Boyfriend broke it off and left me pretty much homeless..

[TryingtoUnderstand32]

I said amiable not admirable. He didn't kick you out in the street, he gave you rent money and offered to help you out if you need it. You're trying to turn this into some kind of drama of being left homeless. He doesn't owe you a home for life. Maybe you need to start taking responsibility for yourself and maybe he realised that he was putting up all the money while you expected an equal say without an equal contribution.

 

 

For a stranger you are making too many assumptions. anyways..

[NXS]

For a stranger you are making too many assumptions. anyways..

 

I suggest you read the thread, it's full of assumptions about him.

[TryingtoUnderstand32]

I suggest you read the thread, it's full of assumptions about him.

 

You are way off about me. But that's ok.

[musemaj11]

I

Family is sacred. I even offered to still do it. I was more upset he would go and say ok, without talking to me.

But u offered to still do it only as a last resort.

 

In his culture, if u asked him if your sister or brother could live with you and him, I bet he would say yes right away.

[Mr.Cairo]

That's a common thing among men from outside the USA.

 

We come from a culture England who's greatest monarchs have been female... plus American Indian culture in which men and women had equal power OR women often had more power...plus African culture in which women often had equal or greater power.

 

He comes from southern Europe. A place where the paterfamilias for all intents and purposes owned everything and everyone in the family. It goes back to the Romans with them.

 

To your BF he was the man of the house... soon to be paterfamilias. He wants a woman who's going to submit to that. You were raised in a culture where the man and woman of the house have equal say...no matter who does the paying.

 

This is an issue that can be worked out...but it's going to take time and patience and he has to be willing. He may not be... or he may give you a call on Monday or Tuesday.

 

You have to give him the time and space to think and make his own decision. You have to break contact completely and let him come back on his own accord. I know how hard that can be trust me.

 

 

A bit of a goddess worship, I see? I think Richard The Lion Heart etc should be informed that they were actually female. You are referring to 'Chefe de familia', the head of the family. It used to be like that in Spain and in Portugal until the end of fascism. Now women are equal to men. Equality reached such a point that, women and men divide their expenses when going out on a date.

 

You are right that European men do put far more importance on family than on their girlfriends and their wives. It has to do with the fact that romantic relationships are temporary, family is forever.

 

Second, I don't know what you are about with your belief about men dominating the women. Women are equal to men. People from the same social backgrounds get together, people with the same jobs have relationships instead of one earning more than the other.

 

No offense, but you don't really know that much about Europe to make assumptions.

 

Take it from a guy who lived in Portugal, Spain, Italy and France for several years.

 

European men put family far above their girlfriends and their wives. That's how it should be. This silly tendency that American have of putting women on a pedestal sure is strange.

[Els]

This is why I don't think I would ever be able to be with a 'pure american' woman. I was born and raised in asia and like your bf, I believe in strong family values. My family comes first and when I get married, my wife's family will come first also and I will expect her to treat my family in the same way.

 

This is the reason that I feel more comfortable with hispanic/latin women because their culture is very similar. We believe that family is sacred.

 

Uh, are you going to be completely happy with your gf bringing her family into both of yours' house without even talking to you about it?

 

I'm Asian and I don't see this as a very nice thing to do, sorry. Strong family values doesn't mean that you don't even talk to your live-in (or going-to-live-in) SO about decisions you plan to make.

[Mr.Cairo]

I

But u offered to still do it only as a last resort.

 

In his culture, if u asked him if your sister or brother could live with you and him, I bet he would say yes right away.

 

One last thing.

 

(my post is not directed at the guy I quoted)

 

Portugal has quite a bit of people from the ex-colonies. The men from Angola, Mozambique etc don't worship their women. What they do is, a bunch of women rent a house, bring their children and raise them. Their guys come home once in a while but leave soon after. The women also have children from different men. So lets say that Johnny has 4 sisters from different fathers.

 

The men from Africa(read, not westernized) are as masculine as Hemingway was many decades ago. In fact, it's becoming fairly popular for an African woman to date a Portuguese white man because of the difference of treatments.

 

Since this subject came up, I'm going to inform ya about some more European customs. It's normal for grandmothers etc to live with their family instead of being sent away. My father was raised with his great-grandmother, his mother, and his father under the same roof.

