dreamingoftigers Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 Okay this thread is all over the place, I'm not even sure what it's about, but this ^^^^^^ was Freaking Funny!! I like your style Dreaming... Thanks, that's awesome of you to say I am glad someone got it.
Spark1111 Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 Spark nothing justifies any of the bullsh*t we do to eachother.... nothing justifies... - saying hurtful things - neglect - dismissal of one another's views Why do you feel the needs to make special note about cheating and nothing else? The reality is people provoke people....action - reaction....theres no justification but we do it anyways..... thats life... so you can go on about whats justified but to me its a moot point. ....... and that is where we part paths...to me cheating is just a line item on a long list of failures...to you it gets special status over many other things that can be just as damaging All of the above is hurtful and eroding....but to me, cheating is intentional: It takes deception, lying, sneaking around, planning, plotting, executions, emotional, physical investment and often expending financial resources, all unknown to your spouse. I have yet to meet a person who could claim they were just innocently walking down the street and by golly, my d&&k just slipped inside this woman, and I have no idea how it got there.
Spark1111 Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 Thanks, that's awesome of you to say I am glad someone got it. I did too! Bringing alcohol to alcoholics is like throwing gasoline on the house fire!
dreamingoftigers Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 Bringing my Dad and his family out in public is like asking for a new zoo to be built in the city!
StoneCold Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 LAll of the above is hurtful and eroding....but to me, cheating is intentional: It takes deception, lying, sneaking around, planning, plotting, executions, emotional, physical investment and often expending financial resources, all unknown to your spouse. I have yet to meet a person who could claim they were just innocently walking down the street and by golly, my d&&k just slipped inside this woman, and I have no idea how it got there. I dont buy it Saying and doing hurtful things to the point of damaging is never just a one off. Its a history and pattern of behaviour. Dont tell me that you have no idea of what you are doing...oh yeah you just suffer from daily ammesia and you are deaf dumb and blind because you jist have no idea of the hiurt you perpetiate. Once they get to a certain point they know damn well what tjhey are doing....yet tjhey choose to continue. And then when the **** hits the fan they conveniently retreat to "oh i didnt know"...... Poppycock Looks pretty intentional to me
Author HalfAlive22 Posted April 23, 2011 Author Posted April 23, 2011 L I dont buy it Saying and doing hurtful things to the point of damaging is never just a one off. Its a history and pattern of behaviour. Dont tell me that you have no idea of what you are doing...oh yeah you just suffer from daily ammesia and you are deaf dumb and blind because you jist have no idea of the hiurt you perpetiate. Once they get to a certain point they know damn well what tjhey are doing....yet tjhey choose to continue. And then when the **** hits the fan they conveniently retreat to "oh i didnt know"...... Poppycock Looks pretty intentional to me Dude,your nuts just sayin
StoneCold Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 (edited) Dude,your nuts just sayin of course...because its not what you want to hear Edited April 23, 2011 by StoneCold
alexandria35 Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 L I dont buy it Saying and doing hurtful things to the point of damaging is never just a one off. Its a history and pattern of behaviour. Dont tell me that you have no idea of what you are doing...oh yeah you just suffer from daily ammesia and you are deaf dumb and blind because you jist have no idea of the hiurt you perpetiate. Once they get to a certain point they know damn well what tjhey are doing....yet tjhey choose to continue. And then when the **** hits the fan they conveniently retreat to "oh i didnt know"...... Poppycock Looks pretty intentional to me I think the thing that sets infidelity apart from other types of bad behaviour in a marriage is the deception. Maybe your wife is a cold bitch or something, but you know she is a cold bitch right? Or maybe she speaks to disrespectfully. Again, you know if you are being spoken to in a demeaning manner or not. It's not something covert or sneaky. So you have the choice to be with a cold bitch or not. You have a choice to be with someone who treats you disrespectfully or not. Nobody is limiting or taking your choices away from you by keeping the truth from you.
StoneCold Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 Thanks, that's awesome of you to say I am glad someone got it. Its not a matter of "getting" it.... I simply dont agree with the anology to infidelity.
