I feel so shaken up

[Star Gazer]

But you can't figure out IN TWO DATES whether or not a guy is worthy of a relationship, no matter how he makes you feel.

 

You'd agree though that you can tell if a guy is NOT relationship material in 2 dates. And with this guy, she should have.

 

Knowing full well that the guy is a heavy drug user and apparently tried very hard to get her into bed (she just posted this is the other thread), she decided she was falling in love with him after 2 dates. Why? He had "an edge."

 

I'm really not sure OG is capable of taking LS's advice. I think we're here more as a diary than anything.

[Kamille]

You'd agree though that you can tell if a guy is NOT relationship material in 2 dates. And with this guy, she should have.

 

 

I definitely agree she sould have cut that guy loose when she found out about the drugs & drinking and the "pressuring for sex". OG completely disempowers herself by putting way too much focus on how guys make her feel, and not enough on who guys are. She doesn't seem to understand what "relationship material" means, be it as a way to present herself to men, or as a way to filter the men she dates.

Edited November 24, 2010 by Kamille

[northern_sky]

I think this is the real problem. I'm pretty much the same age as you, and when a guy dumps me I find it difficult to accept that he was just an idiot and move on. What gets me is this feeling that "I thought it was finally my turn, but it never is". It's a general depression about not having a loving relationship, not a feeling of loss over one specific man, especially if the man in question was obviously a loser.

 

My age doesn't help. When I was younger, I felt less stressed about it all because I felt hopeful that I'd eventually meet someone; now I feel stressed that every rejection just takes me closer to the point of being too old to marry and have a family. The fact that it's "never my turn" is becoming increasingly worrying. If a guy is a jerk, I don't want him back; I just feel bad because yet again I haven't met the right man.

 

Acknowledging the fact that it's a feeling about my own age and singledom rather than a feeling about a particular man actually helps. It makes me realise that this is my own feeling (which I can deal with and control) not a feeling caused by a man (which is outside my control). I just need to relax and be less attached to the idea of meeting someone and having things work out for me.

 

EXACTLY. This is what people don't seem to understand about OG. It's not about the individual guy for her, it's about what she perceives that guy to represent in terms of yet another "failure" in a long series of disappointments. But this is also fallacious thinking, because even though it trivializes the individual, it gives too much weight to the outcome of her interaction with him (not good).

 

Her trivialization of the individual is another problem that leads to a lack of pickiness. Most women are very picky. OG is picky in some ways, but not picky enough in others. She'll give guys chances who other women would dismiss. Often she does this because she believes the guy can give her the love and acceptance she craves, even when the guy has little in common with her or has some obvious problems of his own.

 

For example, this dude had some disturbing things in his profile that OG recognized but chose to set aside where a lot of other women would have nexted him. Because she desires so much to be in a loving relationship, she let herself get taken in by his gestures despite these red flags.

 

Another big draw for OG is physical attraction. With the last guy she dated, she continued to see him for awhile because she found him very attractive despite the fact that he bored her to death and they had little in common.

 

I think with this new guy she was trying to break her pattern by giving a guy a chance who is average looking, which is a step in the right direction, and I'm proud of her for that . But it's hard to change a habit all at once. She was less picky about his looks, but not picky enough about his personality. When she said they had so much in common, like the fact that they both liked "Dexter", my alarm bells went off. I remember thinking to myself that a shared appreciation for a popular show like Dexter should hardly be even one basis for a relationship. I was concerned she was setting herself up for a crash.

 

Because OG over-invests in bad matches, she ends up accumulating more heartbreak than is normal. Most dating experiences DO fizzle out, but other women either next a guy or never let themselves get invested before things sour. They also externalize the disappointments. This guy wasn't good enough for me or we weren't compatible rather than there is something inherently wrong with me that makes me unloveable. They go into dating accepting that lots of frog-kissing is just part of the process. Instead OG internalizes it as some personal failure, when it's perfectly normal.

