flow15 Posted February 24, 2011 Posted February 24, 2011 So I've found out that my ex has been reading up on how to seduce women, how to pick up women. I've also heard that he lives for seducing women... It's all come to a bit of a shock to me, and kind of makes sense as to why he broke up with me as he'd rather do this than be in a relationship. Anyway, my point is... How normal is it for guys to do this? To read up on how to seduce women, and to basically dedicate his time to going out nearly every night and pick up women?
Untouchable_Fire Posted February 24, 2011 Posted February 24, 2011 Anyway, my point is... How normal is it for guys to do this? To read up on how to seduce women, and to basically dedicate his time to going out nearly every night and pick up women? If it's common among the men you date... that means you have a problem.
self-improvement Posted February 24, 2011 Posted February 24, 2011 I'd say it's pretty common. Guys often think about how to get a woman into bed (you know, reproductive instinct and so on). If you're not a natural at doing it, you can learn it. You're probably shocked, because it seems manipulative/exploitative to you or because you don't believe something like that works, right?
xpaperxcutx Posted February 24, 2011 Posted February 24, 2011 I'd say it's pretty common. Guys often think about how to get a woman into bed (you know, reproductive instinct and so on). If you're not a natural at doing it, you can learn it. You're probably shocked, because it seems manipulative/exploitative to you or because you don't believe something like that works, right? Agreed. Seduction is nothing new it just has a bad rep because of all the notoriety of PUAs.
Author flow15 Posted February 24, 2011 Author Posted February 24, 2011 ok but it seems my ex is now dedicating his life into being a pick-up artist... is every guy like this?? do pick-up artists avoid relationships? i guess i'm being really naive, i just didn't think he was like that that is why i am shocked.
xpaperxcutx Posted February 24, 2011 Posted February 24, 2011 ok but it seems my ex is now dedicating his life into being a pick-up artist... is every guy like this?? do pick-up artists avoid relationships? i guess i'm being really naive, i just didn't think he was like that that is why i am shocked. Our generation has no morals when it comes to sex. Everyone's an adult. As long as he's not committing rape you can't slap him with an offense for wanting to play.
fishtaco Posted February 24, 2011 Posted February 24, 2011 I believe these skills, maybe not exactly those skills, because I don't know what PUA seduction strategies are, but strategies for approaching women, getting positive attention, and creating attraction are something all men should to learn how to do. Dedicating one's life to picking up women is... well, not something I would do, but whatever floats their boat. Most likely it's just a phase. Women do that too. I've known a few party girls in my younger days. As for morals. When did sex become evil? I must have missed that memo.
xpaperxcutx Posted February 24, 2011 Posted February 24, 2011 I believe these skills, maybe not exactly those skills, because I don't know what PUA seduction strategies are, but strategies for approaching women, getting positive attention, and creating attraction are something all men should to learn how to do. Dedicating one's life to picking up women is... well, not something I would do, but whatever floats their boat. Most likely it's just a phase. Women do that too. I've known a few party girls in my younger days As for morals. When did sex become evil? I must have missed that memo. hmm what's that word... discretion!
Author flow15 Posted February 24, 2011 Author Posted February 24, 2011 I'm not saying it is evil what he is doing, he can do what he wants. I was just shocked because I thought he was a 'good guy', not someone who plays with women for sex and then drops them when he's got what he wanted.
Ms. Joolie Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 Oh let it go. After a break up people will pick up all sorts of hobbies: bridal magazines, music, porn, Jesus, etc. You just never know. My guess is that he probably is a good guy and he probably doesn't know how to pick up women...
J200 Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 I'm not saying it is evil what he is doing, he can do what he wants. I was just shocked because I thought he was a 'good guy', not someone who plays with women for sex and then drops them when he's got what he wanted. You are very naive. A high percentage of men play with women for sex. It has nothing to do with being good or bad. Quite a bit of men that you might respect, like respected community members or family members probably cheat on their wives or see prostitutes all the time. It's the male sex drive and has nothing to do with "good" or "bad". A lot of "good guys" are into it.
Movingthrough Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 Heres the other side of it, me personally, i have been reading up on the same stuff, heres why. A lot of that "training" has to do with being more confident and not putting the woman on such a pedestal. If he is 100% into that stuff then disregard this post, but i read all about that stuff because its like a psych course on men and women, i do not in any way want to "seduce" woman or any of that. Just saying there is another side of it.
Sivok Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 Pick Up stuff honestly is more about becoming a more confident man and being comfortable with yourself. The material helps men break irrational fears and anxieties - with some scripted stuff to help them get in the door. Keep in mind that the guys that do read this stuff are actually alot more relationship oriented than the naturals who've been using women their entire life. There are always exceptions, but this material help the actual decent guys get out there and not creep you girls out with their quaking and lack of social skills
dispatch3d Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 meh, a lot of it is produced by narcissistic guys. There also seems to be a huge rut guys go in when they do it. Hard to describe. Basically the guys subject themselves to a lot of scrutiny, often when they aren't ready to handle it, so they sometimes develop certain defense mechanisms that can be a little cumbersome. I agree overall it helps men. The balance of power is a little too far in the womens favour right now, and it doesn't make the world anymore fun to live in.
