For the Betrayed... Which do you think is "better?"

[PhoenixRise]

Interesting

 

Like so many others my H was busted, he left his email up on our SHARED computer. For so long I have thought my respect for him would not have taken such a hit if he had just been honest and told me he had someone else.

 

H says that sometimes I looked at him as if he was some bit of slime stuck to the bottom of my shoe and he is right. For a while, a long while I had zero respect for him because he didn't have the ballz to tell me the truth.

 

However... considering Owl's comments earlier in this thread about the possibility of only being told once the WS has made all the decisions makes me think.

 

I can say without a doubt that my H is a better man because he had to deal with my pain and my rage in the aftermath of dday. Not because he chased me down to get me back but because he had to seriously look at himself and deal with what he did and what his actions said about him as a man.

 

So now I am not so sure it would have been better, long term, for him to confess.

 

Darn you Owl for making me rethink what I though I already knew for sure

[love4me2c]

I'd say the best possible scenario is #1. Personally, I had been asking for a divorce for years only to be put down and felt like a failure for doing so. Then he had an affair. He was caught. While he expressed what seemed to be remorse, I think it was more sadness he was caught.

 

Like some of the others here, I tried my best to get past it, but couldn't. I ended my marriage in October. I do not regret it. I couldn't stand constantly living my life wondering if he was fooling around (he travels a lot.)

 

I think had he come clean about it and told me, I would have felt that there was some remorse there. But I don't know that it would have changed the outcome.

[seibert253]

I was hoping for #1 because I "knew" something was going on, yet had no proof. Gave her every out, "just be honest with me and we can forget it ever happened and start afresh", blah, blah, blah. Nothing but lies.

I was dumbfounded because up until her A, my W was the most honest person I ever knew.

 

I was driving myself crazy because I "knew" something was wrong, but rationalized she would never deceive me that way. Yeap, I was dead wrong.

 

So, #1 would have been ideal, but had to settle for #2, which really sucked.

[kaysun]

It was #1 for me. The OM tested positive for HIV so my STBX W felt she needed to tell me about her affair at that time. That's the only reason she told me.

[imagine]

I'm a long time reader and not involved:

 

I think number 5 -"Other" is appropriate. You gut instinct should kick in and tell you the relationship is different _there is something wrong with your spouse.

 

This indicates sensitivity and depth within your own relationship. Even good relationships succumb. Discussion should be able to elicit appropriate responses and lies will be uncovered. Consequences can be mentioned.

 

A good spouse should protect a marriage and ward off early advances.

 

This is probably why these folk don't have to post here!

[bentnotbroken]

Number 1 would have been preferable. It would have shown me at least a little respect and it would have given me option of making different decisions for my life. There were things that I did to try to make him happy that I would have never done. Instead I ended up with #2 and whole lot of mess to clean up.

[Owl]

Interesting

 

Like so many others my H was busted, he left his email up on our SHARED computer. For so long I have thought my respect for him would not have taken such a hit if he had just been honest and told me he had someone else.

 

H says that sometimes I looked at him as if he was some bit of slime stuck to the bottom of my shoe and he is right. For a while, a long while I had zero respect for him because he didn't have the ballz to tell me the truth.

 

However... considering Owl's comments earlier in this thread about the possibility of only being told once the WS has made all the decisions makes me think.

 

I can say without a doubt that my H is a better man because he had to deal with my pain and my rage in the aftermath of dday. Not because he chased me down to get me back but because he had to seriously look at himself and deal with what he did and what his actions said about him as a man.

 

So now I am not so sure it would have been better, long term, for him to confess.

 

Darn you Owl for making me rethink what I though I already knew for sure

 

 

This is what I do best!

[Fight4Me]

It was #1 for me. The OM tested positive for HIV so my STBX W felt she needed to tell me about her affair at that time. That's the only reason she told me.

 

I think yours is the nightmare scenario we all have had in the back of our minds when we think about our spouses having been with someone else. I'm so, so sorry, but at the same time... thank God she told you! (Maybe she was required to do so by the CDC?)

 

I'm a long time reader and not involved:

 

I think number 5 -"Other" is appropriate. You gut instinct should kick in and tell you the relationship is different _there is something wrong with your spouse.

 

This indicates sensitivity and depth within your own relationship. Even good relationships succumb. Discussion should be able to elicit appropriate responses and lies will be uncovered. Consequences can be mentioned.

 

A good spouse should protect a marriage and ward off early advances.

 

This is probably why these folk don't have to post here!

