Crazy chick1 Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 We have been talking regularly all week & have plans to continue to do so. On the one hand I feel happier & calmer, because he is back in my life but on the other hand I keep trying to analyse what he tells me & none of it makes sense. For example, he has told me that he needs to protect his W right now but then immediately afterwards told me that he wants to talk to me, that we have unfinished business & that he is confused by how he feels. It just seems that whenever we speak it's just a jumble of words from us both. He also said that he could see that I was getting on with my life & was obviously either nearly if not completely over him (I didn't deny it but I clearly am nowhere near this point). Sorry WWiU as I know this will annoy you but I really am just trying to understand what exactly he wants from me. He doesn't want an A, he doesn't want to hurt his family, so WHY is this contact continuing? For me it's simple, I miss him & want him in my life, I'm not sure he has a reason, but obviously he must have because he is risking the happiness of the family he wants to protect again? This is hard.
Silly_Girl Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 He's having an affair with you. He could have many reasons or none. If you're happy to continue, and have no expectations, does it really and truly matter what his motives are? Just enjoy what you've chosen, or stop doing it
Gentlegirl Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 His big ego is hurt because he thinks you are getting over him. Gentlegirl
bentnotbroken Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 We have been talking regularly all week & have plans to continue to do so. On the one hand I feel happier & calmer, because he is back in my life but on the other hand I keep trying to analyse what he tells me & none of it makes sense. For example, he has told me that he needs to protect his W right now but then immediately afterwards told me that he wants to talk to me, that we have unfinished business & that he is confused by how he feels. It just seems that whenever we speak it's just a jumble of words from us both. He also said that he could see that I was getting on with my life & was obviously either nearly if not completely over him (I didn't deny it but I clearly am nowhere near this point). Sorry WWiU as I know this will annoy you but I really am just trying to understand what exactly he wants from me. He doesn't want an A, he doesn't want to hurt his family, so WHY is this contact continuing? For me it's simple, I miss him & want him in my life, I'm not sure he has a reason, but obviously he must have because he is risking the happiness of the family he wants to protect again? This is hard. No it's not. It is the drama you crave and you are making sure it happens. You just want to make sure you lay it at his feet since he is the one with the family.
26pointblue Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 Yeah I'm wondering why you're doing this . . . you say you care about him & miss him but he isn't able to give you what you want so why are you giving him you? I guess I just don't get it although I've done unfathomable things too. I wish you luck in whichever way you decide to go.
jwi71 Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 We have been talking regularly all week & have plans to continue to do so. On the one hand I feel happier & calmer, because he is back in my life but on the other hand I keep trying to analyse what he tells me & none of it makes sense. For example, he has told me that he needs to protect his W right now but then immediately afterwards told me that he wants to talk to me, that we have unfinished business & that he is confused by how he feels. It just seems that whenever we speak it's just a jumble of words from us both. He also said that he could see that I was getting on with my life & was obviously either nearly if not completely over him (I didn't deny it but I clearly am nowhere near this point). Sorry WWiU as I know this will annoy you but I really am just trying to understand what exactly he wants from me. He doesn't want an A, he doesn't want to hurt his family, so WHY is this contact continuing? For me it's simple, I miss him & want him in my life, I'm not sure he has a reason, but obviously he must have because he is risking the happiness of the family he wants to protect again? This is hard. Maybe you should just ask HIM. How hard is that?
Author Crazy chick1 Posted June 15, 2011 Author Posted June 15, 2011 Maybe you should just ask HIM. How hard is that? I guess deep down I'm afraid to scare him away when he's only just come back. And yes, I do understand how truly pathetic that sounds & yes, my self esteem is suffering at the moment. I probably am just his toy to make him feel good at a time when his W is making life hard & no, I'm sure he couldn't really give a sh.it about me. I obviously don't deserve to be treated any better.
