Innocent until proven guilty??

[OnyxSnowfall]

OP - My point is... is that she may be telling you the truth. What if she wasn't physical with the guy and what if she really just wants you? Are you willing to see if she's learned that her behavior was inappropriate or not? There are certainly other ways to deal with things, it would be wise of her to seek out healthier options (i.e, ones that do not pose a threat to your relationship)... and if she's willing to do that, why not give her a chance?

 

In the end, would you rather someone "make a fool" out of you by doing the right thing, or possibly end up making a fool out of yourself by "punishing" her for something you don't know if she did or not?

 

Sadly enough, we can never really know what goes on... that's why trust is crucial within a relationship.

[John Michael Kane]

OP - My point is... is that she may be telling you the truth.

 

No. She's been cheating on him.

 

What if she wasn't physical with the guy and what if she really just wants you?

 

You don't cheat and still love the person you cheated on. Those two are like oil and water.

 

Are you willing to see if she's learned that her behavior was inappropriate or not? There are certainly other ways to deal with things, it would be wise of her to seek out healthier options (i.e, ones that do not pose a threat to your relationship)... and if she's willing to do that, why not give her a chance?

 

She had that chance when she first got in a relationship with him and married him. If he chooses not to, then he's not a jerk.

 

In the end, would you rather someone "make a fool" out of you by doing the right thing,

 

She made a fool of herself and her husband by cheating and is still lying.

 

or possibly end up making a fool out of yourself by "punishing" her for something you don't know if she did or not?

 

He's won't be making a fool out of himself by leaving her whether she screwed the guy or not. He already has enough evidence that shows she's been "making a fool" of him.

 

Sadly enough, we can never really know what goes on... that's why trust is crucial within a relationship.

 

Exactly, which is why it would be even more foolish for him to roll over on the ground and treat this as something innocent.

[Ian42]

I have asked her all of the direct questions – have you ever kissed him, have you hugged him, held hands and of course have you had sex (or anything sexual).

 

Not only has she denied all of these things….she says that she hasn’t even seen him since all of the communications started. Based on the phone records I can see that this all started over the past two months (I looked back over the past 6 months and there were only four calls in total which were probably kid related).

 

Her response as to “why” she did it was almost exactly like Onyx’s description….she just liked having someone to talk to. She is home all day with the kids, I am at work and cannot call and text during the day and she liked having an “adult” to make conversation with. When things did start getting flirty she admits that she did make her feel good, but she says the flirting was a very small part of the communication – she says they never flirted while talking, just little comments while texting.

 

Regarding giving up her cell phone, I showed her the phone records already when I confronted her – she knows that each call and text is logged and that I would be able to check if there were any calls or texts to him going forward. I asked her to give up the phone, facebook, etc. so she could focus on our family.

 

I agree that a long term EA is just as bad, if not worse than a PA. However, in my situation, the EA was not long term; it has only been a month or so (as far as I can tell). Given that, if it did get physical in that time, it is much worse that if it was just calls and texting.

 

As far as I can tell she has been open, remorseful, agreed to change and admits that the calls and texts “got out of hand”. Obviously, I am still left with the thought “what if she is lying about a PA”?

 

I would not give up our marriage and put our kids through a divorce if it was just a month of calls and flirty texting. I think we can work through that.

 

However, if it was a PA too then I don’t think I could deal with that.

 

I guess since I do not have any proof of a PA I will work on the EA side of this and see if anything else surfaces. I don’t want to end our marriage assuming she had a PA.

[dreamingoftigers]

All the men are thinking...like men. For men, recovery is most difficult when there has been a physical affair, because men are very visual about sex.

 

They cannot get the mind movies out of their heads, so it is hard to come to forgiveness.

 

Women, usually are more upset about the romantic emotional connection their husbands had during the affair.

 

Now, let's think like woman, since the OP is concerned about his wife.

 

The emotional connection she has developed with this man speaks volumes to how close (or maybe did) head towards a physical affair

 

He is right to nip it in the bud and to monitor, very closely, what happens next.

 

He should also get them both to MC as soon as possible, IMO.

 

Local Weirdo Here,

 

I have been the exact opposite from Day One in regards to what type of affair would crater my heart.

