out, sometimes the truth is not so pretty.

Ah, so YOUR "truth" is okay to dispense, but not the "truth" of others?

[Owl]

Q.E.D.

 

Civility is a great concept. Theoretically the TOS is in place to enforce civil behavior for those that don't seem to be capable of maintaining it themselves without outside 'help'.

 

I absolutely don't have any expectation that everyone else on this site will agree with my points of view...not even those on civility. I could expend a lot of effort in trying to do so...but then I'd be accused of being the "civility police" by those offended by that effort.

 

Welcome to the wide world of the internet, folks.

[stillafool]

Why do you ask? Are only moderators allowed an opinion here?

 

No, everyone is allowed an opinion anywhere on this board they choose to post it. This is what YOU obviously don't understand. I don't need you to list the forums on this board, I can read. I've been here a lot longer than you. Newsflash: Not everyone thinks the way you do or have the same opinions. If I ask a question and expect to receive 100 opinions on my issue; I would hope they all wouldn't be the same.

[no expectations]

a few points i'd like to make, and then i'll shut up ( for once)

 

(a) who decides what is "civil" and what is not? who decides what is "support" and what is not? while one person may consider support oto only mean " yay for you! just keep on doing what you're doing" another person may consider support to be" i'm worried that you'll get hurt...slow down and think a bit about situation and what could happen to you". as long as both are said in a polite way, i fail to see what the problem is.

 

(b) what makes one poster feel that it is up to them to chide the rest for what they perceive to be "uncivil behavior/comments"? i would assume ( and maybe I am way off here) that it is up to a particular poster to speak up if they feel a comment about them is rude/unacceptable/ off the mark

 

© this is going to sound really rude, and for that i am sorry, but this is an open public forum. i would assume that people who post here would have to expect a wide range of responses, some useful, some not so useful and some outright useless. But we are all "big people" and have to realize that not everyone is going to agree with us or tell us what we are doing is great and wonderful. Mind you, this does not mean that when someone responds to a post that they should be rude or unkind, but rather people responding shouldn't feel they have to censor their responses to suit a certain agenda

 

to summarize ( sorry for being so long winded), I will give the following example:

someone starts a thread on here discussing how they are the "other woman" and the affair has been going on for several years. They talk about how they are treated by the guy they are seeing and how they hope his marriage will end soon because they really want to be with the guy they love. They say the marriage is over and they are more like "roomates"

Three different types of responses could be:

(i) you are in love...how wonderful! stay with him and eventually you will wind up together

 

or

 

(ii) be careful- he may be lying to you. he may have no plans on ending his marriage. I've been through this before so i know what can happen...you could wind up being really hurt

 

or

(iii) i was the wife in a similar situation. my husband lied to the woman he was seeing and told her we were living like "roomates", but that wasn't true. he was lying to both of us. i have seen it happen firsthand, so be careful as you could get hurt.

 

both responses are, in my opinion, "supportive" but only one may be what the original poster wants to hear. does this make the second or third "uncivil" or "invalid" or "stating the obvious"

 

thank you for taking the time to read all of this

 

I think all three of your replies are civil and supportive. Now if you had a fourth option that said "you're a whore...you deserve everything you get...how could you expect any different for what you've done...don't come here and whine about your problems, blah, blah, blah..." then I'd say it was not civil or supportive. Is it their right as a part of this forum to post a response like that? Yes, it is. Still doesn't make it civil. There ARE posters who actually say such things.

[SoMovinOn]

Ahh, a very tiny pack of rabid wolves. Hardly a pack at all.

 

I imagine if you were lying on the ground being chewed up by as few as two or three wolves, you might not find any comfort in the smallness of the pack.

[SoMovinOn]

Also IMO you have been telling people how to post. I don't see a great deal of difference between telling people how to post and telling people how you think they ought to post.

 

Frankly, I find someone so arrogant to decide that they own the OW board and know how everyone should post to be decidedly uncivil, but my displeasure obviously isn't going to stop it.

 

I seem to have boggled some minds with what I thought was a simple request.

 

Any suggestion that my request was intended as some type of command is reading more into my OP than what was there. At no time did I "tell people how to post" or indicate I've decided I "own the OW" board. Arguments or opinions against my doing so are therefore, nothing less than foolish.

 

The most ridiculous aspect of those who have felt the need, some repeatedly, to point out that I cannot tell others how to post - is they are telling me what they think I should not post (and sometimes pointing out they feel others should not have posted on this topic in the past).

 

If this point has come up more than once in the past, is it possible it's because there is a real problem here?

 

 

 

Why must people believe support means agreeing with them and helping them stay in a no win no good situ?

