Jonno_S Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 I seem to have a reoccurring problem - it's a pattern of communication I get into and don't want to. I touched on this a little on another thread, but it's a little different so I am starting this. It has to do with misunderstandings during discussions. For background I am a heterosexual guy. For example, let's say we're getting ready to go somewhere and I might say "A." But the person 'hears' and responds to "F," and what's worse, "F" is a something kind of hostile or aggressive where "A" was just meant plain and simple. I know that some of it has to do with, according to the latest ex-GF, women tending to read into things whereas men are more two-dimensional. And I have explained that I don't speak in innuendo. I say what I mean and only what I mean, no reading between the lines. But whatever the underlying cause, how do I avoid it turning into a fight? So when she responds to "F," I say, "That's not what I said," and it becomes this whole big thing. I don't want to fight. I don't want there to be misunderstandings, in fact. I just want to hang out, hassle free. If that's too vague, I can give an example but I was trying to keep it short. Thoughts?
zengirl Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 Yeah, I got lost there. I'd need an example to understand. My BF and I both misunderstand each other sometimes. It's not one-sided. He reads things into what I say that I never meant, as I do with him; that just happens when communicating with people, I think. Dating heightens communication issues, especially if one or more partners is in love or thinking seriously about the future. Women are more keen to actively look for "clues" as to whether someone truly cares for them (love tests) or is truly right for them, but men do it too, sometimes. I've noticed----Men tend to test to see if they can get the space they need, whereas women tend to test to see if they can get the attention they need (this is on average; men and women do both kinds of tests). Thus, the tests are often counter to each other and thus cause friction. The truth is, it's a vicious cycle. If you make a partner feel secure and like they get enough attention, they'll give you space, and if you give a partner the space they need, they'll give you attention. But it's easy to get stuck in a cycle of just the opposite. This seems to be the most common puncture into otherwise healthy relationships. Just an observation. But, as to the miscommunication in your case specifically, I don't know what it is, or how you say it, so I don't know what's happening. I do know the cleanest way to clear up miscommunication for me has always been (a.) If my SO is the offended party and I didn't mean what they think I mean: stopping the argument by stating that I hear their feelings, but I really didn't mean that, I mean THIS and asking for a way to learn how to say it better next time or seeing what in my language triggered the miscommunication. This is me OWNING the miscommunication but not accepting the mistaken meaning as true. (b.) If I'm the offended party, expressing my feelings and expressing why I got that impression without attacking. If my SO says that's not what they meant, and owns the miscommunication, and seems attentive to my hurt feelings, that's the end of that. If he cannot see why I was upset, or doesn't even attempt to, then I'm way more likely to stay upset.
EasyHeart Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 For example, let's say we're getting ready to go somewhere and I might say "A." But the person 'hears' and responds to "F," and what's worse, "F" is a something kind of hostile or aggressive where "A" was just meant plain and simple. I know that some of it has to do with, according to the latest ex-GF, women tending to read into things whereas men are more two-dimensional. And I have explained that I don't speak in innuendo. I say what I mean and only what I mean, no reading between the lines. But whatever the underlying cause, how do I avoid it turning into a fight? So when she responds to "F," I say, "That's not what I said," and it becomes this whole big thing. I don't want to fight. I don't want there to be misunderstandings, in fact. I just want to hang out, hassle free.I think I understand what you're saying, and I've been there with some women myself. But the answer to your problem isn't that "women" react this way, it's that "the women you're dating" react this way. IME, the women who react in this way usually have severe insecurity problems, and there's really nothing you can do about it -- except be more careful about who you date.
