USMCHokie Posted August 29, 2011 Posted August 29, 2011 (edited) We all have our insecurities when it comes to dating, whether it be our height, our weight, our education (or lack thereof), our career (or lack thereof, etc... Everyone has their own way of dealing with these insecurities, and some can control them better than others. I've noticed that I've become very angry and bitter lately, and I need to come to terms with what has been my underlying dating insecurity all my life and figure out a way to deal with it. Those who know me on LS probably know that my "crippling" (I hate to use the word, but it seems to make sense) insecurity is my race. Throughout my life, I have dealt with it by compensating in every way possible, including: working on my body and then finding every possible opportunity to take my shirt off in public, avoiding association with other Asians, self-deprecating humor, and being as white and awesome as I could possibly be. I had also completely avoided dating for the first 23 years of my life. Generally, when you work on yourself to become a better person, you feel better about yourself and more confident in your own skin. When overweight people hit the gym, maintain good nutrition, and successfully lose the weight and keep it off, they feel great about themselves and feel much more confident in the dating game (just ask phineas). If someone who had no job finally puts in the work to educate themselves and establish a successful career, they feel like they can accomplish anything; they feel desirable. However, for me, everything I do to better myself only makes me feel more bitter and angry. I can work hard to be this great guy with good morals, a good set of skills, smart, funny, education, career, etc., but at the end of the day, no matter what I've got to offer, I'm still an Asian and seen only as such. Imagine a seesaw...on one end, you have all my qualities and on the other, you have "Asian." No matter how much you stack on the qualities side, Asian always seems heavier...as if it just inflates and becomes bigger and bigger. And it just makes me hate myself even more, because it's something I can't change. And I'm sure you'll say this is all in my head, but the fact of the matter is, yes, it's in my head. And no matter how hard I try, I can't get it out. It affects how I interact with women. I approach every woman as if I'm already in her friendzone, because that's where Asians belong. I don't message women on online dating sites, because there are plenty of white guys for women to choose from. I become every girl's gay best friend, because Asians are as good as gay to them. So I'm finally getting tired of being angry at myself and the universe for making me an Asian and then blaming women in general for not accepting Asians as viable for dating. I'm tired of coming on LS and making a fool of myself with threads bashing women and bashing myself. I can only go so far with faking it and pretending that I'm cool with it, but deep down, I'm not cool with it. LS has helped me before get over an ex, and I'm genuinely asking for your help again with getting over this deep-seeded insecurity. I don't want this to haunt the rest of my days. I can only assume that race insecurity is much like other insecurities that people have, and the steps to overcome them might be similar. So hopefully this thread will helps others here overcome their own crippling insecurities. Thanks in advance. Edited August 29, 2011 by USMCHokie
motive2002 Posted August 29, 2011 Posted August 29, 2011 What is your racial preference? I've known at least 3 white girls that dated asian men. I really don't think it's out of the realm of possibility. And these girls are pretty good looking too. I assume the only thing you can do is be proud of your ethnicity and culture. To do otherwise would be a turn-off. The only time I recall a difference in race being a problem, is whether or not another person "fits" into the culture. My one friend who had an asian bf said that his mom ALWAYS hated her for no other reason than she was a white girl. Otherwise it was a terrific relationship. If you like who you are.. then others will too.
Queen Zenobia Posted August 29, 2011 Posted August 29, 2011 This should be required reading for all the virgin/inexperienced, etc. men on here. Because, as insecure as they are about their situation (be it looks, height, experience level) clearly there are people with even worse insecurities. I only answer from my own perspective. Having grown up in a fairly multicultural, multi-ethnic atmosphere (Arab family, live in the suburbs around mostly white folk) I honestly don't look at someone only in the context of their racial background. I tend to let people define themselves. I dated an Asian guy briefly several years ago (he took a study abroad trip to South Africa and broke it off shortly thereafter) so I can honestly say Asian men aren't "as good as gay". Since I don't know much about you, has any woman ever given you a reason to feel self-conscious about your race?
Rinas Posted August 29, 2011 Posted August 29, 2011 I don't see how being Asian should effect your dating at all. Many women would have no problems dating an Asian man. I myself, have always been attracted to Asians.
