kimnjj Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 You have to understand that as a female you are getting a million messages a day. I often wonder if 95% of them are cut and pasted to all messages the guys throw out to the women. When I get a message I look at the profile first of the sender. I check his age because I listed my ranges ( I am not trying to date my father ) Does he have a nice picture ? maybe smiling or doing something fun with more than just one picture. Does he have pics to show how tore up his abs are ( huge turn off , save it for later ) . If that's working all is good . Can he come up with more than 2 lines describing himself in his profile , maybe even something funny or original . Do we have anything in common ? In his message did it sound like he read my profile and threw in a comment or 2 directed towards me , not generic. The whole process takes about 2 minutes. I respond or just delete the message. You do not have to be a super stud to attract women. They see a lot more than looks and everyone is attracted to different things. I have messaged a few men and heard nothing back , so the street runs both ways. Women are on dating sites to meet men. I have met 2 long term bf's ( now ex's ) on dating sites over the years. It is just weeding through the crap to find what your looking for. Additional info. Women ( and I am sure men ) hate the exchanging of numbers and the texting forever games. If you are interested , than get to know each other and meet up. Good luck !
Imajerk17 Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 (edited) If you happen to be "amazing on paper" (like a 6'2" doctor with great pictures) then actually, you want to be very careful with the cocky approach. You'll come across as conceited. It's similar to real life. If I tell a girl that "women are after me only for my body", it's funny and attractive because I'm not an Adonis. If a great-looking guy were to say it though, he would come across as a jerky player and blow himself out. You don't want to insult the woman either. Saying she looks fat or her friends are ugly just won't win you points. If she says she got her pet from the shelter last month, then don't tell her that her dog looks skinny! And sometimes a more sincere approach works too--complimenting her if she mentions something truly impressive. Edited August 31, 2011 by Imajerk17
EnigmaticClarity Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 As for leading nowhere, that's not really true, the nice and complimentary approach clearly leads to no where since it doesn't get responses. I agree, it frequently DOES lead somewhere if you make the emails beyond the opener more substantial. A short, funny opener is just an attention-grabber to get a profile view--they can decide from there if it's worth going further.
ThsAmericanLife Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 24-32 years old If you are legimately coming up with something that shows you read their profile, and aren't dumping your life story onto the first page, then yes, the normal ones probably will at least give you a response. If you are making snarky comments about their profiles, then you will probably attract the more unstable ones.
ThsAmericanLife Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 I can't believe you, I'm sorry, but if I was tall/dark/handsome with a big house, nice car, and I was a doctor who treated sick little children, then you would go out with me even if I insulted you initially. You may come back with a rude or upset response of your own, but you'd keep the conversation going with hopes I'd come around and show a nicer side, then you would be more than accepting of a date. Women are superficial like that, you will overlook a coke addiction if he has all the other "right things". You need to lose those stereotypes. I've rejected all of the above. but you are dating 24-32 year olds. Hardly a 'font' of wisdom. If you are in this age range yourself, then you have your own blind spots and can't blame you for wanting to stay close to your own age. One of them being the notion that all women want tall/dark/handsome with lots of $$ and 'things'. That is just your lame excuse for not working on your personality. If you are older than this, then well, you get what you get when you troll for younger women... and I'd add you aren't terribly concerned with character either... and you can stop your complaining.
fortyninethousand322 Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 If you are legimately coming up with something that shows you read their profile, and aren't dumping your life story onto the first page, then yes, the normal ones probably will at least give you a response. If you are making snarky comments about their profiles, then you will probably attract the more unstable ones. At some point though attracting something is better than nothing. I don't know about the OP but I'll take a dose of instability over perpetual singledom. I mean what's the worst that could happen? I'll have to break it off if it doesn't work? At least then I'll at least have some experience. I mean I haven't had any response to a message since early March. I'd like at least some response, even if it was just a "I'm not interested".
