Trying to hold it together with WW

[Decimated]

This is my first time posting to LS. I have been reading for the last couple of months. Please excuse the length of this post. I sincerely do apologize but I wanted to provide as much detail as possible in order to receive constructive advice.

 

My wife and I have been married for 14 years. We have 3 children. I am a young and active 47 and she is 39. I always thought we had a great life and marriage. We seemed to be totally in love always talked about how fortunate we were to have each other. Our relationship has always been the envy of our friends and the pride of our families. I am fortunate to have a good, solid income, nice home and wonderful children. I am one of those husbands that always considered my family to be the most important part of his life. I am home every night by 6:00 pm. I am involved with our home life and don’t “hang out with the guys”.

 

My wife had become slightly selfish but I was ok with that because we had a good marriage and I loved her. When we first met and were married our relationship was close to 50/50 in terms of commitment, emotional energy, communication, sacrifice, and even household chores. But over the years the ratio had gradually changed. I had become more of a giver and her more the taker. I gave her new cars every year. I paid her credit card debts. She loves shopping…clothes, shoes etc. She always looks stunning and I was ok paying for that. I wanted her to be happy and have all the things she didn’t have growing up. Her income was hers but my income paid for everything else. In retrospect I was the enabler for her taker by spoiling her and allowing her inner princess to take over. I was the attentive, loving husband and she was the center of my universe.

 

This is her first marriage and my second. My first marriage ended after 2 years because I discovered my XW had cheated. I divorced her immediately (no children) and it was over. She regretted her affair and wanted to R but I declined and moved on. It was a very difficult time for me. I took many years to learn to trust again but I did and 5 years later I met and married my current wife.

 

About 2 years ago I started to have a feeling something was wrong in my current marriage (the same gut feelings that lead to the discovery of cheating in my first marriage) My wife seemed slightly disconnected. I discussed these feelings with my her many times. She denied anything was wrong her or us and that we were fine. I couldn’t shake those feeling so I started looking deeper.

 

I discovered in our cell phone records that she had been texting and calling some guy for 3 months…460 texts and about 30 phone calls back and forth between June and August. He turned out to be a facebook friend from her Jr. high school days. I joined facebook and was able to see some of their posts and comments to each other that seemed flirty. I confronted her and told her to stop all contact and delete him as a facebook friend or I would divorce her. She complied and ended contact with him. I even called him and told him to stay away from her. She told me that they were just friends and she got carried away and that she was sorry. She said he was married with 2 kids; they lived separate lives and were only together for their kids. She admitted that they had met for coffee and he was at her class reunion. I could not attend with her because I was at Boy Scout camp that weekend with one of our sons.

 

We reconciled and were fine after that until about July of last year. I started to get those gut feelings again. Again I expressed my concern to her. She again assured me that we were good. Our sex life seemed to be slipping to about once a week….not from lack of trying on my part. I began digging again….nothing. She now had a new phone...a smart phone with complete internet access. This should have been a big red flag.

 

As the year went on she seemed to become more disconnected from me and our children. I found I was doing more and more around the house and with the kids as well as working 50 hours a week. Because of my income she has the luxury of only working 3 days a week…about 15 hours total. I tried to reason that she maybe going through a funk of some sort. She had lost both of her parents a few years ago…4 months apart and her grandfather a couple years before that. She was now 39 years old…possible MLC. Her group of girl friends that she would go out with about once a month seemed to be breaking up. She was also unhappy with her job. She had stopped working out at the health club and was complaining that she was gaining weight….I thought she looked great.

 

In December 2010 she spoke the words that no husband ever wants to hear…”I’m not happy” She said she was dealing with stuff in her mind. She mentioned her parents and the fact that they died young…(50’s) She said she was thinking about mortality. She also said she didn’t know how she felt about me anymore. I was stunned to say the least. I didn’t expect this. After this point our sex life stopped. She noticeably pulled away from me emotionally and physically and little eye contact. During this time she stopped going to church with us as well.

 

I became hyper sensitive to everything at this point. I carefully listened to every word she said….which wasn’t much. She was never one to be open with her deep thoughts and expressing emotions….she internalizes. She did not give me much to go on. I began to investigate and track her miles as well as noting everywhere she went. I became convinced there was something more going on.

 

In early January I found out she was facebook friends with him again. He had blocked me so I could see the friendship. I confronted her and she said that it was no big deal and they didn’t communicate much…not like before. She also reiterated to me that she was not happy again and that he was not a factor.

 

In mid January I then installed a GPS tracker in the car she drives. I felt like scum for having to do it but I needed answers that she was not giving me. I began to find inconsistencies immediately….but nothing conclusive. I would not bring them up yet. I didn’t want to tip my hand.

 

I was now convinced she was involved with him again. While she was sleeping I got into her phone and found several messages in her sent file that she forgot to delete. They were from October. They seemed to be passionate in nature but incomplete…just responses. They had terms of endearments for each other like gorgeous and beautiful. She was signing with XOXOXO. She was upset that I went into her phone. I left the house for the day to think about everything. She stayed in bed all day.

 

When I came home I sat her down to talk about everything. She said they were old messages. She said that he is just a good friend and he was nice to talk to and funny. She said they had met for coffee a couple of times and messaged a couple times a week. I was getting trickle truth from her

I gave her an ultimatum. Dump this guy for good or I will file for divorce. She said she would but needed time. She promised she would not drag it out for weeks. It was now late January.

 

Over the next few weeks she dragged her feet. She would get irritated whenever I would try to talk to her about it and shut down. I would be talking to myself with no answers from her. When she did answer it would usually be one word answers with a delayed response. When this happens she looks as if she was going into a trance and will stare at the floor. At times she would start shaking. She kept saying she needed time to do this. I could tell she was fence-sitting and ambivalent.

