Dust Posted July 1, 2011 Posted July 1, 2011 I wanted to take a moment to talk to women about creeps. I’d like to tell women not to be afraid of creeps. Instead to try and understand a mans motivations. For the men reading this you understand far to well that any women may find you to be a creep. To that I say the be yourself and don’t worry about creeping women out. You’ll never be a creep to the people who care about you. That’s all that should matter. This post is almost identical to a post I made today responding to girl who was afraid and had determined a guy was a creep. I told her she had every right to be turned off by the guy but to please understand why he might be persistent. The guy had creeped her out on the date by just being unsmooth and saying silly crap like “that guy is looking at us” and “I’m a real ladies man.” Now I’ve said silly things myself and I like to think I’ve out grown those days. The real thing that got to me was her, and most womens hatred of mens persistence. I do understand why they feel like we would just go away when they don’t want us. The thing is we have nothing to lose and everything to gain. In the thread that inpired this the girl had received flowers after ignoring the guy. It got her to stop ignoring him and consider dating him again but she just didn’t like him. That’s fair. So she made up a lie about getting back with her ex. The guy saw through it and asked her out again anyways. Now she is mad. Well who cares he took shot and I respect him for that. It might have worked. Even though it didn’t he lost nothing. He probably even felt better for trying and making it all more real for him. From this point forward it gets almost identical to my other post so try not to be annoyed if you read that one. I’d like to relate this all to myself and my experiences. I have serious girlfriend and we’ve been going out for a few years now, even live together, so I save all my creeping for her these days, but when I was single I surely creeped out my fair share of women. First off I’ve said many silly immature things like the “I’m good with women” comment before. Seems stupid now but at the time my thinking was she’ll see I picked her out of all the girls and I’m not* desperate. I’m sure I’ve also done awkward things I just can’t remember them now. As for girls finding it creep to get flowers from a guy they don’t like, that’s a pretty bold move. I do believe in making bold moves when you like a girl. Not necessarily sending flowers, but when you’re making a bold move you have to do what you are thinking. I also believe in trusting your gut and asking a girl out anyways even if she says she’s getting with some guy. Girls lie about imaginary guys constantly, you some times get a feeling. It’s like the fake lesbians at the night club, that isn’t her gf she just wants you gone quick. You probably are wasting your time but feel free to try again if you are feeling it. I pretty much believe in trying until I get bored. Men will eventually get bored. The guy will get bored a lot quicker if you communicate your complete disinterest before ignoring him. Just ignoring him will work also, just not as fast. I personally along with most guys I know of would never hurt or scare a girl purposely even when drunk. I mean I guess I might accidently scare a girl when drunk I mean that’s easy enough to do just by being friendly, the thing is I wouldn’t touch them or anything. Obviously there are dangerous guys out there and girls should be careful but chances are this guy is harmless. The best thing a girl could do to get me, and most guys to stop bothering her as I said before would be to clearly yet nicely tell me/them so. Something like “I don’t want to go out with you again, please don’t contact me any more.” You could do it over the phone for maximum benefit. An email or txt would also work. He might send one or two more msg’s after that but if you just ignored him they should stop for good eventually. Girls are often afraid of being rude when rejecting a guy. It’s hard to be rude by mistake, but I guess it could happen. If a girl was rude to me, which has happened before the most I’d be likely to do was insult her back. Like a girl at a bar called me a “loser” and all I was doing was trying to talk to her. I was embarrassed to be called a loser in the middle of a bar and I ended up calling her a “bch” in the middle of a bar. I’m not proud of doing that but she upset me and I snapped. For the most part I feel I don’t need to say anything to some one who is rude it says more about them then myself. After being called out as a bch she actually then seemed to seek out my approval, she asked in a sad voice “you really think I’m a bch?” I might have been able to turn it around in my romantic favor at that point but I was still angry about being insulted so I insulted her again, I think I said “yeah you’re a real bch!” Now the girl was really angry and turned to a group of guys she was with and started talking about how I had called her a bch. The guys came over and it seemed like maybe it was going to be trouble. They asked “did you call her a bch?” I answered their question ready to fight these guys even though I would have been outnumbered and couldn’t necessarily count on my friends to fight with me. I said “yes I did call her a bch she insulted me and called me a loser for just saying hi.” They backed off and that was that. I didn’t talk to her again and she disappeared some where. I’m sure a lot more humiliated then me. This bch in a bar story illustrates a good point, women are a lot more afraid in interactions then the men are. I don’t recommend calling a girl a bch like I did even if she personally attacks you but the point is girls can be brought practically to tears both because of fear and humiliation most men aren’t facing that level of fear. My point is also that I’m sure she thought I was a creep, I mean girls get creeped out by everything. I never would have hurt her though. Most people I know would never hurt a girl over being rejected even in a humiliating manner like being called ugly, or a loser. Obviously some guys do bad things to women, but the more rational fear should be to respect some one the way you would want to be respected in that situation. I want women to realize men are on the other side of the game and it’s only advantageous for them to be aggressive/persistent with in norms. It’s within norms if you can’t get the guy arrested or otherwise threatened by his behavior. Like stalking is a crime, but what most women call stalking might be something as little as a guy commenting on their fb page. I’m also writing this for all the men on this forum who do bad with women because they’ve allowed women to fill their brains with worries of being a creep. They can’t be themselves and go after the things they want because they are so afraid of being rejected, being seen as a creep. That is their problem they need to get over that. Women have nothing to do with that. What women do have to realize is they are kidding themselves if they don’t realize that the men who are persist ant aren’t getting an advantage. They do. Obviously they will lose that advantage if they are insane persistent. What most women do call too persistent is just right or not enough in my opinion though. Here is the facts and rules to being a man when it comes to dating women. We aren’t all smooth. Whether you are smooth or awkward one thing holds true, the more aggressive and persistent you are the better off you’ll be. I mean if a woman writes a guy off as a loser or whatever and then he keeps trying and she changes her mind or almost changes her mind or just curses his name, that man can only gain from trying. He has nothing to lose. Being called a creep or persistent does nothing bad to a man who isn’t a fragile person who needs others approval on everything. In fact if he some how becomes the famous don won creep women will like him just for that. Not that he will ever get a reputation guys generally don’t get reputations the same way women can. I mean a guy known as a player only seems to get more women. I was known as a player, I’m not a player and never was one, but it never seemed to hurt. Being persistent as a man only helps. We’re on the other side of the coin. If we are internet dating for example, which I do not recommend for men, there aren’t hordes of women trying to exchange numbers and meet up with us. In real life most men never get approached and asked out. The best we can hope for is a girl to say “hi” and smile and make herself available in hopes we ask her out. Really even having a woman approach you and say “hi” and smiling at you or something can be rare. We have to make it happen. The guys who are afraid to be creepy and persistent have less of a chance with women. They are more likely to settle or be single. It’s really a nothing to lose everything to gain scenario. I’ve literally had women insult me by saying I creeped them out and ask “I’m not going to get raped am I” only to end up both kissing and having sex with them. (consensually of course) I’ve come to accept that women get creeped out. Women should come to accept that maybe that’s just a guy doing what he needs to do. Being aggressive and giving himself the best chance. Men should go after the things they want. Nothing like not answering the door when opportunity is knocking. If you were wrong and you had no chance you lost nothing. It’s very fair if for a women to make the decision to reject because she doesn’t like him. If she doesn’t like him I suggest she be firm about it, communicate it and then ignore him, or just ignore him if she really can’t handle communicating it. Communicating “I don’t want to see or talk with you any more” and then ignoring would be most effective. Most guys should give up with very few more attempts after something like that. I’d say 3 tops. Obviously if a guy keeps calling and trying to see you many times after being clear then there is a problem. That isn’t necessarily what I heard described at this point. Good luck. Hopes this helps women be less annoyed with the way some guys are. I also hopes this helps those men who are so afraid of being creeps they don’t try, or don’t try as hard as they’d like to.
