At a crossroads after my wife's affair...

[Mr.Harris]

The vast majority of the posters here are saying “dump the lady.” Ask yourself about the totality of your marriage: was it good, do you love your wife and does she love you. If you can forgive her, look at this as a three month speed-bump in a twelve year plus good marriage. You can forgive, you won’t forget, but you can move on.

 

The "vast majority" are saying dump the lady for many strong reasons. This is not just some other petty marital problem. This is really serious.

 

Your wife says that she did it “for the thrill of it.” If she had been married eleven plus years prior to the affair, then she has been having sex with the same man for that time and she may simply have wanted some variety. Give the lady some slack, some people can handle a sex diet of one partner year after year and some people have a difficult time with this. The sex drive can be a powerful motivating force and can drown out the voice of reason. From your description I would say that your wife has learned that her solution was not a good one.

 

There is no excuse for her behavior, and her decision to cheat was never a solution to whatever problems they were having. She took a vow to love this man and only him, and she intentionally broke it and liked doing it. You don't cheat, destroy your marriage and put someone's life at risk for STDs then talk about cutting some slack.

 

Other posters here are saying that if you do not divorce her you have no respect for yourself, and she will assume that you will continue to accept adultery in the future.

 

No one said that so you're putting words where they don't fit.

 

There is a middle ground between zero tolerance and being a door mat, and that is where true self-respect falls. If she has sincerely re-committed to monogamy you should forgive her and work on rebuilding the marriage; if she repeats the affair in the future then you can say the marriage is over and divorce her.

 

It doesn't matter how hard she works. That won't lessen his pain. Only he's the one that has to truly live with this knowledge that his wife has been unfaithful, on his own.

 

Sure he could stay but he'll always be disgusted at what his wife did. Years down the line her back is turned and he'll involuntarily look at her with a twisted look on his face, and with good reason.

 

Or he could cut out the main source of his pain, continue to see his daughter until she goes to college, and find a woman who won't be jumping beds with Mr.Rogers in the neighborhood.

 

Everyone makes mistakes and she has made a big one, but it is not an unforgiveable sin.

 

It was never a mistake. She knew what she was doing and that's why she lied to him for well more than just 3 months.

 

Regarding your daughter and what will your decision teach her regarding self-respect, you should talk to her now or perhaps when she is ready to begin dating about self-respect and tolerating abusive behavior. Point out that people make mistakes and they can learn from them if you let them know that such action will not be tolerated in the future.

 

Point out that a lot of people make mistakes, but cheating is a calculated decision, along with other things.

 

If they continue with the error then “kick them to the curb.” Finally, regarding the issue of whether the first mistake is so great that the relationship should be ended without a second chance, there is a difference of what a girl should forgive when she is dating and what a spouse should forgive after a good twelve year marriage. Good luck to you and your family.

 

There is no difference of what a girl should forgive whether the ring is on her finger or not, because the commitment should be the same. It doesn't change when you decide to get married.

[Entropy3000]

The vast majority of the posters here are saying “dump the lady.” Ask yourself about the totality of your marriage: was it good, do you love your wife and does she love you. If you can forgive her, look at this as a three month speed-bump in a twelve year plus good marriage. You can forgive, you won’t forget, but you can move on.

 

Your wife says that she did it “for the thrill of it.” If she had been married eleven plus years prior to the affair, then she has been having sex with the same man for that time and she may simply have wanted some variety. Give the lady some slack, some people can handle a sex diet of one partner year after year and some people have a difficult time with this. The sex drive can be a powerful motivating force and can drown out the voice of reason. From your description I would say that your wife has learned that her solution was not a good one.

 

Other posters here are saying that if you do not divorce her you have no respect for yourself, and she will assume that you will continue to accept adultery in the future. There is a middle ground between zero tolerance and being a door mat, and that is where true self-respect falls. If she has sincerely re-committed to monogamy you should forgive her and work on rebuilding the marriage; if she repeats the affair in the future then you can say the marriage is over and divorce her. Everyone makes mistakes and she has made a big one, but it is not an unforgiveable sin.