 

When she did talk she seemed to only remember the low points in our marriage…there were not many and they were minor and none of the great times. She had rewritten our marriage history in her mind and would tend to demonize me at times and accuse me of being controlling and emotionally unavailable when in actuality, the opposite was true. I would point out some of the errors and she would look confused and not have a response. During these times I was always calm and composed with her. I was not begging or pleading but I was trying ask her questions and occasionally point out that in our relationship was basically sound and salvageable. She remained distant…not much conversation or eye contact.

 

The GPS data had showed me that she had been meeting him at least a couple times a week which was easy because my wife only worked 3 days a week…about 5 hours a day. He is self employed, if that is what you call it, and works out of his family house….about 5 miles away. They would meet at the grocery store, have lunches together, in coffee shops, meeting and parking in far corners of parking lots for short amounts of time, going for drives. I found out later that they had met for dinner and drinks at least once. She had lied and told me she was meeting a girl friend.

 

The GPS also showed that they had met in a hotel one afternoon. This was the point that I confronted her with all of the GPS evidence. She broke down and cried and swore that nothing physical ever happened and that they had kissed once. In the hotel room they were only talking and she was crying the whole time because she had to make a choice. She said she needed to talk to him and she knew she would be crying and that’s why they got a hotel room. At this point she said that it was pretty much over with him. I asked her if she loved him, she said no.

 

In late February, I made an appointment with a attorney and told her if she didn’t say good bye to him forever…DNC, Fully commit to rebuilding our marriage, seek help in IC to start with, and hand over all passwords for her laptop and phone by the time of the appointment, 3:00 pm, I was filling for D.

 

On the day of the appointment she sent me a text at 1:30 saying that she didn’t know if I really had an appointment but she didn’t want me to go. I sent back “I didn’t want to go either but I can not live like this anymore”. At 2:58 pm she sent “I know, I understand…I’m sorry”. To me this meant go head and file. I went to the appointment but it was a first consultation. I did not tell her that.

 

When I got home she wanted to know what happened. I told her I went to the lawyers office. She said “why didn’t you call me”. I said you gave me your answer in your last text and it wasn’t the one I needed to stop me. She said that wasn’t what she meant and that she ended it with him that afternoon and sent him a DNC note, deleted him from facebook, wanted to commit to our marriage and wanted to see a therapist. She was still reluctant to hand over passwords.

 

That night she initiated sex with me. I was very passionate and unexpected. This would be the last time we had sex. She seemed to be a lot better in the following days… better eye contact, more talkative, great hugs and kisses before and after work. She was saying I love you again. From there it has been up and down.

 

She seems to have good days and bad days in terms of her being distant. Some days she seems deep in the fog….staring into space and won’t show much affection. She is still not able to open up and discuss the affair and why she got involved with him. This is the most frustrating part of this R, if that is what you call it. When I try to talk to her about it she gets irritated and defensive and shuts down. She shows no patience or compassion for me. At one point she said “it is all up here in my head and that is where it is staying” She also said she may tell a therapist but not me. I asked her why, are you afraid you will hurt me? She said “maybe…I don’t know”. I said “It can’t possibly be worse that I have already imagined.

 

She claims she has not had contact with him. I cannot be sure. He is not on her facebook but that means nothing. Some of their communicating was done with instant messenger from her cell phone. She has yet to schedule an appointment with a therapist….doesn’t trust them. She says she is working on our marriage but has yet to do anything. She is still acting stubborn and not always totally transparent with her whereabouts during the day but she is getting better. Lately, she has been sending me texts letting me know where she is going although she tends to leave things out occasionally. She wants the GPS off of her car. She still refuses to discuss the affair or her feelings and shuts down when I try. She still has not given me her computer password but her phone is unlocked now although it is never more that a couple feet away from her at all times. The only difference in her is she seems to be more talkative about everyday stuff at home and we have better eye contact. Her “I love you’s” and hugs are more frequent. She still has no interest in sex. She say’s she is not thinking about that right now.

 

I am concerned that she does not seem to show any remorse for her actions. She has not apologized for the pain she has put me through …not even a simple “I’m sorry” She shows no patience or compassion for me…no empathy when I try to discuss the affair or ask her questions. This is not the woman I fell in love with or married…more like her evil twin. I feel I am doing most of the work towards getting past this.

 

I am trying to take it one day at a time. I try to reassure her that I am here for her if she makes an effort but her affair is absolutely unacceptable. At the same time I am doing a soft 180…working on myself. I have started to go out with friends again and treat myself after years of sacrifice. Strange thing, she has been snooping through my stuff and cell phone. She seemed to be really jealous when an old work friend (attractive younger woman) looked me up on facebook and sent me some messages that were flirty in nature.

 

This is the most painful experience I have ever been through. There are days that I feel like just filing D and walking away. I do think that I owe it to my kids and our families to exhaust every last option before doing so. If I decide to D her I need to make sure I can walk away with no guilt or regrets. I couldn’t live with that.

 

I don’t want to end what was, for the most part, a good marriage. I don’t want to lose her or destroy our family...our children would be devastated. I am committed to rebuilding our marriage but at this point I am doing all of the work, feeling all of the pain and making all of the sacrifices.

 

I welcome any comments, thoughts or observations you may have relating to my dilemma or your personal experiences.

 

Some questions I have are…

 

Is she in this emotional affair fog that I have read about?

Should I be more patient?

How long can I expect it to last? And what should I do…not do?

Is the fact that she seems to be depressed a good sign…could it mean that there is still no contact?