StoneCold Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 (edited) I think the thing that sets infidelity apart from other types of bad behaviour in a marriage is the deception. Maybe your wife is a cold bitch or something, but you know she is a cold bitch right? Or maybe she speaks to disrespectfully. Again, you know if you are being spoken to in a demeaning manner or not. It's not something covert or sneaky. . So are you saying that just because someone knows you are a bitch it is ok for you to treat people like ****? Thats your "get out of jail free" card?? I think not. To me it makes no difference as it all depends on how the actions are interpretted by the recipient. Maybe some people would rather be decieved than outright treated like **** by the person whos supposed to love you the most. Everybody is different....we all have different expectations and yardsticks...you can only speak for yourself So you have the choice to be with a cold bitch or not. You have a choice to be with someone who treats you disrespectfully or not. Nobody is limiting or taking your choices away from you by keeping the truth from you. 1) You have the choice to do whatever you want. Your destiny lies in your hands and its your responsibility to get all the facts for yourself...nobody elses....because as far as you are concerned its ultimately your a*s. Deception is any and everywhere but its up to you to make sense of it for you. Sorry Alex but the above reads as an excuse to not do your share of due dilligence. 2) You have got to be extremely delusional or downright bonkers to think that you can just be a "cold bitch" to whoever you like; however you like and never reap what you sow. Its not realistic Alex...you have to know that if you screw people you may very well get screwed; and when your garbage comes back at you...you dont get to pick how it goes down. Thats life...thats reality....its why we have terms like "watch your back" Edited April 23, 2011 by StoneCold
alexandria35 Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 So are you saying that just because someone knows you are a bitch it is ok for you to treat people like ****? Thats your "get out of jail free" card?? I think not. To me it makes no difference as it all depends on how the actions are interpretted by the recipient. Maybe some people would rather be decieved than outright treated like **** by the person whos supposed to love you the most. Everybody is different....we all have different expectations and yardsticks...you can only speak for yourself 1) You have the choice to do whatever you want. Your destiny lies in your hands and its your responsibility to get all the facts for yourself...nobody elses....because as far as you are concerned its ultimately your a*s. Deception is any and everywhere but its up to you to make sense of it for you. Sorry Alex but the above reads as an excuse to not do your share of due dilligence. 2) You have got to be extremely delusional or downright bonkers to think that you can just be a "cold bitch" to whoever you like; however you like and never reap what you sow. Its not realistic Alex...you have to know that if you screw people you may very well get screwed; and when your garbage comes back at you...you dont get to pick how it goes down. Thats life...thats reality.... LOL...exactly where did I say that I think it's okay to be a cold bitch to anyone? I was talking about deception and choices, not defending cold bitches. LOL. Hard to have any discusson with someone who completely loses the plot. Your reality is not everyones reality by the way. I don't play tit for tat. I don't spend my valuable time getting even with people. If someone is a prick to me I remove that person from my life as much as possible and consider myself done with them. It does me no good to compromise my own values and lower myself to their level. Childish games of "you started it" don't appeal to me.
StoneCold Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 (edited) LOL...exactly where did I say that I think it's okay to be a cold bitch to anyone? I was talking about deception and choices, not defending cold bitches. LOL. Hard to have any discusson with someone who completely loses the plot. Your reality is not everyones reality by the way. I don't play tit for tat. I don't spend my valuable time getting even with people. If someone is a prick to me I remove that person from my life as much as possible and consider myself done with them. It does me no good to compromise my own values and lower myself to their level. Childish games of "you started it" don't appeal to me. your talking about decption and choices.... I'm saying sh*t is sh*t and you alwayshave a choice You are completely missing the point Thats fine and dandy that you dont play tit for tat....but theres 6 billion people on the earth and you have to get on with them in regular everyday life...and guess what..you may verywell encounter people like this...and you may not see them for who they are...what then? You screw someone and then they screw you back and now its your problem to deal with. Let me ask you a question.... why do they say "dont play with fire" Edited April 23, 2011 by StoneCold
dreamingoftigers Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 Its not a matter of "getting" it.... I simply dont agree with the anology to infidelity. The last line made it a joke, I am glad that someone got the humor.
