If he showed you the divorce papers....

[blinded_27]

...would you go back to him?

 

Okay I'm not there yet. I'm ashamed. I allowed NC to be broken (yes, partially my fault for leaving him on facebook etc).

 

Him crying to me for the past 4 days, telling me he loves me and that he just is not happy when he is with his wife was pathetic to me at first. But I've been sucked in again.

 

Okay different circumstances this time... him and his wife are officially separated. Living in separate apartments. Originally, he left because he wanted to at least try to make it work with her (first love, engaged and married young, blah blah). For the 4 days I stopped talking to him, he said he spent as much time as he could with her to see how he felt and if it was worth it for the two of them to make things work again. He said he couldn't even be around her, he was too depressed and preoccupied thinking about me the entire time (yes I know most of you are thinking LIARRRR... I was too kinda sorta ).

 

I grilled him. Badly. He waited outside my place for 2 hours last night for me to come home from my trip, begging me to let him in, but I refused. I told him everything he's telling me now I've heard before. He swears this time is different. He looked into divorce today, and he no longer has those feelings for his wife.

 

Says he wants to start over with me, go back to dating me again. Wants to take me to his work christmas party (which before, he refused to tell any of them about me). Removed his "married" status from facebook (GASP!!! ) He's looking into whether an annulment or a divorce is appropriate (they've only been married since july). Says he's going to prove me wrong that I think he's lying and is going to show me the signed papers when he gets them.

 

So if this was your xMM coming at you with all of this, would you follow your heart and jump back in with him again? Or would you stay far far away? I'm not sure what to do...

[fooled once]

...would you go back to him?

 

Okay I'm not there yet. I'm ashamed. I allowed NC to be broken (yes, partially my fault for leaving him on facebook etc).

 

Him crying to me for the past 4 days, telling me he loves me and that he just is not happy when he is with his wife was pathetic to me at first. But I've been sucked in again.

 

Okay different circumstances this time... him and his wife are officially separated. Living in separate apartments. Originally, he left because he wanted to at least try to make it work with her (first love, engaged and married young, blah blah). For the 4 days I stopped talking to him, he said he spent as much time as he could with her to see how he felt and if it was worth it for the two of them to make things work again. He said he couldn't even be around her, he was too depressed and preoccupied thinking about me the entire time (yes I know most of you are thinking LIARRRR... I was too kinda sorta ).

 

I grilled him. Badly. He waited outside my place for 2 hours last night for me to come home from my trip, begging me to let him in, but I refused. I told him everything he's telling me now I've heard before. He swears this time is different. He looked into divorce today, and he no longer has those feelings for his wife.

 

Says he wants to start over with me, go back to dating me again. Wants to take me to his work christmas party (which before, he refused to tell any of them about me). Removed his "married" status from facebook (GASP!!! ) He's looking into whether an annulment or a divorce is appropriate (they've only been married since july). Says he's going to prove me wrong that I think he's lying and is going to show me the signed papers when he gets them.

 

So if this was your xMM coming at you with all of this, would you follow your heart and jump back in with him again? Or would you stay far far away? I'm not sure what to do...

 

See, I don't buy it. Does he have ANY clue what needs to be done for an annulment? Does he have any clue how much work it takes to get one?

 

If he married young, but only been married since July, how old is he? 19?

 

You need to take a break. He is becoming your entire world. So what if he changed his FB status to not married :laugh: What does that even mean? Is he in junior high?

 

He sounds incredibly immature and incredibly needy.

 

Sure, date him - AFTER he is divorced. After he is done flip flopping. He took 4 WHOLE days to focus on his marriage - the person he claims is his first love that he married in July? When did YOU start your affair with him? July was only 4 months ago!

 

Do what makes you happy, but IMHO, your 'relationship' doesn't stand a chance until he grows up, you stop focusing soley on him, both of you stop these games and he makes a decision to either divorce or not. Sounds like he is only saying what he knows you want to hear. Anyone can provide lip service, but action is what speaks louder than words.

[Pokemon]

Honey, I was down that road, exactly where you are, 3 months ago. He went back to work it out with wife for 2.5 weeks and then bolted. Promised divorce papers, going to IC instead of MC, and I took him back.

 

Fast forward 3 months, I found out by accident that his IC was actually MC, but they do it separately and then do it together later. How the hell was I supposed to know how MC works? Anyway beware of anything he tells u now. The moment you take him back he WILL be back into the inertia zone. I found out the hard way.

 

After I found that out, I just packed all my sh*t outta his apartment and left. No good byes, no apologies. 8th day on NC and back to this stupid forum again.

[OWoman]

Says he's going to prove me wrong that I think he's lying and is going to show me the signed papers when he gets them.

 

Then let him do that - let him prove to you that you're wrong. Let him show you the signed papers. Let him convince you that he's for real.

 

But don't go back in until he really has convinced you with those ACTIONS and OUTCOMES, not just the promises of them.

[SunsetRed]

Ok, I'll admit...I'd take my ex back if he showed me divorce papers. He broke my heart and lied to me and betrayed me, but if he showed me divorce papers, I'd weaken and give him another chance.

 

That being said, he'd have to SHOW ME THE PAPERS!! I will no longer accept the "I'm working on my divorce" statement. He'd have to have done the work and have all his sh%t in order before I'd take him back.

 

You wouldn't ask someone to "work" on getting an HIV test. If you wanted to know if they were clean you'd ask them to get the test and show you the proof.