 

I think your "other" is a given for all of us. If they had been a good spouse, they would have protected the marriage. And this is the key part of reconciliation... an acknowledgment and genuine remorse over having not done so. Nobody is harder on himself in this area than my fWH, and has taken action to fortify himself, our marriage, and family overall.

 

I wish I had been able to pick up on the signs of infidelity, but I was very sick at the time and a lot of the signs of stress my fWH exhibited were easily contributed to that, plus some major job issues taking place at the same time. I often refer to it as "the perfect storm." I know if I had been well, we would be in tune with one another as we had always been before. I could drive myself nuts contemplating what could have been prevented if events had become so out of control, but that is on him since "in sickness and in health" should have been the ruling factor.

 

Thank God that's all in the past now!

[wheelwright]

This is an interesting thread, because the ethics are all caught up in the the future and the not wanting to hurt.

 

An A is often a statement that those involved are willing to risk current life situations for a new love that is powerful in a way the M is not.

 

A M is a commitment for life.

 

Do I want to hear that my M is in danger after the fact or before?

 

Once after, how do I want to hear?

 

If my H loves me, from him.

 

If he doesn't, who cares?

 

It doesn't matter where you hear, as long as what you get told after resembles truth.

 

If not, surely trust is lost?

[Snowflower]

This is an interesting thread, because the ethics are all caught up in the the future and the not wanting to hurt.

 

In my case I wouldn't say it was "ethics" that made me decide to continue my marriage. I'm not sure I understand this statement?

 

An A is often a statement that those involved are willing to risk current life situations for a new love that is powerful in a way the M is not.

 

Not always. I know some don't like to consider this. My H didn't love the OW and if our marriage had ended as a result of the affair either by his decision, my choice, or a choice we made together, it was quite unlikely he would have ended up with her. He was already backing away from her even before he confessed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Do I want to hear that my M is in danger after the fact or before?

 

Once after, how do I want to hear?

 

If my H loves me, from him.

 

If he doesn't, who cares?

 

It doesn't matter where you hear, as long as what you get told after resembles truth.

 

If not, surely trust is lost?

 

In a perfect world, the soon-to-be WS would tell their soon-to-be BS that infidelity was about to occur. Wouldn't that be nice!

 

Unfortunately, BS (and even the AP) have to deal with what is handed to them by the WS, which is usually finding out after the fact.

 

But I agree, words must match actions.

[PortuguesePrincess80]

In my case I wouldn't say it was "ethics" that made me decide to continue my marriage. I'm not sure I understand this statement?

 

 

 

Not always. I know some don't like to consider this. My H didn't love the OW and if our marriage had ended as a result of the affair either by his decision, my choice, or a choice we made together, it was quite unlikely he would have ended up with her. He was already backing away from her even before he confessed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In a perfect world, the soon-to-be WS would tell their soon-to-be BS that infidelity was about to occur. Wouldn't that be nice!

 

Unfortunately, BS (and even the AP) have to deal with what is handed to them by the WS, which is usually finding out after the fact.

 

But I agree, words must match actions.

 

I agree with this!

 

As far as the thread title goes..I'd have preferred #1 as well without saying...but I also think many other factors play into any reconciliation as well. How long the affair was...was there love..and I mean REAL love.. is there remorse and regret after the fact..and so on.

[slowbutSURE]

Wow, very interesting thread. Mine was a #2 and like most others on here, I would have preferred a #1. My STBXW coming to me and HONESTLY opening up about her mistake(s) would have enabled me to have some respect for her. I think I would have that respect for her because she would have respect for herself. Well....none of that happened, just more lies, deception, blah, blah, blah and the divorce is in the works.

Try this on for discussion. I followed most of what is suggested on this site, as well as other sites and numerous books to stop the affair.

1. I confronted her "Friend". He denied until I finally presented proof.

2. I informed his wife of the little fun her husband was engaged in.

His wife had me repeat my claims, including that my wife had finally admitted to it, then slammed the door in my face.

My point in this? His wife, I believe, already knew. It was no bombshell to her, she just didn't want to KNOW. Her hubby makes a BIG paycheck and I am guessing it is just a trade-off in their marriage.

(anyone else here noting that we are referring to the scenario as #2? To me it was and is a bunch of #2 indeed)

[Snowflower]

 

2. I informed his wife of the little fun her husband was engaged in.

His wife had me repeat my claims, including that my wife had finally admitted to it, then slammed the door in my face.

My point in this? His wife, I believe, already knew. It was no bombshell to her, she just didn't want to KNOW. Her hubby makes a BIG paycheck and I am guessing it is just a trade-off in their marriage.

 

It sounds to me like the other BS was in shock. She asked you to repeat your claims about your wife and her husband.Then she had nothing else to say?

