Ouroboros Posted June 14, 2011 Posted June 14, 2011 This thread is a good example of why you should never be too honest. It is a great lesson for everyone regardless what skeleton you are hiding in your closet.
stepka Posted June 14, 2011 Posted June 14, 2011 Sweetsarah, this "relationship" is only days old and already you're in love? No hun, they call that infatuation and you're probably drawn in by the fact that he's crying over you already and begging you not to leave him. If he cared about your future at all, he would stand back and be patient. But, patience is not a quality that the criminal mind is capable of and the fact that he's declaring his love for you this soon should be a huge red flag--after all, he should be the mature one here. I very much believe that people are capable of changing and I suppose it's quite possible, but a couple of things to keep in mind are: 1. After 6 yrs in prison for a violent crime, he's going to have a heck of a time getting and keeping a job and if you were to dump your family for him, you'd need him to have one 2. His old compatriots from the streets and the prison are probably going to come looking for him some day, either to get him back in the business or to hurt him (and his family). Another thought--he's offered to support you if you leave, but what does he do for a living? Does he have a lifestyle that matches his purported income? What job do you guys have? If you two make minimum wage and he has a decent place and a nice car, then run, b/c he's probably still dealing drugs. Right now he's telling you want to hear. Of course, what fool wouldn't? But you have way too much at stake to throw it all away on this guy. Hmm, which should I choose? Parents and sisters who adore me and want all the best for me? Or man who's been in prison for 6 years, has a totally different background and religion, and probably won't ever have a decent job. Sometimes I think we English teachers do more harm than good when we assign Romeo and Juliet as a reading assignment.
Author sweetsarah Posted June 14, 2011 Author Posted June 14, 2011 Everyone is right and I am so thankful to have posts like these on here. Over the past day, I haven't been talking the way I have and he's been sending me facebook messages (because he is out of the country right now) that he is willing to sacrifice everything for me and his family will support us. To get some money, he is willing to sell his jewelry and get a job with his mom at UTMB (but I don't think they hire ex- convicts?). He keeps telling me that he can't picture his life without me and I told him I loved him and I should follow my heart. For example this is what he wrote: Hey baby! I miss u!! I am just writing because i love u and i feel alot better. I talked to my mom and bo and they both r there for us if u male the decision to follow ur heart. I know it is hard baby and i do not want to put any more pressure on u. I love u and i am here for u no matter how hard things get. I am not gonna b without u. If we have to hide our relationship for tha rest of our lives, i will!! I swear. U r my soulmate and i will prove to u how much i love u everyday for tha rest of our lives. I am willing to sacrifice my family, my life, and any and everything else for u. Just let me know what i need to do to make sure that i have u forever and ur wish is my command. I promise that i will not let this stop us. We will get thru this one way or another. I love u sooooo much phatgirl!! It's me and u against tha world!! Bonnie and Clyde nigga. If we have each other who else do we need? U were talkin about that girl whose parents disowned her but think about how strong her love was for her to make that type of choice and still find happiness in her life. That is true amazing love. Tha same love i know that we share. I can't wait to sit down and talk with u friday and see u and hold u and love u like u wanna b loved. Trust in me like i trust in u. I love u baby!! EVERYTHING about u! He's asking me for a decision that I simply cannot make. Parental love and love you have for someone else outside your family is different and is not comparable at all. I can't just follow my heart and be with him and possibly leave my family. If I make the decision to be with him, I will be facing a lot of consequences for my own happiness. My mom has high blood pressure and I am simply putting her life at risk for myself and I feel so selfish. My dad is in his late sixties and can't handle it because he has severe depression already. I wish there was a middle ground that I could choose to make everyone happy, unfortunately, life doesn't work that way.
Author sweetsarah Posted June 14, 2011 Author Posted June 14, 2011 I am not going to give up on school no matter what. He said he would wait for me until I am completely done with school. However, engineering is a very difficult major and maybe having a serious relationship will affect my grades- even though he said he would make sure I have a perfect gpa, no exceptions. I think some people think I might give up my education all together. No, that will never happen. He said that he would help me pay for my tuition and work extra jobs if he needs to in order to get me through school. What is your opinion on this?
Ouroboros Posted June 14, 2011 Posted June 14, 2011 You won't know how much of it is talk until you walk the walk.
