Banker Chick Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 This topic seems to generate a lot of mixed thoughts within my circle of friends. I'm on the cusp of being proposed to and my bf and I have discussed rings. I don't care if the stone is real or not and some of my friends think I'm absolutely crazy! I'm divorced and my ex and his family own a high-end jewelry store so my ring back then was nice and the stone was high quality and big. I didn't care. I am 42 and my bf will be 40 this year and stuff like that just doesn't matter to me. He also is in the process of getting his bachelors degree and is a hard working college student with limited funds right now. They make some really nice fake stones (moissanite, etc) in quality settings so not too many would be able to tell the difference. At this point in my life I'd rather spend money on other things instead of a nice diamond. Same with the wedding ... my first wedding was 200+ people and all the stress that goes along with it so this time we're talking about just something between us (and my 19 yr old daughter) to make it more about us and our love for each other and not the hoopla. It's funny because I have a sapphire ring I wear on my left hand and it's fake but I get compliments all the time on it and asked if it's my ER. If it wasn't an issue of someone lying to you and trying to pass off a fake stone as a real one, would you have an issue with it?
tigressA Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 Doesn't matter to me, but I don't care about jewelry, period. I don't ever want to have money wasted on an engagement ring. Real or fake, if you think it looks beautiful and you love it, don't concern yourself about what anyone else thinks.
Hopeful30 Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 Of course I would have an issue. I would rather have no diamond at all than have a fake one. It's a big deal to women because diamonds are expensive, and they are beautiful. If a man can put in the effort to get her at least ONE real diamond, then she would rather wait a year for that one diamond, then get lots of fake ones often. Quality over quantity. It's like asking if a girl cares if she gets real flowers or fake ones. Everyone wants the real thing. It means more.
30Years Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 They make some really nice fake stones (moissanite, etc) in quality settings so not too many would be able to tell the difference. At this point in my life I'd rather spend money on other things instead of a nice diamond. Same with the wedding ... my first wedding was 200+ people and all the stress that goes along with it so this time we're talking about just something between us (and my 19 yr old daughter) to make it more about us and our love for each other and not the hoopla. It sounds like you have your head on straight to me. Good for you.
denise_xo Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 If it wasn't an issue of someone lying to you and trying to pass off a fake stone as a real one, would you have an issue with it? Personally I don't care about diamonds and don't have an ER, and I don't see the problem at all. The only 'problem' is if someone actively lies about it - as in, if I were you, I wouldn't tell people it's a diamond when it isn't. There's about five million things or so I'd spend money on before a diamond ring. Happy engagement and wedding
carhill Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 IMO, if the parties are in agreement about the symbolism and value of the e-ring/wedding band, that's what matters. Simulants are perfectly reasonable choices for many people. I would choose a gem and setting consistent with my usual taste in jewelry. As an example, my exW wore a diamond e-ring ring in the .8ct range along with a platinum and diamond eternity ring for a wedding ring. I wouldn't 'size up' just because a simulant was less expensive. Best wishes with your betrothal and wedding
daphne Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 I do not wear much jewelery, thank god cos I have expensive taste. For me, however, I'd rather have no ring at all than a fake. I can do rhinestone costume jewelry, but I wouldn't want a fake engagement ring. It's great that you found someone you love that much that you just want to get married. Congratulations. You're a lucky woman.
Nexus One Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 (edited) Lots of real diamonds are blood diamonds, that means if you buy them you're financing weapons for warfare in Africa. On top of that diamonds are not as rare as the DeBeers want you to believe. The DeBeers buy up almost all the diamonds in the world, but most of them they'll have destroyed by burning them in furnaces. In that way they create an artificial scarcity in the market. That market is located in Antwerp in Belgium where the remaining stones are processed and sold to the highest bidders. If you've ever worked with a bidding system that determines the price by canceling out the buyers against the sellers, like is done on the stock market, then you know how scarcity can drive the price up to extreme heights. Besides, artificially created diamonds which are created by pressing carbon together under high pressure and temperatures are even more perfect than natural diamonds which are found in Kimberly mines. So with natural diamonds you actually also pay more for the imperfections in the stone. Edited February 7, 2011 by Nexus One
daphne Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 Lots of real diamonds are blood diamonds, that means if you buy them you're financing weapons for warfare in Africa. On top of that diamonds are not as rare as the DeBeers want you to believe. The DeBeers buy up almost all the diamonds in the world, but most of them they'll have destroyed by burning them in furnaces. In that way they create an artificial scarcity in the market. That market is located in Antwerp in Belgium where the remaining stones are processed and sold to the highest bidders. If you've ever worked with a bidding system that determines the price by canceling out the buyers against the sellers, like is done on the stock market, then you know how scarcity can drive the price up to extreme heights. Besides, artificially created diamonds which are created by pressing carbon together under high pressure and temperatures are even more perfect than natural diamonds which are found in Kimberly mines. So with natural diamonds you actually also pay more for the imperfections in the stone. When you put it like that, you take all of the romance out of it. Don't tell us how they process certain foods. We'll end up starving to death after that one.