Author Crazy chick1 Posted June 15, 2011 Author Posted June 15, 2011 Woa, what kind of talk is that?!! Of course you deserve to be treated well. As an OW a lot lies in how you interpret your situation. If you're where you want to be and feel good about it, it doesn't affect your self esteem. Your MM is having opposing emotions. That's why he doesn't make sense. He will tell you things one moment and others the next, because that is how mixed up he feels inside. It's not lies, it's different parts of the truth. As I keep getting told, I am accepting crumbs from MM, it's not because I'm happy about it but simply because it's crumbs or nothing. I want to understand what he's about but it is hard to make sense of the things he says. I do feel as though this WILL end soon because I can't see a point in it continuing from his point of view (I cannot continue to fake happiness for his benefit & if I act miserable, he isn't going to want to talk to me anyway). I am afraid to deal with the end because I let him back after the couple of months NC & know the pain I will feel once more. It just seems so pointless for me to have to go through this when he doesn't even seem to have a reason for having reconnected with me.
26pointblue Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 As I keep getting told, I am accepting crumbs from MM, it's not because I'm happy about it but simply because it's crumbs or nothing. I want to understand what he's about but it is hard to make sense of the things he says. I do feel as though this WILL end soon because I can't see a point in it continuing from his point of view (I cannot continue to fake happiness for his benefit & if I act miserable, he isn't going to want to talk to me anyway). I am afraid to deal with the end because I let him back after the couple of months NC & know the pain I will feel once more. It just seems so pointless for me to have to go through this when he doesn't even seem to have a reason for having reconnected with me. Good for you. Don't change what you want to suit him. If he isn't giving you what you want, move on. Believe me it's hard but your self esteem will increase as you get stronger & realize you are worth more than crumbs & you shouldn't accept crumbs. Be true to yourself & hold out for someone who loves all of you & gives you all of himself. I'm doing it & so can you . . . yes it's hard but not nearly as hard as being an OW who wants to not be an OW but instead have a full relationship. Yeah he's feeling opposing things right now but you deserve someone who ONLY feels that he wants you & no one else. If any guy has a feeling opposite of your best interest of giving himself only to you, then he isn't worth your time in trying to figure out his opposing emotions & tip-toeing around them & changing your desires to suit him. Good for you, you are getting there, I can tell.
MissBee Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 We have been talking regularly all week & have plans to continue to do so. On the one hand I feel happier & calmer, because he is back in my life but on the other hand I keep trying to analyse what he tells me & none of it makes sense. For example, he has told me that he needs to protect his W right now but then immediately afterwards told me that he wants to talk to me, that we have unfinished business & that he is confused by how he feels. It just seems that whenever we speak it's just a jumble of words from us both. He also said that he could see that I was getting on with my life & was obviously either nearly if not completely over him (I didn't deny it but I clearly am nowhere near this point). Sorry WWiU as I know this will annoy you but I really am just trying to understand what exactly he wants from me. He doesn't want an A, he doesn't want to hurt his family, so WHY is this contact continuing? For me it's simple, I miss him & want him in my life, I'm not sure he has a reason, but obviously he must have because he is risking the happiness of the family he wants to protect again? This is hard. How is this an update? It is the exact same question and scenario as you mentioned in your "madness" thread....and the same answers still apply. Nothing new or different has happened and the analysis of what is REALLY going on still remains.... .................................
MissBee Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 He's having an affair with you. He could have many reasons or none. If you're happy to continue, and have no expectations, does it really and truly matter what his motives are? Just enjoy what you've chosen, or stop doing it Yep......
MissBee Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 I guess deep down I'm afraid to scare him away when he's only just come back. And yes, I do understand how truly pathetic that sounds & yes, my self esteem is suffering at the moment. I probably am just his toy to make him feel good at a time when his W is making life hard & no, I'm sure he couldn't really give a sh.it about me. I obviously don't deserve to be treated any better. Honestly Crazy....you need to get off the forum and perhaps get to a counselor who can help you work through these issues. They are far deeper than it first appeared and the married man IS NOT your real problem. He is just a symptom of a larger problem that is preexisting. Once you work on your real problem then this married man scenario will solve it self. Trust me. Please do so. Visit that site I told you about baggagereclaim.co.uk and really check out a counselor.