Author Jonno_S Posted February 5, 2011 Author Posted February 5, 2011 (edited) Okay, here's the simple one: We're getting ready to go skiing. I need a neck-warmer thing that she says she'll lend me. We're running around, gathering stuff, no tension, and I say (apparently for the second time), "And you'll get me that neck thing?" Her response is along the lines of and in a snappy tone, "Will you give me a break? I said I would!" I didn't respond, but internally I cringed because I was just asking a simple question and hadn't remembered all what exactly was said. In her defense, I discussed that event about a month later - it was a good example because it didn't start any friction at the time but she remembered it. She thought I was saying, "Get the thing now[/]," and that's what she reacted to. I explained how my words never included now, nor did my tone, and that I just hadn't remembered what we had discussed. She ACTUALLY CONCEDED that she misinterpreted me,took it the wrong way and she might have gotten it from her overbearing mother I was so happy, felt so glad that she just took a little responsibility for doing something negative. But two days later, a more complicated example: We had another "women who make problems out of nothing" event. (There's a thread by that name.) Thanks to the good advice that Zengirl and others provided I handled it much better this time and it was really just a blip on the radar. So as we were winding down the conversation, she was saying how she can't have these distractions because she has to focus on school. I agreed and said, "And you can control some of the things that you let bother you." I just said it kind of an agreeable tone - one of the things you say as you are getting off the phone. But that produced a 15 minute (and final) argument. She had two interpretations of that: First, she said that I was saying, "Fix my brain and everything will be okay in the relationship." I re-quoted what I said and said there is no way I was suggesting that, that I don't speak in innuendo, etc. But no concession from her that she misinterpreted what I said. Instead she moved on to another interpretation, that I was saying that she could control ALL things that EVER bother her. Wrong again. I told her how she put the word "all" in place of "some" and how that too was not what I was saying at all and that I never said those words. I then went on to point out (big mistake) that most people in response to my original statement would have just said, "That's true" or "Yeah, probably so," or, "Maybe you're right," or even just, "I'll think about that." Now understand, I am not someone who has to be right - that's not the issue. I just think that my statement was meant as something to help her, not for her to get into an argument and certainly not what she claimed I was saying. To me that is just so difficult to deal with and when that happens, all I need to hear is, "Yes, I see what you meant, I misinterpreted that," but this girl lacks that capacity for the most part. Fast fwd: no resolution to that. E-mail came where she said all this kind of sweeping, defensive things (comparing me to a scolding father, etc.) I just said I have no idea what you're talking about, I give up. And I did. Edited February 5, 2011 by Jonno_S
Author Jonno_S Posted February 5, 2011 Author Posted February 5, 2011 (a.) If my SO is the offended party and I didn't mean what they think I mean: stopping the argument by stating that I hear their feelings, but I really didn't mean that, I mean THIS and asking for a way to learn how to say it better next time or seeing what in my language triggered the miscommunication. This is me OWNING the miscommunication but not accepting the mistaken meaning as true. (b.) If I'm the offended party, expressing my feelings and expressing why I got that impression without attacking. If my SO says that's not what they meant, and owns the miscommunication, and seems attentive to my hurt feelings, that's the end of that. If he cannot see why I was upset, or doesn't even attempt to, then I'm way more likely to stay upset. (a.) is definitely what I need to learn. But it sounds so Dr. Phil and so unnecessary to me - I confess, however, that I am like Spock. I get emotional but never illogical which is why (b.) almost never applies to me. I don't mean to sound pompous with that. That's just how I think. Very linear. In fact, this latest drama was pretty offensive, but I handled it with little emotion. (She saw the "Craigslist Killer" movie on TV and started comparing him with me - yes, comparing me with a sociopath - and worked herself into a dither. I diffused it pretty well, IMHO, in part based on what I learned before. I listened to her and most importantly did not take the "You are being an idiot" response to it. And that was what I was referring to when I said that she could control some of the things that bother her.
paddington bear Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 What was her relationship to her parents and or her ex's? Reading between the lines here, it seems like someone in the past has been overly critical of what she does, her decisions and so on and so even any hint of a criticism is picked up on and taken offence at and now it is a sore spot and you are pressing on that sore spot by saying things like "And you can control some of the things that you let bother you." To me, this does sound like a criticism implying that she is currently useless and has no control over the things that bother her and also that she should not be letting those things bother her in the first place. In short: When you get to school you can get your life under control because your life and you are a mess right now. See how easily my woman's mind did that? Also, just for yourself, you say you are clear with what you say. However, some people who describe themselves in this way are simply blunt, saying they are merely being honest, as a justification for being rude. It doesn't seem like you are doing this, but I'm throwing it in there in case it needs to be looked at.
