I Grow a Little Weary of Stereotypes RE: BS

[Spark1111]

Anyone else?

 

Our marriages are dysfunctional; our fWS return to the dysfunction because they can't or won't give up their children, their finances, their status quo.....blah, blah, blah....

 

They appear oh-so-noble to their former OW/OM as they end their affairs to give their marriage one more go...to wallow in sadness as they abandon their "true love" to be quietly miserable with their spouse and their families in an attempt to be the better man.

 

Does anyone else think this standard line from the affair script is as much a bunch of bunk as I do?

 

Does anyone else question WHY, oh why this is the preferred leaving line and WHY oh why so many APs believe it?

 

I personally believe this strategy does two things: Let's the AP down as easy as possible while ending the relationship AND keeps the glorious delusion alive of your MP taking the high road to keep his/her family unknowing of their personal misery but still intact.

 

I've know my fWS since he was 17! I knew he was stressed, unhappy, distant, and really, really odd, mostly angry during his affair.

 

WE, all of us, chalked it up to the stress of a new high-powered postion, one we had prayed for him to get after several years of illness and unemployment and subsequent depression.

 

Now some may turn a blind eye to the marital relationship, but that is really none of the smart, funny, self-sufficient women I know.

 

Most women want and demand more in their personal relationships these days.

 

Why would anyone believe a woman would want an unhappy spouse sacrificing himself to do the right thing by his family? Why would anyone believe we/I would not be asking every ten minutes, "What is wrong? Why do you seem so unhappy?"

 

What is this? The 1950s?

 

Why doesn't everyone acknowledge there are two, maybe three sides to the story you have been told about this terrible relationship, the one he or she returned to at the expense of "true love?"

[Spark1111]

Why doesn't anyone acknowledge that we were married....so hell yeah there was sex!

[bentnotbroken]

I didn't/don't want a martyr. I also don't want a liar. Did Mr. Messy have a rough time in our marriage....hell yeah. So did I! It wasn't all roses, candy, romance and boat loads of sex. I get sick of the wife doesn't listen, have sex or ignores his needs bull*****. I wanted sex, but not with a verbally abusive not long lasting man who put himself above everyone else in the family. The OW bought that load of mess hook, line and sinker. :lmao:

 

Are there some women out there that fit that stereotype...I would bet my last dollar there are. Is that all or even the majority..don't know but I know that the numbers are high enough to give pause to what the truth really is. Even some AP who have talked to the BS have found more than a few inconsistencies in the story they were told by the WS. And if there are problems in the marriage...why would that mean go "f" somebody else?

[Snowflower]

I think many BS who reconciled can relate but I don't think you'll change anyone's mind.

 

You see, someone has to the bad guy in the triangle as far as the AP and MP are concerned. It alleviates their guilt and makes them feel better about doing something they know on some level is wrong.

 

After the affair ends/d-day the mindset often remains and you see it here all the time.

 

But I agree, I get sick of it too. I wonder why more AP don't realize the similarities of the things the MP say about their spouses and marriages and realize that there are too many coincidences.

[scatterd]

I agree with you no one I know let alone myself are willing to settle for a man wanting someone else and putting up with a miserable relationship

allot of the times when marriage has been bad its been the woman thats gets divorced.When the man cheats they hide it and then when they are caught they promise to change and do anything for the wife not to leave.

I'm sure their is few that are afraid to leave or have no where to go but

the way these MM talk about their relationships while cheating I think its a lot of BS.They will say what ever to get it on the side I have known of men that cheat and they don't want their wifes to know and tell the OW all kinds of BS about how bad it is when its not.Not all men hide their affairs

to their friends.What is so sad is how they hurt so many people by doing this.

[Spark1111]

I didn't/don't want a martyr. I also don't want a liar. Did Mr. Messy have a rough time in our marriage....hell yeah. So did I! It wasn't all roses, candy, romance and boat loads of sex. I get sick of the wife doesn't listen, have sex or ignores his needs bull*****. I wanted sex, but not with a verbally abusive not long lasting man who put himself above everyone else in the family. The OW bought that load of mess hook, line and sinker. :lmao:

 

Are there some women out there that fit that stereotype...I would bet my last dollar there are. Is that all or even the majority..don't know but I know that the numbers are high enough to give pause to what the truth really is. Even some AP who have talked to the BS have found more than a few inconsistencies in the story they were told by the WS. And if there are problems in the marriage...why would that mean go "f" somebody else?