 

Why do you think she already knew? My guess it was shock that made her react the way she did. Sometimes the BS doesn't react/go into action immediately. I know I didn't; my shock was too great.

 

Did you feel bad for the fellow BS in your situation?:sick:

[slowbutSURE]

I absolutely felt sorry for her, still do to an extent. I wished all the pain/hurt in world to rain down upon her husband but his wife and kids are innocent victims, as are my girls.

"Best defense is a good offense" About a month prior to me talking to his wife, I confronted him and told him to leave my wife alone or I would follow through with telling his wife. When I DID speak with her, she told me her husband informed her of our meeting a month earlier and he denied everything! In the month interim, his wife was calling their place of employment daily, which she had never done before. (my wife and her hubby work together).

However, you are making me re think this a little. Her being in shock is not out of the question. Maybe she just realized I was telling the truth and her husband had been really bs ing her to wits end for the past month. A revelation/epiphany if you will.

I originally posted this to offer some help and a different perspective, looks as though I might be learning the most from it. Thanks!

[Snowflower]

I absolutely felt sorry for her, still do to an extent. I wished all the pain/hurt in world to rain down upon her husband but his wife and kids are innocent victims, as are my girls.

"Best defense is a good offense" About a month prior to me talking to his wife, I confronted him and told him to leave my wife alone or I would follow through with telling his wife. When I DID speak with her, she told me her husband informed her of our meeting a month earlier and he denied everything! In the month interim, his wife was calling their place of employment daily, which she had never done before. (my wife and her hubby work together).

However, you are making me re think this a little. Her being in shock is not out of the question. Maybe she just realized I was telling the truth and her husband had been really bs ing her to wits end for the past month. A revelation/epiphany if you will.

I originally posted this to offer some help and a different perspective, looks as though I might be learning the most from it. Thanks!

 

I'm glad it was helpful.

 

It sounds like her WH gaslighted her and minimized his relationship with your wife. She thought/hoped she had the whole truth but then when you came knocking on her door, she realized she did not. So, her shock (and pain) doubled.

 

I'm trying to think how I would have acted if the OW's H in my situation had showed up at my door with a different truth than what I had been told from my H. I think you would have been able to knock me down with a feather.

 

It would have been a double-shock for her because after only a month after the first d-day when her H concocted a bullsh*t story about him and your wife, she then finds out a different version from you. Poor woman...I imagine her shock must have been huge.

 

She knew something wasn't right because she was checking/calling their workplace. It just takes awhile for some BS to figure out what to do. It isn't always a snap decision, if that makes sense?

 

I also highly doubt she is staying with him because of his paycheck. That seems to be a common stereotype of a BW. More likely, she is/was completely blindsided (again) and needs time to figure out what to do next.

Edited January 7, 2011 by Snowflower

[slowbutSURE]

Snowflower, another great post which forces me to think in a broader sense. The paycheck thing, you probably have that nailed too. My reason for thinking that way? He is a physician who knocks down a 7 figure income and from my conversation with him I suspect he has played this game before. One area of focus to him in our conversation was my ability or inability to prove his involvement with my wife. Almost a challenge because they had been so careful not to leave an electronic or paper trail. A game to him?

I really don't know and never will I am sure, but WOW you have made me think. I did not think a lot about his wife or her motivations too much after that. It seemed as though she was burying her head in the sand, why won't she wake up?? Pretty judgmental from someone who had done the same thing and only recently came out to see the light in my own marriage, huh?

Thanks again. You have made me look up some of your previous entries on this site, see what else I can learn today!

[carhill]

Limited datapoints, but I'll share what I know:

 

My M was #1. I disclosed and my now exW met my 'affair partner' at my insistence. I wanted no ambiguity about what I wasn't getting from the M and my willingness to get it elsewhere. We're divorced.

 

In all of the marriages of friends where I am directly aware of infidelity, discovery was by #2 or #3 and, AFAIK, all of those marriages continue, with the exception of that of my former MW, whose ended about 10 years after we discontinued our contact. Some of the M's have seen multiple affairs on both sides, some only singular. There is no commonality as to WS gender, some having been male and some female. Some have had MC, some not. One clear commonality in the M's which survive is that they are first M's for both parties and long-term M's, meaning 15 years or more. In our case, I was my exW's third husband. She was my first wife.

 

I dislike drama, even though the women who seem to gravitate towards me often have lives filled with it, so I chose disclosure and found it to be a less drama-filled path to resolution.

