Rejection Today

[NoMagicBullet]

I'm arriving at this thread kind of late, so I only skimmed though most of the posts. But it all looks like excellent advice, OP, especially about not getting so invested before a real life meeting. I have a different take, though...

 

If you were tired and you feel that influenced the date, you could politely ask for a second date, saying "I had a rough week at work, and I don't think I was a very good date that evening. I'd like to make it up to you. Could we try again?" Even if it's too late for the one girl, don't be afraid to ask for a second date if the first didn't go as well as you hoped but you think the two of you might still hit it off. If the offer is declined after that, then definitely do not persist.

[Goatsie]

UPDATE: If you are thinking I'm updating you because she's replied, then I'm sorry, because she hasn't (and don't think she will).

 

However, I must say something: Over the past 24 hours I have come to a discovery and an epiphany about this woman. I will address this two fold separately

 

Discovery: I have just discovered the true extent of her experiences. It is NO WONDER why she felt that there was no chemistry; I have had no where near the experiences she's had. What I mean is that she's SO involved with the community. She's created programs to teach youngsters leadership skills, she was on Boards of Trustees, she was a committee member as numerous organizations, she's spearheaded projects that have far reaching and perennial effects, etc. etc. I mean there's so much to this girl. SO MUCH.

 

Epiphany: As I woke up this morning, it occured to me that I was not dynamic enough during our date. I was not creative enough, I was not exciting enough, I did not have enough bravado and actual substance to impress her. I couldn't impress her. One other thing that I realized was that I was not funny enough. Though, at basal level, we have VERY similar ideas and thoughts and personalities, she was let down. THAT WAS WHY!

 

All in all, I was WAY OVER MY HEAD, beyond what I had imagined. I didn't know...I never had a chance....

 

However, with all of that said. I was ALWAYS willing to do all of this stuff. I just never found a way to do it and it was never stressed to me that I should do it.

Edited May 17, 2011 by Goatsie

[thatone]

that's what we told you two pages ago .

 

there's no need to try to be who you're not, if you do you'll just wind up unhappy with someone you have nothing in common with. so by all means, approach women who you're more comparable to. go ask the girl at the library with the glasses and the sweater on (which is incredibly sexy btw, even to men with other options) out for dinner, and go do all of those things with her.

Edited May 17, 2011 by thatone

[fishtaco]

All in all, I was WAY OVER MY HEAD, beyond what I had imagined. I didn't know...I never had a chance....

 

Actually, no, don't sell yourself short. But you do get very valuable experience every time you try, whether you succeed or not.

 

The fact is, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. In theory, you should just assume it's random. You walk into a room, 10 - 20% of the women will be interested in you. But you don't know who they are. Could be the fat personality chick in the corner, could be the hot attention getter that all the men are circling around. You simply don't know.

 

In practice, of course, there are more factors to consider. But these additional "factors" are more for refining your game, to give you a bit of an extra edge at seeking out the interested ones. The bulk of it, is still the concept I've described above.

 

So really, like Nike said, just do it.

[ladyinlimbo]

Goatsie,

 

I wanted to check back on your thread to see how you were doing. I read your last response and I have to say, I think you are very, very hard on yourself and it might be a good idea, seriously, for you to talk to a therapist or counselor about your sense of value, self-worth and self-esteem? And do not ever go changing yourself to please someone else or what you think will please or impress them. Just be yourself and then one day you will surely find someone who loves you just as you are. Seriously, don't be so hard on yourself. You make it sound like this girl was a million times better and more valuable as a person than you. Not a chance.

[Goatsie]

I'm subscribed to this thread but I didn't get any notice on the updates to this thread.

 

Thanks, Ladinlimbo for your positive encouragement. I'm am a very critical person and am the type that seeks answers IN the information I'm given; sometimes I don't realize that the answer cannot be found within myself. However, I do find relief when I do discovery new helpful information or an epiphany occurs. Anyway it is day 6 and it's still hurting quite a bit.

 

fishtaco: I do feel like I've gained valuable experience. I've actually been talking to various people and getting their opinion on my situation and, somewhat surprising, is how well they match up with your (the group's) answers. I am beginning to understand the rules. I guess what I'm saying is that because I hadn't dated in a while, I didn't know what the norms are; however, having researched this situation backwards and forwards, I've come to realize that "it is just the way it is", which is stupid and sucks because I don't like being pigeon holed into rules and regulations, etc. I know not all people play by the rules like this girl, but it seems like most people do. Does this make sense?

 

thatone: You are right in that people shouldn't be who they're not; my last statement in my previous post, what I meant was that I think we are similar and compatible people, it is just that because of my particular circumstance, I didn't get to have similar experiences. Does that make sense? However, at the core, I believe us to be compatible; I just think she might/might not have realized it but because my first impressions were 'meh', she thought we're not compatible. I hope that makes sense.

 

Anyway, I've been meaning to tell you that in conjunction with your feedback and her inspiration I've decided that I'm going to volunteer more. I'm going to volunteer with the goals of meeting new people (hopefully another "her") and, though not my main goals, but as a side product, help other people. It really takes a lot of effort for me to do it, but I see no other way. Wish me luck.