 

In short, the answer for OG is to be pickier. If a guy is waving red flags, she should either next him or emotionally divest. She should also pay more attention to a guy's personality and behavior rather than whether he is showering her in compliments and attention. And she really needs to be warier of guys who show too much interest too fast. She has all the perceptive abilities she needs. She just needs to apply them at the right times to the right ends.

 

I hope this is the take away for her from this experience. I really can't wait for her to find a loving, healthy relationship, and I know it will happen.

[northern_sky]

All men aren't like this guy, or other guys you've dated, but you have to give yourself the chance to find that out. If you go on dates simply picking faults, you'll never find anyone because no one will be able to meet your standards and expectations if you keep raising the benchmark. If a guy cancels once and tries to rearrange, think 'life happens, we'll rearrange.' If he continues to be flaky, drop him. But rather than reading all sorts into things maybe it would be better to stop imagining the worst, and just go with it. Tread carefully, but not so carefully that you stop yourself enjoying it.

 

Wrong, the answer is for OG to be pickier, not less picky. I agree that she may be a tad bit too dismissive when it comes to a guy's flakiness (and I said a tad), but I think she needs to be way pickier when it comes to a guy's overall personality traits.

[Mad Max]

Wrong, the answer is for OG to be pickier, not less picky. I agree that she may be a tad bit too dismissive when it comes to a guy's flakiness (and I said a tad), but I think she needs to be way pickier when it comes to a guy's overall personality traits.

 

 

She's picky enough as it is. She's always looking for reasons to dump a guy and using double standards. Star Gazer has called her out on it multiple times in the past.

[northern_sky]

 

If anything, I think that I am not being discerning enough. Next time some guy pulls a 48 hour response lag - it will be instantly over.

 

I don't see how giving someone the benefit of the doubt has ever umm benefited me.

 

Yep. You're not. Your intuition tends to be dead on and it causes you a lot of grief, because you agonize over whether to follow it. Then you end up not following it only to be disappointed. Next time just go with your gut.

 

But you also need to apply your intuition to more than just whether the guy is into you. Pay attention to his other qualities and whether they're compatible.

[northern_sky]

She's picky enough as it is. She's always looking for reasons to dump a guy and using double standards. Star Gazer has called her out on it multiple times in the past.

 

She's actually very un-picky when it comes to the guy's personality traits. She'll give guys chances whom she has nothing or little in common with just because she hopes he can give her love. You should read through some of her past threads and you'll see this pattern.

[northern_sky]

 

2) Regarding the guy you posted the other thread about - after reading all the details you disclosed to us later regarding his drug use and such, and him being in love with his ex, yes, he certainly isn't right for you. But that isn't the point. The point is that before you even found everything out, you were considering dropping him just because he declined a date because he had prior arrangements with friends. How exactly would it have benefited you to break things off then instead of now? Did the one more date you went on cost you that much more in terms of time, money, or emotional investment? No - I think you just fear rejection so much that if you feel there is even a slightest chance that the relationship will not work, you want to be the one to break it off and not him. Preemptive strike.

 

Now, think how these two points would serve you poorly in a LTR such as that which you hope to achieve. Imagine you've been together for three months and everything is going fine. One night, he does something undesirable in your eyes, such as refuses intimacy, is moody and distant, or chooses to go out with his friends over you. Do you wait and see, or would you preemptively end the relationship because you feel it is 'a sign'?

 

Nah, she knew about the drug use before their second date. That's when she should have dropped him. And yes, the point very much is whether he is right for her, which he clearly wasn't (even before their second date).

[northern_sky]

I agree you aren't discerning enough, but I think you have no idea what constitutes proper discernment. You're too focused on judging men's interest level, and not concerned enough about evaluating men's relationship potential. This last guy spent the weekend passed out on a mix of beer and LSD... Clearly, he's a bit of a mess right now and unlikely to be in a frame of mind to maintain a healthy relationship. Yet, you were willing to overlook all that because he made you feel good.