fooled once Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 No it's not. It is the drama you crave and you are making sure it happens. You just want to make sure you lay it at his feet since he is the one with the family. Ditto Maybe you should just ask HIM. How hard is that? Ditto How is this an update? It is the exact same question and scenario as you mentioned in your "madness" thread....and the same answers still apply. Nothing new or different has happened and the analysis of what is REALLY going on still remains.... ................................. Seriously....same things, different posts. Crazy, you seem very happy to be all wrapped up in him and talking on the phone - WOW TALKING ON THE PHONE!!! WOW!!! So enjoy it. Enjoy knowing that is the extent of it. Enjoy knowing when he hangs up, he goes back to his wife and they plan their life, while you sit and wait for his next call.
whichwayisup Posted June 16, 2011 Posted June 16, 2011 =Sorry WWiU as I know this will annoy you but I really am just trying to understand what exactly he wants from me. He doesn't want an A, he doesn't want to hurt his family, so WHY is this contact continuing? For me it's simple, I miss him & want him in my life, I'm not sure he has a reason, but obviously he must have because he is risking the happiness of the family he wants to protect again? This is hard. Nah, don't be sorry and no you're not annoying me at all. I will say it 100x or until you understand. Your MM is selfish and puts himself first. He will tell you one thing and do another, just like what he says to his wife (OW is gone, the A is over, no contact etc) but he will do what he wants because he is a good liar and manipulative. You feed his ego, make him feel good. He wants to stay married and have you on the side and get away with it. He feels entitled to stay married and have you as well. This isn't about you or his wife, it's about him.
whichwayisup Posted June 16, 2011 Posted June 16, 2011 I guess deep down I'm afraid to scare him away when he's only just come back. And yes, I do understand how truly pathetic that sounds & yes, my self esteem is suffering at the moment. I probably am just his toy to make him feel good at a time when his W is making life hard & no, I'm sure he couldn't really give a sh.it about me. I obviously don't deserve to be treated any better. You are afraid of letting go and it ending for real, never hearing from him again. So, instead you'll settle for what he can give you..Tiny moments he can spare to talk to you. Please don't be afraid of the pain.. It's goin to get a lot worse as time goes on. Best to deal with it now and just end it! YOU DO DESERVE BETTER and MORE. Glad you see that, just wish you could find the strength to end it and go NC so you can truly let yourself grieve and begin your healing process.
Silly_Girl Posted June 16, 2011 Posted June 16, 2011 Crazy. Don't beat yourself up. Else this vicious circle will just be reinforced. Where do you see yourself in 3 or 6 months time? I know that day to day to lose touch with someone with whom you felt incredible closeness is devastating, and can damn near make you ill! So I know it's hard to be blasé about it. But I'm interested in what you want for yourself looking a bit more longer term than just today
Spark1111 Posted June 16, 2011 Posted June 16, 2011 Why is he talking to you still? Because as long as you are friendly and accomodating, he can feel less guilty about his choice, because see, she is still my friend, so what I did couldn't be so bad. Wow, talk about making it easy for this guy to not experience any consequences for his actions.
Author Crazy chick1 Posted June 16, 2011 Author Posted June 16, 2011 How long have you guys been together? Hasn't he seen you unhappy before? If he loves you, he's not going to go away because you show him the real you. In fact, it's the real you he wants to see. Nobody should fake happiness in a relationship. About the crumbs, look at your relationship. If it was a relationship with a single guy, would you still consider that you were getting crumbs only? We've been 'together' for about 8mths & have known each other as friends for over 3 years. Trouble is the 'friendship' that we are attempting isn't really working because the lines are too blurred because of the sex stuff & the emotions. He has indeed seen me in a very unhappy state before d day & went out of his way to support me & he wasn't scared away. I think I just feel more vulnerable since the break up because I don't want to lose him again. Then again I really don't want to lose my self-esteem because of him. I guess I need to start being more truthful, stop playing games & ask him straight out what he is wanting from me. I hear his words that he doesn't want a PA 'for the foreseeable future' & speaks of 'unfinished business', he needs to protect his W, he has to work at his M, he hates what he has done to his family (& me), he doesn't know if he still loves me (because we have only seen each other once since we got back in touch) & he seems to be fishing to find out how I feel about him. Ok, so I need to find out exactly what he does want from me & I will ask him.... Thankyou for the continued advice.
