xpaperxcutx Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 or does it? Based on past dating experiences, I will shamefully label myself as a " Sex on the first date" offender. And boy, did it send me into a mess. I ended up being an easy lay for guys who disappear after 3 dates. Nowadays, I don't do sex, even though, I'm more than aware of my attraction towards my dates. There will be the touching, hand holding, body hugging, but no clothes shall ever fly off. I can't say I got it patsdown to an exact science- because the kissing can really drive both parties nuts. However, I am more aware of my need for self-control. So, the question is, how much are you willing to dish out before you finally call " halt" ? Ie. kissinghuggingmassaging
Mad Max Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 Kissing is fine, but no sex. If I'm on a first date and she's willing to sleep with me without knowing who I am or my sexual health, there won't be a second date.
pookster72 Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 well... sex on the first date > sex with the random guy at the bar lol.
carhill Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 Can I wait to urinate until I find a bush? Can I kiss a woman, get a hard-on and not have to pop a load in my pants, her mouth or her vagina? We're not six here. We're adults. We have self-control. I personally like the ebb and flow of intimacy and physical affection. My sexual response rises and falls with the ebb and flow. It can go on for hours. The cool thing about *knowing* sex is a wonderful expression of intimacy and love is that it can wait to be wonderful. This was a mindset I learned during my many, many years of being a virgin. The problem, IME, is finding women who understand this mindset and realize I am interested even though I'm not sticking my d!ck into them right away. You cannot imagine how many think lack of d!ck equals lack of interest, desire and passion. My exW would tell you, if she were honest, that we had many passionate moments without sex in the nearly three months of dating before becoming sexually involved. She, like the others, had her doubts, and I heard them and just pressed on. I see this as a compatibility issue. If both people are on the same page, it will work. If not, not.
colliejoanie Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 Back in my twenties....after a bitter 5 year relationship, sex occured on the first date....because I knew that's all I wanted....... But now, there isn't a chance in Heck I'd do that on the first date. Kissing, lightly....very lightly is OK for me. A massage only leads to one thing, so NO WAY. My only reasoning for this is because I'm really looking for a partner. If it were about sex only, absolutely.....sex on the first date please!
Mad Max Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 well... sex on the first date > sex with the random guy at the bar lol. You don't know much, if anything about someone on date #1. That's not much more than Mr. Random Guy At Bar.
pookster72 Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 You don't know much, if anything about someone on date #1. That's not much more than Mr. Random Guy At Bar. yea but first-date dude has at least expressed some interest by asking for or agreeing to a date, which is important considering the op's worries about guys who disappear.
Author xpaperxcutx Posted January 5, 2011 Author Posted January 5, 2011 Can I wait to urinate until I find a bush? Can I kiss a woman, get a hard-on and not have to pop a load in my pants, her mouth or her vagina? We're not six here. We're adults. We have self-control. I personally like the ebb and flow of intimacy and physical affection. My sexual response rises and falls with the ebb and flow. It can go on for hours. The cool thing about *knowing* sex is a wonderful expression of intimacy and love is that it can wait to be wonderful. This was a mindset I learned during my many, many years of being a virgin. The problem, IME, is finding women who understand this mindset and realize I am interested even though I'm not sticking my d!ck into them right away. You cannot imagine how many think lack of d!ck equals lack of interest, desire and passion. My exW would tell you, if she were honest, that we had many passionate moments without sex in the nearly three months of dating before becoming sexually involved. She, like the others, had her doubts, and I heard them and just pressed on. I see this as a compatibility issue. If both people are on the same page, it will work. If not, not. I think you really hit the point with this paragraph carhill. I don't want to be a prude but neither do I want to be a slut. There has to be a middle ground where I'm showing that I'm sexually attracted to the guy without coming across as a tease. In fact, I think most guys don't mind a boner at the end of the night even without some sexual relief from the girl.
johan Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 Sex on the first date doesn't mean anything either way. Whether you do or not isn't what determines whether a guy will continue to be interested. More important is whether he respects you. If you are easy and throwing yourself at him, expect him to lose respect for you. If you have sex because you're really physically turned on, but you are still able to assert yourself, and you don't immediately fall in love, then he probably will continue to respect you.
