tigressA Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 My mind is still swirling and I don't know what I want my next plan to be. I have an urge to get out, at least for a little while. Last night the TV was tuned to CNN and Piers Morgan was interviewing Paris Hilton (not the best program choice, I know ) and he asked her the inevitable set of questions about the sex tape. I said, "There are cases when a tape or nude photos are purposely released in order to garner publicity, but in other circumstances, when someone does it without the other knowing--that's a huge betrayal. I can certainly understand her feeling devastated and violated, if that was the case." BF argued that people who are in the public eye "should know better" and be conscious that there are plenty of people out there who are out to make a good bit of money off them. I said, "People don't think about that when they're in love! When you're in love with someone you trust them to not do that sort of thing to you no matter what!" That's when he dropped the bomb on me. He said that if we ever broke up and he had the chance to make a lot of money (like a million or so) by handing over X-rated material made during our relationship, he would. I couldn't believe it. I still can't. I had to leave the apartment after a couple of minutes because I didn't want to see or hear him. He went out after I came back; he said he was sorry and tried to hug me, I said, "Please don't touch me." He came back and we didn't say a word to each other. He sent me a text (A TEXT! When he's sitting RIGHT THERE! ) telling me again, "Sorry, I love you, blah blah". He fell asleep and then I went to bed, making sure we weren't touching. After awhile he woke up and tried to spoon with me; he wouldn't let me go even though I kept taking his arm off me. He repeated his apologies and I sat up, said, "I know. Please stop." We didn't say a word to or look at each other before he left for work this morning. I don't know what to say to him. I feel like he's severely damaged the trust I have so far put in him. I already feel violated and betrayed, knowing that if he had the chance, however remote, to violate me for a cool million or two, he would. I am thinking of getting a one-way bus ticket to my dad's house and staying there for an undetermined period. I really love him; other than this incident he's been so amazing and supportive and because of that I am not immediately thinking of breaking up...I think I just need some time away.
Kamille Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 Honestly TA, from where I sit, it sounds like the kind of thoughtless things someone says to win an argument. I mean, in reality, what are the chances he'd be able to make millions were you two to break up? Don't do anything impulsive. (But, to be on the safe side, you should really destroy all the sex tapes you've made! )
Author tigressA Posted June 1, 2011 Author Posted June 1, 2011 Honestly TA, from where I sit, it sounds like the kind of thoughtless things someone says to win an argument. I mean, in reality, what are the chances he'd be able to make millions were you two to break up? Don't do anything impulsive. (But, to be on the safe side, you should really destroy all the sex tapes you've made! ) :laugh: I wish I could agree, but when he said it and I questioned him (mostly out of shock and disbelief) he said, "It's the truth. I'm just being honest." It doesn't seem so impulsive then, to me. It seems like someone being honest about their willingness to humiliate someone they at one point said they loved more than anyone in order to make a lot of money. It was only after I displayed how utterly shocked and upset I was that he started apologizing.
johan Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 A million dollars is a lot of money. Everyone has their price. If someone actually showed up with a million dollars, you would probably sell them yourself. But be realistic: your sex tapes are probably worth a couple hundred at most. Your special techniques are safe and sound. As perfect as you think he is, it's not the last dumb thing he'll ever say.
robdrm32 Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 He's sorry it upset you, not because he understands it was a low thing to say.
Author tigressA Posted June 1, 2011 Author Posted June 1, 2011 A million dollars is a lot of money. Everyone has their price. If someone actually showed up with a million dollars, you would probably sell them yourself. But be realistic: your sex tapes are probably worth a couple hundred at most. Your special techniques are safe and sound. As perfect as you think he is, it's not the last dumb thing he'll ever say. :rolleyes: Where did I ever act like I was being all high on myself? You can stop being an a** now, J. Thanks. And no, I wouldn't sell them, if I had them, for any amount of money. I absolutely loathe the idea of putting a price on my body. I could never live with myself.
Kamille Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 If life and working as a social scientist has taught me anything it's this: There's a huge discrepancy between what people say they would do in an hypothetical situation and what they actually end up doing should the situation actually present itself. And the discrepancy can work both ways: sometimes people will claim noble goals and behave poorly, sometimes people will claim they'd act immorally and actually behave with dignity. What you do now know about your bf is that in the immediate, he values honesty. He won't bull**** you, tell you what you want to hear, and then turn around and do as he pleases. The paradox is that he just told you he believes he has a price. (ps: How important is financial security for him?)
mitchell Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 These types of responses help to gain insight into people. This is part of dating and getting to know each other. You've had a whirlwind of a relationship. Now, while living together, you are getting to know each others thoughts and values. He values money. He made that very clear. You even gave him an opportunity to recant, but he restated his values. Yes, he values money over even you. Now you are getting to know each other. Is he materialistic in other ways?