RedRussian8080 Posted July 1, 2011 Posted July 1, 2011 Sorry, i forgot my reading glasses...oh wait i was never about to put them on..cause i don't have them....too long no one cares next thread.
Author Dust Posted July 1, 2011 Author Posted July 1, 2011 Sorry, i forgot my reading glasses...oh wait i was never about to put them on..cause i don't have them....too long no one cares next thread. Go ahead copy and paste it into word and make the font real big if that helps. Even print it out with big font and read a hard copy. I think a person like you might learn a thing or two. Hopefully I motivated you to read it. I’d love to hear your thoughts if they were genuine.
fortyninethousand322 Posted July 2, 2011 Posted July 2, 2011 I agree with this, OP. I am one of those guys who is afraid to be creepy. Listen to people like Eeyore, who said that it would be creepy for me to date a 19 year old. When I was 27, I had the chance to date a 19 year old. She also was interested in me. I didn't pursue it, because I was afraid (gasp!) to be considered the creepy man because of our ages. Women don't understand what it's like to face this kind of thing. To them, they breeze easily through life. Yeah sure, they get called far worse names, but creep is something that they can't comprehend, because there's no female equivalent. Slut...well, some guys like sluts. No girl likes a creep. Yeah I had a chance to date a 17 year old girl when I was 21 (she all but begged me to ask her out). But, I was very uncomfortable with it, for multiple reasons, partly for being a "creep". As for the OP, I guess it's sort of like basketball: the team that drives to the basket and crashes the boards tends to do well, while the team that sits back and takes a bunch of jumpshots might do well every once in a while but never consistently. Did I just lose everyone with a sports analogy?
sweetjasmine Posted July 2, 2011 Posted July 2, 2011 Obviously there are dangerous guys out there and girls should be careful but chances are this guy is harmless. Not exactly. There's a good chance that "harmless" guy isn't really so harmless. The vast majority of rapes are committed by acquaintances/dates, not scary strangers lurking in dark alleys. The risk is always there, even with men you consider casual friends. This is something "persistent" guys often don't understand. Men who are aggressive in their approaches put some women like me on the defensive. When a man keeps pushing and demonstrates lack of respect for my disinterest, alarm bells go off like crazy. You guys may think that women "breeze easily through life," but I doubt you've been followed in public by a man who could easily overpower you if he got his hands on you or been lunged and grabbed at by a guy you thought was just a friend.
Cracker Jack Posted July 2, 2011 Posted July 2, 2011 Well, aside from being overly aggressive, is there anything else that falls under the category of "creepy" for us men? I've heard so many different opinions on this. Even had a few female friends of mine tell me that approaching women, in their opinion, is looked at as creepy. Shyness aside, that's one of the main reasons (yeah, I know it looks like a typical excuse, but I'm serious) why I never bothered approaching women. I know I'm not a creep, so I don't want to be looked at as one.
Author Dust Posted July 2, 2011 Author Posted July 2, 2011 I agree with this, OP. I am one of those guys who is afraid to be creepy. Listen to people like Eeyore, who said that it would be creepy for me to date a 19 year old. When I was 27, I had the chance to date a 19 year old. She also was interested in me. I didn't pursue it, because I was afraid (gasp!) to be considered the creepy man because of our ages. Women don't understand what it's like to face this kind of thing. To them, they breeze easily through life. Yeah sure, they get called far worse names, but creep is something that they can't comprehend, because there's no female equivalent. Slut...well, some guys like sluts. No girl likes a creep. The truth is you might have been annoyed with her. 19 year olds have more of a chance of being very self centered and flakey. Self centered as in you’ll be annoyed by them, and flakey as in very likely to cancel and undependable. Then again some 19 year olds are better then some 30 year olds. You definitely should have take a shot. No one would have even had the balls to call you a creep. Most guys like myself would just high five you. If she was pretty could have been one of the highlights of your life getting to know her. Girls always look better naked to so she may have been a lot better looking then you’ll ever know. Girls who call you a creep are just ignorant. Guys who call you a creep either have the same hang ups you do or are jealous and full of sht. Guys shouldn’t really call people creeps or get creeped out in my opinion. Well there is no time like the present. Stop being afraid of being a creep and just enjoy going after women. For the most part pretty women look young. I thought I was hitting on a young woman once but she turned out to be forty years old. Really not the age I go for considering I’m in my twenties but she was beautiful. Usually the opposite happens you think you’re talking to some one in their twenties but they end up being a teenager. If they are legal why not go for it. Also don't be afraid to bother women. Just go talk to them if you like them. Then ask them out. Yeah I had a chance to date a 17 year old girl when I was 21 (she all but begged me to ask her out). But, I was very uncomfortable with it, for multiple reasons, partly for being a "creep". As for the OP, I guess it's sort of like basketball: the team that drives to the basket and crashes the boards tends to do well, while the team that sits back and takes a bunch of jumpshots might do well every once in a while but never consistently. Did I just lose everyone with a sports analogy? Age of consent is 16 in a lot of places around the U.S. Some states even have special rules for people who are early twenties to be able to date below 18 like 16 year olds and up. You should have done it if age was the only thing holding you back. The creep thing isn’t only about dating younger women. Its about basically doing what you want and realizing you have nothing to lose. If you make a fool out of yourself in front of some women you actually have more chance at getting her then if you never do a thing. You may say to yourself well if I make a fool that will screw it up for me later, or screw it up with her friends. They’ll all think I am some creep loser. No, you’ll actually be more likely to be successful with that girl or her friends because they will see you as some one who goes for things. That will be confirmed when you go for them again on day or go for their friends. Obviously try your best, don’t purposefully be a creep, but if its be a creep or nothing then nothing is always the worst. Do something. Try. Don’t throw away give me’s like a 19 year old girl who likes you because you feel it wouldn’t be right. Especially if you are chronically single. It will also help your relationships. If you are just in a relationship because you are settling and afraid you can never get a gf again and all women think you are a creep that is bad. In fact take that same relationship and now make yourself confident in yourself whether you get dumped or not. Believe that you could get another girl and that you would ask out girls if you were dumped. You relationship dynamic will be much better with that mind set. I don’t date my gf because I’m to afraid to ask out other girls and fear I would be single forever with out her. I date her because she is a good match and we enjoy each other. Big difference. I get your basket ball analogy. Its pretty much like that for anything in life. If the basketball players were to afraid of looking stupid and