[WorldIsYours]

This is my first time posting to LS. I have been reading for the last couple of months. Please excuse the length of this post. I sincerely do apologize but I wanted to provide as much detail as possible in order to receive constructive advice.

 

My wife and I have been married for 14 years. We have 3 children. I am a young and active 47 and she is 39. I always thought we had a great life and marriage. We seemed to be totally in love always talked about how fortunate we were to have each other. Our relationship has always been the envy of our friends and the pride of our families. I am fortunate to have a good, solid income, nice home and wonderful children. I am one of those husbands that always considered my family to be the most important part of his life. I am home every night by 6:00 pm. I am involved with our home life and don’t “hang out with the guys”.

 

My wife had become slightly selfish but I was ok with that because we had a good marriage and I loved her. When we first met and were married our relationship was close to 50/50 in terms of commitment, emotional energy, communication, sacrifice, and even household chores. But over the years the ratio had gradually changed. I had become more of a giver and her more the taker. I gave her new cars every year. I paid her credit card debts. She loves shopping…clothes, shoes etc. She always looks stunning and I was ok paying for that. I wanted her to be happy and have all the things she didn’t have growing up. Her income was hers but my income paid for everything else. In retrospect I was the enabler for her taker by spoiling her and allowing her inner princess to take over. I was the attentive, loving husband and she was the center of my universe.

 

This is her first marriage and my second. My first marriage ended after 2 years because I discovered my XW had cheated. I divorced her immediately (no children) and it was over. She regretted her affair and wanted to R but I declined and moved on. It was a very difficult time for me. I took many years to learn to trust again but I did and 5 years later I met and married my current wife.

 

About 2 years ago I started to have a feeling something was wrong in my current marriage (the same gut feelings that lead to the discovery of cheating in my first marriage) My wife seemed slightly disconnected. I discussed these feelings with my her many times. She denied anything was wrong her or us and that we were fine. I couldn’t shake those feeling so I started looking deeper.

 

I discovered in our cell phone records that she had been texting and calling some guy for 3 months…460 texts and about 30 phone calls back and forth between June and August. He turned out to be a facebook friend from her Jr. high school days. I joined facebook and was able to see some of their posts and comments to each other that seemed flirty. I confronted her and told her to stop all contact and delete him as a facebook friend or I would divorce her. She complied and ended contact with him. I even called him and told him to stay away from her. She told me that they were just friends and she got carried away and that she was sorry. She said he was married with 2 kids; they lived separate lives and were only together for their kids. She admitted that they had met for coffee and he was at her class reunion. I could not attend with her because I was at Boy Scout camp that weekend with one of our sons.

 

We reconciled and were fine after that until about July of last year. I started to get those gut feelings again. Again I expressed my concern to her. She again assured me that we were good. Our sex life seemed to be slipping to about once a week….not from lack of trying on my part. I began digging again….nothing. She now had a new phone...a smart phone with complete internet access. This should have been a big red flag.

 

As the year went on she seemed to become more disconnected from me and our children. I found I was doing more and more around the house and with the kids as well as working 50 hours a week. Because of my income she has the luxury of only working 3 days a week…about 15 hours total. I tried to reason that she maybe going through a funk of some sort. She had lost both of her parents a few years ago…4 months apart and her grandfather a couple years before that. She was now 39 years old…possible MLC. Her group of girl friends that she would go out with about once a month seemed to be breaking up. She was also unhappy with her job. She had stopped working out at the health club and was complaining that she was gaining weight….I thought she looked great.

 

In December 2010 she spoke the words that no husband ever wants to hear…”I’m not happy” She said she was dealing with stuff in her mind. She mentioned her parents and the fact that they died young…(50’s) She said she was thinking about mortality. She also said she didn’t know how she felt about me anymore. I was stunned to say the least. I didn’t expect this. After this point our sex life stopped. She noticeably pulled away from me emotionally and physically and little eye contact. During this time she stopped going to church with us as well.

 

I became hyper sensitive to everything at this point. I carefully listened to every word she said….which wasn’t much. She was never one to be open with her deep thoughts and expressing emotions….she internalizes. She did not give me much to go on. I began to investigate and track her miles as well as noting everywhere she went. I became convinced there was something more going on.

 

In early January I found out she was facebook friends with him again. He had blocked me so I could see the friendship. I confronted her and she said that it was no big deal and they didn’t communicate much…not like before. She also reiterated to me that she was not happy again and that he was not a factor.

 

In mid January I then installed a GPS tracker in the car she drives. I felt like scum for having to do it but I needed answers that she was not giving me. I began to find inconsistencies immediately….but nothing conclusive. I would not bring them up yet. I didn’t want to tip my hand.

 

I was now convinced she was involved with him again. While she was sleeping I got into her phone and found several messages in her sent file that she forgot to delete. They were from October. They seemed to be passionate in nature but incomplete…just responses. They had terms of endearments for each other like gorgeous and beautiful. She was signing with XOXOXO. She was upset that I went into her phone. I left the house for the day to think about everything. She stayed in bed all day.

 

When I came home I sat her down to talk about everything. She said they were old messages. She said that he is just a good friend and he was nice to talk to and funny. She said they had met for coffee a couple of times and messaged a couple times a week. I was getting trickle truth from her

I gave her an ultimatum. Dump this guy for good or I will file for divorce. She said she would but needed time. She promised she would not drag it out for weeks. It was now late January.

 

Over the next few weeks she dragged her feet. She would get irritated whenever I would try to talk to her about it and shut down. I would be talking to myself with no answers from her. When she did answer it would usually be one word answers with a delayed response. When this happens she looks as if she was going into a trance and will stare at the floor. At times she would start shaking. She kept saying she needed time to do this. I could tell she was fence-sitting and ambivalent.