dreamingoftigers Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 your talking about decption and choices.... I'm saying sh*t is sh*t and you alwayshave a choice You are completely missing the point Thats fine and dandy that you dont play tit for tat....but theres 6 billion people on the earth and you have to get on with them in regular everyday life...and guess what..you may verywell encounter people like this...and you may not see them for who they are...what then? You screw someone and then they screw you back and now its your problem to deal with. Let me ask you a question.... why do they say "dont play with fire" I think the point that virtually everyone is trying to make is that others actions don't justify your own. (General you, not you personally). My signature is that way partially because even though my husband has wiped the floor with me over the last two years while I have been making huge strides and efforts to alter our marriage into one both he and I would be happy in. (This is not banging the victim drug, I have made the efforts and at times I have faltered, but I am very proud of the results and have managed to make headway in our marriage as far as can be expected with an addict who has tons of foundational issues). I do not use his actions against me and against our marriage as justification to cheat, lie or do other hurtful things. I don't have that philosophy because I am applying for sainthood. I have that philosophy because: 1. It allows me to keep control of my own life, dignity and choices. 2. I can rolemodel stability for my daughter even though her Dad at this point isn't able to. 3. I won't put myself at risk legal, sexual or otherwise as a reaction to hurt. 4. I just feel better knowing that if I do something that I consider wrong, it isn't justifiable and I can own what I did and repair what I can. Cheating is conflict-avoidance to the extreme in most cases. By not just looking your spouse dead in the eye and saying: "look, I have needs but you treat my like such **** that I am not coming here to get them met." You are somewhat avoiding the reality of the situation and adding another coal to the conflict fire. Does that make you the ****tiest person since Hitler. Probably not. Are you justified? Only you and/or an independent non-biased party would know for sure. I would say that if it was me that cheated I wouldn't be justified, my actions are my own and I think cheating is wrong. The justification for me ends right there. By having his direct actions influence my response to pain, I give him control over my sexuality even. Forget it. My sexuality is mine. It appears that you have a different set of values. Whatever makes you happy, at the end of the day I don't really give a **** if you choose Coke or Pepsi. You get to live with it. I couldn't cheat and look myself in the mirror, I also couldn't be the dependent, sad girl that I was and look myself in the mirror. Everyone has different settings depending where they are in life. I made a comment before about housework and I didn't notice until now but it looked like you might have put a reference to me "guilttripping?" I hope I got that wrong but just in case that was there I thought I would clear it up: My H did do a lot of housework the first 3 years or so of our marriage and I would cook like crazy (literally hours a day because I wanted to impress my new husband). Then I would get exhausted and not help with the vacuuming etc. as much. He would occasionally complain and I would brush it off. Later on he took off on me for a bit and I stopped cooking so much and started doing more of the housework and could appreciate what he had to say about it. I do feel some guilt over not helping so much in those early years. (At least he had nice pie for dessert made from scratch most nights though.)
alexandria35 Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 The last line made it a joke, I am glad that someone got the humor. Somehow I don't think SC has much of sense of humor. And Stone you made my point for me in your last response you may verywell encounter people like this...and you may not see them for who they are...what then? Exactly!! This is why I hate deceit! How can I make a well informed choice about someone who lying and deceiving me? If I had to make the choice between being with someone who is a blatant ahole or being with a cheating liar, I would pick the blatant ahole because then at least I would be making my choice based on knowing the truth about him. If I decided to invest my heart and time into being with an ahole, well so be it, that's my choice to make and I know what's in store for me. On the other hand I could spend years with a cheater and talented liar and not know it. Spend years investing myself into a relationship with someone based on the false belief that he is being true and loyal. See the difference? The first guy might be an raging ahole, but he's not deceiving me. He's not tricking me into wasting my time with him by lies and deceit. Sure I always have a choice, but why would I choose leave someone when I (falsely) believe that they are a good loyal partner? Furthermore I am in my forties. You don't get to be my age without encountering all kinds of people. Your assumption that I haven't met anyone who has hurt me is very condescending. I actually did spend several years in love with an emotionally and verbally abusive man. He caused so much pain and sorrow to us both. I walked away when I reached my limit and realized that I could only rescue myself, not both of us. It hurt me to leave although I knew it was the right thing to do. I never ever believed that I had some God Given right to hurt this man or screw him over because he had mistreated me and I thank the heavens that this is not how my mind works. How angry and sad would I have to be to be hell bent on getting even with people. what a waste of my precious life that would be.
wicked_angelbaby Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 Just have to get this off my chest. I hate cheaters, I hate liars, I hate woman who want to be the OW, and men who are the OM! what happend to loyalty, honesty and having some class! I hate that the Ow in my H's life get to move on years later now with their lives and new marriages, and think of me as crazy wife and have no consequences for their actions! I've been molested, date raped, abused, and have had a bad miscarrige, but nothing compares to the way my H's infedelity has made me feel or messed me up! I wish people thought about this before they opend there legs for a married man, or f'd around with a married woman! feewww...thanks PERHAPS you should of given him some sex... maybe if you weren't such a prude he wouldn't of cheated. I am a cheater and I do not mean to cheat, but there are deep reasons for cheating. If you have had all those things happen to you, that many times... you probably had placed your self in unsafe situations. There are major consequences to the actions of a cheaters, thats for sure. Do not hate the other man or other woman, hate the cheater I guess who is more at fault for being undecided.