OnyxSnowfall Posted August 29, 2011 Posted August 29, 2011 Where I'm from (N. CA), plenty of women (and men) are attracted to asians.
Author USMCHokie Posted August 29, 2011 Author Posted August 29, 2011 What is your racial preference? I've known at least 3 white girls that dated asian men. I really don't think it's out of the realm of possibility. And these girls are pretty good looking too. I don't really have a preference, though all my social circles are filled with white people. I have found that Asian women in this area are generally focused on white men, so I've just let them have what they "prefer." The only time I recall a difference in race being a problem, is whether or not another person "fits" into the culture. My one friend who had an asian bf said that his mom ALWAYS hated her for no other reason than she was a white girl. Otherwise it was a terrific relationship. My family and I are pretty much 100% assimilated, and they know and accept how completely detached I am from my Asian culture. If you like who you are.. then others will too. I like who I am, but not what I am...and I can't help but think that's all others see, no matter how hard I try to pretend it's a non-issue.
Author USMCHokie Posted August 29, 2011 Author Posted August 29, 2011 This should be required reading for all the virgin/inexperienced, etc. men on here. Because, as insecure as they are about their situation (be it looks, height, experience level) clearly there are people with even worse insecurities. One of my hopes is that others will apply any guidance from this thread to work on their own insecurites... Since I don't know much about you, has any woman ever given you a reason to feel self-conscious about your race? No, not openly or directly that I can remember, but I've just always consciously attributed it to my race...it really all started in grade school...there were only two Asians in a high school class of 375 to give you an idea of the demographic. All my friends were always coupled up and I was always the odd wheel whenever we hung out...when you're that young, how else can you explain it other than the fact that you are different from everyone else and coincidentally the only single one...? I never got over that.
Feelin Frisky Posted August 29, 2011 Posted August 29, 2011 Dude, when all is said and done, a woman is not attracted to a race. What persuades her more that anything usually is a man being comfortable in his own skin, no matter what hue that skin may be. You have totally emphasized the most meaningless issue and have reinforced this over and over in your head. Perhaps doing so makes it easier for you to not keep going out and getting exposure to people. My advice is to stop looking for someone and start being someone so that you will be FOUND. Being "found" is the secret to everything. But a big part of that is having substance to validate any image. What do you believe in? Take a stand. What do you want to do professionally? Jump in with both feet. Whatever you do, get out of your head and get yourself seen. If you want to solve your loneliness problem in this decade while you're still young and in great shape, do something where someone can see that you deserve their interest. There are more Asians that anything else in the world. Someone thinks you're beautiful. (no homo)
Author USMCHokie Posted August 29, 2011 Author Posted August 29, 2011 What? I saw your pics, you're asian? So what..why is that crippling? Is it that you prefer white woman and most of them don't prefer Asian men...is that the issue here? I'd kill to look like you, man.... Some girl has to find you desirable. Thanks...I'm glad I don't have the other pictures up on LS anymore... But it's not just the white women, it's just women in general...at least in this area...so yes, that's the issue. I wouldn't even be as generous as to say they don't "prefer."
krz12 Posted August 29, 2011 Posted August 29, 2011 Out of curiosity, do you want an Asian girl or a non-Asian girl?
Author USMCHokie Posted August 29, 2011 Author Posted August 29, 2011 Out of curiosity, do you want an Asian girl or a non-Asian girl? I don't know. I've never dated an Asian girl. So we'll just go with non-Asian.
Ruby Slippers Posted August 29, 2011 Posted August 29, 2011 My family and I are pretty much 100% assimilated, and they know and accept how completely detached I am from my Asian culture. Have you considered exploring the positive aspects of your ethnic culture? Asian cultures in general are full of rich history and fascinating spiritual ideas. I am attracted to guys of many races and ethnicities, but when it comes to guys from different cultures, I connect best with the ones who have a good sense of theirs, who have embraced the beneficial aspects and moved beyond the non-useful. To me, this is a natural part of being who you are, being comfortable with yourself. Also, especially in cities, populations are becoming more diverse all the time, and cross-cultural relationships are becoming more common. Also, have you considered making some Asian or non-white friends? I'm sure plenty of non-white guys have dealt with these feelings, too, and can relate.
zengirl Posted August 29, 2011 Posted August 29, 2011 The truth is in your writing: you believe it to be a problem, so it is a problem. You're saddling yourself with a negative belief that being Asian = being undesirable to women. Women can tell you it's not true all day long, but you'll continue experiencing the "truth" of your belief until you manage to change the belief, especially if it's been ingrained in you for over a decade. Only you can unravel it, figure out where it comes from, and replace it with beliefs that work better for you.