 

You are so anxious about meeting someone that it's causing you to filter out the wrong things. Anxiety notoriously makes us self-centered. I'm quoting my therapist here. When we're anxious, we tend to internalize and interpret events in self-centered ways. Your anxiety is making you focus on whether or not men are into you, at the expense of you figuring out what qualities a man needs to have in order to maintain a relationship. IMO, that is why it has yet to be your turn.

 

Relationship-minded people seek relationship-minded people: that is to say, people who are grounded, get to know someone before becoming too emotionally invested, show a capacity to handle conflict in productive ways, have their lives together. If a guy had told me he spent a weekend passed out on beer and LSD, I would have run the other way.

 

But you can't figure out IN TWO DATES whether or not a guy is worthy of a relationship, no matter how he makes you feel. I was crazy about bf from day one, which only meant I made extra effort to stay grounded: hitting the gym, making and keeping commitments with friends, letting him take the lead - Note: he only contacted me about twice a week at the beginning-. I reread the emails we exchanged the first month we were together and one thing stood out to me: I was clear and obvious about how much I liked him. I had figured, as someone else said on N_S's thread, that I didn't have time to waste with little boys who couldn't handle a woman being into them. Being into him, however, didn't mean jumping in with my eyes closed. It means, as I said, making the extra effort to make sure I didn't get too emotionally invested too fast.

 

One thing strikes me about this thread: you present yourself as if you have no control over: your work and the way men treat you. You do. You have control over yourself. If you don't want to give a guy a chance if he bails on you once, then do so. But more importantly, do everything in your power to gain control of your emotions: yoga helps with that. Realizing that insta-relationships are mostly a myth will also helps. It takes awhile for two people to get to know each other enough to figure out if they are compatible. For me, it usually takes 3-6 months. So stop thinking "my turn is finally here" within two dates. Don't allow yourself to think that until YOU've assessed whether or not a guy is 1) compatible 2) relationship material.

 

 

 

Like Els, apart from this guy, I would be interested to know when you've given someone the benefit of the doubt.

 

Also, note: you posted yesterday that you realize now that something was wrong with someone being so forward so fast. I think that's the valuable lesson here. If someone shows a strong interest too fast, there's usually an underlying issue. The thing about interest is that it SHOULD build over time, as you and a guy get to know each other. That's precisely why the "He took six hours to answer my text" isn't a proper gage of potential. Pay less attention to "interest" and more to "compatibility" and "relationship-material". By doing this, you will stop making the process all about you and start paying attention to these men.

 

I read your post after I wrote mine, but it seems like we're making exactly the same points.

 

The only thing I disagree with is whether you can tell if somebody is compatible with you after two dates. I believe you can figure out whether somebody is NOT compatible with you, but not definitively whether they ARE.

 

I hope OG listens.

[Citizen Erased]

She's actually very un-picky when it comes to the guy's personality traits. She'll give guys chances whom she has nothing or little in common with just because she hopes he can give her love. You should read through some of her past threads and you'll see this pattern.

 

I agree with what you're saying. And Max. OG is picky when it comes to superficial traits, but doesn't seem to be so much with what's underneath. That's where she needs to be pickier. You aren't going to have an incredibly fulfilling and happy relationship with a drug user/binge drinker that still has a soft spot for his ex. She shouldn't settle for these people when what she's looking for is a LTR.

[Star Gazer]

To summarize: Whether he's interested shouldn't matter if he's not relationship material, you should get out of there if he's not a quality, relationship material guy. The "relationship material" inquiry should come first and remain of primary importance over how long it takes a guy to respond to a text during the period of the first few dates.

[Mme. Chaucer]

I'm sorry, but being "picky" is not going to touch upon the issues that are standing in the way of OG (excuse us for talking about you as if you are not here ... you're not though!) having a loving relationship.

 

Shadow, I am surprised at how cavalier you seem when you write about OG's "trivializing" of the individual men who she comes in contact with. It could be okay, I guess, if you're a completely self satisfied narcissist - but NOT in the context of a search for love.

 

Love involves TWO PEOPLE. Not just one person who has a list of deep needs and a desire to find some warm compliant body who will fill in all those blanks.

