In love with my best friend, he and his wife both know

[saloli]

I'm in love with my dearest and closest friend. I know he loves me on some level but doesn’t say he is in love with me, so I just keep hoping. Oh yeah, he's also getting married in two weeks, and they're trying to have a baby. I know the wife too, and she knows all about my feelings for him. He, the man I’m in love with, is also my one and only heir in my will, so he'll get my house and land and life insurance. So, I'm hoping that he will soon let the physical intimacy barrier down. It is definitely complicated. Both he and his soon to be wife know that I am hoping for a polyamorous type relationship wherein he has a wife and a husband (me). And we can form a family together. I believe that mainly he just can’t get passed certain things physically. The wife is bisexual, or at least she was always with women before meeting him.

He’s 36, I'm 40, and his soon to be wife is 38. He is a psychotherapist of all things. We have done a lot of intense spiritual work together, in other things in life, beliefs, likes, dislikes, we're a perfect match. Even his fiancée has commented on how spooky it is that we are so much alike and seem to have such a strong spiritual connection. Bryan and I have both consistently spoken to each other about this wonderful connection, even a spiritual level that we feel with each other. So, the relationship has been intense anyway.

 

There has never even been so much as a kiss, but we hug all the time, not the way two male friends typically hug, but deep, longish hugs, I rub his back and even stroke his hair while I hug him. Very often, he initiates the hugs.

 

A few weeks ago, we sat and had a very long talk. I know he already knew everything, but it had yet to be spoken. So, I told him that I was in love with him and that I will love him no matter what, but that I would never stop wanting to be with him and wanting more physical intimacy with him, etc. Then I gave him copies of legal documents showing him as my health care power of attorney as well as the only heir to my will (he'll get my house and land), and then there is also a life insurance policy. He was pretty overwhelmed by all that, and all he has said is that we will have to talk about all that again.

 

Regarding intimacy, he did say that there could be no sexual relationship, and I told him that I would never stop wanting that. So, that's sort of where things sit now. So, I think most men, straight or not, would not continue this relationship if he didn't feel something, especially knowing that it hurts me like hell not having that with him and that will never go away until he and I do have that intimacy. but anyway.... one of the interesting things is that he said he felt like he would need to pull back on the hugging even, but what has happened is the opposite. The hugging has actually increased as well as the intensity of our spiritual work together having intensified.

 

He also asked me what my sister thinks of all of this and said he wants to talk to her about it. And he asked what my parents had to say (that after I gave him a key to my house). So, he can talk to my sister whenever he wants. This week, I told my mom everything, she already knew anyway. And she is totally OK with it. That surprised me since my mom knows that my friend is about to be married, they're trying to have a baby, and I'm hoping to be with my friend as a male mate since he has a female one. I don’t think he has ever been with a man before at all.

 

When I hug him, it is not the brotherly hug. I stroke my hands up and down his back, stroke his long hair and squeeze him tight. And he has never pulled away. Sometimes I nuzzle my head into his chest.

 

So, it's complicated, yet simple at the same time.

 

I don’t remember if I said, but his fiancée also knows everything, and she has never been anything but kind to me. Since i told him how I feel, they both seem to actually be including me more in their lives, even wanting me to take an active role in their wedding. they had me over to work on some wedding stuff this weekend. While we were working, at one point, I slipped and called him 'sweetie', and a little while after that, he laid his fingers over mine and we just sat there like that for a minute sort of holding onto each others fingers. I just don't see a straight man doing that with the gay man he knows is in love with him, and at the same time also planning a weekend together just the two of us about a month after the wedding.

 

So, you see, I'm totally in love with a man who says he's a 1.5 on the Kinsey scale. I had made several comments to him about how I feel my ideal mate is a heterosexual man... His response was to say, 'well, I'm a heterosexual'. He has also made several comments about how back in old days, a man would have his wife and kids, and when he was with his male friends they would have sex, too. After the big talk though, he says that he only meant those things as observations, but says he understands how to me it would seem like he was saying that he's open to the idea. So, not sure what to make of that.

 

Anyway, there you have it basically.