Author tigressA Posted June 1, 2011 Author Posted June 1, 2011 (edited) What you do now know about your bf is that in the immediate, he values honesty. He won't bull**** you, tell you what you want to hear, and then turn around and do as he pleases. The paradox is that he just told you he believes he has a price. (ps: How important is financial security for him?) True. This is just yet another instance in which he has shown me he doesn't like to spew BS. We had talked about a couple of other controversial topics before and I was very reactive. He had expressed concern that he would have to censor himself around me out of fear of my reactions/losing me. As far as how important it is to him to be financially secure, it's fairly up there on his list of priorities. He isn't attached to material things but he likes having the money to do what he wants. And yeah, I get it--everyone has a price. Who wouldn't want to be a millionaire? I certainly would like it--but I would never, ever make my money by exploiting my and/or someone else's body. That's just disgusting to me. I couldn't ever bear knowing that perfect strangers could have seen me performing sex acts on someone I was in a loving relationship with. I wouldn't ever be able to walk down a street or a hallway with my head held high, no matter how much money I would have made. I couldn't bear knowing that you could Google my name with "sex tape" and pages of results would come up. Edited June 1, 2011 by tigressA
kiss_andmakeup Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 (edited) Sorry to hear about this, Tigress. There are two schools of thought: Kamille's, which suggests that he only said what he said to prove a point, win an argument, or on hypothetical terms only. Then there's Johan's: it's an extreme circumstance that very few people would be at risk for (since we're not celebrities like Paris Hilton), but on the rare occasion that such an opportunity arose, most people would, by their very nature, take advantage of it. I don't think Johan was necessarily trying to by be a dick by insinuating that your videos wouldn't fetch the same fare as Paris Hilton's (though he did come off as dick-ish), I think he was just making a point that the situation you and your boyfriend were discussing is fantastical (kind of like asking "would you sleep with (insert celebrity's name here) if you had the chance?") and is unlikely to actually happen. I tend to believe in some combination of the two. I think your boyfriend spoke crassly, carelessly, and in the moment. But I also think he might have been showing some selfish human tendency. I honestly think the best thing to do is drop it for now, remain a bit distant, and then re-visit the subject if it truly bothers you. Wait a couple of days and then say "You know, I'm still a bit disturbed about your comment regarding the sex tape thing. Is that really, truly how you feel? It really causes me to question my trust in you." I can't remember, Tigress. How long have you been with him? Edited June 1, 2011 by kiss_andmakeup
johan Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 I wasn't saying you were high on yourself. I was stating what is probably a fact. I'm never an ass, T. Personally I think you're failing to put yourself in his shoes, for what reason, I'm not sure. But don't let your righteous indignation ruin what is apparently a halfway decent relationship.
reticulated Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 omg - those of you pointing out that the tapes wouldn't be worth millions because TA isn't a celebrity - you are totally missing the point. It's the principle of the exchange. Principles are the goods between the slices that make or break a sammich. TA, I'd be offended, put off, disgusted, floored, repulsed... all of these things. After he sweats, I'd say 'splain that you understand he was coming from a *practical* perspective and that, often, practicality conflicts with integrity. Maybe you can offer him an alternative way of thinking about it (your way ). At the crossroads of US 61 and US 49, which way would he go? That is what you're talking about there - interpersonal integrity - and it's scary if he'd sell it to get cozy in the world. Pretty damn shallow. Nonetheless, I think he was just being a dull-a$$ dunce. He probably thought it was cute. It sounds like you may be a little deeper than he is, but then too, perhaps it was just a shallow moment. I bet he's thinking about it now.
Mme. Chaucer Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 I agree with Kamille about the vast differences between how people behave in life and their responses to the hypothetical, and with the person who suggested that you look further into whether he is too materialistic for you in other ways. Tigress, I would be very hurt and angry to be on the receiving end of such a statement, but I truly hope that if it's not an indicator of deep incompatibility that you can take it as a stupid, thoughtless, inappropriate comment. Is this your first real "fight"?
Author tigressA Posted June 1, 2011 Author Posted June 1, 2011 I tend to believe in some combination of the two. I think your boyfriend spoke crassly, carelessly, and in the moment. But I also think he might have been showing some selfish human tendency. I honestly think the best thing to do is drop it for now, remain a bit distant, and then re-visit the subject if it truly bothers you. Wait a couple of days and then say "You know, I'm still a bit disturbed about your comment regarding the sex tape thing. Is that really, truly how you feel? It really causes me to question my trust in you." I can't remember, Tigress. How long have you been with him? It's been almost 4 months. Aside from a few hiccups, including this one, things have been great. I kind of have to give it to him for being honest with me but at the same time, like Kamille said, I know now that he has a price. I had even asked him, "What if we were still friends after we were broken up? What then? Would you still do it?" He still answered that he would. THAT really makes me shiver, because it doesn't seem like a huge leap from doing it while we're friends and broken up, to doing it while we're still together.