 

When she did talk she seemed to only remember the low points in our marriage…there were not many and they were minor and none of the great times. She had rewritten our marriage history in her mind and would tend to demonize me at times and accuse me of being controlling and emotionally unavailable when in actuality, the opposite was true. I would point out some of the errors and she would look confused and not have a response. During these times I was always calm and composed with her. I was not begging or pleading but I was trying ask her questions and occasionally point out that in our relationship was basically sound and salvageable. She remained distant…not much conversation or eye contact.

 

The GPS data had showed me that she had been meeting him at least a couple times a week which was easy because my wife only worked 3 days a week…about 5 hours a day. He is self employed, if that is what you call it, and works out of his family house….about 5 miles away. They would meet at the grocery store, have lunches together, in coffee shops, meeting and parking in far corners of parking lots for short amounts of time, going for drives. I found out later that they had met for dinner and drinks at least once. She had lied and told me she was meeting a girl friend.

 

The GPS also showed that they had met in a hotel one afternoon. This was the point that I confronted her with all of the GPS evidence. She broke down and cried and swore that nothing physical ever happened and that they had kissed once. In the hotel room they were only talking and she was crying the whole time because she had to make a choice. She said she needed to talk to him and she knew she would be crying and that’s why they got a hotel room. At this point she said that it was pretty much over with him. I asked her if she loved him, she said no.

 

In late February, I made an appointment with a attorney and told her if she didn’t say good bye to him forever…DNC, Fully commit to rebuilding our marriage, seek help in IC to start with, and hand over all passwords for her laptop and phone by the time of the appointment, 3:00 pm, I was filling for D.

 

On the day of the appointment she sent me a text at 1:30 saying that she didn’t know if I really had an appointment but she didn’t want me to go. I sent back “I didn’t want to go either but I can not live like this anymore”. At 2:58 pm she sent “I know, I understand…I’m sorry”. To me this meant go head and file. I went to the appointment but it was a first consultation. I did not tell her that.

 

When I got home she wanted to know what happened. I told her I went to the lawyers office. She said “why didn’t you call me”. I said you gave me your answer in your last text and it wasn’t the one I needed to stop me. She said that wasn’t what she meant and that she ended it with him that afternoon and sent him a DNC note, deleted him from facebook, wanted to commit to our marriage and wanted to see a therapist. She was still reluctant to hand over passwords.

 

That night she initiated sex with me. I was very passionate and unexpected. This would be the last time we had sex. She seemed to be a lot better in the following days… better eye contact, more talkative, great hugs and kisses before and after work. She was saying I love you again. From there it has been up and down.

 

She seems to have good days and bad days in terms of her being distant. Some days she seems deep in the fog….staring into space and won’t show much affection. She is still not able to open up and discuss the affair and why she got involved with him. This is the most frustrating part of this R, if that is what you call it. When I try to talk to her about it she gets irritated and defensive and shuts down. She shows no patience or compassion for me. At one point she said “it is all up here in my head and that is where it is staying” She also said she may tell a therapist but not me. I asked her why, are you afraid you will hurt me? She said “maybe…I don’t know”. I said “It can’t possibly be worse that I have already imagined.

 

She claims she has not had contact with him. I cannot be sure. He is not on her facebook but that means nothing. Some of their communicating was done with instant messenger from her cell phone. She has yet to schedule an appointment with a therapist….doesn’t trust them. She says she is working on our marriage but has yet to do anything. She is still acting stubborn and not always totally transparent with her whereabouts during the day but she is getting better. Lately, she has been sending me texts letting me know where she is going although she tends to leave things out occasionally. She wants the GPS off of her car. She still refuses to discuss the affair or her feelings and shuts down when I try. She still has not given me her computer password but her phone is unlocked now although it is never more that a couple feet away from her at all times. The only difference in her is she seems to be more talkative about everyday stuff at home and we have better eye contact. Her “I love you’s” and hugs are more frequent. She still has no interest in sex. She say’s she is not thinking about that right now.

 

I am concerned that she does not seem to show any remorse for her actions. She has not apologized for the pain she has put me through …not even a simple “I’m sorry” She shows no patience or compassion for me…no empathy when I try to discuss the affair or ask her questions. This is not the woman I fell in love with or married…more like her evil twin. I feel I am doing most of the work towards getting past this.

 

I am trying to take it one day at a time. I try to reassure her that I am here for her if she makes an effort but her affair is absolutely unacceptable. At the same time I am doing a soft 180…working on myself. I have started to go out with friends again and treat myself after years of sacrifice. Strange thing, she has been snooping through my stuff and cell phone. She seemed to be really jealous when an old work friend (attractive younger woman) looked me up on facebook and sent me some messages that were flirty in nature.

 

This is the most painful experience I have ever been through. There are days that I feel like just filing D and walking away. I do think that I owe it to my kids and our families to exhaust every last option before doing so. If I decide to D her I need to make sure I can walk away with no guilt or regrets. I couldn’t live with that.

 

I don’t want to end what was, for the most part, a good marriage. I don’t want to lose her or destroy our family...our children would be devastated. I am committed to rebuilding our marriage but at this point I am doing all of the work, feeling all of the pain and making all of the sacrifices.

 

I welcome any comments, thoughts or observations you may have relating to my dilemma or your personal experiences.

 

Some questions I have are…

 

Is she in this emotional affair fog that I have read about?

Should I be more patient?

How long can I expect it to last? And what should I do…not do?

Is the fact that she seems to be depressed a good sign…could it mean that there is still no contact?

 

Dude you need to leave her. She cheated and has no remorse for her actions. I know you still want to keep it together because you've been with her a long time but being in a miserable relationship with someone who doesn't love you and puts your life at risk for STDs will destroy you. Your kids do not need to witness a bad relationship between their parents. Don't try to use your kids to stay in a crappy marriage because that is no way to live.