Richard Friedman Posted June 14, 2011 Posted June 14, 2011 Well what do you expect when the nice guys are boring, sycophantic schmucks? I feel for the poor women. It seems the "typical path" of hs/college/white collar job turns guys into wimps who walk on needles around their women? What's a girl to do?
ivalm Posted June 14, 2011 Posted June 14, 2011 hes a psychopath and felon. I think Chickenliver is 100% correct. Seriously, if he truly loved you he wouldn't be writing you the kind of messages you posted. They read as form someone who is emotionally immature, which is never a good sign. His gang/drug/criminal history is just the final nail in the coffin. Seriously, save your life, dump the guy, or, at least, put this relationship on hold for the next 4 years while you're getting your degree. If after 4 years both of you feel the same, then I will admit I was wrong and you have true love and everything will be wonderful.
mortensorchid Posted June 14, 2011 Posted June 14, 2011 I assume that you are about to start or are already in your college years as you write this. I knew a girl during my college years whose family threatened to disown and take her out of college if she continued to see this man. I thought she was rather neive, but she really did have an affinity for bad boys. The guy she was with was never employed, had two children from previous relationships, and was in and out of jail for missing his child support payments. He was also black and she was white. She did not make any secret about her "preferences" in that department, either from her family or friends. This guy was a loser, plain and simple. He took advantage of her like many before and after have - "borrowing" money and never repaying, accepting "gifts" of appliances and furniture, "borrowing" her credit cards, etc. You have not hinted that this man in question has ever done any of those things, but the fact that he has been to jail gives me and others on this forum pause. He did something bad. Is he reformed? Maybe so. But that will always be hanging over you and him and others once they read it on paper. Honestly, do you know that this guy is really going to make good on his promises? Because usually people do not. I'm sorry to hear that your family has threatened to disown you, but honestly, listen to them. They will be there twenty years from now, like it or not, and you will be happier if you have a good relationship with them. Get your education too. Many things can happen between now and then. You might change your mind about a lot of things.
ProjekctionMan Posted June 14, 2011 Posted June 14, 2011 What I understand is that there are two disadvantages here: Disadvantage A - You're Muslim, and having a relationship outside of an arranged marriage. This is bound to get your parents upset. Disadvantage B - You're dating someone who is by, all means, a thug. These two disadvantages make me understand your situation, and understand your parents perspective.
stepka Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 Over the past day, I haven't been talking the way I have and he's been sending me facebook messages (because he is out of the country right now) that he is willing to sacrifice everything for me and his family will support us. To get some money, he is willing to sell his jewelry and get a job with his mom at UTMB (but I don't think they hire ex- convicts?). He keeps telling me that he can't picture his life without me and I told him I loved him and I should follow my heart. He's asking me for a decision that I simply cannot make. Parental love and love you have for someone else outside your family is different and is not comparable at all. I can't just follow my heart and be with him and possibly leave my family. If I make the decision to be with him, I will be facing a lot of consequences for my own happiness. My mom has high blood pressure and I am simply putting her life at risk for myself and I feel so selfish. My dad is in his late sixties and can't handle it because he has severe depression already. I wish there was a middle ground that I could choose to make everyone happy, unfortunately, life doesn't work that way. Don't count on it. Money from jewelry can't go far and you're not even sure he can get a job at his mother's company. And then where will the money come from? If he gets desperate, he may go back to what he knows. Honestly I'm sorry, but he does not sound like a prize. I've heard all this stuff before and it's just hot air, b/c a real man would be trying to ingratiate himself with your parents and would be out working hard to get a real job so he could support you rather than making empty promises that he has no way to keep. He would be working hard to prove to you and your parents and the rest of the world that he has changed. Instead he's working hard to draw a young (probably virgin) girl away from her family and into lord knows what. Remember, your mother has been 18 before, but you've never been the age she is--listen to her and your family.