 

I always felt that the PA would be much worse for me to experience. TBH, I look at the emotional component as what is "fixable." Once you open the "sex" door it kinda taints things. It "defiles" the marriage bed.

 

Over the course of a lifetime I expect myself or my husband to develop those feelings for someone else and maybe even to slide down that slippery slope for a bit, but at some point to come to our senses before one of us touches another person in a sexual way. Unfortunately in my M, that hasn't been the case and now I think there is a permanent taint regardless of the outcome.

 

The physical aspect of our relationship was very very important to our bond. The way it is expressed is very much a part of how I knew he loved me. Some things you just can't fake.

 

I also get the mind-movies though. EMDR therapy helped greatly with the occurrence and physical reaction to them, thank God. Some of them have even degraded a bit.

 

Maybe I just have a bit of a different brain set-up or something.

[dreamingoftigers]

I have asked her all of the direct questions – have you ever kissed him, have you hugged him, held hands and of course have you had sex (or anything sexual).

 

Not only has she denied all of these things….she says that she hasn’t even seen him since all of the communications started. Based on the phone records I can see that this all started over the past two months (I looked back over the past 6 months and there were only four calls in total which were probably kid related).

 

Her response as to “why” she did it was almost exactly like Onyx’s description….she just liked having someone to talk to. She is home all day with the kids, I am at work and cannot call and text during the day and she liked having an “adult” to make conversation with. When things did start getting flirty she admits that she did make her feel good, but she says the flirting was a very small part of the communication – she says they never flirted while talking, just little comments while texting.

 

Regarding giving up her cell phone, I showed her the phone records already when I confronted her – she knows that each call and text is logged and that I would be able to check if there were any calls or texts to him going forward. I asked her to give up the phone, facebook, etc. so she could focus on our

family.

 

I agree that a long term EA is just as bad, if not worse than a PA. However, in my situation, the EA was not long term; it has only been a month or so (as far as I can tell). Given that, if it did get physical in that time, it is much worse that if it was just calls and texting.

 

As far as I can tell she has been open, remorseful, agreed to change and admits that the calls and texts “got out of hand”. Obviously, I am still left with

the thought “what if she is lying about a PA”?

 

I would not give up our marriage and put our kids through a divorce if it was just a month of calls and flirty texting. I think we can work through that.

 

However, if it was a PA too then I don’t think I could deal with that.

 

I guess since I do not have any proof of a PA I will work on the EA side of this and see if anything else surfaces. I don’t want to end our marriage assuming she had a PA.

 

I think that you made the right decision and the right moves Ian. Onyx's scenario would seem to be the case here as well.

 

Be watchful of course.

[dreamingoftigers]

Nice assumption but way off-track.

 

I thought your marriage did end in D because of your wife's indiscretions.

[John Michael Kane]

I thought your marriage did end in D because of your wife's indiscretions.

 

Which is true but the "angry at all WSs" is way off.

[reboot]

Angry at the world is probably closer to the truth.

[John Michael Kane]

I have asked her all of the direct questions – have you ever kissed him, have you hugged him, held hands and of course have you had sex (or anything sexual).

 

Not only has she denied all of these things….she says that she hasn’t even seen him since all of the communications started. Based on the phone records I can see that this all started over the past two months (I looked back over the past 6 months and there were only four calls in total which were probably kid related).

 

Her response as to “why” she did it was almost exactly like Onyx’s description….she just liked having someone to talk to. She is home all day with the kids, I am at work and cannot call and text during the day and she liked having an “adult” to make conversation with. When things did start getting flirty she admits that she did make her feel good, but she says the flirting was a very small part of the communication – she says they never flirted while talking, just little comments while texting.

 

Regarding giving up her cell phone, I showed her the phone records already when I confronted her – she knows that each call and text is logged and that I would be able to check if there were any calls or texts to him going forward. I asked her to give up the phone, facebook, etc. so she could focus on our family.

 

I agree that a long term EA is just as bad, if not worse than a PA. However, in my situation, the EA was not long term; it has only been a month or so (as far as I can tell). Given that, if it did get physical in that time, it is much worse that if it was just calls and texting.