Silly_Girl Posted June 16, 2011 Posted June 16, 2011 Ok, so I need to find out exactly what he does want from me & I will ask him.... What do YOU want?
Author Crazy chick1 Posted June 16, 2011 Author Posted June 16, 2011 I want what I pretty much know I can't have.
Frogwife Posted June 16, 2011 Posted June 16, 2011 I agree with Silly Girl and the "don't beat yourself up". I went through similar feelings from the other side - I'm a married woman and developed feelings for a man I was having an affair with. I ended it and OF COURSE still thought of him. During the affair (and after), I would analyze so many things - "What did this mean? Why did he do this? What is he looking for?" etc. I ended up putting those questions into a "things we'll never know" file in my mind. I would never know the answer to many hows and whys and really, frankly, it didn't matter when I really thought about it. This may sound trite, but a technique I use when I'm "going into that place" of thinking about someone, missing them, etc is to "spin plates" - I make sure I have lots of activities in my life so I'm not focusing on just one thing. Some people do this by dating multiple people, so they are not too focused on one person. For me, it was starting to work out, taking French and photography lessons, etc. I was improving my mind and my body. I was taking care of myself and that helped me not focus on this area that I was obsessing about. Also "no contact" REALLY helps (as many people here have in other threads, etc). Good luck to you (and to anyone who is in this place). It's not an easy time but it does get better if you take steps to take care of yourself.
MissBee Posted June 16, 2011 Posted June 16, 2011 (edited) This explains beautifully what you're currently doing, what many women do and what I myself have done in the past. It's from that site I told you about. Excerpted Quote: "GET OFF THE DRAMA/RELATIONSHIP CRACK .....When my relationships unraveled or I felt I was losing someone or that they’d find out my flaw, or we had a showdown, or I told them about themselves, or everyone was fussing around or whatever – I liked the high. When drama kicks off, you know you have someone’s attention and if you associate drama with normality or affection/love, the high cloaks you…until it wears off. Even if you know that nothing ‘good’ is going to come of the drama, on the high you feel more comfortable, showered with attention and in control of things. That’s pseudo attention, pseudo comfort, pseudo control which dissipates. As time goes on, especially in relationships, just like drugs, you have to create more drama to feel the same level of attention you used to and it also gets harder to climb back up from the low. I’ve written many posts on unhealthy and shady behaviour in relationships. I’m not talking about having disagreements, forgetting to do something and the minutae of the day-to-day; I’ve written extensively about emotional unavailability, commitment resistance and ultimately recognising inappropriate behaviour. What fascinates me is that people know that someone’s said or done something that ticks at least a code amber or red, and yet there they are indignant, analysing the crappola out of it or researching on the net to see if they have a ‘condition’ that caused it, and denying, minimising and rationalizing While you dislike or even hate their behaviour, your drama then becomes trying to understand the workings of someone else’s mind – a someone, I might add, who doesn’t think and act like you, so you could never understand unless you’re planning to be like them or are like them. You then create even more drama by refusing to accept what their actions mean and instead decide that you will be the exception to the rule and make them change. ...I no longer have any desire to feed off danger, inappropriateness or just things going haywire in my life because it’s like saying that I can only feel good if my life is screwed up. I just can’t stomach the rollercoaster. That’s saying a lot for me because I literally come from a home where my parents drama, especially my mother’s controlled the temperature of everyone’s moods. I don’t think someone’s trying to destroy me, I don’t believe I’m an unloveable person, I don’t think I deserve poor treatment, and I also don’t believe in investing any chunk of my life, no matter how big or small into playing Columbo and investigating the crappola out of someone else. I say this to you (and yes this is one predominantly for the ladies) because we spend too much time sucking on the Drama/Relationship Crack pipe which means that life is like one scene after another of Dynasty level dramatisations. You’re the