Author Eternal Sunshine Posted March 24, 2011 Author Posted March 24, 2011 I agree that how well people age is highly variable for both sexes. I am just sick of generalizations such as "men age well and women age poorly". It's simply not true.
blind_otter Posted March 24, 2011 Posted March 24, 2011 (edited) I don't think they have limited options. There are always men around the same age group. Only thing I would say is many women in their 30's are divorced with kids. Kids, even if they are good kids, can make things more complicated. For one thing, if the kid's dad is a douche, well, he can make thing tough too. This pretty much applies until the kid turns 18. Not a deal breaker for me, but not a positive thing either. ^ This! My baby daddy calls himself "the cockblock extraordinaire" for good reason. He is good at what he does. LDR, oh hai. At least I have fun vacations... That being said I have no biological clock in effect because I reproduced and, according to asian tradition, having a son means I'm done! Because hey, women are just vessel through which more penises are born into this world. /sarcasm And I am not the marrying type. I am a devadasi. Edited March 24, 2011 by blind_otter
Woggle Posted March 24, 2011 Posted March 24, 2011 I will say that men tend to collect as much baggage as women as they age. Modern day society just wears people down whether they are a man or a woman.
Author Eternal Sunshine Posted March 24, 2011 Author Posted March 24, 2011 BO I was just going to say that! While having kids at that age will limit your dating pool somewhat, at least you don't have to worry about your biological clock. You have accomplished your biological mission
threebyfate Posted March 24, 2011 Posted March 24, 2011 Ouch. So... in other words, it doesn't get any better for men as we get older. That's depressing, I was really counting on that. One more male advantage myth busted. That leaves... nothing, actually. Well, we supposedly make more money, but who the hell cares? Basically, if there's such a thing as reincarnation, and you get to pick, don't come back as a man, it's a very lonely life.No. What I'm saying is that success in dating has nothing to do with empowering oneself at the expense of another. That's why these guys fail time and again. They don't view women as people, as human being with wants, needs and feelings too. It might surprise these guys how that kind of attitude is such a turn-off to women. We can smell most of these guys coming and want nothing to do with them. That being said, there's the odd one that does fool different women, but not for long...
lenny Posted March 24, 2011 Posted March 24, 2011 I turned 38 and a half two days ago and I have to say that I disagree with the idea that the 30s have less dating options. I have weathered 4 kids, am smart and have a good career. When I was 18, I was built like a barbie doll - tall, big boobs, tight body, nice ass. Now, I'm a lot "softer" and in my opinion totally unappealing but I get more attention now than I did when I was 18. Maybe looking at me across a room would have been more appealing but I now have so much self confidence, I've found that's a way bigger attraction than the fresh looks of my youth. I had decided I wanted to be single and remain single so in an effort to discourage anyone from approaching me, totally let myself go. I still get more attention now than I did when I was 18. IMO, for a woman ... the 30's is where it's at!
Disillusioned Posted March 24, 2011 Posted March 24, 2011 And, keep in mind that 50 is the new 27. Perhaps, but I've seen with my own eyes that 80 is the new 2.
Leeway Harris Posted March 24, 2011 Posted March 24, 2011 No. What I'm saying is that success in dating has nothing to do with empowering oneself at the expense of another. That's why these guys fail time and again. They don't view women as people, as human being with wants, needs and feelings too. It might surprise these guys how that kind of attitude is such a turn-off to women. We can smell most of these guys coming and want nothing to do with them. That being said, there's the odd one that does fool different women, but not for long... Thanks for responding. But that part about "dating has nothing to do with empowering oneself at the expense of another"... Is there another way to date besides letting somebody empower themselves at your own expense? I don't know how it is for women, of course. But I feel like if I don't let women empower themselves at my expense, I'll never date again! That's why I was hoping things might change as I got older. I thought maybe the "power dynamic" would even out a little. And more women might give me a chance because now that they're older and wiser, they have to be more realistic about things. And they won't mind so much that I don't make six figures, drive a hot car, or live in the trendiest neighborhood in the city. They have to look at me rather than what I own or what kind of status I have in society. Oh well, so much for that, eh? ;-)
Eeyore79 Posted March 24, 2011 Posted March 24, 2011 That's why I was hoping things might change as I got older. I thought maybe the "power dynamic" would even out a little. And more women might give me a chance because now that they're older and wiser, they have to be more realistic about things. And they won't mind so much that I don't make six figures, drive a hot car, or live in the trendiest neighborhood in the city. They have to look at me rather than what I own or what kind of status I have in society. Oh well, so much for that, eh? ;-) I think as men get older, there's actually more of an expectation that they'll have higher status and more material assets. I suppose the thinking is something like "You're no longer offering youth and good looks, so what are you offering instead?" No young woman would date an old man unless he was offering substantial wealth to compensate for his age (nobody would have sex with Hugh Hefner unless he was wealthy enough to make up for being old). I'm not saying it's right, just saying that's how people tend to think. Older women, however, might be a bit more flexible simply because they're getting desperate. They want to settle down, get married and have a family, and their options are increasingly limited so they consider men whom they might not have wanted ten years previously. So I can see how the playing field might even out between men and women of the same age, simply because they're getting a little more desperate and keener to settle down.