 

Regarding your daughter and what will your decision teach her regarding self-respect, you should talk to her now or perhaps when she is ready to begin dating about self-respect and tolerating abusive behavior. Point out that people make mistakes and they can learn from them if you let them know that such action will not be tolerated in the future. If they continue with the error then “kick them to the curb.” Finally, regarding the issue of whether the first mistake is so great that the relationship should be ended without a second chance, there is a difference of what a girl should forgive when she is dating and what a spouse should forgive after a good twelve year marriage. Good luck to you and your family.

 

So he should dump her because she can't handle being monogamous year after year. Good point in favor of dumping.

[Where To]

"You didn't do anything wrong, but I cheated anyways. There was nothing you could do to prevent it".

This has been what I have thought about for quite some time. For some, it would be somewhat of a relief to know that you had minimal responsibility for your partner's actions. For me, it has been very difficult to find any form of closure from what she has said. I essentially have to go "Oh, okay then, I see."

 

It was never a mistake.

Straight from her mouth. She has never attempted to minimise the severity of her actions and accepts full responsibility. It is both a good thing and a bad thing for me.

 

Considering that her ill mother is currently living with us, it seems unlikely but not impossible that sex occured in our home. We live in a fairly small town. I don't doubt that one of the gossipy neighbours would have noticed this man entering our home, and I haven't heard any gossip of that sort.

 

I have learnt quite a lot about the nuances of forgiveness this past year. But I don't know what meaning it has to me just now. The only thing about forgiveness that feels appealing at the moment is the "let go of hate and move on part". The rest of it seems like rubbish.

 

I suppose that one of the causes of my disappointment in her is that she has placed so much weight on my shoulders. She wants to work on the marriage and support my recovery, but what do I want? She is basically forcing me to make a decision on how I am going to dictate my entire future. I'm standing on the d*mned crossroads because of her actions and it isn't fun. The fact is, in the history of our relationship, I've never placed this amount of pressure on her.

 

I've been thinking about a revenge affair. But I have been hesitant for a few reasons. I would only gain an ego boost and some small form of satisfaction. Nothing in the long-term. And there is a very large possibility that it would end any form of reconciliation that is left. I actually spoke to my wife about this and she said that if that's what it would take, then she would be okay with it. So now she is placing even more pressure on me. Christ.

 

The truth is, had she at least said something, I would have at least made some attempt to be more accommodating towards her actions. The fact that this has basically come out of nowhere kills me.

 

One of the only things even keeping me here is this...

 

I don't think that one act instantly means that she is not who you think she is or who you thought she was. Think of all of the other moments in your life together. It would be impossible to fake all of that and be someone else-for twenty five years.

There is a lot of good memories there, but they are just that, memories. I don't think that I could handle living in the past, and I'm seeing less and less reasons why she should be in my future.

[John Michael Kane]

This has been what I have thought about for quite some time. For some, it would be somewhat of a relief to know that you had minimal responsibility for your partner's actions. For me, it has been very difficult to find any form of closure from what she has said. I essentially have to go "Oh, okay then, I see."

 

Straight from her mouth. She has never attempted to minimise the severity of her actions and accepts full responsibility. It is both a good thing and a bad thing for me.

 

Considering that her ill mother is currently living with us, it seems unlikely but not impossible that sex occured in our home. We live in a fairly small town. I don't doubt that one of the gossipy neighbours would have noticed this man entering our home, and I haven't heard any gossip of that sort.

 

I have learnt quite a lot about the nuances of forgiveness this past year. But I don't know what meaning it has to me just now. The only thing about forgiveness that feels appealing at the moment is the "let go of hate and move on part". The rest of it seems like rubbish.

 

I suppose that one of the causes of my disappointment in her is that she has placed so much weight on my shoulders. She wants to work on the marriage and support my recovery, but what do I want? She is basically forcing me to make a decision on how I am going to dictate my entire future. I'm standing on the d*mned crossroads because of her actions and it isn't fun. The fact is, in the history of our relationship, I've never placed this amount of pressure on her.

