Star Gazer Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 Right, like break up wouldn't cross your mind if an SO said "We need to talk tomorrow". It would cross mine and my attachment style is secure. And because you said it, it must be so? With everything else this guy said immediately before and after that one little comment, there's absolutely nothing to lead a reasonably secure person to think a breakup is on the horizon. "Please ask for your time off for our trip. We should talk tonight." Planning a trip does NOT equal breakup. I mean, really.
OliveOyl Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 Right, like break up wouldn't cross your mind if an SO said "We need to talk tomorrow". It would cross mine and my attachment style is secure. I agree. "We need to talk" is usually a bad sign. He might not have meant it that way but I think he should have known otherwise . If I wanted to talk with my guy about something other than a problem or breakup, I would have phrased it like, "Hey, there's something I want to chat with you about." I think the fact that he phrased it that way, even if there was no intention whatsoever of breaking up, was manipulative.
threebyfate Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 I agree. "We need to talk" is usually a bad sign. He might not have meant it that way but I think he should have known otherwise . If I wanted to talk with my guy about something other than a problem or breakup, I would have phrased it like, "Hey, there's something I want to chat with you about." I think the fact that he phrased it that way, even if there was no intention whatsoever of breaking up, was manipulative.Why wouldn't he just wait for the next time they're together since according to him "it wasn't important"? Not very considerate, stunned or deliberately manipulative. From the sounds of it, he's not stupid so I agree that it's the latter.
zengirl Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 I think this is where texting sucks, BTW. "We should talk" is so much more ominous in a text. Though if I saw it, I'd totally go, "What about?" or "Okay, call me" then. I don't put talks off. That's the best way I know about not getting anxious over nothing.
eerie_reverie Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 Right, like break up wouldn't cross your mind if an SO said "We need to talk tomorrow". It would cross mine and my attachment style is secure. Yes but he has shown over the course of many weeks that he is really into ES and has been reassuring since the ominous text message. I bet it's about their upcoming trip - maybe some bad news. Maybe he doesn't want ES to go because his friends wanted it to be a guy thing and he doesn't know how to tell her (don't blame him).
threebyfate Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 Yes but he has shown over the course of many weeks that he is really into ES and has been reassuring since the ominous text message. I bet it's about their upcoming trip - maybe some bad news. Maybe he doesn't want ES to go because his friends wanted it to be a guy thing and he doesn't know how to tell her (don't blame him).It doesn't matter what he's shown. That line is a classic break up line and pretty much everyone...besides possibly yourself, is well aware of this. Come on spook. You've had some unusual relationships and situations too and within each situation, haven't exactly acted in what I would call a "secure" or even rational manner. It's kind of shocking to me that now you're holding someone else to a bar you personally can't even meet.
Star Gazer Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 It doesn't matter what he's shown. What? Why not??
Star Gazer Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 I just got a cryptic text from him: "Dumplings King. Tomorrow 7pm. We need to talk." I still fail to see how you can still interpret that as a "break up threat" given what he said in the short period afterward: I couldn't help it so I texted again "No kiss back for me? :(" He responded "I am WORKING ES. I will kiss you tomorrow " So I just got this e-mail from him: BTW my darling, I loved the song - I have never heard it before. I hope you had a nice day. I have to ask you something. I need to get a new passport and I know that you travel a lot. How should I go about this? He has sent me the following text: "Hey beautiful, what do you think about inviting John and his girlfriend to Dumplings King - or did you want it to be just the two of us?" I said: "That's cool but I thought you wanted to talk about something?" Him: "Nah, it's nothing important - we can do it another time." Me: "OK" Him: "Why one word answer? I sense some distance. Is it because I didn't send you a kiss back?" Me....(haven't responded yet), perhaps I will in a few hours Yeah, that sounds like a guy who wants to break up alright. Says he wants to talk, and then showers you with reassurance.
eerie_reverie Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 It doesn't matter what he's shown. That line is a classic break up line and pretty much everyone...besides possibly yourself, is well aware of this. Come on spook. You've had some unusual relationships and situations too and within each situation, haven't exactly acted in what I would call a "secure" or even rational manner. It's kind of shocking to me that now you're holding someone else to a bar you personally can't even meet. Yah, but I date ashsoles. ES's bf seems like a good stable guy.
threebyfate Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 Yah, but I date ashsoles. ES's bf seems like a good stable guy.Even the ones who appear "good" or "stable" can be jack-offs underneath. You might be surprised who they are. Been fooled myself a few times so being cautious is better than being jacked off. And realistically, neither you or I know him from a hole in the ground, only how we perceive ES's perception of him which might also be coloured by how he wishes to project himself. Add that all up together and you and I know dick about him. Time tells better than a few tidbits of information.
