Who is pining more?

[siuys]

It seems to me that in most cases during NC it is the OW or OM pining for, or struggling more than the married person rather than the other way round. What is the consensus out there?

 

I am not sure about if both parties are married, but I am more interested to know the affairs between a single person and a married person...

[Ladyblue]

It seems to me that in most cases during NC it is the OW or OM pining for, or struggling more than the married person rather than the other way round. What is the consensus out there?

 

I am not sure about if both parties are married, but I am more interested to know the affairs between a single person and a married person...

 

In my case, that was definitely true. I "pined" for him certainly much more than he pined for me, or we would be together tonight, instead of me posting here on LS!

 

In fact, the "reasoning" behind it is what led to the demise of our A. It was a long term, and long distance, EA. We saw each other sometimes, but not on a regular, frequent basis. We talked and texted constantly. He wrote me letters and sent me packages. He spent hours talking in detail about our future together.

 

We had been sweethearts as far back as I could remember. We just always assumed we would be together. Separated by family conflict, and his family's move to another country when we were 15.

 

When we reconnected, he was in the midst of terrible family problems, wife a serial cheater, who yo-yoed back and forth between wanting her lover and her husband.

 

Three years we carried on the most incredible love story you could ever imagine. But he never left. And it slowly began to sink in. While he was There, with Her, living his Life, with Her, I was sitting home alone, loving him, missing him, wanting him. Alone. Yeah, he loved me, missed me, wanted me, too. But his bed wasn't empty. His house wasn't empty. He had her to occupy his time and thoughts, he had her to come home to every night, he had her to go to dinner with, he had her to accompany him to social outings. When he was sick, or she was sick, the other person was there for them.

 

I came home to my dog every day. I had social outings. With platonic friends. Spent a lot of time waiting for my phone to ring. My dog and I really bonded.

 

As I've said in other posts, our love story was his fantasy, but it was my reality. While I was alone, he was with his family. While my only relationshlp was with him, he had both of us. I know their relationship wasn't great, but it was still a real life, day-in, day-out relationship. He was still there with her every single day. While he couldn't stand the thought of another man touching me, he was with his wife every night. I'm sure there were nights when he slept in the recliner. But I'm sure there were nights when he didn't, too.

 

His words to me were incredibly sweet and loving. his promises breathtaking.

 

But he stayed with her.

 

He was never alone. I was always alone. Yes, I pined for him more than he did for me. He had someone full-time every day. I didn't.

[Ladyblue]

To illustrate my point, here is a post I wrote on LS in 2009:

 

"but after being the OW in a long-distance EA for almost a year, it did occur to me today that if I were in a real-life relationship, instead of being the OW, I would probably be making plans for the evening, and living a real life, And making real plans that might really happen, instead of every day sleeping, eating and showering with the cell phone in my hand, and spending today sitting here on the couch crying all day, and reading posts from people I don't even know on LS! All for the phone calls and empty promises of Mr. Wonderful! Aaahh, what a life I have chosen for myself!"

 

While HE was home with his wife. Yes, they were fighting a lot, but they were having some not so awful moments, too. Even during the bad times, his emotions and attentions were directed toward her. They were still having SOME KIND of full-time relationship. He was living a full life - full of SOMETHING, which might have been better than my life full of nothingness.

 

Apparently it was, because he didn't leave her.

[jj33]

People are people, married or not. I was at a party recently where someone was separated. I heard him say to the hostess, I miss her. He had been seprated from his wife for almost a year. The party was a very very fun evening very distracting hard to think of anything else but what was going on there. But he wasnt thinking about the band, wasnt thinking about the fact that he was dancing around like a rubber band. He was doing all this and wishing she was there. He left with someone he met that night, but his mind was on his wife....

 

Almost 2 years after we broke up xMM texted me from his birthday party. There were tons of people there he was the man of the evening, but his mind was elsewhere. Of course the text marginally related to work but puleeese.... it was after midnite on a weekend....

 

There is no way to know if someone is thinking of you or missing you unless they tell you. And if you are in NC, they wont tell you.

 

Suiys, only you know in your heart what you and he shared. If you miss him, Im sure he misses you too. But where does that get you? It makes you feel better because you didnt go through everything for nothing, the love was real.