 

But I don't think my ex or any of the other ex's on here will show up with actual divorce papers. They've already shown us who they are and we just have to accept it or remain stuck for the rest of our lives.

[blinded_27]

Hi Fooled Once!

 

In answer to your questions:

See, I don't buy it. Does he have ANY clue what needs to be done for an annulment? Does he have any clue how much work it takes to get one?

I'm having a hard time buying it right now as well. But he is doing research as of yesterday and is again today. In Canada at least, he found out that if he admits to adultery, he has to wait a full year to get a divorce, but if she files the process can happen immediately. He's going to talk to her sometime this week. Tell her everything and see how she is going to handle this (is she going to put up a fight [understandable] or get fed up and just file). Annulments are a little more difficult but he thinks there's a possibility because the marriage was so short that it can be done fairly easily.

 

If he married young, but only been married since July, how old is he? 19?

 

You need to take a break. He is becoming your entire world. So what if he changed his FB status to not married :laugh: What does that even mean? Is he in junior high?

 

He sounds incredibly immature and incredibly needy.

Sorry, yeah some of the stuff I write here it pretty vague I write too much then delete a lot of it haha... What I meant by that was they got engaged when they were about 19 or 20. (He's been with her for 7 years, he's 25 now). I know my original thread about my story is incredibly long, but to sum it up he met me while he was still engaged and went through with the marriage because I told him I didn't really want to be with him long term at the time, and also to avoid disappointment with his family. (Yep, someone originally wrote, "conflict avoidance". It's true).

 

Oh and about the facebook thing, yeah that's why I put the laughing face in . I know it sounds ridiculous, but it was sort of a small step for him. We got into an argument a while ago about it still saying he was married. Friends of ours that know or suspect something was going on between us were able to see this and it felt weird, even though he said they were separating and not together anymore. Changing the status was just one small step towards letting his friends and family know that he's getting serious about this.

 

He took 4 WHOLE days to focus on his marriage - the person he claims is his first love that he married in July? When did YOU start your affair with him? July was only 4 months ago!

To be fair it was approximately 3 weeks he took. He wanted time alone to think about everything and whether he should make the marriage work or start something new with me. But I was still talking to him during that time until I gave up and told him I wanted to walk away from all of it. So it was 4 days of me not talking to him. During that time, he says he was angry and stressed out when he was with her. A sign he says he knows the chemistry is gone between them...

 

Oh and we started the affair back in April.

 

Do what makes you happy, but IMHO, your 'relationship' doesn't stand a chance until he grows up, you stop focusing soley on him, both of you stop these games and he makes a decision to either divorce or not. Sounds like he is only saying what he knows you want to hear. Anyone can provide lip service, but action is what speaks louder than words.

He definitely is guilty of telling me things I want to hear. You're spot on with that one. I keep telling him to stop trying to make me happy and just be brutally honest with me at this point, because we've already been through the worst.

 

As far as actions go, we came to an odd, but solid agreement today. I'm still not sure whether I can trust him, and I've been voicing this to him. He has this ring that his grandmother gave to him before she passed away. I know how much this ring means to him because he thought he lost it a while back and he hardly slept for days until he found it. He's giving it to me to keep for now to show me how serious he is about this, That he is going to get the divorce/annulment, whichever, and that he's done flip flopping between the two of us. That he's made up his mind. This ring means the entire world to him, and although I feel guilty about keeping it for now, our relationship is also my entire world right now... and he says its the same for him. So by this, I suppose we'll see what comes of it.

 

Could end really well, or it could end badly that I end up back here again.. I think I'm willing to take a risk.

Edited November 23, 2010 by blinded_27

[blinded_27]

Honey, I was down that road, exactly where you are, 3 months ago. He went back to work it out with wife for 2.5 weeks and then bolted. Promised divorce papers, going to IC instead of MC, and I took him back.

 

Fast forward 3 months, I found out by accident that his IC was actually MC, but they do it separately and then do it together later. How the hell was I supposed to know how MC works? Anyway beware of anything he tells u now. The moment you take him back he WILL be back into the inertia zone. I found out the hard way.

 

After I found that out, I just packed all my sh*t outta his apartment and left. No good byes, no apologies. 8th day on NC and back to this stupid forum again.

 

Yeah this is exactly what scares me... I want to hear stuff like this though, I want to know the harsh reality... maybe I'm still "blinded" lol... and I know it differs from person to person but it's funny how the majority of the MM seen to follow the exact same pattern. I'm sorry to hear it worked out for you like this Hopefully you're a bit stronger now than before... someone said on here before sometimes you have to be burned a few times before you really start to get it... didn't think that would be me but clearly.... lol

 

As I mentioned in the above post, he have an agreement with this ring he's going to let me keep for a while until everything is settled and done... his grandmother's ring she gave him which means the entire world to him. (Witnessed, he would actually die if he ever lost this ring). He's willing to let me keep it to prove to me that he's serious.. we'll see how this pans out.

 

 

Then let him do that - let him prove to you that you're wrong. Let him show you the signed papers. Let him convince you that he's for real.

 

But don't go back in until he really has convinced you with those ACTIONS and OUTCOMES, not just the promises of them.

 

I'm going to try this... taking things slow... which is exactly what he wants to do, He wants to start "dating" again and not jump right back into the passionate affair we had before all of this. Which is kinda good because I know he's not just after a booty call when he's lonely. I'm hopeing these promises turn into action soon enough after he talks to her this week..