SmileFace Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 All he did was tell you the truth. You guys are learning about each other. It is a relationship. You guys aren't going to agree on everything. If this is something you feel so strong about that you think it means you guys should break up, go ahead. However a break won't help anything. It will not change his opinion on this matter. Like someone else said he isn't sorry for what he said but sorry because he hurt you. Which I think is great that he wouldn't change his opinion because it hurt you. All the best
heartshaped Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 I've kept up with your threads about this guy from the beginning even if I didn't comment on them all. I think you've been looking for a reason to get out of this relationship from the beginning. You want to find something that justifies your insecurities. You are acting as if he has actually betrayed you. He made a comment on a situation that is highly unlikely to ever take place. There's also a huge difference between what people say they would do and what they would actually do. No one can predict how they would act in a certain situation unless they are actually in it. Believe it or not, everyone has their price. He was just a little too forthcoming about his.
Author tigressA Posted June 1, 2011 Author Posted June 1, 2011 omg - those of you pointing out that the tapes wouldn't be worth millions because TA isn't a celebrity - you are totally missing the point. It's the principle of the exchange. Principles are the goods between the slices that make or break a sammich. TA, I'd be offended, put off, disgusted, floored, repulsed... all of these things. After he sweats, I'd say 'splain that you understand he was coming from a *practical* perspective and that, often, practicality conflicts with integrity. Maybe you can offer him an alternative way of thinking about it (your way ). At the crossroads of US 61 and US 49, which way would he go? That is what you're talking about there - interpersonal integrity - and it's scary if he'd sell it to get cozy in the world. Pretty damn shallow. Nonetheless, I think he was just being a dull-a$$ dunce. He probably thought it was cute. It sounds like you may be a little deeper than he is, but then too, perhaps it was just a shallow moment. I bet he's thinking about it now. Thank you. This explains how I have been feeling so well. I'm sure he is thinking about it now--he had a lot of trouble falling asleep again last night. Mme. Chaucer--yeah, I would say it's our first "real" fight. We had a couple other disagreements but they were never anything like this because we always made up really quickly, like within the hour. Things are still really chilly between us now.
EasyHeart Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 Goodness, if I broke up with everyone I ever had a philosophical disagreement with, I would be dateless, relationship-less and friendless. You can't agree on everything. And if you did, you'd get pretty bored. All you should take from his answer is "Well, I guess we won't be making any sex tapes." And what you're teaching him to do by reacting the way you did is "Never tell me the truth. Always tell me what I want to hear or I will punish you".
Art_Critic Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 At the very least... you learned not to ever make any sex vids with him I think he should get a pass.. so should you. Smileface makes a very good point where she says you can't agree on everything.. who can ? I think you are feeling insulted that he wouldn't protect those vids the same way you would.. well.. he isn't you.. You really should look hard and long at why you are upset at this.. it seems a little like you are looking for an out.. He was being honest.. he could have lied and told you what you wanted to hear but doing that would have been a character flaw.. being honest isn't a flaw.
Mme. Chaucer Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 Also, look at how you are handling your first real fight. As I said, I do understand your feelings ... but you really are teaching him how being honest with you is a terrible idea, as posted above. I think you should forgive him for what he said and the belief behind it as long as his actual behavior towards you in daily life is what you need and want. Unless you really are looking for an escape route.
kiss_andmakeup Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 And what you're teaching him to do by reacting the way you did is "Never tell me the truth. Always tell me what I want to hear or I will punish you". This is a great point. I guess a good way to look at it is - would you rather he have lied?
carhill Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 Interesting... Read the thread title - What? She's got to be overreacting Opened the thread - That guy's an idiot. Learned more about attraction. Hope it works out.
Author tigressA Posted June 1, 2011 Author Posted June 1, 2011 Yeah, you all are right about the honesty stuff. I don't want him to start routinely BS-ing me. He is a wonderful guy apart from this incident. I'm not looking for an escape route. As I said in my OP, I was not and am not thinking of breaking up...just getting away for a bit. I miss my family, I'm unemployed and no prospects have come up, so it had been on my mind the last few days. Then this happens.
Mme. Chaucer Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 Well, going to visit your family because it's what you really want to do does not have to be a "vacation from this relationship." It can be just a regular little ... vacation. I'm thinking that some other things might be at play here - you're unemployed, living with the boyfriend, you might be getting a little stir crazy and / or feeling uneasy about a level of dependence that's not comfortable? How are you spending your time?
Author tigressA Posted June 1, 2011 Author Posted June 1, 2011 Well, going to visit your family because it's what you really want to do does not have to be a "vacation from this relationship." It can be just a regular little ... vacation. I'm thinking that some other things might be at play here - you're unemployed, living with the boyfriend, you might be getting a little stir crazy and / or feeling uneasy about a level of dependence that's not comfortable? How are you spending your time? Yes. Oh f*ck, yes. I hate it! He's been wonderfully patient, more so than I have been. He knows it'll take awhile sometimes to find work--he was unemployed for 6 months at one point. He doesn't expect or even want me to contribute anything (I had to fight him to alternate paying for groceries!), especially now because I have a negative cash flow--but I can't stand being so dependent. There's nothing I can do about it though. It will be the same no matter where I am until I get a job. I spend much of my time applying for jobs, online and IRL. I go out for walks. I clean. I read. I go to the gym. I just...try to stay occupied.
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