 

My mother was raised with her cousins by her grandfather and her grandmother and by her aunts, while her parents were making a living. My uncle lived with my mother well until his late 40's, which means that I was raised by my father, my mother and my uncle. My other uncles(mother side of the family) married young so they began their families sooner than my mother and my uncle, but family moved in with them as well.

 

My paternal uncle never got married so he stayed with his mother and takes perfect care of him. You know how a Portuguese woman evaluates the quality of a man? How well he treats his family. How much connected he is to his family. It's very normal for woman or for a man to introduce the potential boyfriend/girlfriend to the parents before actually having sex. One time, I went out with a Portuguese woman and her brother-in-law wanted to meet me. Even when the person moves out, it usually isn't to very far away. Many if not most stay in the same street. I remember my neighbors son or daughter living in the same building, always spending time with their parents.

 

It's also very common for example, for a mother to convince her husband that this guy deserves their daughter. My mother wasn't exactly the woman my grandparents wanted for my father, but my grandmother convinced my grandfather that she was the right one and next thing you know it, my parents were getting married. Stuff like that happens in Portugal all the time. The new addiction to the family now belongs to a selected group, nothing can interfere with that. There are cases where the bond is so strong that even when divorce occurs, the person never really leaves the family.

 

 

Young couples move in with the family of the boyfriend or the girlfriend and they save up most of what they earn to eventually move out and get their own place. People also stay at home when going to the University. Unless the student is from the country, students tend to stay with the family. When that is not the case they band up with a bunch of people from their village/city and as soon as they can, they go to see their families.

 

Babies don't usually go to kindergardens. They are raised by the grandparents. You'll see cases of people with good money but preferring to leave the baby/kid with the grandparents.

 

People always stay over with their parents when they can. The family is in permanent contact. It's very usual for a single man in his 40's, with his own house, to be on the phone everyday with his parents.

 

Parents do everything for their kids, even when the kid is grown up, an elderly woman with nothing more than her pension will spend every money she has on her family. I remember this woman in her 60's who spend the majority of her paychecks buying fruits and foods and whatever was necessary, for her daughter and her grandkids. Not that they needed it, it simply is the natural way of the Portuguese/European.

 

I remember another man, this guy was 70 years old. He'd pay for his daughter home, his grandson school, and he'd give money to charity. Should I go on?

 

Did you know that the traditional music of Portugal is called Fado? Do you know what's the other word for Fado? Saudade. It means to miss something or someone.

 

How could such a people deny whatever it was that their family wanted, when 50 years ago, the national motto was:

 

1)God.

2)Family.

3)The nation.

 

Family is even more important than God, and Portugal is a religious Country, with Churches everywhere and people spending their time doing charity work, and dedicating their free time to the Church.

 

So bro, you see, Portuguese men/European men and women sacrifice themselves for their families. Nothing of that nonsense of women submitting to men. Heck, I remember my 8th grade History teacher saying that her grandfather dominated everyone but was dominated by his 5 feet tall wife.

 

So let me see. You know my stance about relationships. But lets imagine that I cared about them. If my family didn't like the woman I was with: what do you think I was going to do?

 

Defy people who've been with me since I was alive? Defy the race that instilled great values in me?

 

Heck no. I'd dump the woman/man as fast as possible.

 

7 months against decades.

 

Maybe you thought that we were living in caves, painting our faces with red paint and treating our women like crap, huh?

Edited March 28, 2011 by Mr.Cairo

[musemaj11]

Uh, are you going to be completely happy with your gf bringing her family into both of yours' house without even talking to you about it?

 

I'm Asian and I don't see this as a very nice thing to do, sorry. Strong family values doesn't mean that you don't even talk to your live-in (or going-to-live-in) SO about decisions you plan to make.

Err, his problem with her was that she wanted his brothers to look for other 'options' first. Her upset that he didn't consult with her first is valid. But that's not why he broke it off with her.

[Mrlonelyone]

One last thing.

 

Never said they "worship" their women. Only that Matriarchy is more prevalent in Africa than in Europe. Just as matriarchy was more prevalent among the American Indians than in Europe.

 

That these cultural backgrounds informed the way we view domestic relations in the USA.