Els Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 You don't have to have sex on the first date, although that'll be just fine by a lot of guys, myself included. But if there's no sex by the end of the third date, we'll start to look elsewhere because we will think that you're not that interested in us. Stop trying to speak for everyone. I'm pretty sure 90% of the guys I know don't get sex on the third date. Unless this is an American culture thing?
Allisha Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 You don't have to have sex on the first date, although that'll be just fine by a lot of guys, myself included. But if there's no sex by the end of the third date, we'll start to look elsewhere because we will think that you're not that interested in us. I don't have the numbers with me to back me up, but I'm willing to bet that there are a lot of people who have had long term relationships after having sex after the first or second date. I had a 18-month relationship after having sex with her after the first date. Another one lasted almost a year after there was sex on the first date. A few years ago, Tyra Banks discussed a topic on her show that caught my interest. It was about men telling women how we look for in women or something like that. Everyone one in the audience (and I mean EVERYONE) was a guy. Anyone on stage was a woman. These group of women were asking men questions about love and sex. One of the questions asked was "Is is okay to sleep with a guy on a first date?" Do you know how many guys stood up? ALL OF THEM but two (or three). Keep in mind that the audience seated a few hundred men. One guy said that if you feel hot enough for the guy to want to have sex with him, then there's nothing stopping you. Basically, he said that if those immediate urges are there, then you're more than welcome to act out on them. All the guys agreed. But then the question came up as to whether the guy will stay around after sex on the first date? Basically, they answered that some guys would leave while others can stick around. Whether you have sex with a certain guy on Date 1 or Date 9, you're taking the risk that the guy will lose interest in you right afterwards. But I don't know of too many guys who will wait until the ninth date before the girl finally puts out. Sex by the third date? Are you freaking kidding me?! Sorry, but there's nothing sexual gonna happen with me and another guy unless it's exclusive. And in my experience, not many relationships go exclusive that quickly. If a guy is dating multiple people, and must have had sex with them all by the third date, you're opening yourself up to a big web of sexual partners. No method of protection against pregnancy or STDs is fool proof. I study medicine, so when health is always at the forefront of my mind, it kind of prevents me from taking certain risks. I've even been known to make guys get STD tests before doing anything sexual.. I know you're speaking in general terms, but if every guy on this planet really was like that, I would happily never have sex again because I just simply can't do it that quickly.
810 Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 (edited) Paper, it's great that you're becoming more aware of yourself. Self-control takes time to develop but once it's set, it's a great tool to have on your belt. I've never done sex on first date so in honesty, I don't know how it feels like. If a guy thinks I'm not interested in him after 3rd or 9th or 15th dates because I haven't had sex with him then that is fine with me. Personally, I see sex as a form of expression for love, trust and commitment. Those three substances take time to develop and if a guy doesn't see it that way, then he's not for me. I believe there are a lot of things two people can do and enjoy doing together without having to have sex. My partner number is super low and I don't have any intentions to increase the number randomly and that includes those hormones calling times also; it's just my personal choice. As I grow older, I realize I enjoy caressing my partner. I think it's differ from person to person where they draw the line when to stop. Personally whenever I feel his hand is wandering, I place my hand upon his, gently press it down, caress his hand/fingers before I slowly moving it away from the area. lolz So I guess for me, it stops where my hand presses his. Edited January 5, 2011 by 810
carhill Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 OP, re-reading helped my dim light bulb get a little brighter. With compatibility on this issue, sex *can* happen on the first date/meeting/encounter but genital sex may not happen until many dates down the road. I was happily reminded of this feeling recently but your post has put it into the proper context. Now it's just a matter of finding a mutually attracted and compatible partner. For clarity, my position is that, if two people are compatible regarding having sex at first meeting and have a history of progressing successful LTR's from such a perspective, then that is a healthy perspective for them. I've felt that pull and it was strong, but I know it doesn't match up with my psychology so choose a different path. I respect that others have their path. Some people are looking for casual, uncommitted sex when and where there is mutual attraction. That's another path. Many paths. I need some new shoes
810 Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 Geeks, dweebs, nerds, losers, or unpopular men will wait for as long as you make them wait. They'll be happy if they lose have the sex by Date 10, after spending well over 600 dollars throughout the course of that time. i don't know why i'm answering to this lolz how about an attractive successful physician who owns two clinics and a million dollar commercial property (fully tenanted) who waited five and a half months before having sex with a girl? i have to say he did spend a lot more than the 600 dollars you mentioned. in case you asked, he's my 4 year relationship ex.
