Men, do you give up too easily?

[Surrealist]

I'm glad I read this thread. I've been confused about this. I made approaches to two women, though strictly freindly only, but still approaches imo, that neither reciprocated. I'm not expecting any direct response but just some friendly chat. Now one of them was a work colleague and another from my gym, both of whom I have intereacted and spoken with and had shown me clear interest in some capacity with flirting and so on. I have been feeling really disappointed about this all. But this thread clears up some of the confusion, and that is, don't worry about it, just move on. I should have more pride in myself rather than let these things confuse me and drag me down in any way.

[the_dynamo]

Then be direct!

 

I've had more than few girls tell me how much they appreciate my straight-forwardness. I went on a 2nd date with a girl, but I got the distinct impression she wasn't interested in another date, so I told her. I didn't whine about it, I said "I get the impression you're not interested in continuing this, which is fine, thanks for great conversation!". She replied back explaining her stuff going on in her life and apologizing for giving me that impression. Problem solved.

 

Start being the kind of person you want to be and you'll quickly attract similar people and filter out those who can't hack it.

 

RF

I am direct the girls aren't!!

I almost always say what's on my mind in regard to my interest in girls, so I have rarely had a case where a girl falsely thinks I like her.

 

But the girls, they rather make some ridiculous story than tell the simple understandable truth, they say they don't have time or that I did something wrong, which is utter bull****, unless I do some really weird thing I don't believe I can turn off a girl that likes me so easily.

 

I also don't think it's a good Idea to go ask girls outright if they are not interested, unless it's super obvious, cause it might actually promote such a mindset even if it wasn't there before you asked.

[fishtaco]

Women that think like this are not worth dating.

 

Unless I have really good reason to try again, usually it's because we already have some sort of history together, I never make a 2nd attempt.

[BackUpOrGetStung]

Attention whores are cool once you understand how to treat them. Jump through their hoops, do what it takes to smash, then go cold like they were. Make them work to keep you around. Personally, I don't talk to these girls after sleeping with them once or twice because I despise them for making me jump through the hoops. The good thing about it, is that you can be very patient and pursue other women at the same time.

[the_dynamo]

I don't have the time and patients for games, If a girl starts acting up I make point that I m not amused and if she continues I let go.

[fishtaco]

Attention whores are cool once you understand how to treat them. Jump through their hoops, do what it takes to smash, then go cold like they were. Make them work to keep you around. Personally, I don't talk to these girls after sleeping with them once or twice because I despise them for making me jump through the hoops. The good thing about it, is that you can be very patient and pursue other women at the same time.

 

Funny how that works isn't it? Some women think making men jump through hoops shows that the men are truly interested in them. But in reality, all they did was make assumptions and create games, and did nothing to improve their chances of finding a guy that really is genuinely interested in them.

[BackUpOrGetStung]

Truth is, it doesn't even take much time or patience once you stop caring about them. Just give them their little attention fix, it really doesn't take much, and eventually you'll get in there. The main point is not caring when it happens or how she feels about you. Even if it takes a while, you shouldn't be "waiting".

[BackUpOrGetStung]

Funny how that works isn't it? Some women think making men jump through hoops shows that the men are truly interested in them. But in reality, all they did was make assumptions and create games, and did nothing to improve their chances of finding a guy that really is genuinely interested in them.

 

It is ironic, but it's also deserved.

[somedude81]

Not to jump on you, but that was terrible.

 

First off, the first text was bad. Not confident at all. A better text would have been "Going to do X on Saturday, interested?". If you got the "don't know", you shouldn't have replied, or just replied "K".

 

Your follow up texts just scream desperate. Even if you don't have other chicks to work on, act like your life doesn't revolve around her answer.

 

RF

There was no confidence in my text because I wanted and expected her to say no. I've been pining for her too long and want her to shut me down so I can move on.

 

BTW, the whole, "I'm going to to do X on Saturday" thing doesn't work for me since I don't go out. If there was something I really wanted to do I'd invite her, but normally I'm just always at home.

 

My fallow up texts was me trying to tell her to give me a real answer and not worry about hurting my feelings. And that still wasn't enough to provoke her. At the end I was just frustrated with her.

 

I am not going to contact her again and it will be a miracle if I hear from her.