 

Ok, I'll admit...I'd take my ex back if he showed me divorce papers. He broke my heart and lied to me and betrayed me, but if he showed me divorce papers, I'd weaken and give him another chance.

 

That being said, he'd have to SHOW ME THE PAPERS!! I will no longer accept the "I'm working on my divorce" statement. He'd have to have done the work and have all his sh%t in order before I'd take him back.

 

You wouldn't ask someone to "work" on getting an HIV test. If you wanted to know if they were clean you'd ask them to get the test and show you the proof.

 

But I don't think my ex or any of the other ex's on here will show up with actual divorce papers. They've already shown us who they are and we just have to accept it or remain stuck for the rest of our lives.

Hi SunsetRed, it's so hard eh? They're so good at sucking us back in even though our gut is screaming at us to run away...

 

Great analogy though with the HIV testing lol... It's true. I think maybe I'm going to give it a time line. I know these things don't happen immediately, and I'm really hoping that if/when he does go through with this divorce that it won't take a full year to complete and will happen as quickly as possible.

[jwi71]

I'm having a hard time buying it right now as well. But he is doing research as of yesterday and is again today. In Canada at least, he found out that if he admits to adultery, he has to wait a full year to get a divorce, but if she files the process can happen immediately

Just wanted to say he is dead wrong on the divorce law in Canada.

If either party admits to adultery the one year separation is waived. Also, the one year separation begins when HE notifies HER and her consent is not considered. In fact, its possible to even separate and still live in the same house.

 

I suggest you read it (link below). It even discusses that the BS suing or getting unequal distribution of assets (damages) is highly unlikely and probably cost prohibitive.

 

I got that straight from the Canadian Bar Association website in all of three minutes.

 

http://www.cba.org/bc/public_media/family/120.aspx

 

You can read it for yourself there...

 

I find it quite interesting that what he told you is radically different from what the Canadian Bar says.....hmmmmmm, makes you wonder.

 

. He's going to talk to her sometime this week. Tell her everything and see how she is going to handle this (is she going to put up a fight [understandable] or get fed up and just file). Annulments are a little more difficult but he thinks there's a possibility because the marriage was so short that it can be done fairly easily.

What he thinks. Ha.

Why doesn't he get himself to a lawyer? I mean, look what I found in 3 minutes. It appears that all he has to do is say "I want out and I am having an affair" and presto...the divorce can happen MUCH faster.

 

What's wrong with that plan?

 

I know its not what you want to hear or read...but what he is saying is NOT what the legal realities are.

 

And...I got all the info I needed in 3 minutes from the Bar. How much more does he need before hiring a lawyer?

 

Just be careful...many, perhaps most cheaters, find all kinds of great reasons to NOT file. Yet even basic internet "legal" research refutes what they say. Be careful.

[Confused4Now]

Then let him do that - let him prove to you that you're wrong. Let him show you the signed papers. Let him convince you that he's for real.

 

But don't go back in until he really has convinced you with those ACTIONS and OUTCOMES, not just the promises of them.

I'm with OWoman on this...it's always about ACTIONS....in my situation if my xMW came to me with her papers and moved out I would be very supportive only cause she was through my whole divorce. It doesn't mean their would be a US and we'd pick up where we were. A lot of more things would have to happen in order for us to be a couple. I learned all I had to from LS and I finally saw what affairs can do to people. I was no different and I went through I PAIN.

 

The key is have enough of yourself so that when your partner takes care of their business they are just gravy to your already full life. To many people including myself made it my whole mission to help them get out of their own marriage. It is their own journey....not yours. Again let them show you.....by ACTIONS.

[blinded_27]

Just wanted to say he is dead wrong on the divorce law in Canada.

If either party admits to adultery the one year separation is waived. Also, the one year separation begins when HE notifies HER and her consent is not considered. In fact, its possible to even separate and still live in the same house.

 

I suggest you read it (link below). It even discusses that the BS suing or getting unequal distribution of assets (damages) is highly unlikely and probably cost prohibitive.

 

I got that straight from the Canadian Bar Association website in all of three minutes.

 

http://www.cba.org/bc/public_media/family/120.aspx

 

You can read it for yourself there...

 

I find it quite interesting that what he told you is radically different from what the Canadian Bar says.....hmmmmmm, makes you wonder.

 

What he thinks. Ha.

Why doesn't he get himself to a lawyer? I mean, look what I found in 3 minutes. It appears that all he has to do is say "I want out and I am having an affair" and presto...the divorce can happen MUCH faster.

 

What's wrong with that plan?

 

I know its not what you want to hear or read...but what he is saying is NOT what the legal realities are.

 

And...I got all the info I needed in 3 minutes from the Bar. How much more does he need before hiring a lawyer?

 

Just be careful...many, perhaps most cheaters, find all kinds of great reasons to NOT file. Yet even basic internet "legal" research refutes what they say. Be careful.

 

jwi71: I agree, I've been telling him that all along. His excuse before was that he wasn't sure if he should try to make the marriage work or not. But now that he says he's made his final decision, we shall see.

 

Oh and thanks so much for that link! Believe it or not neither of us came across that site... (I started looking myself out of curiosity from what he was telling me and found the same stuff he did). Looks as if court costs are higher if you want to divorce due to adultery... he is in a really bad financial situation right now, I'm not sure he would even be able to afford it... that kind of scares me too... yes, it's an excuse, but a legitimate one at that. I would have no idea what it would cost to go through this whole process.

