Anna Kay Posted December 28, 2010 Posted December 28, 2010 I'm seeking to better understand myself by getting your perspectives on this one: As an OW, what is love to you; how do you measure/define/feel love in your relationship with your MM? All thoughts welcome; thank you.
OpenBook Posted December 28, 2010 Posted December 28, 2010 It had more to do with how he made ME feel - like the most wonderful/gorgeous/precious creature in the world. Men are very good at implementing that effect on women, especially when they're MM (domesticiled by their W's) and so desperately starving for love and attention. Not all MM are like this; just the ones who are unsatisfied at home.
KarmasTestDummy Posted December 28, 2010 Posted December 28, 2010 Coincidence? For the sake of support and allowing these posts to actually be of benefit, it would be really nice if we didn't scare off every single new member with immediate accusations. I personally don't care if every single member on this board is all a schitzoprenic entity of the same person as long as they each came with a different perspective that helped me gain insight on my situation and yes "better understand myself". To respond to OP, love with mm is no different than the love I've had with others. Maybe more intense at times because of the way it still is exciting like a brand new relationship not falling into the mundane existence like some R's do...but the cause is the same. Chemistry, attraction, great communication, total honesty ( or at least a sense of), being needed and appreciated, having someone to need and appreciate, patience, understanding, a general feeling of being fulfilled.
ItsNeverForever Posted December 28, 2010 Posted December 28, 2010 Coincidence? Coincidence??? Do you mean to imply that there couldn't possibly be more than one person here who wants to better understand themselves??? Oy... For me, the love is not the same, but I don't think it had anything to do with the fact that he's "M" (he's not, but might as well be for all intents and purposes). In comparing with my mannnnny past relationships, some short, some LT, I believe it has everything to do with the fact that he's the man most compatible and complimentary to me that I've ever met. The feeling of love is completely different than what I've experienced in the past. Hard to describe. Like Karma though, there is super chemistry, fulfillment, communication (and right now, too much of that for comfort!). Not sure I was of any help, and perhaps I shouldn't attempt to be, being in the situation I am right now. But I'll always try.
jthorne Posted December 28, 2010 Posted December 28, 2010 To respond to OP, love with mm is no different than the love I've had with others. Maybe more intense at times because of the way it still is exciting like a brand new relationship not falling into the mundane existence like some R's do...but the cause is the same. Chemistry, attraction, great communication, total honesty ( or at least a sense of), being needed and appreciated, having someone to need and appreciate, patience, understanding, a general feeling of being fulfilled.It's very telling that you left out one major requirement, for me at least: RESPECT.
desertIslandCactus Posted December 28, 2010 Posted December 28, 2010 It had more to do with how he made ME feel - like the most wonderful/gorgeous/precious creature in the world. Men are very good at implementing that effect on women, especially when they're MM (domesticiled by their W's) and so desperately starving for love and attention. Not all MM are like this; just the ones who are unsatisfied at home. I had to take the fall for my failed M. (No one on here would believe otherwise ).. However, the MM who came onto me years later: I don't believe the 'unsatisfied at home' holds true. Married for just a few yrs, and professing love for his W.. he was truly just a 'cake eater' and with great Ego and self deception.
calliope Posted December 28, 2010 Posted December 28, 2010 I'm the same as Forever (you seem to be doing better today! ). The feelings I have for him are unlike anything I've ever felt for anyone before. I've never been married, but CL 8 yrs and just a couple other short term relationships. My MM (again, like Forever, he's not officially M), we started off as friends & were so for 2 yrs before anything ever happened between us. It grew from there. For me, the feelings I have for him are based on him being my best friend - the comfort we feel when we're together, how much we laugh together, how we each know what the other is thinking (and often finish each other's sentences), that our goals and interests are very similar, that we can talk to each other like neither of us have been able to talk to anyone before. Besides that, it's the chemistry between us, the butterflies in my stomach when I hear his voice, the way I count down the time til I'll see him again, the way that it feels like forever since I saw him last, when it may only be a day... Unfortunately we're not together now, but I still feel all those things...