Author GivenUp0083 Posted August 31, 2011 Author Posted August 31, 2011 I actually think that Anela and Fitchick are telling the truth. For themselves that is. I don't think their opinions are in the mainstream though. At least not the mainstream for the age range that myself and the OP are talking about (early 20s to early 30s). This is one reason why you are struggling with dating. You believe them. I made the same mistake, and too many times do men take the words of what women say to truth. How many times have women said "I just don't want to be in a relationship right now" and then they have a boyfriend the week after? Exactly. Actions are all that matter at this stage, not words. You have to understand that as a female you are getting a million messages a day. I often wonder if 95% of them are cut and pasted to all messages the guys throw out to the women. I do understand this, which is why the sarcastic approach is much more suitable as it does stand out, and it requires low effort from the man when the odds are clearly stacked against his message even being noticed. You just proved this. When I get a message I look at the profile first of the sender. I hope so. I check his age because I listed my ranges ( I am not trying to date my father ) Does he have a nice picture ? maybe smiling or doing something fun with more than just one picture. Does he have pics to show how tore up his abs are ( huge turn off , save it for later ) . If that's working all is good . This is the most important part of an online dating profile, the pictures. If you have bad pictures then it doesn't matter WHAT you write in an email or the profile. If you can't pass this step, you're hopeless. Straight from the horse's mouth. Can he come up with more than 2 lines describing himself in his profile , maybe even something funny or original . Do we have anything in common ? I've found less is more. Sure, more than 2 lines is important to show you are serious about actually describing yourself, but no life stories and no details. Vague is key, if women can figure you out before they've met you then you won't get the date. Having things in common doesn't matter (observation from experience). In his message did it sound like he read my profile and threw in a comment or 2 directed towards me , not generic. Yeah, copy/paste tactic is bush league. The whole process takes about 2 minutes. I respond or just delete the message. You do not have to be a super stud to attract women. They see a lot more than looks and everyone is attracted to different things. I agree, they do see more than looks but superficiality is much more prevalent. Women DO care more if you have a high paying job, travel a lot, have a boat, or own your own condo. Women care about status and financial security. If you are well off in those areas they will sacrifice their standards in the looks department. I agree with you. I have messaged a few men and heard nothing back , so the street runs both ways. Of course, this is to be expected, women don't have 100% response rates. Even women I messaged first who responded and showed little to no personality I just stopped communicating with. Women are on dating sites to meet men. I have met 2 long term bf's ( now ex's ) on dating sites over the years. It is just weeding through the crap to find what your looking for. Not always. Some women are on just to look, some need an ego boost, some like to laugh at profiles with friends or just have something to talk about. Not all women are on dating sites for the agenda of going on dates with men they are interested in. Many women use men for dates as well. These are things men have to be wary of. Additional info. Women ( and I am sure men ) hate the exchanging of numbers and the texting forever games. If you are interested , than get to know each other and meet up. Good luck ! I've online dated for many years, and this is the one thing I've seen change....women are more impatient now than in previous years. I used to have women say I'm moving to fast after requesting a date after only 5 emails. Now I feel like if you don't bring up a date mention within the first 3 they will give up on you. I find this interesting, but it doesn't bother me, actually I prefer it, less time I have to waste emailing them. I agree, it frequently DOES lead somewhere if you make the emails beyond the opener more substantial. A short, funny opener is just an attention-grabber to get a profile view--they can decide from there if it's worth going further. Years of experience has told me otherwise. I respectfully disagree. If you are legimately coming up with something that shows you read their profile, and aren't dumping your life story onto the first page, then yes, the normal ones probably will at least give you a response. If you are making snarky comments about their profiles, then you will probably attract the more unstable ones. What's to say you aren't attracting unstable women by writing thoughtful emails? I highly doubt the type of message I send dictates the mental health of the person I'm sending it to. Many men make the argument that ALL or MOST women are 'unstable'. My last gf I met after 4 years of singledom, 2 years of sending out "friendly and nice" emails trying to make intelligent conversation. She ended up dumping me because she wanted a Fairy Tale Love Story Relationship like in the movies. She told me this and I was blown away. I was hurt, but also baffled that she was this ridiculous in her expectations and mindset. I feel better now knowing I dodged her. Point being though: writing nice, friendly, intelligent, mature emails vs short and sarcastic ones has no bearing on the type of women you will attract on these sites. You cannot argue otherwise and have any ground to stand on.