being made fun of to shoot the ball they would never score. It is also true that professionals both make and miss more shots then most people ever will. They will miss more shots then you and I. Its not really about turning dating into a numbers game either. It should be personal. Its just as a guy women aren’t going to ask you out. If you are like most guys you might have one maybe two girls ask you out your entire life. You might not even be attracted to them. You have to be out there asking out girls. When you ask a girl out you don’t really know them. You might not like them once you do. Also the girl didn’t pick to be asked out by you so while you may get a good feeling about the way she looks and caries herself she might outright reject you and yes be creeped out by you. That shouldn’t scare you. Just keep going and keep trying. That’s what you have to do when you are single. Or atleast what you should do to find your best match. Also don’t settle. Feel free to dump a girl after going out on a few dates if you don’t like something. Like if a girl hates everything you do and makes you feel stupid or something. Just cause she is wiling to date and torture you doesn’t mean you should let her. You may have liked the way she seemed but the reality may be different. If you have the confidence to go out there and meet more girls you’ll be more likely to be picky and find a good match. Being to picky is also bad though so be reasonable and be happy. Not exactly. There's a good chance that "harmless" guy isn't really so harmless. The vast majority of rapes are committed by acquaintances/dates, not scary strangers lurking in dark alleys. The risk is always there, even with men you consider casual friends. This is something "persistent" guys often don't understand. Men who are aggressive in their approaches put some women like me on the defensive. When a man keeps pushing and demonstrates lack of respect for my disinterest, alarm bells go off like crazy. You guys may think that women "breeze easily through life," but I doubt you've been followed in public by a man who could easily overpower you if he got his hands on you or been lunged and grabbed at by a guy you thought was just a friend. I’m very well aware that rapist and violent men exist. I’m also aware that true stalkers exist which is bad enough on its own but might also involve rape and or violence. I’m also very well aware that a family friend, a family member, a friend, exbf, ex-husband, a guy who thinks he’s your boyfriend, or just some acquaintance can rape, stalk, hurt a girl. I’m also very well aware that I am none of those things. I could care less if a girl thinks I might be a rapist or a stalker or what ever when I’ve done nothing disrespectful. If I approach a girl and she starts running I’m not going to chase after her. If I call a girl a few times and she doesn’t answer so I leave a polite message saying “hey its _______ just been trying to reach you so we can get dinner” and it scares her, well I know I’m not a stalker or a rapist. I know I’m not going to show up and kill her. I know I’ve done nothing wrong. One bad man can cause trouble for every year he isn’t in prison or dead. How many people are violent vs. how many people are not. I feel a lot more are not. I feel I get every advantage in being aggressive. When I say aggressive I don’t mean violently or disrespectfully so. I just mean not being afraid of making women afraid. Not being afraid to call a woman who may have ignored one of my calls in the chance that maybe she missed the call or was on the fence and another call would get her to go out and think gee he really likes me. I have nothing to lose. I have nothing to lose like seeming like a creep when I’ve been polite and broken no laws. So if I decide to be real passive about the way I approach women. Then I get to watch all the men who are aggressive do better then me. Why would do that. Because there are rapist, stalkers, and violent men out there. They wouldn’t stop. A womans husband can rape her. There’s nothing I can do about that. All I can do is know I don’t do those kinds of things to women. Well, aside from being overly aggressive, is there anything else that falls under the category of "creepy" for us men? I've heard so many different opinions on this. Even had a few female friends of mine tell me that approaching women, in their opinion, is looked at as creepy. Shyness aside, that's one of the main reasons (yeah, I know it looks like a typical excuse, but I'm serious) why I never bothered approaching women. I know I'm not a creep, so I don't want to be looked at as one. Knowing you’re not a creep should be good enough. If you see a beautiful girl sitting on a park bench reading a book you loved you really wouldn’t go and say “excuse I just noticed you’re reading ________ I love that book” she smiles and makes your day then answers in a flirty way “Yeah it’s really good so far” the cute way she is makes you want more she is just so pretty so you say “Well I better let you get back to the reading, maybe we could talk about the book and other stuff some time…I’d love take you to dinner tomorrow” she looks nervous then smiles “Ok heres my number dinner sounds good.” So are you really going to let your female friends scare you into this crap. These same female friends don’t know what its like for a second. So just go out and live the way you are. Be yourself with out fear of creeping women out. I guarantee just by being alive you’ve probably creeped some girl out. Doesn’t change who you are.
fortyninethousand322 Posted July 2, 2011 Posted July 2, 2011 Age of consent is 16 in a lot of places around the U.S. Some states even have special rules for people who are early twenties to be able to date below 18 like 16 year olds and up. You should have done it if age was the only thing holding you back. In the state that I live in age of consent is 18, and there are still several very traditional laws regulating sex still on the books. So much for Virginia being "for lovers". But I went back and forth about it, in the end it would have been a big mess. Her older sister didn't like me talking with the girl, and she was a junior in high school at the time. It would have been a lot of midnight curfews and other things. I was (and still am) looking for someone who could hang out until late or go on weekend road trips. And that just wasn't going to happen with her. Not exactly. There's a good chance that "harmless" guy isn't really so harmless. The vast majority of rapes are committed by acquaintances/dates, not scary strangers lurking in dark alleys. The risk is always there, even with men you consider casual friends. This is something "persistent" guys often don't understand. Men who are aggressive in their approaches put some women like me on the defensive. When a man keeps pushing and demonstrates lack of respect for my disinterest, alarm bells go off like crazy. You guys may think that women "breeze easily through life," but I doubt you've been followed in public by a man who could easily overpower you if he got his hands on you or been lunged and grabbed at by a guy you thought was just a friend. I get what you're saying here. But really, I think Dust is talking about passive guys who really have trouble getting dates and relationships. If you tell an already passive guy not to be too aggressive he's really never going to get anywhere, he'll just be even more passive than he was to begin with. It's sort of like telling a comatose patient not to be so hyperactive. The guys you're worried about being "too aggressive" aren't the guys Dust is talking about, and they're not guys like me who just aren't getting the whole dating and attraction thing. I mean, if your goal is to get me to be single for the rest of my life then I guess I can take your advice, but I think I can stand to be a little more aggressive.