 

But pining is no barometer of what will happen in the future. He may pine for you for the next 30 years, he may pine for you on his deathbed. But that still doesnt mean he will act on his feelings.

 

Hang in there. It will get better

 

Edited to add: Knowing xMM was pining for me used to make me feel better sometimes. After awhile it just bugged me. I failed to understand how someone could pine for years and yet do nothing. On paper he has the most amazing life. But he doesnt love it. Hes not happy. And thats not my problem and hes not willing to change it so I just ignore the pining now. None of it moves me anymore. It annoys me.

Edited January 23, 2011 by jj33

[East7]

Hi siuys, in my case it was xMW who pined the more, I never called/texted/e-mailed first. She broke NC many many times.

 

I hope you are doing better. Keep strict NC if you want to find some peace. Hugs

[siuys]

It goes to show that, again, like most of us already know, pining or not, action is everything.

 

Thanks, East, I am doing a lot better. I have been keeping strict NC but our A/R is not resolved. For the first time, he seems to be able to honour my request and keep NC. Well, it's been the longest NC anyway. Now it's whether or not the actions will follow like he said he would. I don't doubt his intentions, but I doubt his strength and conviction. But at the end of the day, I have no control over anything except my own actions, my own responses, how I want to live my life and the choices I make. So I get on with it, and I believe, in time, hopefully not too long, I will get some answers from his actions/inactions. If he moves out again, maybe there is a chance, if he does not, chances are pretty slim that I will want him. But either way, NC for now is the best.

 

I hope you are all doing better, also.

[woinlove]

It goes to show that, again, like most of us already know, pining or not, action is everything.

 

Yes!

 

A lot of OW/OM wonder how MM/MW can stay married when they say they are so unhappy. Actually, some will not be happy for long no matter what situation they chose. They can have the most amazing life on paper (as jj33 says) and be unhappy, while other people appear to have very little, but are happy.

 

Lasting happiness is first and foremost the relationship we have with ourselves. When that relationship is lacking, people's words often don't match their actions. If you fall in love with such a person, you may be falling in love with the person they could be, but if they don't choose to become that person, there really is nothing you can do about it. Whether they spend their time pining or not, doesn't really matter.

[Ellin]

Yes!

 

A lot of OW/OM wonder how MM/MW can stay married when they say they are so unhappy. Actually, some will not be happy for long no matter what situation they chose. They can have the most amazing life on paper (as jj33 says) and be unhappy, while other people appear to have very little, but are happy.

 

Lasting happiness is first and foremost the relationship we have with ourselves. When that relationship is lacking, people's words often don't match their actions. If you fall in love with such a person, you may be falling in love with the person they could be, but if they don't choose to become that person, there really is nothing you can do about it. Whether they spend their time pining or not, doesn't really matter.

 

Very wise words, worth dwelling upon.

 

Thank you for this insight.

[half_ofa_heart]

I love this thread siuys!

 

Pining is not my favorite word. I believe we both spend a fair amount of time pining for each other but like EVERYONE says, actions speak volumes. I don't know what it's going to take to end this affair but pining sure doesn't help. In all the times I attempt NC, its always him that breaks it. I've prayed that some day he will QUIT pining over me so I can move on.

 

I want out of this A but for some reason, being without him doesn't seem BETTER than being with him. Even though my head tells me otherwise.

[alexandria35]

I think women pine more and longer just in general, or at least they show it more.

 

As in jj's example of the man who said he missed his ex but then still danced up a storm and left with someone else. Men are just more pratical that way. They might really love and miss a woman but they are not going to stop living due to this. I remember being absolutely devasted during a bad break up and refusing to even look at another man for months and months afterwards. About 8 months after this break up, we reconcilled. Like I said, during our many months apart I was heartbroken and didn't even consider dating another. My ex, on the other hand, had been out there actively seeking a new partner and actually had on ongoing relationship of about 5 months with another woman. Oh my goodness, did we ever have some heated discussions about that!!

