Women: I need your wisdom--what's going on here?

[drdarwin]

It's hard to summarize several years worth of dates, but I will do my best. I've dated a girl off and on for several years, and it always seems to fizzle out after a couple of dates only start up again after a couple of months. It almost always starts back up when I call or text her to see if she wants to do something, so I have definitely shown more interest. The second date is sometimes at her request and sometimes at mine. The problem is that even if she suggests doing something, which I obviously take as a sign of interest, she never follows it up by demonstrating a lot of interest on the date, so the night concludes with me having no idea where I stand.

 

Then, I'll check to see if she wants to do something the next weekend, and I won't hear back from her for a week or two despite sending several texts and/or calling her a couple of times. I therefore give up--I don't ask her out again when she eventually calls back--and then the process starts all over again a couple of months later. Most recently, we went to a museum and had dinner afterward. We had a great time, and she even drove me home. She parked illegally, so I couldn't get her to stay in my apartment very long. Earlier in the night, she had invited me to a Thanksgiving party at her house the next weekend, so I didn't have to worry about asking for a second date. Because all of her friends were going to be there and would certainly ask her about me afterward, I assumed things were heading in the right direction.

 

Fast forward one week. I went to the party and had a good time, although she had an out of town girlfriend in town as well who she was also trying to entertain, so her attention was divided between us and her other guests. Eventually, all of the guests left, and her roommates went to bed, so it was just me, unsaid girl, and her out of town friend watching tv. This was good, but she never sat close to me on the couch. And when she did sit next to me, she spent the whole time on her computer finishing up some work. Right before I left, she also spent about 30 minutes upstairs in her bedroom changing into her pajamas while I sat downstairs talking with her friend.

 

She offered to drive me home before going up to change, but I could tell she really didn't want to. I also didn't think it would be fair for her to do so because I don't live nearby and she had to get up early the next morning to go to work, so I called a cab. Before I left, she thanked me for coming, sent me home with some food and wine, and said that we would talk later. I was kind of confused about what was going on because she had just run downstairs right before my cab arrived but had spent the previous 30 minutes upstairs in her bedroom--I was actually just about to go up and knock on her bedroom door when she came downstairs to make sure that I got to say goodbye to her before I left--, so I just gave her a hug, thanked her for inviting me, and said that I had a great time.

 

Earlier in the night, she mentioned that she really wanted to see a particular movie. I had never heard of the movie but found out that it was premiering a couple of days later when I checked the internet the next day. So, about three days later, I texted her and asked if she wanted to see the movie. The day after that was Thanksgiving, and I texted her again and to wish her a happy Thanksgiving. I haven't received a response to either text. We're both very busy (in the medical field), so I understand that she may not reply immediately, but it's takes minimal time to reply to a text. Maybe she has her reasons for not replying, but I'm doubtful about that, especially when I invited her to go to a movie I know for a fact she really wants to see. I sometimes wonder if a lack of physicality is the problem.

 

There has always been a lot of mutual physical attraction, but we have never had sex. I always tell myself that I'll try to be more physical with her, but I never feel that she demonstrates enough sustained interest for me to feel comfortable doing so. I also think she may be a virgin, and I know that she got very mad at a mutual friend of ours who tried to make a move on her before we started dating. I'm not going to pretend I'm any kind of Don Juan myself, but I've dated a fair number of girls, and she's the only one with whom I can never tell where I stand becuase the messages are so mixed.

 

I would just give up, but I'm very picky, and I think she's one of the most beautiful women I've ever met. She also has a lot going for her. I've told her I feel this way, although it was a couple of years ago. Do I assume that no response to several texts is a negative, or do I keep calling/texting until she says no? Should I tell her again how I feel, as it's been several years since I've done so and she may not be sure of my intentions? Since I don't want to call or text too often, I was planning to call her sometime this week and ask about the movie if I don't hear back beforehand. I'd be very appreciative of any assessments on the situation and/or advice on how to proceed. Thanks in advance!