SincereOnlineGuy Posted July 2, 2011 Posted July 2, 2011 The term "creep", used in social references, is almost always unique to the accuser, and not to the target. For the term is used disproportionately by "Springer-esque" accusers as measured against non-"Springer-esque" types. So, if your dad was a creep, and his actions impacted your life somehow, then you are extremely likely to throw the "creep" label around at just about anybody, and particularly at the straight-laced, decent guys who ARE the abnormal ones by the environmental standards in which you live and thrive. Such Springer-esque types continue to invite other Springer-esque types into their circles. They continue to be turned-on by these same Springer-esque types, aaaaaaaaaaaand they continue to be further harmed by the same Springer-esque types. Just because one cannot recognize a "creep", given all of the true creeps he/she has been around all of his/her life, does not mean that the random person whose path intersects his/her path one day, and who is "not his/her type", is the "creep". So to those who think they encounter an inordinate number of "creeps", next time you're seated at a table with many of your close friends... (to paraphrase a poker reference) "If you can't find the creep, it's you..."
Cracker Jack Posted July 2, 2011 Posted July 2, 2011 Knowing you’re not a creep should be good enough. If you see a beautiful girl sitting on a park bench reading a book you loved you really wouldn’t go and say “excuse I just noticed you’re reading ________ I love that book” she smiles and makes your day then answers in a flirty way “Yeah it’s really good so far” the cute way she is makes you want more she is just so pretty so you say “Well I better let you get back to the reading, maybe we could talk about the book and other stuff some time…I’d love take you to dinner tomorrow” she looks nervous then smiles “Ok heres my number dinner sounds good.” So are you really going to let your female friends scare you into this crap. These same female friends don’t know what its like for a second. So just go out and live the way you are. Be yourself with out fear of creeping women out. I guarantee just by being alive you’ve probably creeped some girl out. Doesn’t change who you are. Yeah, you're right. I guess hearing some women say that gave me a reason to use that as an excuse to not approach, which is silly on my part. Really, if I approach a woman to say hi, and she thinks I'm creepy for doing that, then there's not much else I can do in the situation. Your book situation is something I faced some wks ago....but I chickened out. She was right next to me, too. Had no idea what book she was reading, either. Is it a good idea to comment on the book even if you have no idea about it?
amethyste Posted July 2, 2011 Posted July 2, 2011 Your book situation is something I faced some wks ago....but I chickened out. She was right next to me, too. Had no idea what book she was reading, either. Is it a good idea to comment on the book even if you have no idea about it? In this case you could tell her that you wanna read that book too, and eventually ask her what she thinks about it. This post was an interesting read. As for the age difference, I think it depends a lot from one person to another. I'm 21, and my last ex is 33, and I haven't seen anything wrong with this. On the other side, if I'd be around 15 yr old, I wouldn't date someone 10+ yr bigger. Of course, this is just a personal opinion.
Author Dust Posted July 2, 2011 Author Posted July 2, 2011 In the state that I live in age of consent is 18, and there are still several very traditional laws regulating sex still on the books. So much for Virginia being "for lovers". But I went back and forth about it, in the end it would have been a big mess. Her older sister didn't like me talking with the girl, and she was a junior in high school at the time. It would have been a lot of midnight curfews and other things. I was (and still am) looking for someone who could hang out until late or go on weekend road trips. And that just wasn't going to happen with her. I get what you're saying here. But really, I think Dust is talking about passive guys who really have trouble getting dates and relationships. If you tell an already passive guy not to be too aggressive he's really never going to get anywhere, he'll just be even more passive than he was to begin with. It's sort of like telling a comatose patient not to be so hyperactive. The guys you're worried about being "too aggressive" aren't the guys Dust is talking about, and they're not guys like me who just aren't getting the whole dating and attraction thing. I mean, if your goal is to get me to be single for the rest of my life then I guess I can take your advice, but I think I can stand to be a little more aggressive. With the 17 year old girl you should revisit that since you are single. If she lives with in a good distance of you it could work now. If you still like her and she must be over 18 now just go for it. As for rapist, stalkers, and violent men they exist. I can’t suddenly become a rapist or a stalker just by trying to date a girl. It really confuses the issue to even bring that into play from my perspective. So even though a girl may be worried the guy could turn dangerous the guy himself already knows whether he is dangerous or not. I mean I guess a dangerous person might not realize they are dangerous but that is besides the point. If the person isn’t crazy they at least know they’ve never done anything like that and don’t plan on doing anything like that in reality. The point that acquaintance rape happens means girls should take precautions even with men they are attracted to or just trust. Obviously every woman sooner or later will be in a position to get raped. Just agreeing to spend some alone time in a car with a guy you like or a guy friend can get you raped, killed or what ever. People have to live their lives though. I believe I once read that men are many times more likely to be a victim of violence. Yet it would be unhealthy to constantly be scared. So obviously girls shouldn’t hang out with guys they aren’t into. It’s a waste of time for both people involved. I’m just saying if you want to get rid of a guy don’t label him as a creep and be scared, just go right out and tell him to go away politely “I don’t want to see or talk with you any more.” Then ignore them. You could also just ignore them but then expect a few calls or last attempts. Also there might be a few calls or last attempts even if you out right reject a guy. The thing is guys get an advantage in every way by being aggressive with in societal/legal norms. Worrying about women calling you a creep is not a societal norm. It is obvious that any romantic gesture, anything that can be looked at as smooth can be looked at by a group of women as creepy. If the guy had worried about it being creepy he never would have got his great gf. So, I say to the women stop being so annoyed. Yes stay safe. Different things though. To the men I say be yourself, and talk to the girls you like, the girls you encounter in ever day, and try to engage them as yourself with out constantly trying to hide or be lame in fear of being creepy. Better to ask a girl out a few times get a yes, then try to kiss her then to sit in your room mad at the world and happy that no one thinks you’re a creep. The term "creep", used in social references, is almost always unique to the accuser, and not to the target. For the term is used disproportionately by "Springer-esque" accusers as measured against non-"Springer-esque" types. So, if your dad was a creep, and his actions impacted your life somehow, then you are extremely likely to throw the "creep" label around at just about anybody, and particularly at the straight-laced, decent guys who ARE the abnormal ones by the environmental standards in which you live and