Mrlonelyone Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 @Zengirl The problem is that to someone who is selfish anyone who is attentive, faithful, charitable, or kind is only so because they want something. To someone who is selfish anyone who acts selfless is not to be trusted because they don't belive that selfless people exist. When I give five dollars to someone who's obviously homeless and poor as dirt I don't expect a damm thing back. If a womans reaction to my giving that person five dollars is that I am a fool to give away that kind of money then well we wouldn't be compatable. I would be "too nice" for her. In most cases the guys who come on here and complain probably are truly nice... not just dateless. Their problem is they chase after women who are not right for them. Link to post Share on other sites
fortyninethousand322 Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Yeah. I know a few guys, my son's uncle (his dad's brother) has a whole posse of single guy friends. They hang out together most of the time, drinking a lot of beer and playing videogames. They don't really put themselves out there to be in a vulnerable position. I think they are afraid of being hurt. The thing is - if you don't risk anything, you can't win anything, because meeting someone that you really click with is a total gamble. Either that or they did put themselves out there once or twice (maybe even a dozen times) and didn't do so well and just concluded it wasn't meant to be and gave up on the whole thing. Either way, you're right. Link to post Share on other sites
Woggle Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 I agree they are choosing the wrong bad boys. Instead of abusers they should be picking cheaters. Abusers are so overrated when there is much better quality scum out there. Link to post Share on other sites
Author LeaningIntoTheMuse Posted February 21, 2011 Author Share Posted February 21, 2011 I agree they are choosing the wrong bad boys. Instead of abusers they should be picking cheaters. Abusers are so overrated when there is much better quality scum out there. This made me laugh! Yeah, I'm taking dating way too seriously. I should be out there, having fun, instead of worrying about what people think of me. Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 I think they are afraid of being hurt. The thing is - if you don't risk anything, you can't win anything, because meeting someone that you really click with is a total gamble. I agree.. in their case though is it afraid to get hurt because they were hurt in the past ? or afraid to get hurt because of some other outside element ? Link to post Share on other sites
blind_otter Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 I agree.. in their case though is it afraid to get hurt because they were hurt in the past ? or afraid to get hurt because of some other outside element ? I'm thinking about each of them in turn and I would say that they all had bad breakups, at least from what I have heard. But I believe that even if you have negative experiences in your past, you can reframe it cognitively, so that the hardship becomes a learning experience. A medium for growth and bettering yourself and furthering your self-development that you can actually be proud of! Then you can visualize what you want to be, where you want to go - and part of getting there is achieving that mindstate of the capability to generate positive purpose in your life through the easiest thing, your way of just being who you are. You know, being who you are and happy about it is the best way to make other people feel happy. You taught me that, friend. A long long time ago, I can still remember those days of trying to quit drinking. And you were not a lecturing kinda guy. Thank you for helping me, you didn't even know, you just generated it easily and effortlessly with your way of being. Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 You know, being who you are and happy about it is the best way to make other people feel happy. You taught me that, friend. A long long time ago, I can still remember those days of trying to quit drinking. And you were not a lecturing kinda guy. Thank you for helping me, you didn't even know, you just generated it easily and effortlessly with your way of being. ....... Link to post Share on other sites
blind_otter Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Can you feel the love tonight? It's where it's at, man. Sending it out! Link to post Share on other sites
zengirl Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 @Zengirl The problem is that to someone who is selfish anyone who is attentive, faithful, charitable, or kind is only so because they want something. To someone who is selfish anyone who acts selfless is not to be trusted because they don't belive that selfless people exist. When I give five dollars to someone who's obviously homeless and poor as dirt I don't expect a damm thing back. If a womans reaction to my giving that person five dollars is that I am a fool to give away that kind of money then well we wouldn't be compatable. I would be "too nice" for her. In most cases the guys who come on here and complain probably are truly nice... not just dateless. Their problem is they chase after women who are not right for them. I disagree. Some are, but I think there are also some who are not truly nice. If they were truly nice, they wouldn't even think about being jerks because jerks are more successful, and I see that attitude on LS all the time. Link to post Share on other sites