 

I'm with OWoman on this...it's always about ACTIONS....in my situation if my xMW came to me with her papers and moved out I would be very supportive only cause she was through my whole divorce. It doesn't mean their would be a US and we'd pick up where we were. A lot of more things would have to happen in order for us to be a couple. I learned all I had to from LS and I finally saw what affairs can do to people. I was no different and I went through I PAIN.

 

The key is have enough of yourself so that when your partner takes care of their business they are just gravy to your already full life. To many people including myself made it my whole mission to help them get out of their own marriage. It is their own journey....not yours. Again let them show you.....by ACTIONS.

 

Definitely. This is a great way of looking at things. I'm definitely going to keep myself guarded and concentrate on myself for a while until all of this starts to happen. And like I mentioned before, when we do get back together officially this time, we're starting at the dating stage. Which is probably a good thing.

 

He just told me he's going to talk to her tonight. I'll know more tomorrow I guess about how (and if) he is serious about moving forward with this.

[siuys]

blinded, this is similar to my situation. i have heard it all before, even with xMM living on his own for 6 months. he went back supposedly to work on his M then came back days later (twice). so far, his inaction has told me what i needed to know. at this stage, we are on NC (day 12). he's supposed to be cleaning up his crap and then look me up. yeah, whatever. can't take him serious anymore. i had to learn the hard way - i trusted him, listened to his BS and realised as long as i'm around, he is buying time.

 

so unless he DOES turn up with D papers, don't even think for a moment he's for real.

 

and i'm with confused. even if xMM turns up with D papers, it will take me a while to think about whether i can trust this man, and if i really want to be with him. i'm curious how i'd feel when i get to say a 2-month NC, which has never happened. i'm just moving through my own pain right now. it's not about him anymore. he's zapped enough life energy out of me already this past 9 months. time to regain my life.

 

look at what he does. he can talk the talk, but can he walk the walk?

[Hazyhead]

...would you go back to him?

 

Okay I'm not there yet. I'm ashamed. I allowed NC to be broken (yes, partially my fault for leaving him on facebook etc).

 

Him crying to me for the past 4 days, telling me he loves me and that he just is not happy when he is with his wife was pathetic to me at first. But I've been sucked in again.

 

Okay different circumstances this time... him and his wife are officially separated. Living in separate apartments. Originally, he left because he wanted to at least try to make it work with her (first love, engaged and married young, blah blah). For the 4 days I stopped talking to him, he said he spent as much time as he could with her to see how he felt and if it was worth it for the two of them to make things work again. He said he couldn't even be around her, he was too depressed and preoccupied thinking about me the entire time (yes I know most of you are thinking LIARRRR... I was too kinda sorta ).

 

I grilled him. Badly. He waited outside my place for 2 hours last night for me to come home from my trip, begging me to let him in, but I refused. I told him everything he's telling me now I've heard before. He swears this time is different. He looked into divorce today, and he no longer has those feelings for his wife.

 

Says he wants to start over with me, go back to dating me again. Wants to take me to his work christmas party (which before, he refused to tell any of them about me). Removed his "married" status from facebook (GASP!!! ) He's looking into whether an annulment or a divorce is appropriate (they've only been married since july). Says he's going to prove me wrong that I think he's lying and is going to show me the signed papers when he gets them.

 

So if this was your xMM coming at you with all of this, would you follow your heart and jump back in with him again? Or would you stay far far away? I'm not sure what to do...

 

That WAS my xMM. I know how easy it is to be sucked back in by them, it takes everything you have. BUT, I called him on his promises - I heard him out, his plans and such, and called him out, asked him to show me. The things that he had put in to place had been there since D-day, and his wife initiating it all. IT wasn't him, he was full of cr@p. If she hadn't kicked him out he'd still be trying to string us both along. Anyway, after I asked him to prove himself, he didn't like it. Luckily this time I hadn't fallen for his lines. I walked away and told him to do the same but he wouldn't, he still kept contacting me. And so I did the controversial thing - told his wife. Haven't heard from him since and I like it that way. If he got divorced I would run a mile (but hey ho - I think I'm the LAST person he'd try it with )

 

Do what you feel is right for you. I would advise you, however, to not give anymore of yourself than you already have. Stay cautious and see what he delivers. If it's what you want then good luck to you. You'll need it if the majority on this forum is anything to go by, but I hope for you you are one of the exceptions.

[siuys]

Sometimes I do think about telling xMM's W. That would save me a lot of pain coz then i know for SURE he'll never contact me again.

[jwi71]

jwi71: I agree, I've been telling him that all along. His excuse before was that he wasn't sure if he should try to make the marriage work or not. But now that he says he's made his final decision, we shall see.

 

Set your boundaries NOW.

What line, should he cross it, ends it for you?

If he goes to MC...then tries to contact you...is that ok?

If he fails to file by...some point in time...is that ok?

Right now...you are second place at best. He values:

 

1) Himself

2) His standard of living (aka money)

3) what his family thinks

4) his W (can't hurt her and so on)

5) social stigma of leaving his W for the OW

6) you

 

And I believe, powerfully, we train people how to treat us. What are you teaching to him and accepting for yourself?