paddington bear Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 (She saw the "Craigslist Killer" movie on TV and started comparing him with me - yes, comparing me with a sociopath - and worked herself into a dither. I diffused it pretty well, IMHO, in part based on what I learned before. I listened to her and most importantly did not take the "You are being an idiot" response to it. And that was what I was referring to when I said that she could control some of the things that bother her. Woah there, was she joking? Or is your linear thinking and handling things without emotion comparable to the behaviour of this fictional sociopath? Perhaps she wants you to be more emotional and less logical because some kind of emotion denotes feelings. The appearance that you lack any, could make a girl feel uneasy about your feelings towards her... In the instance of your GF comparing you to a sociopath...perhaps you should have taken the "you're an idiot" path...'mildly' insulting.
Author Jonno_S Posted February 5, 2011 Author Posted February 5, 2011 What was her relationship to her parents and or her ex's? Her mother was an overbearing (and controlling, I think) person. German. She would say, "Having been raised by Hitler." Reading between the lines here, it seems like someone in the past has been overly critical of what she does, her decisions and so on and so even any hint of a criticism is picked up on and taken offence at and now it is a sore spot and you are pressing on that sore spot by saying things like "And you can control some of the things that you let bother you." But I was never critical. I love(d) her. Pretty much everything she did was great with me. I was always telling her she had the best ideas, very affectionate to her. To me, this does sound like a criticism implying that she is currently useless and has no control over the things that bother her and also that she should not be letting those things bother her in the first place. In short: When you get to school you can get your life under control because your life and you are a mess right now. See how easily my woman's mind did that? No. In fact I cringed. Please tell me you were kidding. Wait, are your initials KM??? Also, just for yourself, you say you are clear with what you say. However, some people who describe themselves in this way are simply blunt, saying they are merely being honest, as a justification for being rude. It doesn't seem like you are doing this, but I'm throwing it in there in case it needs to be looked at. Yes, blunt sometimes. More so when I was younger. I realized that my Spock-like view of the world is not the only way so I have learned to soften things. But this wasn't such an instance. It was really said with the tone of, "It's getting late, let's get off the phone." And just for further background, she's 35, I am 10 years older so it's not like we're two kids fumbling into adulthood. She's a part-time student and works full time.
Author Jonno_S Posted February 5, 2011 Author Posted February 5, 2011 (edited) Woah there, was she joking? Or is your linear thinking and handling things without emotion comparable to the behaviour of this fictional sociopath? Perhaps she wants you to be more emotional and less logical because some kind of emotion denotes feelings. The appearance that you lack any, could make a girl feel uneasy about your feelings towards her... In the instance of your GF comparing you to a sociopath...perhaps you should have taken the "you're an idiot" path...'mildly' insulting. These are great points but I am not devoid of emotion. Very, very attentive and affectionate as well as saying those 3 words often. Because in some ways I really, really adored her and she knew that. In the day-to-day things we got along so great. But then other times, it was crash and burn. And it seemed to happen over the telephone more than in person. She was not joking about the CL thing. And the Craigslist Killer is not fictional. The guy was in Boston and in some ways, we are similar - Ted Bundy too - white guy, professional degrees etc. The CL guy was engaged to a great girl, everyone like him, but he had this double life. I did take offense to it and I explained that to her - I said the fact that you compared me to him in the same thought was offensive enough, much less to the point where she was "anxious" about it (her word). But she was just telling me her thoughts - she explained how it was a perfect storm of events (including possibly a little PMS) and I did put her at ease (putting my emotions aside) so I think I handled that well. When she first brought it up I kind of responded as if she were kidding but then the next day when she said she was anxious then I addressed it more seriously (by listening, then dispelling). Edited February 5, 2011 by Jonno_S