To me, when I hear a woman say this (esp. if she's spending time with you like you said), it's pretty rude, actually insulting, and I'm suprised that they (or she) can be so complacent about that comment.

 

If I would imagine, if they were talking me, their tone and inflection would be like, "Meh, if I have time for you, or care enough, we'll hang, but I think I have better things to do"

 

She might even imply that watching a Lifetime movie by herself is more important than you watching that movie together.

Yeah it does sound rude. Especially since I've known her for almost a year, we've hung out many times and I've brought her to my apartment on a couple of occasions.

 

Her level of indifference is annoying.

 

But she is the only girl that I'm even remotely close to. So I spend time with her when I can.

 

Either way, I really doubt I'll see her again.

It has always been irrational to me that girls are not direct. In my own case right now, if the girl directly told me she was not interested, it would have made stuff a lot easier and i wouldn't text her again.

Exactly how I feel.

 

The indirect stuff just makes things a lot more harder than it has to be.

 

Some men are stupid/desperate (me) and will cling to a maybe like it's a life-raft.

 

All they need to do is just give a straight answer. Though I do see the irony in wanting a woman to man up.

[the_dynamo]

 

All they need to do is just give a straight answer. Though I do see the irony in wanting a woman to man up.

girls just need to realize that they are not doing guyz any favor or they aren't actually going easy on them when they don't say the truth, In fac they are indirectly saying that the guy does not have it in him to handle the truth. which is far more offending to me than girl telling me to **** off.

[somedude81]

 

His logic is faulty though. If you are going to ask, then do so confidently. He shouldn’t take it personally.

How should I have have asked confidently?

 

What I want from her is not a rejection to a specific event but her reject me. I know there are things that she won't do with and things she will.

 

I'm trying to get her to tell me to leave her alone.

 

Normally I'm not this pushy, but I've known her for a long time and really like her.

[runner]

How should I have have asked confidently?

 

YOU: i like you, i think you're hot, and i'd like to date you.

HER: um, i'm flattered, but...no.

YOU: k

 

end transmission.

[xRJ85x]

Funny how that works isn't it? Some women think making men jump through hoops shows that the men are truly interested in them. But in reality, all they did was make assumptions and create games, and did nothing to improve their chances of finding a guy that really is genuinely interested in them.

 

And so the vicious cycle continues.

 

Actually scratch that emoticon, cuz it's rather sad.

 

It's this reason that I DON'T have a problem jumping through hoops for a girl I like (some hoops, nothing insane). I'll be the bigger person and go for what I want. I'd hate to think that I'm missing out on some girl because some ******* cheated/used her in the past. It actually can have a better outcome in the end, because if she sees you as trustworthy, you're just gonna be worth that much more.

[Chicago_Guy]

I've had a couple of friends that had female friends claim they didn't try hard enough or perhaps told them, "you give up to easily" when pursuing a certain woman.

 

I think I mentioned in another post about how some women got upset with a guy because he didn't pusue further than one phone call with them.

 

Or when talking with their friends they say, "Really, that's it, you left one message?! Dude, you give up too easily".

 

That being said, I've often wondered if I gave up too easily in some instances, perhaps I was one phone call or email away from getting a woman to go out with me? I don't know. But after comments made by friends or what my friends told me when they made those comments to him, it made me wonder if, I don't know, should I have left that extra message or email?

 

If a woman is mature enough for a relationship and is interested in you, there is no reason to call more than one time if you leave a message. Women might say that men give up too easily and should jump through certain hoops to prove that they like the women, but women really don't respect men who come across as too eager. Look at all of the threads here about the "nice" guys who are unattractive in part because they showed too much interest in the women who didn't put forth much effort themselves.

[Jeff M Stevens]

I've had a couple of friends that had female friends claim they didn't try hard enough or perhaps told them, "you give up to easily" when pursuing a certain woman.

 

I think I mentioned in another post about how some women got upset with a guy because he didn't pusue further than one phone call with them.

 

Or when talking with their friends they say, "Really, that's it, you left one message?! Dude, you give up too easily".

 

That being said, I've often wondered if I gave up too easily in some instances, perhaps I was one phone call or email away from getting a woman to go out with me? I don't know. But after comments made by friends or what my friends told me when they made those comments to him, it made me wonder if, I don't know, should I have left that extra message or email?