ThsAmericanLife Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 You have nothing to lose, right? I don't even read their whole profile. I say things like "You actually wear a snuggie at work? Don't people tease you?" "You're allergic to air? Do you wear a gas mask all day?" "Why do you use the word 'actually' 10 times in your profile?" You wouldn't get a response or a delete from me. Either one would take too much time. I probably would go to the trouble of 'blocking' someone like this from further emails though or making their profile 'invisible' so I wouldn't even need to see whether they were visiting or not. Smart women can tell when you've read their profile. Guess you are trolling for stupid. No wonder your response rate went up..
EnigmaticClarity Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 I've found less is more. Sure, more than 2 lines is important to show you are serious about actually describing yourself, but no life stories and no details. Vague is key, if women can figure you out before they've met you then you won't get the date. Having things in common doesn't matter (observation from experience). While I can't disagree with this, I go with wordy profiles to attract creative types and intellectuals. I do believe it decreases my response rate by turning off people at an early stage and by making myself look as if I'm putting too much effort into the profile, but I'm fine with it--I think it attracts a higher percentage of the ones I'm looking for.
EnigmaticClarity Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 Smart women can tell when you've read their profile. You didn't at LEAST find the one about using the word "actually" too many times in your profile worth a response? Man...that's cold. And I'm not sure I believe it--if Jon Stewart or Stephen Colbert were using online dating, that could easily be one of many they'd use.
ThsAmericanLife Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 What's to say you aren't attracting unstable women by writing thoughtful emails? I highly doubt the type of message I send dictates the mental health of the person I'm sending it to. Many men make the argument that ALL or MOST women are 'unstable'. My last gf I met after 4 years of singledom, 2 years of sending out "friendly and nice" emails trying to make intelligent conversation. She ended up dumping me because she wanted a Fairy Tale Love Story Relationship like in the movies. She told me this and I was blown away. I was hurt, but also baffled that she was this ridiculous in her expectations and mindset. I feel better now knowing I dodged her. Point being though: writing nice, friendly, intelligent, mature emails vs short and sarcastic ones has no bearing on the type of women you will attract on these sites. You cannot argue otherwise and have any ground to stand on. IME, Men who claim that all or most women are unstable are men that have nothing to offer anyone... So, you were hurt. Big deal. Everyone gets hurt. That's life!! You do have a choice though. These 'bad guy' tactics will not attract a nice girl. It will attract those who are insecure and lack self-confidence. Easy to manipulate, sure. Then again, that puts you in the manipulator category... not a quality man. Dime a dozen. Alot of these are PUA tactics... Works on weak women.
Author GivenUp0083 Posted August 31, 2011 Author Posted August 31, 2011 You wouldn't get a response or a delete from me. Either one would take too much time. I probably would go to the trouble of 'blocking' someone like this from further emails though or making their profile 'invisible' so I wouldn't even need to see whether they were visiting or not. Smart women can tell when you've read their profile. Guess you are trolling for stupid. No wonder your response rate went up.. That's you, and by the sounds of your posts I wouldn't date you anyway. I know how you feel and what you'd like to see in an email from a man, but I highly doubt you follow that religiously, as the proof is in the pudding: my approach has been working and I have the email response rate and dates to prove it. While I can't disagree with this, I go with wordy profiles to attract creative types and intellectuals. I do believe it decreases my response rate by turning off people at an early stage and by making myself look as if I'm putting too much effort into the profile, but I'm fine with it--I think it attracts a higher percentage of the ones I'm looking for. Hey, if that works for you, great. I wish I could get more creative/intellectual types, but I find in a large city like mine, people don't have time to read the whole profile, they get annoyed with all the writing. Specific, to the point, a few key unique qualities mentioned, a few hobbies/interests, and a general idea of what I'm looking for is all that's needed. I've had women tell me that if you elaborate too much and she doesn't "agree" with something (like political stance, musical taste, choice of books you've read) then it gives them a reason to eliminate you. As someone else already stated above, they get hundreds of emails so they are looking for something to rule you out with.