 

I'm aware of other situations primarily because for some reason women choose to confide in me voluntarily. I do not seek out this information. Sincerely. I do not want to know. I do suggest MC. It worked for me. Hope that helps

[Fight4Me]

Yes, it's a very common misconception that a BS (particularly BW) stay around for the paycheck, to maintain a certain lifestyle while burying her head in the sand. Oh, I'm sure some of those exist, but I have yet to meet one online or IRL before.

 

The BW in question could have helped put the schmuck through medical school and is now reeling with the reality of how he has repaid her. Plus, the gaslighting can cut someone off at their knees, and it could take a lot of IC and careful planning to finally be able to do what is right for themselves.

 

 

Again, thanks everyone for your responses. I have learned a lot myself and that's ultimately what I hoped to gain from posing this question in the first place.

[blahlately]

I would have definitely preferred #1, but had to settle for #2. And even when confronted with direct evidence, my wife still hasn't completely come clean. I'm a noob here, and still dealing with my prolonged D-day, so I won't presume to offer any advice.

 

Sorry you are going through this. Best of luck.

[Owl]

This is an interesting thread, because the ethics are all caught up in the the future and the not wanting to hurt.

 

Huh?

 

An A is often a statement that those involved are willing to risk current life situations for a new love that is powerful in a way the M is not.

 

No...an affair is often an indicator that those involved are willing to risk their current relationship for one that they PERCEIVE as better than their M.

 

Sadly, during an affair their perceptions are often massively skewed by the "in love" chemicals blasting through their brains, preventing them from thinking rationally.

 

Whether or not the A relationship truly is better than the M relationship isn't something that they can truly determine when they're in the middle of it. The A relationship has no basis in reality...they don't know what that relationship is going to end up looking like once that fog clears.

 

A M is a commitment for life.

 

It's supposed to be. But if you can't honor that committment, you should at least try to honor your former partner enough to end that commitment before you emotionally devestate them by moving on to someone else and not being honest with your former partner.

 

Do I want to hear that my M is in danger after the fact or before?

 

Well, obviously you'd like to know that it's in danger BEFORE it's too late for you to try to save it.

 

Once after, how do I want to hear?

 

If my H loves me, from him.

 

If he doesn't, who cares?

 

It doesn't matter where you hear, as long as what you get told after resembles truth.

 

If not, surely trust is lost?

 

Trust was lost when the deception is revealed. Sadly, its emotionally devestating to find out that you trusted when you shouldn't have...when the person you were trusting used that trust to betray you.

[silktricks]

Mine was #1. His was a long affair - he says 1 year, I say 2+, as the emotional attachment had been growing for at least a year prior to the protestations of love.

 

I had and still do have some mixed feelings about the "best" way to find out. The fact that he told me was good in most ways for our marriage, but #2 would have been, I believe, less harmful to my own opinion of myself. I felt a fool for a number of years. The fact that I disregarded my own feelings that something was "off" because he told me it was not was difficult for me to come to terms with.

 

Had I discovered the situation elsewise, however, I'm not sure that our marriage would have survived. Because he confessed, my anger, though definitely present, was not a flaming volcano, which I believe it would have been under any of the other scenarios.

[SidLyon]

First of all, my apologies for the title of this thread. I wrestled with what to put in place of "better," but I couldn't decide if "less worse" would make any difference. Not enough coffee this morning, I guess. LOL

 

Okay, so my question is simply one for discussion without any hidden meanings, and is not meant to open up any kind of divisive firestorm. I'm simply curious. So, here it is...

 

How would you have preferred to have discovered your WS's A?

 

1. Have him/her come to you directly with a desire to be honest (even if it meant asking for a divorce)?

 

2. Find out on your own through investigation or having stumbled across evidence?

 

3. Have a trusted friend or loved one tell you what they know?

 

4. Have the OW/OM contact you.

 

5. Other (there always has to be an other)

 

With the above in mind, which scenario would make you more likely to consider reconciliation (assuming the WS showed undeniable remorse)? Given your own situation, if you had learned about the A in a different way, would it have changed the outcome of your decision to D or R?

 

I've read a lot of stories and the majority seems to have experienced #2, and given that my fWH came to me and we have since fully reconciled, I sometimes wonder if our outcome would have been different if I had discovered it in another way. I guess I think I'm glad I was told directly because the lies by omission were killing him, and there is comfort in knowing he isn't capable of living like that for very long. In his case, he went six weeks, and it darn near destroyed him.

 

I am particularly interested in those who have experienced betrayal, since people often assume what they would do until it actually happens to them. Anyone can respond, though, but it would be helpful if you make it clear whether you're a BS, WS, OP, are blissfully married, or never been married (you get the idea).