 

As far as I can tell she has been open, remorseful, agreed to change and admits that the calls and texts “got out of hand”. Obviously, I am still left with the thought “what if she is lying about a PA”?

 

I would not give up our marriage and put our kids through a divorce if it was just a month of calls and flirty texting. I think we can work through that.

 

However, if it was a PA too then I don’t think I could deal with that.

 

I guess since I do not have any proof of a PA I will work on the EA side of this and see if anything else surfaces. I don’t want to end our marriage assuming she had a PA.

 

So it's okay for her to talk freaky on the phone with another man just because you're not at home all the time but if she did have sex with him it's over?

[linwood]

You can't control the advice he sees/given.

 

I`m not trying to.

I`m just offering him some advice myself.

Good advice I might add.

 

I wouldn't give her the benefit of the doubt. She's been involved with him for too long and running up that cell phone bill. Keep an eye on her and wait until she slips up again.

 

I know you would`t give her the benefit of the doubt but you are obviously an extremist concerning these matters.

All one has to do is take a quick look at your posting on this forum to see evidence of it.

 

If the OP still wants his wife/marriage and she is willing to do whatever it takes to make it work I think they have a pretty good shot if she`s sincere and remorseful which it seems she might be.

 

Many marriages have successfully overcome affairs JMK, many couples find a way and realize happiness.

 

This OP seems textbook for reconciliation.

Edited August 19, 2011 by linwood

[John Michael Kane]

 

I`m not trying to.

I`m just offering him some advice myself.

Good advice I might add.

That's not advice.

 

I know you would`t give her the benefit of the doubt but you are obviously an extremist concerning these matters.

All one has to do is take a quick look at your posting on this forum to see evidence of it.

Never tried to hide my own view, but that's not the subject of discussion here.

 

If the OP still wants his wife/marriage and she is willing to do whatever it takes to make it work I think they have a pretty good shot if she`s sincere and remorseful which it seems she might be.

Sorry but anyone would notice that someone who cheated is not going to be remorseful.

 

Many marriages have successfully overcome affairs JMK, many couples find a way and realize happiness.

That's not true. Less than 15% of marriages "survive" after an affair. The numbers are scary.

 

This OP seems textbook for reconciliation.

No, he's just in shock now.

[John Michael Kane]

Angry at the world is probably closer to the truth.

 

Nope. Not true and off-topic.

[Owl]

So let's clear this up with some direct questions, shall we?

 

Ian- What's your "goal" at this point? Reconciliation, or divorce?

 

Does your wife seem "remorseful" at all to you?

 

What kind of support/advice are you hoping that we here on LS can provide you?

[Ian42]

Owl, thank you for getting this back on track.

 

My goal is to make the right decision (but not sure what that is) – I do not have my mind set on reconciliation or divorce yet. The only real fact that I have is that there is an unbelievable amount of calls and texts and that it is all within the past month or so – not a long term situation.

 

I have asked all of the questions to her that I can think of, she has said that it was mostly just normal conversations with a little flirting. Not only does she claim there was no PA, she claims that she hasn’t even seen him during this time. His wife is telling me that he is saying the same thing to her. She claims it was more of an addiction to the communication itself and not based on sexual feelings towards him (although she said the attention did make her feel good).

 

If it was just a lack of judgment and it really was just a lot of calls and text (even if somewhat flirty) and it did not progress to a PA we can probably work through that and I would want to put in the effort to save our marriage and family.

 

However, if it was a PA too I would not want to work on the marriage and would look to a divorce. To me, that is just a much higher level of betrayal.

 

So, without having any proof of a PA and not knowing if she is lying now or not – do I assume the worst and file for divorce or do I deal with it as just a short term EA?

 

I understand that EA’s do develop into a PA’s, and it is possible that this could have given time, but since I caught it early it may not have gotten that far yet…..should that factor into my decision – do I assume it would have developed into a PA if I had not caught on therefore file for divorce?

 

Does anyone have experiences where an EA that did not develop into a PA? Does the fact that she was in an EA mean she will do it again (once a cheater always a cheater theory)? Again, she says that it was an addiction not an EA, but that just may be semantics.

