Is ignorance bliss?

[JaneyAmazed]

Nope no difference at all...living a lie, being exposed to diseases, bunny boilers and making choices for the future based on partial info...limits the options for breaking away when the lie is exposed. But hey....

 

 

This is so important, Bent. I found out a year or so later after my parents split that my dad had been exposed to HPV and gave it to my mom. She of course didn't find out until years later. She had all kinds of problems with her cervix and bad pap smears and couldn't figure it out.

People don't even know what they are carrying.

[John Michael Kane]

Sorry please tell me so I can get my dick tested for ravenous diseases, and so I can get a divorce so I can find a better woman. Not going to stay in a crappy marriage and act like it didn't happen and use the kids or finances as an excuse with a skanky tramp.

[Mansman]

You should keep your mouth shut unless you haven't ended the affair. Even if you divorce, I would spare the SO the agony.

[JaneyAmazed]

This is so important, Bent. I found out a year or so later after my parents split that my dad had been exposed to HPV and gave it to my mom. She of course didn't find out until years later. She had all kinds of problems with her cervix and bad pap smears and couldn't figure it out.

People don't even know what they are carrying.

 

 

I meant to add to this...

 

People don't even know what they are carrying. Maybe 20 years ago my dad was ignorant to that fact, but these days with common knowledge of STDs there no excuse to keep a secret that could affect the health of another person. I am disgusted with my own behavior regarding that. I often wonder how much more guilt would be piled on me had I given my husband an STD.

[bentnotbroken]

You should keep your mouth shut unless you haven't ended the affair. Even if you divorce, I would spare the SO the agony.

 

 

Really?

 

This is so important, Bent. I found out a year or so later after my parents split that my dad had been exposed to HPV and gave it to my mom. She of course didn't find out until years later. She had all kinds of problems with her cervix and bad pap smears and couldn't figure it out.

People don't even know what they are carrying.

 

 

So when do you suppose her mom should be spared the agony. Before or after she contracted HPV? Maybe she should be spared the agony even if she could prevent cancer. Been there done that. Spoken like someone who hasn't had to bury someone because of cancer that stems from the HPV virus. What about the woman who is having children with the cheating man? Pregnancies and babies can be put at risk due to STD's. What about the man who catches something from the wife he believes is faithful...maybe he should be spared the agony of getting tested and just let a potential disease take his life. :sick:

[jnj express]

Hey luvbun----did I read you to say---you are considering having your own A

 

You don't for sure know if your wife has been unfaithful---but that doesn't even matter

 

DO NOT STOOP SO LOW AS TO HAVE AN A.

 

that just puts you down on the same level as the cheater----you loose your own way, morally---don't do it----if you want others, get a D., and then go do whatever you wish

[Dust]

Ignorance is not bliss when it comes to some one cheating on you. Bliss is not having your trust abused. Bliss is being with some one who treats others the way they would want to be treated. So, is that what you want for yourself to be cheated on and never know. With that logic it makes doing any hurtful thing ok if you manage to keep it a secret, it’s a sociopathic view in a sense.

[JaneyAmazed]

Really?

 

 

 

 

So when do you suppose her mom should be spared the agony. Before or after she contracted HPV? Maybe she should be spared the agony even if she could prevent cancer. Been there done that. Spoken like someone who hasn't had to bury someone because of cancer that stems from the HPV virus. What about the woman who is having children with the cheating man? Pregnancies and babies can be put at risk due to STD's. What about the man who catches something from the wife he believes is faithful...maybe he should be spared the agony of getting tested and just let a potential disease take his life. :sick:

 

I don't think there was ever a good time, but if she had known earlier at least she would have known what was going on with all those abnormal pap smears. Everything you have said here is so important. I hope what you have said will convince everyone that ignorance is not bliss.

[nyrias]

Very good points. Although the type of person who can carry a secret like that to their grave without allowing it to affect the rest of their life wouldn't be someone I would care to be in a relationship with.

 

See, the problem is that you don't have a choice.

 

If a person is indeed like that, his/her spouse would have no clue. That is the principle of asymmetric information.

 

My point is NOT that this is justification, or make it right.

 

My point is that all relationship is a crap shoot. There is a positive probability that your spouse is such a person (however small) and there is no way you can tell.

 

Heck, if you have pre-knowledge of whether a spouse will stray, there would be no marriage, no A, and this forum would not have existed.

[nyrias]

Nope no difference at all...living a lie, being exposed to diseases, bunny boilers and making choices for the future based on partial info...limits the options for breaking away when the lie is exposed. But hey....

 

I don't think you get the concept of frame of reference.

 

If the BS *knows* it is a lie (and all the bad stuff to come with it), it won't be ignorance.

 

The whole point is that he/she THINKs that it is a perfect marriage. Unless the lie is exposed (which of course makes the BS not ignorant), how could he/she feel any differently than a marriage without an A?