 

Also, I doubt with great vigor that OG's intuition is "dead on" or even "on" at all. I have seen not one sign of good intuition. I've seen giddiness when her ego is getting stroked, and big emotional spin-out when it's not. A person who is very invested in control, and indulgent of fantasies and emotional binges cannot be quiet enough to hear their own intuition. CANNOT. OR, to learn about another human being, not to even mention to develop some entity known as a "relationship" with one.

 

I do not see looking for love, or anything resembling openness for love. I recognize a desperate search for external validation. That has nothing to do with love. I don't even think love can be possible in such an environment. Whatever "pickiness" or intuition is at play is functioning to discern whether a guy is able to validate OG, only.

 

I am sorry if I seem harsh, but I am weary of you, OG, going on about guys doing you wrong or your "suffering" and "sensitivity" when you have really never shown any signs, here on LS, of looking into yourself for the solutions to your dilemmas.

 

Can you even imagine what people who really are in relationships, who "love," must feel when their love is betrayed? Or dies, or somehow turns out way different than promised? People who are already committed, with kids maybe? If you can't handle some dating bumps gracefully or even sort of appropriately, how would you handle a relationship?

 

Really, when people say "work on yourself," a lot of them know what they are talking about ... like me. I mean, I personally had to work on myself a great deal, (and it felt terrible), to become a person ready and worthy to be in a healthy relationship with another fine human being. I have to check myself for "backsliding" behavior every single day. I believe that if you are going to have a different life where love is concerned, you will need to do the same.

 

If you are really "giving up," like you say, then embrace the other parts of your life and don't use your experiences in this department as excuses for self indulgence, bitterness, etc.

 

It's up to you; please be accountable for yourself and where you find yourself. The red flags waving in your face are there to alert YOU to YOUR OWN SELF DEFEATING PATTERNS.

[northern_sky]

I'm sorry, but being "picky" is not going to touch upon the issues that are standing in the way of OG (excuse us for talking about you as if you are not here ... you're not though!) having a loving relationship.

 

Shadow, I am surprised at how cavalier you seem when you write about OG's "trivializing" of the individual men who she comes in contact with. It could be okay, I guess, if you're a completely self satisfied narcissist - but NOT in the context of a search for love.

 

 

How is this at all cavalier?

 

Her trivialization of the individual is another problem that leads to a lack of pickiness.

 

Did you even read the rest of my post? The whole point I was getting at is that she needs to be pickier about a guy's deeper personality traits rather than whether he's into her.

 

In terms of OG's intuition, she has a lot of insight when it comes to other people and their relationships. I've also heard her say insightful things about herself. She just has trouble applying that insight to her own experiences.

 

I feel like you accuse me and OG of seeing in things in black and white, yet your advice tends to oscillate between those extremes.

Edited November 24, 2010 by northern_sky

[Surrealist]

I was married for 8 years and on the surface, you'd think that I have every right to blame the other for the demise of the relationship. However, I learnt some things about myself that certainly need working on and being aware of those things will make me more conscious of it in any future relationship.

 

Man, the dating part? It's child's play!

 

Wait until you are in an LTR or marriage and see what you (general not just OP) learn about yourself in that situation. It can be great but it takes two mature, pretty level-headed people to make it work!

 

OG as much as I like her and enjoy reading her posts, I have to agree with some of the more prudent people here who have experience in LTRs, that she is not ready for one. Not a dig at all. It is reality!

 

Also OG, you seeking out such guys for a loving relationship, as you described ie: drug taking and alcohol issues, is sure certainty that you will never get into an LTR no matter how much chemistry you have. These types of people are not suitable for LTRs.

 

I'm not being prudent here either, I started smoking pot way back in 1984 and had drinking problems going back even further. Wasn't until my mid 20s I got this under control and haven't touched pot at all for over 3 years and dont care to. Typical bad boy behaviour is not in any way healthy nor will provide a prudent healthy woman a viable loving relationship. It just will not happen. Attempt to find out otherwise but I pretty much guarantee you will still be here on this forum when you are 40 years old and beyond still searching for that elusive loving partner.

