siuys Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 After not getting any replies to his 4 emails, he turned up at my door yesterday. He said he had to find out if i had written him out of my life. We talked for hours and he told me everything that's he's been discovering through IC, through his own reading, what the flipping was all about, what's been going on in terms of ending his M, when he is moving out etc. We connected and we both talked about our individual growth process this past month alone. we both agreed that it's either going to be a proper R or nothing. i feel we have outgrown the toxic phase of the R. realistically i know he's still got a lot to work on. but i know now that as long as i'm working on myself, and comfortable in my own skin, stay emotionally independent and strong, i will be ok. i am monitoring how this 'episode' will affect me in the days to come. if it's negative, i will ask him to stop for another month before contact. so that's where i'm at now. i will continue to live my life and work on me. in time, i will really find out if this is meant to be...
Confused4Now Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 After not getting any replies to his 4 emails, he turned up at my door yesterday. He said he had to find out if i had written him out of my life. We talked for hours and he told me everything that's he's been discovering through IC, through his own reading, what the flipping was all about, what's been going on in terms of ending his M, when he is moving out etc. We connected and we both talked about our individual growth process this past month alone. we both agreed that it's either going to be a proper R or nothing. i feel we have outgrown the toxic phase of the R. realistically i know he's still got a lot to work on. but i know now that as long as i'm working on myself, and comfortable in my own skin, stay emotionally independent and strong, i will be ok. i am monitoring how this 'episode' will affect me in the days to come. if it's negative, i will ask him to stop for another month before contact. so that's where i'm at now. i will continue to live my life and work on me. in time, i will really find out if this is meant to be...All he did was give you HOPE....no actions yet that puts him to you. Just his own soul searching. We will see... P.S. what does we connected mean? physical or emotionally?
calliope Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 After not getting any replies to his 4 emails, he turned up at my door yesterday. realistically i know he's still got a lot to work on. but i know now that as long as i'm working on myself, and comfortable in my own skin, stay emotionally independent and strong, i will be ok. so that's where i'm at now. i will continue to live my life and work on me. in time, i will really find out if this is meant to be... I know this is what you expected to happen if you didn't reply to his e-mails, so maybe in a way you were already prepared. Talking everything through is probably what you've needed because it's obvious how much you've been struggling over the past few weeks. I hope you don't lose sight of making sure you're ok for yourself. Hard advice for me to offer, when I feel very much the same about my MM and A situation as you and I'd give in to him again too. You have to do whatever you feel in your heart is right for you. Take care, siuys, I'm in your corner...
Author siuys Posted December 29, 2010 Author Posted December 29, 2010 Thanks, Calli. You are right. I just KNEW he was going to turn up if I kept ignoring his emails. I was doing fine without seeing him. Right now, I am thinking the best is that we do not communicate (including him turning up) until he's moved out... I think that would be the best way forward for ME, so I don't wobble and can concentrate on my stuff...
calliope Posted December 30, 2010 Posted December 30, 2010 Right now, I am thinking the best is that we do not communicate until he's moved out... I think that would be the best way forward for ME... Everyone on here will tell you "actions, not words" - so true. But you obviously already know that!
half_ofa_heart Posted December 30, 2010 Posted December 30, 2010 Everyone on here will tell you "actions, not words" - so true. But you obviously already know that! Hi Siuys and Calli, I am the last to give advice as I KNOW what to do but can't do it. Both of you have come so far to just slip back into misery so all I can say is tread lightly and be careful. Love yourselves!
IzzyB Posted December 30, 2010 Posted December 30, 2010 Siuys- I am also routing for you. Of course you know that actions speak louder,but here's another reminder. lol I am wondering how you felt seeing him and talking to him. It sounds like you gained comfort and clarity from your meeting. Just a question for you - did you make it clear to him what you need him to do, ie. stay away from you for a bit? If not, are you planning to? Also, dont be surprised if you feel stronger, and then you get a backlash of missing him more and feeling down for a bit - that is completely normal. Either way, we are here for you. You are doing great!!! I'm really messed up about my own no contact. I was very firm that it is over and I told him do not contact me, very sternly (after half a dozen failed no contacts without being stern). Then I find myself still hoping at times that he contacts me, even though I absolutely know that any relief/happines would be short lived on my part. I also think I would freak out a bit if I did get contact from him. I think I am part common sense and larger part crazy . I'm also M by the way. To be continued... Big Hugs Izzy
Spark1111 Posted December 30, 2010 Posted December 30, 2010 Everyone on here will tell you "actions, not words" - so true. But you obviously already know that! I agree! It is what he does, not what he says, that matters. You ignored him, and he needed to see if there was a glimmer of hope. A four hour conversation absolutely gave him that gimmer. Watch what HE DOES for you. Please!