Author flow15 Posted February 25, 2011 Author Posted February 25, 2011 Thanks for your replies! Some of you make some very interesting points.. I was just wondering, is there an equivalent for women? Not a book on how to seduce men lol but maybe a book on how to be more confident and comfortable around men and how to not put men on a pedestal? Also if a guy plays a woman for sex, if she gets hurt, used and 'played' then how does that make the guy a good person??
self-improvement Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 I'm not saying it is evil what he is doing, he can do what he wants. I was just shocked because I thought he was a 'good guy', not someone who plays with women for sex and then drops them when he's got what he wanted. Guys of course are always after sex. But that's not what these books are necessarily about. As Sivok and Movingthrough already said, those books help you build confidence and give you an idea of what to do. Whether the pickup advice leads to a chit-chat, one-night stand, a relationship, marriage,... is up to the two contestants in the game. For many guys it's difficult to strike up even a normal conversation with a girl. That is either because they have no clue, come across weird/needy/... and probably also because of women dishing up their defense mechanisms (which is only natural). If getting a conversation going is already so complicated, imagine how difficult making out or having sex can seem to a guy. The threads here on LS, e.g. "whether to split the check on the date or not" are in my understanding a sign of how confusing dating can be nowadays and how insecure many guys are. So the guys reading those books usually aren't the w****mongering jerks (cuz they already know how to get women), but rather guys who under normal circumstances are too anxious to do anything at all. In your case, his sarging is probably the male equivalent to a woman getting a new haircut after a breakup.
ascendotum Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 ok but it seems my ex is now dedicating his life into being a pick-up artist... is every guy like this?? do pick-up artists avoid relationships? i guess i'm being really naive, i just didn't think he was like that that is why i am shocked. No not all guys. Just those who get really disillusioned with their relationships and getting taken for granted. Its because of you he turned to the dark side.
Andy_K Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 I was just wondering, is there an equivalent for women? Not a book on how to seduce men lol but maybe a book on how to be more confident and comfortable around men and how to not put men on a pedestal? The first two that spring to my mind are 'The Rules', which is manipulative game playing crap that most guys won't put up with anyway, and 'Catch him and keep him', which is a creation for girls by David DeAngelo of Double Your dating infamy. Also if a guy plays a woman for sex, if she gets hurt, used and 'played' then how does that make the guy a good person?? Generally, these things do NOT advocate outright lying or deceptive behaviour. Rather they're about flirting, being fun, and physical escalation. Being 'played' in this case amounts to failing either failing to communicate what she's looking for from the interaction, failing to ask what he's looking for, or both. It's arguable this is her responsibility
Author flow15 Posted February 25, 2011 Author Posted February 25, 2011 No not all guys. Just those who get really disillusioned with their relationships and getting taken for granted. Its because of you he turned to the dark side. I was the one that got taken for granted in the relationship not him. I don't think it is because of me why he is like this, if anything he has always been like this but I just didn't see it..
Phateless Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 (edited) So I've found out that my ex has been reading up on how to seduce women, how to pick up women. I've also heard that he lives for seducing women... It's all come to a bit of a shock to me, and kind of makes sense as to why he broke up with me as he'd rather do this than be in a relationship. Anyway, my point is... How normal is it for guys to do this? To read up on how to seduce women, and to basically dedicate his time to going out nearly every night and pick up women? It's common. Every guy wants to improve his odds and understand the dating game. I read a lot of that stuff when my ex of 5 years dumped me and there's a lot of self-improvement and character development bundled in. It really helped me grow as a person and actually led me to my current relationship. For me I just wanted to FINALLY have some social intelligence which I'd never before had in my life. Don't freak out, he just wants to feel like he understands dating. Thanks for your replies! Some of you make some very interesting points.. I was just wondering, is there an equivalent for women? Not a book on how to seduce men lol but maybe a book on how to be more confident and comfortable around men and how to not put men on a pedestal? Also if a guy plays a woman for sex, if she gets hurt, used and 'played' then how does that make the guy a good person?? There are forums just like this one dedicated to helping men understand how to connect with women. Most of those forums also have a sub-forum for women who are interested in learning. Do some googling. One of the cornerstones of "Game" is "leave them better than you found them." This means the goal is NOT to take advantage, hump and dump, or use someone and move on. The goal is to have meaningful encounters and connections where BOTH PARTIES are happy with the outcome, whether that is a mutual one-night stand or a long-term relationship. It's never about taking advantage of anybody, it's about learning how to connect. Does that make more sense? Edited February 25, 2011 by Phateless
Author flow15 Posted February 25, 2011 Author Posted February 25, 2011 Yes it does make sense, thanks for your reply. It doesn't make me feel any better, so he's making all these meaningful connections with new girls.. which will probably lead him to having a new relationship pretty soon. I think I preferred it when I thought he was just using girls for sex!!
Phateless Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 Yes it does make sense, thanks for your reply. It doesn't make me feel any better, so he's making all these meaningful connections with new girls.. which will probably lead him to having a new relationship pretty soon. I think I preferred it when I thought he was just using girls for sex!! Aww, I'm sorry girlie, it will be ok I promise. If it makes you feel any better my experiences after my breakup helped me to realize all the mistakes I made with my ex that I never saw before. In a strange way I think I appreciate her in a new light. You just have to let go of the past and move forward. Maybe you and he can be friends someday, but don't take his newfound interest personally. What action steps are you taking in your own life right now to feel better about the breakup and create a more positive future for yourself?
sally4sara Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 No one finds it creepy that you can google "sarging" and the first instructional video you find is one where the guy is teaching his students to hypnotize women? Oh yeaaaahhh, PUA stuff is all kinds of warm and fuzzy noble advise.
Phateless Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 No one finds it creepy that you can google "sarging" and the first instructional video you find is one where the guy is teaching his students to hypnotize women? Oh yeaaaahhh, PUA stuff is all kinds of warm and fuzzy noble advise. One example clearly illustrates that the whole thing is bad. Sounds like sound logic to me.
sally4sara Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 One example clearly illustrates that the whole thing is bad. Sounds like sound logic to me. Lots of other examples out there already discussed in threads about this same subject. Is ignoring any one I didn't mention logic?
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