Stung Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 This topic seems to generate a lot of mixed thoughts within my circle of friends. I'm on the cusp of being proposed to and my bf and I have discussed rings. I don't care if the stone is real or not and some of my friends think I'm absolutely crazy! I'm divorced and my ex and his family own a high-end jewelry store so my ring back then was nice and the stone was high quality and big. I didn't care. I am 42 and my bf will be 40 this year and stuff like that just doesn't matter to me. He also is in the process of getting his bachelors degree and is a hard working college student with limited funds right now. They make some really nice fake stones (moissanite, etc) in quality settings so not too many would be able to tell the difference. At this point in my life I'd rather spend money on other things instead of a nice diamond. Same with the wedding ... my first wedding was 200+ people and all the stress that goes along with it so this time we're talking about just something between us (and my 19 yr old daughter) to make it more about us and our love for each other and not the hoopla. It's funny because I have a sapphire ring I wear on my left hand and it's fake but I get compliments all the time on it and asked if it's my ER. If it wasn't an issue of someone lying to you and trying to pass off a fake stone as a real one, would you have an issue with it? I love jewelry, have taken classes in designing and making jewelry, and almost always wear at least a couple of signature pieces although since I have a toddler I am careful about what I wear around him. I hate diamonds. I hate the diamond industry, and what it's done, it's mining practices and disdain for human life. I also think that the diamond industry's conditioning of Americans to believe diamonds are a traditional engagement stone or necessary proof of love is a shining example of the masses being sheep--in fact the use of diamonds in engagement rings is relatively new, and started AFTER heavy-handed advertising campaigns by the diamond industry. They also started the tradition of people spending multiple months salary on rings and going into debt. You are obviously more practical than that. When I got engaged, I looked at semi-precious stones as a substitute, because I personally prefer black pearls and fire opals to almost any other stone. However, I was quickly dissuaded from using those as they are fragile and not suitable for everyday wear, and I wanted to wear my ring every day. I looked at lab-created diamonds, and those would have been perfectly acceptable to me. There is something poetic about science creating it's own diamonds under fantastic pressures, IMO. My now-husband was iffy on them however, he didn't like the symbolism of something illusory. We settled on a sapphire. Sapphires are actually more rare than diamonds, very very very nearly as hard and durable, were a traditional engagement stone in Europe, and are a good deal less expensive than diamond. Win-win, to our way of thinking. Of course, you have to check on the reputable source of sapphires as some of them come from poor mining conditions as well, and it is possible to get an ethically sourced diamond. In the end, it is your life, your ring and your marriage. Do what is comfortable to you and what reflects your values, not something to impress friends who seem to make more shallow judgments than you do.
zengirl Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 Personally, I want neither. I just want a plain band, the same as whomever I marry. But I'm weird. I really dislike diamonds---both aesthetically and some of their political/moral/economic implications. Lots of real diamonds are blood diamonds, that means if you buy them you're financing weapons for warfare in Africa. On top of that diamonds are not as rare as the DeBeers want you to believe. The DeBeers buy up almost all the diamonds in the world, but most of them they'll have destroyed by burning them in furnaces. In that way they create an artificial scarcity in the market. That market is located in Antwerp in Belgium where the remaining stones are processed and sold to the highest bidders. If you've ever worked with a bidding system that determines the price by canceling out the buyers against the sellers, like is done on the stock market, then you know how scarcity can drive the price up to extreme heights. Besides, artificially created diamonds which are created by pressing carbon together under high pressure and temperatures are even more perfect than natural diamonds which are found in Kimberly mines. So with natural diamonds you actually also pay more for the imperfections in the stone. Yep, this is why I wouldn't even really feel right accepting a diamond unless it was an heirloom or something.
denise_xo Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 When you put it like that, you take all of the romance out of it. Don't tell us how they process certain foods. We'll end up starving to death after that one. Well, do you want to base your romance on human suffering? We have options, especially with regard to jewelry. With other parts of our consumption it can be more difficult to act ethically. But with diamonds it's really easy and with food it's relatively easy, with a bit of thought.
Nexus One Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 When you put it like that, you take all of the romance out of it. Don't tell us how they process certain foods. We'll end up starving to death after that one. Here is how pigs get slaughtered for their meat in the US. A large group of pigs is driven into a room with metal walls. The walls of that room are actually automated hydraulic compressors. That means 2 walls of the metal room move with high pressure towards the center of the room, compressing all the pigs so tightly they can't move or breathe. Then once the pigs are compressed like that, but still alive, then they put 10000 Volts on the metal walls of the room for several minutes, killing all the pigs in the room by electrocution. And that is how the meat on your plate died.
Mme. Chaucer Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 I don't care a bit about diamonds, but I don't like "fake." I am in the same situation and I will get a ring that I really like and will enjoy wearing every day. What it symbolizes will be known to the two of us.
SmileFace Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 I will be more mad at the fact of someone lying to me about the type of ring. I doubt I will get married but if I do , I always just wanted a plain gold band. Something simple.
