Grinding is only a dance!

[fishtaco]

But men in relationships staring straight into the various orifices of hundreds of different naked women in porn is totally cool, right?

 

 

And it's all the atheists' fault.

[Woggle]

That is not cool... not cool at all in my book. As far as grinding with other women, Woogle, I'm a few months from turning 21, my girlfriend is 22 so I can't go to the club with her.

 

You are only a few months away so when you are 21 put your theory to the test.

[betterdeal]

You might enjoy it.

[BeginAgain]

These are not rules. Maybe these are reasons YOU go and that's fine. But no one forces you to dance any particular style of dance or hook up with someone whether you're in a relationship or not just because you went inside a dance club. You can even go to a club with your SO (gasp!). No one is checking single status at the door and no one is going to force you to go home with someone on your way out. Clubbing is what you make of it. If your experiences in going out clubbing were trashy its because you behaved that way - not because of some law of clubbing.

That's like saying I can go to the strip club only for the complimentary buffet without it being an act of cheating in my heart because I'm actually there for the free wings.

 

You are young and trying desperately to hold on to the idea that you can keep the freedom of your singlehood while being in a committed relationship by rationalizing anyway possible your continued visits to the club. You can have all that the club provides in the comfort of your home minus the meat market. It would be more fun, the drinks would taste better, the company would be better, the music selection would be more to your taste, and the entire evening would be cheaper. The issue with that is no one goes to the club for any of that. They are going for sexual validation, especially for women, and hookups. All of this you can't quite get from your usual group of close ones. That's why we even bother going. It's a kin to them taking out all of the strippers from the strip club leaving the rancid buffet as the sole attraction.

[mr.dream merchant]

What does porn have to do with the OP? Fight that war where it's relevant.

 

And I'm glad someone is serving Sally4Sara like she deserves.

 

The OP isn't cool with the woman he loves grinding in a sexual manner on other men. That is perfectly reasonable. OP, have you and your GF talked on this disagreement more?

[nessaaa]

ha ha ha ha. Grinding is NOT just a dance, it's a sexual one, her ass should not be touching another man, shouldnt even be that close to him. It's not okay, she knows it too.

[welikeincrowds]

Cultural differences are playing into this thread big time, no doubt about that. Some cultures will view certain dances as a violation, and other cultures (particularly the south american ones I'm guessing) will accept the dance, because they are more comfortable with certain displays of human sexuality.

 

However, this may not actually be a complication in OP's relationship, given that they probably belong to the same culture. I don't know, OP, do you? What really matters here is how your GF reacts to your needs. If she can't reconcile and neither can you, then you've exposed a fundamental principle about behavior upon which you both disagree. That's not good news for a relationship, but hopefully you guys don't have to hate each other for it.

[fishtaco]

Cultural differences are playing into this thread big time, no doubt about that. Some cultures will view certain dances as a violation, and other cultures (particularly the south american ones I'm guessing) will accept the dance, because they are more comfortable with certain displays of human sexuality.

 

Thank you. So I'm siding with sally4sara on this one. There is definitely a cultural difference. Some people think dancing is only for the purpose of pursuing sex. Not always the case.

 

Merengue for example (a very basic type of Latin dance, most learned dancers, i.e. people that took salsa lessons or whatever, commonly find it boring), is danced usually apart here in the US. My friend from Venezuela told me, merengue is danced cheek to cheek and body to body. So if you go to a Latin club, and people are dancing close, it'll look like a club full of cheaters from BeginAgain's perspective, but for other people that are immersed in that culture, it's called Tuesday night.

 

So I'm not going to say BeginAgain is wrong, he is right, in his own little plot of land. If you look at the big picture, especially in multi cultural areas like Southern California, sally4sara is correct. People dance as a hobby. Hook ups happen, sure, because it happens everywhere people meet. But people dance because they have a passion for it just like any other hobby. And many times, people will even choose their hobby over their potential boyfriend/girlfriend.