thrive. Such Springer-esque types continue to invite other Springer-esque types into their circles. They continue to be turned-on by these same Springer-esque types, aaaaaaaaaaaand they continue to be further harmed by the same Springer-esque types. Just because one cannot recognize a "creep", given all of the true creeps he/she has been around all of his/her life, does not mean that the random person whose path intersects his/her path one day, and who is "not his/her type", is the "creep". So to those who think they encounter an inordinate number of "creeps", next time you're seated at a table with many of your close friends... (to paraphrase a poker reference) "If you can't find the creep, it's you..." This post was entertaining. I think you were joking with that last line. I really don’t know what a creep is. Really all it means is something that creeps up on you like creepy crawlers are bugs. Really it all comes down to rejection. I’m talking about when girls reject a guy and then label him a creep because he doesn’t just disappear because they made the decision in their head. The guy usually isn’t formally rejected. If he rides the train with the girl and looks at her and smiles and she just doesn’t like it he may already be a creep. If they had a date and now she won’t return his calls he may be a creep. They expect us to just agree with them immediately. I think a man is best served by going with his gut. If he feels there is still a chance with in reason and societal norms he should keep trying. If the girl has told you she is going to call the police or you are scaring her then yes stop immediately. If she just says “I’m busy” over and over again go ahead and try till you the person asking gets bored or insulted. That’s what I’m talking about. I do believe there are problem guys out there but what is often described as a problem guy doesn’t seem like one to me. Yeah, you're right. I guess hearing some women say that gave me a reason to use that as an excuse to not approach, which is silly on my part. Really, if I approach a woman to say hi, and she thinks I'm creepy for doing that, then there's not much else I can do in the situation. Your book situation is something I faced some wks ago....but I chickened out. She was right next to me, too. Had no idea what book she was reading, either. Is it a good idea to comment on the book even if you have no idea about it? When you chickened out I bet one of the things you said to yourself was “I don’t want to bother her.” You used your fear of rejection to come up with any excuse. She was right by you so it’s not like you even had to travel far. You could have just said “excuse me” until you get her attention, or “miss” if that didn’t work. Then you could have said something like “I’m curious what is that book you’re reading” she might have said something like “It’s the Hunger Games” then you might have said “Oh I’ve heard about those books, but what are they about” if you were smiling and she was smiling and maybe you make joke, wow you’re flirting. Then you just ask her out “I really like girls who read, we should talk some more, lets have dinner tonight” she smiles, seems on the fence. You say “I’ll take you to this great place I know _________” she says “I love that place yes heres my number.” You just have to do something. If you had gone over and burped in her face then said “Your reading a book!” when she looked up in disgust. Then followed that with “Please go out with ME!” She might have said yes. It would be a better chance then you had now. Even if she said “No” the correct response would be to pat yourself on the back for trying. If a bunch of your friends and gf’s found out about how you did that you’d actually look bad a$$ for at least trying. So don’t worry about being smooth just try your best and say what comes to mind. Anything is better then nothing. Not only that but you might run into that same girl again and she probably thought about the entire even more then you did. She might be awkward around you but she may actually want you to try again especially if she sits or puts her self around you. You could say “Hi” to her again to test the waters. If she was friendly in what seemed like it might be a genuine way you might try again. If you felt like she was giving the get away from me vibe and it was unmistakable you might not. Even if you did try again oh well. The fear you are some how going to creep women out and be shunned by society is just false. In fact by trying to not be creepy you often turn yourself creepy. Like a guy who asks women out all the time and is known for dating might get more leeway. Like you might see one of your female friends going out with a guy named Quagmire for example who she had called a degenerate creep. “why are you going out with that guy you said he was a creep?” she might answer “oh that’s just Quagmire hes going an out going personality and is very friendly, that’s why he dated all those women, he really is a nice guy though once you get to know him.” Happens every time a girl complains about the type of guy and then dates that exact type of aggressive guy. Then the guy who is so afraid of scaring women ends up being the guy who scares women the quiet introvert who know one really knows or wants to date. So by living your life in fear of being a creep you actually make it more likely to be labeled that very thing or at least not get women and in essence have the result you are scared of. Best to be yourself and talk to and ask out that girl you wanted to get to know and not use creep or seeming annoying or what ever as an excuse to avoid fear of rejection. In this case you could tell her that you wanna read that book too, and eventually ask her what she thinks about it. This post was an interesting read. As for the age difference, I think it depends a lot from one person to another. I'm 21, and my last ex is 33, and I haven't seen anything wrong with this. On the other side, if I'd be around 15 yr old, I wouldn't date someone 10+ yr bigger. Of course, this is just a personal opinion. I wonder what the book was. My guess either Hunger Games or one of the many Sister hood of the traveling pants books. Either way it would have given him opportunity to flirt and talk. Great conversation starter. In essence just having a simple conversation and showing he is normal would help humanize him. Give him that shot at asking her out. Men are often creep until proven innocent. Showing he could have a conversation would have done that and he could have asked her out. I agree it does depend on the person with age different relationships. A man the same age as a woman can take advantage of her. Obviously and older man can take advantage to but women are usually on guard or that type of thing.
amethyste Posted July 2, 2011 Posted July 2, 2011 This post reminded me about something that happened to me a couple of years ago. I took a subway ride; initially there was nobody, then a man came in. He looked around for one minute or so (he seemed to be very nervous), and then he decided to sit down next to me. This was a bit creepy. Then I felt his hand trying to touch my butt. I was absolutely sure that he was trying to steal my wallet... I threw him some looks that could kill, and turned around. Next thing you know... he unzipped his pants, came on my leg and then closed his eyes. Errrmm... creepy. And because we were talking about approaching someone, I really liked how a guy approached me a couple of weeks ago. He ran after me, asked for my phone number & called me later. I was taking a nap so I didn't answer. Then he sent me a message that sounded something like: "Hey, sorry if I bothered you. Can I have your (IM) id? I'd like to go out with you once. If you're not interested, you don't have to answer. Thx, bye." He had the courage to approach me & tell me what he wants, he gave it a try, he didn't beg & he didn't bother me.