 

See when we got back together, of course it was very passionate and full of "i've never stopped missing you", "thought of you everday", "never quit loving you" type of talking. Soooo...when I heard that he started dating again right away and had even had a girlfriend I was quite upset. To my way of thinking, he was lying to me about his feelings for me, otherwise he wouldn't have been out there dating. I simply couldn't get my head around how you can say you love and miss me, but then date another. No way! that's not love right? My ex didn't see it this way at all. He said sitting home alone, crying in his beer every night, and thinking about how much he loved and missed me wasn't going to change anthing and that to do so would just be choosing to wallow in misery. When I pointed out that I hadn't dated anyone else, he was unimpressed. Said that was my choice, nobody forced me to spend months and months home alone. Grrrrr...that conversation pissed me off.

 

So overall, I think women generally pine the most. In the early stages the pain of the broken relationship takes over her whole life for awhile. I think men can take that same pain and put it in little box and get on with life. This makes it sound like women take the worst hit, but not really. The woman may be completely consumed by pain at first, but this forces them to deal with it immediately, totally and completely. Usually once the woman has done this it is fully resolved for her and she truly does go forward with no backward glances. I think men, on the other hand, take that little box of pain that I mentioned earlier and carry it around in their pocket. Every so often they take it out and examine it, if it causes pain they close it back up and put it back in their pocket, only to revisit it time and time again. They can carry their little box for years and years whereas the woman completely unburdened herself of the pain years ago and barely even thinks about it in the present.

[Ladyblue]

I think women pine more and longer just in general, or at least they show it more.

 

As in jj's example of the man who said he missed his ex but then still danced up a storm and left with someone else. Men are just more pratical that way. They might really love and miss a woman but they are not going to stop living due to this. I remember being absolutely devasted during a bad break up and refusing to even look at another man for months and months afterwards. About 8 months after this break up, we reconcilled. Like I said, during our many months apart I was heartbroken and didn't even consider dating another. My ex, on the other hand, had been out there actively seeking a new partner and actually had on ongoing relationship of about 5 months with another woman. Oh my goodness, did we ever have some heated discussions about that!!

 

See when we got back together, of course it was very passionate and full of "i've never stopped missing you", "thought of you everday", "never quit loving you" type of talking. Soooo...when I heard that he started dating again right away and had even had a girlfriend I was quite upset. To my way of thinking, he was lying to me about his feelings for me, otherwise he wouldn't have been out there dating. I simply couldn't get my head around how you can say you love and miss me, but then date another. No way! that's not love right? My ex didn't see it this way at all. He said sitting home alone, crying in his beer every night, and thinking about how much he loved and missed me wasn't going to change anthing and that to do so would just be choosing to wallow in misery. When I pointed out that I hadn't dated anyone else, he was unimpressed. Said that was my choice, nobody forced me to spend months and months home alone. Grrrrr...that conversation pissed me off.

 

So overall, I think women generally pine the most. In the early stages the pain of the broken relationship takes over her whole life for awhile. I think men can take that same pain and put it in little box and get on with life. This makes it sound like women take the worst hit, but not really. The woman may be completely consumed by pain at first, but this forces them to deal with it immediately, totally and completely. Usually once the woman has done this it is fully resolved for her and she truly does go forward with no backward glances. I think men, on the other hand, take that little box of pain that I mentioned earlier and carry it around in their pocket. Every so often they take it out and examine it, if it causes pain they close it back up and put it back in their pocket, only to revisit it time and time again. They can carry their little box for years and years whereas the woman completely unburdened herself of the pain years ago and barely even thinks about it in the present.

 

WOW! This makes a lot of sense, and explains a lot of things! I'm amazed at the insight you have into the workings of a man's mind. But it ALL rings true!

[NoIDidn't]

I think women pine more and longer just in general, or at least they show it more.

 

As in jj's example of the man who said he missed his ex but then still danced up a storm and left with someone else. Men are just more pratical that way. They might really love and miss a woman but they are not going to stop living due to this. I remember being absolutely devasted during a bad break up and refusing to even look at another man for months and months afterwards. About 8 months after this break up, we reconcilled. Like I said, during our many months apart I was heartbroken and didn't even consider dating another. My ex, on the other hand, had been out there actively seeking a new partner and actually had on ongoing relationship of about 5 months with another woman. Oh my goodness, did we ever have some heated discussions about that!!