[Mme. Chaucer]

How is this at all cavalier?

 

Her trivialization of the individual is another problem that leads to a lack of pickiness.

 

Did you even read the rest of my post? The whole point I was getting at is that she needs to be pickier about a guy's deeper personality traits rather than whether he's into her.

 

I found it to be cavalier because I do not equate "trivialization" of a potential partner with "pickiness" in any way, shape or form.

 

Trivializing an individual's personhood completely cancels all potential for any kind of relationship at all, ever, in any way. Being more "picky" is not even in the same realm. There is no picky or unpicky if you don't even really recognize a person as a fellow human being.

 

Okay, sorry for the cross talk. I'm out!

[northern_sky]

I found it to be cavalier because I do not equate "trivialization" of a potential partner with "pickiness" in any way, shape or form.

 

Trivializing an individual's personhood completely cancels all potential for any kind of relationship at all, ever, in any way. Being more "picky" is not even in the same realm. There is no picky or unpicky if you don't even really recognize a person as a fellow human being.

 

Okay, sorry for the cross talk. I'm out!

 

You're overreacting to my word choice.

 

On the first couple of dates, it's natural to view somebody from a detached perspective. If you don't, you're more liable to make bad choices and to get hurt. That doesn't mean you should treat them without respect of course.

 

Most people DO NOT feel a personal connection or strong empathy to somebody's personality traits after a date. Instead, they're paying attention to those traits to assess whether there is long term potential and compatibility. By your logic, those people are also dehumanizing the other by being self-serving and strategic.

 

It is only with time that people build an attachment to those traits and real empathy for the other person.

 

I think there are a few extraordinary individuals like Kamille , who can feel strong empathy for strangers almost immediately. But most people need time for that to develop.

 

Yet again, I feel like you're jumping to extremes, proclaiming OG as a narcissist. While I grant that you have some good points, the truth of her psychological makeup is more complex.

Edited November 24, 2010 by northern_sky

[sb129]

There is some fabulous advice on this thread. SG, M Chaucer and Elswyth- nice work.

 

OG, I know you think its your "turn" to be happy, but why can't you be happy WITHOUT a guy?

 

You can't be truly happy in a R without being happy with yourself.

 

Others are right when they say that in a sense this is only the tip of the iceberg.

 

Being married is no picnic at times. You HAVE to accept the others faults, otherwise you would go insane.

[Els]

Nah, she knew about the drug use before their second date. That's when she should have dropped him. And yes, the point very much is whether he is right for her, which he clearly wasn't (even before their second date).

 

No, Shadow, my point was the principle of things: She was considering dropping him solely because he took a long time to text her and had stuff on with his mates. I'm not sure if subconsciously the fact that she knew about his drug problem affected her decision - I'm just taking her posts at face value. If the drug problem did cause her to want to drop him, I'll say good for her. But if she really did disregard the drug problem and wanted to drop him just because of the 'signs'... that's even worse.

 

I think M Chaucher hit the nail on the head perfectly when she said that aside from superficial traits, the most important thing OG considers in a guy is how infatuated he is with her - yes, infatuated. She has an incredibly high standard of 'how a guy should treat a woman he's interested in', based on her multiple posts across the board. Basically, that standard allows for no slack. He has a prior arrangement with friends? He'd better cancel it just to go on a (FIRST!!) date with her, otherwise he's not into her and should be axed. He takes a couple days to answer a (non-critical) text message? Not into her, should be axed.

 

Any guy is bound to fail, sooner or later. Unless he is completely, hopelessly infatuated with her, checks his phone every hour just to see if there's a text from her, would drop his friends at a snap of the fingers from her, etc. And that doesn't bode well for a relationship either.

Edited November 25, 2010 by Elswyth

[OceanGirl]

Ahh. I read all the posts and there is some good advice but there are people who are completely missing the boat as usual.

 

Shadow's advice was/is basically spot on. She probably knows me a bit better because we correspond privately but still I am glad that she took the time and offered me her insights in a kind manner.