Star Gazer Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 Even the ones who appear "good" or "stable" can be jack-offs underneath. Add that all up together and you and I know dick about him. Time tells better than a few tidbits of information. Why is it not okay for anyone to give him the benefit of the doubt, but okay for you to be totally, unjustifiably suspicious to the point of calling him names?
zengirl Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 Even the ones who appear "good" or "stable" can be jack-offs underneath. You might be surprised who they are. Been fooled myself a few times so being cautious is better than being jacked off. And realistically, neither you or I know him from a hole in the ground, only how we perceive ES's perception of him which might also be coloured by how he wishes to project himself. Add that all up together and you and I know dick about him. Time tells better than a few tidbits of information. And I think even people who misbehave are not necessarily systematically like that in every relationship (some are, but it's rarely so simple as, "Oh, well, that guy was a jackoff"). I also think if you suspect/worry someone will be a jerk, they're WAY more likely to be one. That's just life, IMO. And I'm also confused -- breaking up with someone does not equal misbehaving (assuming you don't do it on a Post It, etc). Would someone be a jerk, in your eyes, just because they broke up with ES or anyone for that matter? (I'm not saying I *want* that to happen or that I wouldn't feel bad for ES, but I don't see why there has to be some clear right/wrong distinction.) Most of the time when a relationship breaks down, both people did some things right and wrong. And by "wrong" I don't simply mean "Picking a crappy person." That all seems very oversimplified.
threebyfate Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 And I think even people who misbehave are not necessarily systematically like that in every relationship (some are, but it's rarely so simple as, "Oh, well, that guy was a jackoff"). I also think if you suspect/worry someone will be a jerk, they're WAY more likely to be one. That's just life, IMO. And I'm also confused -- breaking up with someone does not equal misbehaving (assuming you don't do it on a Post It, etc). Would someone be a jerk, in your eyes, just because they broke up with ES or anyone for that matter? (I'm not saying I *want* that to happen or that I wouldn't feel bad for ES, but I don't see why there has to be some clear right/wrong distinction.) Most of the time when a relationship breaks down, both people did some things right and wrong. And by "wrong" I don't simply mean "Picking a crappy person." That all seems very oversimplified.The post quoted was solely to address spook's dichotomy of jack off vs. good, stable guy. Quite often people break up due to incompatibility.
Star Gazer Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 And I think even people who misbehave are not necessarily systematically like that in every relationship (some are, but it's rarely so simple as, "Oh, well, that guy was a jackoff"). I also think if you suspect/worry someone will be a jerk, they're WAY more likely to be one. That's just life, IMO. And I'm also confused -- breaking up with someone does not equal misbehaving (assuming you don't do it on a Post It, etc). Would someone be a jerk, in your eyes, just because they broke up with ES or anyone for that matter? (I'm not saying I *want* that to happen or that I wouldn't feel bad for ES, but I don't see why there has to be some clear right/wrong distinction.) Most of the time when a relationship breaks down, both people did some things right and wrong. And by "wrong" I don't simply mean "Picking a crappy person." That all seems very oversimplified. Great post.
eerie_reverie Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 (edited) Even the ones who appear "good" or "stable" can be jack-offs underneath. You might be surprised who they are. Been fooled myself a few times so being cautious is better than being jacked off. And realistically, neither you or I know him from a hole in the ground, only how we perceive ES's perception of him which might also be coloured by how he wishes to project himself. Add that all up together and you and I know dick about him. Time tells better than a few tidbits of information. I know it's not all black and white, but good guys don't reassure you just to dump you as soon as they get the chance. I've dated plenty of dicks and even dicks don't do that. And, IMO, ES's bf has demonstrated himself to be a good guy so far. He has even sensed her tenseness and let her know they were ok! However, predicting ES's next move, I think she will dump him preemptively so we will never know what he wanted to talk about. Edited June 1, 2011 by eerie_reverie
threebyfate Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 I know it's not all black and white, but good guys don't reassure you just to dump you as soon as they get the chance. I've dated plenty of dicks and even dicks don't do that. And, IMO, ES's bf has demonstrated himself to be a good guy so far. He has even sensed her tenseness and let her know they were ok! However, predicting ES's next move, I think she will dump him preemptively so we will never know what he wanted to talk about.It's possible he's a decent person. It's also possible he's not. Either way, whatever you believe him to be, is all in your imagination and from the sounds of it, quite a fertile imagination. So out of your imagination, you've cast ES as "bad" and "insecure" and this guy who you know nothing about, as the "good" fairy. Now how bad is that.
utterer of lies Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 Would someone be a jerk, in your eyes, just because they broke up with ES or anyone for that matter? (I'm not saying I *want* that to happen or that I wouldn't feel bad for ES, but I don't see why there has to be some clear right/wrong distinction.) This guy is a saint, because despite all the drama the ES conjures constantly, he still seems to care for her, a lot. So out of your imagination, you've cast ES as "bad" and "insecure" and this guy who you know nothing about, as the "good" fairy. Now how bad is that. Did you even her ES' threads? She's the paragon of insecurity, and whenever she's convinced that something is wrong, she will write she never felt something for him and all this stuff. I had some insecure girlfriends, but I would never accept such behavior.