I have always known that they we're planning to get married, and having a baby and all that. I knew that from the time we met. In a way, it feels like once they get that done, it might open things up even more. Also, his wife is bisexual, or at least she was until she and my friend got together. I would definitely feel better if things started to happen between my friend and me before the wedding at least, but we'll see. It doesn’t seem very likely though.

 

As I said, they both know that I'm in love with him and it doesn’t look like they want me out of their lives, but rather it seems they're making more room for me in their lives. It’s a little weird I know, but that’s what it is.

 

I tell him fairly regularly now when we talk "I love you". So, it's not like we talked about it and now I have to hide it, if anything its more out in the open now. When he visits, as he leaves, he gives me a big hug and I usually say ‘I love you’ to him while looking him in the eye and he just looks at me tenderly, but so far hasn’t said anything in response, except one day on the phone he just said ‘Thank you’.

 

He recently visited and we sat on the couch together for a while. I laid my head on his shoulder and held his hand, stroking his hand with my thumb. Later we did some meditative, spiritual work, and we decided to actually touch this time, usually we lay apart. This time, we lay on my bed, side by side, touching arms/shoulders/legs, and journeyed together. It was an amazing experience, and even he talked about how amazing it was and how he and I can do powerful things together. So, it really is like everything (spiritual/emotional) is in place except for the physical intimacy.

 

I know that him getting married and having a baby is a huge part of his happiness. I have no problem with that, I just hope he finds a place for me too. They also have fertility issues; I even offered to be the sperm donor if it comes to that. I don't know if they'll go for that, but who knows?? I want him to be the father, but it seems somewhat unlikely. In that event, I hope to be the donor and form an incredible family with him and his wife.

 

I just don’t think they would continue to want to be in my life knowing that I am in love with him, how much it hurts to not be intimate with him, always wanting to have that with him etc. unless they we're at least somehow open to it. Most people would kick you to the curb so fast you wouldn’t know what hit you. But neither of them has done that. So, I just have to wait for him to be ready. Given our relationship so far, I believe there is a really good chance of it happening, but it will require patience.

 

I know it sounds messed up, but love can make you do crazy things at any age. Also the fact that he is trained in psychology, he has to know and realize all this stuff.

 

This past Monday he is rearranged his work schedule to basically spend all day with me. We went to a waterfall. He asked how I was doing with everything regarding our first big conversation. So, I told him, and I also took the opportunity to tell him about my parents support and how they thought we already were lovers because of all the time he spends at my house. He said he was shocked that they thought that. His response was to say he has other male friends and spends time with them but no one thinks they’re lovers (I pointed out that those other friends, whoever they are, are straight). I say whoever they are because even his soon to be wife has made the statement that he spends more time with me than with anyone else, and she told my sister a while back when we went to the beach together that she was so happy that he has me, as there is no one else that he can share so much with or that he has so much in common with (and even at that point, she was very well aware that I am in love with him).

 

He just said again in an email yesterday that we could be no more than friends, yet the day before, out by the waterfall, he told me that he ”didn’t want to destroy my hope”, meaning the hope that he and I would find a way to be together. So, that’s at the very least a mixed message.

At any rate, I wrote him back just saying that I love him and I would happily die for him if I had to and that we need to lay off the heavy talk for a while and just go have some fun together, and not talk about anything, at all! Just make some good memories together.

 

 

ARGH, so, it’s all fairly confusing to me, and I feel like my heart is breaking. He knows that I’m in a lot of pain, but also that I love him no matter what and I’ve told him that in the meantime I will be the best friend to him and his wife that I can be. Neither one of us has ever had any ‘poly’ experience, right now he says it’s not going to be possible, yet he still wants me around, which I think is odd, even if you love someone as a friend and nothing more, I think that by far most people would not be wanting to maintain that friendship given the situation.

 

I’d appreciate any insights you might have, but there you have the story.

[Afishwithabike]

You are reading WAY more into his reactions than he intends.

 

You're projecting, hoping, wishing and he's making it clear to you that he doesn't feel the same way about you. You say you know what he wants, but really you don't. You're imagining things in his words and reactions because you so desperately want him. You read inconsequential reactions as meaningful and you attribute more significance to things than someone else would.