 

And the money excuse is perhaps older than the "for the kids excuse".

Quick...what's the cost of a D? You don't know do you. He doesn't either.

Only way TO know is...ask the lawyer who can give you a good idea.

 

And seriously...he doesn't have a credit card?

 

Looks as if court costs are higher if you want to divorce due to adultery...

 

Highly unlikely. You can find this out simply by calling the court. In fact, I bet they have a schedule of fees on their website. The cost of a D is NOT the filing fees and so on...its the lawyer fees.

 

he is in a really bad financial situation right now, I'm not sure he would even be able to afford it... that kind of scares me too... yes, it's an excuse, but a legitimate one at that.

 

Not in my book. To me, it says, I value my living standards over you. And yes, people DO choose a lower standard of living to be happy. I did.

 

Definitely. This is a great way of looking at things. I'm definitely going to keep myself guarded and concentrate on myself for a while until all of this starts to happen. And like I mentioned before, when we do get back together officially this time, we're starting at the dating stage. Which is probably a good thing.

 

The only thing to remember is...don't slip up about WHEN you two met to friends and family. It means you must forever LIE to those closest to you. Believe it or not...its incredibly stressful to lie to everyone about how and when and under what circumstances you met. Whatta surreal conversation to have - have you guys had it yet?

 

Of course, taking the "I am done with the M and am having an A" route makes the above moot. And opens a whole different can of worms.

 

Nothing will be easy.

 

But you seem to have a good, distanced attitude towards this. IT will serve you well. But, then again, the deadlines you will set (from the above right...you will set boundaries right) haven't been missed. You'll understand when you get there.

 

He just told me he's going to talk to her tonight. I'll know more tomorrow I guess about how (and if) he is serious about moving forward with this.

 

Protect yourself against his hedging his bets. Telling her one thing and you another while he decides. Those boundaries you set above will save you here.

[Hazyhead]

Sometimes I do think about telling xMM's W. That would save me a lot of pain coz then i know for SURE he'll never contact me again.

 

Siuys, this was a major factor in my decision to do so. Sometimes I feel a bit sad that he must hate me now, that it ended so badly after initially being quite amicable and gentle, but then it was what was needed to cut the ties totally. There will be no more from him. I'm free. I wouldn't recommend it if he's sticking to NC, due to the amount of devastation you cause all round, not to mention you put yourself back into the storm. You're doing really well, siuys, one day at a time. It will get easier.

[siuys]

Thanks, hazyhead. I know what you mean. I don't want to cause more pain for everyone, and bring myself right back to square one so I agree with you. As long as he leaves me alone, I'll be fine eventually. I just will no longer go back to this toxic situation. It would be a somewhat revengeful thing to do (in my case) and I don't want to be like that. But if something happens and I lose all respect for him, and he wouldn't leave me alone, then that's the road I will take.

 

Thanks for your input. I appreciate it.

[LucreziaBorgia]

I would hold out for the official papers. My exH and I separated and lived separately, but it took five years before either of us were ready to actually divorce. We even toyed around with renewing vows during that separation time.

 

When we divorced, it was because we both reached the point where it was time let go. If he hasn't reached that point yet with his wife, there is no point in pinning your hopes on it now. It takes a long time to reach the point of divorcing emotionally even as you are planning the 'pen and ink' version.

 

If he is in a vulnerable state and his wife is fighting to stay married, you will want to step away until the dust settles. At a point like that, it isn't unheard of for the WS to be talked into (and agree to) staying married.

[fooled once]

Hi Fooled Once!

 

In answer to your questions:

 

I'm having a hard time buying it right now as well. But he is doing research as of yesterday and is again today. In Canada at least, he found out that if he admits to adultery, he has to wait a full year to get a divorce, but if she files the process can happen immediately. He's going to talk to her sometime this week. Tell her everything and see how she is going to handle this (is she going to put up a fight [understandable] or get fed up and just file). Annulments are a little more difficult but he thinks there's a possibility because the marriage was so short that it can be done fairly easily.

 

* I have to agree with jwl - I fail to see how he can do research and fail to find the actual 'laws' for his area. Honestly, sounds like lip service.

 

So he, like SOOO many MM, doesn't want to be the 'bad guy' and wants HER to file. So he is going to tell her he is having an affair, 2 days before Thanksgiving (oh, but if you are in Canada, your is different than ours in America, right) but right before the Christmas season is upon us. If he is so sure of the end of his marriage, I don't understand why he doesn't grow a pair, state his feelings and state he is going to file for divorce. I have had 2 girlfriends get annulments here in the US - the process was way more detailed, involved and lengthy vs a 'normal' divorce.

 

Sorry, yeah some of the stuff I write here it pretty vague I write too much then delete a lot of it haha... What I meant by that was they got engaged when they were about 19 or 20. (He's been with her for 7 years, he's 25 now). I know my original thread about my story is incredibly long, but to sum it up he met me while he was still engaged and went through with the marriage because I told him I didn't really want to be with him long term at the time, and also to avoid disappointment with his family. (Yep, someone originally wrote, "conflict avoidance". It's true).

 

Gotcha. I did read your original thread when you originally posted it. So he felt the need to continue to betray his now wife by starting an affair while engaged, disrespect his fiance/now wife and disrespect you by having an affair AND getting married! Hon, LOOK at his actions! Where is there any integrity? This isn't 'conflict avoidance' - it is cheating and making a fool of someone. It is horrific, IMHO. Think about how he is going to destroy his wife when it all comes out. She trusted him. She relied on him. She believed him. And he chose to be a coward.