[TurningTables]

Hello Ian. I did have a EA with my best friend/xMM that did not progress to a PA. I was in the middle of separation/divorce. He was unhappily married. We formed a bond and were each other's sounding board. To answer your questions: I would never go there again. I ended our friendship as soon as I realized it was going beyond a normal friendship. This was a 20+ year friendship also. I didnt even realize it until someone noticed us and said something to me. So, sometimes, you dont "see" it until someone points it out to you. Maybe this was your W's POV.

 

I dont believe that once a cheater always a cheater. There have been many many marriages that have recovered from an A. What bothers me about your posts is that you are not facing the reality that something is wrong somewhere in your marriage. There is a reason why your W was going outside of it to talk to someone about her day, the kids(etc). Why would she need to do this if everything is "good" with your M? It just dosent add up. You may never know if it progressed to PA. You need to start from this point and go see a MC NOW. I feel that you caught your W's EA early on and there is hope. Make the appointment. You wont be sorry.

[Owl]

Does anyone have experiences where an EA that did not develop into a PA? Does the fact that she was in an EA mean she will do it again (once a cheater always a cheater theory)? Again, she says that it was an addiction not an EA, but that just may be semantics.

 

My own personal experience was along these lines. My wife got involved in an online (initially) EA with an OM that lived better than a thousand miles away. Someone she never had the opportunity to meet "face to face".

 

It escalated from online communication within the game (an online MMORPG) to IM/email communications external to the game, finally to several phone calls per day alongside all of the computer communications.

 

The bottom line for you is that there is no way she can differentiate it between an "addiction" and an EA. What you have described clearly meets what most would accept as an EA.

 

I personally don't subscribe to the "once a cheater, always a cheater" concept, although I DO believe "twice a cheater, always a cheater".

 

With that said...if she refuses to see it as an EA, if she refuses to be remorseful for it, if she denies it was anything serious, or something you should be concerned about....then you have some serious basis for concern that it could happen again.

 

I'd suggest that you seek out a marriage counselor who has a good track record and method for helping couple cope with infidelity. INSIST that your wife go with you.

 

Let him pick the label for it. And more importantly, ask him to help the two of you work out PRECISELY what she felt/feels is lacking in your relationship that she was getting from OM. Odds are...there'll be fewer items that she can identify than she thinks there are.

 

Work to find ways to meet those needs in your marriage instead...and do the same thing in the other direction...identify what needs you have that she needs to be meeting.

 

Just some thoughts.

[OnyxSnowfall]

Ian - if it was a true EA, then she may be susceptible to it in the future (and she would have to admit it to herself and begin to uncover why she began it... in order to help prevent it from recurring [it is possible to change and to prevent things. I don't believe in once a cheater always a cheater - people just tend to naturally resist change and don't like taking responsibility/assessing themselves and questioning their actions... hence cyclic behaviors that extend far beyond repeatedly cheating even]).

 

But either she's in denial about it or... she really wasn't emotionally attached to him. If it was due to primarily needing social interaction, then maybe she could find a female friend to have conversations with/occasional outings with? Also, does she have any family nearby that she can become closer with?

 

I was a stay at home mother for a few years... it gets tedious. It isn't an excuse to develop what "may" (or may not) become an inappropriate relationship... but I suppose I can grasp the craving for interaction outside of home life. What are her hobbies? Does she get "alone" time at all? Do you? And if you two don't already, what about making time to get out without the children here and there? People are more than just one or two roles - people are multi-faceted creatures and I think that when large aspects of themselves go unheeded, not so healthy things begin to surface. I think it would be beneficial for both of you to go to couple counseling together to really find out what's up.

 

But I can't really stress enough how it seems to me that the right thing to do is to give the benefit of doubt and believe her when she says it wasn't physical. If you later discover that she lied to you, at least you'll know what to do. If it seems like she was telling the truth however (i.e, this situation doesn't repeat and she doesn't see him again etc), at least you'll know you didn't throw everything away over suspicion.

 

That's just my two cents though. If you have too much doubt, then it may be best to separate - regardless of the truth... doubt is pretty toxic.

 

To me it would be tragic if she didn't mean any harm to you by it... but you may be unable to help exactly how you feel too. And it would be best to move on if the "what-ifs" are just going to devour you.