welikeincrowds Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 Hypothetical conversation. Her: Well, I don't want to do it with just anybody. I want there to be feelings. Me: Well guess what? With men, there's no feelings. At least not in the beginning. Men just want to get laid. Her: So what do I do about this? Me: Well, you can date all the dweebs and nerds. These are guys that you don't want to have sex with, but they will wait for as long as you make them wait. The more popular guys can have sex with whoever they want and they dont' have to wait for anybody. You see, you want what you can't have. You want a guy who's in demand. You want that guy who can get any girl he wants to sit there and get to "know you" before he has sex with you. The problem with that way of doing it, is that that guy can have sex with whoever he wants. And while he waits for you to put out, he's getting it somewhere else. Why would any desireable guy wait for you? Think about it: He's desireable. Let's take a guy out of thin air. Think of a famous guy you have the hots for. Let's take Geroge Clooney as an example. If you don't like him, then replace him with a famous guy you like. Perhaps LeBron James. Anyway, Geroge Clooney can have any girl in the world. Anytime he wants them. Let's say he meets you. Do you think he's going to sit there and get to know you for a few months and do without sex for that time? Her: Probably not. Me: Right. So the guys who are going to wait are the dweebs and the nerds. And that's because they're not getting it anywhere else. Those guys will wait for as long as you want them to wait. But you don't want THEM. You want what you can't have. A lot of men would LOVE to have the newest Aston Martin, but they can't have it. Speaking of cars, would you buy a car without test driving it? Her: No. Me: Most guys wouldn't either. So if there's someone who you really, really think has potential for a relationship, you have to take your chances and have sex with him. You have to do it. No guy is going to sit there and have his face pressed against the glass waiting for your O.K. if he's in demand. Realize that there are women who will do what you won't do. And these guys will go to those women. Her: But they're dirty... Me: No, they're not all dirty. Do you understand that many of the long term relationships men have had over the years are with women who had sex with them on the first or second date? You have to look at guys who you think have a potential as a relationship, have sex with him and take the chance that he won't be interested anymore. By the way, guys who don't call you after the date don't do it because they're rude. They do it because they're not interested. The sex wasn't that good, or you're not that interesting or whatever. So you have to get over your ego trip, realize that you might sleep with someone who may never call you again. And if he doesn't call you is because he doesn't like you. This is the rejection women have to live with. When you see someone who looks lilke a long term boyfriend, a future husband, long term relationship, you have to give it up to him. And then you have to hope that he really likes it. And some guys might not. That's the risk you have to take. The risk men have to take is that they have to come up to you and ask you out on a date. And women laugh at them or make fun of them behind their backs and brush them off most of the time. Don't you? But you don't want any rejection at all. You want things to be all in your favor: every guy thinks you have the golden vagina, you want them to think that sleeping with you is the best thing ever. In the meantime, men have to go through rejection all the time. Guys who don't call you are not into you. Don't let that be the reason that you don't put out anymore. Because some guys are not going to like what you have to offer. Her: But I just want to keep it clean and not dirty. Me: Listen, you are using them for time, you are using them for meals, you are using them for drinks, you are using them for attention, you are using them for concert tickets, or whatever it is you do with these guys on dates. You're using THEM. What happens if a guy invites you out to a concert and he spends $200 on tickets? Would you feel bad enough to get in the sack with him? Her: Um ..... Um ..... Me: That's my point. So you see, you're not the only being used. This is a pretty ridiculous hypothetical. Personally, I wait on purpose, because I think it makes for better sex. I will deny, and have denied, advances to this end. And a bachelor you describe, who is able to deal in sex as a (cheap) commodity, may even be more likely to delay gratification to create value.