Edited November 28, 2010 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[drdarwin]

Just wondering if anyone has any feedback. This is a great forum, so I'm looking for some helpful and honest replies. I sincerely apologize for the length of the post, but I don't think I can condense it any further without leaving out some important information. Thanks in advance!

[daphne]

Paragraphs would make your post easier to read.

 

I realize that you think this girl is a catch, but several years of on and off dating doesn't seem destined for a committed relationship. If you are young and have the patience and fortitude to see where it leads then I say go for it. Otherwise, I'd have to suggest moving on as it seems like it's leading nowhere.

[drdarwin]

It's hard to summarize several years worth of dates, but I will do my best.

 

I've dated a girl off and on for several years, and it always seems to fizzle out after a couple of dates only start up again after a couple of months. It almost always starts back up when I call or text her to see if she wants to do something, so I have definitely shown more interest. The second date is sometimes at her request and sometimes at mine. The problem is that even if she suggests doing something, which I obviously take as a sign of interest, she never follows it up by demonstrating a lot of interest on the date, so the night concludes with me having no idea where I stand. Then, I'll check to see if she wants to do something the next weekend, and I won't hear back from her for a week or two despite sending several texts and/or calling her a couple of times. I therefore give up--I don't ask her out again when she eventually calls back--and then the process starts all over again a couple of months later.

 

Most recently, we went to a museum and had dinner afterward. We had a great time, and she even drove me home. She parked illegally, so I couldn't get her to stay in my apartment very long. Earlier in the night, she had invited me to a Thanksgiving party at her house the next weekend, so I didn't have to worry about asking for a second date. Because all of her friends were going to be there and would certainly ask her about me afterward, I assumed things were heading in the right direction. Fast forward one week. I went to the party and had a good time, although she had an out of town girlfriend in town as well who she was also trying to entertain, so her attention was divided between us and her other guests. Eventually, all of the guests left, and her roommates went to bed, so it was just me, unsaid girl, and her out of town friend watching tv. This was good, but she never sat close to me on the couch. And when she did sit next to me, she spent the whole time on her computer finishing up some work. Right before I left, she also spent about 30 minutes upstairs in her bedroom changing into her pajamas while I sat downstairs talking with her friend. She offered to drive me home before going up to change, but I could tell she really didn't want to. I also didn't think it would be fair for her to do so because I don't live nearby and she had to get up early the next morning to go to work, so I called a cab. Before I left, she thanked me for coming, sent me home with some food and wine, and said that we would talk later. I was kind of confused about what was going on because she had just run downstairs right before my cab arrived but had spent the previous 30 minutes upstairs in her bedroom--I was actually just about to go up and knock on her bedroom door when she came downstairs to make sure that I got to say goodbye to her before I left--, so I just gave her a hug, thanked her for inviting me, and said that I had a great time. Earlier in the night, she mentioned that she really wanted to see a particular movie. I had never heard of the movie but found out that it was premiering a couple of days later when I checked the internet the next day.

 

About three days later, I texted her and asked if she wanted to see the movie. The day after that was Thanksgiving, and I texted her again and to wish her a happy Thanksgiving. I haven't received a response to either text. We're both very busy (in the medical field), so I understand that she may not reply immediately, but it's takes minimal time to reply to a text. Maybe she has her reasons for not replying, but I'm doubtful about that, especially when I invited her to go to a movie I know for a fact she really wants to see.

 

I sometimes wonder if a lack of physicality is the problem. There has always been a lot of mutual physical attraction, but we have never had sex. I always tell myself that I'll try to be more physical with her, but I never feel that she demonstrates enough sustained interest for me to feel comfortable doing so. I also think she may be a virgin, and I know that she got very mad at a mutual friend of ours who tried to make a move on her before we started dating. I'm not going to pretend I'm any kind of Don Juan myself, but I've dated a fair number of girls, and she's the only one with whom I can never tell where I stand becuase the messages are so mixed. I would just give up, but I'm very picky, and I think she's one of the most beautiful women I've ever met. She also has a lot going for her. I've told her I feel this way, although it was a couple of years ago.