Cracker Jack Posted July 2, 2011 Posted July 2, 2011 When you chickened out I bet one of the things you said to yourself was “I don’t want to bother her.” You used your fear of rejection to come up with any excuse. She was right by you so it’s not like you even had to travel far. You could have just said “excuse me” until you get her attention, or “miss” if that didn’t work. Then you could have said something like “I’m curious what is that book you’re reading” she might have said something like “It’s the Hunger Games” then you might have said “Oh I’ve heard about those books, but what are they about” if you were smiling and she was smiling and maybe you make joke, wow you’re flirting. Then you just ask her out “I really like girls who read, we should talk some more, lets have dinner tonight” she smiles, seems on the fence. You say “I’ll take you to this great place I know _________” she says “I love that place yes heres my number.” You're correct. That's exactly what I thought to myself, and even then, I realized how lame it was. I don't know why I just sat next to her for 20 mins and said nothing. She really did look like she was into her book, so I didn't want to break her focus--but that's just an excuse on my part. I'm just not bold enough. You just have to do something. If you had gone over and burped in her face then said “Your reading a book!” when she looked up in disgust. Then followed that with “Please go out with ME!” She might have said yes. It would be a better chance then you had now. Even if she said “No” the correct response would be to pat yourself on the back for trying. If a bunch of your friends and gf’s found out about how you did that you’d actually look bad a$$ for at least trying. So don’t worry about being smooth just try your best and say what comes to mind. Anything is better then nothing. Not only that but you might run into that same girl again and she probably thought about the entire even more then you did. She might be awkward around you but she may actually want you to try again especially if she sits or puts her self around you. You could say “Hi” to her again to test the waters. If she was friendly in what seemed like it might be a genuine way you might try again. If you felt like she was giving the get away from me vibe and it was unmistakable you might not. Even if you did try again oh well. Yeah, doing something is much better than doing nothing, I agree. To be honest, I just want to get rejected so I can finally be over the fear of it. Some may believe being rejected will make the fear worse--but many others have said it's not even that bad. I have gotten better with talking to people in general, but when it comes to a woman I find attractive, I simply get lost in my thoughts. The fear you are some how going to creep women out and be shunned by society is just false. In fact by trying to not be creepy you often turn yourself creepy. Like a guy who asks women out all the time and is known for dating might get more leeway. Like you might see one of your female friends going out with a guy named Quagmire for example who she had called a degenerate creep. “why are you going out with that guy you said he was a creep?” she might answer “oh that’s just Quagmire hes going an out going personality and is very friendly, that’s why he dated all those women, he really is a nice guy though once you get to know him.” Happens every time a girl complains about the type of guy and then dates that exact type of aggressive guy. Then the guy who is so afraid of scaring women ends up being the guy who scares women the quiet introvert who know one really knows or wants to date. So by living your life in fear of being a creep you actually make it more likely to be labeled that very thing or at least not get women and in essence have the result you are scared of. Best to be yourself and talk to and ask out that girl you wanted to get to know and not use creep or seeming annoying or what ever as an excuse to avoid fear of rejection. Also true. I guess it's just a matter of me not being confident enough to be myself around these women, simply because I feel like I have no reason to be confident. While the fear of rejection is still up there, I feel the thought is not as dreaded as it used to be. I'm more worried about making myself look stupid, if anything. There have been so many times where I would share long eye contact with a woman, only to have them sit next to me...and then, utter silence proceeds. I knew that it was the perfect opportunity to say something, yet I simply had no idea what to say. It's like when I told you about the woman from a month ago; I simply ran out of things to talk about. That's also a lame excuse, but I wish I knew how to act in those situations. Trust me, I know as much as you do, that being worried about everything I do or say is not going to help me get ahead in life. I'm trying to work hard on this. I just have to actually start understanding that it's okay to make mistakes. Basically, I miss 100% of the shots that I don't take, and, more times than not, reject myself because I wasn't ballsy enough to make a move. I think I just need to put myself out there more. I'm not good with crowds, and never been to a nightclub/bar before, but those seem like good places to deal with situations like these.
Mrlonelyone Posted July 2, 2011 Posted July 2, 2011 I agree 100% with this OP. Women will call any guy they don't like who approaches them a creep or looser. Men just can't let that first rejection stop them. Just ask former Rep. Anthony Weiner his wife rejected him at first now he must have put it on her really good. She ain't leaving him.
dispatch3d Posted July 2, 2011 Posted July 2, 2011 labelling guys as creeps and girls as princesses who aren't interested is stooopppid. Are you an 11 year old girl? ;-). Seriously, I'll mirror the "who cares" sentiment. Don't get wrapped up in thinking like this.
Author Dust Posted July 3, 2011 Author Posted July 3, 2011 This post reminded me about something that happened to me a couple of years ago. I took a subway ride; initially there was nobody, then a man came in. He looked around for one minute or so (he seemed to be very nervous), and then he decided to sit down next to me. This was a bit creepy. Then I felt his hand trying to touch my butt. I was absolutely sure that he was trying to steal my wallet... I threw him some looks that could kill, and turned around. Next thing you know... he unzipped his pants, came on my leg and then closed his eyes. Errrmm... creepy. Most girls who call something creepy or stalkerish are talking about a guy they were ignoring calling or trying to talk to them. What you described goes beyond that. The man in your story committed a battery on you. I hope he gets arrested and charged and convicted for what he did to you. One bad/crazy man like this can obviously terrorize many women in his life. It only takes one bad man to truly scare hundreds if not more women. That’s why I tell men who are afraid to just politely approach and flirt with a girl, then ask her out not to worry. If you creep her out so what, there are real creeps/psycho’s in the world and you know you’re not one of them. You can’t help scaring women they scare easy. You still have everything to gain and nothing to lose by just being yourself. Being a man! And because we were talking about approaching someone' date=' I really liked how a guy approached me a couple of weeks ago. He ran after me, asked for my phone number & called me later. I was taking a nap so I didn't answer. Then he sent me a message that sounded something like: "Hey, sorry if I bothered you. Can I have your (IM) id? I'd like to go out with you once. If you're not interested, you don't have to answer. Thx, bye." He had the courage to approach me & tell me what he wants, he gave it a try, he didn't beg & he didn't bother me.[/quote'] Doing anything is better then nothing. It takes balls to just approach some one, so if you ever had a chance with that girl it will only increase those chances. Guys need to get out of that mentality that I only want to approach a girl if I know or think she will probably like me. You really don’t have the information to make that guess. Be as ballsy in real life as you are on an internet dating site. Because in real life you have a much better chance. Internet dating is the real waist of time and effort. Like I said doing something is infinitely better then doing nothing. I could see myself making the same mistakes the guy who approached you did. You seemed to like the way he went about it though. Firstly, I think asking a girl out in person is best. Who was he kidding just asking for your number. People put to much emphasis on the number. He could have come over and asked you out. Then he would have just got the number as part of that. “Lets get dinner tonight” “Ok” then the girl gives him her number or he says “great let me get your number and I’ll call you tonight and get directions to pick you up.” So, I’m not a fan of wasting that in person opportunity to ask a girl out, don’t just ask for her number ask her out in person. Now his really big mistake was saying something like “sorry I bothered you” that is just really negative. Then he goes on to sort of ask you out in a msg along with wanting your IM info so he can communicate with you in the most stress free way for him. It’s just a bad idea to be so timid. Don’t apologize for possibly bothering them. Just assume that things are going well until the girl literally tells you to go away or