Woggle Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 I disagree. Some are, but I think there are also some who are not truly nice. If they were truly nice, they wouldn't even think about being jerks because jerks are more successful, and I see that attitude on LS all the time. It's human nature. Nobody wants to be a martyr for goodness while watching the scum of the world get all the rewards. People generally don't like going through the world as a doormat. Link to post Share on other sites
zengirl Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 It's human nature. Nobody wants to be a martyr for goodness while watching the scum of the world get all the rewards. People generally don't like going through the world as a doormat. Being nice is not being a doormat. If someone cannot differentiate between goodness with self-respect and being a doormat, then they aren't really nice. And if they're more concerned with rewards than their own actions, they're not really nice. You've just made my point. Link to post Share on other sites
Woggle Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Being nice is not being a doormat. If someone cannot differentiate between goodness with self-respect and being a doormat, then they aren't really nice. And if they're more concerned with rewards than their own actions, they're not really nice. You've just made my point. It's about rewards but if you kick somebody enough eventually they will turn. Link to post Share on other sites
zengirl Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 It's about rewards but if you kick somebody enough eventually they will turn. No, a good person knows how to stop the kicking and get away from toxic people without becoming toxic. It's a little different if it happens in formative years (i.e. with parents and such, to children) but even then, at some point in their adult life, people need to take responsibility. Link to post Share on other sites
Mrlonelyone Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 No, a good person knows how to stop the kicking and get away from toxic people without becoming toxic. It's a little different if it happens in formative years (i.e. with parents and such, to children) but even then, at some point in their adult life, people need to take responsibility. That's a bit unrealistic. Suppose you took a puppy dog and raised it with violence and abuse. Would you be surprised if the dog came out violent and abusive? People are not so different. Suppose a nice guy "gets lucky" and married a "mean girl". The mean girl then proceeds to be mean to him for a number of years, cuckolds him, then runs off with the hot pool boy. Might that nice guy not become a little understandably bitter? I stand by my assessment... these nice guys simply need to choose women who are equally nice. Link to post Share on other sites
zengirl Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 That's a bit unrealistic. Suppose you took a puppy dog and raised it with violence and abuse. Would you be surprised if the dog came out violent and abusive? People are not so different. Suppose a nice guy "gets lucky" and married a "mean girl". The mean girl then proceeds to be mean to him for a number of years, cuckolds him, then runs off with the hot pool boy. Might that nice guy not become a little understandably bitter? I stand by my assessment... these nice guys simply need to choose women who are equally nice. Puppies have lesser cognitive functions than human beings and rarely have outside influences, as human beings do. Being raised badly, as a human being, you still have influences outside of your home -- at your school, at your work, at your new homes, as you grow and change, assuming you are a free person in this society. You have choices. I do not think it odd when people in severely restricted societies with no decent influences are bad, no, but nobody in America grows up that way. Everyone has choices. Everyone sees something good, and they can chase after that, or not; at some point, they make the choice. I don't blame children, but adults, yes; even teenagers. At some point, you make your own way. Bitterness is not nice. If someone is bitter, they are not nice. Being mistreated and unsuccessful does not somehow mean you are nice. This is the myth too many people believe. Of course, nice people should stay away from mean people (not that the world is all that simple -- people are not black and white/mean or nice, in whole) or people who mistreat them. But I dispute that plenty of these so-called 'nice' guys are even all that nice. Link to post Share on other sites