zengirl Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 Okay, here's the simple one: We're getting ready to go skiing. I need a neck-warmer thing that she says she'll lend me. We're running around, gathering stuff, no tension, and I say (apparently for the second time), "And you'll get me that neck thing?" Her response is along the lines of and in a snappy tone, "Will you give me a break? I said I would!" I didn't respond, but internally I cringed because I was just asking a simple question and hadn't remembered all what exactly was said. Eh, that stuff happens. It's unfortunate, but you were running around, her stress levels might have been higher than yours (everyone is different), and that's easily diffused, really. My BF does that to me sometimes because he gets more easily stressed than I do during errands. I usually diffuse with humor, with him; it'd be something like, "No, get it right now, or I'm karate chopping you" because he'd know what I was saying ("Chill out, I didn't mean right now) and he'd laugh at that. I don't recommend this with your gal. With other people, I suppose I'd say something like, "Hey, no worries, I was just going through my checklist. Sorry if I stressed you out." Is it possible you heighten the situations by getting upset when you're misunderstood. I understand it --- being misunderstood sucks. But being bothered by it really doesn't help anything. And the issue really shouldn't be "Who's fault is it?" because at that point, you're playing a losing game. When you get into the blame game, nobody wins. And you cannot control her behavior, only your own. So as we were winding down the conversation, she was saying how she can't have these distractions because she has to focus on school. I agreed and said, "And you can control some of the things that you let bother you." I just said it kind of an agreeable tone - one of the things you say as you are getting off the phone. See, that is so not a "getting off the phone" kind of conversation. I don't disagree with the sentiment (in fact I often suggest the same thing here, and I suggest it to you in this thread!), but the timing is very poor in this case. It just sounds like a criticism in that context. Also, it doesn't sound like you're her teammate, or partner, there, which is what a lot of people expect from an SO. It sounds like blame. There's no reason to add that little pip, except to be right. Now, if she's having issues with things bothering her, providing support and suggestions as to how she can control her own feelings might be helpful, but context is key. FTR, I completely agree you can control what bothers you. But I also think that being 'bothered' by something is kind of like physical pain, it's there to alert you to an issue of concern. Then, the key is to examine it and see if it's real or imagined---if it should bother you, so to speak. A SO who said something like that to me on the phone, as a sort of closing remark, would bother me. It would suggest a criticism of my character and the way I handle things that is from the outside---not a teammate hoping to help me and be in it with me. First, she said that I was saying, "Fix my brain and everything will be okay in the relationship." Not what I'd take, but I get what she's saying. Goes back to what I said about blame. You seem to want to know "Who's right?" And the answer is, "It does not matter." It almost never does in relationships. Do you want to be right, or do you want to be happy? That's true in sales, it's true in love, and it's true basically anywhere you deal with people. that I was saying that she could control ALL things that EVER bother her. Fussing about this is kind of parsing words. All or some was likely not the issue. I'm not saying she didn't say this. She likely felt attacked. I get why she felt that way. I don't think you meant to "attack" her but I do think you meant to coerce her to change for your benefit. Which is really where the blame game comes in. I then went on to point out (big mistake) that most people in response to my original statement would have just said, "That's true" or "Yeah, probably so," or, "Maybe you're right," or even just, "I'll think about that." Now understand, I am not someone who has to be right - that's not the issue. I don't think you have to be right, but I think you very desperately want to see who is right in these situations. (Meaning I think you can admit when you realize you're wrong, but that you do focus on right/wrong more than is useful in relationships.) And you're right, this was a HUGE mistake. When you say to a partner, "Most people would just say X," what you're saying is essentially, "Why are you acting abnormal?" which nobody wants to hear. FTR, I'm not saying this girl doesn't have broader issues. Sounds like she might, but the only person you can change in any dynamic is YOU, so I'm just suggesting paths you can take to make your own communication more effective in relationships and paths that may lead you awry. (a.) is definitely what I need to learn. But it sounds so Dr. Phil and so unnecessary to me - I confess, however, that I am like Spock. Well, I hate Dr. Phil. He's kind of a jerk. To me, (a) is all about recognizing there are two in the conversation, and that you're playing TOGETHER. It's a team. It seems like you fall into "versus" mode. Which never gets a relationship anywhere. I get emotional but never illogical which is why (b.) almost never applies to me. I don't mean to sound pompous with that. That's just how I think. Very linear. Too much logic can be just as detrimental as not enough. (She saw the "Craigslist Killer" movie on TV and started comparing him with me - yes, comparing me with a sociopath - and worked herself into a dither. I diffused it pretty well, IMHO, in part based on what I learned before. Well, that sounds kind of crazy.