Els Posted March 24, 2011 Posted March 24, 2011 If you include the shallow people, it is indeed true that women tend to lose options as they grow older, and men tend to gain them as they grow older due to increased wealth/status. However, what you may want to consider is this: Are you really bemoaning the loss of the men who would rather be banging 20 year old girls solely for their young nubile bodies? Also, are those older men really gaining anything by dating women who are with them solely for their money? The answer will hopefully be a 'no'. So yes, your pool of compatible/good options probably remains the same no matter what age you are.
Els Posted March 24, 2011 Posted March 24, 2011 Ouch. So... in other words, it doesn't get any better for men as we get older. That's depressing, I was really counting on that. One more male advantage myth busted. That leaves... nothing, actually. Well, we supposedly make more money, but who the hell cares? Basically, if there's such a thing as reincarnation, and you get to pick, don't come back as a man, it's a very lonely life. Why do you want to have that sort of lousy 'advantage' anyway? A poor man leads as 'lonely' a life as an ugly woman.. which isn't very lonely at all, really, if you know how to seek out compatible people who are with you for you. I disagree with TBF's statement, btw. One need only look at Donald Trump, Hugh Hefner, etc, to disprove that. No, Hugh is totally not 'aging well'.
Eeyore79 Posted March 24, 2011 Posted March 24, 2011 However, what you may want to consider is this: Are you really bemoaning the loss of the men who would rather be banging 20 year old girls solely for their young nubile bodies? Also, are those older men really gaining anything by dating women who are with them solely for their money? You could equally say to young men: Are you really bemoaning the loss of the young women who would rather be banging old men solely for their money? Also, are those young women really gaining anything by dating men who are with them solely for their looks? The bottom line is, it's not a good idea to date anyone solely for looks or money, no matter what age you are. So you're right in saying that women in their 30s shouldn't bemoan the loss of shallow men, just as young men shouldn't bemoan the loss of shallow women. However I still think that a person's options generally decline with age, because more of their potential dating partners are either taken or are unsuitable for various reasons (divorce, kids, etc). The reduction in suitable men within my own age group is the main reason why I've started dating younger men.
Leeway Harris Posted March 24, 2011 Posted March 24, 2011 Why do you want to have that sort of lousy 'advantage' anyway? A poor man leads as 'lonely' a life as an ugly woman.. which isn't very lonely at all, really, if you know how to seek out compatible people who are with you for you. I didn't want an "advantage", I didn't want "power" over anybody, and I didn't want a 20 year old when I'm 80. I thought what I wanted was realistic and attainable, but now that I'm 35 and running out of time, I'm learning that it's a one-in-a-million shot. So I need a new plan. Anybody know of any good monasteries?