sally4sara Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 It's human nature. Nobody wants to be a martyr for goodness while watching the scum of the world get all the rewards. People generally don't like going through the world as a doormat. And by rewards do you mean STDs, being the target of gossip, Stupid drawn out and dramatic conflicts with the people you mistreat, occasional vandalism to personal property by people you eff over and a couple of women in your past who had to get abortions? I think for some people, when they see others doing better socially than they are, they soothe themselves by assuming the relationships they see around them are suspect. Without knowing the relationship well, they pick it to pieces and invalidate it so they don't eye it with such want. When I would see clues that a relationship was troubled, I didn't envy it and consider either person involved rewarded simply by having an SO. Its like saying this guy sees a girl eating crap and being mistreated and thinks "why don't I have a girl to treat like ****? Man that guy gets all the luck!" Or the opposite "Wow that girl just never stops screaming at him and running around on him. He is so lucky! What won't some girl like that give me a chance?" So what are these rewards you're talking about? Link to post Share on other sites
Mrlonelyone Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Bitterness is not nice. If someone is bitter, they are not nice. Being mistreated and unsuccessful does not somehow mean you are nice. This is the myth too many people believe. Wouldn't the negative reinforcement of failure cause a person who was nice to turn bitter? Nice people, truly nice people are not some kind of saints. Even Ghandi...who was nice...and an alpha male by any reasonable definition... could and did act bitter sometimes. He found the nicest possible way to get a brutal empire to free his people through non violent resistance. Now was Mohandas Ghandi being not nice...because he was resisting and not being a doormat? Was Ghandi being nice because his form of resistance did not involve violence? How about Jesus Christ (peace be upon him)? When he overturned the tables of the money changers did he forever relinquish the assessment that he was a generally nice guy? My point is that some of you have set a standard for the "truly nice" that is unhuman to attain...even the likes of Ghandi or Jesus Christ (peace be upon him) could not meet it. Link to post Share on other sites
EasyHeart Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 I have empathy for people who grew up in abusive homes or suffered real emotional trauma. But we're not talking about those kinds of people here. We're talking about guys who are desperately searching for someone else to blame for their problems instead of looking in the mirror to see the real culprit. Women will dump you. Women will cheat on you. Women will take advantage of you. Women will be attracted to men who are smarter, richer or better-looking than you. Get used to it, because it happens to all of us. The difference is whether you sit around feeling sorry for yourself or whether you deal with it and move on. Most of the self-proclaimed "nice" guys in this forum aren't nice at all. They're angry, bitter whiners who don't like reality because it doesn't meet with their perceptions of what the world "ought" to be like. Instead of learning and adapting, they prefer to sit around feeling sorry for themselves. The reason most women aren't attracted to you self-proclaimed "nice guys" isn't that you're "too nice"; it's because you are passive, lame and boring. The problem isn't with women, the problem is with YOU. This forum is an invaluable resource for people to learn things in an instant that it took me years of trial and error to figure out. Most people do that. But instead of taking advantage of the resources this forum offers, some of you would rather sit around and feel sorry for yourselves. If you "nice guys" spent half the time working on improving yourselves that you spend whining about how "nice" you are and how "mean" women are, you'd have a date every night of the week. PS: Please note that I am not a "nice guy". Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 I'm constantly amazed at the cleanliness and quality of the female-driven cars which enter and exit the Avenal State Prison, which is on my route over to the coast when I go camping. I actually parked my RV one day and watched for an hour. Fascinating. It's like a little city, filled with felons. Felons getting love. I think that's wonderful. Everyone deserves to be loved. Link to post Share on other sites
jane100 Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 I have empathy for people who grew up in abusive homes or suffered real emotional trauma. But we're not talking about those kinds of people here. We're talking about guys who are desperately searching for someone else to blame for their problems instead of looking in the mirror to see the real culprit. Women will dump you. Women will cheat on you. Women will take advantage of you. Women will be attracted to men who are smarter, richer or better-looking than you. Get used to it, because it happens to all of us. The difference is whether you sit around feeling sorry for yourself or whether you deal with it and move on. Most of the self-proclaimed "nice" guys in this forum aren't nice at all. They're angry, bitter whiners