delilah123 Posted July 26, 2011 Posted July 26, 2011 Template messages shows you are lazy and didn't feel like actually responding and taking the initiative to show your interested. I wouldn't of given you the time of day, personally. jesus i just don't want to pay $60 to send an email, template messages are FREE to send an email you need to spend minimum $60!! actually check the site out before telling me how lazy I am.
irc333 Posted July 26, 2011 Posted July 26, 2011 Being how this thread had turned into 8 pages, it appears there's no real solution for a better response rate (for men). No matter what advice is given.
PhillyDude Posted July 26, 2011 Posted July 26, 2011 Ok I have to intervene here. First off, for those advocating meeting after just a few emails obviously have no common sense in the reality of internet dating safety. I mean you really don't get to know someone even if you meet them three or four times but to rush to meet someone after 3 or 4 emails could be a disaster waiting to happen. And yes I do believe a phone conversation is mandatory if not two or three before meeting the aforementioned person. Thank you, Now you can set up a meeting on email for lunch or coffee after work if you work in the same area but AFTER you talk on the phone.
zengirl Posted July 26, 2011 Posted July 26, 2011 Ok I have to intervene here. First off, for those advocating meeting after just a few emails obviously have no common sense in the reality of internet dating safety. I mean you really don't get to know someone even if you meet them three or four times but to rush to meet someone after 3 or 4 emails could be a disaster waiting to happen. And yes I do believe a phone conversation is mandatory if not two or three before meeting the aforementioned person. I don't get the safety argument, really. I mean, I always meet new OL guys in a public place I know and generally one I go to regularly so I feel completely safe since the people there also know me. A public place alone would probably do for safety, and, of course, let someone know where you will be. The end. What's going to happen in a well-lit, public place?
Imajerk17 Posted July 26, 2011 Posted July 26, 2011 Two or three emails per person (no more than actually) -> phone call (maybe but regardless not too long) -> first meet in a public place. Get to the first meet as quickly as possible.
Imajerk17 Posted July 26, 2011 Posted July 26, 2011 Ok I have to intervene here. First off, for those advocating meeting after just a few emails obviously have no common sense in the reality of internet dating safety. I mean you really don't get to know someone even if you meet them three or four times but to rush to meet someone after 3 or 4 emails could be a disaster waiting to happen. And yes I do believe a phone conversation is mandatory if not two or three before meeting the aforementioned person. I disagree. You meet up with strangers all the time. Have you ever waited tables? You bring people you've had no contact with food and hope that they are honest and can pay you.
oaks Posted July 26, 2011 Posted July 26, 2011 I don't get the safety argument, really. I mean, I always meet new OL guys in a public place I know and generally one I go to regularly so I feel completely safe since the people there also know me. A public place alone would probably do for safety, and, of course, let someone know where you will be. The end. What's going to happen in a well-lit, public place? Yeah, I also meet the first time in a public place, and don't try to go to her place either to pick her up for the date or afterwards and I wouldn't invite her back to my place. As the man I'm usually the one suggesting where to meet, but sometimes the woman has suggested meeting somewhere else that she was familiar with, which was fine with me. For first dates, I let someone know where I'm going (and I'm a guy!). I'm not convinced that a handful of phonecalls makes things safer for either of us, but perhaps I should connect my phone to a voice stress analyser and ask questions about whether she's a psycho. There's probably an app for that.
oaks Posted July 26, 2011 Posted July 26, 2011 My close friend who is a female met a guy from Plenty of Fish in a public place dunkin donuts after exchanging one email with him and talking to him for thirty seconds on the phone. Well, when she got there and wasnt feeling it, she went into the bathroom to call me to come um rescue her. The guy followed her into the bathroom and before you know it her pants were down around her ankles, she managed to fight him off and scream but the reality is you cannot be complacent with dating safety. What happened to your friend is horrible. You're right that you can't be complacent with dating safety but I don't see that a few more phone calls would've told her that he was a potential rapist.