 

The idea is to leave a message, wait a week and then leave 1 more. Generally you're out after 1 non-returned call but there could be rare situations where she didn't get the first message due to a technology break down. If you leave 2 messages over the span of a couple weeks or so, and you get no call back, she's definitely not interested. I call it the George Clooney rule. If a woman was being pursued by George Clooney (or some other Hollywood star that she found hot), think she'd ignore calls? No way.

 

I ran into a woman, in fact, that said that "guys in their 40's are way too old for me" (she's in her mid-20s). Knowing that she loves George Clooney, I said "Does that mean you wouldn't go out with George Clooney?" and she replied "He's Different! Of course I'd go out with him!!!"

 

If you can't have a woman that is all about going out with you and has a "George Clooney type of reaction" to the prospect of going out with you, forget it, its not worth it, and generally when you have to pursue, pursue, pursue then you aren't getting anywhere with her.

[Jeff M Stevens]

I know exactly what you are saying, and it happens to me all the time.

 

It's very rare that I ever get a bite, but when I finally do, I put all my effort in trying to reel 'er in. At the same time, I'm way down on her priorities list. I've had girls make me wait weeks for another date. Of course I put up with it, beggars can't be choosers. Yes I'm trying to go after other women but it's a very rare thing getting any attention.

 

One thing I really need from women is a solid negative response or else I don't really know when to stop trying. It's annoying becuase women don't want to say no.

 

There's a girl at my school that I've hung out with several times. I see her every day in class. Now that the semester is over, the only time I'll see her is if we actually make plans to hang out. She knows I like her. Even though I know she's not interested in me, it's hard to give up because she still gives me attention, a little part of me still has hope.

 

Yesterday we had this text conversation after our final

 

Me: Any chance you want to hang out this weekend?

Her: Don't know

 

(I was hoping for a yes or no answer. Something solid.)

 

Me: LOL, if you don't want to, just say no, I can take it.

Her: No, I mean I don't know. If I have free time I'll give you a text.

Me: LOL, I guess that's the best I can expect

 

And that was it. It's the stringing me along that drives me crazy. I wish she would just say sorry, "I'm not interested." Be hot or cold, anything but lukewarm.

 

Remember this man: WHEN THEY LIKE YOU, THEY HELP YOU

 

Let me repeat that: WHEN THEY LIKE YOU THEY HELP YOU

 

I can 100% tell you that woman you describe neither likes you or wants to help you. You are spinning your wheels. They speak womanese, by the way. She did tell you in womanese that she doesn't want you at all. She is not "lukewarm," she is ICE COLD.

 

Here's the better play.

 

1. Never "hang out." You are there to take them on a date. Period.

 

2. Strongly ask for a woman's # after establishing a little rapport with her as you did by being at school with her. "Jennifer, what is your home phone number?" then shut up and see what she does. If she fumbles around or makes excuses, she's NOT INTERESTED. You want her to IMMEDIATELY and ENTHUSIASTICALLY give you the digits.

 

3. Wait 5-9 days and call her if you get the # (every other guy calls in 2 days) and ask her on a date you have planned for Monday-Thursday night (every other guy asks her out for Friday or Saturday but you want her to think you have other dates those nights) "Jennifer, its SomeDude, how are you? (Wait to see if she remembers you and enthusiastically responds). There's a great Mexican restaurant at 10th & Vine I want to take you to next Tuesday at 7p. Great. What's your address? (make sure that you give her at least a 5 day notice---you don't want to be asking her out for Tuesday on a Monday!)

 

If she responds with anything but a "Yes" or "I can't make it Tuesday but could we go out next Thursday" you're OUT and you need to TOSS THE NUMBER

 

I understand that it's tough mentally on a guy when he can't find someone and you grasp at the first girl that shows you attention sometimes but that is NOT THE WAY TO GET WOMEN. They smell desperation a mile away. You have to have a take it or leave it attitude and you most certainly do not want to beg a non-interested girl like you're doing. And yes, you are begging her based on what you wrote above.

