Lostinlife4now Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 Oh half...:bunny: Been there done that!!!!!! One thing that really struck me in your post was He loves himself more than he loves his W and you. You bet your sweet ass they do! My MM always said he could never leave because of his kids. BULL****!!!! I am a divorced mother and my daughter turned out JUST FINE!!!! He is having his cake and eating it too. My MM used to say all the right things, call me ten times a day, take me places, buy me things....now IT IS VERY OLD, and I see right thru it. Right now he is on vacation with his W and kids for 2 weeks...if he didn't love her he wouldn't be there...HELLO??? If things were that bad in his M like he used to tell me....Sexless, Friendless, nothing in common.....so on and so forth............................... He gets the best of both worlds, she cooks and cleans for him, takes care of his kids. and I stroke and yoke his ego and make his penis hard...HE HAS GOT IT ALL....and the OW, well you can answer that. Do they love us? NO they love themselves more... You will get out of this someday....I guarantee it.... I did, and I feel wonderful....be patient with yourself...it will happen... Now when I think of my exMM and throw up in my mouth....jus sayin' Only a real man would stand up for what he REALLY wanted..... Did you ever hear the saying: To get over someone is to get under someone else......
bentnotbroken Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 For the first time ever, albeit very briefly, I think I got a glimpse of what this OW forum is SUPPOSED to be about. Two OW sharing their hopes, their dreams, and yes, their angst. And angst is not exclusive to extramarital relationships. It occurs in "normal" relationships as well. But I'm sure this valuable rapport will be short-lived with the appearance of people who shouldn't really be chiming in anyway. Wait! It already has been! Yes, this is a public forum, and everyone is allowed to say and participate in any way they want, but the point of this very forum is to support OW/OM who find themselves in a position in which they want to dicuss their situation with other like-minded individuals. It was nice while it lasted.. sometimes when one finds the places they frequent no longer appealing, they tend to stop going to those places. They don't typically stand outside the establishment yelling, complaining and stamping their foot about what the place should be.
donnamaybe Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 I wasn't aware of the fact that marriage made you an emotionless zombie.I wasn't aware I said that. Please point that out for me. Yes I've hurt him. Whether its in the same manner as I'm hurt is irrelavant. Relationships aren't tit-for-tat. Either I've hurt his feelings by leaving for the upteenth time, telling him how I never want to be in contact with him again and its hurt him deeply, or he's simply hurt @ losing his ego stroker I don't know, but in reality..I have hurt him too.I just find it odd how so many women stuck in the OW role don't even acknowledge the hurt they themselves are experiencing by the MM's refusal to leave the M in the midst of all his protestations of "true love." It's sad that there are so many who place the lying cheater's supposed emotional pain above their own.
cupshalfempty Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 Half, does it tick you off as it does me, when he puts things out there like that? (Telling you about a convo, about him complaining to her parents) I hate when he tells me they are fighting again. Its as though he is laying hope for me "see we aren't getting along, I am going to leave soon, I took my ring off and gave it to her"....but then he took it back...and crawled into bed with her for the night (I don't believe he sleeps on the couch like he claims). It drives me crazy. I was in a bad dysfunctional relationship and stayed, I knew I wanted out years before my A started. When it did, and dday came for me, I just told the truth and was relieved for the end. I think I subconsouly got caught of my own doing. His R isn't horrible like mine was. But I don't want to be thrown tid bits of hope in the destruction of their marriage simply to pacify me. Either u r unhappy and want to leave or not. Now mine "claims" he wants to leave. Now that push comes to shove though, he says he wants to just walk out his door and never turn back. BUT....ahhh yes always a but..he is scared ill reject him. Pfft...pffft pfffffffftttttt. Sorry I'm crabby today. Last night he was all asking about the last time I was with XH (new years) and acting like since I had left H I shouldn't have done that and I got the feeling he was on the verge of saying he can't trust me..hahahaha ok hypocite!
cupshalfempty Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 I wasn't aware I said that. Please point that out for me. I just find it odd how so many women stuck in the OW role don't even acknowledge the hurt they themselves are experiencing by the MM's refusal to leave the M in the midst of all his protestations of "true love." It's sad that there are so many who place the lying cheater's supposed emotional pain above their own. I think half and I have totally acknowledged our pain. Yes maybe we make excuses for it, but we also know we are doing it. I wasn't saying I put his pain above mine @ all. But I will take credit for any pain I have caused...maybe he doesn't really take credit for his, as each day he is with is a continuation of my pain...and I ALLOW that..because I guess I'm emotionally retarded. My point is simply, I create pain to him as well and simply because he's married doesn't disqualify him from being human and having emotions.
donnamaybe Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 I think half and I have totally acknowledged our pain. Yes maybe we make excuses for it, but we also know we are doing it. I wasn't saying I put his pain above mine @ all. But I will take credit for any pain I have caused...maybe he doesn't really take credit for his, as each day he is with is a continuation of my pain...and I ALLOW that..because I guess I'm emotionally retarded. My point is simply, I create pain to him as well and simply because he's married doesn't disqualify him from being human and having emotions. Of course you're not emotionally retarded! Good grief! As if no one else has made excuses for a partner before! Hell, I used to do that - but as I've matured (I don't wanna say "aged" - ) I've come to realize I WANT a man but I don't NEED a man. My life is better alone than with someone who can't or won't give me everything I need in a R. If I may ask, how long have you been waiting for this guy to make a choice? I'm sorry if you've already stated this and I've missed it.