whichwayisup Posted December 30, 2010 Posted December 30, 2010 Thanks, Calli. You are right. I just KNEW he was going to turn up if I kept ignoring his emails. I was doing fine without seeing him. Right now, I am thinking the best is that we do not communicate (including him turning up) until he's moved out... I think that would be the best way forward for ME, so I don't wobble and can concentrate on my stuff... Did you tell him this? Make it clear to him that he isn't to drop by? And of course you two connected emotionally. Did you think that wouldn't happen? Or are you back in LC and seeing how it goes. I agree with confused, this just gave you hope and it gave him a fix of seeing you, he bought himself more time, he now knows you're waiting for him.
silverplanets Posted December 30, 2010 Posted December 30, 2010 After not getting any replies to his 4 emails, he turned up at my door yesterday. He said he had to find out if i had written him out of my life. We talked for hours and he told me everything that's he's been discovering through IC, through his own reading, what the flipping was all about, what's been going on in terms of ending his M, when he is moving out etc. We connected and we both talked about our individual growth process this past month alone. we both agreed that it's either going to be a proper R or nothing. i feel we have outgrown the toxic phase of the R. realistically i know he's still got a lot to work on. but i know now that as long as i'm working on myself, and comfortable in my own skin, stay emotionally independent and strong, i will be ok. i am monitoring how this 'episode' will affect me in the days to come. if it's negative, i will ask him to stop for another month before contact. so that's where i'm at now. i will continue to live my life and work on me. in time, i will really find out if this is meant to be... Just out of interest ... WHY did he have to find out if you had written him out of your life , especially if he is going through a divorce and has gained this *new* understanding of flipping and everything. Didn't his *new* understanding include how important it was for him to show his W the respect to divorce her without having you confirmed as available for him. Didn't his *new* understanding include taking responsibility for his own actions without knowing he had a fall back position. Didn't his *new* understanding include accepting that your non-reply to his emails should be accepted as such WITHOUT him stepping over that boundary and turning up at your door ? I get why he contacted you I really do .... What I don't get is how him contacting you fits in with this *new* man that has now seen the light ... I would have thought if he had truly seen the light in that 30 days then he could have either : a) left you well alone and focused on ending his marriage and sorting out all the myriad of details that this entails and listened to the IC if/when they said that perhaps he needed to sort himself out fully before commiting to another relationship or b) been open and upfront with his wife about contacting you in the spirit of his *new* self with nothing to hide and no secrets I'm not trying to be negative, not criticising and not judging him or you ... I just am honestly confused about how this new enlightened him relates to a) ignoring your clear boundary of not returning his emails b) turning up at your house without his wife knowing (I presume he didn't bring her with him in the interest of new openness and honesty) It reads one way as if he just wants to confirm your availabilty at this time ... ,perhaps so he can factor it into his descision making process. Don't know ... only you can judge .... does his wife know about the February date he put in his email ... or is he "planning" it behind her back ... in which case how much has he really learnt about respect and upfront honesty and integrity. If, right to the last, someone can manipulate someone else for their own ends then is that really a characteristic that you want in a partner? Is she blissfully unaware of his plans right now (despite this new enlightened him) ... is this new enlightened him really behaving in any way differently to the old him? Just food for thought ... ignore and throw out with pleasure Chris
