Women want rich guys, guys want beautiful women. Where is love in all this?

[LittleTiger]

What?!

 

Of course you can. Studies like the one I posted are about generalizations. You know that what that study said was on point. That study did not deviate from the norm. In the rest of your post, you basically agreed that what the study said spoke on behalf on how most people operate when it comes to finding a mate. If I showed a study that said people who drink alcohol and then drive soon after are more likely to crash their cars than those who don't drink, how can someone say that you can't make generalizations about most people based on what that study said?

 

There were, I think only, 30 to 50 people involved in that study (one single study conducted in Germany) - how many people are there on this planet and how many of us are German? As I already said, the results only show a minute sample of a particular type of person in a particular part of the world so, NO, generalisations about the entire population of the world cannot be made from it. Social scientists have a rather bad habit of trying to do this all the time!

 

The results of the study do happen to be in line with our biological tendancies, yes, I'm not arguing with that - it's actually pretty obvious, as you say. None of us can help our genetically predisposed behaviour - it's there for a reason. If it wasn't there men and women would never get together at all. What I'm saying is that the study was skewed towards observing only our biological tendancies NOT the reality of how people actually choose their mates in the real world.

 

For men, the way women look matters more to them than it is the other way around. For women, they want to know what a guy's FICO score is, they want to know what's in guy's bank account, they want to know what he does for a living, what kind of car he drives, what zip-code he lives in. They're less interested in knowing how good he is in the sack. In fact, women try to delay that as long as possible while the guys try to get sex as soon as possible. This can explain why many married men complain why they're not getting any sex at home.

 

The only reason women delay sex is so that they don't get used and dumped - it has nothing to do with men being more interested in how good a woman is in the sack than the other way around. In a relationship, women are VERY concerned about how good a man is in bed. There are a number of threads on LS about women walking out on their very comfortable lives because their husbands are no longer able to satisfy them sexually. If men think that all they have to do to secure a beautiful woman is to make sure she's financially comfortable, they're wrong.

 

The more money a man has, the more likely it is that he'll get the hottest women. The less money a man has, the more likely it is that the girl he'll hook up with is unattractive. The ones in the middle, in terms of wealth and looks, will attract others who are also in the middle. Water seeks its own level.

 

This is just rubbish. It may be true that most very rich men will choose a beautiful woman given the chance but if the opposite was also true then all beautiful women would be married to rich men - and last time I looked this wasn't the case. There are just as many beautiful women in the lower financial levels of society as there are amongst the filthy rich. If anything, all it proves is how shallow most men are compared to women.

 

Whether someone believes in love or not, people know that women generally want men for financial stability because to this day society does not expect women to be the breadwinners. This is why men (in general) do the harder, more dangerous jobs than women do. Because those jobs pay more. Women can afford to do the easier or less dangerous jobs because they have men to supporting them who are doing the harder, or dangerous, or more demanding jobs.

 

Actually, if you're interested in sociology and anthropology you should be aware that men do the harder, more dangerous jobs for two main reasons. 1) because they are physically stronger and therefore more capable (yes it's biological) and 2) because, going back to our early ancestors, the woman's job was to take care of the home and the offspring. Without the mother very young children would die so the mother's survival and therefore safety was important. She also took care of the man in terms of his need for someone to prepare his food and give him sex. The men therefore protected and looked after the women.

 

There is still some element of this bias in term of jobs today although now it has more to do with men's physical strength than the woman's caregiver role. There are some jobs that woman physically are not capable of or can't do as efficiently or as quickly because of their size and strength. Employers also don't employ women to do these kinds of jobs because it wouldn't be financially viable.

 

Dangerous jobs do offer higher rates of pay, of course, but men choose these jobs because they are generally higher risk takers and because they are more competitive and less emotional - it's about testosterone levels and has nothing to do with women having the easy jobs because men will give them a free ride in life.

 

The title of this topic should've been headlined on the cover of No Sh*t magazine -- where it's also revealed that the sun is hot. That study should not have knocked anyone over with a feather.

 

As I said before, this thread is not actually about the first statement in the title, it's about the question at the end. So we can argue this point until we're blue in the face but it's not really the issue.