ThsAmericanLife Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 You didn't at LEAST find the one about using the word "actually" too many times in your profile worth a response? Man...that's cold. And I'm not sure I believe it--if Jon Stewart or Stephen Colbert were using online dating, that could easily be one of many they'd use. Well, maybe... I did initiate a correspondence with a guy who used the f-word a few times in his profile... and told him he had a nice profile... except for all the f-words, but maybe that wasn't the worst vice someone could have. I did follow up with a couple of nice things though. So it was balanced. The things he was saying the f-word over were things that annoyed me about online dating too, so it worked. We did eventually meet, and have a very good time. He didn't use the f-word even ONCE during our date. He turned out to be a very nice guy. Offered to take me to the ballet for our first date!! (I dance ballet). Of course, I offered to pay for myself... Keep in mind too... that he responded without me showing even one picture... I did send him a few after he responded. That is one of my 'tests'.
Author GivenUp0083 Posted August 31, 2011 Author Posted August 31, 2011 IME, Men who claim that all or most women are unstable are men that have nothing to offer anyone... So, you were hurt. Big deal. Everyone gets hurt. That's life!! You do have a choice though. These 'bad guy' tactics will not attract a nice girl. It will attract those who are insecure and lack self-confidence. Easy to manipulate, sure. Then again, that puts you in the manipulator category... not a quality man. Dime a dozen. Alot of these are PUA tactics... Works on weak women. Well maybe weakness is a flaw I'm willing to overlook. I don't tread women poorly, I've always been good to them, and despite being a good guy I've never had luck attracting very good women who showed the same courtesies. It is what it is, I've accepted it. But I have 2 choices: 1. Keep this nice guy mentality in approaching women in a sincere manner and going months or years without dates or even any kind of physical connection further frustrating and bruising my attitude. Or. 2. Keep this approach, maybe end up dealing with weak or stupid women, but at least I get to interact and participate, and get laid when I play my cards right. While still trying to find that "nice girl", but in the mean time I get a boost to my confidence and experience less frustration. I'm trying really really hard not to let my past bitter me, and at this point in my life I think most of the time I really only want to get laid with someone I've gotten to meet a couple times and gotten to know and have a casual dating relationship focused on physicality. I'm not so eager to put myself on the line emotionally only to be burned once again. I don't have much desire for a serious relationship anymore.
EnigmaticClarity Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 Hey, if that works for you, great. I wish I could get more creative/intellectual types, but I find in a large city like mine, people don't have time to read the whole profile, they get annoyed with all the writing. That's EXACTLY why I do it--women who are annoyed by writing is exactly who I'm looking to weed out. If I were an aspiring PUA or using it for casual sex or short-term relationships I'd dumb it down. Most of it is light, pleasant, and funny anyway, so if they're not willing to read the kind of thing they'd be listening to if they dated me, I definitely want them to move on.
ThsAmericanLife Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 That's you, and by the sounds of your posts I wouldn't date you anyway. I know how you feel and what you'd like to see in an email from a man, but I highly doubt you follow that religiously, as the proof is in the pudding: my approach has been working and I have the email response rate and dates to prove it. Hey, if that works for you, great. I wish I could get more creative/intellectual types, but I find in a large city like mine, people don't have time to read the whole profile, they get annoyed with all the writing. Specific, to the point, a few key unique qualities mentioned, a few hobbies/interests, and a general idea of what I'm looking for is all that's needed. I've had women tell me that if you elaborate too much and she doesn't "agree" with something (like political stance, musical taste, choice of books you've read) then it gives them a reason to eliminate you. As someone else already stated above, they get hundreds of emails so they are looking for something to rule you out with. This is interesting. Well, you just said that you wish you could get more creative/intellectual types... and I just told you that with your current approach, you won't be attracting the creative/intellectual types. ... that you are trolling for stupid. You just proved my point. You really don't care about the quality of the women you are meeting. You just want 'lots' of them. yes, you will get more responses... Because you aren't going for quality. Apparently. Validation? Some ego boost that your 'response rate' is so high? Yep.
ThsAmericanLife Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 That's EXACTLY why I do it--women who are annoyed by writing is exactly who I'm looking to weed out. If I were an aspiring PUA or using it for casual sex or short-term relationships I'd dumb it down. Most of it is light, pleasant, and funny anyway, so if they're not willing to read the kind of thing they'd be listening to if they dated me, I definitely want them to move on. yes, this seems to be his goal... aspiring PUA/casual sex/short-term relationships. Caveat emptor to the ladies who respond...