 

Oh and about the facebook thing, yeah that's why I put the laughing face in . I know it sounds ridiculous, but it was sort of a small step for him. We got into an argument a while ago about it still saying he was married. Friends of ours that know or suspect something was going on between us were able to see this and it felt weird, even though he said they were separating and not together anymore. Changing the status was just one small step towards letting his friends and family know that he's getting serious about this.

 

* You do know that you can block certain things, such as a change in relationship status, from your friends, or from everyone but you And if he did that on facebook, don't you think his wife would have heard about this already? From mutual friends or even by seeing it herself?

 

To be fair it was approximately 3 weeks he took. He wanted time alone to think about everything and whether he should make the marriage work or start something new with me. But I was still talking to him during that time until I gave up and told him I wanted to walk away from all of it. So it was 4 days of me not talking to him. During that time, he says he was angry and stressed out when he was with her. A sign he says he knows the chemistry is gone between them...

 

* So for 4 days of not getting his ego stroked, he realized he needed that and decided he was done with his marriage, or so he says. Again, all he has done to this point is words - NO actions (I do not count changing the relationship status on FB as action)

 

Oh and we started the affair back in April.

 

He definitely is guilty of telling me things I want to hear. You're spot on with that one. I keep telling him to stop trying to make me happy and just be brutally honest with me at this point, because we've already been through the worst.

 

* Honey, you have not been through the worst. The worst will be the divorce and the time immediately after that. Does he have kids with his wife? If so, again, you haven't even been even near the worst. The worst is when his wife finds out, and more 'worst' will be when his family finds out, and your family finds out, friends take sides, heck, his boss finds out. Trust me, what you two have gone through since April is far from the worst. If she names you in the divorce, I can guarantee you that what you consider the worst to date will have been a cake walk.

 

As far as actions go, we came to an odd, but solid agreement today. I'm still not sure whether I can trust him, and I've been voicing this to him. He has this ring that his grandmother gave to him before she passed away. I know how much this ring means to him because he thought he lost it a while back and he hardly slept for days until he found it. He's giving it to me to keep for now to show me how serious he is about this, That he is going to get the divorce/annulment, whichever, and that he's done flip flopping between the two of us. That he's made up his mind. This ring means the entire world to him, and although I feel guilty about keeping it for now, our relationship is also my entire world right now... and he says its the same for him. So by this, I suppose we'll see what comes of it.

 

*Not to minimize what you see as significant with the ring <which amounts to being storage for it> he could also be hiding it from his wife because she may do something to it. I find it appalling that he gave you this ring, almost like a promise ring if you wear it or view it as something like that, while he is actively MARRIED and his wife has no idea.

 

So, are you going to continue to "date" him during the divorce (if he actually does that)? Are you going to continue to sleep with him? I guess I would stop doing that - sleeping with him - if only to be respectful to your body so that you aren't being used by him. If he is serious, he will respect that from you. If you are serious about not wanting to continue to be his mistress, and you won't stop talking to him while he truly makes a decisions and takes action on that decision, then stop having a physical relationship with him. If you two really want to build something more than an affair, IMHO you both need to step back. You deserve to be courted. You deserve his full attention, which he can't give you while married. And by that token, without his full attention, why would you give him your body? To keep him interested? If he loves you, he would stay interested.

Could end really well, or it could end badly that I end up back here again.. I think I'm willing to take a risk.

 

Answers above in bold.

 

I also wanted to add that I am betting you are about his age. People in their 20's are usually not the same people when they hit their mid 30's. I know I changed so much between 25 and 35. I grew up a lot. I was a single parent during my late 20's (had my son at 24; married at 22). By my mid 30's - I was divorced from my son's father, and remarried to a man with 2 kids from a previous marriage. There was no cheating in either of our marriages, but dang, was the first few years hard. NOT because we doubted our love, but because we were blending families, had crappy x's to deal with, etc. But we were older, more grown up, more knowing of what we wanted with a partner. You two are both so young. NOT that it can't work, but because the foundation was built on an affair, it has a 'worse' starting than those that didn't start due to an affair. There are trust issues now -- think about how you may have those same issues down the road. He has shown the ability to cheat, to deceive, to lie and to be untrustworthy. I know OW say it isn't any different than with a single guy - but it IS. I don't personally believe the phrase, once a cheater, always a cheater....but in some cases, I do believe it. This guy went INTO his marriage cheating and deceiving! Will you truly be able to give him 100% of your trust, knowing his past and his past manipulation of his wife? He stood before her and witnesses claiming to love her and promising to not betray her ... all the while HE WAS lying to her and betraying her!

 

And finally, I hate how he is your whole life. NO person should lean or expect another person to define them OR be their whole world. I love my H more than anything, but he is not all there is to my life. I am a mother, a step-mother, a daughter, a sister, a friend and a worker bee. I have other obligations besides him. NO person should expect another person to make them happy or to meet all their needs. Please think about getting into some counseling to see if you can find out why you chose to be with an engaged man, why you chose to continue the affair after he married and why he is your world. YOU DESERVE BETTER...okay? Don't accept anything less.

 

GOOD luck!

[silverplanets]

...would you go back to him?

 

Okay I'm not there yet. I'm ashamed. I allowed NC to be broken (yes, partially my fault for leaving him on facebook etc).