 

Do you know many people in the scene refer to dancing as a sport? Do you know when people go dancing it's common to NOT drink any alcohol? Because it messes up their balance and they won't be able to do the technical moves. Do you know people spend hundreds if not thousands of dollars on dancing? Classes cost money, and private lessons are really expensive, dance shoes need to be replaced once worn out, because they protect your joints. Some people buy their own outfits if they want to perform, they have to train to audition for teams, and once they get on one, they have to practice for hours every night, some even pay for the opportunity to perform. And these are amateurs. They will never make a dime off of dancing.

 

The local hip hop clubs where people get drunk and have sex in the bathroom then start a drunken brawl later isn't the only type of club dancing that happens.

 

There's an Asian idiom. "The frog at the bottom of the well". When the frog looks up, it see a small circle of the blue sky. Therefore it believes that's what the world looks like - a small blue circle. Surprise, the world is kind of more than that.

 

BeginAgain, you have the right to be strict about dancing, for you personal preference. But please don't be the frog at the bottom of the well.

 

So again, boundary issue. Everyone has different boundaries. Communicate and compromise. If that cannot be reached, then it's a deal breaker. Just like everything else in a relationship. This is not any different.

[Dust]

Lets put it this way, most single girls don’t let random guys come up from behind and start grinding so why should she. Just tell her she upset you and if she could please stop. If she couldn’t care less after nicely telling her I would dump her. You can’t control people but you can dump them when they couldn’t care less about respecting your feelings. Don’t threaten to dump her, just dump her if she doesn’t listen to you’re respectful explanation of how it upsets you and would she please not let men touch her at the club.

[ChocolateChipWaffle]

Thank you. So I'm siding with sally4sara on this one. There is definitely a cultural difference. Some people think dancing is only for the purpose of pursuing sex. Not always the case.

 

Merengue for example (a very basic type of Latin dance, most learned dancers, i.e. people that took salsa lessons or whatever, commonly find it boring), is danced usually apart here in the US. My friend from Venezuela told me, merengue is danced cheek to cheek and body to body. So if you go to a Latin club, and people are dancing close, it'll look like a club full of cheaters from BeginAgain's perspective, but for other people that are immersed in that culture, it's called Tuesday night.

 

So I'm not going to say BeginAgain is wrong, he is right, in his own little plot of land. If you look at the big picture, especially in multi cultural areas like Southern California, sally4sara is correct. People dance as a hobby. Hook ups happen, sure, because it happens everywhere people meet. But people dance because they have a passion for it just like any other hobby. And many times, people will even choose their hobby over their potential boyfriend/girlfriend.

 

Do you know many people in the scene refer to dancing as a sport? Do you know when people go dancing it's common to NOT drink any alcohol? Because it messes up their balance and they won't be able to do the technical moves. Do you know people spend hundreds if not thousands of dollars on dancing? Classes cost money, and private lessons are really expensive, dance shoes need to be replaced once worn out, because they protect your joints. Some people buy their own outfits if they want to perform, they have to train to audition for teams, and once they get on one, they have to practice for hours every night, some even pay for the opportunity to perform. And these are amateurs. They will never make a dime off of dancing.

 

The local hip hop clubs where people get drunk and have sex in the bathroom then start a drunken brawl later isn't the only type of club dancing that happens.

 

There's an Asian idiom. "The frog at the bottom of the well". When the frog looks up, it see a small circle of the blue sky. Therefore it believes that's what the world looks like - a small blue circle. Surprise, the world is kind of more than that.

 

BeginAgain, you have the right to be strict about dancing, for you personal preference. But please don't be the frog at the bottom of the well.

 

So again, boundary issue. Everyone has different boundaries. Communicate and compromise. If that cannot be reached, then it's a deal breaker. Just like everything else in a relationship. This is not any different.

This is the way I look at it, and unfortunately she goes to the local hip hop clubs.

[fishtaco]

This is the way I look at it, and unfortunately she goes to the local hip hop clubs.

 

Hence you have to talk to her and reach a compromise. Not everyone that go to hip hop clubs are looking for sex. Some people, even in the hip hop scene, do dance for the sake of dancing.

 

I don't know your girlfriend, I don't know the crowd she hangs with, so I can only tell you general things.

 

If you can't reach a compromise, then you have no choice but to break up with her. But again, without knowing her, generally I'd say it's not her affinity to grinding that's the focus here, I happen to think it's no big deal. What's a big deal is her unwillingness to work with you. Swap this for any other relationship issues, it's equally bad that she's not willing to compromise for the sake of the relationship.