Author GivenUp0083 Posted August 31, 2011 Author Posted August 31, 2011 This is interesting. Well, you just said that you wish you could get more creative/intellectual types... and I just told you that with your current approach, you won't be attracting the creative/intellectual types. ... that you are trolling for stupid. You just proved my point. You really don't care about the quality of the women you are meeting. You just want 'lots' of them. yes, you will get more responses... Because you aren't going for quality. Apparently. Validation? Some ego boost that your 'response rate' is so high? Yep. Let me clarify.... I couldn't get responses from the creative types when I had a long and well written profile. I just didn't get responses. I didn't garner any interest. More effort = no dates Now I've dumbed my profile down and I use the PUA approach and I can't comment on their personalities or quality since I haven't met them yet, I'm sure I'll post about it afterward. But at least I'm getting something. PUA effort = dates So what's better? Getting dates? Or not getting dates? I'd rather go on dates and take a risk that they may be unintelligent or boring (as you assume the same risk with a well written profile and sincere emails even if they warranted responses), than get ZERO dates at all. You haven't justified sticking to the nice guy approach with any real benefit. I'm still waiting to hear that part from you but so far you've danced around it.
ThsAmericanLife Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 Well maybe weakness is a flaw I'm willing to overlook. I don't tread women poorly, I've always been good to them, and despite being a good guy I've never had luck attracting very good women who showed the same courtesies. It is what it is, I've accepted it. But I have 2 choices: 1. Keep this nice guy mentality in approaching women in a sincere manner and going months or years without dates or even any kind of physical connection further frustrating and bruising my attitude. Or. 2. Keep this approach, maybe end up dealing with weak or stupid women, but at least I get to interact and participate, and get laid when I play my cards right. While still trying to find that "nice girl", but in the mean time I get a boost to my confidence and experience less frustration. I'm trying really really hard not to let my past bitter me, and at this point in my life I think most of the time I really only want to get laid with someone I've gotten to meet a couple times and gotten to know and have a casual dating relationship focused on physicality. I'm not so eager to put myself on the line emotionally only to be burned once again. I don't have much desire for a serious relationship anymore. ok... now that you explained things a little... I understand better. And actually take back my last post. Your current tactics (PUA/casual sex/short-term relationship) will likely be successful in getting those. As long as you are up front with the women you meet, and not leading them to believe you are ready for a relationship, then your conscience is clean. I think you will find though... if you focus on obtaining and fine-tuning the good, decent personality traits (and not use these silly PUA tricks), you will have much more success in the long run. These days, everyone wants instant results... Our current culture has trained us to expect that, so it is understandable. FYI.. I've never personally met a PUA that ended up happy.
sm1tten Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 The problem is that the women who are attracted to the sarcasm going to be disappointed if you can't deliver that, but maybe you'll luck out with a pity lay.
ThsAmericanLife Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 Let me clarify.... I couldn't get responses from the creative types when I had a long and well written profile. I just didn't get responses. I didn't garner any interest. More effort = no dates Now I've dumbed my profile down and I use the PUA approach and I can't comment on their personalities or quality since I haven't met them yet, I'm sure I'll post about it afterward. But at least I'm getting something. PUA effort = dates So what's better? Getting dates? Or not getting dates? I'd rather go on dates and take a risk that they may be unintelligent or boring (as you assume the same risk with a well written profile and sincere emails even if they warranted responses), than get ZERO dates at all. You haven't justified sticking to the nice guy approach with any real benefit. I'm still waiting to hear that part from you but so far you've danced around it. I'm sorry things didn't work out for you before. I really believe that with a few minor changes, you could have kept the nice/sweet part and attracted more. Do you really believe that the most you have to risk is unintelligent or boring? I dunno about that. One of my best male friends dated a girl for two weeks... and she ended up stalking him and trumping up false charges against him that took months to clear out. If he hadn't saved all of their IM chats, he'd be screwed. Here's my question... I get my experience and opinions from people I meet in real life. Friends, relatives, neighbors, co-workers. Watch and observe. Would you get a response from anyone you'd respect IRL with an approach like this? Sounds like you are at a crossroads... and I feel for you. I really do.