 

At no time have I suggested civility and/or support requires constant agreement. That is another point that has been pulled from thin air, then argued against. I have *agreed* that agreement is neither required nor desired.

 

 

It stands to reason that civility is desirable on a forum such as this.

 

If it stands to reason, then my original request was reasonable and should not have ellicited so many negative responses and arguments. If it stands to reason civility is desired, this topic should have been dead a long time ago. If it stands to reason, why does it appear some respondents cannot grasp the simplicity of my original request?

[whichwayisup]

I get your request and I'm sure others do too, yet there will always be those who choose to still do what they normally do... Tony has asked for 'requests' too, many times, yet it falls on deaf ears with some.. Hense the suspensions and bannings that continually go on, not only in this section, but all throughout LS.

[SoMovinOn]

No, everyone is allowed an opinion anywhere on this board they choose to post it. This is what YOU obviously don't understand.

 

In what way have I indicated a lack of understanding? You are arguing a point I've not made.

 

I've been here a lot longer than you.

 

So, your opinion is more valid? ... what's your point here?

 

 

Newsflash: Not everyone thinks the way you do or have the same opinions. If I ask a question and expect to receive 100 opinions on my issue; I would hope they all wouldn't be the same.

 

Breaking news... this just in (actually, it was in my OP, or rather, it wasn't) ... I have never suggested others should think like me or need to have the same opinions as me.

[Owl]

No...you've suggested that they should post in what YOU deem is a civil manner.

 

Your view of civility (and mine for that matter) is irrelevent. On this internet forum, it's the view of the owner/moderator as outlined in the TOS that counts.

[donnamaybe]

No...you've suggested that they should post in what YOU deem is a civil manner.

But you left out the part where it's okay to be an arse if it tickles the OP's fancy as evidenced in this thread.

 

Your view of civility (and mine for that matter) is irrelevent. On this internet forum, it's the view of the owner/moderator as outlined in the TOS that counts.

True.

[SoMovinOn]

No...you've suggested that they should post in what YOU deem is a civil manner.

 

Bolded and underlined is mine.

 

 

Your view of civility (and mine for that matter) is irrelevent.

 

As are our views on affairs and anything else. However, without discussion, a discussion board wouldn't seem to have much purpose. Therefore, we offer our views and opinions, and in response, others do the same.

[jthorne]

No...you've suggested that they should post in what YOU deem is a civil manner.

 

Your view of civility (and mine for that matter) is irrelevent. On this internet forum, it's the view of the owner/moderator as outlined in the TOS that counts.

You know, I really don't see why this is such a big deal. This is the way it is on ANY internet forum. There are rules and guidelines, and if you sign up to be a member, you (general you) are expected to agree and be bound to the guidelines. If you don't agree with the guidelines, don't sign up. There are other sites that more closely align with your values.

 

What's the big deal?

 

It seems there is far too much internalizing on this particular board, certainly more than I have viewed on the other LS boards. I have to wonder why that is.

[Owl]

Simply put, I think it's this way because there is a handful of posters who have come to LS and decided that they want to convert/change the forum to what they think it should be, rather than seek a forum that fits their wants, or create their own forum that does so.

 

The options are clear. Either accept the forum "as is", use the tools provided via the TOS and the moderator to enforce THE OWNER'S vision of what this forum is supposed to be...or find another forum that suits your desires more closely.

[no expectations]

Simply put, I think it's this way because there is a handful of posters who have come to LS and decided that they want to convert/change the forum to what they think it should be, rather than seek a forum that fits their wants, or create their own forum that does so.

 

The options are clear. Either accept the forum "as is", use the tools provided via the TOS and the moderator to enforce THE OWNER'S vision of what this forum is supposed to be...or find another forum that suits your desires more closely.

 

Okay...I readily accept that I am ignorant but I'm sick of trying to figure it out...what on earth does TOS stand for?

[carhill]

TOS= Terms of Service

TOU= Terms of Use

 

Different forums use different terminology.

[Owl]

TOS= Terms of Service

 

It's the guidelines you agree to follow when you post here. Look at the "community guidelines" link in the menu bar at the top of your page, you should be able to find it from there.

[SoMovinOn]

Simply put, I think it's this way because there is a handful of posters who have come to LS and decided that they want to convert/change the forum to what they think it should be, rather than seek a forum that fits their wants, or create their own forum that does so.

 

The options are clear. Either accept the forum "as is", use the tools provided via the TOS and the moderator to enforce THE OWNER'S vision of what this forum is supposed to be...or find another forum that suits your desires more closely.

 

I completely agree, which is why I am opposed to a small number of posters who feel the need to come here to push their own agenda and disrupt the intended purpose of this section of LS.