 

I will address some things in the bullet form:

 

 

• I deliberately didn't mention drugs/alcohol because I knew exactly what type of reaction I will get (isn't that kind of intuitive Of course passing out for days at the time is not a plus for me nor does it make someone LTR potential. I think I clarified that I was NOT looking for anything serious with him but everyone seems to have missed that point. I have also never dated anyone with drug/alcohol problem so this is by no means a pattern for me. Basically, at this point it is irrelevant and you should all let it go.
  

 

• I agree with looking at deeper personality traits more rather than surface ones. But again you are all missing something. Even if a guy is THE PERFECT LTR material, it is pretty irrelevant if he is NOT INTERESTED IN ME. My logic is to evaluate interest first and then look for deeper compatibility (this is something you can't see on the first few dates anyway).
  

 

• Comments about being narcissistic are laughable. I am probably the exact opposite of narcissistic.
  

 

• Working on myself in vacuum doesn't work. I am just wasting more time that I could be spending looking for a relationship. I took a good 2 years break from dating to just chill and pursue other interests. It didn't help me ONE BIT. All it did is make me more anxious when I got back into it. On my first few dates after the break, I pretty much nearly had a panic attack. Given my age, I also can't afford to take breaks. I need to learn by doing.
  

 

• Posting my problems and having randoms judge me is probably counter productive at this point. I use LS as an outlet where I voice my genuine feelings but I have reached the stage where it's doing more harm than good. Not to mention that some posters bring their personal biases into giving advice. Lots of regulars on here keep up a certain image and still very much censor what they post, choosing not go in depth about their problems. Of course they will come across as more "together" than me.
  

 

• For those of you that said that how I will be able to handle a LTR break down if I am this affected after few dates: again you are really not reading what I am saying. I HAVE NEVER HAD A MUTUALLY LOVING RELATIONSHIP FOR ANY SIGNIFICANT PERIOD OF TIME. At 31, do you know how depressing that is? I would feel a lot better if I at least experienced this for a little while. IT would actually make things easier on me, not harder. As for marriage taking work, I am willing to invest and do all the work imaginable if I can only have a relationship with someone who returned my affection.
  

In closing, this is going ot be my last LS post in a long time. I am not going to keep going back to something that is depressing me even further and keeps dragging me down by exaturagging all the negative aspects of my personality without acknowledging the positives.

 

Good bye.

[Eeyore79]

It was the IDEA of having someone, the idea of finally settling in a loving relationship that I so desparetly want.

 

I know all about this, being in the same situation myself. It took me a long time to figure it out in my head, so hopefully I can share some insights which might seem obvious to other people - they certainly didn't seem obvious to me though!

 

1) Be more picky.

Yep, more picky! This seems counter-intuitive when you're feeling desperate, but really it makes sense. You don't have time to waste, so you need to reject the losers as fast as possible in order to move on to better prospects. You know what you're looking for, so if a guy doesn't fit that, dump him and move on. When you're desperate and lonely, the temptation is to stick with a bad relationship because you don't want to be alone, but in fact you would be better off moving on to a better relationship asap and not wasting your time.

 

2) Think about whether a guy is what you want, not just about whether he wants you.

This is the part I found difficult. I was so desperate for love and acceptance that I jumped on any guy who seemed prepared to offer it, even if he wasn't what I wanted or wasn't a good relationship prospect. You need to dump anyone who doesn't meet your criteria - don't get sucked into dating an unsuitable man simply because he pays you the attention you're craving.

 

3) Rethink your criteria for what you want in a man.

This was a key point for me, because previously I was dating the wrong type of men. I was following my instinctual attractions instead of consciously analysing whether a guy was what I wanted, and I was ending up with cute guys who liked to party but offered no long term relationship prospects, or stable but boring men who paid me attention but who I had no real interest in. I could have ruled out a lot of the guys I wasted my time on before I even dated them!