Fieldsofgold Posted December 30, 2010 Posted December 30, 2010 Just out of interest ... WHY did he have to find out if you had written him out of your life , especially if he is going through a divorce and has gained this *new* understanding of flipping and everything. Didn't his *new* understanding include how important it was for him to show his W the respect to divorce her without having you confirmed as available for him. Didn't his *new* understanding include taking responsibility for his own actions without knowing he had a fall back position. Didn't his *new* understanding include accepting that your non-reply to his emails should be accepted as such WITHOUT him stepping over that boundary and turning up at your door ? I get why he contacted you I really do .... What I don't get is how him contacting you fits in with this *new* man that has now seen the light ... I would have thought if he had truly seen the light in that 30 days then he could have either : a) left you well alone and focused on ending his marriage and sorting out all the myriad of details that this entails and listened to the IC if/when they said that perhaps he needed to sort himself out fully before commiting to another relationship or b) been open and upfront with his wife about contacting you in the spirit of his *new* self with nothing to hide and no secrets I'm not trying to be negative, not criticising and not judging him or you ... I just am honestly confused about how this new enlightened him relates to a) ignoring your clear boundary of not returning his emails b) turning up at your house without his wife knowing (I presume he didn't bring her with him in the interest of new openness and honesty) It reads one way as if he just wants to confirm your availabilty at this time ... ,perhaps so he can factor it into his descision making process. Don't know ... only you can judge .... does his wife know about the February date he put in his email ... or is he "planning" it behind her back ... in which case how much has he really learnt about respect and upfront honesty and integrity. If, right to the last, someone can manipulate someone else for their own ends then is that really a characteristic that you want in a partner? Is she blissfully unaware of his plans right now (despite this new enlightened him) ... is this new enlightened him really behaving in any way differently to the old him? Just food for thought ... ignore and throw out with pleasure Chris All he did was give you HOPE....no actions yet that puts him to you. Just his own soul searching. We will see... As these two posters had BTDT - for years - there really is nothing I can add. Except to send you my heartfelt support, and pray that you don't get sucked into more pain.
jwi71 Posted December 30, 2010 Posted December 30, 2010 Just out of interest ... WHY did he have to find out if you had written him out of your life , especially if he is going through a divorce and has gained this *new* understanding of flipping and everything. Didn't his *new* understanding include how important it was for him to show his W the respect to divorce her without having you confirmed as available for him. Didn't his *new* understanding include taking responsibility for his own actions without knowing he had a fall back position. Didn't his *new* understanding include accepting that your non-reply to his emails should be accepted as such WITHOUT him stepping over that boundary and turning up at your door ? I get why he contacted you I really do .... What I don't get is how him contacting you fits in with this *new* man that has now seen the light ... I would have thought if he had truly seen the light in that 30 days then he could have either : a) left you well alone and focused on ending his marriage and sorting out all the myriad of details that this entails and listened to the IC if/when they said that perhaps he needed to sort himself out fully before commiting to another relationship or b) been open and upfront with his wife about contacting you in the spirit of his *new* self with nothing to hide and no secrets I'm not trying to be negative, not criticising and not judging him or you ... I just am honestly confused about how this new enlightened him relates to a) ignoring your clear boundary of not returning his emails b) turning up at your house without his wife knowing (I presume he didn't bring her with him in the interest of new openness and honesty) It reads one way as if he just wants to confirm your availabilty at this time ... ,perhaps so he can factor it into his descision making process. Don't know ... only you can judge .... does his wife know about the February date he put in his email ... or is he "planning" it behind her back ... in which case how much has he really learnt about respect and upfront honesty and integrity. If, right to the last, someone can manipulate someone else for their own ends then is that really a characteristic that you want in a partner? Is she blissfully unaware of his plans right now (despite this new enlightened him) ... is this new enlightened him really behaving in any way differently to the old him? Just food for thought ... ignore and throw out with pleasure Chris Took the words right out of my, uh, keyboard. PERFECTLY said.
awkward Posted December 30, 2010 Posted December 30, 2010 What would have happened if you hadn't answered the door?
SunsetRed Posted December 30, 2010 Posted December 30, 2010 I'm jealous. I want my xMM to contact me. I'm doing a good job of not contacting him and I am working really hard on me. Guess I need some more time.