 

Hopefully this turns into a fruitful discussion. I am genuinely interested in your thoughts.

 

Like many here I got Number 2.

 

I have thought a lot about whether Number 1 would have been preferable and I think my view might be a little different to those who found out by Number 1.

 

I truly believe that the reason my H went to enormous lenghts to hide his A from me is because despite all (including having great passion and love for the OW) he wanted to remain married.

 

Therefore coming to me with Number 1 would have meant he had finally decided to be with her, rather than a desire to be honest or assuage his guilt. I don't believe he would ever have told me except if he had decided to end our marriage. Ergo, if he'd confessed of his own accord, our marriage would have ended; because that is the way he is.

 

Whether this would have been better or not for me and our kids I can't say. I was truly devastated to find out about his A but don't know whether him announcing his A and then leaving would have been more devastating. He certainly retains the view that had he done this it would have been even more destructive to me, but I just don't know.

 

Our children were teenagers at d-day. When my H and his sister were teenagers his father had an A and after flip-flopping between women he left the family. Leaving my MIL and the 2 kids behind. My fWH felt/feels that somehow he is "better" than his own father, because he never decided to leave us. Again I have difficulty seeing this but I can see that my H doesn't want to see himself in the same poor light as he viewed his own father.

 

Interestingly, my H's A went on for 3.5 years, d-day occurred more than 3 years after it ended after there was an attempt to restart it.

 

His father's A went on for a year and eventually his father married the OW. Ten years later my FIL divorced the OW and returned to his first wife. They are still very happy together more than 50 years after they first married. My H hopes for something similar for us.

Edited January 9, 2011 by SidLyon

[Crusoe]

Number 1 would have been preferable. It would have shown me at least a little respect and it would have given me option of making different decisions for my life. There were things that I did to try to make him happy that I would have never done. Instead I ended up with #2 and whole lot of mess to clean up.

 

Similar. Number 1 would have been preferable, but any way would been better than not knowing. Instead I found out through friends 5 years after her first affair. That opened the floodgates and within a week I discovered all the other affairs. Made all those big life decisions during that time, all based on her lies. None of which I would have done had I known at the time.

[wheelwright]

Huh?

No...an affair is often an indicator that those involved are willing to risk their current relationship for one that they PERCEIVE as better than their M.

Sadly, during an affair their perceptions are often massively skewed by the "in love" chemicals blasting through their brains, preventing them from thinking rationally.

 

 

Aha! I see you are not only a realist, you are a romantic one.

 

I heard that there are certain 'boring' chemicals that make people stick with people they are not suited to. Like their loyalty factor outweighs their discrimination. (believe me the science is there - hey ho)

 

Lets forget chemicals. Really I would like to talk to you where that was/is forgotten. Cos it isn't known.

 

Too many variables.

 

Many other interesting factors.

 

As for the intense feelings I felt during my A - if that was only MY perception and not HIS - then in one way I am lost.

[wheelwright]

Like many here I got Number 2.

 

I have thought a lot about whether Number 1 would have been preferable and I think my view might be a little different to those who found out by Number 1.

 

I truly believe that the reason my H went to enormous lenghts to hide his A from me is because despite all (including having great passion and love for the OW) he wanted to remain married.

 

Therefore coming to me with Number 1 would have meant he had finally decided to be with her, rather than a desire to be honest or assuage his guilt. I don't believe he would ever have told me except if he had decided to end our marriage. Ergo, if he'd confessed of his own accord, our marriage would have ended; because that is the way he is.

 

Whether this would have been better or not for me and our kids I can't say. I was truly devastated to find out about his A but don't know whether him announcing his A and then leaving would have been more devastating. He certainly retains the view that had he done this it would have been even more destructive to me, but I just don't know.

 

Our children were teenagers at d-day. When my H and his sister were teenagers his father had an A and after flip-flopping between women he left the family. Leaving my MIL and the 2 kids behind. My fWH felt/feels that somehow he is "better" than his own father, because he never decided to leave us. Again I have difficulty seeing this but I can see that my H doesn't want to see himself in the same poor light as he viewed his own father.

 

Interestingly, my H's A went on for 3.5 years, d-day occurred more than 3 years after it ended after there was an attempt to restart it.

 

His father's A went on for a year and eventually his father married the OW. Ten years later my FIL divorced the OW and returned to his first wife. They are still very happy together more than 50 years after they first married. My H hopes for something similar for us.

 

As the FMOW of someone I loved, I wonder if that is what he hopes for with his W.

Edited January 12, 2011 by wheelwright
Oh - and this was a beautiful post