jayinblue Posted June 2, 2011 Posted June 2, 2011 Evaluating a situation--giving up an OM--as a "loss" instead of as a "gain" isn't the expression of a "feeling." It is a value-judgment on the part of one's intellect, not one's emotions. If the marriage is valued more highly than the affair, then giving up the affair and the OM to work on the marriage is a "gain," not a "loss." It has nothing to do with any emotions being felt. It is the way the person chooses to intellectually frame the experience. I disagree, they are two different things. A "loss" is just that, a feeling of a missed connection or something that you once had which is now gone. While something might ultimately be a "gain" later on (even in that moment) that doesn't change the feeling of loss. This to me is just verbal judo, which does nothing to but disconnect you from how you are feeling. It might be more appropriate to say she feels good about making a positive change, but nonetheless feels a loss of some components of the relationship she had with the OM. I get the power of "positive thinking," - I've been listening to Tony Robbins like crazy too, but I think that particular understanding comes in time. The head is usually much faster than the heart, IMO. At least that's what I've noticed. It may make a person feel bad to give up the OM, but that is still not a "loss." It is still a "gain." In MANY situations in life, we have to experience "the pain" to achieve a "gain." We have to make what seems to be a sacrifice "in the now" to achieve a goal. Giving up the OM is a positive achievement, hence a "gain," and therefore should be perceived as a "gain," not as a "loss." The fact that some bad feelings may be associated with it makes no difference--it's like having a few hunger pangs because you finally went on a diet that you needed to in order to lose some excess weight. Cheaters need to realize that the goal of everything in life isn't immediate personal gratification, and it's not a "loss" to put other values ahead of immediate gratification, it's a "gain." It's called "growing up." While there are people who enter into the "immediate gratification" mindset, there really are a couple of things being said here, and I think you'd do a disservice by being so narrow in your thinking. Saying it another way, to use your example above, the person on a diet still has the hunger pains, knows what is causing them, but decides not to act on them because of the belief that the "gain" later will make it worth it. Whether someone ultimately perceives what is going on as a gain, it doesn't change the fact of the hunger pains. The sad truth is that affairs start for many reasons. I agree that the decision to have an affair is a very poor decision, but I think most people here would agree with me that absent sociopathology, people have needs, and if you're one of the moderate folks, there was something significantly missing from your relationship, either something you aren't contributing or something you aren't receiving in return that sets the stage for an affair to occur. I think given enough time, if two people come to an understanding as to what was missing in the relationship or wasn't being given to the relationship by the person who had the affair, and the relationship is saved with two happy people, then you can have the feeling of "gain" later on. But I don't sincerely believe you would feel "nothing" or would immediately be able to reframe the giving up of someone you cared about (assuming this was true) without noticing and feeling a loss. I think the idea of intectualizing the loss as a "gain" distances you from your feelings, which is what probably caused the relationship problems in the first place. Feeling the loss, exploring the loss, and then processing the loss seems to be the best way to do it, at least from everything I've read, but I won't proclaim to be an expert on this subject. No one is "hating" on her. Really? People get burned alive on this board. I've been seeing it too, and we can cite examples from your own posts on this thread (including people who aren't Janey).
BB07 Posted June 2, 2011 Posted June 2, 2011 Janey, I just wanted to give a shout out to you and a hand raised in voicing my support of you reconciling your marriage. Hang in there! You know what is good advice and what is just someone venting on you. Take what is good and true.......leave the rest. Hugs..........
Author JaneyAmazed Posted June 2, 2011 Author Posted June 2, 2011 Janey As someone who has gone through what you are now experiencing, I can honestly say that you are perfectly reasonable for having such emotions about the ex-OM at this stage. If you felt nothing this early on I would question whether you have actually worked through your thoughts, feelings, motives etc. When you have those feelings, acknowledge that but then take some positive actions to get you through those times. In time, you will find that you no longer have those memories crashing in to your head. As you may know/remember, I still work with the ex-OM. How does he make me feel now? Nothing. He is just a work colleague who I will be polite and professional with but have no personal interaction with him whatsoever. I am just not interested - he has since married someone and that did not bother me in the slightest (except maybe me feeling sorry for her ). I know that what I am experiencing is normal. Thank you for your kind words. It helps to hear from someone who has actually been where I am.
Author JaneyAmazed Posted June 2, 2011 Author Posted June 2, 2011 Janey, I just wanted to give a shout out to you and a hand raised in voicing my support of you reconciling your marriage. Hang in there! You know what is good advice and what is just someone venting on you. Take what is good and true.......leave the rest. Hugs.......... Thank you, BB07. I am heading in the right direction in my marriage. I do know what is good advice, and my head hurts from the bad "advice." It's usually not advice. The good thing is my husband knows I love him. That's what matters.
Author JaneyAmazed Posted June 3, 2011 Author Posted June 3, 2011 I think an OW support forum is the wrong place to mourn the ending of the affair, yes. I think it should be in conjunction with the overall context and that individual counselling would be the best place. Lots of OW here haven't been married, or haven't been the MW or the WS and I think there's a lot for Janey to have to process without getting caught up in all this noise. However, she's not unwelcome here and I've (to my mind) shown her support, so my opinion is as well-intentioned as the next. Silly Girl - You are right. LS helps me sometimes in a time of crisis or when I really need advice from the smart ones here, but sometimes it just makes me dwell on the affair and xOM. I have to know when it's productive to be here and when it's not. Right now I'm thinking of taking a break to see if it helps. I am so comforted by so many people here. There's no one in my real life beside my couselor that I can share such details and raw emotion with, but the downside to that is I spend more time than I probably should thinking about the affair and xOM. I spend too much time trying to explain my posts to people who make assumptions, and it just doesn't help me or anyone else. I need to learn to ignore those posts.