 

I wouldn't want a martyr either! Who would want to be anyone's default choice. Ugh!

 

AND how toxic would that relationship become to the parenting of children? So HOW IN ANY WAY would that be good, or better for the children?

 

Why would someone leading a secret and compartmentalized life from his/her family be trusted to be telling anyone the gospel truth of anything?There is no way to verify the facts of anything you are being told. You can't call his sister, brother, best friend, father, child, etc.

 

It is a leap of faith bordering on delusional to believe they are miserably married, just because THEY SAY SO.

 

It was a leap of faith bordering in retrospect on the delusional to believe he was working late all those nights, just because HE SAID SO.

 

But i'd known him, loved him and supported him for a long time before his affair. I so trusted him, I did not feel any need to check up on him, stalk, verify.

 

She knew him all of three months, fer crying out loud!

 

One thing the IC kept hammering, over and over is "How do you know this for sure?" after DDay.

 

ANd he was right. All I know is what he told me. All she knew is what he told her. There is absolutely no way to verify any info in a secret forbidden relationship, because they never interact with anyone but each other. They can't.

 

So if I can't "know" it, how can anyone else they assume they know anything about me and our relationship?

[Spark1111]

I think many BS who reconciled can relate but I don't think you'll change anyone's mind.

 

You see, someone has to the bad guy in the triangle as far as the AP and MP are concerned. It alleviates their guilt and makes them feel better about doing something they know on some level is wrong.

 

After the affair ends/d-day the mindset often remains and you see it here all the time.

 

But I agree, I get sick of it too. I wonder why more AP don't realize the similarities of the things the MP say about their spouses and marriages and realize that there are too many coincidences.

 

 

Oh, I get this. And I also believes it needs to be fueled fairly regularly.

 

It leaves us the bad guy for a very long time. It ennobles the WS, who returned for duty, never for love.

 

As the IC said to both of us: "How do you know this be TRUE?"

 

And as we mumbled he said, she said...his eyes woiuld grow squinty as if we were idiots.

[Spark1111]

I agree with you no one I know let alone myself are willing to settle for a man wanting someone else and putting up with a miserable relationship

allot of the times when marriage has been bad its been the woman thats gets divorced.When the man cheats they hide it and then when they are caught they promise to change and do anything for the wife not to leave.

I'm sure their is few that are afraid to leave or have no where to go but

the way these MM talk about their relationships while cheating I think its a lot of BS.They will say what ever to get it on the side I have known of men that cheat and they don't want their wifes to know and tell the OW all kinds of BS about how bad it is when its not.Not all men hide their affairs

to their friends.What is so sad is how they hurt so many people by doing this.

 

Scattrd, that has been my experience to. Not just personally, but IRL where I live.

 

ANd these men and women go to great, great lengths to reconcile, basically doing anything asked of them by that spouse they so disparaged during the affair; the one they are "forced" to return to.

 

Unless they never even confessed or were not discovered.

 

That's the equivalent of a break up; the AP became too needy, too demanding, the guilt NOW consumes the MP and they return for "the sake of the family" and to give the marriage "one more go."

 

It's the perfect line: No recriminations, no vases hurled at his head, no exposure to the spouse.

[September]

Spark, with all due respect, you were lucky that the A only lasted a few months and by that I am not discrediting the hurt and pain you still went through.

 

I think you may find though that when the A has been for a considerable amount of time, at least over a year, you do tend to get to know the AP pretty well (certainly not as well as a H or W that has been with them for a very long time). In my situation, I knew the reasons he was unhappy as they were the for the same reasons I was also unhappy in my M. That's was a big part of where we understood each other, we did things for each other that made us incredibly happy.

 

I don't think for one minute that a W is a Martyr for taking back her WH. The main thing I do question (and this is in relation to my situation only) is

that knowing he had such an intimate relationship with another woman for 2 years, how on earth his W could get over it. In all honesty, he has not told her everything, rug sweeps and minimises to reduce to pain. He had an extremely difficult time ending our relationship to return home and I believes still battles with it a year later. He realised that he did not want to lose his family and that includes his W. Now whether he really intimately loves his W deeply or whether it is the type of love where he really cares for her, we will never know, only he does.

 

I love my xH and care for him very much, but certainly not enough to ever want to make the M work again. Once I had experienced the feelings I had with xMM, I knew that I couldn't have that again that with my xH.