Knittress Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 ^^^ I'm kind to people and they're generally kind right back. :-/ People don't seem very nice to each other in your universe...
carhill Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 OP, after further reading, I have a question. Are you talking about relationship-centric sex or hedonistic sex? In my view, those are two very different paths. On the hedonistic path, I'd tend to align with FourthPlanet's perspective. Don't dick around, no pun intended. If the attraction is there, get busy and press flesh. My exW, who had ten times the sexual partners I did, explained it as 'he's cute; I want him but I know nothing long-term is possible, so I took him for the moment'. My mind and emotions don't work that way so, even when the opportunities present themselves, I don't see that path. It is nice to understand it though. Another great lesson she taught me. My posts have been regarding perspective on the relationship-centric path, which is a bit more complex and many-faceted and of which sex is just a small but important part, IMO.
Allisha Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 (edited) Did I stutter? You would, because if you got cheeky like that with me in real life I'd slap ya. Right. But that doesn't mean that I shouldn't wear a condom every single time I have sex. Anytime you have sex, whether Date 1 or Date 8, you're at the risk of having something go wrong. Yep. That's why STD tests are the way forward. Not EVERY single guy in the planet is like that. There are exceptions. But there's no reason to think that a lot of guys don't share the same ideas as I do. If you're never going to have sex again, then that's cool. Because there's another girl who's just as hot or hotter than you are who's down the block and around the corner who will do what you won't do. We'll happily go to them and have them become our girlfriends or f(u)ck buddies or whatever fun you're not having. I don't do hookers, so let's take them out of the equation.Bold bit: If you read what I said, I said "I know you're speaking in general terms"... Underlined bit: You don't know if there's anyone hotter than me . And, sexually, there aren't many things I wouldn't actually do.. but what's the harm in waiting? If you guys really need laid to know someone is interested in you, I suggest stop thinking with what's inbetween your legs for a change. Italic bit: super. Regarding the $600 you'd have apparently spent waiting for a girl to put out; if for a strange reason i don't offer to pay my share on the first date, I definitely will on the second. Also, just because guys have spent money on dates, do they really think that 600 entitles them to sex? Edited January 5, 2011 by Allisha
TheBigQuestion Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 Also, just because guys have spent money on dates, do they really think that 600 entitles them to sex? In a way, yes. It would depend on what else the woman is bringing to the table. If a woman hasn't really offered to pay for anything, then a man spending all that money without attaining the thing which is one of any man's primary goals in relationships is definitely a raw deal for the man.
Untouchable_Fire Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 The problem, IME, is finding women who understand this mindset and realize I am interested even though I'm not sticking my d!ck into them right away. You cannot imagine how many think lack of d!ck equals lack of interest, desire and passion. My exW would tell you, if she were honest, that we had many passionate moments without sex in the nearly three months of dating before becoming sexually involved. She, like the others, had her doubts, and I heard them and just pressed on. This! This is the real issue here. Women now think you are not into them or some dispassionate loser if you don't attempt to rape them on the first date. It's freaking crazy! Once I learned that trick I didn't have anymore issues. It seems I had "chemistry" with every woman I dated as long as I was super physically aggressive... in a respectful way.
Untouchable_Fire Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 You would, because if you got cheeky like that with me in real life I'd slap ya. ... and if he slapped you back you would find yourself in the hospital. You have no more right to hit him... than he has to hit you!
Surrealist Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 It's good to read the women here defending some level of restraint with sex, really. As for the comment about spending gobs of money on a woman for multiple dates before having sex, I would never do that, doesn't mean I'd expect sex by the third date either, but the woman can pay her share, or do low-cost dates, or if she's a gold digger, let her go use someone else.
Untouchable_Fire Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 Also, just because guys have spent money on dates, do they really think that 600 entitles them to sex? Kind of... If I pay for a steak... I am entitled to eat it. Pretty much goes for anything else I spend money on.
Allisha Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 Kind of... If I pay for a steak... I am entitled to eat it. Pretty much goes for anything else I spend money on. Good god....:lmao: I think imma slap you next!
musemaj11 Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 (edited) Why would any woman find it hard to restrain themselves sexually? I cant imagine such a woman being a man. She would probably be a serial rapist. Also, just because guys have spent money on dates, do they really think that 600 entitles them to sex? In reality, most men dont think they are entitled to sex just because they treat women to dates. But in principle I do believe that men should be entitled to sex as much as women feel that they are entitled to men spending money on them on dates. Edited January 5, 2011 by musemaj11
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