Author GivenUp0083 Posted August 31, 2011 Author Posted August 31, 2011 ok... now that you explained things a little... I understand better. And actually take back my last post. Your current tactics (PUA/casual sex/short-term relationship) will likely be successful in getting those. That is what I'm looking for at this point. I'm just not that ecstatic about going head first into a meaningful relationship that will just get me burned again. As long as you are up front with the women you meet, and not leading them to believe you are ready for a relationship, then your conscience is clean. I know you won't want to hear this, but I'm not going to be up front about anything. If she assumes that because I'm taking her on dates that I want something more than just a casual relationship then that's on her. I've been lied to countless times by women, I see no reason to show a respect that I have never received. I won't blatantly tell them I love them just to get in their bed, but I won't be openly honest about my intentions. I think you will find though... if you focus on obtaining and fine-tuning the good, decent personality traits (and not use these silly PUA tricks), you will have much more success in the long run. Experience has taught me otherwise. I'll try this approach and decide for myself. These days, everyone wants instant results... Our current culture has trained us to expect that, so it is understandable. I agree, I wish you'd have that conversation with my ex gf. FYI.. I've never personally met a PUA that ended up happy. I personally know many who are. I know many more men who recently proposed to their gf's to be turned down. That would be something that would easily break me for good and can't imagine going through that. Rather be the PUA guys then those.
EnigmaticClarity Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 I couldn't get responses from the creative types when I had a long and well written profile. I just didn't get responses. I didn't garner any interest. More effort = no dates Now I've dumbed my profile down and I use the PUA approach and I can't comment on their personalities or quality since I haven't met them yet, I'm sure I'll post about it afterward. But at least I'm getting something. PUA effort = dates So what's better? Getting dates? Or not getting dates? I'd rather go on dates and take a risk that they may be unintelligent or boring (as you assume the same risk with a well written profile and sincere emails even if they warranted responses), than get ZERO dates at all. You haven't justified sticking to the nice guy approach with any real benefit. I'm still waiting to hear that part from you but so far you've danced around it. Definitely a laudable goal to transition from frustration to getting some results. Goal one should be get results, refining them comes later!
EnigmaticClarity Posted August 31, 2011 Posted August 31, 2011 The problem is that the women who are attracted to the sarcasm going to be disappointed if you can't deliver that, but maybe you'll luck out with a pity lay. That's a huge challenge with online--don't spend a ton of time putting something witty in a profile or an email and then come across as serious, withdrawn, and uptight in person. Your frustration will just transition to "nobody's contacting me" to "I can't get past a first or second date" if you act one way in writing and another way face-to-face. If this becomes a problem, the solution isn't all that hard--just work on your conversational speed and wit over lunches and conversations with friends, family, co-workers, etc.
Author GivenUp0083 Posted August 31, 2011 Author Posted August 31, 2011 I'm sorry things didn't work out for you before. I really believe that with a few minor changes, you could have kept the nice/sweet part and attracted more. Believe me, I tried, I asked for a lot of advice, tried many things in the name of sincerity, but I am not exaggerating when I'm telling you I got ZERO responses... Do you really believe that the most you have to risk is unintelligent or boring? I dunno about that. One of my best male friends dated a girl for two weeks... and she ended up stalking him and trumping up false charges against him that took months to clear out. If he hadn't saved all of their IM chats, he'd be screwed. I carry the same risk meeting ANYONE online, or in person for that matter. Just because I was sweet to her from the beginning doesn't mean she couldn't be crazy. I don't see this as an added risk in my new approach, as it's just as risky meeting anyone for a date. Here's my question... I get my experience and opinions from people I meet in real life. Friends, relatives, neighbors, co-workers. Watch and observe. Would you get a response from anyone you'd respect IRL with an approach like this? Yes, and I have. Such is the way of women in Chicago. They meet hundreds of men each year. You have to stand out and typically being a little sarcastic and PUA has proven success. You start out PUA and they hope to change you, but for me it won't be hard to change because deep down I know I'm not a true PUA. Wolf in sheeps clothing is the strategy here. Sounds like you are at a crossroads... and I feel for you. I really do. I appreciate the sympathy, but if you search my previous posts you'll find I'm much better now and I'm much clearer in how I see things and what I want. Love is blind, it won't allow you to see what is most obvious to be your downfall. I'd much rather have the clarity ;-)
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