LucreziaBorgia Posted December 28, 2010 Posted December 28, 2010 I saw my relationships with married/otherwise spoken for guys the same way I did guys I didn't see having a future with, but otherwise cared for. Some I admit I didn't really care much for outside of FWB stuff but some I did - I cared for them the way you do a boyfriend that you have that you don't really see yourself wanting to spend the rest of your life with. Not every relationship is meant to be followed through with marriage. I didn't see any of these guys as long term material - just dating, fun, etc. - no different than dating single guys and keeping your options open really.
OpenBook Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 However, the MM who came onto me years later: I don't believe the 'unsatisfied at home' holds true. Married for just a few yrs, and professing love for his W.. he was truly just a 'cake eater' and with great Ego and self deception. Yes, of course. I did not go into WHY these MM are unsatisfied at home because there are probably as many reasons as there are people - and may or may not have something to do with the BS. Each case is different. But bottom line, all cheating MM ARE unsatisfied at home in some way. In the cake-eater's case, home will never be enough for him, no matter who his W is. MMs who are happy at home do not stray. What's at home is too important for them to risk mucking it up. (And those are the REALLY good men!)
starlight102 Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 (edited) I'm seeking to better understand myself by getting your perspectives on this one: As an OW, what is love to you; how do you measure/define/feel love in your relationship with your MM? All thoughts welcome; thank you. My MM makes me feel appreciated, cared about, he supports and encourages me. He shows his love through his words and actions, and something that's very important to both of us - we respect each other and are honest with each other. We know each other well now and can easily tell when something is wrong with the other one. Edited December 29, 2010 by starlight102
Author Anna Kay Posted December 29, 2010 Author Posted December 29, 2010 I appreciate all of your feedback so far! I want to share where I am coming from too, but initially, I didn't want that to taint your responses in anyway. I've read some, but haven't had a chance to read everyone's story here just yet. ItsNeverForever: I did spend a few hours immersed your story today and my heart sooo goes out to you. Actually, everything I have read in the LS forums over the past week has been very educational and I've felt myself swing from one end of the pendulum to the other in being able to identify with many of the sentiments expressed here, even with some of the ones coming from the CHs! It's very telling that you left out one major requirement, for me at least: RESPECT. jthorne: I've enjoyed your concise brand of feisty no-nonsense advice and retorts in other threads, so leave it to you to raise a point here that makes a good segue way to an equally important and probably more telling companion question I also should have asked, which is: Is there any facet of what love means to you that is either missing from your relationship with your MM or otherwise markedly different to what you've experienced in non MM-OW relationships? And if so, how do you deal with that?
jthorne Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 jthorne: I've enjoyed your concise brand of feisty no-nonsense advice and retorts in other threads, so leave it to you to raise a point here that makes a good segue way to an equally important and probably more telling companion question I also should have asked, which is: Is there any facet of what love means to you that is either missing from your relationship with your MM or otherwise markedly different to what you've experienced in non MM-OW relationships? And if so, how do you deal with that?I was speaking from my experience as a wife. I was trying to point out that OW in your thread are referring to the connection and being needed etc, but one thing I saw missing in their posts was respect. Perhaps respect isn't important to them, I don't know. Maybe respect is a given so no one thought to mention it. What I do know is that men don't marry women they don't respect, and I doubt they'll leave existing marriages for them either.
redcurls Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 What I do know is that men don't marry women they don't respect, and I doubt they'll leave existing marriages for them either. But men sure have no problem staying married to women they don't respect either. How much respect do cheating men have for their wives and mothers of their children? From my own experience, my xMM has ZERO respect for me, ZERO respect for his wife, and worst of all - he has ZERO respect for himself.
jthorne Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 From my own experience, my xMM has ZERO respect for me, ZERO respect for his wife, and worst of all - he has ZERO respect for himself.Respect is a key requirement in any healthy relationship, IMO.
desertIslandCactus Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 But men sure have no problem staying married to women they don't respect either. How much respect do cheating men have for their wives and mothers of their children? From my own experience, my xMM has ZERO respect for me, ZERO respect for his wife, and worst of all - he has ZERO respect for himself. Believe me Redcurls, whether seen or not: there is more respect for a diligent loyal wife, than for anyone.