cupshalfempty Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 Of course you're not emotionally retarded! Good grief! As if no one else has made excuses for a partner before! Hell, I used to do that - but as I've matured (I don't wanna say "aged" - ) I've come to realize I WANT a man but I don't NEED a man. My life is better alone than with someone who can't or won't give me everything I need in a R. If I may ask, how long have you been waiting for this guy to make a choice? I'm sorry if you've already stated this and I've missed it. I guess about 4 months. @ first we were both in m's. I left mine after 8 months, i tried to sort myself out but mm was still there, then a few months later he said he wanted ME and only me and promised he was going to leave. No time frame, just..he's working on it, and soon and yada yada yada. I gave 2 more months...that gives him a total of 6 months (which I personally find VERY giving of me to waste that much time on someone who is most probably lying to me) to man up or man out.
Author half_ofa_heart Posted July 27, 2011 Author Posted July 27, 2011 Half, does it tick you off as it does me, when he puts things out there like that? (Telling you about a convo, about him complaining to her parents) I hate when he tells me they are fighting again. Its as though he is laying hope for me "see we aren't getting along, I am going to leave soon, I took my ring off and gave it to her"....but then he took it back...and crawled into bed with her for the night (I don't believe he sleeps on the couch like he claims). It drives me crazy. I was in a bad dysfunctional relationship and stayed, I knew I wanted out years before my A started. When it did, and dday came for me, I just told the truth and was relieved for the end. I think I subconsouly got caught of my own doing. His R isn't horrible like mine was. But I don't want to be thrown tid bits of hope in the destruction of their marriage simply to pacify me. Either u r unhappy and want to leave or not. Now mine "claims" he wants to leave. Now that push comes to shove though, he says he wants to just walk out his door and never turn back. BUT....ahhh yes always a but..he is scared ill reject him. Pfft...pffft pfffffffftttttt. Sorry I'm crabby today. Last night he was all asking about the last time I was with XH (new years) and acting like since I had left H I shouldn't have done that and I got the feeling he was on the verge of saying he can't trust me..hahahaha ok hypocite! Cup, I strangely enough, don't mind but it's probably because, like you said, i'm hanging on to the hope that it's the beginning of the end. They do fight a lot (I know this NOT by HIS telling me) but I've been married before and know when there is resentment on both sides, it's bound to happen. I was absolutely MISERABLE in my marriage; when I divorced, it was the happiest I'd ever been! However, I stayed married 3 years longer than I should have simply because I couldn't bear the thought of not being with my children for even one day. Later, his lack of emotional stability allowed me to keep my children 100% which was all I needed to go forward with my decision. My point is, I completely understand where my MM is coming from as far as his little girl. It's not that he feels SHE will suffer if he leaves; HE just doesn't want to be without her for even one day. I GET that. I also get that THAT doesn't work for ME! I tell him all the time that his marriage must not be horrible otherwise he would leave. I once asked him on a scale of 1 - 10 (1 being AWFUL and 10 being the BEST) where he would rate his marriage and his answer was 2. He said if he could go and take his daughter 100% he would leave in a heartbeat. I made sacrifices for my children (still do) so I can understand this but it still doesn't justify my unhappiness. My MM doesn't tell me he sleeps on the couch but he tells me (and I know this to be true) that their daughter sleeps in between them every night. Does that mean he's not having sex with her???? No, he has never told me that is the case. He says it happens very infrequently. Still, just knowing it still happens, should be enough for me to tell him to get lost. I'm super crabby as well so no worries. I sat in bed last night and couldn't sleep and was thinking about even if he did leave her today... we still couldn't be together for a while until he got his life together. I've told him (and I say the same to you cup) when and IF he leaves... he has to do it because he no longer wants to be married to her and NOT because he wants to be with me. He has asked me over and over again, "when I leave her, how much time has to pass before I can be with you openly?" my answer is always, when you have settled all your business with your divorce and are comfortable and happy with YOURSELF. I don't want to be the REASON he leaves; when and if he leaves, he has to be happy alone and on his own before ANY relationship has a chance to work. Well, that sounds all great and perfect in my mind but will it happen????
donnamaybe Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 I guess about 4 months. @ first we were both in m's. I left mine after 8 months, i tried to sort myself out but mm was still there, then a few months later he said he wanted ME and only me and promised he was going to leave. No time frame, just..he's working on it, and soon and yada yada yada. I gave 2 more months...that gives him a total of 6 months (which I personally find VERY giving of me to waste that much time on someone who is most probably lying to me) to man up or man out. Well, good for you for making a timeline! I've seen several of these situations where a gal is still waiting after over 5 years (and sometimes more) for an MM to leave. No one should put up with that kind of waffling!