 

Him crying to me for the past 4 days, telling me he loves me and that he just is not happy when he is with his wife was pathetic to me at first. But I've been sucked in again.

 

Okay different circumstances this time... him and his wife are officially separated. Living in separate apartments. Originally, he left because he wanted to at least try to make it work with her (first love, engaged and married young, blah blah). For the 4 days I stopped talking to him, he said he spent as much time as he could with her to see how he felt and if it was worth it for the two of them to make things work again. He said he couldn't even be around her, he was too depressed and preoccupied thinking about me the entire time (yes I know most of you are thinking LIARRRR... I was too kinda sorta ).

 

I grilled him. Badly. He waited outside my place for 2 hours last night for me to come home from my trip, begging me to let him in, but I refused. I told him everything he's telling me now I've heard before. He swears this time is different. He looked into divorce today, and he no longer has those feelings for his wife.

 

Says he wants to start over with me, go back to dating me again. Wants to take me to his work christmas party (which before, he refused to tell any of them about me). Removed his "married" status from facebook (GASP!!! ) He's looking into whether an annulment or a divorce is appropriate (they've only been married since july). Says he's going to prove me wrong that I think he's lying and is going to show me the signed papers when he gets them.

 

So if this was your xMM coming at you with all of this, would you follow your heart and jump back in with him again? Or would you stay far far away? I'm not sure what to do...

 

Hi Blinded,

 

This is kinda the million dollar question isn't it ... would you have them back if they turned up at your door with D papers.

 

I honestly believe that my answer nowadays would be no ... and that is because she lied to me ... ..

 

And as I've got further and further away from it I've realised that, of the many reasons why she would not be right for me, the main one is quite simple .. she lied to me.

 

Her H may have taken her back after she lied to him, but I am not her H ... I respect myself more, and I have higher standards.

 

So no, if she turned up on my doorstep with all the D papers in the world professing undying love etc then I would honestly say that the problem would be I would never know if she was telling the truth or not ... since she has already proved she can lie perfectly well whilst looking into my eyes.

 

And that, that means she is an unsuitable partner for me to make any future with.

 

Looking at it another way, I have more faith in my ability to live a deep and fulfilling life and maybe find a new partner than I do in her ability to be truthful and honest over and extended period of time.

 

Nothing you get from a liar is real ... and my life deserves to be real.

 

take care

C

[blinded_27]

* Honey, you have not been through the worst. The worst will be the divorce and the time immediately after that. Does he have kids with his wife? If so, again, you haven't even been even near the worst. The worst is when his wife finds out, and more 'worst' will be when his family finds out, and your family finds out, friends take sides, heck, his boss finds out. Trust me, what you two have gone through since April is far from the worst. If she names you in the divorce, I can guarantee you that what you consider the worst to date will have been a cake walk.

Yeah she already knew about us though... that's why she moved out a little over a month ago now into a friends place. (She now has gotten her own place, and his own place now separately as well). *Sigh* feels like it can't get much worse from here really...

 

 

I also wanted to add that I am betting you are about his age. People in their 20's are usually not the same people when they hit their mid 30's. I know I changed so much between 25 and 35. I grew up a lot. I was a single parent during my late 20's (had my son at 24; married at 22). By my mid 30's - I was divorced from my son's father, and remarried to a man with 2 kids from a previous marriage. There was no cheating in either of our marriages, but dang, was the first few years hard. NOT because we doubted our love, but because we were blending families, had crappy x's to deal with, etc. But we were older, more grown up, more knowing of what we wanted with a partner. You two are both so young. NOT that it can't work, but because the foundation was built on an affair, it has a 'worse' starting than those that didn't start due to an affair. There are trust issues now -- think about how you may have those same issues down the road. He has shown the ability to cheat, to deceive, to lie and to be untrustworthy. I know OW say it isn't any different than with a single guy - but it IS. I don't personally believe the phrase, once a cheater, always a cheater....but in some cases, I do believe it. This guy went INTO his marriage cheating and deceiving! Will you truly be able to give him 100% of your trust, knowing his past and his past manipulation of his wife? He stood before her and witnesses claiming to love her and promising to not betray her ... all the while HE WAS lying to her and betraying her!

Yeah I'm 27... I feel like I've gone through a huge change in "finding myself" when I was 25 and my boyfriend and I of 6 years split up. Now I feel like I've lost all of that again being with MM I've become so dependant on him... and she is still as well..

 

And finally, I hate how he is your whole life. NO person should lean or expect another person to define them OR be their whole world. I love my H more than anything, but he is not all there is to my life. I am a mother, a step-mother, a daughter, a sister, a friend and a worker bee. I have other obligations besides him. NO person should expect another person to make them happy or to meet all their needs. Please think about getting into some counseling to see if you can find out why you chose to be with an engaged man, why you chose to continue the affair after he married and why he is your world. YOU DESERVE BETTER...okay? Don't accept anything less.

 

GOOD luck!

I hate this as well. I know he isn't my whole life, it's just very hard being new-ish in a big city all alone. Us having made the same friends, they're the ONLY friends I've made here, and starting over means going back into a depression like I was when I first moved here and found it difficult to meet people. I feel like way of getting over this is to move back to my old city, close to my family and friends...

 

Hi Blinded,

 

This is kinda the million dollar question isn't it ... would you have them back if they turned up at your door with D papers.