 

Here both partners are more or less equal. Wheras in the latin influence world the man is head of the house hold and he can do whatever he wants with whoever is in it. Known as pater familias

 

The point is that this is a really old cultural clash going on here and that such a cultural issue can be worked through given time. That's all I was trying to say.

[irc333]

My family comes first and when I get married

 

Actually, in marraige, the spouse comes first. It's called "cleave and leave". Of course, family is always important....but it's the spouse that should always be put first, of course this is a Biblical stand point, but apparently, that's one of the rules in marraige.

[Mr.Cairo]

Never said they "worship" their women. Only that Matriarchy is more prevalent in Africa than in Europe. Just as matriarchy was more prevalent among the American Indians than in Europe.

 

That these cultural backgrounds informed the way we view domestic relations in the USA.

 

Here both partners are more or less equal. Wheras in the latin influence world the man is head of the house hold and he can do whatever he wants with whoever is in it. Known as pater familias

 

The point is that this is a really old cultural clash going on here and that such a cultural issue can be worked through given time. That's all I was trying to say.

 

I don't know about the Native Americans because I never had any contact with their history.Africa has been part of Portugal for at least 500 years. I'm a little familiar with it. First thing a Portuguese boy learns in school is all about the former colonies and their history. The way I see it, the Africans might have had the female worshiping going on, but that probably happened centuries ago.

 

With the integration of the Africans, most Portuguese have many friends from Africa. The kid's parents are still functioning how their fathers made them to be, and I see more of a 'macho' mentality in the Africans who keep to themselves, while the ones who have children with the Portuguese become more 'feminine'.

 

African men are very strict. A friend of mine despite being born in Angola is more Portuguese than anything else, but his sisters being older, were born and raised in Angola with their father(100% African), whereas my friend was raised in Portugal by his mother(white and Portuguese).

 

His sisters are very obedient of their husbands and they are married to the Alpha male type. These guys mean business. They take everything serious and their entire life is scheduled. The wife must do their part. Look good, cook for the kids etc etc.

 

They very rarely show affection and they spend a lot of their time with their girlfriends. They are also taught to not care that much about their women and to see sex as a way to prove their value. As a group they are very homophobic. You can't show emotions, they automatically assume you are gay. Same goes for the women raised by the Alpha male type. They will come strong if they are attracted to you, but if you don't treat them like their fathers treat their mothers they won't be attracted to you.

 

They'll think you are gay or something. The Alpha male type is also very protective of their women and they don't mix with women from other races. They're repressed to the point of not finding women of other races to be attractive and they don't befriend people from other races.

 

I think that they're very much like the Asians living in Portugal. They stick to themselves. I don't recall seeing that many Asians when I visit the European Countries so it must be something to do with their culture, too macho I guess.

 

Nah, I'm not offended. That Latin dominance you speak of can be said to exist in certain areas of Oporto, and in some more rural parts of the Country, but I've visited every city in Portugal, interacted with people from all of those cities ,and I didn't see that much of that male dominance.

 

I notice that Latin dominance but within the Brazilians. They have this ' I'm gonna screw every woman in sight' mentality.

Edited March 28, 2011 by Mr.Cairo

[musemaj11]

Actually, in marraige, the spouse comes first. It's called "cleave and leave". Of course, family is always important....but it's the spouse that should always be put first, of course this is a Biblical stand point, but apparently, that's one of the rules in marraige.

What I was saying was that I'm going to treat my spouse's direct family no different than I treat my direct family.

 

But then again typical americans don't value their own family in the first place. They throw their kids on the street at 18 and the kids throw their parents to elderly homes.

 

Madness.

Edited March 28, 2011 by musemaj11

[Mr.Cairo]

What I was saying was that I'm going to treat my spouse's direct family no different than I treat my direct family.

 

But then again typical americans don't value their own family in the first place. They throw their kids on the street at 18 and the kids throw their parents to elderly homes.

 

Madness.

 

Yeah, I don't understand the habit of moving out so soon.

[SnowandStars]

What I was saying was that I'm going to treat my spouse's direct family no different than I treat my direct family.

 

But then again typical americans don't value their own family in the first place. They throw their kids on the street at 18 and the kids throw their parents to elderly homes.

 

Madness.