[drifter777]

To me it would be tragic if she didn't mean any harm to you by it... but you may be unable to help exactly how you feel too. And it would be best to move on if the "what-ifs" are just going to devour you.

 

This is on of the dumbest post's I've seen in a long time, and I don't understand how anyone with any experience with infidelity could say something like this. In the overwhelming majority of cases the WS says something like "I didn't mean to hurt you" or "it wasn't about you, it was me" to the BS. It's part of their damage control when they go into panic mode and they will say anything to make them appear less guilty in the eyes of BS. In this case, her selfish, slutty behavior with this man was fun, exciting, and felt good. She gave no thought to her husband or how he would feel about her activity because she simply didn't care. It was more important to trade texts, sexts, and phone calls with another man than it was for her to discuss her wants and needs with her husband and decide how to work on them together. There is nothing innocent here so please don't suggest that there was.

 

OP, you continue to ignore my suggestion that your wife is lying to you and that the chances this escalated to (or always was) a physical affair are great. However I feel a genuine uncertainty in your posts as to whether or not you believe that it was "only" a EA. You have probably read other posters warn you about the propensity of a WS to lie, lie, and then lie some more. I think a really good rule of thumb is to not believe anything they tell you regarding the extent of the affair, the details of sexual contact, or whether or not they still are in contact with their affair partner. These are the primary areas that the cheater does not want you to know about as they fear the truth will destroy any chance of reconciliation. You really need to believe me here, and you really need to get yourself into counseling and work on sorting out your emotions and preparing yourself for the truths that are bound to trickle out over the next few weeks & months. Marriage counseling may help, but you should place your own needs first at this time.

 

To assume she is lying and there is much more to the story is the best way to approach this right now because she is busy distracting and manipulating you to believe that what you have found out on your own is the extent of her cheating. Think about that. Everything you know and she has "confessed" to is the direct result of your suspicions and research. Do you really think you have found out EVERYTHING on your own?

[OnyxSnowfall]

drifter --- why did she oblige handing over the phone and deactivating her FB account? why did she admit it was inappropriate? why has she said that she wasn't attracted to the other guy and why does the OP believe her in regards to it? why has she not made more effort to "see" and or "be" with the other man? (these are rhetorical, I already realize things can be seen in multiple lights and those who are passionate about claiming something without knowing enough about it are going to put it in under their little lamps. I'm aware that it's possible she is deceiving him... I'm simply saying it's irrational to let fear and doubt and suspicion destroy a relationship).

 

"slutty" is a bit much based on what Ian has posted... was there actually "sexting" going on?! He said that there was some flirting... she was being "complimented"... not that the wife was "sexting"...

 

what I was implying by "no harm", is that she may have been self-absorbed and not maliciously trying to "deceive" him... sheesh. People "hurt" people without meaning to all the time... I think there's a difference between being in a dark spot yourself and intentionally putting others there.

Edited August 19, 2011 by OnyxSnowfall

[drifter777]

drifter --- why did she oblige handing over the phone and deactivating her FB account? why did she admit it was inappropriate? why has she said that she wasn't attracted to the other guy and why does the OP believe her in regards to it? why has she not made more effort to "see" and or "be" with the other man? (these are rhetorical, I already realize things can be seen in multiple lights and those who are passionate about claiming something without knowing enough about it are going to put it in under their little lamps. I'm aware that it's possible she is deceiving him... I'm simply saying it's irrational to let fear and doubt and suspicion destroy a relationship).

 

and I'm saying it's irrational to believe a cheater so soon after d-day. She may have a disposable phone that OP doesn't know about. She admitted it was inappropriate because he had the content of the texts and records of hundreds of calls. She said she wasn't attracted to the other guy because that's what just about every WS says to their spouse. She may be seeing the OM just as often as before - how would he know?

"slutty" is a bit much based on what Ian has posted... was there actually "sexting" going on?! He said that there was some flirting... she was being "complimented"... not that the wife was "sexting"...