Eddie Edirol Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 Dood, the bottom line is the problem isnt you. Someone who is over-emotional will WANT to get angry by deliberately mis-interpreting things you said to turn them into an argument. Start over with a new girl, when you get one that is normal, you will see that the problems had nothing to do with you. You cant fix her, drop her now.
Cee Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 On the Myers-Briggs, I am off the charts on feeling. Yet, most of the men I date are very high on thinking. I have learned to regulate my feelings to the point that I only express them when I see value in it. Usually, if something upsets me, I let it go. But if I detect a pattern where I am having persistent negative feelings, I address the problem. I do fall into the trap of reading too much into what a man says. I do it a lot more than I let on. When I was young, there'd be a fight. Now, I let it pass. I still have strong feelings, but I keep them more private. I believe that thinkers can learn to express feelings that they keep private. Even if your dominant style is logic, you still have feelings. Like love and affection for your GF. Or anger at a work situation. Simply saying, "I feel X emotion" is enough. I think us feeling types love to "process" feelings. But thinkers don't do that. If they express a feeling, they don't want to elaborate. Personally, I don't push logical people to process feelings. If they express one, I go quiet and listen. But when I'm with a feeling type friend, omg, we love to process.
paddington bear Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 (edited) Her mother was an overbearing (and controlling, I think) person. German. She would say, "Having been raised by Hitler." Well there you go. Problem is...how do you raise the topic of not jumping to conclusions or being overly sensitive with someone who will immediately jump to conclusions and is overly sensitive??? I love(d) her. Love(d)...uh oh. And no, don't worry my initials are not KM! But...I was raised by a mother myself, who still now, (I'm in my 30's) can be incredibly critical and rude - not that I would ever describe her as a nazi, but comments made over the course of my life really did dent my self-esteem. They say that we fall in love with her parents. Perhaps there are aspects of you and how you say things that are reminiscent (reminiscent I said!! not exactly the same) of her mother subconsciously which is why she was drawn to you in the first place, but conversely gets angry exactly because it seems familiar (even if it was not your intent). Edited February 5, 2011 by paddington bear
Author Jonno_S Posted February 5, 2011 Author Posted February 5, 2011 Zengirl, let me tell you that I think you're amazing. While I don't agree with all you say, it's well thought out and on-point. The statement I made was not to change her for my benefit. She needs to focus on school which is what she was saying so that was the context and my words were intended to encourage her in that direction. If she had just said, "what do you mean by that?" or something else, rather than impute things that weren't there, maybe this thread would never have been started. And get this, I was saying that based on your advice in another thread so I thought it was just one of those innocuous statements, almost a trueism. During the skiing thing - I am pretty laid back and I was having a great morning - and she didn't seem to stressed out either but she is not a great multi-tasker so when I said that, I got barked at. I wish, I so wish, I could take the jokey-diffusing response. Sometimes I do, but the misunderstanding thing hits a button with me so in that instance I kind of cringed internally and said nothing and just moved on. I get what you're saying about the "Who's right" thing. And sometimes I am that way. But what I mean is that if all this drama happens, it seems so much more palatable to me if someone apologizes for creating it. That's not to say that every time an apology or a, "you're right" or both, are necessary, but sometimes, just sometimes can't a person concede? It means so much to me when I hear it and I apologize all the time. Some people make such a big deal about letting out an apology and life would be so much smoother - the other day a guy in a car almost hit me while I was walking. It wasn't that big of a deal but I heard him just say, "My bad" and I just said, "It's cool" and it was DONE. That's what I mean. Not a right or wrong thing. As the pedestrian, I was right - I had the right of way, but I don't care about that - the point was that the apology immediately made it right and it was over. GOD I wish I could just get her to see that simple little example. When she took responsibility for the neck-warmer thing and connected it to her mother, I didn't jump and yell "Victory!" - that's not me. I just want the team-mate thing too because she had treated me like the enemy, frankly, by her original response.
zengirl Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 I get what you're saying. FTR, this girl sounds exhausting. That doesn't mean I don't see a few of her points, or instances where you can improve, but what it comes down to is: You can't change people. You can change you, or you can choose to not deal with someone. If these miscommunications happen frequently in your relationships, you can either choose to change the people you pick or the way you communicate. Or complain about it. But you seem like someone who honestly wants a better result, so I doubt you'll just complain about it. Frankly, I suggest a little of both choosing better people and honing those communication skills. It never hurts to get along with anyone you choose (and that's what the communication skills will do) but that doesn't mean you have to date someone who takes a lot of extra communication work.