 

See when we got back together, of course it was very passionate and full of "i've never stopped missing you", "thought of you everday", "never quit loving you" type of talking. Soooo...when I heard that he started dating again right away and had even had a girlfriend I was quite upset. To my way of thinking, he was lying to me about his feelings for me, otherwise he wouldn't have been out there dating. I simply couldn't get my head around how you can say you love and miss me, but then date another. No way! that's not love right? My ex didn't see it this way at all. He said sitting home alone, crying in his beer every night, and thinking about how much he loved and missed me wasn't going to change anthing and that to do so would just be choosing to wallow in misery. When I pointed out that I hadn't dated anyone else, he was unimpressed. Said that was my choice, nobody forced me to spend months and months home alone. Grrrrr...that conversation pissed me off.

 

So overall, I think women generally pine the most. In the early stages the pain of the broken relationship takes over her whole life for awhile. I think men can take that same pain and put it in little box and get on with life. This makes it sound like women take the worst hit, but not really. The woman may be completely consumed by pain at first, but this forces them to deal with it immediately, totally and completely. Usually once the woman has done this it is fully resolved for her and she truly does go forward with no backward glances. I think men, on the other hand, take that little box of pain that I mentioned earlier and carry it around in their pocket. Every so often they take it out and examine it, if it causes pain they close it back up and put it back in their pocket, only to revisit it time and time again. They can carry their little box for years and years whereas the woman completely unburdened herself of the pain years ago and barely even thinks about it in the present.

 

Yep, married or single, men have a simple creed: "love the one you're with".

[blizzard]

Definitely women pine more so.

Men find practical things to do to keep focused. More men have the "if it happens, it happens and if it doesn't...well let the cards fall where they may" view as well. Whereas women need more direction of where love is headed or why it ended.

And as long as men are "comfortably taken care of " I think they can make the best of any situation for a long time.

Because men view "time" differently than women. 8mts NC seems like an eternity to me... Men seem to have all the time in the world.

[Confused4Now]

Definitely women pine more so.

Men find practical things to do to keep focused. More men have the "if it happens, it happens and if it doesn't...well let the cards fall where they may" view as well. Whereas women need more direction of where love is headed or why it ended.

And as long as men are "comfortably taken care of " I think they can make the best of any situation for a long time.

Because men view "time" differently than women. 8mts NC seems like an eternity to me... Men seem to have all the time in the world.

Being a man I have to to agree with all that was said. That's always been my approach with my xMW who still pines for me. I never initiate any dialog with her. I have a full life and I really don't need to be bothered. Like men I've learned to compartmentalize and put that part of my life aside.

[SunsetRed]

LadyBlue, your post #3 took the words right out of my mouth.

 

He can say whatever he wants to say and I know one day he'll want to see me, but it doesn't change the fact that he and his wife celebrated the holidays together and even celebrated their anniversary in Dec and I was either alone, or working overtime.

 

My xMM had been separated from his wife for 3 years and hadn't celebrated an anniversary for 4 years. When she found out how close he was with me and knew what she was about to lose, she wanted him back.

 

I know they went as a family to see the Broadway production of the Lion King. Again, I was alone.

 

So, back to Siuy's question, who pines more...obviously the single person.

The xMM goes right back to sharing his life with someone.

[Ladyblue]

LadyBlue, your post #3 took the words right out of my mouth.

 

He can say whatever he wants to say and I know one day he'll want to see me, but it doesn't change the fact that he and his wife celebrated the holidays together and even celebrated their anniversary in Dec and I was either alone, or working overtime.

 

My xMM had been separated from his wife for 3 years and hadn't celebrated an anniversary for 4 years. When she found out how close he was with me and knew what she was about to lose, she wanted him back.

 

I know they went as a family to see the Broadway production of the Lion King. Again, I was alone.

 

So, back to Siuy's question, who pines more...obviously the single person.

The xMM goes right back to sharing his life with someone.

 

Exactlty. Honestly, I think you are my older and wiser twin, Red. And I think we dated the same guy!