 

I've been thinking about a revenge affair. But I have been hesitant for a few reasons. I would only gain an ego boost and some small form of satisfaction. Nothing in the long-term. And there is a very large possibility that it would end any form of reconciliation that is left. I actually spoke to my wife about this and she said that if that's what it would take, then she would be okay with it. So now she is placing even more pressure on me. Christ.

 

The truth is, had she at least said something, I would have at least made some attempt to be more accommodating towards her actions. The fact that this has basically come out of nowhere kills me.

 

One of the only things even keeping me here is this...

 

There is a lot of good memories there, but they are just that, memories. I don't think that I could handle living in the past, and I'm seeing less and less reasons why she should be in my future.

 

We all know how you feel. It's like you're wondering what's left to convince you to stay, that everything is destroyed and you might as well start over with someone else. The innocence will be lost forever. It will never come back, and while it will never come back, you'll go forward with a new perspective on relationships.

 

And you are correct about having a "revenge" affair. It will only make matters worse and it won't achieve anything. Stick to your guns and keep your head up high. You received a lot of good advice from a few folks here. I would suggest speaking to your lawyer about your rights. No need to keep staying in an energy draining relationship full of sadness and disappointment. You put in a lot of effort by even staying after finding out such traumatic news.

[rafallus]

I don't think that one act instantly means that she is not who you think she is or who you thought she was.

 

Three months long act? You're really pushing suspension of disbelief to call it "one act". It was a quite repeatable decision

 

There is a lot of good memories there, but they are just that, memories. I don't think that I could handle living in the past, and I'm seeing less and less reasons why she should be in my future.

 

Anyway, looks like you're heading into conclusion of dumping her on your own. On your own accord, man.

 

Yes, it turned out she clearly has a wild side. What makes me wonder is whether it showed inside of your relationships or was she just suppressed (possibly on her own) to be goody-two-shoes when it was clearly not what she wanted?

[Bryanp]

Please do not even consider a revenge affair. It is counter productive. "it was never a mistake" comment would have to be a deal breaker for most men. I think this is very painful to hear. What did your wife think would happen when she engaged in this affair? Why did she gave herself permission to hurt you in such a terrible way? Her actions indicate that she now has a broken moral compass. Something just does not add up here. Good luck.

[Entropy3000]

No point in a revenge affair. Move on with your life in a positive way. Divorce her and find someone else.

[Where To]

No, I wouldn't feel comfortable with a revenge affair anyway. I wouldn't gain anything by it, just make things worse for everyone involved. It's something that just entered my mind.

 

Yes, it turned out she clearly has a wild side. What makes me wonder is whether it showed inside of your relationships or was she just suppressed (possibly on her own) to be goody-two-shoes when it was clearly not what she wanted?

Well, I've known my wife since Primary School. Even before we started dating, we were very close. If she did have a hidden wild side for so long, she must be one of the greatest actors of all time. That just isn't who she is. Supposedly.

 

Considering that she has valued honesty, loyalty, and open behaviour all of her life, I absolutely believe that there is more going on than what she is willing to say. The problem is, I've looked at every single source of information I can find and found nothing else to suggest this. I'm not as paranoid as I was last year, but it is still something that hangs over my head.

 

I suppose she has just changed a lot over the years and hidden it, or I've failed to notice the changes. Having said that, even now, after the affair, she still seems like the person I've known for decades.

 

Something doesn't add up. But I can't find closure when there is nothing to be found.

[Untouchable_Fire]

No, I wouldn't feel comfortable with a revenge affair anyway. I wouldn't gain anything by it, just make things worse for everyone involved. It's something that just entered my mind.

Well, I've known my wife since Primary School. Even before we started dating, we were very close. If she did have a hidden wild side for so long, she must be one of the greatest actors of all time. That just isn't who she is. Supposedly.

Considering that she has valued honesty, loyalty, and open behaviour all of her life, I absolutely believe that there is more going on than what she is willing to say. The problem is, I've looked at every single source of information I can find and found nothing else to suggest this. I'm not as paranoid as I was last year, but it is still something that hangs over my head.