 

Do I assume that no response to several texts is a negative, or do I keep calling/texting until she says no? Should I tell her again how I feel, as it's been several years since I've done so and she may not be sure of my intentions? Since I don't want to call or text too often, I was planning to call her sometime this week and ask about the movie if I don't hear back beforehand. I'd be very appreciative of any assessments on the situation and/or advice on how to proceed. Thanks!

[MorningCoffee]

It's hard to summarize several years worth of dates, but I will do my best. I've dated a girl off and on for several years, and it always seems to fizzle out after a couple of dates only start up again after a couple of months. It almost always starts back up when I call or text her to see if she wants to do something, so I have definitely shown more interest. The second date is sometimes at her request and sometimes at mine. The problem is that even if she suggests doing something, which I obviously take as a sign of interest, she never follows it up by demonstrating a lot of interest on the date, so the night concludes with me having no idea where I stand. Then, I'll check to see if she wants to do something the next weekend, and I won't hear back from her for a week or two despite sending several texts and/or calling her a couple of times. I therefore give up--I don't ask her out again when she eventually calls back--and then the process starts all over again a couple of months later. Most recently, we went to a museum and had dinner afterward. We had a great time, and she even drove me home. She parked illegally, so I couldn't get her to stay in my apartment very long. Earlier in the night, she had invited me to a Thanksgiving party at her house the next weekend, so I didn't have to worry about asking for a second date. Because all of her friends were going to be there and would certainly ask her about me afterward, I assumed things were heading in the right direction. Fast forward one week. I went to the party and had a good time, although she had an out of town girlfriend in town as well who she was also trying to entertain, so her attention was divided between us and her other guests. Eventually, all of the guests left, and her roommates went to bed, so it was just me, unsaid girl, and her out of town friend watching tv. This was good, but she never sat close to me on the couch. And when she did sit next to me, she spent the whole time on her computer finishing up some work. Right before I left, she also spent about 30 minutes upstairs in her bedroom changing into her pajamas while I sat downstairs talking with her friend. She offered to drive me home before going up to change, but I could tell she really didn't want to. I also didn't think it would be fair for her to do so because I don't live nearby and she had to get up early the next morning to go to work, so I called a cab. Before I left, she thanked me for coming, sent me home with some food and wine, and said that we would talk later. I was kind of confused about what was going on because she had just run downstairs right before my cab arrived but had spent the previous 30 minutes upstairs in her bedroom--I was actually just about to go up and knock on her bedroom door when she came downstairs to make sure that I got to say goodbye to her before I left--, so I just gave her a hug, thanked her for inviting me, and said that I had a great time. Earlier in the night, she mentioned that she really wanted to see a particular movie. I had never heard of the movie but found out that it was premiering a couple of days later when I checked the internet the next day. So, about three days later, I texted her and asked if she wanted to see the movie. The day after that was Thanksgiving, and I texted her again and to wish her a happy Thanksgiving. I haven't received a response to either text. We're both very busy (in the medical field), so I understand that she may not reply immediately, but it's takes minimal time to reply to a text. Maybe she has her reasons for not replying, but I'm doubtful about that, especially when I invited her to go to a movie I know for a fact she really wants to see. I sometimes wonder if a lack of physicality is the problem. There has always been a lot of mutual physical attraction, but we have never had sex. I always tell myself that I'll try to be more physical with her, but I never feel that she demonstrates enough sustained interest for me to feel comfortable doing so. I also think she may be a virgin, and I know that she got very mad at a mutual friend of ours who tried to make a move on her before we started dating. I'm not going to pretend I'm any kind of Don Juan myself, but I've dated a fair number of girls, and she's the only one with whom I can never tell where I stand becuase the messages are so mixed. I would just give up, but I'm very picky, and I think she's one of the most beautiful women I've ever met. She also has a lot going for her. I've told her I feel this way, although it was a couple of years ago. Do I assume that no response to several texts is a negative, or do I keep calling/texting until she says no? Should I tell her again how I feel, as it's been several years since I've done so and she may not be sure of my intentions? Since I don't want to call or text too often, I was planning to call her sometime this week and ask about the movie if I don't hear back beforehand. I'd be very appreciative of any assessments on the situation and/or advice on how to proceed. Thanks in advance!