[dreamingoftigers]

Okay, you clearly want to be in this marriage but get overwhelmed/exasperated sometimes.

 

Don't do a 'soft 180' do a hard one. A solid 100% 180.

 

See what happens in the next month.

 

She doesn't "Get it" and maybe having you pull away 100% and drop the issue completely until she stops her games will do it.

 

She hasn't earned her way back into the marriage yet and supporting her through this actually is giving her the ticket to prolong it and not deal with it. Trying to push her to open up will be fruitless.

 

Check out the book After the Affair. It has some pretty good ideas about how a WS thinks and why.

[TMCM]

By your comments, it sounds like your W is going through a female MLC.

 

Hands down one of the best books dealing with female MLC is an ebook written by Christine Carter Schaap titled "Survive Your Wife’s Midlife Crisis (Eight Steps From Bleak to Bliss)". Her approach almost mirrors Michele Weiner-Davis 180 degrees check list. I beleive you will like what she says.

[drifter777]

The GPS also showed that they had met in a hotel one afternoon. This was the point that I confronted her with all of the GPS evidence. She broke down and cried and swore that nothing physical ever happened and that they had kissed once. In the hotel room they were only talking and she was crying the whole time because she had to make a choice. She said she needed to talk to him and she knew she would be crying and that’s why they got a hotel room.

 

Hotel room and nothing physical happened? That's an insult to your intelligence. They had sex. You are not dealing with an Emotional Affair, this is the physical kind.

 

To this point you have handled this whole thing very, very carefully and that is to say very, very weakly. If you are afraid to start a new life without her or refuse to break up your family than just keep doing what you are doing or give up and let her run around with whoever she chooses. If you want things to change I think you know pretty well what you have to do. My guess is that you know in your heart which way you should go so listen to it and just do it.

[dreamingoftigers]

Oh you do realize that they had a physical affair, there is really no getting around that one. I caught my father in a hotel room (phone call, not in person) and he told me he was having a "business meeting." Riiiiggggghhhttt.......

[YellowShark]

A few choice cliches.

 

1) If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck and looks like a duck.... it's a duck.

 

2) Don't buy her denials and half-truths. A person with nothing to hide, hides nothing.

 

Sorry you have to go through this Decimated, but it is not a reflection on you, it's a reflection on her. Do what you have to do to protect yourself from her taking this very unhealthy destructive path in life with an old flame.

 

Best of luck.

[dreamingoftigers]

She married you for your money. You gave her all the toys, cars, clothes etc., now she wants a boy toy.

 

By the way you need to get your kids, all of them, DNA tested, because there's a good chance one or more, aren't yours biologically. It's unlikely this is the first time she ever cheated on you.

 

A woman like your wife is just selfish. (New car EVERY year? That's just pure greed on her part.)

 

Just divorce her as quickly as possible and try your best to minimize the economic damage. Even if it costs half your stuff to get rid of her, that's a winning deal for you.

 

Do you read minds part-time or something?

[whammy]

i have one question for you and when you answer it you will know what to do. If your wife was a millionaire, where would she be right now... right this second? would she be at home working on the marriage? or at the beach with loverboy?

 

and since you know in your heart, that should would be gone if she wast financially Dependant on you, Ill ask you another question. If she had money and left... would she take her kids with her?

once again, I think you know the answer... no, she would probably leave them with you.

 

i think you know the answer....

[Binster]

Sorry mate I dont mean to kick you when your down and I'm not saying divorce her or dont, but you just dont get a hotel room to say goodby -no way.

Also stop being so good to her she wants a new car this year tell her to put more hours in, you've been taken for granted for long enough.

[rowell2024]

Why is it almost EVERY TIME a WS gets caught or admits to being in a hotel room with their OP, they say stupid stuff like "we just kissed" or "we just hugged" or even "we just hugged and kissed". Then they expect the BS to actually believe it?

[misternoname]

Why is it almost EVERY TIME a WS gets caught or admits to being in a hotel room with their OP, they say stupid stuff like "we just kissed" or "we just hugged" or even "we just hugged and kissed". Then they expect the BS to actually believe it?

 

I got the same line of BS from my now ex wife. Truly an insult to your intelligence origianl poster! People don't sneak off to a hotel to just kiss. What baloney!

[UnsureinSeattle]

It sounds like it is more than an EA and it sounds like she's not particularly remorseful.

 

And it sounds like you've been plenty patient. You've already warned her about the consequences of maintaining this "friendship."

[Spark1111]

I'm sorry. I truly do not see that she suffered any consequences for her actions.

 

Maybe you are too patient?

 

NC, IC, MC, and all passwords. Out him to his wife. Expose the affair.

 

Work on yourself, your life, your goals. Hope for the best, but prepare for the worst: a future without her.

 

Draw your line in the sand. Next contact with OM, to the curb she goes.

 

I understand you love her and want this to work, but do not be played here.

 

Often, the WS makes a million promises and steps up their game to placate the BS, only to have the EA go further underground.

 

There is all sorts of spyware. Install it. Only when there are true consequences for both APs, does the fog lift.

[RobD70]

You hold all the cards, "Decimated" is what her life would be if you left her.

 

She's still pinning for the affair and yea, you should assume she slept with him. She still doesn't fully understand what she has done and what she will lose if she continues it (and yes she will reach out to him again after the dust settles).

 

You can't get her to fall back in love with you again by being the nice guy, you have to man up and show her the consequences.