 

Just because the wife is bisexual doesn't mean she wants a nonmonogamous relationship with her husband. They've said they don't want a poly relationship. I'm amazed at your audacity. You are so selfish. These two people love each other and they want to be with only each other. They don't want you. You can take your selfish love and go elsewhere. You really take the cake as my mother would say. You should be a friend to their marriage. Instead you are doing your best to drive a wedge between them so that you can have him. Selfish,selfish,selfish.

 

This man is straight. He's not in love with you. He doesn't want to have sex with you. He doesn't desire you. He loves his fiancee. He wants to be with her.

 

The best thing to do is to remove yourself from their lives and to stop making advances to a man whose heart and soul belong to another (a woman).

 

You sound very dramatic and over the top. This sounds more like an infatuation than true love. Perhaps in time and with distance from him, you'll realize that.

Edited September 20, 2011 by Afishwithabike

[saloli]

ok, wow! so, you don't see any of his actions as misleading in the least. In my entire life I have never heard of ANY friend situation whether between two men, two women, a man and a woman, etc. where so many of this interactions go on without there being some clear intimate feelings behind them. I have never had any "friend" hug me like that, hold onto me, etc. certainly every person I've tried to get advice from here locally has agreed that no one is going to act like this with someone they know is in love with them. Every one else I've talked to locally seem to think that whether gay, straight, bi, whatever, if they have no interest, the other person is going to back way off from you, even in terms of giving hugs, certainly not increase them, and then all the other little shows of affection.

 

you really think it makes sense?? or that after having spelled it all out about how I feel that they would start including me even more in their lives instead of cutting me out, which is what everyone else I have ever known would have done??

 

i came here seeking advice, not to be berated... you really think I'm being selfish... I made it very clear I do not want remain just friends, and despite what he said, his actions do not match his words, and then there's the fact that the wife knows everything anyway, this is not and never had been about trying to split anyone up, but about having a slightly larger family than the "mainstream" idea of one.

 

If someone just wanted to be friends, and they know the other person is in love with them and does not in any way wish to remain just friends, would that person really keep behaving in this way, even to the point of planning weekend get-aways together, just the two of you in a cabin in the woods, this in just a few weeks time?? really?

 

I have given all I will ever have to offer and give to anyone in this 'companionship' both financially, emotionally and spiritually, you really think that is being selfish?? They are having fertility issues as well, likely will need a sperm donor, they know I would do that for them. I will likely never even see the child grow up due to kidney dysfunction, the doctors say I'll be dead in 10 years tops.

 

If all these other things happened accidentally etc, I would agree, reading into it, but it's so obvious to me and to everyone else that sees this happening that none of his actions support his words.

[Afishwithabike]

Yes, I do think you're being selfish. This man is engaged. He asked a woman to marry him. If I had any feelings for a man who was engaged (I'm a woman by the way), I wouldn't pursue him. I would leave him alone. That's the honorable thing to do. I wouldn't touch him, hug him, encourage him to make "good memories" with me all the while knowing he was engaged and soon to be married to another. How is it that you don't see that as selfish and manipulative?

 

You think only of your love.

 

What about his love for her?

 

What about her love for him?

 

Why do they need you to provide for them financially and otherwise? They don't need you as a sperm donor. You make it sound as if you're so altruistic, but your intentions are anything but. If you fathered a child with his wife, you would have even more of a connection to him and you'd be in this man's life for good. Again, it's about you and how it benefits you.

 

They are making it clear they don't want a poly relationship. I think he could be a lot clearer and he should stop hanging out with you, but sometimes people are overly nice and kind and those actions are misinterpreted.

 

Look I don't know you. You don't me. I'm just some stranger on the internet, but if you want my opinion, and I presume that you wanted honest, unbiased opinions (not opinions from friends who might not want to hurt your feelings), I say revise your will to remove this man as your heir ( a really over the top action), stay away from him, find new friends.