 

Dude, you deserve a girl that is REALLY INTERESTED IN YOU but in life, we don't get what we deserve, we get what we negotiate and right now, you are selling yourself way short by the way you're going about things so you will get what you're getting. What are you getting? A girl that has you 100th on her list (even if you're that high!)

 

Good luck man

[fishtaco]

And so the vicious cycle continues.

 

Actually scratch that emoticon, cuz it's rather sad.

 

It's this reason that I DON'T have a problem jumping through hoops for a girl I like (some hoops, nothing insane). I'll be the bigger person and go for what I want. I'd hate to think that I'm missing out on some girl because some ******* cheated/used her in the past. It actually can have a better outcome in the end, because if she sees you as trustworthy, you're just gonna be worth that much more.

 

LOL, good for you that you're willing to jump though hoops.

 

My point was that hoops don't increase the women's chance of finding a genuine guy. Sure, you are one of the very few genuine guy that are willing to jump through hoops. But if the hoops weren't there, then you'd lose interest in her? I don't think so, sounds like you don't want to miss out on a great woman, hoops or no hoops. So in the end, what was the hoops for? Didn't make one bit of difference. Because as a genuine guy, you are attracted to the woman, not the hoops.

 

It's just another game that doesn't prove anything.

[Jeff M Stevens]

When a woman wants to spend time with you, you as a man will know. I hate the notion of "giving up too easily." That's just a way for women to place blame on men, especially when they weren't getting the free food and drink carousel they might have been expecting without a ghost of intention of putting out.

 

When a woman is sending "mixed" signals or no signals, the man should interpret it only as lack of interest. If she were interested, she'd go out of her way to be available. Otherwise, it's better for a man to move on to other prospects (which he should have). Though it may sound like throwing the baby out with the bathwater, it will save a man a lot of wasted time, energy, and (often) emotion wondering WTF is going on in some disinterested woman's head.

 

Of course the best way to prevent this mentality is to have options. Approach more women, get more numbers, make more dates....then see if you ever care about a woman who doesn't call you back.

 

Sam, the thing we always tell guys is WHEN THEY LIKE YOU, THEY HELP YOU. I loved what you said about having options. You are so right. Until a lady makes it obvious she wants to be with you and you feel the same about being with her, then it is all about fishing around!

[Jeff M Stevens]

How should I have have asked confidently?

 

What I want from her is not a rejection to a specific event but her reject me. I know there are things that she won't do with and things she will.

 

I'm trying to get her to tell me to leave her alone.

 

Normally I'm not this pushy, but I've known her for a long time and really like her.

 

Confident Play (and NO, NEVER ASK A WOMAN OUT VIA TEXT, CALL HER OR ASK FACE TO FACE):

 

SOMEDUDE: "There is a great Italian Restaurant on 20th & Vine. I would like to take you there next Tuesday at 7p"

 

If she reacts with anything but an enthusiastic YES or counteroffer then she is REJECTING YOU. Don't you see? When she is rejecting the event, she is REJECTING YOU.

 

Think she'd reject Brad Pitt for dinner or some other hot Hollywood Hunk?

 

And why would your end game be to get her to say "leave me alone?" Seems to me that that would (in her mind) border on stalking.

 

And she DID TELL YOU TO LEAVE HER ALONE. She rejected your date offer. Plus, you said in your other post when she told you that she may or may not text you that weekend that "well, it's the best I can expect LOL"

 

THAT IS WEAK, WEAK, WEAK. Not trying to hurt you man but you seem like a good guy and you deserve to treat yourself better than that!!!

 

Let me bottom line it for you. This girl is NOT INTERESTED and you need to MOVE ON.

 

Period.

[Surrealist]

Is it fair to women that if a chick likes a guy, and of course, the guy likes the girl, and the girl is waiting for the guy to man up and initiate, and the guy does, but only half-assed, meaning approaches the chick in a purely friendly manner (ie: Hi how are you? Just thought I would contact you to ask how you're going?) after substantial non-verbal flirting, that it would be reasonable that the woman does not respond on the first occasion but rather waits for a more clear direct approach until she feels okay to reciprocate?

 

I'm asking because I feel like I make this manner of approach and the woman appears to be annoyed if anything. I also fail to follow up for feeling like I've been kicked to the curb. I have big rejection issues.

Edited December 17, 2010 by Surrealist

[xRJ85x]

LOL, good for you that you're willing to jump though hoops.