Author sweetsarah Posted June 15, 2011 Author Posted June 15, 2011 I think I probably will end it with him. My sister texted me earlier today telling me that since our family will not accept him, he might try to hurt us. From reading the posts on here, it really has me thinking that he might not have changed a 100%. I was planning to end it with him in person, but since he was put in jail for agitated assault, what if he tries to hurt me or my family ( because they wouldn't accept him)? A part of me still cares for him and then a part of me feels like my life or family's life might be in danger.
musemaj11 Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 (edited) At least you are listening to the advices being given to you unlike many other young girls in similar situation. You are going to be an engineer. It would be really sad for you to squander your future for a criminal. There are countless boys with no criminal history out there. Its not hard to find one. Edited June 15, 2011 by musemaj11
Ouroboros Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 I think I probably will end it with him. My sister texted me earlier today telling me that since our family will not accept him, he might try to hurt us. From reading the posts on here, it really has me thinking that he might not have changed a 100%. I was planning to end it with him in person, but since he was put in jail for agitated assault, what if he tries to hurt me or my family ( because they wouldn't accept him)? A part of me still cares for him and then a part of me feels like my life or family's life might be in danger. You should always handle the most important events in your life in person otherwise they clearly mean nothing to you. You are succumbing to mass paranoia. If this man had been in the army or in the police in which he would have killed and assaulted many then these people would be singing a very different tune. They would be in complete support of your decision to be with him and naysaying your family's opinion. If you still feel uncomfortable around him then have him meet you in a public place with plenty of people and don't go anywhere you two would be alone or isolated like his home or your home. One good place would be a food court in a mall.
Ouroboros Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 At age 18 you are still a child. At 18 one is an adult. Childhood ends at about 12 when adolescence begins. What makes sense now will not make sense later on when you mature.She is about as mature as she'll come. Scientists claim there is further development in the brain into one's early twenties but I haven't seen that play out as better decision making. A person acts a particular way at 18 will be acting the same way at 40 and at 70. A difference of seven years in this age bracket is huge.That would be true if they weren't adults but they are. Furthermore this guy was in jail for six years. That is a long time and I have to assume he did some serious crimes.Five to six years is about the norm for an assault and it involved drugs so that would mean extra time since the judicial system is spiteful like a child. Regardless of the opinion of your parents this is not a match. At age 18 you should be looking forward to go to college and date boys in your age bracket and with similar socio-economic background.He is in her age bracket even in the strictest, most puritanical sense. She isn't putting college off for a boy so drop the rhetoric. They are both Indian at least in part so they do share a background.
Ouroboros Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 If you had a daughter. Would you want her to dedicate her life to a getto, excon, uneducated drug dealer? Yeah right. Nice trolling dude. I can't make that decision for her and it would be wrong of me to make that decision for her. She'll need to pursue the relationships she desires. Interfering would be wrong and it would be more of an act of hatred rather than love.
BetheButterfly Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 I have talked to family and friends about my situation and I just need an outside opinion. First of all, I am an eighteen year old muslim girl and I am in love with a guy who is seven years older than me. He is half indian and half black. I am very intrigued by his culture, however my family wants nothing to do with him. He has had a background that he is not proud of and was in jail for six years, but that experience has caused him to become the amazing person he is today. He loves me unconditionally and ALWAYS goes out of his way to make me feel like the happiest woman in the world. As my mom and my sisters found out, they completely disapproved and said they wanted me to focus solely on school. I respect their decision and my dream is to become a successful and educated woman in the future. My boyfriend told me that he wants nothing else for me to succeed and I have never had anyone care for me the way he does. My dad is very strict and I know he will never ever accept it. My mom told me that when my dad finds out he will disown me, take away my education, and take drastic measures to make me stop whatever I am doing. I am stuck in a situation whether I might lose my family, who I love dearly and who has been through everything with me. I could never ask for a better family. Or I can lose a guy who loves me unconditionally and loves me more than his life. I honestly don't know what to do and I sincerely need your advice and your opinion. You need to ask yourself some tough questions. 1. Do I sincerely believe in Islam? If you are sincere in your Muslim beliefs, you know that you are not supposed to marry a man who is not Muslim. If you are sincere in your beliefs, that leads to the second question. 