Ok, slutty may be a bit much since I do not know the content of the text's other than OP's description of "flirty". It would be for him to comment on whether it qualified as "sexting".

what I was implying by "no harm", is that she may have been self-absorbed and not maliciously trying to "deceive" him... sheesh. People "hurt" people without meaning to all the time... I think there's a difference between being in a dark spot yourself and intentionally putting others there.

Yeah, spouses hurt their partners all the time without meaning to by sleeping with other people. You're not saying that this is ok, so what do you mean? The number of people who have affairs for the sole purpose of hurting their spouse has got to be a very small percentage and I don't ever recall reading such a post on LS (although I'm sure there is one somewhere). The reasons people give for cheating are endless, but I think it boils down to the fact that it is exciting, they love the attention of a new lover, and sex feels good. The rest is rationalization.

[OnyxSnowfall]

drifter --- it isn't apparent whether or not Ian's wife slept with someone else. I think that's one of his biggest concerns... he doesn't really know; there's not enough "evidence" that suggests she has... but it's still possible. But it's ALWAYS possible... with or without evidence. Belief is KEY, trust is KEY, within a relationship. FORGIVING is also key. I don't think people can have healthy and long-term relationships unless they are capable of forgiveness... why? Because people are walking disasters ... we all make mistakes. Many, many people base their capacity of forgiveness off into the confines of theory: some people surprise themselves when confronted with forgiving something that they thought they'd never forgive --- while others try and try and never seem to succeed at forgiving something that they thought they could. But we all mess up at times and we all need that forgiveness from those we hurt, we all need to "forgive" those who hurt us too... including ourselves. Otherwise we can get sucked into very bitter places and so often end up spreading it around...

 

Anyway... it's not wrong to put deal-breakers down (i.e, if you are unfaithful to me it will be something I cannot get past and our relationship will be over)... and ideally those things are communicated. People should be aware of their boundaries. Boundaries that take "one another into consideration".

 

As for typical reasons of infidelity... it's obvious it's a self-absorbed thing that hurts. It's not an expression of love for whomever is being betrayed. I think love can exist for whomever is being betrayed, perhaps that's not usually the case but nonetheless... it can exist and come out of immature states of being/thinking/feeling.

 

I just lean towards Ian's wife having been selfish in an altogether different way -- not in a cheating kind of way. For better or worse, I can relate rather well to what he's posted about it... and I never slept with anyone, nor did I want to. And I haven't repeated my behavior =P... so I think either way is possible. Given that,

 

why embrace the one that will be far more upsetting in the long-run to everyone involved? If his wife is sorry and she wants to work on things with him, why discourage that? Why not let everyone try to learn and heal from it?

 

Only Ian can decide what he can handle. As I stated before, if doubt is just going to eat away at him, it's probably "not" worth it to remain with her. EVEN if she NEVER strayed in her heart and with her body, belief is more powerful than truth and it will just keep everyone down and no one will truly mend.

 

That's why it'd be tragic --- if she was just being silly and lonely and not even wanting to be with someone else sexually etc --- but nevertheless it would be a better outcome than dragging things out which are not allowed to heal.

Edited August 19, 2011 by OnyxSnowfall

[drifter777]

drifter --- it isn't apparent whether or not Ian's wife slept with someone else. I think that's one of his biggest concerns... he doesn't really know; there's not enough "evidence" that suggests she has... but it's still possible. But it's ALWAYS possible... with or without evidence. Belief is KEY, trust is KEY, within a relationship. FORGIVING is also key. I don't think people can have healthy and long-term relationships unless they are capable of forgiveness... why? Because people are walking disasters ... we all make mistakes. Many, many people base their capacity of forgiveness off into the confines of theory: some people surprise themselves when confronted with forgiving something that they thought they'd never forgive --- while others try and try and never seem to succeed at forgiving something that they thought they could. But we all mess up at times and we all need that forgiveness from those we hurt, we all need to "forgive" those who hurt us too... including ourselves. Otherwise we can get sucked into very bitter places and so often end up spreading it around...

 

Anyway... it's not wrong to put deal-breakers down (i.e, if you are unfaithful to me it will be something I cannot get past and our relationship will be over)... and ideally those things are communicated. People should be aware of their boundaries. Boundaries that take "one another into consideration".