PhillyDude Posted July 26, 2011 Posted July 26, 2011 Yeah, I also meet the first time in a public place, and don't try to go to her place either to pick her up for the date or afterwards and I wouldn't invite her back to my place. As the man I'm usually the one suggesting where to meet, but sometimes the woman has suggested meeting somewhere else that she was familiar with, which was fine with me. For first dates, I let someone know where I'm going (and I'm a guy!). I'm not convinced that a handful of phonecalls makes things safer for either of us, but perhaps I should connect my phone to a voice stress analyser and ask questions about whether she's a psycho. There's probably an app for that. The Phone Call allows you to get a FEEL for someone's personality
zengirl Posted July 26, 2011 Posted July 26, 2011 I can get a feel for someone else's personality through messages easier than phone calls. I find that the more gentlemanly men are happy to message for a couple weeks, thus telling me about their weeks and days and what they generally do (a little bit too much effort if you're just looking to creep randomly, though I suppose a creep who targets might bother to do it). A phone call seems more aggressive and something that more creepy guys are more likely to insist upon to me (no offense, PD, except for your extremely rigid boundary issues on what times are appropriate for phone calls and odd tranny paranoia, you seem like a good guy to me, but what do I know?) since it's a more aggressive move than continuing to write me and get to know me over time. But I also like writing! I still love getting a long email from my BF. Way better than a phone call. It's like a little mini-book, just for me. Yeah, I also meet the first time in a public place, and don't try to go to her place either to pick her up for the date or afterwards and I wouldn't invite her back to my place. As the man I'm usually the one suggesting where to meet, but sometimes the woman has suggested meeting somewhere else that she was familiar with, which was fine with me. For first dates, I let someone know where I'm going (and I'm a guy!). I'm not convinced that a handful of phonecalls makes things safer for either of us, but perhaps I should connect my phone to a voice stress analyser and ask questions about whether she's a psycho. There's probably an app for that. Yeah, that's pretty much how I feel. I don't see how a few more calls would help anyone. Also: locking the bathroom door seems like a good solution. The place I generally went has a one-person bathroom and the whole place is a teeny room where everyone can see everyone and there's one way out. There's virtually no way I could've been kidnapped from there or raped in there. I'd rather rely on that kind of practical common sense than a 'vibe' from a few phone calls.
ScienceGal Posted July 26, 2011 Posted July 26, 2011 Out of curiosity, how long would you email back and forth with a woman before you know you are interested in her? How long before asking to call or meet her?
oaks Posted July 26, 2011 Posted July 26, 2011 Out of curiosity, how long would you email back and forth with a woman before you know you are interested in her? How long before asking to call or meet her? Well since I'm almost always initiating the first contact then I'm already interested. I might lose interested in a handful of emails, but I don't have a timetable of how many emails there should be to see if I'm still interested. I'd rather figure out if we stand a chance at having a relationship by going on a date.
sm1tten Posted July 26, 2011 Posted July 26, 2011 I am just finding it totally ironic that some of the people arguing that they would never do this or never do that and that all these specific elements must be in place... are generally the ones not having success with online dating. There is no magic formula to this. The expectation that doing A) should always lead to B) is why some of ya'll are so frustrated. You are allowed to have your expectations, boundaries, hoops for your romantic interest to jump through, etc, all you want - we all do - I just don't get why you're so butthurt that other people don't see/do things your way. (General you, not directed at anyone in particular.)
ThsAmericanLife Posted July 26, 2011 Posted July 26, 2011 I agree. There's been way too much time spent on everyone looking for some "magical no-fail solution" that guarantees the person will end up dating the other...or some seeking some hidden gem of a site where all the hot people who want average folk exist. It's all ridiculous because in many cases online dating is simply a scam to get men to join and pay money. I've seen some people succeed in OD, but too many more just go offline, live their lives, and find someone. If it was an ideal solution, then we would see more happy couples, not loads of singles who can't find anyone and more people who still see it as the "place for losers", or even the sites themselves not attempting to make themselves appear like they're full of great singles who want to meet...when those people made free profiles and never came back. I agree, but I also think going offline at the same time is another solution. I think men and women will make OD a better place when they stop thinking there's a fashion model and a wealthy athlete around every corner for them. When they accept the dating pool that's available to them and willingly choose to be alone or select from the pool. I see more people connect offline, when these very same people would never have connected online. Friends who rejected loads of plan janes and average joes online, but they end up dating one they meet in real life. My thoughts exactly. Time to get offline and get a *&^* life.
irc333 Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 I disagree. You meet up with strangers all the time. Have you ever waited tables? You bring people you've had no contact with food and hope that they are honest and can pay you. Exactly, a stranger is a friend you haven't met yet.