Author Jonno_S Posted February 5, 2011 Author Posted February 5, 2011 Yes. Love(d). I told her I give up. Because I do/have/did. I can't be with someone who consistently takes my words as fights when they never, ever are meant that way. So my delivery sucks. So I don't put the right words around all that I say to make sure she's not taking it as an attack. She should know, from all that I have done and said, that I was very much in love with her and wanted a relationship and ultimately marriage. (I am not some commitment-o-phobe.) It's too unnatural. I mean, in a relationship there has to be natural harmony to some extent and the way she takes things so far afar - like I'm her enemy - is just too much. I could see it if I were distant, or always demanding my space, but I am not that way. I loved her being near me, always told her that and never minded when she'd just stay over or make some plan. I made beautiful, passionate love to her - she would come so intensely, as she never had before. Always a gentleman, she'd never pay, open a door or carry anything other than her purse if I were near. (I usually don't speak about intimate stuff, but I am a little pissed off at this point - not at you guys.) To the contrary, I would always say how she had the best ideas. I'm not a psychologist or her therapist. As was pointed out on another post, I am the quintessential "nice guy" who tries to fix the situation so we all get along. Sniff sniff. If she ever were to say (which she would never do) "Look, I will try to not argue with what you say," then maybe, maybe I would try again. But it's gone too far, too damaging. I think what I needed from her was the benefit of the doubt. I needed her to say, "well, this guy said this, but I know he loves me, so maybe he meant something else." I needed her to look at my heart if the words didn't sound right. But that rarely happened, and if it did, I didn't see it. What I saw was her in fight mode.
zengirl Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 Yes. Love(d). I told her I give up. Because I do/have/did. I can't be with someone who consistently takes my words as fights when they never, ever are meant that way. So my delivery sucks. So I don't put the right words around all that I say to make sure she's not taking it as an attack. She should know, from all that I have done and said, that I was very much in love with her and wanted a relationship and ultimately marriage. (I am not some commitment-o-phobe.) It's too unnatural. I mean, in a relationship there has to be natural harmony to some extent and the way she takes things so far afar - like I'm her enemy - is just too much. I could see it if I were distant, or always demanding my space, but I am not that way. I loved her being near me, always told her that and never minded when she'd just stay over or make some plan. I made beautiful, passionate love to her - she would come so intensely, as she never had before. Always a gentleman, she'd never pay, open a door or carry anything other than her purse if I were near. (I usually don't speak about intimate stuff, but I am a little pissed off at this point - not at you guys.) To the contrary, I would always say how she had the best ideas. I'm not a psychologist or her therapist. As was pointed out on another post, I am the quintessential "nice guy" who tries to fix the situation so we all get along. Sniff sniff. If she ever were to say (which she would never do) "Look, I will try to not argue with what you say," then maybe, maybe I would try again. But it's gone too far, too damaging. I think what I needed from her was the benefit of the doubt. I needed her to say, "well, this guy said this, but I know he loves me, so maybe he meant something else." I needed her to look at my heart if the words didn't sound right. But that rarely happened, and if it did, I didn't see it. What I saw was her in fight mode. Yeah, Jonno, and you always sound like a nice guy FWIW. Personally, I used to be in ad sales when I was very young (graduated college just before I turned 20 and worked in advertising till I was almost 24), and I learned how to communicate with everyone during that time. Thinkers, feelers. . . you name it. That was my job. Making sure everyone loved talking to me and felt "heard" and respected. So I often make a game of trying to communicate with anyone and everyone in real life in effective ways. It's fun to me. But I get wanting the benefit of the doubt (who doesn't?), and probably, this girl just wasn't for you. You can take tips and tricks as you find necessary, but the best tip and trick is probably to see what qualities clashed and find a woman who's a better fit.