[saloli]

"I think he could be a lot clearer and he should stop hanging out with you, but sometimes people are overly nice and kind and those actions are misinterpreted." -

 

Well, I mean, he is a psychotherapist of all things... if he didn't want something, given his personality in general, he would have already cut me out of his life, instead he's including me in it even more than before, and so is his wife, even having me help in wedding preparations. Those certainly don't seem like actions of someone wanting to distance themselves in any way.

 

I do not believe I arrived at this place all by myself in a completely delusional state, they have played a big role in it as well. I mean, come on, when someone tells you they love you and want to be with you as another spouse, if you don't want that on some level, are you really going to keep coming to that persons home, having home-cooked meals together, and before you leave stand there with your arms outstretched actually initiating deep intimate hugs with that person when you know they want to be with you like that and not as a friend. I have always been a very 'touchy feely' type, he is not except for what I've written about here. Even though I am generally an affectionate person, i have never in my life taken it this far with someone who is just a close friend, certainly not with someone that I know is in love with me, and I have never seen any other friend ever do this either. It just does not add up to just be friends.

 

So, either he and his wife are being deliberately cruel to me in this situation by continuing this, or there is something else going on.

 

The one time we all had a conversation about this type of relationship, granted not talking specifically about us, the wife and I were in a sort of agreement that in a situation like that, she would be ok with the husband having a male mate, but not another woman, and the wife could have female mate, but not another man, as they could each offer something the other could not.

 

I know you think I'm being selfish, whatever, that's your opinion, I believe otherwise and I know that if they thought this was just me being selfish or delusional or what have you, I know they would have cut me out of their lives a long time ago. I do not pursue him, I always wait for him to make plans to see me, usually just the two of us, sometimes all three of us do things together.

 

granted, we dont know each other or have all the story either way about anyone's life, especially over the internet on a forum.

[Afishwithabike]

I do think they could have gone about this in a better way, ethically and morally. You clearly laid yourself out there and they could have nipped this in the bud earlier on.

 

It's possible these two are using you and your feelings. You're really very open about your feelings. I would say far too open. You're wearing your heart on your sleeve. Perhaps that's your personality. However, telling them about the will wasn't a good idea. Is it possible that he is stringing you along for the money? You may not be a multimillionaire, but you have life insurance and some property. Nothing to sneeze at. You said you had some kidney dysfunction which affects your lifespan. Isn't it possible, even slightly possible, that they may have monetary motives for still maintaining a relationship with you especially when you said you won't change him as the heir?

[saloli]

I hear what you're saying, but honestly, they are far better off financially than I am, he's a psychotherapist and she is a physician's assistant. They both have good incomes, i only make about 20K/year, and they will have to wait for me to die to get anything anyway... I mean, he could have pushed me off a waterfall fairly recently if he wanted to just collect on everything and/or even make it look like suicide or an accident, it would have been very easy... anyway, law and order stories aside I don't think finances are any kind of motivation.

 

I know sometimes people are in relationships and years later betray one another. But given the levels of intimacy we've already attained, the fact that so many people know what's going on, the fact that we also share our spirituality and have regular sessions with each other (well, my friend and I do, not so much with the wife), I just don't see money as a motivation.

[SummerLady]

I hear what you're saying, but honestly, they are far better off financially than I am, he's a psychotherapist and she is a physician's assistant. They both have good incomes, i only make about 20K/year, and they will have to wait for me to die to get anything anyway... I mean, he could have pushed me off a waterfall fairly recently if he wanted to just collect on everything and/or even make it look like suicide or an accident, it would have been very easy... anyway, law and order stories aside I don't think finances are any kind of motivation.

 

I know sometimes people are in relationships and years later betray one another. But given the levels of intimacy we've already attained, the fact that so many people know what's going on, the fact that we also share our spirituality and have regular sessions with each other (well, my friend and I do, not so much with the wife), I just don't see money as a motivation.

 

 

You don't continue to pursue someone that is taken. That is the problem with our society. Its does not make a difference if its a man/man woman/man,. woman/woman. You lost@! Accept it...Move on. You are stuck...Not a good place to be. You asked for advice and you are getting it...Work on moving on. End of story!