jthorne Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 But none of them are your friends Donna, as you categorically stated that you could never be friends with an OW in real life, so just to be correct you only know what you read, which is as reliable as... Well I just mean it would be hard for you to truly say what being in that position might be like, other than your own take on it.Wow, stretching it much? You the one who says everyone should be able to show empathy here. What does your spat with Donna have to do with the subject of this thread?
heartinlove Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 HI Half and Cup, I am in the same boat as the both of you. Pretty much all the same story. My MM has made the decision to leave the marriage and is planning to tell in the next month after a few things that I won't go into is resolved. There have been alot of back and forths though, and it has been really rough sometimes. Mainly, I love you, want to spend my life with you then back to how can I leave my kids and not see them everyday, how can I hurt my wife, so I completely relate. It is so easy for people outside these situations to say oh the kids, the pain, typically mm bull**** response, hes just a cake eater. But when your dealing with real people and real children, you know that it is a big deal to leave a marriage with children and sometimes it takes time for the MM to come to terms with that emotionally. So, where others will say, walk away, make an ultimatum, hes just a typical cake-eater, I dont think those cookie cutter statements work. Sometimes, people do need time to come to these difficult decisions. Only you both know your situation. For me, I have an internal timeline. If there isn't a clear choice and actions in the next 3 months, I am moving on, because I can't stay in this space any longer. I have given him lots of space to choose, and its time. That keeps me sane. I know the pain you both feel of promises and futures spoken of and I know the devastation when then they are pulled away again, and my heart cant handle that indefinitely. I am grateful to this forum, but I also know at the end of the day, I need to listen to myself too. I wish you both the best of luck, and feel for you. Being in this situation is no picnic.
heartinlove Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 That's good that you've got a timeline, hope you stick to it. Of course it takes time to make big decisions in life, but how much rope is it reasonable to give someone before they hang themselves? As for you discounting advice because it sounds too typical and cookie cutter for you, don't forget that a lot of us have walked in the shoes you have on now. I now have the hindsight and clarity that comes with time and an ability to look back without the fuzziness of hope and denial and rationalization. It might work out for you and it might not......but there comes a time when it's wise to cut your losses. HI BB. I appreciate your posts. I wasn't saying that to discount advice given. I understand that many people here have been burned badly and are trying to help others avoid that kind of pain, and I appreciate that perspective. I think its generous for those people to stay in this forum and offer feedback. I was just saying at the end of the day the only people that know the full picture is the people in it and you have to also find your own truth. And some advice here is cookie cutter, in making blanket statements that all mm say they cant leave cause of the kids or cause they would cause pain, and imply that there isn't real truth for the MM inside those emotions. I am sure many MM truly are in love with the OW and truly can't live with themselves if they were to leave their children, or devastate their wives. They still need to ultimately make a choice, but all those struggles are real for them. They are not always just bs answers that are given to OW's to string them along. Some of these men are decent people, just horribly conflicted. Sometimes, men actually do leave marriages, and follow through. I just wanted to give space for that being a possibility too. What this forum has given me is the sense to have a timeline and not let this go on indefinitely. I agree you need a timeline and have to be at some point willing to cut your losses. Reading the stories here, and how some people stayed in for many years only to get horribly hurt in the end, has motivated me to create a timeline and stick to it. I hope I stay true to that. So, for that I am grateful to be here, because the feedback helps me stick to that.
Author half_ofa_heart Posted July 27, 2011 Author Posted July 27, 2011 As for you discounting advice because it sounds too typical and cookie cutter for you, don't forget that a lot of us have walked in the shoes you have on now. I now have the hindsight and clarity that comes with time and an ability to look back without the fuzziness of hope and denial and rationalization. It might work out for you and it might not......but there comes a time when it's wise to cut your losses. I wouldn't say I'm discounting advice (especially from you BB) but I know every situation is different. Not every person/affair is the same. Granted, they seem to have many similarities but they are different and all have differrent circumstances. And just like any problem that any one person suffers from... until THEY themselves are ready to address that problem, it will never get fixed. That's why I come here to LS... to slowly absorb every little piece of wisdom bestowed upon me to help deal with my current problem. In time, its bound to shine thru and help me either get out or continue down the difficult road of an open R with him. Either way... LS helps!
Confused4Now Posted July 27, 2011 Posted July 27, 2011 That's good that you've got a timeline, hope you stick to it. Of course it takes time to make big decisions in life, but how much rope is it reasonable to give someone before they hang themselves? It might work out for you and it might not......but there comes a time when it's wise to cut your losses.It has been said many times people aren't where they don't want to be. Timelines are good and dandy if they are followed through. I had so many of them given to me but none of them were never met. I also felt I gave my xMW the rope and it was a matter of time before she hung herself.
Author half_ofa_heart Posted July 27, 2011 Author Posted July 27, 2011 I know half........and I know that every situation has it differences, but putting the differences aside, it's the same for any ow who wants the man full time. He is there, still married, and you are going nuts wanting what you don't have. You deserve better......I know it. Thanks BB... deep down I know it too:(
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