Better'n Outer Space Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 (edited) Quote: Originally Posted by Disillusioned To the OP: Abandon OLD ASAP. It's a waste of effort. Concentrate on working on yourself instead: become an alpha (chick magnet) and don't chase women AT ALL. If you get rich and you're good looking, you'll be fighting from a positon of strength. Then you can be the prize they'll never hook. The ball will be in your court. Working to improve yourself is a good plan, but I wouldn't suggest taking yourself off the market in the meantime. If you don't pursue women, you're probably not going to end up with anyone. Most women want to be pursued, but are not comfortable with pursuing a guy. If you don't make the effort, you won't get the prize. This right here are two responses which contradict each other yet hold the good 'ol truth. Like others here have said, "OLD" is a waste of your brain's calculation. Women go there after a breakup to boost their self-esteem again. 5's get attention & sent IoI's from lotsa betas & become 9's & are then deeming themselves out of our league. They all go for the alpha's who will always treat them like crap. I'm also tired of this myth, that woman do not approach guys because they think it would turn us off. This has to stop. Ladies, how about showing some creativity yourself & send an indication of interest 1st? Offline. Edited July 27, 2011 by Better'n Outer Space typo
Disillusioned Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 This right here are two responses which contradict each other yet hold the good 'ol truth. Like others here have said, "OLD" is a waste of your brain's calculation. Women go there after a breakup to boost their self-esteem again. 5's get attention & sent IoI's from lotsa betas & become 9's & are then deeming themselves out of our league. They all go for the alpha's who will always treat them like crap. I'm also tired of this myth, that woman do not approach guys because they think it would turn us off. This has to stop. Ladies, how about showing some creativity yourself & send an indication of interest 1st? Offline. Ain't gonna happen, bud, unless you're conspicuously wealthy. The female brain is not wired to pursue males; it requires considerable amounts of $$$ to override that instinct. Quote: Originally Posted by KathyM Working to improve yourself is a good plan, but I wouldn't suggest taking yourself off the market in the meantime. If you don't pursue women, you're probably not going to end up with anyone. Most women want to be pursued, but are not comfortable with pursuing a guy. If you don't make the effort, you won't get the prize. You're missing my point. I'm not talking about pursuing the prize, I'm talking about being the prize. There are women who will ignore the "don't pursue" rule, if offered a suitable incentive. As for the women who refuse to pursue... they're free to get hit on by all the jerks they want.
zengirl Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 Are you Psychic Miss Cleo that you can interpret text messages ? How do you know you are even messaging someone of the same gender, you dont. You seem very naive. And as for my friend and your little jab at her, this place had one bathroom and he blitzkrieged himself in behind her when she opened the door. But go ahead and live in your little fantasy bubble. Are you Psychic Miss Cleo that you can read voices? You might be able to tell gender (that's not really some concern; if some woman fakes me out and meets me on a date, I'll just leave. . . ) but you cannot read character over the phone any better than you can in an email. At least I can't. I wasn't making a jab at your friend, but I don't think the issue is that she didn't talk to the guy on the phone enough or that it would've helped. I take more than reasonable precautions. The truth is, the world is a dangerous place, and I could get raped or killed walking the dog in my neighborhood or in the parking lot at work. But that doesn't stop me from living my life. I've never met anyone I felt uncomfortable with online, and I've never invited strangers anywhere near my house. I take what precautions I find reasonable, and talking on the phone certainly doesn't seem like some magic bullet to me. I think it's easier to lie in a phone call than it is in many messages over a period of weeks.
NursingGirl Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 Your Email comes across as a bit boring. Sorry. I don't think it's wise to start talking in depth about books you've read right off the bat. Way too early for that, and it gives people a sense that you are a very serious guy. You need to project an image of someone that is fun to be with. Someone that is mysterious, where they would be interested in meeting you, and don't get the whole essence of you from a couple of Emails. I'd suggest saying something like: "Hi. You sound like a very interesting woman. Someone I would enjoy meeting. I think we have a lot in common, since I'm also interested in sports and reading a good book. Email me if you'd be interested in talking further. I'd like to get to know you." (Or something along those lines). To me, that would be a good start. You go into too much detail in a first Email, and it doesn't put you in the best light. Also, not a good idea to talk about your injuries or health issues in a first Email. You ask too many questions. Be a little cool. A little mysterious. So she'll be interested in getting to know you. That would be my suggestion. Yes! I agree with this! Too much info and too heavy for the first email. Have you tried Plenty of Fish?