 

I am very pleased for you that you are doing all that you can to keep your M together. Please don't think that all OW think along the same lines, some are just confused about being dumped and look for a small crack, something to grasp onto.

 

Sorry for the ramble...

[Spark1111]

Spark, with all due respect, you were lucky that the A only lasted a few months and by that I am not discrediting the hurt and pain you still went through.

 

I think you may find though that when the A has been for a considerable amount of time, at least over a year, you do tend to get to know the AP pretty well (certainly not as well as a H or W that has been with them for a very long time). In my situation, I knew the reasons he was unhappy as they were the for the same reasons I was also unhappy in my M. That's was a big part of where we understood each other, we did things for each other that made us incredibly happy.

 

I don't think for one minute that a W is a Martyr for taking back her WH. The main thing I do question (and this is in relation to my situation only) is

that knowing he had such an intimate relationship with another woman for 2 years, how on earth his W could get over it. In all honesty, he has not told her everything, rug sweeps and minimises to reduce to pain. He had an extremely difficult time ending our relationship to return home and I believes still battles with it a year later. He realised that he did not want to lose his family and that includes his W. Now whether he really intimately loves his W deeply or whether it is the type of love where he really cares for her, we will never know, only he does.

 

I love my xH and care for him very much, but certainly not enough to ever want to make the M work again. Once I had experienced the feelings I had with xMM, I knew that I couldn't have that again that with my xH.

 

I am very pleased for you that you are doing all that you can to keep your M together. Please don't think that all OW think along the same lines, some are just confused about being dumped and look for a small crack, something to grasp onto.

 

Sorry for the ramble...

 

Ah...but here is where we have oh so much in common. My fWS's affair lasted about 1.5 years!

 

My point was she knew him for 3 months before their affair started. I knew him for a lifetime!

 

I told him to go get her! If she is your "soulmate" what are you doing here? Set me free from your misery! The text I intercepted on DDAy spoke of love, and passion, and a future together.

 

I was relieved to discover the cause of his cold. distant personna where nothing I did or said was good enough. It was so horrible to be so gaslighted for so long, as if fairies had stolen his true personality.

 

And do you know what the first words were out of his mouth, given carte blanche to go be with his divorced OW?

 

"Please don"t tell anyone."

 

Can you believe it? Now that it was no longer secret and forbidden, now that I was willingly and without acrimony intent on dissolving our marriage so he could go find happiness elsewhere, it appeared to be the very last thing he wanted.

 

And I have spent the last three years on LS, the internet, in IC and MC trying to discover the why of it all.

 

If you need to ask me any questions, feel free.

 

I AM the woman who took that man back and it has not been easy road to not only reconcile, but to feel assured he truly, deeply loves ME not just like he did, but better.

 

Plus, and I am not implying this applies to your situation, there was soooo much delusion in HIS affair relationship, that it just boggles my mind what facades were necessary to sustain it.

[jthorne]

Spark,

You should just accept your role as the evil overbearing, unstable, manipulative, vile cretin that all BS are. Meanie, you kept that poor OW from winning her prize! You're probably fat and smell bad too. :p:p Things would be so much easier if you'd just be the doormat that you're expected to be.*

 

*Disclaimer: the above is a JOKE.

Edited December 21, 2010 by jthorne

[Spark1111]

Hahahahaha! Must be why SHE STILL hates me today!:rolleyes:

 

She had to believe his Bullcrap to engage, and they needed to fuel it to continue the affair.

 

But if you spoke to the 100 people who knew/know us best, they would present a very differrent picture: one of a loving, self-sacrificing wife who supported that man through every burp and wrinkle of his life to the point of distraction because she LOVED him, their children, and their life together.

 

Only, he stopped loving himself and it was sooooo easy to blame me and our marriage for all of his misgivings.

 

And he crashed into her and oh so needed someone to see him with new and adoring eyes; someone who didn't know his history, his baggage, his failures, his regrets, his difficulties and his moodiness.

 

Someone, a stranger really, where he could reinvent himself into a strong, noble, kind family man. And she could then do the same thing too! She no longer had to be the bitter, lonely divorcee who still hated her xH for marrying his last AP and living happily ever after, after her.

 

And let me tell you, this fantasy was fueled for a long time as he began to crash and burn all bridges; his wife, his children, his siblings, his friends, his work colleagues all to get the next fix of feeling like a hero.

 

Because he wasn't. He wasn't that at all during his affair. Not with the people who had known and loved and supported him his entire life.