Nexus One Posted August 29, 2011 Posted August 29, 2011 No, not openly or directly that I can remember, but I've just always consciously attributed it to my race...it really all started in grade school...there were only two Asians in a high school class of 375 to give you an idea of the demographic. All my friends were always coupled up and I was always the odd wheel whenever we hung out...when you're that young, how else can you explain it other than the fact that you are different from everyone else and coincidentally the only single one...? I never got over that. Did you hit on girls back then?
OnyxSnowfall Posted August 29, 2011 Posted August 29, 2011 The truth is in your writing: you believe it to be a problem, so it is a problem. You're saddling yourself with a negative belief that being Asian = being undesirable to women. Women can tell you it's not true all day long, but you'll continue experiencing the "truth" of your belief until you manage to change the belief, especially if it's been ingrained in you for over a decade. Only you can unravel it, figure out where it comes from, and replace it with beliefs that work better for you. Well said.
Author USMCHokie Posted August 29, 2011 Author Posted August 29, 2011 Dude, when all is said and done, a woman is not attracted to a race. What persuades her more that anything usually is a man being comfortable in his own skin, no matter what hue that skin may be. You have totally emphasized the most meaningless issue and have reinforced this over and over in your head. Perhaps doing so makes it easier for you to not keep going out and getting exposure to people. My advice is to stop looking for someone and start being someone so that you will be FOUND. Being "found" is the secret to everything. But a big part of that is having substance to validate any image. What do you believe in? Take a stand. What do you want to do professionally? Jump in with both feet. Whatever you do, get out of your head and get yourself seen. If you want to solve your loneliness problem in this decade while you're still young and in great shape, do something where someone can see that you deserve their interest. There are more Asians that anything else in the world. Someone thinks you're beautiful. (no homo) No homo, of course. I understand what you're saying, and I have tried my best to get out in the world and make myself a man of substance. I'm not quite the caged hermit I used to be, and outside of dating, I feel quite accomplished and fulfilled. Life is quite good, and I have the privilege and honor of influencing other's lives in my career. But when you talk about being "found," I just can't help but think that no matter how big and bright my proverbial neon sign is, I've got something that makes women pass me over for the next neon sign.
Author USMCHokie Posted August 29, 2011 Author Posted August 29, 2011 Have you considered exploring the positive aspects of your ethnic culture? Asian cultures in general are full of rich history and fascinating spiritual ideas. I am attracted to guys of many races and ethnicities, but when it comes to guys from different cultures, I connect best with the ones who have a good sense of theirs, who have embraced the beneficial aspects and moved beyond the non-useful. To me, this is a natural part of being who you are, being comfortable with yourself. Also, especially in cities, populations are becoming more diverse all the time, and cross-cultural relationships are becoming more common. Also, have you considered making some Asian or non-white friends? I'm sure plenty of non-white guys have dealt with these feelings, too, and can relate. I had briefly tried in college and more recently with some of my brother's friends to befriend Asians. I just never felt like I fit in, and it was honestly a bit awkward for me...but no, I had never made a legitimate effort to make Asian friends. Though I did go to a historically black college for law school and made plenty of friends there. I am pretty much comfortable with everyone except my own kind...
Author USMCHokie Posted August 29, 2011 Author Posted August 29, 2011 Did you hit on girls back then? Yes, I tried; of course in neurotic high school fashion, but I never received positive feedback. As it happened more and more, the deeper I went into the hole that I'm in now...
krz12 Posted August 29, 2011 Posted August 29, 2011 I don't know. I've never dated an Asian girl. So we'll just go with non-Asian. Ah. Forgive me if you don't want to answer, but you made this great thread, that I still have bookmarked. http://www.loveshack.org/forums/showthread.php?t=251962 What happened with that first relationship? You think it contributes to your issue?
