Crusoe Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 And between writing and intelligence level. I guess there's the occasional idiot savant, but in general if somebody sounds like an idiot in writing they're probably an idiot overall. There are billions who struggle to read or write, it's not because they lack intelligence. Do you think they could be excused for judging a book by it's cover?
Star Gazer Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 Education and even intelligence are not measures of character. Ding ding ding! Yes! But still, everyone is entitled to their preferences.
dispatch3d Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 I actually think in general you could benefit from a bit more focus on detail rather than spewing out whatever pops into your brain. I often have trouble following your posts and the logic behind your arguments. It would be very very hard for me to focus more on detail. I do my best to do things slow and methodically the first time, but I've come to realize I'm very much a big picture person. I think in abstractions, bigger pictures, etc. For me, details are difficult. Hating on profiles of people who don't bother making certain all of their sentences are carefully laid out, grammer is perfect, etc. is really just hating on people who think more big-picture. The people most guilty having phd's or degrees is a pretty interesting observation I think.
northern_sky Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 Writing well is more evidence of skill, taste, and style than intelligence. Education and even intelligence are not measures of character. I actually think that contempt for low intelligence is the result of poor critical thinking. Having high intelligence is like being good looking. It's not an achievement. It's an advantage. It's a gift. It's blind luck. Should good looking people have contempt for average or ugly people? Should they scorn, or mock them? The above is not directed at any one person, it's just an idea I have that this thread gave me an opportunity to write out. There's nothing wrong with having individual preferences. Tigress and many other women are attracted to intelligent men. This doesn't mean she has contempt for people who are less intelligent than she likes to date.
northern_sky Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 There are billions who struggle to read or write, it's not because they lack intelligence. Do you think they could be excused for judging a book by it's cover? If somebody is uneducated due to lack of opportunity, that's totally different.
dispatch3d Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 Writing well is more evidence of skill, taste, and style than intelligence. Education and even intelligence are not measures of character. I actually think that contempt for low intelligence is the result of poor critical thinking. Having high intelligence is like being good looking. It's not an achievement. It's an advantage. It's a gift. It's blind luck. Should good looking people have contempt for average or ugly people? Should they scorn, or mock them? The above is not directed at any one person, it's just an idea I have that this thread gave me an opportunity to write out. I agree with this, except I wouldn't say being intelligence is a skill or blind luck. In some (extreme) cases maybe it is, but most of the time it's probably a result of how people chose to live their lives. They may chose to think deeply on different issues, and therefore not be very smart. Or they may chose to only do things that come to them easily, and never attempt difficult tasks. They may also have a sense of entitlement, a sense they are always right, or something of that nature which limits their thinking. I guess what I'm saying is I believe being intelligent can be learned, most people aren't doomed to be dumb, just like most people (probably) aren't doomed to be intelligent. But yeah, I would say it's completely unneccessary and childish to mock dumber people.
hydorclops Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 When I was a kid a neighbor had a relative from Germany come live with them for a while. When she arrived she didn't speak English. She was maybe 30 years old. After a few months she was communicating clearly. After a year she was fluent. But she used "poor" grammar, like my neighbors. She was mostly interested in game shows and professional wrestling. And she was cheerful and warm. Intelligence is a slippery concept. Everyone is unique.
Star Gazer Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 If somebody is uneducated due to lack of opportunity, that's totally different. And how exactly do you know if the person has lacked opportunity from the face of their profile?
Nexus One Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 If you fail to present yourself well in writing. I see plenty of profiles on OKC from guys who mention they finished college and/or graduate school, and some are in a PhD. program. Yet they have little grasp on proper spelling, grammar and punctuation. This annoys me. The importance of writing skills, grammar, spelling, reading comprehension, et al has been almost completely lost among my age group and it's only getting worse. It's such a huge turnoff to see private messages/IMs from guys who come off unintelligent and inarticulate in writing, and I find it even more deplorable if they've gone through higher education. Is it too much these days to want a guy who actually presents himself like he's been educated? It could also be laziness on the part of the guys to correct any type or spelling errors they make. You could be misinterpreting their laziness for correcting with a low level of knowledge and/or intelligence.
welikeincrowds Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 (edited) The only thing i can say besides "i agree!" is that there is an exception in the learning disabled, who can often be bright and beautiful people, yet they struggle with writing. Edited January 16, 2011 by welikeincrowds and so do i apparently
jerbear Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 Ok I reread my first post and it was not that great. I was using a tablet. I have to disagree with some posters with the use of grammar, punctuation, and spelling in post-graduates. In graduate school, grammar and spelling levels was assumed at the 12th grade level or higher. Each school has different levels and professors. Many professors were nice to the students and just give a lower grade instead of suggesting to the department chair that the student needs remedial help. The department would not dismiss a student based on their writing skills. I will use my dating profile as a case; I never had it reviewed or read it out loud. Once I started to read it out loud and received trusted female feedback, the error of my ways were pointed out. Now it could be the guys fault by not having their profiles reviewed. I had reviewed my profile before graduate school and after graduate school, both were eye openers. The pre-graduate school profile had spelling mistakes, poor grammar, and sentence structure problems. I think the guys need to have some friends review their profile. Just like in graduate school when their papers were reviewed prior to submission.