only person you can control and if you don’t like the drama taking place around you or you have genuine aspirations to be happy and in a mutually fulfilling healthy relationship, you have to stop participating in drama whether it’s creating, seeking, or analysing the crap out of it and then trying to change people. It’s time to be choosier about who you associate/interact with and distance yourself from those who can create drama with a paper bag. Stop feigning naivety – yes feigning. Drama comes from the same type of people, the same type of situations. You’d literally have to be a frickin’ ostrich not to recognise what spells drama – none of us were born yesterday and most of us have a back catalogue and a life resume to draw on that indicates where drama comes from – stop trying to be the exception to the rule and stop being a short-term thinker, because the crack feels good now, but you’re suffering medium to long-term consequences." ------------------------------------------------------------ Edited June 16, 2011 by MissBee
TigerCub Posted June 16, 2011 Posted June 16, 2011 CC, At first I was gonna comment on how this post is just like the one before it. But...it actually occurred to me that you really do seek an answer of WHY he's doing what he's doing. Here's your problem (why you're going to keep asking this question): You're looking for meaning where there really is none. This is what you see at face value: - he claims to love you - he doesn't want to hurt his wife & the children - He wants to protect 3 vs. 1 (you) - He chose them over you - He still contacts you and you willingly go for it - You will gladly offer emotional support - You gladly offer friendship - You will gladly offer sex and yet you wonder WHY would he contact me if he wants to protect his W? You're trying to find an answer beyond the obvious. There is no answer beyond the obvious. He's doing this because you are so willing to go along for the ride. He's doing this because he's already been through 1 DDay and his wife is still with him He's doing this because the 1 dday probably taught him how to cover his tracks better So why wouldn't he do this? If you're willing he's getting his needs met he's doing a better job at hiding things from W & kids why wouldn't he do it? I was really sad to see how low your self esteem was in your own posts. I truly hope that you find a good therapist. What kind of relationship do you have with this guy, if you're faking being happy, if you're so afraid to voice your concerns, fearing that he will leave you a second time. That makes me so sad for you. I'm no therapist, but I'm guessing you have abandonment issues (from your past) - I dunno, and I really don't mean to be insulting. From me, my A experience brought out a LOT of "daddy issues", and therapy helped me deal with all that crap. I'm not saying that everyone that has an A has daddy issues, and usually if people are happy being the AP, I say fine, do what you will. But you're not happy, and your pain shines through in your posts. I do hope that you see someone to deal with your low self esteem. You do deserve more than crumbs, you do deserve to be with a partner that you KNOW will not abandon you, you do deserve to be fully loved and cherished.
Owl Posted June 16, 2011 Posted June 16, 2011 Here's my take. Stop limiting yourself to just calling. All you're doing is denying yourself from ALL of what you want. Limiting contact to just calling WILL NOT reduce the emotional devestation and trauma his wife will experience when she finds out that the two of you are still communicating. She's still going to see this for what it is...a continuation of the affair. Given that...from her perspective...nothing's changed. He's still "with you". Given THAT...why bother going through all this heart ache and stress trying to limit contact, when it's not going to change anything? I say go for it. Kick it all back into gear. Why not?
reboot Posted June 16, 2011 Posted June 16, 2011 Here's my take. Stop limiting yourself to just calling. All you're doing is denying yourself from ALL of what you want. Limiting contact to just calling WILL NOT reduce the emotional devestation and trauma his wife will experience when she finds out that the two of you are still communicating. She's still going to see this for what it is...a continuation of the affair. Given that...from her perspective...nothing's changed. He's still "with you". Given THAT...why bother going through all this heart ache and stress trying to limit contact, when it's not going to change anything? I say go for it. Kick it all back into gear. Why not? Nail, meet hammer.
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