[thatone]

life takes a lot of effort, welcome to life.

 

sounds like a great plan to me.

 

Goatsie,

 

I wanted to check back on your thread to see how you were doing. I read your last response and I have to say, I think you are very, very hard on yourself and it might be a good idea, seriously, for you to talk to a therapist or counselor about your sense of value, self-worth and self-esteem? And do not ever go changing yourself to please someone else or what you think will please or impress them. Just be yourself and then one day you will surely find someone who loves you just as you are. Seriously, don't be so hard on yourself. You make it sound like this girl was a million times better and more valuable as a person than you. Not a chance.

 

and we were doing so well together!

 

here's where we have to part ways and disagree, and i'll tell you why.

 

men handle such issues completely differently. for a man, realizing and accepting your failures is all that's required to overcome them. men don't typically need help overcoming these issues, they need simply to perceive them. then our rational minds take over and we can deal with those issues just fine. not that therapists aren't valuable for men with deeper issues that they can't handle, they can be. but men derive their confidence from independence. being able to deal with our own problems is how we grow up.

 

we don't get confidence from others, we get it from ourselves.

 

if a man runs to a therapist every time he feels less than perfect he'll wind up unloading all of his issues on women too, and drive them away just as fast. seeing problems on the horizon instead of when they slap you in the face, and dealing with those problems on your own, is part of being a man.

Edited May 20, 2011 by thatone

[oaks]

I'm just quoting from the original post...

 

Less than a week into our conversation I asked her for her number and promptly received it. We began to message through the ubiquitous text messaging system. A date was set up for that first weekend,

 

 

Did you talk to her on the phone before setting up that first date? A few text messages are fine, but then call her and talk!

[ladyinlimbo]

life takes a lot of effort, welcome to life.

 

sounds like a great plan to me.

 

 

 

and we were doing so well together!

 

here's where we have to part ways and disagree, and i'll tell you why.

 

men handle such issues completely differently. for a man, realizing and accepting your failures is all that's required to overcome them. men don't typically need help overcoming these issues, they need simply to perceive them. then our rational minds take over and we can deal with those issues just fine. not that therapists aren't valuable for men with deeper issues that they can't handle, they can be. but men derive their confidence from independence. being able to deal with our own problems is how we grow up.

 

we don't get confidence from others, we get it from ourselves.

 

if a man runs to a therapist every time he feels less than perfect he'll wind up unloading all of his issues on women too, and drive them away just as fast. seeing problems on the horizon instead of when they slap you in the face, and dealing with those problems on your own, is part of being a man.

 

I totally understand where you're coming from, and you make excellent points. Being that I'm not a man (lol), it's neat and helpful to learn more about the mind of men, how they think and process. :-)

 

I only suggested the therapist because it seemed to me that the degree of anguish and pain Goatsie had expressed was somewhat disproportionate to the whole situation of a guy meets girl online, one date, girl doesn't feel the click, not a lot of time or energy invested -- but Goatsie came across as being completely gutted, to the point of sounding like he was in such deep and bitter despair, sooooooooo down on things, know what I mean? --- almost as if there was a much deeper issue at play here.....one in which his self worth and self esteem were derived solely from whether another human was interested in him and that if that person wasn't interested, it was somehow a reflection on him as a person, his fault, etc. Actually, to me he came across as almost acute depressed, feeling so worthless....it kind of concerned me, just a vibe I was getting by the way he was explaining how distraught he was.

[Imajerk17]

I saw this thread and I read the replies. Anyway, a few thoughts....

 

(1) Yes, I can relate to idealizing the first girl I met off the internet. I even drove several hours to see her! And yes, I was down that it didn't work out. In your case though, I don't think she was ever as interested as you might think she was. She couldn't make the time you originally scheduled for your first date because she was "busy", and you were the one who had to take the initiative to reschedule. That says a lot right there.

 

 

(2) Sure this girl is well on her way to saving the world and all that, but I'm not sure that you needed to be Superman yourself. How many guys are? More important questions: Do you have a drive to make something of yourself too? Any passions/goals of your own? Did you talk about that on the date?

 

That your time with her got you to think about these things is, IMO, really good.

 

 

(3) Most first dates do NOT lead to second dates. I have gone on a bunch of first dates that seemed to go quite well (kiss at the end, holding hands, ect) that did not lead to second dates. You are probably only one of SEVERAL guys that she was communicating with.

[thatone]

I totally understand where you're coming from, and you make excellent points. Being that I'm not a man (lol), it's neat and helpful to learn more about the mind of men, how they think and process. :-)

 

I only suggested the therapist because it seemed to me that the degree of anguish and pain Goatsie had expressed was somewhat disproportionate to the whole situation of a guy meets girl online, one date, girl doesn't feel the click, not a lot of time or energy invested -- but Goatsie came across as being completely gutted, to the point of sounding like he was in such deep and bitter despair, sooooooooo down on things, know what I mean? --- almost as if there was a much deeper issue at play here.....one in which his self worth and self esteem were derived solely from whether another human was interested in him and that if that person wasn't interested, it was somehow a reflection on him as a person, his fault, etc. Actually, to me he came across as almost acute depressed, feeling so worthless....it kind of concerned me, just a vibe I was getting by the way he was explaining how distraught he was.