I suppose she has just changed a lot over the years and hidden it, or I've failed to notice the changes. Having said that, even now, after the affair, she still seems like the person I've known for decades.

Something doesn't add up. But I can't find closure when there is nothing to be found.

 

I recommend you read this thread. His situation seems similar to yours and he goes through all the stages in this... it may help you connect and understand.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t40398/?highlight=dazedandconfused

 

The only trait most cheaters truly share is a very deep selfishness.

[drifter777]

I suppose she has just changed a lot over the years and hidden it, or I've failed to notice the changes. Having said that, even now, after the affair, she still seems like the person I've known for decades.

 

Something doesn't add up. But I can't find closure when there is nothing to be found.

 

You suspect your wife is withholding information from you, why would she do that?

 

You said you were "oblivious" to her cheating when she confessed - do you think you are more diligent now and would know if she is still fooling around on you? Would it matter if this was the 3rd or 4th different man she has been with since you married? My point is that your intuition is telling you she is lying and/or withholding more dirt from you and you are probably correct. You don't believe that there is "nothing to be found", and you shouldn't. Trust your intuition and press her for the truth.

[Where To]

I recommend you read this thread. His situation seems similar to yours and he goes through all the stages in this... it may help you connect and understand.

I'll have a read. Thanks.

 

The only trait most cheaters truly share is a very deep selfishness.

It was a selfish act on her end. She said so. I agreed.

 

Trust your intuition and press her for the truth.

I've been searching every source I can think of for over a year. Either she is being honest and I'm searching for a Cassandra truth, or she's hidden it extremely well. I know she isn't tech savvy which could mean she had help from xOM or somebody else.

 

Even though I said that I wanted the reconciliation to work out (this is what I've been telling her and myself), I've been thinking, where would that lead? I mean, one of the earlier posters said that a person isn't defined by one action. I agree with that. But it will affect the rest of our relationship. I think that we could still have a functional marriage, but it wouldn't be the same.

 

She could be genuinely sorry, honest and faithful for the rest of her life, willing to treat me like a king, consumed with guilt, or whatever else. I've started to not care for a while now. I'm not really angry or anything, just becoming apathetic. Feels like a waste of time for both me and my wife.

[GorillaTheater]

What's the status on your neighbor? Is he still your neighbor? Is he married? If so, have you considered having a chat with his wife?

[Where To]

What's the status on your neighbor? Is he still your neighbor? Is he married? If so, have you considered having a chat with his wife?

 

Divorced.

 

I'm distancing myself from him. For both our sakes.

[RepairMinded]

I mean, one of the earlier posters said that a person isn't defined by one action. I agree with that.

 

It depends on the action, and on the person taking it.

 

When you hear the name "Lee Harvey Oswald" what do you think of?

[Where To]

It depends on the action, and on the person taking it.

 

When you hear the name "Lee Harvey Oswald" what do you think of?

 

I would define Lee Harvey Oswald as "Lee Harvey Oswald". But his actions as a sniper have defined the perception that people will have on him for a very long time. So while I would define my wife as my wife, I would define the perception I have of my wife's infidelity, to be the actions of a selfish cheater.

 

It's kinda complicated maybe, but I don't see how a debate on my apparent existentialist views will help anyone.

 

Anyway, I've been talking to her quite a bit lately. Seriously considering separation for a while now. Then the big D route maybe. I'm still undecided there.

 

I could stay with her, work things out, and have a happy ending...I don't know. I'm starting to think: **** that.

[jnj express]

Your wife's comment, in re:you bringing up a revenge A.---says it all about her------Her moral's arn't there---she is willing to let you drop to her level, to prove what---that you then can both be equally miserable

 

If she had any class, no matter what she did, she should have done everything she could to convince you NOT to take revenge

 

You have been dealing for how long now, with a woman who you came home to every night, looked you right in the eyes, and said everything was great---welcome home honey---she forget to tell you "Hey guess what--I just finished sleeping with blah blah"

 

Is she a stay at home mom??? With nothing to do everyday, but go have sex with her neighbors----You in all actuality, don't really know what she has been doing for all these years, do you????