 

Yeah, I still remember the night I wrote that. He had promised to come see me the day before. But the day had passed without a word, and then a brief maybe 10 second phone call to say he couldn't make it. Click. And then all day the next day I waited to hear from him. And nothing. And that evening, I wrote that post.

 

And get this. He caught his wife in a major PA just 19 days before their anniversary. And guess what? They STILL celebrated it. They spent a quiet evening together at home, cooked dinner, looked at their wedding photos, and talked. All the while I was sitting at home with my dog, and getting the occasion text from him in the bathroom, telling me how much he loved me, and "it won't be long now." what, before he wiped his butt and flushed?

 

No one deserves to be put through that emotional ringer.

 

Stay strong, Red. If he dares to call you, you tell him exactly how much better than HIM you deserve!

[lovingwhatis]

Yes!

 

A lot of OW/OM wonder how MM/MW can stay married when they say they are so unhappy. Actually, some will not be happy for long no matter what situation they chose. They can have the most amazing life on paper (as jj33 says) and be unhappy, while other people appear to have very little, but are happy.

Lasting happiness is first and foremost the relationship we have with ourselves. When that relationship is lacking, people's words often don't match their actions. If you fall in love with such a person, you may be falling in love with the person they could be, but if they don't choose to become that person, there really is nothing you can do about it. Whether they spend their time pining or not, doesn't really matter.

 

This is a great thread and a fantastic post, woinlove!! The bold paragraph is something I have recently realized as well, but to read it here in such clear expression was great! Thank you.

 

In my early 20s I argued with reality so much. I was in love with someone imagining how they could be, and I was insistent that they live up to their potential. I was continuously disappointed when he made choices (not related to me) that he knew were not in his best interest, and yet that's how he chose to live. That to me was true longing, but I question the feelings for him for I really didn't see him. I didn't see myself as well. It was torturous for both of us.

 

Loving xMM has been a decidedly different experience. I loved him, but didn't expect, didn't argue, didn't get mad. He didn't make empty promises either. I have longed for him since, and haven't dated anyone else in a long time. That hasn't been due to A fog or waiting for something he has promised, it has been because I don't feel the feelings I feel for him in for anyone else in my life. And I only experience difficulty when I lose track of the reality of what you wrote above.

 

On the subject on longing I'd like to share this though. There are two men in my life that long for me. Having been there myself, I definitely have compassion and understanding. They have both professed their love for me many times, but I am not in love, nor have been with either of them. "B" is my best friend and we get along wonderfully. We have discussed our situation numerous times, gone with brief NCs, and currently we appear to have reached a happy space. With the one exception, he sometimes makes very small remarks that lead me to believe that he still longs for me. I've confronted him in the past numerous times, yet for both of us, the value of the friendship is really great, we are just good for each other and love each other. The only thing that's missing is the passion on my end. But it is a question in my mind whether I should actually discontinue the friendship because ultimately it is not a good thing for him to have to stifle his feelings.

 

The other person "C" had a very abusive marriage with a emotionally ill wife (which ended years before I met him). He ultimately had to leave with nothing and has been prevented from talking to his children since. Having his own emotional difficulties, he has played victim with me after I have rejected him, and has been very accusatory with me. Because of this I went NC with him for almost a year, but recently we reconnected. He claimed to be in a completely different space and wanted my friendship (we do share many interests and have lots to talk about). He has also said how much I've helped him heal and move to a different space in his life regarding the deeper hurt with his children. Naturally I was glad about it, and was willing to find the middle ground and have a friendship. Yet, he just emailed me accusing me of things that are simply not true. I trigger his painful emotions and he wrote me 5 page letters that are very difficult to read. I am realizing that the intent of transcending the past and building a friendship may have not been the best. It is the reality of the current situation, so I accept it, yet it is sad to see that not much has changed in the level of hurt since last year. And maybe I prolonged it by renewing the friendship with him.

 

Thankfully it took me only half an hour to actually realize that his accusations are not meant to hurt me. He is doing the best he can with the hurt in his heart.

 

So in many respects I am glad that xMM has not broken NC and that he asked for NC (after me asking for it and breaking it), that has been the kinder thing in many many respects. He gave all he could give. I intuitively understood that and didn't blame him.