 

Ah, here we go with the "Americans have no family values" crap. As if you and everyone else's culture is so much better. Right. I can point out many things "wrong" with your culture. Let's not act like your culture does not have an equal amount of "faults."

[SnowandStars]

Yeah, I don't understand the habit of moving out so soon.

 

It is because the children want their independence early on. This is America. We value freedom. They feel a sense of accomplishment if they can handle the hassles of adult responsibility as early as possible. It is also out of respect because if they want to have an active dating life, they are not going to feel comfortable banging their date under their parents' roof. If they want to throw parties, where else are they going to do it? In American culture, some consider that disrespectful (past a certain age). Our culture thrives on individualism. Children are encouraged to make their own decisions and build their own lives as early as possible. It may not be the "right" way according to your standards, but it got us where we are today.

[Mr.Cairo]

It is because the children want their independence early on. This is America. We value freedom. They feel a sense of accomplishment if they can handle the hassles of adult responsibility as early as possible. It is also out of respect because if they want to have an active dating life, they are not going to feel comfortable banging their date under their parents' roof. If they want to throw parties, where else are they going to do it? In American culture, some consider that disrespectful (past a certain age). Our culture thrives on individualism. Children are encouraged to make their own decisions and build their own lives as early as possible. It may not be the "right" way according to your standards, but it got us where we are today.

 

Yeah, different perspectives. My mother's best friend had a daughter who'd sleep with her boyfriend in her mother's own house. Turns out, that guy was the best thing that ever happened to the young woman and 14 years after their marriage, his mother-in-law would do anything for him as he'd do the same, for his mother-in-law and for his wife.

 

Another friend of mine has been living with her boyfriend for the past 5 years, sharing the house with her mother and her step-father. Sometimes the boyfriend's younger brothers(5 years old and 10) spend weeks with them. They don't exactly become monks while the kids are there.

 

Boyfriends and girlfriends either spend a lot of their time in their partners houses interacting with their partner's parents, or they're there to spend the night. I only know of one couple who bought a house to have sex.

 

I don't see why it would bother the parents or the offspring. Sex is natural. People know what happens between a man and a woman. Why would someone feel uncomfortable. I mean, most people are raised by their parents. Does that mean that the parents are going to become celibates because they now have children?

 

It's the same principle. Unless the man or the woman are trying to compete in terms of sex noises with a porn star, everything is fine.

 

Christ, if we had to move out or rent a room just to have sex, I think we'd give up on sex, too expensive .

Edited March 28, 2011 by Mr.Cairo
T

[musemaj11]

Ah, here we go with the "Americans have no family values" crap. As if you and everyone else's culture is so much better. Right. I can point out many things "wrong" with your culture. Let's not act like your culture does not have an equal amount of "faults."

Just because I have my own faults doesn't mean my assessment of your faults must be wrong.

 

American culture has countless superior qualities, but family values aren't one of them.

[Nexus One]

TryingtoUnderstand32. From the sounds of it you pushed him into a corner where he probably couldn't make any other decision. I have a brother and between us it's bro's over ho's so to speak. You mentioned your relationship was relatively fresh/new, then that makes that decision even easier, for as far such a decision can be easy.

 

You actually did quite a good job of describing how he reacted, because I could almost feel similar feelings grow in me while reading that. Let me explain to you the following. When you push a guy into a corner, cut off all his options and demonstrate to him you have no compassion, then you reach a certain threshold in men. If you push beyond that threshold, then we can sever the connection between ourselves and you as the woman. I'm fairly sure this is a survival instinct/effect in men. When things that are important to men are in danger and people start to f*ck with that, then we become very practical, we then become very cold and goal oriented and the goal then is the safety of that which we care about. If he reacted as cold as you mentioned, then there's a good chance your attitude might have killed his crush for you. I'm not sure a man could ever return to feeling the same way about a specific woman after cutting off his "connection" like that. Because that is a very drastic measure for a man to do. I get the feeling you must have pushed him pretty far.

 

I'm not trying to make you feel bad, but I am telling you how it is. Although I'm not sure it's what you want to hear, but it is perhaps what you need to hear.

Edited March 28, 2011 by Nexus One

[Els]

Err, his problem with her was that she wanted his brothers to look for other 'options' first. Her upset that he didn't consult with her first is valid. But that's not why he broke it off with her.