 

My point was that hoops don't increase the women's chance of finding a genuine guy. Sure, you are one of the very few genuine guy that are willing to jump through hoops. But if the hoops weren't there, then you'd lose interest in her? I don't think so, sounds like you don't want to miss out on a great woman, hoops or no hoops. So in the end, what was the hoops for? Didn't make one bit of difference. Because as a genuine guy, you are attracted to the woman, not the hoops.

 

It's just another game that doesn't prove anything.

 

Well, yes and no. On one hand, the hoops are gonna piss off a lot of guys, this convo being the prefect example. So that screws the woman. On the other hand, it probably does weed out a lot of guys who aren't seriously interested in them. And as men, just as we are supposed to take the initiative to pursue the girl, it seems that game playing men have brought upon the new responsibility of jumping through hoops. So genuine guys like you and I have become forced to deal with it. The nice thing that comes out of this is if the girl accepts you, you know she's at least being honest.

[xRJ85x]

Is it fair to women that if a chick likes a guy, and of course, the guy likes the girl, and the girl is waiting for the guy to man up and initiate, and the guy does, but only half-assed, meaning approaches the chick in a purely friendly manner (ie: Hi how are you? Just thought I would contact you to ask how you're going?) after substantial non-verbal flirting, that it would be reasonable that the woman does not respond on the first occasion but rather waits for a more clear direct approach until she feels okay to reciprocate?

 

I'm asking because I feel like I make this manner of approach and the woman appears to be annoyed if anything. I also fail to follow up for feeling like I've been kicked to the curb. I have big rejection issues.

 

This is similar to what fishtacos and I were saying. Maybe women want us to jump through hops to prove our worth (doesn't that sound just like certain species in the animal kingdom?). We want women who are mature and with that not solely turned on by challenge but also partly by affection and romance. Its immature of a woman to hold it against a guy for really being into her. So guys shouldn't have to worry about jumping through hoops because some women actually want a guy to do that.

 

Correct me if I misunderstood what you meant tho...

[dreamingoftigers]

If the man "give up to easily", it's the woman's own fault for playing games and expecting him to do all the work, some men just get tired of it. Unfortunatley all women think that men should chase and chase and chase and put in all the effort and take all the iniatives and jump though hoops to get her... Men want to feel wanted to, most men want to feel that the woman likes him too, offcourse this is compleltey irrelevant to women. To women it's all about them.

 

This thread proves yet again, that in reality women have no real intrest in being with a man. They have a take it or leave it attitude, "either treat me like a queen and chase me for a freakin eternity or leave" basicly. I don't see why women would act this way if they where intrested in men at all.

 

All men compose musicals in their spare time. All men use their dicks as dowsing rods. All men chase after rainbows. All men have been to Ireland. All men have grown crops and harvested them. Men seem to have all of the same qualities. It couldn't be that only some men have some of these qualities/experiences. It must be every single one of them.

 

So weird....

[xRJ85x]

All men compose musicals in their spare time. All men use their dicks as dowsing rods. All men chase after rainbows. All men have been to Ireland. All men have grown crops and harvested them. Men seem to have all of the same qualities. It couldn't be that only some men have some of these qualities/experiences. It must be every single one of them.

 

So weird....

 

Indeed haha.

 

Can you blame us tho? Its essentially the same reason were having this discussion. Most women are afraid of the stereotypical ******* game player. And since we fear what we don't know, its applied to all. Be it man or woman. As I said before, vicious cycle. So if a girl I really want needs me to prove that, I have no choice but to work my ass off.

[Surrealist]

This is similar to what fishtacos and I were saying. Maybe women want us to jump through hops to prove our worth (doesn't that sound just like certain species in the animal kingdom?). We want women who are mature and with that not solely turned on by challenge but also partly by affection and romance. Its immature of a woman to hold it against a guy for really being into her. So guys shouldn't have to worry about jumping through hoops because some women actually want a guy to do that.

 

Correct me if I misunderstood what you meant tho...

 

To be honest I think you did misunderstand me a little. But that's cool, it runs a similar theme only I'm looking to see WHY the women in these instances may not have responded, and rightly so perhaps - then I can understand and learn to adjust my approach.