 

 

Your thread asks women for their wisdom, and I am a guy, but it appears to me she has you clearly categorized as a friend.

 

You say there is a lot of mutual physical attraction, but I do not see it in your account of the relationship as it is. Several years of dates??? Really??? They do not sound like she sees them as dating, more like hanging out. You're a nice guy and she likes you but not in "that way." This situation has happened to me, as well, and it sucks. But there it is.

 

I think it is very tough (and somewhat frustrating, even emasculating) to try and continue seeing someone you are strongly attracted to if she sees you only as a friend. Even though you can enjoy great times and each other's company, the situation doesn't go where guy-girl relationships need to go. (I do not mean guy-girl friendships are impossible, a la When Harry Met Sally, but they are very frustrating if you feel physical attraction/desire).

 

One thing you can do to try to resolve your dilemma, is not to try to talk about it, but seriously to put some moves on her when the situation is right, and see how she responds. If she does not go for the physical, then you can either accept her platonic friendship and be satisified with it, or move on.

 

Good luck.

[Cee]

When you expressed interest in her two years ago, what did she say?

 

Why not have a frank and honest discussion with her the next time you get together? It's not like she's a total stranger. There's no need for you to be hanging on like this. If you don't feel comfortable talking to her, then it's probably best to move on completely.

[drdarwin]

Thanks, Daphne. I'm not that young (29), but I'm definitely tiring of this. I would love to meet someone who is just as much of a catch, but that honestly hasn't happened since I've met her. And I absolutely refuse to settle at this point. I also don't like to date just to date, because, as a medical resident, I don't have the money for it. If I think there is potential, however, I am all about going on some dates. Since I don't know who else to chase, I just continue to chase her. Because I feel like I should probably move on, I'm thinking about just telling her how I feel again and then cutting it off. I'm not sure it will change anything, but I think every rejection makes the next one a little easier, and it will also make it easier to express my feelings toward someone else in the future.

[drdarwin]

Your thread asks women for their wisdom, and I am a guy, but it appears to me she has you clearly categorized as a friend.

 

You say there is a lot of mutual physical attraction, but I do not see it in your account of the relationship as it is. Several years of dates??? Really??? They do not sound like she sees them as dating, more like hanging out. You're a nice guy and she likes you but not in "that way." This situation has happened to me, as well, and it sucks. But there it is.

 

I think it is very tough (and somewhat frustrating, even emasculating) to try and continue seeing someone you are strongly attracted to if she sees you only as a friend. Even though you can enjoy great times and each other's company, the situation doesn't go where guy-girl relationships need to go. (I do not mean guy-girl friendships are impossible, a la When Harry Met Sally, but they are very frustrating if you feel physical attraction/desire).

 

One thing you can do to try to resolve your dilemma, is not to try to talk about it, but seriously to put some moves on her when the situation is right, and see how she responds. If she does not go for the physical, then you can either accept her platonic friendship and be satisified with it, or move on.

 

Good luck.

 

Yeah, you may be right, but when we "hang out" at the movies, for example, she'll lean into me and we'll flirt a lot. I don't do that with any of my other female friends. I thought maybe she was somewhat more interested now after inviting me to her T-giving party, because I don't know any of her friends, and I assumed she wouldn't want to deal with all of the questions, etc. they would ask her afterward about me unless she had some genuine interest. She also spent most of the night talking with me and her out of town friend and had no problem with me staying over until late. With all that said, she then obviously didn't have it mind that we were going to snuggle or make out considering her actions at that point. I maybe should have tried to kiss her when I left, but she had just run down from her bedroom, so it would have felt very forced. I kind of feel like a big pu$$y for not making a move, but it's complicated because I know her so well and she never gives me enough sustained positive signals.

[drdarwin]

When you expressed interest in her two years ago, what did she say?

 

Why not have a frank and honest discussion with her the next time you get together? It's not like she's a total stranger. There's no need for you to be hanging on like this. If you don't feel comfortable talking to her, then it's probably best to move on completely.