 

So really Knittress already have the best answer at post #2. It's about boundaries.

[Woggle]

There is nothing wrong with going to club while in a relationship but it depends on what kind of club. There are meat market clubs that are pretty much havens for people looking to hook up but there are also places where you just go and have fun. I would rather hang out at a neighborhood bar myself instead of most dance clubs.

[betterdeal]

This is the way I look at it, and unfortunately she goes to the local hip hop clubs.

 

What if it was gay guys, would you be happy with that?

 

Dance is a sensual experience. Good dancing uses the reflexive part of the brain mostly and little of the cognitive area. Dance first, think later, as they say.

 

Sensual is not another word for sex (it's often used to mean sex, especially in the sex industry in order to get around legislation). It may lead to sexual, or it may lead to spiritual experiences. It might even lead to nothing at all and be an end in itself: an exploration of the senses.

 

People may dance in order to find a sexual experience, or to exercise, or to not think, to let their hair down, or to earn a living. There's myriad intentions and myriad consequences.

 

If you're not happy with your partner doing anything, that's your issue and your feelings on the matter are just as valid as any other feelings you have, but step away from looking for a Guide to Proper Behaviour and be confident in your own needs, feelings, wants.

 

You then discuss, negotiate, consider, and decide. If it doesn't work for you, do something that does work for you.

[ChocolateChipWaffle]

Hence you have to talk to her and reach a compromise. Not everyone that go to hip hop clubs are looking for sex. Some people, even in the hip hop scene, do dance for the sake of dancing.

 

I don't know your girlfriend, I don't know the crowd she hangs with, so I can only tell you general things.

 

If you can't reach a compromise, then you have no choice but to break up with her. But again, without knowing her, generally I'd say it's not her affinity to grinding that's the focus here, I happen to think it's no big deal. What's a big deal is her unwillingness to work with you. Swap this for any other relationship issues, it's equally bad that she's not willing to compromise for the sake of the relationship.

 

So really Knittress already have the best answer at post #2. It's about boundaries.

The way she said it made me go EH?! She said people don't really dance.. just grind. I don't like the fact that she is usually liquored up (she is confused, and will make friends with just about any creep around when she's drunk, she said so herself) and grinding in itself is something I find baffling. It's used to elicit sexual pleasure, and it is essentially dry humping/stand up lap dance. I question a guys motives if he's going around doing that. Edited April 5, 2011 by ChocolateChipWaffle

[LeaningIntoTheMuse]

This thread has been an eye opener. I'm able to see it from both sides, her's and the OP's.

 

That being said, it's not the 1950's anymore. We have hip hop and rap music, which you can't slow dance to. Unless you're out in a classic ballroom, you're not gonna find anything BUT grinding, which is the typical dance to do when you don't know how to properly move your feet.

 

I never knew that men could be turned on by such an act. Maybe not all men, just the creeps? Which begs the question, why would your girlfriend be grinding against a pervert?

[sally4sara]

That's like saying I can go to the strip club only for the complimentary buffet without it being an act of cheating in my heart because I'm actually there for the free wings.

 

You are young and trying desperately to hold on to the idea that you can keep the freedom of your singlehood while being in a committed relationship by rationalizing anyway possible your continued visits to the club. You can have all that the club provides in the comfort of your home minus the meat market. It would be more fun, the drinks would taste better, the company would be better, the music selection would be more to your taste, and the entire evening would be cheaper. The issue with that is no one goes to the club for any of that. They are going for sexual validation, especially for women, and hookups. All of this you can't quite get from your usual group of close ones. That's why we even bother going. It's a kin to them taking out all of the strippers from the strip club leaving the rancid buffet as the sole attraction.

 

Oh you have no idea what you're talking about. I'm not young and I'm married. When I go to the club it is with my husband and some of our friends. When I was single it was with my female friends and we danced amongst ourselves. I've never picked up someone in a club, I liked the time with friends, dancing and hearing music. The hook up crowd might like to think its all part of going to the club but its just an excuse to act trashy.

 

The company you keep and the way you conduct yourself is on YOU. The club doesn't make you trashy; YOU do. There are no rules about clubbing.