who don't like reality because it doesn't meet with their perceptions of what the world "ought" to be like. Instead of learning and adapting, they prefer to sit around feeling sorry for themselves. The reason most women aren't attracted to you self-proclaimed "nice guys" isn't that you're "too nice"; it's because you are passive, lame and boring. The problem isn't with women, the problem is with YOU. This forum is an invaluable resource for people to learn things in an instant that it took me years of trial and error to figure out. Most people do that. But instead of taking advantage of the resources this forum offers, some of you would rather sit around and feel sorry for yourselves. If you "nice guys" spent half the time working on improving yourselves that you spend whining about how "nice" you are and how "mean" women are, you'd have a date every night of the week. PS: Please note that I am not a "nice guy". Absolutely. Handsome is as handsome does. Faint heart never won fair lady. You can be a totally "average" looking and average man and be totally irresistable to the woman you want. Brad Pitt (Zzzzzz.....) And so on ..... .... Link to post Share on other sites
Mrlonelyone Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Easy heart. You are right about most self procalimed nice guys. However what about people who are really and truly nice? Do you deny that such people exist? Link to post Share on other sites
sally4sara Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 I'm constantly amazed at the cleanliness and quality of the female-driven cars which enter and exit the Avenal State Prison, which is on my route over to the coast when I go camping. I actually parked my RV one day and watched for an hour. Fascinating. It's like a little city, filled with felons. Felons getting love. I think that's wonderful. Everyone deserves to be loved. Hmmm, are you suggesting that because there are some freaks in the world, the "nice guys' are right in assuming all women got an itch for scummy men? Ever hear of Financial Domination? Its where a man gets off on having a woman treat him like **** stuck to her heel while she drains his bank account. Its all above board. The treatment he gets is the nature of the association and he knowingly allows her access and control over his finances in the process. NWS: http://financialdomination.moonfruit.com/ Shall I assume her clients represent a large enough slice of normal life to suggest all men want to be treated this way? Link to post Share on other sites
Mrlonelyone Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Oh Good one Sally. Bringing up the S&M crowd. I wonder if the big strong confident bad boys who like to be kept on a leash and cuckoleded while they watch and play with thiers are suddenly nice guys? Lol @ Easy heart Address my point to Zengirl. Would Ghandi... a generally agreed upon nice guy... be considered passive? Would Jesus Christ a generally considered really nice guy...have been considered passive? Being nice does not being a boring lump. In my book being nice is a set of actions, and a way of acting towards people. Some of you here have confused being nice with being in a coma. Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Hmmm, are you suggesting that because there are some freaks in the world, the "nice guys' are right in assuming all women got an itch for scummy men? Ever hear of Financial Domination? Its where a man gets off on having a woman treat him like **** stuck to her heel while she drains his bank account. Its all above board. The treatment he gets is the nature of the association and he knowingly allows her access and control over his finances in the process. NWS: http://financialdomination.moonfruit.com/ Shall I assume her clients represent a large enough slice of normal life to suggest all men want to be treated this way? You know me better than that. I'm commenting on a real life scenario that I have personal experience with. The OP wished to discuss the *wrong* bad boys. I provided an anecdote. Don't read more into it than there is. EOS. Link to post Share on other sites
sally4sara Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 You know me better than that. I'm commenting on a real life scenario that I have personal experience with. The OP wished to discuss the *wrong* bad boys. I provided an anecdote. Don't read more into it than there is. EOS. I'm always bothered by the reference to women who have relationships with inmates even to the point of marriage as supporting the belief that women go for jerks. There are only 6 states that allow for conjugal visits and the inmate must be in excellent standing and already married when incarcerated. The people who connect with and marry someone after that someone is incarcerated don't get conjugal visitation awarded at the prisons in these 6 states. What it really implies is that there are less men than women willing to marry someone they won't have sexual access to. Big surprise there! Pointing it out without showing why it happens with women more often is misleading to the guys laboring under the delusion that they get rejected for being so "nice". Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts