Mike B. Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 I'm amused at this assertion as I usually have no less than 3 women interested in me at any given time and I usually don't have to pay for their company. However, more power to you if you want to do so. You take her out to a nice dinner and then she can come out and party with my friends and I afterward. She'll still end up in my bed in the morning. Here is your chest thumping, Mrlonelyone. Just look around you, buddy. You and your cheap buddies are not the ones who are leaving the scene with the women or sleeping with them. You can save that tale for another book.
Feelsgoodman Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 The role as a man can never be outdated. No matter what they are calling it these days as far as hanging out or whatever. The concept is the same. A man is hooking up with a woman. Being born in the 70s is not far from being born in the 80s and men born in the 70s do date women born in the 80s too. I agree that the role of a man can never be outdated. However, the role of a man is not to provide free entertainment to single women - it's to provide resources and protection to his family. The concept of buying women's attention with gifts and entertainment is a fairly recent phenomenon in human history. Up until the industrial revolution, there was really no such thing as dating. Taking a woman to a bar or tavern (there were no restaurants back then) would have been unthinkable, as women of good character were not supposed to frequent such places. In fact, the only women to be found at such establishments were whores. Also, buying gifts to a woman was pretty unusual, as most ordinary people had a hard enough time making ends meet, so wasting money on such impractical things as gifts was not a luxury they could afford. In fact, it was a man who was expected to a receive a "gift" - a dowry from the bride's family - to help him with establishing the new household. That's how things were for the vast majority of people up until the Victorian Era. With the advent of the industrial revolution, the disposable income of ordinary people started to rise. At approximately the same time, clever entrepreneurs started thinking of ways to help the ordinary folk spend this newfound wealth. And that was when the concept of "courtship", which initially developed among the idle aristocratic class as a way of fighting boredom, was sold to the masses who bought it hook, line and sinker. To summarize, the idea that a man is supposed to buy the attention of single women with material goods is a byproduct of capitalism. It's neither natural to the human species nor has it been a widely accepted practice for much of our history. You have to man up and pay for your dates. If you can't pay for your dates then you lose out to those who can. It's survival of the fittest. Alpha male beats out beta male. Alpha male shows that he is a provider and can feed his family. Beta male stands with his mouth open, points a finger towards the gaping whole, and says feed me. Chest pumping rhetoric aside, there is nothing alpha in being a walking wallet for a woman who will after a few dates tell you that you are such a nice guy and that she'd love to be friends with you. This is typical beta male behaviour. Real alpha males attract women by default; they don't need to buy female attention.
Feelsgoodman Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 I'm amused at this assertion as I usually have no less than 3 women interested in me at any given time and I usually don't have to pay for their company. However, more power to you if you want to do so. You take her out to a nice dinner and then she can come out and party with my friends and I afterward. She'll still end up in my bed in the morning. As I said before, guys who feel that it's their MANLY DUTY to pay for women usually have deep seated insecurity issues. They think they have nothing of value to offer to the female sex other than what's in their wallets.
Sanman Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 (edited) I'm amused you guys think that these woman are so cheap or that I am broke. For record, I'm a doctor and most of the women I date/ hangout with are also early career professionals or graduate students. I just don't feel the need to spend my money on every woman who crosses my path (including a few Victoria Secret models that are friends of a friend). I treat the women I choose to be in a relationship with very well. However, I have loans and rent to pay in NYC and am more concerned with building personal wealth than paying my way through the never ending cycle of women you date in NYC. Edited May 31, 2011 by Sanman
Mike B. Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 Chest pumping rhetoric aside, there is nothing alpha in being a walking wallet for a woman who will after a few dates tell you that you are such a nice guy and that she'd love to be friends with you. This is typical beta male behaviour. Real alpha males attract women by default; they don't need to buy female attention. New flash: some people have worked hard enough in life to not have to worry about extending their generosity to other through paying for others. I'll even walk over to your table and pay for you and your date's drink since your pockets are looking so much like rabbit ears that you can't even pay for a woman on a date.
thatone Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 I'm amused you guys think that these woman are so cheap or that I am broke. For record, I'm a doctor and most of the women I date/ hangout with are also early career professionals or graduate students. I just don't feel the need to spend my money on every woman who crosses my path (including a few Victoria Secret models that are friends of a friend). I treat the women I choose to be in a relationship with very well. However, I have loans and rent to pay in NYC and am more concerned with building personal wealth than paying my way through the never ending cycle of women you date in NYC. careful you don't pour your BS too deep, you might drown.
Mike B. Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 careful you don't pour your BS too deep, you might drown. Hahahaha! What's with these cheap, broke guys these days. Now they have to be "doctors." As if being part of the top 5% of earners in the world would make you look any better for being broke and cheap on a date.
thatone Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 Hahahaha! What's with these cheap, broke guys these days. Now they have to be "doctors." As if being part of the top 5% of earners in the world would make you look any better for being broke and cheap on a date. yeah they're doctors alright. PHD in internet bullsh*t. it's a popular profession these days.
Sanman Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 careful you don't pour your BS too deep, you might drown. What's the matter can't fathom that people could have it better than you? I really don't care what you believe. I never said I was rich or living the high life. I'm just a lowly resident with a pile of loans. I do have friends on wall street that are and a model friend from high school that is dating a wealthy investment banker (and the son of a Fortune 500 CEO). I also know a lot of teachers and Average Joe types. If you are smart you learn from those in the know. Representing high worth often means you don't have to pay to prove your worth. There are many women out there that still believe the title 'Doctor' suggests wealthy and going to a nice club means you have dough to burn.
Feelsgoodman Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 New flash: some people have worked hard enough in life to not have to worry about extending their generosity to other through paying for others. I'll even walk over to your table and pay for you and your date's drink since your pockets are looking so much like rabbit ears that you can't even pay for a woman on a date. While I admire your generous spirit, I'd feel bad taking money from a mentally handicapped person (either that or you are being deliberately obtuse in failing to get the very simple point that I and others were making).
Mike B. Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 yeah they're doctors alright. PHD in internet bullsh*t. it's a popular profession these days. I see. In that case, I am intergalactic cop. I am taking collections on behalf of the intergalactic police to help these guys treat a woman out on a date. I don't know if I can raise enough to pay for the PHD internet bulls---t school loans but I will give it a try.
Mrlonelyone Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 I have no problem with this assertion. However, I rarely ask a woman out without getting some input from her. So, if I ask her out but she suggests the restaurant she wants to try and I agree....who should pay? Then it's a negotiation. I would say that if you ask her out to get a Polish at a hotdog stand and go for a walk..... then she says she wants to go out for Lobster thermadore and see a show downtown... and you agree without any complaint.. you pay. If she however demands the much more expensive date and will not budge tell her she's paying. If she does not like that and bails on you then to hell with her... that would be classic gold digger attitude. @MikeB. People like me are living proof that acting macho is not the only way to attract women. Even the most hard core 100% homosexual male has had women hit on and pursue him.
Mike B. Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 While I admire your generous spirit, I'd feel bad taking money from a mentally handicapped person (either that or you are being deliberately obtuse in failing to get the very simple point that I and others were making). No it's ok. You will even need help from the mentally handicap community. We all got your back. Tell all of those women in your bed to don't leave just yet. The check is in the mail.
thatone Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 There are many women out there that still believe the title 'Doctor' suggests wealthy and going to a nice club means you have dough to burn. which invalidates your argument and proves ours. the only difference in me and you is you have a title in front of your name to use. i have plot plans and amortizations laying around.
Mike B. Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 @MikeB. People like me are living proof that acting macho is not the only way to attract women. Even the most hard core 100% homosexual male has had women hit on and pursue him. Ok, Mrlonelyone. You've made your point. I heard it.
Sanman Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 Haha, listen guys I could care less what you want to spend your money on. I've seen it all and learned from actual millionaires and Average Joes. My dad is a very generous guy who likes to treat people and show off just like you guys. He has a good job but I grew up middle class. My uncle (an actual millionaire) does not do this despite the fact that he cleared $300-$500k every year as a managing partner in a plastic surgery practice before retirement. He did gift his children a million dollars each though. My best friend (who earns $200k plus in the tech sector) wears the cheapest clothes I have seen and does not treat anyone to anything. They learned the importance of saving and investing over spending their cash.
Feelsgoodman Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 @MikeB. People like me are living proof that acting macho is not the only way to attract women. Even the most hard core 100% homosexual male has had women hit on and pursue him. A woman would be more likely to develop romantic interest in a homosexual than a credit card waving, beta male supplicator. They sure make great friends though!
Sanman Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 which invalidates your argument and proves ours. the only difference in me and you is you have a title in front of your name to use. i have plot plans and amortizations laying around. It really does not. I never said that some women were not attracted to powerful men. I simply said I don't need to pay for women in order to date them. Hell, the last woman I went out with is a surgical resident who just accepted a job offer (in a part of the country I would never live) for $500k/yr after she finishes next year. She could care less if I payed for her. She wants an equal not someone to woo her and 'take care' of her. She is quite capable of taking care of herself. I never needed to spend money on her to impress her. In fact, she offered to take care of me if I moved there since her salary would be more than double mine even after we both finish. There are also many women who want nothing more than to be housewives and are looking to land a rich husband. Those are the ones won over by my title and that I do not view as more than fling material. I don't need to buy them fancy dinners because they usually think there is plenty of money to be had in the future.
carhill Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 Carhill, this was not a first date. He already treated her to 2-3 dates. This was a 4th date if I am not mistaken and it did not seem too expensive. Correct. Their earlier dates were 'coffee' dates. This one was significant in the fact that it was their first 'dinner date'. Hence I identified it that way. OP, is that not correct? To me, it would explain some of the ambivalence of the OP, given her dating partner was 'stepping up' the seriousness of the dating dynamic and then springing 'dutch' on her at a late point in the process. I personally don't see it as a serious issue, but she did post a thread on it, so apparently she does. I think it's resolvable with clear communication. Hope so.
musemaj11 Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 So before anyone rags on me for this...let me clarify. I DO NOT have a problem contributing money to dates. AT ALL. I have been dating this guy a few weeks...on our first date...we went to a bar. He opened up a tab with his card...paid for our first drink...then I paid for the next 2...then him the next one. When I pulled out cash to pay for the drinks...he was not mad...but he definitely didn't want me to pay. But I thought it was only fair... The next couple of dates...he paid.(I offered money for one of the dates but he said no) We really just went out for coffee or drinks though. Last night...we went out for drinks again...and we were going to go to a movie. When the check came...he said "I think we should split this." It was maybe $40-45. I didn't have a problem paying my half...at all. I guess I was a little bit thrown off that he ASKED. Is this weird? I don't know if we are just at a more comfortable place where he felt it was ok. I don't know exactly what his financial situation is...and I feel like it is too soon to ask. I felt a little strange after he asked me just because I was so surprised. And like I said...I don't have a problem paying...but usually I offer...I'm not asked. Just want to get some thoughts on this....thanks guys! So you want the two of you to play that game forever? You know him pretending to want to pay and then you offer in every date? After a few weeks you guys should already be comfortable with each other.
Mike B. Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 A woman would be more likely to develop romantic interest in a homosexual than a credit card waving, beta male supplicator. They sure make great friends though! Oh and I guess you found this out through all of those women that make it to your bed. Wake up. No ones actually there. You were too stingy so they didn't actually make it to the bed. It's called not being stingy and knowing how to man up and treat a woman out. Some of us like to share with others and man up on dates. Boys should stay at home!
Mrlonelyone Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 Sanman No ones talking about millions. Singvoice is talking about a $45 to $50 bill at a bar/club not flying to Paris on the concorde* for lunch for lunch, then to London's high street for shopping and back. We're talking about drinks. *I know they don't fly concorde anymore. But in the day that was the fantasy flight. NYC to Paris or London and back in time for dinner. Were talking about buying drinks.
Feelsgoodman Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 It really does not. I never said that some women were not attracted to powerful men. I simply said I don't need to pay for women in order to date them. Hell, the last woman I went out with is a surgical resident who just accepted a job offer (in a part of the country I would never live) for $500k/yr after she finishes next year. She could care less if I payed for her. She wants an equal not someone to woo her and 'take care' of her. She is quite capable of taking care of herself. I never needed to spend money on her to impress her. In fact, she offered to take care of me if I moved there since her salary would be more than double mine even after we both finish. There are also many women who want nothing more than to be housewives and are looking to land a rich husband. Those are the ones won over by my title and that I do not view as more than fling material. I don't need to buy them fancy dinners because they usually think there is plenty of money to be had in the future. Sanman, you are fighting a losing battle. For some of these guys, the idea of a woman wanting to be with them "free of charge" is so radical, it's literally beyond the scope of their comprehension.
Mrlonelyone Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 @Feels good man. Well if they are the kind of women who want a challenge. Not. They just saw men who took good care of themselves, and had their crap together. The women who show interest in a tranny like me have a more bicurious vibe going on or they are flexible lesbians. Women are good about being much more flexible than men when it comes to these things. That's at the cost of much of the BS women put you through. Indeed the simplicity of relationships with men is the reason why a word that used to mean happy, gay, now means homosexual male. You are right though women are not ALL about being taken care of and blah blah blah. However even such women still want a man who can take care of himself. They don't want to take care of a man. Which brings me to the point.. Sing Voice. Odds are you are over thinking this issue. Just do the three F's I told you about and It'll all work out.
Sanman Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 Sanman No ones talking about millions. Singvoice is talking about a $45 to $50 bill at a bar/club not flying to Paris on the concorde* for lunch for lunch, then to London's high street for shopping and back. We're talking about drinks. *I know they don't fly concorde anymore. But in the day that was the fantasy flight. NYC to Paris or London and back in time for dinner. Were talking about buying drinks. I'm aware, but look at it this way: $50 a date 1 date a week $50 x 52 wks = $2600 That is $2600 per year as long as I am single that I would be investing. Even conservatively, over 40 years, you could tack two zeros on the end of that figure by retirement http://www.dailyworth.com/posts/437--50-Week-x-45-Years-1-Million
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