she ignores you to the point you don’t care anymore. Ask the girl out in person if possible or at least over the phone. A phone msg shouldn’t say anything more then “Hey its ________ I’ll try calling you back later” I said “I’ll try calling you back later” because it leave the option for the girl to call you back but doesn’t put that pressure on her and leave is on the guy to try calling back later. At that point I would call back maybe and hour or what ever later leaving enough time to do what I wanted and if I didn’t here back I’d wait at least a day before trying back. Obviously if the girl never returned calls, or even if she did and we never got the relationship going I would eventually get bored. You're correct. That's exactly what I thought to myself, and even then, I realized how lame it was. I don't know why I just sat next to her for 20 mins and said nothing. She really did look like she was into her book, so I didn't want to break her focus--but that's just an excuse on my part. I'm just not bold enough. Yeah, doing something is much better than doing nothing, I agree. To be honest, I just want to get rejected so I can finally be over the fear of it. Some may believe being rejected will make the fear worse--but many others have said it's not even that bad. I have gotten better with talking to people in general, but when it comes to a woman I find attractive, I simply get lost in my thoughts. Also true. I guess it's just a matter of me not being confident enough to be myself around these women, simply because I feel like I have no reason to be confident. While the fear of rejection is still up there, I feel the thought is not as dreaded as it used to be. I'm more worried about making myself look stupid, if anything. There have been so many times where I would share long eye contact with a woman, only to have them sit next to me...and then, utter silence proceeds. I knew that it was the perfect opportunity to say something, yet I simply had no idea what to say. It's like when I told you about the woman from a month ago; I simply ran out of things to talk about. That's also a lame excuse, but I wish I knew how to act in those situations. Trust me, I know as much as you do, that being worried about everything I do or say is not going to help me get ahead in life. I'm trying to work hard on this. I just have to actually start understanding that it's okay to make mistakes. Basically, I miss 100% of the shots that I don't take, and, more times than not, reject myself because I wasn't ballsy enough to make a move. I think I just need to put myself out there more. I'm not good with crowds, and never been to a nightclub/bar before, but those seem like good places to deal with situations like these. If you go to a bar or night club make sure you go with a friend. Also have a ride and get a little buzzed on alcohol. When you’re buzzed women should seem a lot less scary. The thing is bars/nightclubs are horrible places to meet women. I actually think concerts are a much better place. I mean a concert is a great place to take a date, and its also a good place to meet women. Pick a band or singer you really like and go enjoy yourself. Have drink get buzzed and feel free to talk to the people around you. It’s really the best if it’s a concert where you are standing by the stage instead of just sitting. But even if you are sitting there will be good opportunities to walk around and look at the t-shirts and such. So yeah concerts have most of the advantages as bars and night clubs with out a lot of the other crap. The fact is though the best place to meet women is just during day. You meet a girl in line at the bank, or at the mall, or while shes doing her job as a librarian she’ll be a lot more friendly with you. You can walk right up to that girl and she’ll talk to you. She might even agree to date you. If you meet that same exact girl all dolled up and out with her friends she might not even give you the time of day. You literally might go over to a girl in a night club and say “hi” and she will give you a frown and not say a word. That same girl during the day at the park, bus stop or what ever probably would have talked to you at least. Even if you do ask her out and get her number at the bar/club now she is more likely to just ignore and forget about you because she was drinking so she might not have the clearest memory of you, and even if she wasn’t she might assume you were drinking or just guy in the bar looking to get some and that will taint her opinion of you and might cause her not to want to pursue things farther when if you had asked her out and got her number during the ay things would have been different. So, what I’m saying is for myself every once in a while I find bars/night clubs/ late night hang outs fun. Its fun to go out with your friends and see all the girls looking good in their skimpy outfits. If your single it’s a good time trying to talk to girls and saying silly crap to them. Its fun watching your friends do good or completely bomb. It’s fun trying to go in with your friends and try to talk to a group of girls. Fun just people watching with your friends or by yourself. More fun of course when you’re out with friends but I’ve gone out alone just had a good time trying to dance with girls. I have gotten dates out of girls I met while having a night out on the town. For the most part though it isn’t something I would want to rely on because girls are a lot more aggressive when it comes to being approached and asked out in that kind of environment then compared with others. Also like I said even if they do give you a yes and you get their number its less likely to actualy happen because they were possibly a little drunk and or they just have a tainted view of you because of meeting you in that environment and change their mind. They always might change their mind but more likely in that environment. So yes go out and have fun dancing and hitting on girls. Just don’t stress yourself out about it and don’t rely on night clubs. What you do need to rely on is actually doing something for once in your life. Night clubs would be better then nothing. Really though your problem is ignoring all those opportunities you’ve already been giving. Like the cute girl who sat by you, or the girl you liked who smiled at you. Really you should cross the room or the street just for the chance to talk with a girl who makes you feel good when you see her. Please come on here and update us that you actually tried something. That you actually went up to a girl said something and then asked her out. Good luck. I agree 100% with this OP. Women will call any guy they don't like who approaches them a creep or looser. Men just can't let that first rejection stop them. Just ask former Rep. Anthony Weiner his wife rejected him at first now he must have put it on her really good. She ain't leaving him. People say one thing and the reality is often another. You always need to try to look at the reality of what people do as opposed to what they are saying. With all womens griping about men being a certain way its always that exact kind of man who seems to do well. My advice of course isn’t be a creep, it’s to be yourself and not let irrational fears of being judged stop you. People always respect some one genuine then some one scared and controlled by others. That’s why people are more likely to find you a creep if you’re just shy and hiding. You can’t win is what I’m saying so just be yourself and go for the women you want and be persistent if you want something. Of course within legal and civil/respectful standards. Scaring a woman because you said “hi” then tried to flirt with her in the check out line will not land you in jail. It won’t even ruin your reputation. You only can gain from trying, not lose. labelling guys as creeps and girls as princesses who aren't interested is stooopppid. Are you an 11 year old girl? ;-). Seriously, I'll mirror the "who cares" sentiment. Don't get wrapped up in thinking like this. I was a little confused, but I think you are agreeing with me. My message is basically to stop stressing out on both sides of the equation and just have fun and go for the things you want in life.
fortyninethousand322 Posted July 3, 2011 Posted July 3, 2011 As horrible as I am with women, I am fairly perceptive and good at self reflection. I can identify exactly when I started feeling like a "creep". In my senior year of high school there was this cute girl in my homeroom (she eventually switched out because of scheduling changes) who would give me "the look" like she wanted me to go over and talk to her, etc. One day (after she had switched out of my homeroom) I saw her in the hallway and chatted her up. Eventually I got her phone number and I asked her out. Her response was "I'll let you know", which I knew was a "no" and I was completely prepared to move on. But, a mutual acquaintance started giving me the fifth degree about how I had asked the girl out etc. I basically came away from the situation (because of her friend's treatment of me) feeling ashamed that I had ever really tried to ask the girl out in the first place, like I had no right to do so. Understandably I shouldn't have felt this way, but I was 17, young, stupid, and impressionable. Ever since I've had what I call the "General McClellan" approach to women: don't go for it unless you have overwhelming reason to believe she digs you and you're all but assured reciprocation of your interest. Obviously that never happens, but I thought that way nonetheless.