threebyfate Posted March 24, 2011 Posted March 24, 2011 Thanks for responding. But that part about "dating has nothing to do with empowering oneself at the expense of another"... Is there another way to date besides letting somebody empower themselves at your own expense? I don't know how it is for women, of course. But I feel like if I don't let women empower themselves at my expense, I'll never date again!I've read a list of reasons stated so many times on LS by men about how women take advantage of them. Some of that list has to do with common courtesy, such as opening doors, carrying heavy objects, that kind of thing. As a woman, I open doors for anyone since no one likes having the door crash in their faces. I also have helped physically weaker individuals such as the elderly, with parcels while shopping. These are courtesies I don't mind doing for other human beings. There's no return or resentment that there's no return. Let's take paying for a first date, which is pretty much expected of men. Can't argue that this isn't sexist. But then, women doll themselves up for dates, sometimes for hours. It's also true that men have to do the pursuing most often. But sometimes, it's just as difficult being the more passive gender. You could argue that pursuing means overt rejection which hurts. But same goes for covert rejection which also hurts. Basically, I'm saying that both genders experience problems with the opposite gender when dating. We can either view it solely from our side of the gender divide focusing on the negatives of the other or we can look at it from a more balanced perspective and realize there's a human being on the other side of the line, one who might or might not be attracted. That's why I was hoping things might change as I got older. I thought maybe the "power dynamic" would even out a little. And more women might give me a chance because now that they're older and wiser, they have to be more realistic about things. And they won't mind so much that I don't make six figures, drive a hot car, or live in the trendiest neighborhood in the city. They have to look at me rather than what I own or what kind of status I have in society. Oh well, so much for that, eh? ;-)Once again, is dating even a power dynamic scenario? It can easily be viewed that way or if you shift to a more healthy perspective, it can be viewed as finding a compatible person, one who's values match yours. Take a look at your historical selections with women who you've pursued. What's your criteria for pursuit and why did they reject you each time? Is it that all women are drawn to material security or is it that you're targeting women who "look" a certain way? When I say "look", I mean how they dress and present themselves. If someone takes great pains with their appearances all the time, isn't it more likely they're going to value materiality? Of course everything I've stated above are generalities and you'll find different criteria and results, from different individuals.
Leeway Harris Posted March 24, 2011 Posted March 24, 2011 Once again, is dating even a power dynamic scenario? It can easily be viewed that way or if you shift to a more healthy perspective, it can be viewed as finding a compatible person, one who's values match yours. I agree it's more healthy to look at it from that perspective, rather than a "power dynamic" thing. But we adopt a self-defense posture in this area because it hurts. It hurts to be lonely, and to have to wonder why you're not good enough, and all that stuff. It's hard not to see it as an attack, with you on one side and the rest of the world on the other. Take a look at your historical selections with women who you've pursued. What's your criteria for pursuit and why did they reject you each time? Is it that all women are drawn to material security or is it that you're targeting women who "look" a certain way? When I say "look", I mean how they dress and present themselves. If someone takes great pains with their appearances all the time, isn't it more likely they're going to value materiality Speaking for myself, I don't pursue women. Well, I did a few times, and had successes and failures, but most of the relationships I've had were women who "picked" me. More times than not, I wouldn't have picked them, not for a relationship anyway. But the attention was too hard to resist. I feel so invisible to women most of the time, when one does pay attention to me, it's like... intoxicating! But no, I don't normally approach women. I probably don't let myself become attracted to many women, because of the risk involved. When I do meet one I'm attracted to, my strategy is to avoid her whenever possible. Otherwise, she might find out I'm attracted to her, and of course that would be unacceptable. I haven't had much luck with this approach, hard to believe, I know.
Disillusioned Posted March 25, 2011 Posted March 25, 2011 I didn't want an "advantage", I didn't want "power" over anybody, and I didn't want a 20 year old when I'm 80. I thought what I wanted was realistic and attainable, but now that I'm 35 and running out of time, I'm learning that it's a one-in-a-million shot. So I need a new plan. Anybody know of any good monasteries? Just save up your bread, buy a Realdoll like Iiiiieee did, and kiss the frustration and the headgames goodbye.
pj1970 Posted March 25, 2011 Posted March 25, 2011 beauty fades the moment one begins in the ability for it to do so
Knittress Posted March 25, 2011 Posted March 25, 2011 Just save up your bread, buy a Realdoll like Iiiiieee did, and kiss the frustration and the headgames goodbye. OMG! They make Shemales TOO! ROFL, someone spends waaaay too much time on the internet.