 

I honestly believe that my answer nowadays would be no ... and that is because she lied to me ... ..

 

And as I've got further and further away from it I've realised that, of the many reasons why she would not be right for me, the main one is quite simple .. she lied to me.

 

Her H may have taken her back after she lied to him, but I am not her H ... I respect myself more, and I have higher standards.

 

So no, if she turned up on my doorstep with all the D papers in the world professing undying love etc then I would honestly say that the problem would be I would never know if she was telling the truth or not ... since she has already proved she can lie perfectly well whilst looking into my eyes.

 

And that, that means she is an unsuitable partner for me to make any future with.

 

Looking at it another way, I have more faith in my ability to live a deep and fulfilling life and maybe find a new partner than I do in her ability to be truthful and honest over and extended period of time.

 

Nothing you get from a liar is real ... and my life deserves to be real.

 

take care

C

 

Wow, this was a great post. Thank you so much. I agree with everything. It's so funny, I can see, and agree with everything that is being said here... it's just getting to that point yourself, like someone said here before, and really taking all of that in and to heart. I feel like I'm getting there slowly. I'm not overlooking the lies anymore... I just need to get to that point where I can feel confidant in myself and walk away.

[blinded_27]

Ugh so I feel really sick to my stomach. Since yesterday.

 

I was visiting my friends and family 5 hours away this weekend again and was doing a decent job of having fun and forgetting about him. I really didn't have much desire to see him at all when I got home last night.

 

But he wanted me to see his new place and had ordered pizza for us so I caved... I went there, and we had a huge argument

 

So in Canada (or at least Ontario) there are two grounds for divorce:

 

• The couple has been separated for at least 1 year
  
• Adultery (in which case the betrayed spouse has to be the one to file)
  

So unless she files against him, (which she won't because she isn't ready and still wants to make it work with him), he's stuck for 1 year.

 

On top of this, he really wants to remain friends with her. They still email each other (I've read the emails, there isn't much to be concerned about right now, mostly talking about who's taking what from their old apartment... other than him admitting that this isn't easy for him...). I'm really uncomfortable with this though. He is insisting that he is going to stay friends with her no matter what. I think I'd be okay with that eventually, but right now it scares the hell out of me. Am I wrong to ask that they don't speak to each other, at least for a few weeks to begin healing? He says he just doesn't feel "it" with her anymore and won't go back to her, so he doesn't need to heal from this... but I still fear he will..

 

So otherwise, I'm worried sick, he's dropping off some of her stuff tonight and I hate that they're still finding excuses to see each other. He doesn't NEED to drop that stuff off, she can easily go there and grab it herself while he's at work.

 

It's just NEVER going to end, is it? I've actually made myself physically ill over this. I can't stand that he still talks to her. About legit stuff like their belongings, but also just random stuff. Useless chat. It drives me crazy because he doesn't care that it bothers me.

 

I want to let go SO badly, but I can't.... my family is devastated that I may or may not be back with him again (have not confirmed with them yet but they have a suspicion) and it breaks my heart to see them so upset and hurting for me... it just ISN'T sinking in for me... I really think I should move back to my hometown again because being around people who I know care about me might make this process a lot easier than doing it alone

[carhill]

OP, my sympathies.

 

In Ontario:

Who is eligible to apply for a divorce in Ontario?

You may apply if:

 

1. you were legally married to your spouse in Canada or any other country;

 

2. you are already living apart from your spouse with the intention of not getting back together or you plan to permanently separate from your spouse with the belief that there is no possibility of the two of you reconciling or getting back together again; and

 

3. either you or your spouse have lived in Ontario for at least one year immediately prior to starting the application.

 

Your MM could apply for divorce today, citing item 2, believing there is no possibility of reconciliation. He doesn't even have to live in a separate domicile. The divorce act also allows for 90 day attempts at reconciliation without affecting the divorce 'clock', so they can 'work on it' even while the divorce clock runs.

 

You didn't answer whether the MM and his W have children, which, if so, would complicate legal matters, but still not affect the basic process. The court clerk in your jurisdiction lists or can cite the court filing fees. You can call them for specifics.

 

If he 'shows' you the divorce papers, look for the court seal indicating filing and assignment of docket or case number. Write it down. As a public record, you can watch the progress of the divorce proceedings by perusing the filings. In our case, once we had the CFL# (Cali family law), I could watch the filings my exW and I made from the comfort of my laptop, along with any rulings and/or advisements. It's really not complicated.

 

I'm not going to get into the relationship ho-ha dynamics because that's beyond the scope of this thread. If a MW showed me divorce papers, I'd get the CFL and tell her I'd talk to her in six months (Cali's cooling off period) or when the court attaches that nice seal to the papers or when I see the "Marriage Ends on XXX" notation in the online case file. Pretty basic stuff. I was an OM and dealt with this many years ago, including the lies and gaslighting. Up to you. The divorce part is easy to track. The rest, YMMV. Good luck

[LucreziaBorgia]

Am I wrong to ask that they don't speak to each other, at least for a few weeks to begin healing?

 

Honestly, yes. You cannot dictate what does or does not go on between those two. Yes, your relationship with him is your business but his relationship with his wife as they go through the divorce is not. Trying to force an artificial silence on someone else will not work. It will only result in resentment and hostility. If there is to be any 'NC' between him and his soon to be ex wife, that will have to be his decision and no one else's.