StoneCold Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 ... I do not use his actions against me and against our marriage as justification to cheat, lie or do other hurtful things. I don't have that philosophy because I am applying for sainthood. I have that philosophy because: 1. It allows me to keep control of my own life, dignity and choices. 2. I can rolemodel stability for my daughter even though her Dad at this point isn't able to. 3. I won't put myself at risk legal, sexual or otherwise as a reaction to hurt. 4. I just feel better knowing that if I do something that I consider wrong, it isn't justifiable and I can own what I did and repair what I can. Cheating is conflict-avoidance to the extreme in most cases. By not just looking your spouse dead in the eye and saying: "look, I have needs but you treat my like such **** that I am not coming here to get them met." You are somewhat avoiding the reality of the situation and adding another coal to the conflict fire. Does that make you the ****tiest person since Hitler. Probably not. Are you justified? Only you and/or an independent non-biased party would know for sure. I would say that if it was me that cheated I wouldn't be justified, my actions are my own and I think cheating is wrong. The justification for me ends right there. By having his direct actions influence my response to pain, I give him control over my sexuality even. Forget it. My sexuality is mine. It appears that you have a different set of values. Whatever makes you happy, at the end of the day I don't really give a **** if you choose Coke or Pepsi. You get to live with it. I couldn't cheat and look myself in the mirror, I also couldn't be the dependent, sad girl that I was and look myself in the mirror. Everyone has different settings depending where they are in life. ) Please dreaming... I beg you...please for the love of all thats holy..... (and for the million time) STOP going back to the "justification" tip...you're killing me girl. I already made it clear many times that its not about justification with me (going both ways too). I've explained my view too many times. we just see things differently
dreamingoftigers Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 Please dreaming... I beg you...please for the love of all thats holy..... (and for the million time) STOP going back to the "justification" tip...you're killing me girl. I already made it clear many times that its not about justification with me (going both ways too). I've explained my view too many times. we just see things differently But you keep saying, if spouse x does this then spouse y that That's justification.
StoneCold Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 Exactly!! This is why I hate deceit! How can I make a well informed choice about someone who lying and deceiving me? If I had to make the choice between being with someone who is a blatant ahole or being with a cheating liar, I would pick the blatant ahole because then at least I would be making my choice based on knowing the truth about him. If I decided to invest my heart and time into being with an ahole, well so be it, that's my choice to make and I know what's in store for me. On the other hand I could spend years with a cheater and talented liar and not know it. Spend years investing myself into a relationship with someone based on the false belief that he is being true and loyal. See the difference? The first guy might be an raging ahole, but he's not deceiving me. He's not tricking me into wasting my time with him by lies and deceit. Sure I always have a choice, but why would I choose leave someone when I (falsely) believe that they are a good loyal partner? . Ok Alex but thats you. Not everybody is like you. I dont get why its so hard to get that there are people who may see things differently? I dont get it Furthermore I am in my forties. You don't get to be my age without encountering all kinds of people. Your assumption that I haven't met anyone who has hurt me is very condescending. I actually did spend several years in love with an emotionally and verbally abusive man. He caused so much pain and sorrow to us both. I walked away when I reached my limit and realized that I could only rescue myself, not both of us. It hurt me to leave although I knew it was the right thing to do. I never ever believed that I had some God Given right to hurt this man or screw him over because he had mistreated me and I thank the heavens that this is not how my mind works. How angry and sad would I have to be to be hell bent on getting even with people. what a waste of my precious life that would be. Look Alex...again...thats you.... you have to admit that as a general rule...if one were to make it a habit to scew another, one would have to be prepared to get screwed back. Human beings in general live with this cardinal concept in mind...its a survival instinct
StoneCold Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 But you keep saying, if spouse x does this then spouse y that That's justification. For god sakes no it isnt. Did it ever occur to you that it is actually merely an observation of reality? I didnt say..."its justified". I actually said that it wasnt "justified" (go back and read again)...what I'm saying is..... "thats just how it IS based on what you see everyday"...for the good or the bad it is what it is
wicked_angelbaby Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 But you keep saying, if spouse x does this then spouse y that That's justification. or an explanation. not meaning to be justified.
StoneCold Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 or an explanation. not meaning to be justified. I dunno guys... wicked seems to get it
dreamingoftigers Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 PERHAPS you should of given him some sex... maybe if you weren't such a prude he wouldn't of cheated. I am a cheater and I do not mean to cheat, but there are deep reasons for cheating. If you have had all those things happen to you, that many times... you probably had placed your self in unsafe situations. There are major consequences to the actions of a cheaters, thats for sure. Do not hate the other man or other woman, hate the cheater I guess who is more at fault for being undecided. This is one of the most uninformed posts I have ever seen on this site.
dreamingoftigers Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 I dunno guys... wicked seems to get it OKay, so the line of thought is.... people just react? spouse x this....spouse y that..... it's just the way we are as humans?
StoneCold Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 OKay, so the line of thought is.... people just react? spouse x this....spouse y that..... it's just the way we are as humans? yes...and not just in this context....generally speaking
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