 

Her response is affected by how and when she is told. I imagine if he had said, "Honey, can I talk to you for a bit? My parents don't have anywhere to stay...", her response would have been different from when he said, "Honey, my parents are moving in with us next month".

[musemaj11]

I have no issue with interracial relationships, but honestly I discourage intercultural relationships.

 

Racial differences are only skin deep, but cultural differences can be a mountain to climb.

[Nexus One]

I have no issue with interracial relationships, but honestly I discourage intercultural relationships.

 

Racial differences are only skin deep, but cultural differences can be a mountain to climb.

 

North American and European culture aren't that different though. I think genders from across the pond can get along quite well without too much problems.

[musemaj11]

North American and European culture aren't that different though. I think genders from across the pond can get along quite well without too much problems.

What exactly is european culture? Europe is not a country.

[Alma Mobley]

TryingtoUnderstand32. From the sounds of it you pushed him into a corner where he probably couldn't make any other decision. I have a brother and between us it's bro's over ho's so to speak. You mentioned your relationship was relatively fresh/new, then that makes that decision even easier, for as far such a decision can be easy.

 

You actually did quite a good job of describing how he reacted, because I could almost feel similar feelings grow in me while reading that. Let me explain to you the following. When you push a guy into a corner, cut off all his options and demonstrate to him you have no compassion, then you reach a certain threshold in men. If you push beyond that threshold, then we can sever the connection between ourselves and you as the woman. I'm fairly sure this is a survival instinct/effect in men. When things that are important to men are in danger and people start to f*ck with that, then we become very practical, we then become very cold and goal oriented and the goal then is the safety of that which we care about. If he reacted as cold as you mentioned, then there's a good chance your attitude might have killed his crush for you. I'm not sure a man could ever return to feeling the same way about a specific woman after cutting off his "connection" like that. Because that is a very drastic measure for a man to do. I get the feeling you must have pushed him pretty far.

 

Wow, I guess the OP herself dodged a bullet then, because that is a lot for her to have to deal with for simply asking to discuss the situation of his brothers moving into their new place before they, as a couple, had even moved into the new apartment. She made it pretty clear that all she wanted was to be consulted before her boyfriend allowed his brothers to move in.

 

I guess I'm not a family-values gal either because any boyfriend or husband of mine should actually talk to me before moving in his mother, or sister, or brother, friend, whomever.

 

I (as others have noted) think he actually was looking for a reason to break up with her. He cut it off pretty fast with no discussion.

[Stung]

What exactly is european culture? Europe is not a country.

 

Yeah, there is no such thing as a single cohesive "Native American culture," either, although it has been referenced a few times in this thread.

 

I'm with Star Gazer, this sounds an awfully lot like a rewording of StillSarcasticBlonde's situation to me, in which instance the relatives in question were a sister and toddlers fleeing a disaster-plagued and radiation-contaminated Japan. If I am wrong, OP, you have my apologies.

 

I wouldn't be happy with the bf's high-handed approach either, and we would have to have a big conversation about that--but family in extremis should come before the convenience of some girlfriend of a mere handful of months, every time. I'm not certain of the details, but it's likely I would choose to dissolve a relationship with somebody due to lack of compassion and dissimilar values myself, in those circumstances; and I am both a woman and an American for those who seem to think his was a wholly male and un-American response.

 

You're not homeless, OP. You're not out any moving expenses to the new place, and you've got another month's rent in cash. Before you get hysterical, talk to your landlord and your current boss and see if you can extend your contracts there after all, even if you have to eat a little humble pie. If that doesn't work out, you have another month to try to find someplace new on Craigslist, or appeal to your own family for help. Your recent ex might be willing to help further, he seemed to indicate as much. And if you are SSB, it's probably important to keep in mind that you were planning on rejecting your new job offer and refusing to move in with him if he didn't acquiesce to your demands, anyway.

 

I hope you're going to be able to stay where you are and continue your life with a minimum of further disruption. Good luck.

[DollyGirl12]

You're definitely dealing with cultural differences, like it or not, it' there.

What would concern me, if I were him, would be the comment about you needing to know where things stand, so you can move on and start dating.

Quite honestly, if someone said that to me I would allow them to move on, because if they are ready to get out there and start dating so soon, they probably weren't all that serious about me to begin with.