Author USMCHokie Posted August 29, 2011 Author Posted August 29, 2011 The truth is in your writing: you believe it to be a problem, so it is a problem. You're saddling yourself with a negative belief that being Asian = being undesirable to women. Women can tell you it's not true all day long, but you'll continue experiencing the "truth" of your belief until you manage to change the belief, especially if it's been ingrained in you for over a decade. Only you can unravel it, figure out where it comes from, and replace it with beliefs that work better for you. I know...I'm just not sure how someone goes about changing a belief so ingrained in their system...it feels like telling someone to change religions overnight...
Author USMCHokie Posted August 29, 2011 Author Posted August 29, 2011 Ah. Forgive me if you don't want to answer, but you made this great thread, that I still have bookmarked. http://www.loveshack.org/forums/showthread.php?t=251962 What happened with that first relationship? You think it contributes to your issue? Ah, I remember that thread... She left me after 6 months. That contributed to a host of other issues, but I don't think it either helped or furthered my Asian issue...the reason I think the Asian-ness wasn't an issue there was that we actually knew each other from college, and she had actually gotten a glimpse of my personality long before we started dating. It's just getting women to be willing to take a look beneath the surface before passing me over that is the issue for me.
zengirl Posted August 29, 2011 Posted August 29, 2011 I know...I'm just not sure how someone goes about changing a belief so ingrained in their system...it feels like telling someone to change religions overnight... Well: There's another belief you've thrown up as a roadblock for yourself. That it's a big belief. That it's difficult to change. That you don't know how or can't do it. And who said "overnight" anyway? Though I do believe change is often experienced as a singular moment in time, I'd never say that all change occurs without work or things building up to it. That doesn't fit with my personal experiences at all. Or my beliefs. People rarely change their limiting beliefs unless pushed to do so by enough dissonance. I don't believe change requires pain or pressure to happen, but I will say that many people seem to act as though it does. Depends, likely, on how that person views change.
Author USMCHokie Posted August 29, 2011 Author Posted August 29, 2011 I don't see how being Asian should effect your dating at all. Many women would have no problems dating an Asian man. I myself, have always been attracted to Asians. And I'm sure there are women out there who would be willing to date one, but I just can't shake that notion every girl I encounter just sees me and says no thanks before I can even say hello. So I just don't say hello.
Author USMCHokie Posted August 29, 2011 Author Posted August 29, 2011 Well: There's another belief you've thrown up as a roadblock for yourself. That it's a big belief. That it's difficult to change. That you don't know how or can't do it. And who said "overnight" anyway? Though I do believe change is often experienced as a singular moment in time, I'd never say that all change occurs without work or things building up to it. That doesn't fit with my personal experiences at all. Or my beliefs. People rarely change their limiting beliefs unless pushed to do so by enough dissonance. I don't believe change requires pain or pressure to happen, but I will say that many people seem to act as though it does. Depends, likely, on how that person views change. I know you're really into psychology and all that...do you know of any references or books on this topic? I checked on Google, and there aren't any books on how to get over being Asian...go figure...
OnyxSnowfall Posted August 29, 2011 Posted August 29, 2011 And I'm sure there are women out there who would be willing to date one, but I just can't shake that notion every girl I encounter just sees me and says no thanks before I can even say hello. So I just don't say hello. It's a curious thing... the fear of rejection. While rejection is always a possibility... whatever happened to seeing things in the light of: "Unless you try, you will NEVER succeed". If you are fine with not succeeding anyway, you may as well just go for it. It isn't going to kill you. At some point, when you are successful, it will help your confidence. Maybe what you need to do is stop being ego-centered about potential rejection, too. IF a girl rejects you, don't jump to the conclusion that it has something to do with you. I have rejected many men, not because they weren't attractive, but for entirely different reasons like: a) I'm not available because I'm seeing someone else b) The timing is completely off, I have other priorities c) I'm emotionally unstable right now and it wouldn't be wise, lol.
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