 

She said she was flattered, etc. but didn't know if it would work out because we were in our final year of school and weren't sure where we would end up afterward.

[runner]

She said she was flattered, etc. but didn't know if it would work out because we were in our final year of school and weren't sure where we would end up afterward.

 

it's all or nothing, dude. get her off the pedestal, move on, and stop making excuses (money, time, etc.) for not dating new girls.

Edited November 28, 2010 by runner
yea i'm not a girl but i couldn't help but chime in

[drdarwin]

I also should mention that we never discuss if we're dating other people. The few times that I've seen her when I've been with someone else, she either avoided talking to me or just said "Hi" and kept going, so she doesn't seem to like that or to be happy for me, which I would expect of a friend. On the other hand, she has done some things for me (e.g., spent an afternoon helping me move things since I don't have a car) that only a good friend would do.

 

I only saw her on a hanging out/out on a date with someone once, and, when she saw me, she left immediately after seeing me. She then came back to the place about an hour later to study and talked to me for a while. More recently, she invited a guy I don't know to a party of hers where she knew I would be. At the party, she showed him a lot of interest and was dancing mostly with him, etc., so I was assuming it was someone she liked. (I hadn't seen her for a while at that point.) I got tired of being there and decided to leave. When I told her I was taking off, she seemed all upset and was insisting I stay. I was confused and fed up with what was going on, so I left anyway.

 

The next day, she texted me and asked if I wanted to see a movie. We saw it, snuggled a little, and had a decent time. When I texted her to inquire if she wanted to do something the next weekend, though, I didn't hear back for two weeks.

 

As best I can tell, I'm somewhere between a friend and option B. She likes me enough to go out with sometimes, but she doesn't want to commit too much time. She would also like for me to be single and around just in case.

 

I still haven't received a response to the texts I sent a couple of days ago. Should I wait for her to contact me at this point? If I get tired of waiting, is it unreasonable for me to tell her how I feel and tell her that I want to know where I stand (rather than just assuming the above)?

Edited November 28, 2010 by drdarwin

[gentlewaters]

Yeah... it is possible she sees you as a friend. Could you just be her friend and not worry about anything about "dating" until later? She sounds busy and not all that interested in a relationship right now. I am thinking probably if you can, it's best for you to just see her as a friend.

Edited November 28, 2010 by gentlewaters

[Graceful]

drdarwin,

 

Your only option now is to try calling her one last time, asking her if she has time to get together for something as simple as coffee, and putting all your cards on the table. You are in the "friend zone" right now, or back up guy for when she has time, but I don't like the way she is treating you if this is the way she treats someone she likes!

 

You sound very sincere and you've tried very hard to accommodate her, but she is treating you like she is luke warm, and that's worse than cold. At least if she were cold, you could have just let her go by now.

 

Some women play hard to get, but I don't think that's what she is doing. She's just not sure what she wants from you, she's busy ... and she knows you'll keep coming around, which is why she leaves you hanging.

 

See if you can meet her for coffee, even if you have to get up real early to meet her. Then just tell her the truth. You're very fond of her, you'd like to get to know her, you would just like to know how she feels about dating you and if she wants to put the effort into getting to know you on a deeper level. I am very upset she treated you the way she did when you attended her get together by ignoring you, for crying out loud, she invited you, the least thing she could have done was be polite. I don't want you to put up with that sort of treatment much longer. If she isn't all the way interested in getting to know you better, then let her go. AND stop calling. You can't go on this way, she sounds special, but so do you. You've already swallowed enough of your pride; please don't let the rest of it go before you move on.

Good luck.

[runner]

As best I can tell, I'm somewhere between a friend and option B. She likes me enough to go out with sometimes, but she doesn't want to commit too much time. She would also like for me to be single and around just in case.

 

and this really is nowhere to be. if you want her friendship then be her friend- and she can tag along while you and your real girlfriend are out. don't be option B at her leisure.