NursingGirl Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 Plenty of Fish is like a soup kitchen, its free. All kinds of charcters on there. I can write a book with the experiences i have had. Yes, it is. But there are still quality people there...you just have to do more fishing and be selective.
Author GivenUp0083 Posted July 27, 2011 Author Posted July 27, 2011 Out of curiosity, how long would you email back and forth with a woman before you know you are interested in her? How long before asking to call or meet her? In the past where I've met up for dates, I'd exchange 2 or 3 emails (each of us) before I'd proposition them for a date. My last gf I had actually send 4 emails each, then texted an entire evening, then talked on the phone on two separate occasions before meeting. We just got along really well and talked all the time. It was effortless. I'm not so much worried as how to proceed once we're actually SHARING communication, I'm just having trouble lately getting a response. I think maybe it's the time of year or maybe my age....maybe 28 is past my prime and women my age want something better.
Author GivenUp0083 Posted July 29, 2011 Author Posted July 29, 2011 UPDATE: I kept at it the last week or so and I think I'm just tired of it. I still haven't gotten any responses, and I get a LOT of profile views, even from attractive women that I never viewed or emailed....but no contact. I've tried everything everyone has suggested...not dice. I realize it may not be anything about me, I just haven't gotten lucky and found a match that was interested yet but I'm starting to become disgusted. I don't really have the time for this anyway, it's becoming more a chore. I read some of these profiles and I realize I don't even think they're that great anyway. It's not like they've wrote these wonderfully thoughtful and creative profiles, many of them sound like they put not much effort, yet their "dot" is red which tells me they get so many emails that they can't reply to that many which marks them as "replies very selectively". I know I'm a good guy and I have a lot to offer, and to be honest my life is just fine the way it is. Sure, I miss having a girl to spend time with and having intimate moments, but I also wish I had a mansion and a sports car. Maybe finding a girl just isn't that realistic for me. I just don't care to put in the effort. The brain power I have to use to try and stand out and be creative each and every time I want to see if a girl is interested in getting to know each other is not nearly worth the effort. It's a pain in the ass if anything. I think I'm hanging it up. I thought dating was supposed to be fun....this sure isn't fun at all. More like annoying.
Author GivenUp0083 Posted July 29, 2011 Author Posted July 29, 2011 I disagree. You meet up with strangers all the time. Have you ever waited tables? You bring people you've had no contact with food and hope that they are honest and can pay you. A better example would be the fact I'm in sales. I call up people, try to find out if they have potential interest in my company, and set up a meeting. Do they ever freak out and worry about becoming someone's lampshade? Not only are you lazy, your cheap too. Wow your a keeper. Considering I've sent out about 100 thoughtful emails, tried every way I can to improve my profile/emails, and I'm a man who has been told he's good looking, in good shape, has a stable job, no drug problems, and good relationship experience and I know what I want in life....I haven't landed a single response, or even a date. And you think I'd be cheap if I DIDNT want to have to PAY for that? My thoughts exactly. Time to get offline and get a *&^* life. I love ignorant people like you that assume they use the internet for ANYTHING else (i.e. look for a job, purchase items, find information) that it's just fine, but if they try to use it as a tool to meet new people, even new people to DATE then you chalk it up to "oh they must have no life". I don't know which I'd rather be: The loser who goes online to meet women or the loser who goes on a message board to tell other people THEY are losers for using the internet. Maybe you should go step in front of a train or something.
NursingGirl Posted July 29, 2011 Posted July 29, 2011 You're seem to be another woman who prefers generic emails with no substance. I would never have believed that anyone would like that. Little did I know how wrong I was. We were talking about the FIRST email. It is not established that this woman is even interested in continuing a conversation. Keep it light at first, tell something about yourself/your day, ask her an open ended question that is fairly easy to answer and build on the conversation. That's what I would suggest.
NursingGirl Posted July 29, 2011 Posted July 29, 2011 Considering I've sent out about 100 thoughtful emails, tried every way I can to improve my profile/emails, and I'm a man who has been told he's good looking, in good shape, has a stable job, no drug problems, and good relationship experience and I know what I want in life....I haven't landed a single response, or even a date. I don't even know if I should comment on this thread right now since it's getting alittle heated and maybe even away from the topic? But I am glad my boyfriend didn't give up! I found him on POF.
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