[Kamille]

 

If you're not happy with your partner doing anything, that's your issue and your feelings on the matter are just as valid as any other feelings you have, but step away from looking for a Guide to Proper Behaviour and be confident in your own needs, feelings, wants.

 

 

I wasn't there when you two discussed this issue CCW (obviously), and only you know how the discussion unfolded. But I think I get an idea of what happened. I feel like maybe you reacted emotionally, but tried to find external rational reasons as to why her behavior is inappropriate, instead of focusing on how her behavior made you feel.

 

The focus shouldn't be on whether or not what she did is appropriate. The focus should be on how it made you feel, your needs, and wants. There's a huge difference between: "What you did is wrong" and "When you grind, it makes me feel like you don't value our relationship". The first puts her on the defensive, the second gives her room to suggest solutions.

 

So when you discussed it, if your approach was closer to the first, I suggest you try to get your point across using the second approach. Forget whether what she did is right or wrong. Don't even bring it up, even if you're tempted to do so. Focus on how it made you feel. That way, she can make amends, propose a solution and she won't feel like you're judging her and trying to control her.

[thatdog]

There is nothing wrong with going to club while in a relationship but it depends on what kind of club. There are meat market clubs that are pretty much havens for people looking to hook up but there are also places where you just go and have fun. I would rather hang out at a neighborhood bar myself instead of most dance clubs.

 

The problem here I find is that meat markets cater to girls. Back when i was into clubbing I always went to 'rave' nights where the clubs played jungle, dnb, hardcore ad such. Most girls i knew were all into RnB and House (yeah I'm an old fogey so idk what's 'relevant' with the kids now ). Clubs become meatmarkets cos they play the music the most girls generally like and do other things to entice girls. The guys just follow cos theyy want to pick up and know those are the places with the highest concentration of girls...

[donnamaybe]

People in a relationship shouldn't even go to clubs?! Why? You don't have to dance like you're in heat, hook up with someone or any kind of action that is disrespectful to your relationship just because you went to a club. The only thing you have to do is be around other people in the same building.

 

But I do know what grind dancing signals to guys. The OP's GF is playing naive (or just is that dumb).

s4s, some people have no self control. I guess, once inside the door of a club, they lose all sense of decorum and just start dry humping everything that can't run as fast as they can.

 

All kidding aside, my sweety and I go out often. Sometimes we're together, sometimes separate. BUT - we never lose sight of what is important: US together. I would never do something that would give an outsider the impression that our relationship were less than it is. Even, heaven forbid, should I enter the doors of the dreaded club where all the sex maniacs hang out.

[snug.bunny]

 

I do this with random women every week. In fact, last night I did this with like 20 different women. Some of them have boyfriends/husbands. And the etiquette for this particular dance is you remove all items in your right pocket, because that's where her crotch goes, as you can see in the video.

 

So I think knittress and others have mentioned -- this is purely a boundary issue problem.

 

That example is a bit different. Remember Along Came Polly?:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTsNrtIjZ40&feature=related

 

 

This, is disrespectful:

 

[Memphis Raines]

Forgive me... I'm a little pissed off right now. I found the nearest forum to vent promptly. My girlfriend was grinding with god knows how many people at the club last night.

 

get rid of her. she was having simulated sex with other guys on the dancefloor.

 

you think she'd grind with a guy she thinks is ugly?

 

 

Her friend told me and I was livid but I kept my cool in front of her. Her justification was "it's just a dance", and "grinding doesn't do anything for me".

 

then why do it?

 

 

Excuse me... it isn't just a dance... it's dry humping/simulated sex. It wasn't just her cavalier additude that pissed me off... it was the fact she acted like I was a control freak when I told her to knock it off.

 

enough said, dump her. let her rub her fish taco up against other guys crotches and move on to a better class of girl.

 

 

I have been fair throughout this relationship... and when I ask for her to stop she gets defensive? Aren't I right though, isn't grinding more than just a dance? Isn't it disrespectful to our relationship?

 

it is very disrespectful. and if it doesn't do anything for her, why does she continue to do it?

 

I wouldn't put up with it if I were you, move on to greener pastures.

[Memphis Raines]

this is why I don't date women who like to go clubbing.