 

Whether you want to stay with her or not, you should still move forward towards a divorce. Divorces take some time to process so she will have an opportunity to do the right things and stop it before it's finialized. She has to experence the real fear of losing you forever before she can re-evaluate her feelings for you. That means file a petition and kick her out for a while. She has to prove herself to you again for your marriage to work.

 

If she doesn't then you are better off without her because she WILL cheat again. You've been too much of a parent to her instead of a husband so now you have to change that perspective she has. You can't treat her like a princess anymore, that's never a good idea to do for any woman. I learned that the hard way myself.

[Decimated]

Thank you for your responses and observations. The point has been made rather clearly that I have been way too soft in my approach to this situation…I agree.

 

Yesterday she went to church with us, breakfast after and had spent a good day together at home. She seemed happy. We talked, joked around and there was good eye contact as well.

 

Later she was on facebook and I asked her to see her inbox. She said no. She said "there is nothing in there" Her response was rather light hearted like she doesn't get why I don't trust her. It seems like she is in denial about anything that may have happened was that bad or she has compartmentalized it to a point where it doesn't register in her conscious mind.

 

The kids were getting hungry so I asked her what was for dinner. She said we didn't have anything and she would be grocery shopping the next day. I ended up going to the store and buying food to cook for dinner and cooking it while she lay on the couch all afternoon watching TV and surfing the web. I even ended up doing 3 loads of laundry so the kids and I would have clean clothes and clean towels for showers in the morning.

 

OpunRode, our children are mine…no doubt. She started acting this way about 3 years ago. Our kids are a lot older than that. Our relationship was much different before her parents passed away. It went down hill after that. Besides, they look just like me.

 

She still claims no contact but I have no way to prove it.

I have decided to set a date in the near future to file for "D" if things don't change drastically. I will not tell her…I will just do it. I will also have her served at work to strengthen the shock effect. I think she knows that if I "D" her she will be financially set and I will be living in a cardboard box. I do believe she doesn't think I would ever do it and she is playing me and using me for a door mat. Weather their relationship was ever physical is immaterial at this point. If she is not in contact with OM (he is married too) than I would be willing to be more patient but I am getting sick of doing all the work on us and around the house.

 

I just pray that I have the courage and strength when that day comes to go through with it.

[dreamingoftigers]

Thank you for your responses and observations. The point has been made rather clearly that I have been way too soft in my approach to this situation…I agree.

 

Yesterday she went to church with us, breakfast after and had spent a good day together at home. She seemed happy. We talked, joked around and there was good eye contact as well.

 

Later she was on facebook and I asked her to see her inbox. She said no. She said "there is nothing in there" Her response was rather light hearted like she doesn't get why I don't trust her. It seems like she is in denial about anything that may have happened was that bad or she has compartmentalized it to a point where it doesn't register in her conscious mind.

 

The kids were getting hungry so I asked her what was for dinner. She said we didn't have anything and she would be grocery shopping the next day. I ended up going to the store and buying food to cook for dinner and cooking it while she lay on the couch all afternoon watching TV and surfing the web. I even ended up doing 3 loads of laundry so the kids and I would have clean clothes and clean towels for showers in the morning.

 

OpunRode, our children are mine…no doubt. She started acting this way about 3 years ago. Our kids are a lot older than that. Our relationship was much different before her parents passed away. It went down hill after that. Besides, they look just like me.

 

She still claims no contact but I have no way to prove it.

I have decided to set a date in the near future to file for "D" if things don't change drastically. I will not tell her…I will just do it. I will also have her served at work to strengthen the shock effect. I think she knows that if I "D" her she will be financially set and I will be living in a cardboard box. I do believe she doesn't think I would ever do it and she is playing me and using me for a door mat. Weather their relationship was ever physical is immaterial at this point. If she is not in contact with OM (he is married too) than I would be willing to be more patient but I am getting sick of doing all the work on us and around the house.

 

I just pray that I have the courage and strength when that day comes to go through with it.

 

Whoa whoa whoa.

 

Look my friend, your boundaries are shot and you are playing the passive game. You don't get through to someone or effect any real change by playing either the Passive or the Aggressive game.

 

Lay it out and let her choose which way is up.

 

You set a bottom line and stick with it, drag both of your asses into MC.

 

If you want this marriage at all anymore that means work on your behalf to change the dynamic in it.

 

If you don't then walk, don't just sit there acting like "everything might be fine" or you are "a little down." That just looks like permission and she won't even realize that something has to change.

 

Your approach just went from 'soft' to 'invisible.' Not hard or firm.

 

You not telling her is the same type of withholding communication that has poisioned the relationship to begin with! The antidote is not, add some more poison in the mix!

 

My friend, and I mean this with all sincerity, there is no such thing as a "soft 180." A soft 180 degrees is like 30 degrees, which still puts you way off course! Even if it is 150 degrees, you are still off-course.

 

I know damn well that you "shouldn't have to do it." But guess what? There are plenty of things in this stupid adult life that we "shouldn't have to do" to fix up something we want.

 

At this point if you want to trial-period your marriage, you have to be making changes too instead of just being "marriage-change surveillance." That just allows her to do more of the same with your supposed blessing. Nothing will change before you give your final notice, which is a strike out of spite no less. (Not saying that she doesn't deserve it.)

 

If you don't want to change your behaviours and efforts and put your foot down, then don't wait around and just file for D. Either way you are in control of your destiny and not waiting around for your spouse to decide it for you.

 

You are giving your power, boundaries, marriage and relationship over to someone else that clearly hasn't got the sense or whatever right now to handle even the basics. You have to do it. No one else, especially your spouse is going to do it for you.

 

If I were you (sorry that sounds condescending).

 

1. We are going to MC because I find the current situation intolerable. Without MC (go for solution-based therapy if you can find it in your area) we go no further. That is your choice. 6 sessions no less. In you don't like it, you know where the door is.