Author Jonno_S Posted February 5, 2011 Author Posted February 5, 2011 I get what you're saying. FTR, this girl sounds exhausting. That doesn't mean I don't see a few of her points, or instances where you can improve, but what it comes down to is: You can't change people. You can change you, or you can choose to not deal with someone. Indeed, ZG. That's my point of this thread. I want to change me - I don't want to get sucked into the misunderstood->argument-> whirlpool. She was not exhausting all the time. Funny, in person it was usually so much better. We both thought the other was very attractive so maybe that was bad. I was talking to a friend (a female) who also gave me good advice. She said when people are like that, do not engage. Just say, "sorry you feel that way" and don't respond more. That's the mistake I make/made and want to change me.
Eddie Edirol Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 Indeed, ZG. That's my point of this thread. I want to change me - I don't want to get sucked into the misunderstood->argument-> whirlpool. She was not exhausting all the time. Funny, in person it was usually so much better. We both thought the other was very attractive so maybe that was bad. I was talking to a friend (a female) who also gave me good advice. She said when people are like that, do not engage. Just say, "sorry you feel that way" and don't respond more. That's the mistake I make/made and want to change me. You dont understand, its not you. Theres nothing you can do to change how she reacts to you when she wants to be angry. She might want to get addicted to the anger. If you keep trying to change your behavior to adapt to her mental affliction, eventually you will walk in, say "hey, how was your day?" Then she'll start yelling "WHY do you always have to SAY it like that!!!????" Theres no way to make this a happy ending. Jump ship and move on to someone who knows how to treat people.
paddington bear Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 No, I don't think that was the point - not to change to make someone like you. The point is, when you have issues with someone else within a relationship you can only change how you react to them and their crazy behaviour, but not the other person's behaviour.
Author Jonno_S Posted February 5, 2011 Author Posted February 5, 2011 Right. For the record, it is over, Eddie. But I guess I get into the whole, "How do I figure this out ahead of time?" condundrum. Also, it's rare that I meet someone I want to get to know/go out with. It's not like I can run up to women and ask if they can respond to my check list. I live in Philadelphia and women here are tough.
paddington bear Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 Right. For the record, it is over, Eddie. But I guess I get into the whole, "How do I figure this out ahead of time?" condundrum. Also, it's rare that I meet someone I want to get to know/go out with. It's not like I can run up to women and ask if they can respond to my check list. I live in Philadelphia and women here are tough. You can't (I wish you could...). That is what dating is for. Initial physical attraction on some level. Then during the date you watch out for red flags and don't ignore them like I always do....
Eddie Edirol Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 Right. For the record, it is over, Eddie. But I guess I get into the whole, "How do I figure this out ahead of time?" condundrum. Also, it's rare that I meet someone I want to get to know/go out with. It's not like I can run up to women and ask if they can respond to my check list. I live in Philadelphia and women here are tough. Its not hard, next time, if there is anything that tips you off as crazy when you are dating someone, start stepping away. Thats the only way you can avoid it. Maybe you went this far with her because you think you cant date around, but youre only restricting yourself. You might want to consider that your choices brought you to women like this and you might have to reconsider your criteria.
Author Jonno_S Posted February 6, 2011 Author Posted February 6, 2011 On the Myers-Briggs, I am off the charts on feeling. Yet, most of the men I date are very high on thinking. I have learned to regulate my feelings to the point that I only express them when I see value in it. Usually, if something upsets me, I let it go. But if I detect a pattern where I am having persistent negative feelings, I address the problem. I do fall into the trap of reading too much into what a man says. I do it a lot more than I let on. When I was young, there'd be a fight. Now, I let it pass. I still have strong feelings, but I keep them more private. I believe that thinkers can learn to express feelings that they keep private. Even if your dominant style is logic, you still have feelings. Like love and affection for your GF. Or anger at a work situation. Simply saying, "I feel X emotion" is enough. I think us feeling types love to "process" feelings. But thinkers don't do that. If they express a feeling, they don't want to elaborate. Personally, I don't push logical people to process feelings. If they express one, I go quiet and listen. But when I'm with a feeling type friend, omg, we love to process. Here's where I scored: Your Type is ENTP Extraverted 22% Intuitive 50% Thinking 1% Perceiving 11% It also flashed, "YOU HAVE NO PERSONALITY!! What does this all mean??
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