 

As for typical reasons of infidelity... it's obvious it's a self-absorbed thing that hurts. It's not an expression of love for whomever is being betrayed. I think love can exist for whomever is being betrayed, perhaps that's not usually the case but nonetheless... it can exist and come out of immature states of being/thinking/feeling.

 

I just lean towards Ian's wife having been selfish in an altogether different way -- not in a cheating kind of way. For better or worse, I can relate rather well to what he's posted about it... and I never slept with anyone, nor did I want to. And I haven't repeated my behavior =P... so I think either way is possible. Given that,

 

why embrace the one that will be far more upsetting in the long-run to everyone involved? If his wife is sorry and she wants to work on things with him, why discourage that? Why not let everyone try to learn and heal from it?

 

Only Ian can decide what he can handle. As I stated before, if doubt is just going to eat away at him, it's probably "not" worth it to remain with her. EVEN if she NEVER strayed in her heart and with her body, belief is more powerful than truth and it will just keep everyone down and no one will truly mend.

 

That's why it'd be tragic --- if she was just being silly and lonely and not even wanting to be with someone else sexually etc --- but nevertheless it would be a better outcome than dragging things out which are not allowed to heal.

 

We'll just have to agree to disagree on this one. She hasn't volunteered any details, he uncovered her affair on his own. As I said, the chance that he has found all the details from his own investigation is remote, and she hasn't filled in enough missing pieces to allay his fears that she screwed OM.

 

In this case I appreciate his doubt and suspicions because where there's smoke there's often fire. Over a thousand texts & 300 calls in one month is pretty hard to chalk up to "small talk" for anyone over 18. Since he stated that he would leave her if he found out she had sex with OM then I can easily see her doing everything she can to hide that from him.

 

The other thing that refuse to acknowledge - or maybe you just don't understand - is the lying nature of a cheater. Cheaters will only tell their spouses what they HAVE to tell them and not one thing more. Even the ones that supposedly "come clean" are likely hiding something, and they only came clean because the BS had decided to end the relationship. The likelihood that she is lying about the full details is very, very high.

[reddog63]

I`m not trying to.

I`m just offering him some advice myself.

Good advice I might add.

 

 

 

I know you would`t give her the benefit of the doubt but you are obviously an extremist concerning these matters.

All one has to do is take a quick look at your posting on this forum to see evidence of it.

 

If the OP still wants his wife/marriage and she is willing to do whatever it takes to make it work I think they have a pretty good shot if she`s sincere and remorseful which it seems she might be.

 

Many marriages have successfully overcome affairs JMK, many couples find a way and realize happiness.

 

This OP seems textbook for reconciliation.

 

JMK..........from an outsider looking in, your posts do stick out as coming from someone who was obviously very hurt and still has not gotten over it. If you are not seeing a councilor I think you need to. I am not saying this to put you down, but your responses ARE semi extreme even if you dont see it that way.

 

You could just make up a sample post to respond to all these threads........maybe "Divorce the slut" or "shes cheating on you, get rid of her". Now, in a lot of these threads, it is fairly obvious that cheating is going on. But some have possible exceptions, yet you tell them they should divorce at the drop of a hat. I hope people are not influenced by you because you do not think objectively. You inner rage at your own circumstance comes out in every one of your posts.

 

And also......one last comment after reading your many posts...........are you the off topic police???

[John Michael Kane]

JMK..........from an outsider looking in, your posts do stick out as coming from someone who was obviously very hurt and still has not gotten over it. If you are not seeing a councilor I think you need to. I am not saying this to put you down, but your responses ARE semi extreme even if you dont see it that way.

 

You could just make up a sample post to respond to all these threads........maybe "Divorce the slut" or "shes cheating on you, get rid of her". Now, in a lot of these threads, it is fairly obvious that cheating is going on. But some have possible exceptions, yet you tell them they should divorce at the drop of a hat. I hope people are not influenced by you because you do not think objectively. You inner rage at your own circumstance comes out in every one of your posts.

 

And also......one last comment after reading your many posts...........are you the off topic police???

 

This is off-topic, and has nothing to do with helping OP.

[nyrias]

This is off-topic, and has nothing to do with helping OP.

 

Most of your posts are not about helping anyone anyway.