Feelin Frisky Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 Rule of thumb is that if you're divorced, the jig is up on the whole ring thing. It's in your court to make rational decisions on what's best for the relationship. Kudos to all the other women on this thread who don't put much stock in this tradition. It's a hand-me-down from the days of dowries, arranged marriages, chattel etc which continues to be exploited commercially at great costs.
carhill Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 Most of the jewelry I own (and what went with exW when we divorced) was sourced from estate sales and auctions and is generally 40-100 years old. Her wedding band was ca 1930, as an example. I've never bought any jewelry at a jewelry store, though I do use jewelers to build settings; wonderful craftsmen/women, they are Even though divorced, I'd have no issues symbolizing a future betrothal with a ring, whether purchased or with my now deceased mother's, as I have no daughters. To me, as a single, divorced man, a woman's wedding ring is a quick and easy indicator that she is *not* available. Simple, quiet boundary. A woman not wearing her wedding ring got me into a lot of trouble a generation ago.
tigressA Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 The way I see it, an engagement ring is a promise of a promise. It's totally pointless and I don't see why so many women put so much stock in it.
Stung Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 Most of the jewelry I own (and what went with exW when we divorced) was sourced from estate sales and auctions and is generally 40-100 years old. Her wedding band was ca 1930, as an example. I've never bought any jewelry at a jewelry store, though I do use jewelers to build settings; wonderful craftsmen/women, they are I have a few gorgeous antique pieces I picked up at estate sales. I also prefer using jewelers for 'serious' jewelry, as I like unique artisan-made pieces. I commissioned my engagement and wedding rings from a local artisan who does really beautiful work, and nobody in the world has an exact duplicate. I don't tend to like the cookie-cutter mall jewelry stores but I have bought rings/earrings etc. from small, local antique or artisan stores. The way I see it, an engagement ring is a promise of a promise. It's totally pointless and I don't see why so many women put so much stock in it. That's pretty much how I feel about promise rings.
xpaperxcutx Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 I'm actually allergic to fake jewelry especially for earrings so I normally wear 14 to 18 kt gold. In regards to diamonds, if you're planning to get a fake, you're better off not getting an ER at all. Personally, I don't care much for diamonds, so if you can't afford a real ER, why not place all that money into getting 18 to 24 kt wedding bands?
Jazzari Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 I think expensive rings are a total waste of money. What is important is the feeling. Not the rings, wedding and other trappings that go along with it. A simple band is all I would want. I'd much rather have a kick-ass honeymoon that both partners can enjoy than spend money on rings or wedding.
Jaytb Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 Since diamonds can be synthesized, I imagine that the process is going to get cheaper in the future, and the market will probably be flooded with synthesized diamonds that no one would be able to tell the difference from "natural" ones. When that happens, prices will drop like a rock and I bet no one would want to be caught with having spent 1000's of dollars on diamonds that will be worth much much less. On the other hand, precious metals like gold or rhodium or platinum can't be synthesized, so I think it would be wise for everyone to stick to gold or platinum or silver or rhodium etc and forget the diamond, unless if you're ok with it losing significant amounts of value in the future.
Star Gazer Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 A man-made, cultured diamond is STILL a diamond and you don't have to worry about it being a blood diamond. I want a 1.5-2 carat center diamond of very good quality. That's a pricey rock. If I marry a guy with a ****-ton of money who can easily afford it, then I want a naturally occurring diamond that is a proven humane diamond. But if I marry a guy with a more modest salary (the more likely scenario), a man-made diamond is perfectly fine. I want to stress man-made, cultured diamond...NOT moissanite. I can spot the latter across a room (darker, cloudy, do not sparkle), whereas even licensed gemologists have a difficult time differentiating between an earth-made diamond versus a man-made diamond.
somedude81 Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 When you put it like that, you take all of the romance out of it. There never was any romance in the first place. It's all commercialized marketing meant to sell diamonds. The whole diamond thing wasn't even common until the 1930's.
carhill Posted February 7, 2011 Posted February 7, 2011 Apollo is probably the most well-known maker of CVD (chemical vapor deposition) synthetics. I'm not aware of anything in colorless over .60ct but perhaps that has changed recently. Gemesis makes fancy and colorless synthetics via a different, high pressure process. AFAIK, there are similar limitations on colorless, but colored gems range much larger, into the 3ct area. A typical GIA certificated 1.50-2.00ct natural should range between 15 and 20K, depending on specs. If available, a synthetic of similar specs should be 15-30% less, with larger being lesser in discount. A natural or synthetic colorless sapphire is another option, if a colorless gem is desired. Flame-fusion colorless synthetic sapphires were popular in the early 20th century and I've seen some in old jewelry I've purchased. IME, and I noted similar in my exW, a certain combination of shape, color and 'presence' speaks to a person, irrespective of the particulars and 'specs' of the gem/setting. Desirable and beautiful can be quite affordable. My best advice to the OP, if interested, is to enjoy the process of picking something which speaks to her. For myself, a whole hobby grew out of the simple process of selecting an e-ring for my now exW over a decade ago. The hobby survives the M and is one of the positive memories I have of it. Good luck
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