2. Is this man a Muslim? If he is a Muslim and your parents just don't like that he is from a different ethnicity, then you can look online for Muslim teachings concerning how all people are equal under God. If you want, I can help you find them. Or, you can go to a local masjid/mosque and ask the imam to talk with your parents and with the man. Make sure you agree with what the imam believes though first. If you do believe Islam is true, I sincerely hope that this man is Muslim, because that will make your relationship with him and with your family MUCH easier. As a Christian who has Muslim friends, I understand this. If he is not a Muslim and you are sincere in your beliefs, then you can ask him if he is willing to "revert" if he believes it is true. If so, then ask him to learn about Islam with you and pray for him. If he reverts, ok, then that will pass one hurdle. The hurdle of different cultures is not as big as the hurdle of different beliefs, because in Islam, (at least with the Muslims I know, ethnicity is not supposed to separate the brotherhood of Muslims.) The Muslims I know take great pride in the fact that people of every ethnicity go to Mecca for the pilgrimage and all are equal. 3. How should I respond to my parents? Your parents gave birth to you, fed you, and have helped you arrive to the point you are at today. It is very important, whether or not you are sincere in your beliefs, to respect them. Respecting doesn't mean that you have to always obey them now that you are an adult, though please don't lie to them. You can respectfully tell them that you are an adult and you have chosen him, that you want them to see what a wonderful man he is too, and you would greatly appreciate them giving him a chance. You can't force your parents to get to know him, but if you are respectful and don't insult your parents, that will help them want to get to know them. Hopefully they will. 4. Do I want to make this a big deal? If you are truly serious about this guy, then I suggest making things public. Why? Because in private, negative things can happen, like your parents disowning you. In public, that's harder for them to do, because they know that others are watching. If you are sincere about your beliefs, find an Imam who is "on your side." If you are not sure if you believe in Islam, find another person to be there with you. You need support that isn't just private or family. You need a more objective person who has your back and who can help keep your family and you accountable. 5. Do I want to lose my education and home and family ties for this man? That is possible that will happen. I wish it wasn't the case. However, you need to decide if you want to wait until after you finished your education and are more able to move out on your own, or go now. I personally would advice you to talk with this man and tell him that you would like to finish school first, and if he truly loves you, if he will wait for you. You are young. I would like to give you the advice to not depend on a man for financial security. I personally suggest asking this man to wait for you until you finish your education, and then proceed from there. Who knows? Maybe by that time, your parents will see he is an awesome man. The downside is if they believe in arranged marriages... yikes... You need to discuss this with the man you love, and then yes make sure to get outside help, like an Imam or a person in the community who can stand with you and your love.
BetheButterfly Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 (edited) I think I probably will end it with him. My sister texted me earlier today telling me that since our family will not accept him, he might try to hurt us. From reading the posts on here, it really has me thinking that he might not have changed a 100%. I was planning to end it with him in person, but since he was put in jail for agitated assault, what if he tries to hurt me or my family ( because they wouldn't accept him)? A part of me still cares for him and then a part of me feels like my life or family's life might be in danger. Oh I just read this. I strongly agree that you need to end it with him. I am sorry if that is hard for you, but it is the best since he has issues with violence. Hopefully he will work those out and no longer be violent, but that takes time and intense dedication on his part. I am glad that you are not going to depend on him/put your life into his "care." You do not trust him and it does not seem that right now, he is trustworthy. If at any time you feel your life or your family's life is in danger, that shows that the relationship is not right. Please end it with him not in person, but in a message. If he responds aggressively, please threaten with a restraining order. If he continues, you need to go get a restraining order placed on him. Back to your family, I hope that they do understand that all people are equal, and ethnicity is not an issue in the eyes of God. Please find teachings on Islam and ethnicity if there is an issue with prejudice. People of any ethnicity can become violent and abusive and break the laws, and no matter what ethnicity of the man who you someday marry, it is important to fall in love with a man who is not violent. Ethnicty doesn't matter, what matters is the heart. Edited June 15, 2011 by BetheButterfly
Ouroboros Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 wrong on all counts. you condone lying to her family too. if i had a daughter id want her to stay the hell away from scumbags like you I think she actually needs to cut all ties and being disowned would be good for her. They control her way too much and controlling is never loving.
coffeeaddict Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 I think I probably will end it with him. My sister texted me earlier today telling me that since our family will not accept him, he might try to hurt us. From reading the posts on here, it really has me thinking that he might not have changed a 100%. I was planning to end it with him in person, but since he was put in jail for agitated assault, what if he tries to hurt me or my family ( because they wouldn't accept him)? A part of me still cares for him and then a part of me feels like my life or family's life might be in danger. If he threatens you or your family call the cops, that's what they're there for.
Ouroboros Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 i think she should do the opposite of what you say. Good. Agreement is boring. Keep those flags of discontent waving.
Author sweetsarah Posted June 15, 2011 Author Posted June 15, 2011 I'm going to wait to tell him when he comes back from his vacation next week. This is what he sent me: well, i am confused and i do not know what to do. i asked a friend on facebook what she thinks and this was her reply.....Well its more on her if she want to sacrifice everything. It is a big step. But you gotta understand if her fam really loves and cares about her their back will not be turn forever. The will come around. If they don't then yall should start ur own family. But its her decision. It seems you already made urs and your more than willing to be with her and help her through it all. She needs to decide. When I had to come across that decision I sacrificed everything for my ex. But my fam welcome me wit open arms when they realize that I was happy. Prove to them dat you can make her happy and then their eyes will open. so, i have made my decision and i want u to know that i love u dearly but this is something u need to think about. we will talk when i come home and if u love me unconditionally as i do u then ur decision will support ur feelings. if not then it was not meant to b and i will still respect ur decision. no matter what, i will always love u sarah! I told him that leaving my family is not an option and if he truly loves me the way he says he does then he wouldn't want to take away the happiness of my family.
Ouroboros Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 I told him that leaving my family is not an option and if he truly loves me the way he says he does then he wouldn't want to take away the happiness of my family. Well he's not but you'll have to still arrive at a firm decision who you will choose for the rest of your life. What would you do if your parents had already passed away? Would you allow your sisters to tell you who is acceptable and who is not?
coffeeaddict Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 Sarah, here's a little sample of Ouroboros from another thread. After a woman poster describes a boyfriend who doesn't listen to her, is inconsiderate, and bloodied up her vagina during sex: Star Gazer: I didn't even know I had bled - he told me when he pointed it out. It didn't hurt either, although it wasn't pleasant. But I was sore within like 5 minutes. Ouroboros: He sounds like the bf you need but isn't the bf you want. Star Gazer: You think I need someone who doesn't listen to me, or apparently care about my needs? Someone I'm physically turned off by? Someone who I have no chemistry with in bed, and who's, dare I say, selfish and clueless in bed? Someone who expects me to put him before my friends, after only 6 or so weeks? Ouroboros: Yes, you need someone who can keep you in check. To keep you on your toes. A person who your lawyer schemes won't work on. Perfect balance. Perfect harmony. Star Gazer: This must be a joke. Staying in this relationship would not be good for me in any way, shape, or form. Ouroboros: The reasons why you should stay which I have listed are exactly why you are pulling away. Star Gazer: I am pulling away because I am physically repulsed by him. Staying with someone who physically repulses me and uses me as a masterbatory device will not do me ANY good. You're trolling. Please go away. Ouroboros: I'm not trolling but I'll go away. Ouroboros: That sounds like how you would see it but isn't he madly in love with you iirc? Star Gazer: Umm, see above. Please keep your promise. Ouroboros: Oh I went away from that line of thought. Ms. Joolie: Gosh I'm late to the party. Have you decided how to break up with him yet? Star Gazer: I've settled on a phone call. Ouroboros: Why even do it with that much tact? Why not a singing telegram? Ouroboros is a person who doesn't get a whole lot of attention from other Humans in real life, so he's trolling for attention in an anonymous setting. In other words, he's a person who would be doing the world an enormous favor if he would grab a toaster and jump into the nearest bathtub, but since we're not going to be able to convince him to do that, the next best option is to place him on ignore, which is what I have done.
stepka Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 If you had a daughter. Would you want her to dedicate her life to a getto, excon, uneducated drug dealer? Yeah right. Nice trolling dude. Ouroboros isn't a troll, he's a worm. Still if Ouroboros doesn't think it's loving to help her to a wise decision, I'm not it's loving to be advising her to make a poor decision either. I think sweetsarah will be looking back on this in a few years and breathing a big sigh of relief and wondering WTH was she thinking, but lord knows I've done that too. But I've got to tell you that even if he is wonderful, in-law problems can be a real b*tch. I should know and mine were only half bad.
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