[nyrias]

Ignorance is not bliss when it comes to some one cheating on you. Bliss is not having your trust abused. Bliss is being with some one who treats others the way they would want to be treated. So, is that what you want for yourself to be cheated on and never know. With that logic it makes doing any hurtful thing ok if you manage to keep it a secret, it’s a sociopathic view in a sense.

 

Sigh .. no one is actually getting the logic.

 

Bliss is a state of mind, a psychological state of the world, based on a person's belief.

 

If you do NOT know your spouse cheated, how can you not trust him? You would BELIEVE that he/she is treating you the way you want to be treated.

 

Sure, that belief is false, but you would have no way to know that. If indeed the secret is carried to the grave, you would, wrongly, believe that you live your own life in a good marriage.

 

Now let me ask you this. Logically, if a person lives his/her whole life believing his/her marriage is great, while never discovering his spouse's A, don't you think if you run him/her through some psychological test of well being (like anxiety, days of losing sleep, stress level ...), it will come out BETTER than a person who has discovered his/her spouse A?

 

The question is scientific, not moral. Sure this does not make an A "justifiable". However, i also don't see a way around the conclusion if your are honest about the logic.

[bentnotbroken]

I don't think you get the concept of frame of reference.

 

If the BS *knows* it is a lie (and all the bad stuff to come with it), it won't be ignorance.

 

The whole point is that he/she THINKs that it is a perfect marriage. Unless the lie is exposed (which of course makes the BS not ignorant), how could he/she feel any differently than a marriage without an A?

 

 

I get the frame of reference and I stand by my post.

[nyrias]

I get the frame of reference and I stand by my post.

 

You chose to ignore logic?

[bentnotbroken]

You chose to ignore logic?

 

No I chose to say that my life(and others) was on the line, without my permission. It doesn't matter whether I was (blissfully or otherwise happy)what matters is that when it comes to facing a disease or death....I would have been the one left holding the bag. Would either the WS or AP take on pain and disease for the BS? What would have happened to my children then? I don't (won't) agree with you...let's leave it at that.

[PhoenixRise]

Ignorance does not equal bliss.

 

Even if you never find out specifically about the affair that doesn't mean the affair doesn't impact your life.

 

If you catch a disease from your spouse (all the while believing they are faithful) that impacts your fertility not knowing about the affair didn't keep you blissful and it could mean you can't have children going forward. This happened to a good friend of mine. Not Blissful.

 

If you catch a disease from your spouse (all the while believing they are faithful) that could kill you (HPV can lead to cervical cancer) even if you never find out about the affair, the HPV can still lead to deadly cancer. Not Blissful.

 

In cases like this you could never know about the affair and that ignorance is deadly and/or life changing.

 

However Knowledge will give you the power and ability to make conscious choices about your sexual health. It give you the impetus to request STD testing when you might not otherwise if you falsely believe you are in a monogamous marriage.

 

The only people who benefit from the ignorance of the BS are the AP and the MP.

[bentnotbroken]

Ignorance does not equal bliss.

 

Even if you never find out specifically about the affair that doesn't mean the affair doesn't impact your life.

 

If you catch a disease from your spouse (all the while believing they are faithful) that impacts your fertility not knowing about the affair didn't keep you blissful and it could mean you can't have children going forward. This happened to a good friend of mine. Not Blissful.

 

If you catch a disease from your spouse (all the while believing they are faithful) that could kill you (HPV can lead to cervical cancer) even if you never find out about the affair, the HPV can still lead to deadly cancer. Not Blissful.

 

In cases like this you could never know about the affair and that ignorance is deadly and/or life changing.

 

However Knowledge will give you the power and ability to make conscious choices about your sexual health. It give you the impetus to request STD testing when you might not otherwise if you falsely believe you are in a monogamous marriage.

 

The only people who benefit from the ignorance of the BS are the AP and the MP.

 

 

Yeah...he/she doesn't seem to care much about the sexual health of the blissfully ignorant person. To each their own I guess.

[nyrias]

Ignorance does not equal bliss.

 

Even if you never find out specifically about the affair that doesn't mean the affair doesn't impact your life.

 

If you catch a disease from your spouse (all the while believing they are faithful) that impacts your fertility not knowing about the affair didn't keep you blissful and it could mean you can't have children going forward. This happened to a good friend of mine. Not Blissful.

 

If you catch a disease from your spouse (all the while believing they are faithful) that could kill you (HPV can lead to cervical cancer) even if you never find out about the affair, the HPV can still lead to deadly cancer. Not Blissful.

 

In cases like this you could never know about the affair and that ignorance is deadly and/or life changing.

 

However Knowledge will give you the power and ability to make conscious choices about your sexual health. It give you the impetus to request STD testing when you might not otherwise if you falsely believe you are in a monogamous marriage.