[fishtaco]

The way she said it made me go EH?! She said people don't really dance.. just grind. I don't like the fact that she is usually liquored up (she is confused, and will make friends with just about any creep around when she's drunk, she said so herself) and grinding in itself is something I find baffling. It's used to elicit sexual pleasure, and it is essentially dry humping/stand up lap dance. I question a guys motives if he's going around doing that.

 

The dance moves by themselves could be just dance moves. If everyone around you is grinding, and that's just how it is, then it becomes culturally accepted. The bachata video clip I showed could be considered worse than grinding, because you are actually facing each other. And let me tell you, I'll find out by the end of the night who has fake boobs... with my chest. But it does take more training to pull off, so the people that can do it right, usually are in it for the dance.

 

So it's NOT about the dance moves. It's about what you don't like about this situation. Is it because you think she'll cheat on you? Is it because you think she'll get drunk and get raped by guys? Is it because you think it makes you look bad, because your woman just go off and get all crazy? Is it because you don't like to see your girlfriend dance sexy with other guys?

 

This is where the compromise comes from. You let her do her thing, except the part that annoys you the most. So you have to figure out the reason.

 

Some of the common compromises of dance couples, some are more strict than others, and they "solve" different issues, depending on what is bothering you:

- She's only allowed to grind with friends, but can dance with whoever

- When she's with you, she's only allowed to grind with you. When she's not with you, she can do whatever

- When she's with you, she can do whatever (because you can watch and keep her out of trouble), when she's by herself she's not allowed to grind or talk to drunk guys

- She's only allowed to go to certain clubs... pick the ones that are less meat market-ish

- She is allowed to grind, but after every song or so (tough because songs are mixed together), she has to come back to you, so it's obvious you're her man and she's taken.

- She can only go out with responsible friends that you know will watch out for her.

 

I'm sure there are many others, but these are just some possible compromises to get your brain storming started. If your reason is "grinding is not dancing", well, that's not a good reason. So think about why this annoys you, and come up with a compromise.

 

Like I said, if she's not willing to compromise, that itself is a way worse sign than any grinding with random drunk guys, my personal opinion.

[Dust]

I never knew that men could be turned on by such an act.

 

I never knew men couldn’t be turned on by pressing their entire bodies together with a girl while she rubs her butt back and forth against his crotch.

[elaina]

The dance moves by themselves could be just dance moves. If everyone around you is grinding, and that's just how it is, then it becomes culturally accepted.

I know guys who have no problem dancing like that with their girlfriend, but would have a huge issue if she danced like that with another man, and girls too. Many girls do not appreciate some other girl rubbing her crotch on their man's leg. For many couples, that is extremely disrespectful. It would be interesting to know the people you hang out with, because in both Indian and Latino cultures, the men and women don't tend to appreciate their loved one rubbing their crotch on another person... I had an Indian boyfriend before, by the way, a wonderful man, and he would never even consider such a thing to be acceptable for me to do. Also, the guy I'm interested in is Latino, and he would not appreciate me doing that with another man. That would be a dealbreaker for him, and I understand that.

 

 

The bachata video clip I showed could be considered worse than grinding, because you are actually facing each other. And let me tell you, I'll find out by the end of the night who has fake boobs... with my chest. But it does take more training to pull off, so the people that can do it right, usually are in it for the dance.

Do you have a long term girlfriend? Is she ok with you doing this with other girls? Are you ok with her doing this with other guys? If so, that's your business, but not all men and women are like y'all in being ok with that.

So it's NOT about the dance moves.

Actually, I think it is.

 

The type of Bachata where the woman "glues" her crotch to a guys's leg and grinding are lusty movements "dances". They are not beautiful works of art really. It looks funny when a woman has her crotch rubbing on some guy's leg lol or a man is rubbing a woman's booty with his crotch... it looks lusty, not like a true dance move. You've never find that kind of move in classical jazz or ballet or salsa, cause it's too lusty.

 

There's a difference between sexy and amazing dance moves, and rubbing one's privates on a part of another person's body. Sexy dance moves is art in motion, rubbing one's privates on another is imitating sex, or if you'd like to call it "dry sex" or humping.

Edited April 5, 2011 by elaina