 

2. Contact Divorce Busters for the added support, those guys are great.

 

3. Look up some things about co-dependency (maybe read 12 steps for co-dependents just to make sure that you don't have these tendencies. A lot of BSs tend to be "fixers".)

4. Read After the Affair to see what the hell she was thinking.

 

5. (This should actually be one) Make sure the kids have everything they need and stabilize their environment in case their mom walks.

 

6. Demand NC with OM and transparency and make it abundantly clear that every time you request it, it is to be followed or again the door is exactly where it was last time.

 

7. (This should have been 2, but bear with me here) If you don't exercise, start. Take care of yourself and make sure that you are doing everything to fight back your own depression and do one thing purely for yourself everyday.

 

8. Don't draw hard lines that you can't follow-up on, but dammit draw some lines.

 

I am willing to bet all of my life savings ($3.24 I found in the couch, plus a chocolate bar wrapper) that this affair is largely undealt with grief and a weird aim at trying to emotionally return to a time where she didn't have that pain. Losing one's parents is not an uncommon pre-cursor to an affair. By letting go of OM, she probably weirdly subsconsciously thinks she is letting go of the past.

 

Do not think I am justifying for her. My husband has committed infidelity.

 

I hope that you will boot yourself in the arse and get fighting!

[dreamingoftigers]

 

I think she knows that if I "D" her she will be financially set and I will be living in a cardboard box.

 

I just pray that I have the courage and strength when that day comes to go through with it.

 

To be frank, I doubt that the situation is that dire, but if it comes down to that I can give you some tips on that, Like good locations etc. and good places to locate decent cardboard, I kid you not.

[What_Next]

Well said DOT, and I agree with pretty much everything you have said. Particularly the points surrounding 100% transparency, and exercise, both are absolutely crucial for healing to begin.

 

As for MC, well it is often thought of as the magic bullet, the cure-all, personally I don't think so. In fact I personally (yes this is from a personal standpoint) don't believe that it is necessary in all cases. Just my own slice on things.

 

You are acting like a specatator in your own life, pure and simple. You have all the power and means to make the changes necessary to deal with this properly, even if that means D.

 

Keep in mind though it takes 2 VERY VERY commited people to properly bet beyond any infedility and right now neither of you are.

 

Good luck.

[dreamingoftigers]

A lot of times spouse one can kick spouse two's ass out of the fog though.

[Steadfast]

I think we might live in a parallel universe friend. Except for a few details I could have written your post (and responses) myself. Eerie...the age difference between you two, the history, laziness, the spoiled rotten attitude. Closed off. It comes back like yesterday, not three years ago. One difference; my ex confessed then moved out after six-weeks of hell.

 

She said it was 'temporary' but it wasn't. It was forever.

 

You asked for, and received good advice. I'll give you some more.

 

DO NOT discuss the relationship with her. At all. Act like it is a closed subject. From now on, judge your wife by her actions, not her words. Unless you live in a state where infidelity effects custody/child support or alimony, collect and save what you have and don't bother checking anymore. Let her come and go without one question or comment from you. Be calm and positive for the kids. Let her have what she craves.

 

Do not touch her.

 

Only if she says "I'm sorry. I love you and I'm willing to do whatever it takes to save our marriage" should you break your silence. Understand?

 

She has a lot of work to do. If she loves you, she'll do it. For now, don't act; PROCEED as if your marriage is over and you are wading through the crap necessary to pull yourself out of this very dysfunctional relationship. This may be what it takes to snap her out of it. I hope so, because all things being equal, it is best for everyone if this marriage survives.

 

My wife had a lot of work to do too. But she didn't do it because deep down, she doesn't love me. I filed and divorced her, and while it wasn't easy, it was the correct thing to do. She _does_ love (and miss) the things I did for her, and she still tries to involve me...when things get tough.

 

Set a time, a 'drop dead' date. Don't tell her, that info is for you. If things haven't improved by then, file for divorce and see her out. I repeat; DO NOT LEAVE THE HOME AND YOUR CHILDREN. She is the one who is unhappy, she is the one who should leave. You can do this. You must.

 

Keep posing friend. It does help. Lots of great folks here-

[Decimated]

She has confessed to a limited point. I know some things. This started a few months ago when I was first began to discover every thing. She would only admit when backed into a corner with facts, tricks or GPS data. The details are fuzzy or incomplete though. She doesn't seem to remember some stuff or choses not to. Things like how many times they saw each other.

She still will not talk in detail about everything that happened and why...this is what I need.

 

Do not touch her?

 

What do I do when she wants to hug and kiss me? I understand the hard 180 but I live for these hugs and kisses.

It seems like she is making an effort in this area as well as the "I love you's". I never say it first anymore...I wait for her.

 

I agree with the date and secret "D" file. That is my plan.

 

I need to see remorse and guilt and apologies.

 

I need transparency...Passwords

 

I need to see an effort to R not just telling me she loves me and hugs and kisses. They are a start but not enough.

[dreamingoftigers]

She has confessed to a limited point. I know some things. This started a few months ago when I was first began to discover every thing. She would only admit when backed into a corner with facts, tricks or GPS data. The details are fuzzy or incomplete though. She doesn't seem to remember some stuff or choses not to. Things like how many times they saw each other.

She still will not talk in detail about everything that happened and why...this is what I need.

 

Do not touch her?

 

What do I do when she wants to hug and kiss me? I understand the hard 180 but I live for these hugs and kisses.

It seems like she is making an effort in this area as well as the "I love you's". I never say it first anymore...I wait for her.

 

I agree with the date and secret "D" file. That is my plan.

 

I need to see remorse and guilt and apologies.