[pureinheart]

It seems to me that in most cases during NC it is the OW or OM pining for, or struggling more than the married person rather than the other way round. What is the consensus out there?

 

I am not sure about if both parties are married, but I am more interested to know the affairs between a single person and a married person...

 

ExDM pined after me I think, and that might have been the reason they D'ed..not real sure because the D needed to take place (not for me).

 

Neither of us pine after the other as we have moved on. I wish him all the happiness this world has to give:)

[Owl]

I would GUESS that the OW/OM likely 'pine' for the MM/MW longer than the other way around.

 

And this would be because they typically have their other relationship to "sustain" them while they're going through that grieving period at the end of the affair.

 

If their BS knows, and has agreed to reconcile...typically the MM/MW's focus is suddenly made to turn upon fixing that relationship. That doesn't mean that they don't grieve the end of the affair/miss their AP...but it means that they don't have the opportunity to dwell on it for long. They're kind of forced to deal with it more quickly because they HAVE to take action to rebuild their marriage if they choose to stay.

 

If the BS doesn't know...the MM/MW is forced to hide that grief...again, not allowed to dwell on it. They can't spend time facing it...they're forced by circumstances to let it go more quickly.

 

And...they're supported by having that relationship to "fall back on" to a degree. They're still getting some segment of their emotional needs met through that relationship...making their grieving period less drastic than it is for the AP, who often is forced to go on "alone".

[pureinheart]

In my early 20s I argued with reality so much. I was in love with someone imagining how they could be, and I was insistent that they live up to their potential. I was continuously disappointed when he made choices (not related to me) that he knew were not in his best interest, and yet that's how he chose to live. That to me was true longing, but I question the feelings for him for I really didn't see him. I didn't see myself as well. It was torturous for both of us.

 

Loving xMM has been a decidedly different experience. I loved him, but didn't expect, didn't argue, didn't get mad. He didn't make empty promises either. I have longed for him since, and haven't dated anyone else in a long time. That hasn't been due to A fog or waiting for something he has promised, it has been because I don't feel the feelings I feel for him in for anyone else in my life. And I only experience difficulty when I lose track of the reality of what you wrote above.

 

 

I still hate reality and avoid it whenever possible ...lol...too much of it IMO.

 

Bold, I had to laugh...not at you or what you said, although exDM and me fought like cats and dogs. My friend told me that we reminded him of a brother and a sister R. We didn't fight about the R much at all, we fought about the job and how it should be done and him and a co-worker bypassing inspection points.

Edited January 24, 2011 by pureinheart

[lovingwhatis]

I still hate reality and avoid it whenever possible ...lol...too much of it IMO.

 

Bold, I had to laugh...not at you or what you said, although exDM and me fought like cats and dogs. My friend told me that we reminded him of a brother and a sister R. We didn't fight about the R much at all, we fought about the job and how it should be done and him and a co-worker bypassing inspection points.

 

Haha, Pure, glad I made you laugh.

 

Hate is a strong word.. Why do you feel that you hate reality? I used to avoid facing it, knowingly and unknowingly, because it didn't match up with my ideas in my head. I agree with Katie that that is rather insane. But unlike Katie, I feel that it is not about giving one's self "tough love" about accepting it, but allowing Everything to be as it is.

 

As I read your response, right away I thought of how I am avoiding the reality of my friend's subtle comments of wanting to be with me. I generally choose to sweep it under the rug. But as I was writing him just now about an issue that he is struggling with in his life, I gave him (and me) the answer. Trusting Life. Trusting that Life Knows why things are happening, even if We don't know why. In that moment not wanting him to feel this way simply falls away. It just is.

[East7]

I would GUESS that the OW/OM likely 'pine' for the MM/MW longer than the other way around.

And this would be because they typically have their other relationship to "sustain" them while they're going through that grieving period at the end of the affair.

If their BS knows, and has agreed to reconcile...typically the MM/MW's focus is suddenly made to turn upon fixing that relationship. That doesn't mean that they don't grieve the end of the affair/miss their AP...but it means that they don't have the opportunity to dwell on it for long. They're kind of forced to deal with it more quickly because they HAVE to take action to rebuild their marriage if they choose to stay.