Confused4Now Posted December 30, 2010 Posted December 30, 2010 Just out of interest ... WHY did he have to find out if you had written him out of your life , especially if he is going through a divorce and has gained this *new* understanding of flipping and everything. Didn't his *new* understanding include how important it was for him to show his W the respect to divorce her without having you confirmed as available for him. Didn't his *new* understanding include taking responsibility for his own actions without knowing he had a fall back position. Didn't his *new* understanding include accepting that your non-reply to his emails should be accepted as such WITHOUT him stepping over that boundary and turning up at your door ? I get why he contacted you I really do .... What I don't get is how him contacting you fits in with this *new* man that has now seen the light ... I would have thought if he had truly seen the light in that 30 days then he could have either : a) left you well alone and focused on ending his marriage and sorting out all the myriad of details that this entails and listened to the IC if/when they said that perhaps he needed to sort himself out fully before commiting to another relationship or b) been open and upfront with his wife about contacting you in the spirit of his *new* self with nothing to hide and no secrets I'm not trying to be negative, not criticising and not judging him or you ... I just am honestly confused about how this new enlightened him relates to a) ignoring your clear boundary of not returning his emails b) turning up at your house without his wife knowing (I presume he didn't bring her with him in the interest of new openness and honesty) It reads one way as if he just wants to confirm your availabilty at this time ... ,perhaps so he can factor it into his descision making process. Don't know ... only you can judge .... does his wife know about the February date he put in his email ... or is he "planning" it behind her back ... in which case how much has he really learnt about respect and upfront honesty and integrity. If, right to the last, someone can manipulate someone else for their own ends then is that really a characteristic that you want in a partner? Is she blissfully unaware of his plans right now (despite this new enlightened him) ... is this new enlightened him really behaving in any way differently to the old him? Just food for thought ... ignore and throw out with pleasure Chris OH man...I could have used this post like 2 1/2 years ago.....PERFECTION at it's best.....for me I couldn't have said it better. Please read this Chris..... I truly believe if someone is doing the work....just like silverplanets said...Boundaries is a huge one the MM would respect. The fact he came to your door shows he is not doing the work or else he'd be like you. Doing it alone. He's looking for you to be there so he has someone to go to. UGH...
East7 Posted December 30, 2010 Posted December 30, 2010 Couldn't agree more with SilverPlanets: "He needs to confirm your availability" ! Showing up and talking to you is something he has done for himself not to please you Siuys. He needed to fix his addiction-withdrawal and making you to feel sorry for him. Talking about his D without actions towards it, is about giving you hope and validate him. Undoubtedly he is in a state of limbo and has not made any clear decision. That is also a state that makes him weak, insecure and clingy to his wife and you both. He hasn't fixed yet his inner contradictions, that's why he is unable to make a move unless he feels clear in his head. In this case the temptation of being a supportive and understanding lover is huge. But I would suggest you to be more "selfish" as nothing he is doing takes in considerations your best interest. His IC, his e-mails, nothing is to please you or making any progress with you, it is all about him. So focus on yourself rather than letting your feelings overwhelm you and being the supportive heroic lover that will be disappointed one more time. Don't take more risks to heartbreak until he is more confident about what he is doing.