Knittress Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 I notice a lot of women seem to care about writing style a lot more than most men. I've also read a lot of psychology articles that talk about how language skills are predominately a strength of the feminine mind. So maybe to some degree we're extrapolating our own abilities into a baseline norm that isn't exactly normal for the male gender. I realized at some point that maybe what I was looking for in a partner was a woman with a penis, and I should try and open my mind. Still working on it. I used to write and speak in a much more, er... pompous manner. Then at some point I realized that was I was doing was not demonstrating intelligence, but a pretentious stubbornness. I was expecting the entire world to conform to MY beliefs about what was proper and intelligent, and it was probably a bit off-putting. I have come since to realize that social skills are vastly more useful in life than IQ and am trying to adjust accordingly. (Also shiny hair and a trim waist - but that's an aggravation for another thread) I'm not as judgmental of others along the axis of 'intelligence' as I used to be, but... HAHA - you'll notice I still go for PhDs. And good grammar.
EasyHeart Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 Ah, so men are too stupid to write well? That must be it. For me, if a woman can spell (or count), I'm probably not going to date her.
Nexus One Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 For some women, if the guy is hot enough, most principles probably go overboard anyway. What you no spell right? That no problem, I dunt lik skool eider!
TryingToMoveOn Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 I'm getting my PhD shortly but in the world of online dating, my gut feeling, unsupported by evidence because I don't have any, is that often it's a turnoff to state that you have a PhD in your profile. There are so many other factors much more important than the degree someone may have.
br0ken_w0lf Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 ^^^^ I agree and personally I don't care what types of degrees a woman might have, it's not a factor. But I will say that poorly written profiles and/or e-mails are a turn-off for me as well, so I can sympathize. On a side note, one of the things that women frequently note about my profile is how well it's written and how it's "refreshing to see a guy who can actually spell"
BobSacamento Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 If you fail to present yourself well in writing. I see plenty of profiles on OKC from guys who mention they finished college and/or graduate school, and some are in a PhD. program. Yet they have little grasp on proper spelling, grammar and punctuation. This annoys me. The importance of writing skills, grammar, spelling, reading comprehension, et al has been almost completely lost among my age group and it's only getting worse. It's such a huge turnoff to see private messages/IMs from guys who come off unintelligent and inarticulate in writing, and I find it even more deplorable if they've gone through higher education. Is it too much these days to want a guy who actually presents himself like he's been educated? I feel like I'm detecting something. It's just my gut but...what did you get your degree in?
johan Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 I feel like I'm detecting something. It's just my gut but...what did you get your degree in? She's working on one in driving.
yah Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 If you fail to present yourself well in writing. I see plenty of profiles on OKC from guys who mention they finished college and/or graduate school, and some are in a PhD. program. Yet they have little grasp on proper spelling, grammar and punctuation. This annoys me. The importance of writing skills, grammar, spelling, reading comprehension, et al has been almost completely lost among my age group and it's only getting worse. It's such a huge turnoff to see private messages/IMs from guys who come off unintelligent and inarticulate in writing, and I find it even more deplorable if they've gone through higher education. Is it too much these days to want a guy who actually presents himself like he's been educated? Different people value different things. You value correct grammar, someone may not. Some people value advanced degrees, you may not value it as much. It's just personal preference. Personally, I value the higher degree because grammar is something you can just learn by taking a class or two, or you could fake it nowadays with the internet. That PhD shows somebody has expertise in a specific area of study. It just may not be in grammar or writing.
Author tigressA Posted January 16, 2011 Author Posted January 16, 2011 (edited) I feel like I'm detecting something. It's just my gut but...what did you get your degree in? I have a degree in history. I have a strong English & literature background, as I was raised with a love of reading and I took many English and lit-related electives in high school and college. My point with this thread is that many of the profiles I see look like they're written in a manner that would indicate the person in question really isn't as highly educated as they purport themselves to be. It's almost making a mockery of their education. It's my opinion that being able to express yourself in writing reasonably well should be a cornerstone of education because it's a necessary life skill. Someone being so dismissive of that is a turnoff. Edit: I don't deliberately seek out guys who purport to have a bachelor's or beyond. Whether or not someone has a degree isn't important to me at all. It's incredibly annoying when those who are educated beyond high school don't care or are unable to illustrate that in their writing--and in the worst cases, come off as though they didn't even finish high school. Edited January 16, 2011 by tigressA
shayan Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 I am careful on dating profiles I always spell check. In fact, my grammer has improved drammatically. Girls do it too though, they make plenty of typos and I usually let it slip unless I can tell they are unintelligent. hallelujah
Feelin Frisky Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 After working hard on Wall Street for several years in banking, my bosses implemented a "re-training" program and selected me and another guy to run it. I hadn't finished college and my partner had a degree majoring in English. I started writing manuals and so did he. The consultants we worked with came to me and said "Houston, we have a problem". I wondered if they were criticizing me. Then they showed me what a bunch of absolute unprofessional drivel my more-educated partner was spilling out. Holy smokes what a poor writer this guy was. I wound up doing both our work. Perhaps it's a thing where either you have it or you don't when it comes to writing. But surely, at least people can get spelling and punctuation correct. Grammar is an bridge too far for some.
dispatch3d Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 lol good call bob. I always get frustrated at the teachers who say in papers I bring up great points, have a really well written and thoughtout article, however I'm missing apostrophe's so therefore I get an A instead of an A+. Uhhhh sorry my ideal paper in my head looks different than yours?
Author tigressA Posted January 16, 2011 Author Posted January 16, 2011 lol good call bob. I always get frustrated at the teachers who say in papers I bring up great points, have a really well written and thoughtout article, however I'm missing apostrophe's so therefore I get an A instead of an A+. Uhhhh sorry my ideal paper in my head looks different than yours? Proper spelling, punctuation and grammar is expected in papers. If you don't follow those instructions, don't expect to get an A+.
northern_sky Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 To be honest I think LS has improved my writing a lot. The daily practice helps. Also has made me a much faster writer. I used to agonize over every word; now I just whip things out and polish later.
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