 

If the BS doesn't know...the MM/MW is forced to hide that grief...again, not allowed to dwell on it. They can't spend time facing it...they're forced by circumstances to let it go more quickly.

 

And...they're supported by having that relationship to "fall back on" to a degree. They're still getting some segment of their emotional needs met through that relationship...making their grieving period less drastic than it is for the AP, who often is forced to go on "alone".

 

I must agree with this, in the sense that the married AP and the single AP are not in same situation. It makes perfect logical sense.

 

BUT....the relationships don't always follow logical patterns. I have a story for you:

 

MW decides to confess her A. Her H is devastated but the fear to lose his W makes him forgive her. He doesn't do a 180° but rather a 0°. The DDay made him very vulnerable and he feels very guilty. He becomes too focused on her and very clingy like never before. That provokes the opposite effect that he is looking for. She is immediately feeling comfortable and her fear of being kicked in the curb is gone. Her H validated the M. Against all odds..she keeps talking and flirting with OM while pretending working on her M because she is now comforted. Her addiction is not over. Now that she knows her H is not going, she wants to win the OM back.

OM is confused, what to do with a MW who decided to stay with her H but still "wants" him? He keeps talking back to her because he too is still addicted to her but at some point he is tired and wants it over ! MW pines after him, breaks NC, goes on conflicting feelings, almost harasses OM but he rejects her. After several tries, she makes up her mind that what is over is over...Only then she is really back to her M and starts to work on it.

 

That's why the M counselors recommend 180° because when the BS is doing everything too soon, too much, sometimes it is (paradoxally) counter-productive.

 

Some people will pine after the very person that is rejecting them. The dynamic of post-Dday depends also how the BS and the AP reacts on the situation. Most likely, it is the "rejecting" partner who will attract WS the most.

Edited January 25, 2011 by East7

[Ladyblue]

I must agree with this, in the sense that the married AP and the single AP are not in same situation. It makes perfect logical sense.

 

BUT....the relationships don't always follow logical patterns. I have a story for you:

 

MW decides to confess her A. Her H is devastated but the fear to lose his W makes him forgive her. He doesn't do a 180° but rather a 0°. The DDay made him very vulnerable and he feels very guilty. He becomes too focused on her and very clingy like never before. That provokes the opposite effect that he is looking for. She is immediately feeling comfortable and her fear of being kicked in the curb is gone. Her H validated the M. Against all odds..she keeps talking and flirting with OM while pretending working on her M because she is now comforted. Her addiction is not over. Now that she knows her H is not going, she wants to win the OM back.

OM is confused, what to do with a MW who decided to stay with her H but still "wants" him? He keeps talking back to her because he too is still addicted to her but at some point he is tired and wants it over ! MW pines after him, breaks NC, goes on conflicting feelings, almost harasses OM but he rejects her. After several tries, she makes up her mind that what is over is over...Only then she is really back to her M and starts to work on it.

 

That's why the M counselors recommend 180° because when the BS is doing everything too soon, too much, sometimes it is (paradoxally) counter-productive.

 

Some people will pine after the very person that is rejecting them. The dynamic of post-Dday depends also how the BS and the AP reacts on the situation. Most likely, it is the "rejecting" partner who will attract WS the most.

 

AAAHHHH! THIS!!! THIS would explain why the WS keeps coming back when the AP tries to go NC.

 

It makes sense. Some peopple just want what they can't have, and it may not even be so terribly attractive to them, it might not even be something they want all that much --- until they know they can't have it or might lose it.

 

Perhaps it is the thing that keeps A's stringing along, wavering back and forth, for so long.

 

It would also explain why my MM would seem to get closer to his W, every time he caught her with her lover.

[East7]

AAAHHHH! THIS!!! THIS would explain why the WS keeps coming back when the AP tries to go NC.

 

It makes sense. Some peopple just want what they can't have, and it may not even be so terribly attractive to them, it might not even be something they want all that much --- until they know they can't have it or might lose it.

 

Perhaps it is the thing that keeps A's stringing along, wavering back and forth, for so long.