 

I decided I could deal with someone being shy/overweight/geeky, or not gorgeous/wealthy/outgoing, but I would not put up with someone being flaky, unpleasant, uncaring, or otherwise not the sort of human being I would want to raise my child. My main criteria were that he should be a decent person who I found interesting and somewhat attractive, should make an effort to keep in touch with me and spend time with me, should not cause a load of drama and insecurity, and should be interested in having a lasting relationship. I de-prioritised physical attractiveness in favour of finding someone who was beautiful on the inside.

 

So I re-evaluated what I wanted in a man, and started dumping anyone who showed they weren't relationship material. I went through more boyfriends in a year than I'd had in the previous several years, and I always did the dumping. This made me realise that my people-picker had been broken, because previously I was interested in guys who pushed my sexual attraction buttons but really weren't good people, or guys who paid me attention and met my desperate need to be loved but who I had no real interest in.

 

Eventually I started dating someone who is the nicest person I've ever met; he's kind and decent and trustworthy, intelligent and interesting. He's shy and a bit dorky, but it's cute Once upon a time I probably wouldn't have fallen in love with him, because I wouldn't have considered him "hot" or "exciting" enough, but as it stands I'm really happy with him and have reasonable hopes that things might work out

[Els]

Good luck, then. You may not believe it, but many of us only wish you the best.

[Surrealist]

Well I don't want you to go as I said, I really like reading your posts. They are quite interesting and entertaining at times. But then having a break from here might not be a bad thing either!

 

I find your point about having a break from dating for 2 years and not helping you one bit interesting because I think you have a good point that I can identify.

 

You mention you haven't had a relationship for any significant period of time....

 

How long was your longest relationship? I'm genuinely interested.

Edited November 25, 2010 by Surrealist

[Star Gazer]

I find your point about having a break from dating for 2 years and not helping you one bit interesting because I think you have a good point that I can identify.

 

You mention you haven't had a relationship for any significant period of time....

 

How long was your longest relationship? I'm genuinely interested.

 

OG did not take a break from dating. Based on her own posts here, she's never had a break. She's been dating continuously since she was 16.

 

Her longest relationship was a "few months."

[Kamille]

I think taking a break from LS is a good idea. Spend some time trying to get in touch with your own inner voice and gut feeling. I think we plant more doubts in your head than what you need.

 

I also urge you to still put figuring compatibility out before putting too much emphasis on making sure a guy is "high interest". As long as a guy is making plans to see you, assume he's interested enough... to get to know you some more. That's all you need as you get to know someone and figure out if they're the right fit for you. With the right guy, the interest will likely gradually increase, until it really takes off.

 

I notice you say you don't want to waste any time. This means not wasting time with people who show you they are a mess right now. If you want a serious relationship, don't get involved in something you don't see working out long term. Punto. Know what you want and don't settle for less.

 

Good luck!

[Star Gazer]

Well, since that was apparently your last post on LS for a long time, I don't know whether you'll read this. But I'll give it a shot anyway. Perhaps if it doesn't help you, it'll help someone else.

 

• I deliberately didn't mention drugs/alcohol because I knew exactly what type of reaction I will get (isn't that kind of intuitive Of course passing out for days at the time is not a plus for me nor does it make someone LTR potential. I think I clarified that I was NOT looking for anything serious with him but everyone seems to have missed that point. I have also never dated anyone with drug/alcohol problem so this is by no means a pattern for me. Basically, at this point it is irrelevant and you should all let it go.

 

You acknowledged he wasn't LTR potential, and yet you also said you were falling in love with him. Why allow yourself, your mind, your heart, to go there with someone you know is 100% not what you want? Why waste your time? What have you got to gain from that?

 

You want a LTR. Who can blame you? I certainly don't. But if you waste time with a guy who's not relationship material, the guy who is relationship material will pass you by. I hate to bring age into this, but as Eeyore said, you aren't getting any younger. You don't have time to waste on guys who aren't what you want, guys who take your attention from other potentials, guys who make you feel bad about yourself and therefore cause you to spend more time in pain and not "out there" finding the right guy. At the first sign of not being relationship material, they ought to be tossed out.