 

Is this the kind of person you wanna spend your golden years with

 

You are living in misery, it is coming out in every post you write----the only way that will ever end is if you D. your wife---

 

No matter what she is trying to do, to keep this mge, going---she is the one that is triggering your misery---those triggers will not go away, as long as she is there in front of you

 

On top of that her reason for the A.---I did it just for the he*l of it---is so far over the top, as a horrible excuse

 

You might try to work something out--if it was alcohol related, or there was mental health involved, or there were FOO problems, or the mge., had major problems---but to tell you I did it for kicks----what is she actually saying to you

 

She is telling you---hey dear H---you are nothing but a POS----you are crap to me---who cares if I stomp on your heart, and destroy your soul, take away your carefree life, and do away with your peace of mind-----you obviously arn't worth a rats A. to me

 

I hope she hasn't told you how much she loves you---cuz no one does that to someone they love----chemicals, or what ever else caused this to happen, she knew what she was doing every step of the way---and she knew what the consequences would be---yet for 3 months she did it for thrills----I bet your sub-conscious is running wild with that reasoning

 

Your 13 year old daughter is not a reason for you to live in misery, where everyday you have to look at a woman, who thinks so little of you---as to tromp on her sacred vows just for thrills

 

You have to do what is best for you to regain a healthy outlook, and finish your life in as much happiness as you can---from what I am reading from you---it does not sound like staying with this woman is gonna do those things for you---but no matter what, stand tall, the sun will come up manana----be good!!!!!

[Where To]

You are living in misery, it is coming out in every post you write

Nah, misery isn't the best word. I'm past that stage.

 

Confusion and increasing apathy maybe.

 

By the way, did you ever confront OM to get his explaination for the affair? What did he say?

Yes. A torrent of excuses and apologies.

 

Well, I think that I can talk my wife into moving out and staying with her parents, for a little while anyway. It'll give me time to think about what I want, and give her time to think about what she wants.

 

It's not about "us" anymore, but "me" and "her". I suppose I'll just have to wait and see.

[John Michael Kane]

Nah, misery isn't the best word. I'm past that stage.

 

Confusion and increasing apathy maybe.

 

Yes. A torrent of excuses and apologies.

 

Well, I think that I can talk my wife into moving out and staying with her parents, for a little while anyway. It'll give me time to think about what I want, and give her time to think about what she wants.

 

It's not about "us" anymore, but "me" and "her". I suppose I'll just have to wait and see.

 

Good. This time is for you. Time to think about you for a change.

[Untouchable_Fire]

Nah, misery isn't the best word. I'm past that stage.

 

Confusion and increasing apathy maybe.

 

If you separate that is the first step towards divorce.

 

If you are truly feeling apathetic... that means you are starting to lose the love you had for her. That is bad news for the idea of recovery.

 

Do you have any feelings left or is this a dead horse?

 

Whichever way you go... It's YOUR choice! Moving hurts at first, but then gets really easy. Staying is easier at first, but gets harder each year.

[jnj express]

At this point in time---what if anything is your wife doing to get herself back into the mge, and win any part of you back---Is she doing ANYTHING to show she wants this mge., to go forward

 

If she really wanted the mge., to make it---she would absolutely refuse to leave, and she would stay there and really fight for the mge---is she doing any part of that?????

[RepairMinded]

Where To,

 

if there is a measure of doubt in your mind, at this point, about where to go from here, then you might want to put some effort into determining if this affair was the only time she ever cheated on you.

 

I just don't believe that very many people suddenly decide it's O.K. to cheat for the very first time after many years of marriage. Especially not in the rather remorseless way your wife seems to have gone about it.

 

You spoke of disappointment as the cheating seems uncharacteristic of her personality as you have known it for 25 years. On the contrary, cheaters are very good at keeping that aspect of their personality "hidden" from their relationships partners, sometimes for a very long time. But that doesn't mean "the cheater" wasn't right there with you for all those years anyway.