Kamille Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 I think now would be around date time (although, I kind of have no idea about the time zones). Hope it goes well ES! In thinking about it more, I wonder if his "We need to talk" was meant to be discuss the issues you both raised (daily contact / more compliments) in person. If bf and I had a conversation like that via phone or email, I would want to touch base in person after. Here's hoping for the best ES!
Star Gazer Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 So out of your imagination, you've cast ES as "bad" and "insecure"... It doesn't take ANY imagination to determine that ES is insecure. Do YOU actually think she's secure?
zengirl Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 The post quoted was solely to address spook's dichotomy of jack off vs. good, stable guy. Quite often people break up due to incompatibility. Okay, understandable, just didn't take your meaning. It just seems to me like you (often---not just here) label every guy ES goes out with a jerk . . . when I've no evidence they actually are. Nor do I think she's some sort of awful jerk either. Mostly, I think things are more complicated than that is all.
vsmini Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 This guy is a saint, because despite all the drama the ES conjures constantly, he still seems to care for her, a lot. Did you even her ES' threads? She's the paragon of insecurity, and whenever she's convinced that something is wrong, she will write she never felt something for him and all this stuff. I had some insecure girlfriends, but I would never accept such behavior. I have to agree with this. I would hope most men wouldn't accept this kind of behavior.
vsmini Posted June 1, 2011 Posted June 1, 2011 And the plot thickens. He has sent me the following text: "Hey beautiful, what do you think about inviting John and his girlfriend to Dumplings King - or did you want it to be just the two of us?" I said: "That's cool but I thought you wanted to talk about something?" Him: "Nah, it's nothing important - we can do it another time." Me: "OK" Him: "Why one word answer? I sense some distance. Is it because I didn't send you a kiss back?" Me....(haven't responded yet), perhaps I will in a few hours I seriously don't know what his deal is. Did he want to break up and then had a change of heart? F... this. This is all over text? You say OK and then he has an issue with that being a "one word answer" You guys are both on each other's backs for the dumbest, most meaningless things. You're both feeding the monster.
Author Eternal Sunshine Posted June 2, 2011 Author Posted June 2, 2011 We met up after work. The other couple couldn't make it but his brother wanted to join us. We all had dinner and then went to some bar for a drink. Conversation was good, lots of laughs but fairly generic. Obviously, nothing could really be talked about in front of his brother. By the time his brother left, it was midnight. Boyfriend asked me to take a walk and we ended up sitting on a bench and talking for couple of hours. Kamille called it right He wanted to talk about our issues in person. He said that since he hasn't been in a relationship for a few years, that he is still adjusting. I told him how lack of contact makes me feel. He apologized and asked me to give him a chance to fix it. He again told me how much he likes me and how lucky he feels to have met me. That I have all the qualities he is looking for and that I am "extraordinary" and again that he is quite serious about us. He mentioned marriage again and said that he can see me as his future wife. We didn't really argue as he basically agreed to all my terms in regards to contact and seeing each other. We ended up making out for a long time too He also did something really sweet. I had a suit jacket on only (as when I dressed for work at 7am it was quite sunny). He had a proper jacket and he took it off and gave it to me. He was shivering the entire time we talked. I am still skeptical if he will follow through with everything. Today, he went overboard with contact and was in touch every hour telling me romantic things and sending me love songs. Obviously, that can't be sustained. I guess time will tell if he will do everyday contact like we agreed. We have plans to spend Saturday and Sunday together. I feel like things went well but I am still cautious. I guess time will tell.
zengirl Posted June 2, 2011 Posted June 2, 2011 I am still skeptical if he will follow through with everything. Today, he went overboard with contact and was in touch every hour telling me romantic things and sending me love songs. Obviously, that can't be sustained. I guess time will tell if he will do everyday contact like we agreed. Isn't the fact that he's offered to try and WANTS to make you happy more important than if he misses a day here and there? Couldn't you meet him halfway and accept that sometimes he might not be perfect in the every-day contact thing like you want, but that he's heard what you need and is trying? I think if you could do that, you could both lessen your anxiety over his potential slips in the future AND be more likely to have things work out, long-run.
Kamille Posted June 2, 2011 Posted June 2, 2011 Kamille called it right He wanted to talk about our issues in person. This is one instance where I love being right! So happy it was that simple ES. I like that he's a pretty solid guy who doesn't question the relationship at every turn. That's definitely the kind of guy you need ES, at least until you feel confident enough to stop putting the whole relationship in question every time you hit a snag. (It'll come. You already did pretty good this time managing your impulses to call it quits.) Isn't the fact that he's offered to try and WANTS to make you happy more important than if he misses a day here and there? Couldn't you meet him halfway and accept that sometimes he might not be perfect in the every-day contact thing like you want, but that he's heard what you need and is trying? I think if you could do that, you could both lessen your anxiety over his potential slips in the future AND be more likely to have things work out, long-run. I totally agree with Zengirl. Yet again, your bf has pulled through and shown his commitment. He's taken time to discuss the issue and reassure you. That, to me, is as significant as him following him through on his actions. Again, happy it worked out :bunny:.
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