 

• I agree with looking at deeper personality traits more rather than surface ones. But again you are all missing something. Even if a guy is THE PERFECT LTR material, it is pretty irrelevant if he is NOT INTERESTED IN ME. My logic is to evaluate interest first and then look for deeper compatibility (this is something you can't see on the first few dates anyway).
  

 

Given the traits you're dealing with (drug use!), it's actually a lot easier to find out whether someone's relationship material before you can ascertain whether or not they really want YOU for that relationship long-term. Ascertaining interest is easy: they make it known. You don't need to analyze it. Instead, spend your time analyzing their CHARACTER, not how long they take to respond to your texts and the like.

 

• Comments about being narcissistic are laughable. I am probably the exact opposite of narcissistic.

 

Agreed, actually. Narcissism involves a love of oneself, which you do not seem to have. Your behavior, however, sometimes comes across as narcissistic and self-involved, particularly when you apply standards to others that you refuse to meet yourself.

 

• Working on myself in vacuum doesn't work. I am just wasting more time that I could be spending looking for a relationship. I took a good 2 years break from dating to just chill and pursue other interests. It didn't help me ONE BIT. All it did is make me more anxious when I got back into it. On my first few dates after the break, I pretty much nearly had a panic attack. Given my age, I also can't afford to take breaks. I need to learn by doing.

 

As you know, I spend a little time last night reading some of your older threads under SACWA. One of the things I learned is that you haven't taken a 2 year break from looking for a relationship. You have spent your entire life looking for a relationship. You may have avoided dating other men for 2 years while you pined for your married boss, but you did not take a break from your pursuit of a relationship. THAT, I think, is what people mean when they say you ought to take a break and work on yourself. Take your pursuit of a relationship out of the picture. Get centered with yourself. Kam suggested yoga. That might help. Or running. Or painting. Or adopting a dog. Or...working harder at work, to beat the gal you find so competitive. You get the idea.

 

As for working on yourself in a vacuum, who's to say it requires a vacuum? You don't have to hermitize yourself, but you do need to do some serious work on yourself before you'll be capable of being in a happy, healthy relationship. You're engaging the very definition of insanity, doing and BEING the same person and expecting different results. You can't just throw your arms in the air and say, "This is who I am, I've always been this way, take it or leave it!", particularly when your behavior, choices, thought processes are so destructive. It's quite obvious you need some serious change. "The common denominator" is YOU, OG.

 

Think about it this way. You're a Ph.D., right? Did you give your dissertation before doing a lot of work (undergrad, masters, etc.) to build up your skills and qualify you for that role? Or did you just graduate high school and start standing up in front of a group to "practice how to do a dissertation"? The same thing applies here. In essence, you have to be qualified for what you're going after. You have to have the right skills. Relationship skills. Relationship material people seek other relationship material people. You have so many fantastic qualities, but there are some you're missing - emotional stability and an appropriate people filter is one of them.

 

• Posting my problems and having randoms judge me is probably counter productive at this point. I use LS as an outlet where I voice my genuine feelings but I have reached the stage where it's doing more harm than good. Not to mention that some posters bring their personal biases into giving advice. Lots of regulars on here keep up a certain image and still very much censor what they post, choosing not go in depth about their problems. Of course they will come across as more "together" than me.
  

 

What biases do you think people have against you? Did you harm them in some way? Perhaps they've been where you are, or experienced things you're going through, or thought the way you're thinking, and want to help. At worst, some folks might be annoyed with you, because they've responded to all your threads, watched you not take the very helpful advice given you, and watched you trip and fall over and over and over again and not learn anything from it. But it's clear that every person here is trying to help you, not lead you astray.

 

And you're not being compared to other LSers who may or may not reveal all of their lives here, so what they post has no impact on the advice you're given.

 

Also, there are a small handful of posters (yourself included) who weigh in AFTER a conclusion/update has been reached, only to claim that you "knew it all along" and "didn't want to say anything" because you like the person or didn't want to be negative. That's not intuition. Obviously it's really easy to be right all the time when you're giving your opinion about others only after all the true facts are revealed.