Silly_Girl Posted June 3, 2011 Posted June 3, 2011 Silly Girl - You are right. LS helps me sometimes in a time of crisis or when I really need advice from the smart ones here, but sometimes it just makes me dwell on the affair and xOM. I have to know when it's productive to be here and when it's not. Right now I'm thinking of taking a break to see if it helps. I am so comforted by so many people here. There's no one in my real life beside my couselor that I can share such details and raw emotion with, but the downside to that is I spend more time than I probably should thinking about the affair and xOM. I spend too much time trying to explain my posts to people who make assumptions, and it just doesn't help me or anyone else. I need to learn to ignore those posts. When you figure out the bolded, let me know?! :laugh: Seriously though, DO use the ignore button. It's really useful. I don't envy your position. Perhaps my experience of an affair isn't as extreme as some posters who have harrowing stories of manipulation and lies, but I do know only too well what a shattered heart feels like. As well as the hurt, I found the confusion/lack of understanding/knowledge on my part difficult. To be attempting to reconcile with another at the same time would be difficult. My counsellor advised me to set aside a 'window' every day to think about the relationship, and the guy, and the rest of the time to simply accept it wasn't appropriate to go off in to a thought bubble.... Perhaps this could help you? It sounds extreme, but if you ARE feeling comfort here you could either perhaps converse by PM only, or have a time limit to being here, or a time set aside and beyond that 'refuse' to engage in those thoughts. It might not help, it helped me. Rather than suppressing or denying, which you might suspect at first, it meant the time I spent was more constructive and valuable, rather than darting thoughts and triggers all over the place. I hope things get better. I am a believer that almost anything can be achieved with hard work, but where people and feelings are concerned there's no guarantees.
TurboGirl Posted June 3, 2011 Posted June 3, 2011 Your perception that it is a "loss" to have given up your OM is what would concern me if I were your spouse. Wow, Kriss. I have read your replies here, and maybe YOU should be posting in the infidelity section, you are quite the opinionated and judgmental one. AND not at all kind or sympathetic. OP - please please ignore the mean judgmental people. OP... ignore the rude judgmental posts and try & get over the loss of your MM. Any ending, even a positive one, will be a grieving process. The guy was part of your life, so you have to get over that he isn't there anymore. It's going to take some time for you to get over this. Part of it is looking inside yourself to see why/what is missing that caused you to want to have an A. Difficult to look in there, I know. I am in the process of that now. However... stay the course and don't look back. As time passes you will feel better about yourself and confident that you are headed in the right direction (away from the MM).
Mimolicious Posted June 3, 2011 Posted June 3, 2011 I feel like I got attacked here recently when I say what's on my mind if it has anything at all to do with xOM. It's only been 4 months. I'm still working on my marriage and I'm still moving forward. I've still maintained NC. I still have feelings for xOM sometimes and it hurts because I still grieve the loss. I can't help that, but I can help what I say and do. I'm just trying to heal. Now if I'm still like this 2 years from now, then you should worry about me! I don't dwell on xOM or pine after him. When I said my H is my prize, I was referring to what DonnaMaybe said, "Keep you eye on the prize." You can take what you want to from my posts, but I'm just being honest. I'm not going to pretend like I'm completely over xOM. I know I will be eventually. This is a long process and it helps me to post things on LS and to hear other stories. I've had a tough week and I don't always think clearly. My H got mad at me yesterday and that didn't help things. I don't even know what the future holds, but I'm heading in the right direction, not the wrong. That's all that matters now. (((JANEA))) You're a strong cookie and don't worry, one day you will look back and laugh at all of this. Time heals and you are one step ahead already! Heading in the right direction for YOU and that's what matters. I wish I had a fairy wand and can make your pain go away but I know that soon enough you will be in a better place. xoxo!
Mimolicious Posted June 3, 2011 Posted June 3, 2011 Thanks everyone. Gosh, I sound so defensive in that post. I replied to East in the other thread that I'm hurting, an I really am. I think I need to learn not to post when I'm in this frame of mind. I actually felt like my husband might leave me last night and it messed me up big time, and then to see xOM in traffic. I was like please LORD! Why is all this happening to me! Why? How I can I be so strong sometimes and then so damn weak sometimes. How can I be proud of my progress one day and then feel like it was all for nothing another day? I've told other people on LS not to take things personally and than I do it too! When I'm feeling strong, I don't take things personally. When I'm feeling weak, I take everything to heart. I'm sorry about that. I'm sorry if I sound like a crazy woman most of the time. Maybe I am. Snowflower, thank you for all you've said to help. Janey, remember that the "Lord" (not sure how much you believe in him) doesn't send you something you can't handle. With the trial, he also sends you the way out. You may think is all conincidential but there is a meaning for everything. Hard part is figuring that "meaning" out. Perhaps, you have to fully shatter to be born again, free of guilt and pain?! Maybe your strength is being put through the test to see if you will endure it or you will flake? The Lord never forsakes... Even the strongest person has weaknesses. Remember, you are human with emotions and a beating heart, you will break but the real test is getting up again. You are already in your merry way babes. Be well. DON'T GIVE UP! YOU CAN DO THIS!!! THIS IS NOTHING!!!! You'll see!
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