 

It would also explain why my MM would seem to get closer to his W, every time he caught her with her lover.

 

Some people are wired that way. They will be more attracted to a 'challenge' type of relationship. The easy one doesn't make them thrill.

 

If the AP backs off they will pine after AP.

 

To all the APs : if you want MM/MW pine after you and begging you, cut them off at the very first sign of "bus accident" drama. I can guarantee, they will be after you for a looooong time.

 

To all the BS : if you want to keep your W-spouse never beg, ILYs, cry, scream. It is their job to win you back, not yours.

----------------------

 

Ladyblue, in your particular case I think the MM has serious self-esteem issues, he is accepting to stay with a serial cheating wife while he can have a loving, faithful woman

Why? Because he is in a masochist kind of relationship, everytime his wife cheats on him, his self-esteem plumets and he feels inferior than her. All the abusive relationships are based on a kind of masochist interaction where the abuser takes advantage on the damaged self-esteem of the abused parter. He tries hard to win her back because he feels like he can't have any better and/or she triggers in him the hysterical male competition. Some betrayed men will have a very strong sexual drive towards their WS after a Dday because of their destroyed Ego they will feel like they have to prove to their W that they are worth it, or are better than OM. It is a kind of subconscious competition.

 

While with you he has a very different interaction. You are his "soul-nurse", you are his oasis of peace and reality-escape. He feeds you with imagination because he wants to heal his damaged self-esteem, he wants to create a phantasy world where he is loved and not put down.

Oddly, people who have self-esteem issues don't go towards people who love them, they merely look for validation and reality escape. Why? Because in their inner conscious they have a very low image of themselves and they believe that they don't deserve the love they are given - so they feel like something is wrong when someone loves and nurtures them and they go back to their abuser.

[redcurls]

Some people are wired that way. They will be more attracted to a 'challenge' type of relationship. The easy one doesn't make them thrill.

 

If the AP backs off they will pine after AP.

 

To all the APs : if you want MM/MW pine after you and begging you, cut them off at the very first sign of "bus accident" drama. I can guarantee, they will be after you for a looooong time.

 

To all the BS : if you want to keep your W-spouse never beg, ILYs, cry, scream. It is their job to win you back, not yours.

----------------------

 

Ladyblue, in your particular case I think the MM has serious self-esteem issues, he is accepting to stay with a serial cheating wife while he can have a loving, faithful woman

Why? Because he is in a masochist kind of relationship, everytime his wife cheats on him, his self-esteem plumets and he feels inferior than her. All the abusive relationships are based on a kind of masochist interaction where the abuser takes advantage on the damaged self-esteem of the abused parter. He tries hard to win her back because he feels like he can't have any better and/or she triggers in him the hysterical male competition. Some betrayed men will have a very strong sexual drive towards their WS after a Dday because of their destroyed Ego they will feel like they have to prove to their W that they are worth it, or are better than OM. It is a kind of subconscious competition.

 

While with you he has a very different interaction. You are his "soul-nurse", you are his oasis of peace and reality-escape. He feeds you with imagination because he wants to heal his damaged self-esteem, he wants to create a phantasy world where he is loved and not put down.

Oddly, people who have self-esteem issues don't go towards people who love them, they merely look for validation and reality escape. Why? Because in their inner conscious they have a very low image of themselves and they believe that they don't deserve the love they are given - so they feel like something is wrong when someone loves and nurtures them and they go back to their abuser.

 

Wow, East, this is good. Surely, you have met my xMM! In his case his W doesn't cheat but she constantly verbally and emotionally abuses him. Note to all the BS who are about to jump out and skin me alive - I have heard her myself. XMM never said one bad word about her or about their relationship. I have heard her talking to him numerous times - its not pretty.

 

Anyway, I could never figure out why he couldn't see how highly I thought of him or how amazing I thought he is. He is so used to being bulldozered over by her and so conditioned to respond to her abuse, he absolutely can't comprehend that he can be loved by me to deeply.

 

But you know what? As much as I don't get that whole dynamic, it seems to be working for both of them, so what do I know? I could never have treated him so badly just to arouse his interest - blech. I can't play these games.