 

Maybe if you were able to find out this wasn't the first time, but the second or third or fourth--and do NOT dismiss this possibility, because it is a very real one--your vision of your future path would crystallize in a very clear way.

[Guildford]

Lil Ch00b;2 – I must respond to your post in which you state that people who can forgive have low self-esteem.

 

Are there no Christians on this website? (Pregnant pause) Did Jesus lack self-esteem when he asked that the people who crucified him be forgiven? Did Jesus believe that his disciples lacked self-esteem when he gave them the Lord’s Prayer and included the line: forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us? But enough about religion.

 

It is high self-esteem that facilitates forgiveness. A person with high self-esteem does not need hard and fast rules to govern his personal life and marriage, he can asses his wife’s transgression and decide whether it goes beyond the bounds of redemption or he can forgive and rebuild the marriage. When making this determination he will also evaluate the whole marriage and the totality of the relationship, and not decide the fate of the marriage on one infidelity. I have been married for over forty years and I assure you that the wheels on my marriage have been greased with forgiveness going both ways. In my marriage forgiveness has never been followed with the forgiven sin being continued, and I do not feel that I lack self-esteem.

 

It is the person without self-esteem, the person who does not trust his own judgment, who must govern his life with hard and fast rules. It is the person without self-esteem who must follow the advice of friends who say that divorce must always be the response to infidelity.

 

When I read Where To’s first post I assumed that he correctly described the situation and I took his wife at her word that there was only one affair and that she was truly repentant. I believed that the marriage could be saved; I have read on this website of many extramarital affairs far worst than this one, but where forgiveness was offered. Forgiveness does not mean that such action will be tolerated in the future. If Where To forgave his wife, he would not forget and would be more vigilant in the future. If his wife continued to have affairs after the reconciliation he could say to his wife, “I forgive you, but I want you out of my life now.”

 

Lil Ch00b.2 says that forgiving his wife will teach their daughter to have bad morals. Most children are not as rigid as many of the posters here and can understand that forgiveness is not a license to continue with the same sin in the future without fear of repercussions. Forgiveness simply means the chance to change your ways before it is too late. If Where To divorces his wife he will have to explain to his daughter why. His daughter will be greatly upset that her mother had an affair, but she will be more upset that her father terminated the marriage and the daughter’s family life. (In tort law it is called the “last clear chance” to save the marriage.) What will Where To do if his daughter has an extramarital affair when she grows up, will he disown his daughter? Will the daughter learn that if she does ever have an extramarital affair she should lie, lie, and lie because confession will not mitigate the sin?

 

Very few marriages would last four decades if they are governed by hard and fast rules that cannot be relaxed through forgiveness and it requires good self-esteem to know when to ease up on the rules.

Edited June 26, 2011 by Guildford

[rafallus]

^Note that forgiving is not equivalent of "staying together". You can have one without the other. While forgiving is obvious thing to do overtime, staying needn't be.

[y2k]

I hope you get the general idea that most people who say this are very weak people. I hope you find yourself a good lawyer retain as much of your assets as you can and prove to your daughter that you are a man you will show her true morals of this world and you will never stop being a solid foundation for her.

 

^^^Best advice here.

 

Think of it like this: How would you like it if your daughter married a man, only to have him cheat on her with her "accepting" it in a way and always "trying to fix things first"????? It would break your heart to see this. It already breaks mine by just typing it.

 

But if you set the example of being strong and having a real strong self-esteem, then she'll never fall victim to this. And if she were to encounter cheaters, she would easily throw their punk-@$$3$ out. But if she saw her daddy staying with a cheating spouse, then she, most likely, will not be able to throw a cheater out, and she'll be a wreck.

 

Plus, your self-esteem alone should make you not want to stay with this woman. Good luck.

[RepairMinded]

" god " gives you free will

 

Interesting point.

 

Unfaithful people frequently imply that their cheating behavior is out of their hands. They "fell in love" and satan made their pants fall down. Or something like that.