 

The only people who benefit from the ignorance of the BS are the AP and the MP.

 

If you contract a disease, you will no longer be ignorant.

 

Ignorance is defined as the condition that you will never find out, which includes the lack of any physical clues, such as STD. It is, in fact, hard to imagine how a person suddenly diagnosed with STD would be completely "ignorant".

 

Thus, your argument does not make sense.

 

In fact, the best thought example is an EA. Consider a past EA, with absolute no clues, and no trail.

 

If a BS lives to the end of his/her life without knowing it, psychologically, if you test her before her death, is she better off than one who discovered the EA.

[nyrias]

Yeah...he/she doesn't seem to care much about the sexual health of the blissfully ignorant person. To each their own I guess.

 

Nope. See .. that is the kind of judgmental knee-jerk reaction here that completely ignore logic and reasoning. What i care about has nothing to do with the logic of what a ignorant person knows or feel.

 

A ignorant person would NOT be ignorant if he/she knows about himself contracted STD.

 

By definition, he/she will not be ignorant forever, once there is symptoms.

[2sure]

Thing is...ignorance often turns out not to be bliss.

In a relationship, especially a marriage - life decisions are made by each partner solely based upon what is best for the marriage . Life changing decisions and directions.

 

For one spouse to making those decisions without having the truth, the facts, about the marriage...is like taking away their ability to navigate their own life. And we have only one. No one can decide someone else should be blind regardless of the difficulty of the truth.

 

On another note, secrets and betrayals undermine an intimate relationship whether you realize it at the time or not. They are like something being wrong but you just cant put your finger on it.

[JaneyAmazed]

Thing is...ignorance often turns out not to be bliss.

In a relationship, especially a marriage - life decisions are made by each partner solely based upon what is best for the marriage . Life changing decisions and directions.

 

For one spouse to making those decisions without having the truth, the facts, about the marriage...is like taking away their ability to navigate their own life. And we have only one. No one can decide someone else should be blind regardless of the difficulty of the truth.

 

On another note, secrets and betrayals undermine an intimate relationship whether you realize it at the time or not. They are like something being wrong but you just cant put your finger on it.

 

 

That is the truth!

[PhoenixRise]

If you contract a disease, you will no longer be ignorant.

 

Ignorance is defined as the condition that you will never find out, which includes the lack of any physical clues, such as STD. It is, in fact, hard to imagine how a person suddenly diagnosed with STD would be completely "ignorant".

 

Thus, your argument does not make sense.

 

In fact, the best thought example is an EA. Consider a past EA, with absolute no clues, and no trail.

 

If a BS lives to the end of his/her life without knowing it, psychologically, if you test her before her death, is she better off than one who discovered the EA.

 

 

Sometimes if you contract a disease, like cervical cancer stemming from HVP, all you know is that you have a disease that is likely going to kill you. Since cervical cancer kills the vast majority of the women who contract it you just might not take the time away from fighting from your life to track whether or not your spouse had an affair. All you know is that you only have a small chance to live. So that is where your focus is. I have seen this happen.

 

As I understood it the premise of the OP was an PA not an EA I don't see why anyone should change the premise to better fit your "logic"

 

This may come as a shock to you but many people who discover that their spouse cheated do NOT carry sorrow or anger about it for the rest of their lives. Many of them go on to be better, more self aware, stronger, happier than they ever were before. Some of them reconcile with their spouses and go on to live blissfully ever after and they come to their deaths happy and at peace with themselves and the life they lived. Some of them divorce and go on to live lives so full of joy they have to pinch themselves every day to make sure it is real.

 

The discovery of an affair IS devastating in the moment and it can take some time to recover. But for most people, it is not the defining point of their life and it does not determine their over all level of happiness over the whole of their life.

 

Therefore your argument that if tested at the time of death a spouse that didn't know would prove to be happier than a spouse that did is not logical.

[bentnotbroken]

Nope. See .. that is the kind of judgmental knee-jerk reaction here that completely ignore logic and reasoning. What i care about has nothing to do with the logic of what a ignorant person knows or feel.

 

A ignorant person would NOT be ignorant if he/she knows about himself contracted STD.

 

By definition, he/she will not be ignorant forever, once there is symptoms.

 

 

Judgmental if that label makes you happy...go with it. I am judgemental, you have been validated. Knee jerk...yep it took years for that realization and study of people for that conclusion to be reached. And it appears I am in good company since you think I am ignorant. Humanity does not exist because of people with "

my life is more important than someone else's life. So let me do whatever the hell I want and hide it because I am too big a p*s*y to face the consequences"

Humanity exist in spite of it.

[John Michael Kane]

This may come as a shock to you but many people who discover that their spouse cheated do NOT carry sorrow or anger about it for the rest of their lives. Because those people live in denial and soak up everything their disrespectful spouse feeds them.

 

Here we go again. The old "bitter" argument.