[saloli]

"That is the problem with our society" - part of the problem with that is the fact that all three of us live very much outside of what you probably consider 'society'... there are more cultures than not that have these kinds of relationships, cultures to which he, his wife and I are a part. Therein is a major part of the issue... the husband and I share deep religious convictions and cultural values, more so than he actually shares with his wife. In our traditions there are no taboos whatsoever concerning having multiple spouses of any gender, nor are there any taboos about sex before marriage, nor that marriage = monogamy. Perhaps in your society that's your norm, but not so in ours.

 

HE is the one who makes repeated statements about having a male lover along with a wife and kids, etc... not to mention their actions AFTER all the beans were spilled so to speak. They know how I feel and continue to want me around, HE is the one who initiates 99% of what physical affection we have, even in front of his wife... and I'm sorry, but someone just looking to be your 'friend' is NOT going to do all those things.

 

I realize you're only hearing one side of the story, but there you have it... it is not so clear cut as you seem to want to make it, there are a lot of 'friendship lines' that have been crossed and continue to be crossed.

 

as far as being bound to one another, we've already done that on every other level, we have taken oaths with each other that cannot be broken (this has to do with our cultural and religious lives), to break those oaths would be tantamount to jumping straight into the lowest pit of hell, if you will, and betraying everything we believe in. and these oaths were taken AFTER everything was on the table. So, breaking that bond and removing ourselves from each others' lives would also mean we would be considered 'outcast'. Not that i expect anyone here to get all that, as more likely than not, you are approaching this from your own worldview, which is no doubt vastly different than ours.

[nofool4u]

I think this needs to be posted in the "banning opposite sex friends" thread.

[SummerLady]

"That is the problem with our society" - part of the problem with that is the fact that all three of us live very much outside of what you probably consider 'society'... there are more cultures than not that have these kinds of relationships, cultures to which he, his wife and I are a part. Therein is a major part of the issue... the husband and I share deep religious convictions and cultural values, more so than he actually shares with his wife. In our traditions there are no taboos whatsoever concerning having multiple spouses of any gender, nor are there any taboos about sex before marriage, nor that marriage = monogamy. Perhaps in your society that's your norm, but not so in ours.

 

HE is the one who makes repeated statements about having a male lover along with a wife and kids, etc... not to mention their actions AFTER all the beans were spilled so to speak. They know how I feel and continue to want me around, HE is the one who initiates 99% of what physical affection we have, even in front of his wife... and I'm sorry, but someone just looking to be your 'friend' is NOT going to do all those things.

 

I realize you're only hearing one side of the story, but there you have it... it is not so clear cut as you seem to want to make it, there are a lot of 'friendship lines' that have been crossed and continue to be crossed.

 

as far as being bound to one another, we've already done that on every other level, we have taken oaths with each other that cannot be broken (this has to do with our cultural and religious lives), to break those oaths would be tantamount to jumping straight into the lowest pit of hell, if you will, and betraying everything we believe in. and these oaths were taken AFTER everything was on the table. So, breaking that bond and removing ourselves from each others' lives would also mean we would be considered 'outcast'. Not that i expect anyone here to get all that, as more likely than not, you are approaching this from your own worldview, which is no doubt vastly different than ours.

 

 

Let me say this to your explanation: You are delusional. With all due respect as I don't want to get in trouble for being disrespectful. Please Please get mental help and you may want to consider some medication as well. I am sorry I am not educated or wordly enough to understand your religion or cultural beliefs where it is acceptable for a man to chase after another man that is getting married to a woman and the man and woman getting married supposely don't mind and are fine with it, therefore almost encouraging you to continue in this pattern and where you wish for a relationship and situation that he has made clear that he really doesn't want. This culture and pact, belief system sounds Fabulous. But since I am not smart or fluent enough to really understand this concept, what do I know. One question.. Am I on Candid Camera?

[saloli]

well, did you miss the fact that HE is a psychotherapist, considered one of the best in his field of expertise... if he thought I were delusional and/or needed help, he could rather easily have me committed to an institution, that would be very easy for him to do, not to mention simply staying away, but he keeps coming to see me, and having me over to their house. I'm not 'chasing' him, he is well aware of my feelings, as is the wife, and HE keeps coming to see me, i live an hour away from them, he goes out of his way to come see me. The wife never does, I only see her on the rare occasion when she comes to my town, or when I go to their house, about once a month.