 

'Where is love in all this?' was the question that was asked. Love is something that raises us above our biological begninings and our genetic tendancies and, if we're lucky, most of us will get to experience it at some point in our lives. If anybody here can't see beyond the first statement in the title then I can only assume that you have yet to learn what love is.

[threebyfate]

I realize that historically marriages were pure business agreements and even today it is still the norm.

 

But am I being naive to think that there are actually people who decide to be together because they really enjoy each other's company even though they have better options?

 

Sometimes I'm just worried that one day I'm gonna get into a 'business' marriage in which I'm in it because the girl is hot n she is in it because she wants someone to feed her and provides shelter for her.

 

It is honestly the biggest fear I have for my future.

Bottom line is that you don't trust yourself and your judgement. If you did, you'd realize that the choice is yours who you will marry or not. So, since the choice is yours, that leaves your judgement. And if your judgement of women can easily be skewed by a hot face and body, then the best thing to do is to work on your judgement and weaknesses within you.

 

Also, it's not as if you can't get a prenuptial for future protection. And if you find she's a gold digger, then divorce her. It really is that simple.

[Els]

 

Personally, I know it is love, when I see a woman who is with a man who makes a lot less money or a man who is with a less attractive woman.

 

I agree with GC. Don't show the woman your wealth til she's shown that she's interested in you as a person. To be honest though, as the budget-conscious college student that you are now (based on your posts), if a woman gets with you now, you can be quite sure she isn't a golddigger. Gold-diggers just don't get with college students... unless your father's a millionaire or something.

 

And this is part of the reason I don't makeup and dress myself up all nice and pretty to go out all the time. The guys I've been with, I could tell that they were quite pleasantly surprised the first time in the bedroom, when the baggy tee and jeans went off. That way, I know they're with me for something far more substantial than my appearance.

[Untouchable_Fire]

The only reason women delay sex is so that they don't get used and dumped - it has nothing to do with men being more interested in how good a woman is in the sack than the other way around. In a relationship, women are VERY concerned about how good a man is in bed. There are a number of threads on LS about women walking out on their very comfortable lives because their husbands are no longer able to satisfy them sexually. If men think that all they have to do to secure a beautiful woman is to make sure she's financially comfortable, they're wrong.

 

This is a very sad but true statement. After reading many of the "my husband doesn't do it for me in the bedroom" threads... it's pretty clear that the women share some similar traits. They are emotionally disconnected from their spouse, they tend to have wandering eyes, and they tend to accept no responsibility for their own sex lives.

 

At what point can a woman honestly just point her finger and say it's all his fault... when in reality she could easily be satisfied provided she put in some effort herself.

 

Funny how it's hard to achieve orgasm with a husband or BF who shares responsibilities... but easy and often intense when cheating.

 

If Western men want golddiggers they can just go for foreign women in developing countries, which is what a lot of men do. It takes a lot less money to be "rich" in a poor country and thereby attract local golddiggers. It is just like people in Texas hiring illegal Mexican gardeners and nannies.

 

That's really a false stereotype. Foreign women just tend to be happier being middle class. They also value family and children more, so they tend to actually be attracted to men who are good fathers.

 

Compare that to the women here who are just walking laundry lists of entitled attitudes. They expect men to be good fathers, so it's not a trait even considered attractive in a man... then are shocked when they find the guy cares little for their kids.

 

It's just like that thread about simply expecting a man not to be abusive. Well... if your just expecting it... then your really likely to blindly walk into an abusive situation.

[musemaj11]

And this is part of the reason I don't makeup and dress myself up all nice and pretty to go out all the time. The guys I've been with, I could tell that they were quite pleasantly surprised the first time in the bedroom, when the baggy tee and jeans went off. That way, I know they're with me for something far more substantial than my appearance.

Well, I think people should try to look nice in public. However, there is a difference between looking nice and looking like someone else.

 

Countless women make a great effort everyday to not look like themselves and then whine about how men dont appreciate them the way they are.

 

© If Western men want golddiggers they can just go for foreign women in developing countries, which is what a lot of men do. It takes a lot less money to be "rich" in a poor country and thereby attract local golddiggers. It is just like people in Texas hiring illegal Mexican gardeners and nannies.

As UF already explained, foreign women from developing countries are far more traditional and they do have a very high value in a man's ability to provide. However, usually they simply want a man who has an average but stable job. They dont mind living modestly. Most of the times its their parents who are more picky financially.