FightClub Posted December 30, 2010 Posted December 30, 2010 (edited) Siuys, My experiences with MW were quite different than what you experienced with the xMM but I can say that as the OM who developed deep feelings with the MW, I saw myself seeing lows and highs. The lowest feelings were wondering if this friendship would turn into a meaningful relationship in the future if things progressed and the highest when I was actually with her and in the back of my mind knowing it was wrong but both taking a chance. In the end ( is there every truly an 'end' in one's mind, I wonder ), her leaving and disappearing realizing she needed to work on herself, her M and her life without me as a factor was the best thing possible but I couldn't see that when it was right in front of me until now. If she were to contact me right now, I agree with everyone else that she wouldn't honoring her family, me or herself, she would be just as weak the first time around with me, staying in NC has helped me to continue to move forward despite my feelings for her. In your case, take everything you hear with a bit of caution, there's no doubt he probably does care a great deal about you but if he truly loved you and you truly loved him, it's my personal opinion he'll find you at a better time in his life when he has resolved everything first before bringing more personal/internal issues into the *possible* relationship you may see one day. Reinforce your boundaries. Don't do what I did, don't get caught up in the feelings and lose self respect again, your worth more than that and in time, if it's gonna happen...it'll happen naturally between the two of you, with him free of his vows and you free of hoping. Just...Be, you know what I mean? 'If you ever truly loved someone you'll let them go, we are like flowers and they are like sand...nothing can grow to it's full potential without soil' Take care, -FC Edited December 30, 2010 by FightClub
IzzyB Posted December 30, 2010 Posted December 30, 2010 Siuys, My experiences with MW were quite different than what you experienced with the xMM but I can say that as the OM who developed deep feelings with the MW, I saw myself seeing lows and highs. The lowest feelings were wondering if this friendship would turn into a meaningful relationship in the future if things progressed and the highest when I was actually with her and in the back of my mind knowing it was wrong but both taking a chance. In the end ( is there every truly an 'end' in one's mind, I wonder ), her leaving and disappearing realizing she needed to work on herself, her M and her life without me as a factor was the best thing possible but I couldn't see that when it was right in front of me until now. If she were to contact me right now, I agree with everyone else that she wouldn't honoring her family, me or herself, she would be just as weak the first time around with me, staying in NC has helped me to continue to move forward despite my feelings for her. In your case, take everything you hear with a bit of caution, there's no doubt he probably does care a great deal about you but if he truly loved you and you truly loved him, it's my personal opinion he'll find you at a better time in his life when he has resolved everything first before bringing more personal/internal issues into the *possible* relationship you may see one day. Reinforce your boundaries. Don't do what I did, don't get caught up in the feelings and lose self respect again, your worth more than that and in time, if it's gonna happen...it'll happen naturally between the two of you, with him free of his vows and you free of hoping. Just...Be, you know what I mean? 'If you ever truly loved someone you'll let them go, we are like flowers and they are like sand...nothing can grow to it's full potential without soil' Okay, wow.. this is great input. Needed to read this for me as well, thank you! Plus, i agree with your sig, also spot on.
Author siuys Posted December 30, 2010 Author Posted December 30, 2010 Thank you all for your input. Much appreciated. A day after I saw him my anxiety returned. Long story short, I am now more skeptical than ever that he will do what he says he will do. He might have made some progress, but after further talks, I realised how far he still has to go. Because he didn't hold his end of the bargain, I am starting to lose trust and faith. Because he didn't respect my boundary, I am starting to question if he is the man I thought he was... So this time round, the agreement is to have contact after he's moved out and been on his own for a month. I just don't believe it anymore but this is the agreement. I felt he was buying time. We agreed that he can email me updates if he chooses but I will not respond, and there will be no other contact. I don't know anything anymore. i just know that right now, I believe nothing. I told him firmly that i have lost trust and respect for him as a result of this, and if he keeps coming back with nothing, more of trust and respect will be gone, and soon, I will no longer want him. I am already getting there...
Author siuys Posted December 30, 2010 Author Posted December 30, 2010 I have now sent him an email stating that i do NOT want any email updates either. that what i want is for him to respect my boundaries, honour the agreement and get in touch if and when he's managed to move out and be on his own for a month then we take it from there. i also said i'd probably need to ask him for proof that he's been on his own for a month coz trust is eroding... i cannot believe it has come to this but right now, i no longer care about him. I am so tired and in a bad head space just from this it will take me days to recover... I do NOT want this anymore and if he turns up at my door, it will be finished.
silverplanets Posted December 30, 2010 Posted December 30, 2010 I have now sent him an email stating that i do NOT want any email updates either. that what i want is for him to respect my boundaries, honour the agreement and get in touch if and when he's managed to move out and be on his own for a month then we take it from there. i also said i'd probably need to ask him for proof that he's been on his own for a month coz trust is eroding... i cannot believe it has come to this but right now, i no longer care about him. I am so tired and in a bad head space just from this it will take me days to recover... I do NOT want this anymore and if he turns up at my door, it will be finished. Hang in there siuys ... you did absolutely great to get your head to where it was at before this latest episode ... and all that positive energy you invested in yourself is still there ... You've been looking after yourself, thinking things through and just trying to move forwards ... all that foundation is still there and none of that good work is undone. A hug to you though - cause it is hard and having to call someone on their actions and not their words is a hard thing to do ... be safe Chris
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