 

So if your AP is the one person on the planet who made you happy, why NOT avail yourself of the carte blanche to go be with her full time by a sad wife who loved you enough to set you free to do so?

 

And I know, full well, he NEVER told her he had that opportunity. NEVER.

 

Why?

[jthorne]

Why? Because she had one purpose, and she had served that purpose?

Edited December 21, 2010 by jthorne

[Spark1111]

Why? Because she had one purpose, and she had served that purpose?

 

Nope....I have known him too long.

 

He loved her, or should I say, he loved the facade, the affair persona of her.

 

I mean who wouldn't love the empowerment of undivided attention, flattery, fun, and immediate validation from someone who doesn't truly know you, especially when you have been needy, vulnerable and down and out.

 

Same for her too, I can only surmise.

 

It seems like a really beautiful fantasy, one tinged with drama, romance and sadness, and sex, sex, sex!

 

So why not go explore that, when given the opportunity to do so?

 

And like Seren's H, mine grew to despise her. I wish that were not so, it is tacky and I do not endorse nor encourage it.

 

But when it was no longer forbidden, he no longer wanted it. It went pssssst.

 

So for true love, I could understand. It was almost disheartening to realize all that had been lost for, for what?

 

A fantasy you no longer wanted when it could not remain a fantasy?

[jthorne]

Nope....I have known him too long.

 

He loved her, or should I say, he loved the facade, the affair persona of her.

 

I mean who wouldn't love the empowerment of undivided attention, flattery, fun, and immediate validation from someone who doesn't truly know you, especially when you have been needy, vulnerable and down and out.

 

Same for her too, I can only surmise.

 

It seems like a really beautiful fantasy, one tinged with drama, romance and sadness, and sex, sex, sex!

 

So why not go explore that, when given the opportunity to do so?

 

And like Seren's H, mine grew to despise her. I wish that were not so, it is tacky and I do not endorse nor encourage it.

 

But when it was no longer forbidden, he no longer wanted it. It went pssssst.

 

So for true love, I could understand. It was almost disheartening to realize all that had been lost for, for what?

 

A fantasy you no longer wanted when it could not remain a fantasy?

Well, that's what I meant, but my headache is making me foggy. Her purpose was to fuel the fantasy.

 

Not wanting to assume, so let me ask- had he not been caught, and OW started to "nag" about him leaving, how do you think it would have played out? My personal guess is the pssssst you described.

[Spark1111]

Well, that's what I meant, but my headache is making me foggy. Her purpose was to fuel the fantasy.

 

Not wanting to assume, so let me ask- had he not been caught, and OW started to "nag" about him leaving, how do you think it would have played out? My personal guess is the pssssst you described.

 

That was exactly what happened. While he claims he knew she wasn't the one, he neglected to tell her that, describing it as something he thought he could "control" that just got "way out of hand."

 

How cowardly of you, I told him.

 

My daughter swears he wanted to get caught, that he needed a reason to get out and let her down gently.

 

What better than to claim to have to return for the sake of the family?

 

Meanwhile, I put that man through hell for many, many months. He began to pursue me to the extent of stalking me! He was in fear I would find a better man than the one who had an office affair for 1.5 years!

 

I easily could have too!

 

But when I saw the remorse, the pain, the daily pleadings to give him another chance, I eventually took a very guarded wait and see attitude.

 

There was no dysfunction in our marriage, only what he himself created in his self-imposed mid-life crisis. But I too loved him, or rather, the man he had been pre-affair, and very, very tentatively, began to rebuild trust with him.

 

My conditions: Us, only better, with you doing the lion's share of the heavy lifting;IC, MC, attention, commitment, and respect.

 

Who would settle for less than that, especially having to overcome what a BS has to overcome.

 

Divorce is so much easier. I guess that is why I bristle to hear about how we BSs just grasp for our fWS to return to the marriage at any cost and concession.

 

It is not the 1950s anymore, and that is just unheard of in the sphere of women I associate with.

[jthorne]

Well, see Spark, that's what I've claimed for some time- most women don't require that IC and/or MC of the WS. Whoever ends up with him, BS, OW someone else. Without working out those issues, they just bring their mess with them.

 

It's great your H was willing to do that hard work.

Edited December 22, 2010 by jthorne

[bentnotbroken]

Spark,

You should just accept your role as the evil overbearing, unstable, manipulative, vile cretin that all BS are. Meanie, you kept that poor OW from winning her prize! You're probably fat and smell bad too. :p:p Things would be so much easier if you'd just be the doormat that you're expected to be.*

 

*Disclaimer: the above is a JOKE.