 

both of them are medical professionals, if either one thought mental illness was an issue here, things would not be where they are now. People's actions speak much louder than words I believe, and all these actions are not adding up to a 'let's just be friends' relationship.

 

I thought, given the nature of this website, there would be more people out there who were more aware of different kinds of intimate relationships outside of the modern western European Christian concept, but it seems that it's too difficult for most to wrap their minds around it.

[Jen_X]

Damn, I hardly ever post here, but this is amazing.

 

I feel bad for you. How old are you?

 

What have your other relationships been like - have you had any others? When was the last time you had sex with someone?

 

You are obsessed with this man. You don't care about the fiancee, particularly, but she's not going anywhere so you're tolerating the situation. As is she. She must know this guy well and has accepted what's clear to ME if what you are saying is true - he's GAY.

 

It's not uncommon for men to not want to accept this about themselves, and to marry and have children (sad) and try to do all the traditional things - still trying to convince themselves and others they are something they can't be. Straight.

 

You have met one of these men and can't cut him loose because you are EXTREMELY co-dependent. I almost want to say delusional, but yet, your instincts are also correct. No straight man would behave the way you've described his affections towards you. On the other hand, he doesn't sound sexually attracted to you. If he were, much more would have already happened. If it hasn't yet, then please get a clue for YOURSELF and the 10 years you say you have left - my god man, move the hell on.

 

He is bonded to you, he cares for you, you guys have a connection. But it's one-sided and you don't want to accept this. If the right guy comes along and he feels the sexual attraction he doesn't for you, he'll likely open himself up to that and still have his marriage and family on the side. It's not conventional, and there are almost no women willing to put up with this, but it does happen.

 

You are not the guy in that scenario. You need to seek out counseling on your own apart from this guy and figure out what your issues are. You REALLY need to meet other people - someone right for you.

[nofool4u]

I thought, given the nature of this website, there would be more people out there who were more aware of different kinds of intimate relationships outside of the modern western European Christian concept, but it seems that it's too difficult for most to wrap their minds around it.

 

and different parts of this site cater to different situations. You can post this in forums like Marriage and Life Partnerships, Infidelity, etc. But don't be surprised at the responses you will get. you have to take into consideration one of the main reasons people post in certain forums. Like OM/OM forum. You will get a bunch of people in there that will stick up for OM/OW and support them in their decision to help betray someone elses spouse.

 

And if you told this story in that part of the site, you'd get different responses and the sympathy you are looking for.

[Jen_X]

Why'd you change your handle? Odd.

[country_gurl]

I don’t remember if I said, but his fiancée also knows everything, and she has never been anything but kind to me. Since i told him how I feel, they both seem to actually be including me more in their lives, even wanting me to take an active role in their wedding. they had me over to work on some wedding stuff this weekend. While we were working, at one point, I slipped and called him 'sweetie', and a little while after that, he laid his fingers over mine and we just sat there like that for a minute sort of holding onto each others fingers. I just don't see a straight man doing that with the gay man he knows is in love with him, and at the same time also planning a weekend together just the two of us about a month after the wedding. i came here seeking advice, not to be berated... you really think I'm being selfish... I made it very clear I do not want remain just friends, and despite what he said, his actions do not match his words, and then there's the fact that the wife knows everything anyway, this is not and never had been about trying to split anyone up, but about having a slightly larger family than the "mainstream" idea of one.

 

Ahhhh. This thread was started by "saloli" but now we have "kindy" responding as if he were the OP. If you read "kindy's" posting history, "he" speaks about having a wife. And all of his posts contain a link to an astrology site. both are clearly TROLLS. Tip for Trolls: be sure not to confuse which profile you're logging in under when trolling. LMFAO.

[Jen_X]

Yeah, I caught that too. Truly bizarre.

 

It's incredible that someone would have this much time on his hands to sit around making up these fantasies and stories for fake advice. It wasn't even a good one!