kiss_andmakeup Posted March 25, 2011 Posted March 25, 2011 (edited) I think women are so used to the massive advantage they have in the dating world while in their 20's, that upon entering their 30's and beyond, the playing field simply becoming more level (i.e. neither side having an "advantage") can just feel like a disadvantage. And I'd think attractive, intelligent women would have no trouble getting dates regardless of their age. Oh, and it's worth noting that before joining LS (after I had already met my current bf) I had no idea of all these dating politics: advantages, disadvantages, and whatnot. I think by continuing to discuss these things we are merely perpetuating them, but I doubt it's going to stop any time soon. :] Edited March 25, 2011 by kiss_andmakeup
Els Posted March 25, 2011 Posted March 25, 2011 You could equally say to young men: Are you really bemoaning the loss of the young women who would rather be banging old men solely for their money? Also, are those young women really gaining anything by dating men who are with them solely for their looks? The bottom line is, it's not a good idea to date anyone solely for looks or money, no matter what age you are. So you're right in saying that women in their 30s shouldn't bemoan the loss of shallow men, just as young men shouldn't bemoan the loss of shallow women. I agree completely.
somedude81 Posted March 25, 2011 Posted March 25, 2011 So you're right in saying that women in their 30s shouldn't bemoan the loss of shallow men, just as young men shouldn't bemoan the loss of shallow women. The problem is that all young women are shallow. Since shallow applies to all of them, it can safely be dropped. So then what's left is having young men bemoaning the loss of women. A warning. Before posting something defending that you are not shallow, consider who the author of this post is. A man who has been rejected by every woman he was ever interested in.
kiss_andmakeup Posted March 25, 2011 Posted March 25, 2011 (edited) The problem is that all young women are shallow. Since shallow applies to all of them, it can safely be dropped. So then what's left is having young men bemoaning the loss of women. A warning. Before posting something defending that you are not shallow, consider who the author of this post is. A man who has been rejected by every woman he was ever interested in. The absolutes you use show a direct ignorance of anything any non-shallow young woman on this board has ever said. No, all young women are not shallow. I'm a young woman and I'm not shallow, I know this to be a fact. You know that the women you have encountered are shallow. So that is also a fact. This does not make the idea that ALL young women are shallow a fact. As long as you continue to use absolutes that confound personal experiences that other posters have shared with you, those same fellow posters are going to have a harder and harder time giving advice, empathy, and comfort to you when you post, which would make posting on this forum a waste of time for you. Just something to consider. Edited March 25, 2011 by kiss_andmakeup
somedude81 Posted March 25, 2011 Posted March 25, 2011 You know that the women you have encountered are shallow. So that is also a fact. This does not make the idea that ALL young women are shallow a fact. Yeah, I'm very aware that it's a fallacy. The simple matter is, there is no other way for my brain to see it other than "All women I have liked have rejected me, therefore all women are shallow." That is my reality until one woman breaks the chain. Other peoples personal experience don't really "exist" and might as well be something I see on TV. The only reference point I can use is my own. As long as you continue to use absolutes that confound personal experiences that other posters have shared with you, those same fellow posters are going to have a harder and harder time giving advice, empathy, and comfort to you when you post, which would make posting on this forum a waste of time for you. Just something to consider.You do have a point and I probably should make a new account that I use when I'm feeling bitter. Sadly, I get more attention and replies when I'm feeling angry then when I need actual advice. I have several threads as well that got very little attention that I needed help with. I chalk it up to human nature and a love for drama.
P&R Posted March 25, 2011 Posted March 25, 2011 The problem is that all young women are shallow. Since shallow applies to all of them, it can safely be dropped. So then what's left is having young men bemoaning the loss of women. A warning. Before posting something defending that you are not shallow, consider who the author of this post is. A man who has been rejected by every woman he was ever interested in. Generalizations are dangerous my friend.
Woggle Posted March 25, 2011 Posted March 25, 2011 I don't even think it is that much about age. People in general men and women tend to become more successful as they get older and men tend to be more attractive to women when they are successful. In high school and the younger days the big muscle type of guys have the advantage. Women fawn all over them and they dominate the nerdy guys. When they get into the real world the power shift happens and the nerd ends up their boss. Add to that the fact that poor health habits and reckless living have taken their toll on the macho man's health and his looks while many nerds get better with age. Look at how many hollywood hunks and female beauties were complete geeks in high school. Now that these nerds have made it all of a sudden they are attractive to women that once looked at them as the scum of the earth. They are are tired of the macho men who hit and quit and refuse to grow up and they finally decide to start looking elsewhere but now these men don't want them. Once a man has made it the last thing he wants is a woman with tons of emotional baggage that used to want nothing to do with them. He can now be choosy and wants a quality woman. This is where the power shift happens. Many women who are gorgeous used to be geeks as well and want nothing to do with the macho men who once passed them up.
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