 

 

You left out rude, hostile, judgmental and my all time favorite BITTER. You can't possible think but one way and you have no clue how to get over yourself. :lmao:

[wheelwright]

Why doesn't anyone acknowledge that we were married....so hell yeah there was sex!

 

I told what was true about me and my M.

 

I thought I got the same.

 

xMOM said he had deep feelings for his W. He said there was no intimacy or passion.

 

I told him there had been passion with me and my H, but the love had died.

 

I believe we were honest with one another.

 

I told him the time I had sex with H during my A - the once.

 

I believe he was honest with me.

 

I was in separate beds from H during A.

 

That's why I believe it. Because it was true for me.

 

That's not the same for all I'm sure. Sometimes a WS lies about sex in the M to AP, sometimes they don't.

[Spark1111]

Well, see Spark, that's what I've claimed for some time- most women don't require that IC and/or MC of the WS. Whoever ends up with him, BS, OW someone else. Without working out those issues, they just bring their mess with them.

 

It's great your H was willing to do that hard work.

 

I wouldn't even consider dating him until he did!

 

And if he wasn't willing to fix what was broken within himself, why would I want the same broken, blaming man who had cheated on me?

[Spark1111]

I told what was true about me and my M.

 

I thought I got the same.

 

xMOM said he had deep feelings for his W. He said there was no intimacy or passion.

 

I told him there had been passion with me and my H, but the love had died.

 

I believe we were honest with one another.

 

I told him the time I had sex with H during my A - the once.

 

I believe he was honest with me.

 

I was in separate beds from H during A.

 

That's why I believe it. Because it was true for me.

 

That's not the same for all I'm sure. Sometimes a WS lies about sex in the M to AP, sometimes they don't.

 

Ok, I believe you. If a woman is not engaged emotionally, she does not want sex.

 

But a man? A man doesn't need a reason, he needs a place, as the old line goes.

 

So, tell me this isn't the height of delusion?

 

His OW asks him if we still have sex.

 

He replies rarely to never, taking one look at the expression on her face.

 

(we had sex at least twice a week during the affair. Nothing to write home about, but we still had it, knowwhatImean?_

[Spark1111]

Wait, it gets better.

 

She was soooo disappointed. So the next time, he tells her he stopped having sex with me. (Untrue!) To make her happy, happy happy with him again. He needs, feeds on that adoration in her eyes.

 

She tells him I must have a boyfriend then. Almost convinces him it is true! The same man sleeping with me twice a week.

 

He gets very, very upset, believing it must be true!

 

If that isn't the height of delusional reasoning, I do not know what is.

[Molley]

I had to smile to myself while reading through all the posts here... it all rings so true for me. Honestly, the WS makes up so many lies to themselves, their spouses and affair partners about the AFFAIR.... all to make themselves feel better about what they are doing. Staying for the kids is a pile of crap, as are the other multitude of excuses the WS provides to the AF.... just excuses. When my H came back, he couldn't use the line "I need to go back for the kids" because we don't have kids, plain and simple, he realized he didn't want to leave his marriage. So, why is it they can't be truthful and tell the OW/OM "hey, I'm going back because I actually love my wife/husband, I miss them, I actually find you boring and we're in a rut, don't have enough sex, etc, etc... etc? Why is it that they are so brutally honest with us when we learn about the A and the reason for the A, but they can't be just as honest with the AP when leaving them?

Edited December 22, 2010 by Molley

[fooled once]

Spark,

You should just accept your role as the evil overbearing, unstable, manipulative, vile cretin that all BS are. Meanie, you kept that poor OW from winning her prize! You're probably fat and smell bad too. :p:p Things would be so much easier if you'd just be the doormat that you're expected to be.*

 

*Disclaimer: the above is a JOKE.

 

:lmao:

[thissecretgirl]

There seem to be an awful lot of stereotypes going on in this thread too towards the OW.

Actually I've noticed there seems to be a lot thrown the way of the OW on LS. I guess a lot of its projecting.

I get slightly weary of all the anger thats thrown our way and these type of stereotypes. It amazes me sometimes the pure nastiness that is directed at OW even when seemingly the MM has been forgiven! How does that work then?

 

Perhaps theres a lesson for everyone, if people dont care for stereotypes lets all stop perpetuating them.