redcurls Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 (edited) Believe me Redcurls, whether seen or not: there is more respect for a diligent loyal wife, than for anyone. And this profound respect for a diligent loyal wife is shown by cheating on her. I guess so. Ya know, I would rather be single, than be "respected" this way. But that's just me. Edited December 29, 2010 by redcurls
White Flower Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 (edited) I was speaking from my experience as a wife. I was trying to point out that OW in your thread are referring to the connection and being needed etc, but one thing I saw missing in their posts was respect. Perhaps respect isn't important to them, I don't know. Maybe respect is a given so no one thought to mention it. What I do know is that men don't marry women they don't respect, and I doubt they'll leave existing marriages for them either.I suppose that would depend on your definition of respect. I don't neccessarily see M equal to respect. I've seen live-in partners who have had more respect for each other than most M couples. And sometimes I wonder who he respects more, me or her. A man can stay in a M for many reasons; none of them having anything to do with respect for her. On a fairly recent D-day she presented him with pictures of us taken by a PI. The very next day he hand-delivered them to me. Who was he respecting more with that gesture? You decide. By the way, they were actually quite beautiful pictures of us featuring a couple very much in love. I should thank her for them, but that wouldn't be tactful. Edited December 29, 2010 by White Flower
redcurls Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 I should thank her for them, but that wouldn't be tactful. Not tactful. But surely respectful, no? (pardon the sarcasm. Not feeling very graceful or respectful today)
OWoman Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 Is there any facet of what love means to you that is either missing from your relationship with your MM or otherwise markedly different to what you've experienced in non MM-OW relationships? And if so, how do you deal with that? Respect!! MMs respect my need for space, independence and my own life. They have their own, and so don't (typically) attempt to crowd, cling, suffocate or possess. They are happy to meet me as an equal, on my terms, at my whim, and (typically) feel no need to parade me around like arm candy to boost their own egos. I found SGs to be such losers, even the ones who looked (on the surface) like guys who had it all and had it together. Invariably the time would come - pretty quickly - when I realised why they were single!! Rs with MMs were far more satisfying. It's nice to be valued and respected and treated to the R you want and you deserve, not relegated to some second-class position in some loser's life.
White Flower Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 Not tactful. But surely respectful, no? (pardon the sarcasm. Not feeling very graceful or respectful today) For the price she paid I would have expected 8x10 glossies. I may use them for my wedding invitations... That might dispay appropriately MM's love for his OW.
redcurls Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 For the price she paid I would have expected 8x10 glossies. I may use them for my wedding invitations... That might dispay appropriately MM's love for his OW. Thank you. You are just what I needed today. This whole craziness is soooo effed up, all that's left to do is laugh.
White Flower Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 Thank you. You are just what I needed today. This whole craziness is soooo effed up, all that's left to do is laugh. Aw, you're welcome, and I hope it gets better. I just read your first thread and will comment on it later. Cheer up kiddo, it will get better.
desertIslandCactus Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 I suppose that would depend on your definition of respect. I don't neccessarily see M equal to respect. I've seen live-in partners who have had more respect for each other than most M couples. And sometimes I wonder who he respects more, me or her. A man can stay in a M for many reasons; none of them having anything to do with respect for her. On a fairly recent D-day she presented him with pictures of us taken by a PI. The very next day he hand-delivered them to me. Who was he respecting more with that gesture? You decide. By the way, they were actually quite beautiful pictures of us featuring a couple very much in love. I should thank her for them, but that wouldn't be tactful. She was wrong to waste the cost of a PI - or the pictures on you two. Should have just continued on with her life.
jthorne Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 For the price she paid I would have expected 8x10 glossies. I may use them for my wedding invitations....Wedding to whom?
redcurls Posted December 29, 2010 Posted December 29, 2010 Aw, you're welcome, and I hope it gets better. I just read your first thread and will comment on it later. Cheer up kiddo, it will get better. Oh, it already is better. He is out of my life. No turning back this time.
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