 

 

that's why you hear high school football coaches saying "accept" all of the time. accept your role, accept the things you can't control, accept your knowledge of your own job, and if you still lose accept your failures. speaking of that, that's why you hear so many men say later on in life that playing sports in high school wasn't just a game, it was learning about life. because it was, they were learning to be men.

 

when men learn to see their own shortcomings and deal with them rationally, even young men, they figure the rest out. that confidence switch clicks in our minds and the rest is smooth sailing.

 

no need to justify your response, we didn't design ourselves this way. men are wired differently, simple as that.

 

i'm reminded of a thing on TV awhile back where NFL coaches went back and coached high school teams.

 

here's a video...

 

 

notice how when the NFL coach is teaching, it's quiet and 1 on 1 and asking a lot of questions. when he's talking out loud in front of everyone else, he isn't addressing them by name unless he's praising them. when he's criticizing them, he does it very indirectly. that's on purpose, to encourage them to think about their failures and learn to deal with them on their own. by asking questions, and letting the kids respond with an answer, they have to think that they're achieving by themselves, rather than him doing it for them.

 

the kids never explain themselves in any way. they're not supposed to, that's why the coach never shuts up, even if they wanted to he won't let them. they're supposed to think that they're figuring it out on their own.

 

that's the psychology of men's confidence and where it comes from.

 

taking that a step further, logically, if you as a woman want honest and emotional conversation or answers from men who are reluctant to open up to you, ask questions. a confident, stable man will feel obligated to respond and see it as a sign of equal confidence in the woman asking the questions.

Edited May 20, 2011 by thatone

[fishtaco]

And do not ever go changing yourself to please someone else or what you think will please or impress them.

 

I don't want to discount ladyinlimbo's point of view, but I'm offering a different view. Goatsie, you decide for yourself.

 

Guided change is good. If there something about you that you don't like, change it. I did. And it worked as expected. I improved my body, I improved the way I dress, I changed my life priorities to include more social activities, I grew my social circle, I practiced my social skills, and I changed my mental game.

 

I am what they call a reformed nice guy. I'm not nice anymore. I'm not a douche either. Well sometimes I am. But I would describe myself as someone that's practical. I was able to negotiated with myself to relax on my moral principles. There's still a line I wouldn't cross, but I've done things I would never have done before, for selfish reasons.

 

It wasn't a pleasant journey, but I've been able to improve my dating success. I will NEVER go back to how I was before.

 

But improved success, no matter how you reach it, will have a price. More successful daters have more options. More options means more decisions. Being that none of us are psychic, we will always wonder if we made the right choice. This is the case even outside of dating. That's where I am now. I have choices. I make my decisions, then I wonder about them.

 

But this shouldn't be a surprise. Rarely anything in life is so lopsided that one side is always 100% better than the other side. Even winning the lottery has its drawbacks.

 

So the path that I took, was change myself. I conformed to the expectations of the society. You be the judge if that's for you too.

[Goatsie]

OK OK, where to start....

 

oaks: Touche.

 

ladinlimbo: Do you see know what I mean when I said that the quality of the conversation between me and "girl" was high? You were able to keenly discern my anguish and pain; do you see how I could have been mislead by her diction and how I felt about our connection?, because you clearly were able to pick up on it.

 

imajerk17:

1) I think you misunderstood the situation because she did make time for me. I just chose to be courteous. She didn't lie to me, the event in which she she said she attended was near my place and I saw people at the event (as I drove by it).

 

2) OOOOhhh yes, I have drive. I'm applying to grad school this year and, yes, we did talk about it (even before we met).

 

3) I don't doubt she couldn't have been dating several other people at once -- it seems, many people, even those here, do it, too.

 

fishtaco: I agree with you; I think I am a very much a common-sense type person. I will change the things I feel I'm lacking/excessive in. And hot dog; a reformed nice guy. I'm definitely on the practicality boat. I will do what it takes to achieve my goals, so I understand your story. I think that if you want to play the game, you have to play by THEIR RULES -- if that means that I also have to conform to society norms, then I will (obviously an assessment of pros and cons is must, here.)

[Goatsie]

I have a lot of thoughts on what you all have said; I tried to go out this weekend with my friends to help defray the sore spot that I'm still feeling. I just can't get over. How long is this suppose to last? It seems like every girl I talk to now, I hope that they're like the "first one".

 

Anyway, there's another girl that I'm talking to right now, and I just dont' know about her. She's attractive, physically, but in our limited conversation, she has failed to impress me like the the first one did....

[Goatsie]

Those of you still hanging around (i.e. ladyinlimbo, thatone, fishtaco, etc.) you are all very keen and perceptive; I would surmise that if you were close to me, I might want to even be friends. Thanks again. I'm still working through this and I appreciate the discourse.

[Goatsie]

thatone: I have opinions on your posts, but I dont' know how to further the discussion without interjecting some very personal revelation; something I do not wish to reveal to the www.