 

I need transparency...Passwords

 

I need to see an effort to R not just telling me she loves me and hugs and kisses. They are a start but not enough.

 

This is not going to help you, as long as you aim at that, you are not headed anywhere because you will try to go in two directions at once.

 

In or out? The door is open or closed?

 

At the very least if you are trying to incorporate that into your plan contact some kind of professional who works with marital issues to even see if it is a wise decision. Do you call in the LS forum to help with the plumbing? (I recommend the DB people, resonable priced I think)

 

I would think that a marriage/divorce decision would be better made and planned if you would at least talk to someone that dealt with this as a profession. I view my family as worth that. (Not saying you don't, just throwing my own testimony in).

[Steadfast]

What do I do when she wants to hug and kiss me? I understand the hard 180 but I live for these hugs and kisses.

It seems like she is making an effort in this area as well as the "I love you's". I never say it first anymore...I wait for her.

 

We all must go our own way...walk our own path. It is just my opinion, but romantic affection is reserved for my one and only. Judging by the content of your posts, it seems you are very much living in limbo. Tell me; you're considering/planning divorce but can't resist when she tries to kiss you? Don't allow her weakness to make you weak. Skip the crumbs and order the whole meal. Give back the plastic trinket and shoot for the grand prize.

[Memphis Raines]

I joined facebook and was able to see some of their posts and comments to each other that seemed flirty. I confronted her and told her to stop all contact and delete him as a facebook friend or I would divorce her. She complied and ended contact with him. I even called him and told him to stay away from her.

 

and what did he say? was he fully contrite and didn't give you a hard time? or did he cop an attitude?

 

 

She told me that they were just friends and she got carried away and that she was sorry. She said he was married with 2 kids; they lived separate lives and were only together for their kids. She admitted that they had met for coffee and he was at her class reunion.

 

do you believe thats all that happened?

 

 

She was now 39 years old…possible MLC. Her group of girl friends that she would go out with about once a month seemed to be breaking up. She was also unhappy with her job. She had stopped working out at the health club and was complaining that she was gaining weight….I thought she looked great.

 

and isn't that the kick in the face? you would stand by her and think she looks good even if she gained weight. The other guys she would want to screw around with would only want her if she was thin. so much for loyalty.

 

 

 

In December 2010 she spoke the words that no husband ever wants to hear…”I’m not happy”

 

In early January I found out she was facebook friends with him again.

 

 

ok, you already made the threat that if she didn't stop, you'd divorce her. So now you have to make good on that.

 

 

He had blocked me so I could see the friendship. I confronted her and she said that it was no big deal and they didn’t communicate much…not like before. She also reiterated to me that she was not happy again and that he was not a factor.

 

doesn't matter, you gave her the boundaries, she crossed them again. time to tell her to leave, and document the fact she became disconnected with her kids.

 

 

When I came home I sat her down to talk about everything. She said they were old messages. She said that he is just a good friend and he was nice to talk to and funny. She said they had met for coffee a couple of times and messaged a couple times a week. I was getting trickle truth from her

I gave her an ultimatum. Dump this guy for good or I will file for divorce.

 

but you already gave that ultimatum once

 

 

She said she would but needed time. She promised she would not drag it out for weeks. It was now late January.

 

you should never give a cheating spouse time to dump their lover.

 

They make an immediate choice, lover, or the family. If they don't want to make the choice, make if for them and tell them to leave.

 

 

Over the next few weeks she dragged her feet. She would get irritated whenever I would try to talk to her about it and shut down. I would be talking to myself with no answers from her. When she did answer it would usually be one word answers with a delayed response. When this happens she looks as if she was going into a trance and will stare at the floor. At times she would start shaking. She kept saying she needed time to do this. I could tell she was fence-sitting and ambivalent.

 

knock her off the fence with divorce papers.

 

 

When she did talk she seemed to only remember the low points in our marriage…there were not many and they were minor and none of the great times. She had rewritten our marriage history in her mind and would tend to demonize me at times and accuse me of being controlling and emotionally unavailable when in actuality, the opposite was true.

 

sounds like she is trying to make her case for grounds in case of divorce. ya, I went through this too. its typical.

 

 

The GPS also showed that they had met in a hotel one afternoon. This was the point that I confronted her with all of the GPS evidence. She broke down and cried and swore that nothing physical ever happened and that they had kissed once.

 

she must think you are really stupid. you don't get a hotel room to kiss, much less once.

 

 

I don’t want to end what was, for the most part, a good marriage. I don’t want to lose her or destroy our family

 

so she has you thinking that if you can't be with a cheater that YOU would be the one to destroy the family? you think she cared about what she did to the family when she was having sex with him? (and they did have sex)

 

 

...our children would be devastated.

 

 

again, you think she was thinking about the children when she was out having her sex fun with this guy?

 

 

Some questions I have are…

 

Is she in this emotional affair fog that I have read about?

Should I be more patient?

 

and if we tell you no, will you finally put your foot down after failing to do so in the past? my answer is no, but I have to wonder if everyone here says the same, will it make a difference? No offense to you, but you already gave her ultimatums before you didn't follow through with.

 

 

How long can I expect it to last?

 

a lifetime. she isn't going to ever lose the desire to cheat. whether she actually does again or not is a different matter.

 

 

And what should I do…not do?

 

currently cheating or not, if you stay you will still be married to a cheater and someone that would really like to if she thought you'd never find out.

 

 

Is the fact that she seems to be depressed a good sign…could it mean that there is still no contact?

 

it could mean there is no contact and that is why she is depressed, because she really wants him. and that is why you should get rid of her. yes, the kids will be devestated, initially. But whats the alternative? Staying with someone like your wife who will NEVER be trustworthy?