Cracker Jack Posted July 3, 2011 Posted July 3, 2011 Thanks for the help, Dust. I know you've been very patient with trying to help us guys see the light. Instead of absorbing so much info now, I need to actually take action and see where it gets me. Not sure if I'll be going out on the 4th, but if I do, that would likely be a good time to work on this.
udolipixie Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 lol you want girls to be understanding about creeps understanding he won't be smooth and may have weird/awkward moments and guy's persistence and even going as far even just ignoring him for a few days but you're not understanding about a woman's hostility to being approached? Guys don't understand what a position women are in being constantly bothered with unwanted sexual attention by a strange man (no it's not all flattery some times it's just a oh you have a vagina)and instead of ignoring the hostility or the non sugary sweet rejection she may give most guys turn to insults. So for me no understanding for creeps/persistence for me because of my personal safety and the annoyance/creeped out factor persistence brings just like most guys have no understanding about girls not being approachable, hostile, or giving nasty rejections because of their ego & self-esteem.
aj22one Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 lol you want girls to be understanding about creeps understanding he won't be smooth and may have weird/awkward moments and guy's persistence and even going as far even just ignoring him for a few days but you're not understanding about a woman's hostility to being approached? Guys don't understand what a position women are in being constantly bothered with unwanted sexual attention by a strange man (no it's not all flattery some times it's just a oh you have a vagina)and instead of ignoring the hostility or the non sugary sweet rejection she may give most guys turn to insults. So for me no understanding for creeps/persistence for me because of my personal safety and the annoyance/creeped out factor persistence brings just like most guys have no understanding about girls not being approachable, hostile, or giving nasty rejections because of their ego & self-esteem. I think it's pretty clear you're not quite understanding the purpose of this thread. The idea was that too many of these inexperienced guys give up way too easily. Now, if you want them to continue to give up too easily and remain single for life then that's cool. Just keep in mind most of these guys here in this thread are good people, they just have a little bit of a hard time with girls. Getting them to be better with girls is good for everyone though.
whitefire Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 (edited) When I was younger, I feared being perceived as a creep very badly. I was a hermit through most of high school. Then in my senior year, I finally got the nerve to ask out this girl I had liked for several years. I did it by sending her flowers on her birthday. The next day she confronted me and chewed me out with all her friends, calling me a creep. The incident stuck for a while, and I felt incredibly embarrassed and regretted saying anything to her. I strictly avoided doing anything like that for the longest time. But now when I look back, I admire how bold I was, and all that she said was totally meaningless. I've told others the story recently. Guys thought I had balls and girls thought it was incredibly sweet. It might have to do with the fact that now I'm more mature and confident with myself, while back then I was just a confused teenager experiencing strong attraction for the first time. I've done some things years ago that I know were perceived as creepy, but that's only because I was a nervous guy trying to man up and approach a girl. I had bad intentions whatsoever. It doesn't matter if a girl understands this or not, but I think it's easy to tell the difference between someone like me a few years back and a legitimate stalker/ Edited July 5, 2011 by whitefire
udolipixie Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 I think it's pretty clear you're not quite understanding the purpose of this thread. The idea was that too many of these inexperienced guys give up way too easily. Now, if you want them to continue to give up too easily and remain single for life then that's cool. Just keep in mind most of these guys here in this thread are good people, they just have a little bit of a hard time with girls. Getting them to be better with girls is good for everyone though. " I’d like to tell women not to be afraid of creeps. Instead to try and understand a mans motivations. " The original article was for women this thread became about advising guys to just approach whoever they want with no second thoughts like I'm bothering her by intruding on her and interrupting her life because I find my sexual attraction that important. I understand the purpose it was to tell women to give creeps the benefit of the doubt that they may not be creeps just guys who aren't smooth who say silly things and are persistent. And that when they are persistent just to ignore them until the guy gets bored. So I'm correct in my statement that the OP wants girls to be understanding about creeps understanding that he won't be smooth and may have weird/awkward moments and guy's persistence even going as far even just ignoring him for a few days. I'm correct in that the OP himself is not understanding about woman's hostility to being approached & ignoring of turn off behavior (not nice rejections). He belittles what women feel creeped out by to trivial actions. He tells them not to be annoyed by approaches. My advice is that if guys want women to be understanding about strange guys & persistent guys then men should start being more understanding about hostile girls & hurtful rejections.
udolipixie Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 When I was younger, I feared being perceived as a creep very badly. I was a hermit through most of high school. Then in my senior year, I finally got the nerve to ask out this girl I had liked for several years. I did it by sending her flowers on her birthday. The next day she confronted me and chewed me out with all her friends, calling me a creep. The incident stuck for a while, and I felt incredibly embarrassed and regretted saying anything to her. I strictly avoided doing anything like that for the longest time. But now when I look back, I admire how bold I was, and all that she said was totally meaningless. I've told others the story recently. Guys thought I had balls and girls thought it was incredibly sweet. It might have to do with the fact that now I'm more mature and confident with myself, while back then I was just a confused teenager experiencing strong attraction for the first time. I've done some things years ago that I know were perceived as creepy, but that's only because I was a nervous guy trying to man up and approach a girl. I had bad intentions whatsoever. It doesn't matter if a girl understands this or not, but I think it's easy to tell the difference between someone like me a few years back and a legitimate stalker/ Legitimate stalker or not either way she thought it was creepy aka inappropriate behavior that unsettled her. Bad intentions or not doesn't mean much when it's about inappropriate behavior that unsettles you. It only correlates to if that behavior will continue and/or escalate. Odd you find it the words of a girl you you creeped out meaningless. Whitefire, what you describe is a typical teenage girl reaction to a man she finds unattractive. Many 20 and 30 somethings also have this reaction. I'm glad you put it behind you, because it is not your fault! You were a gentleman to this girl, and she was a bitch. It's better that you didn't get involved with her, because she showed her true colors early on. This is why women continue to be hostile because guys dismiss what women find creepy as oh she only thought it was creepy because I was unattractive or like whitefire even if I know it can be creepy I didn't have bad intentions. It was his fault he creeped her out she acted accordingly. What's not his fault is how it affected him- being embarrassed & full of regret. He may be a gentleman character wise but his actions were a hermit who she most likely didn't know sending her flowers. Key word is sending her in fact it wasn't until the next day she was able to confront him. It might have be ungentlemanly to her to receive flowers at her home or in class by some guy she didn't know who apparently knew her well enough to know her birthday and address (?) She wasn't a b*tch just a girl reacting to a guy whose inappropriate behavior unsettled her.
udolipixie Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 I don't see how someone finding someone attractive or interesting enough to give them a gift on their birthday would make them "creepy." If so, I've had a lot of creepy friends, since I get presents every year! Let me bring up a real life example: There was once a gay guy who was best friends with one of my best friends. Keep in mind that I'm as straight as an arrow, don't find other guys attractive at all. One day, this guy took me aside and asked me if I was gay. I said no, he said he thought I was cute and had a nice butt. I actually was flattered, even though he has the wrong "equipment" - I am a huge supporter of gay rights, and didn't find it offensive at all. Now, take a guy saying the same thing to a girl. Most likely, she would say he was creepy...if she found him unattractive. I found the gay guy unattractive, since he's of my own gender. But I didn't call him creepy, remember? It's little things like that that create gender wars. Were you her friend? Why did you send instead of give the flowers? Where did you send the flowers? In that real life situation most girls would be flattered or call him crude or a pig for the butt comment. Funny how guys try to deflect the creep factor by trivializing it or claiming it's only done if she finds you unattractive. Creep = person who unsettles you through behavior or inappropriate actions
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