[drdarwin]

drdarwin,

 

Your only option now is to try calling her one last time, asking her if she has time to get together for something as simple as coffee, and putting all your cards on the table. You are in the "friend zone" right now, or back up guy for when she has time, but I don't like the way she is treating you if this is the way she treats someone she likes!

 

You sound very sincere and you've tried very hard to accommodate her, but she is treating you like she is luke warm, and that's worse than cold. At least if she were cold, you could have just let her go by now.

 

Some women play hard to get, but I don't think that's what she is doing. She's just not sure what she wants from you, she's busy ... and she knows you'll keep coming around, which is why she leaves you hanging.

 

See if you can meet her for coffee, even if you have to get up real early to meet her. Then just tell her the truth. You're very fond of her, you'd like to get to know her, you would just like to know how she feels about dating you and if she wants to put the effort into getting to know you on a deeper level. I am very upset she treated you the way she did when you attended her get together by ignoring you, for crying out loud, she invited you, the least thing she could have done was be polite. I don't want you to put up with that sort of treatment much longer. If she isn't all the way interested in getting to know you better, then let her go. AND stop calling. You can't go on this way, she sounds special, but so do you. You've already swallowed enough of your pride; please don't let the rest of it go before you move on.

Good luck.

 

Thanks for your concern. I agree that it would be best to be open and honest with her. If I can't see her in person, can I tell her this on the phone? We're both medical residents, so it can be difficult to find common times of availability. I definitely don't want to leave a voicemail or send an email, but I'm also wondering how I would proceed if I miss her when I call or she can't/doesn't want to meet up.

[drdarwin]

and this really is nowhere to be. if you want her friendship then be her friend- and she can tag along while you and your real girlfriend are out. don't be option B at her leisure.

 

i like your style. it's funny, because she would be upset/pissed if i had a party, invited her, and then introduced her to my girlfriend. if we're "friends", she would be happy for me. i guess girls just like to have a safety. i honestly don't care about a safety. i'm either interested or i'm not, and i'd rather not waste my time if i'm not interested, so this situation confuses me. maybe that's just because i'm a guy. i also think she maybe realizes i'm close to as a good of a catch as she can get and doesn't want me out of the picture.

[runner]

well you're not a pair of shoes that she can store in the closet and use in case her usual pair are broken. you're human, you have your needs, and apparently, she isn't what you want.

 

and yes, some girls like "to have a safety" and string guys along- don't fall into that.

 

if she gets pissed at you for haveing sexytime with another girl, well, sucks to be her then

[drdarwin]

well you're not a pair of shoes that she can store in the closet and use in case her usual pair are broken. you're human, you have your needs, and apparently, she isn't what you want.

 

and yes, some girls like "to have a safety" and string guys along- don't fall into that.

 

if she gets pissed at you for haveing sexytime with another girl, well, sucks to be her then

 

Hey runner, even though just dropping things is an option, I feel like the mature thing to do is to be upfront with her and ask her where she stands (even though I have a decent idea). If I can't see her in person, is doing this via the phone reasonable? Someone advised buying a rose and dropping by her place, which is a decent idea and very direct. The problem is, I don't live nearby, so I'd have to know when she's home. We're both also very busy working in hospitals, so it can be difficult to find common times of availability. She has roommates, too, so that makes things a little more complicated. I definitely don't want to leave a voicemail or send an email, but I'm also wondering how I would proceed if I miss her when I call or she can't/doesn't want to meet up.

[drdarwin]

Hey runner, even though just dropping things is an option, I feel like the mature thing to do is to be upfront with her and ask her where she stands (even though I have a decent idea). If I can't see her in person, is doing this via the phone reasonable? Someone advised buying a rose and dropping by her place, which is a decent idea and very direct. The problem is, I don't live nearby, so I'd have to know when she's home. We're both also very busy working in hospitals, so it can be difficult to find common times of availability. She has roommates, too, so that makes things a little more complicated. I definitely don't want to leave a voicemail or send an email, but I'm also wondering how I would proceed if I miss her when I call or she can't/doesn't want to meet up.

 

Any ideas on this one? Thanks.