 

(a) A lot of women spend their youth and peak attractiveness sleeping with guys who don't have a lot of money. Refer to the high school or college sluts you grew up with.

 

(b) It is generally when they're getting older (and less physically attractive) that become more interested in finding a guy with a high salary. Basically when they're finished having fun and approaching 30, finding a beta provider to pay for all their stuff becomes more pressing.

Yes yes, thats why I think I need to find a college sweetheart because I dont wanna end up like the older guys on this forum who are being drained financially by women their age.

 

Also, it's not as if you can't get a prenuptial for future protection. And if you find she's a gold digger, then divorce her. It really is that simple.

Due to my cultural background, divorce is something very taboo for me.

Edited November 22, 2010 by musemaj11

[Els]

Well, I think people should try to look nice in public. However, there is a difference between looking nice and looking like someone else.

 

Countless women make a great effort everyday to not look like themselves and then whine about how men dont appreciate them the way they are.

 

The example that I gave was simply to illustrate the fact that if you so fear being chosen for your financial wealth, you have complete control over whether that is a factor or not. C'mon, it isn't that hard to get, is it? It's just about balance, depending on your needs and desires. I will dress up if the occasion demands it, but I will wear a tee and jeans to a simple date at the movies because I want to know the real reason the guy is with me. Conversely, you don't need to drive a 1970 junk to pick her up for the date, but you should keep your Porsche in the garage (assuming you own one when that time comes) if you are so afraid of being chosen for your wealth. It's really that easy, unless you're the CEO of Microsoft and everyone knows your name. Chances are you won't be, though.

[Chicago_Guy]

I realize that historically marriages were pure business agreements and even today it is still the norm.

 

But am I being naive to think that there are actually people who decide to be together because they really enjoy each other's company even though they have better options?

 

Sometimes I'm just worried that one day I'm gonna get into a 'business' marriage in which I'm in it because the girl is hot n she is in it because she wants someone to feed her and provides shelter for her.

 

It is honestly the biggest fear I have for my future.

 

I don't even think that is is true anymore for a lot of people. Men really do generally want a beautiful woman. However, a lot of women don't seem to care at all whether a man has money or is financially successful. Some women think to themselves that they make enough money themselves and don't need a man for money, so a man's income might have no bearing on whether they choose to date that man. A least with respect to dating, I am actually surprised at how little weight some women place on a man's income, as I would think that this information would be highly relevant to lifestyle compatibility. [Maybe women do place more emphasis on income when they consider marriage than they do when they consider whether to date someone.]

Edited November 23, 2010 by Chicago_Guy

[Chicago_Guy]

This is just rubbish. It may be true that most very rich men will choose a beautiful woman given the chance but if the opposite was also true then all beautiful women would be married to rich men - and last time I looked this wasn't the case. There are just as many beautiful women in the lower financial levels of society as there are amongst the filthy rich. If anything, all it proves is how shallow most men are compared to women.

 

I roll my eyes whenever I read a comment from someone who implies or claims outright that men are more shallow than women. Few men would agree with that claim. Based on my own personal experiences, women are far more shallow than men. Granted, men are generally more visual than women and place more emphasis on overall looks than women tend to do. However, women are far more shallow with respect to everything else.

 

Some women place a ridiculous amount of emphasis on a man's wardrobe or how he dresses, whereas few men care about a woman's wardrobe, provided she looks at least presentable. Also, read the threads here - women place a hell of a lot more emphasis on height and there is absolutely nothing a man can do if he is short, whereas an obese women can actually lose weight to make herself more attractive.

 

Some women even get turned off if a man is reliable, because he is "too nice" or "boring." Most men, on the other hand, are attracted to a reliable woman.

[LittleTiger]

I mean, the idea that men want attractive women and women want men with money is nothing new. Even if this study never came out, people everywhere would still say the same thing.

 

I'm not entirely sure why we're still discussing this as I've already said that I agree with you in terms of how our biology works and my only real argument was with you using a 'scientific study' to prove that love is not involved in choosing a mate - when the study tells us no such thing.

 

For men, the looks and the sex are their main motivators. More so than for women because women would marry men even if the sex is lousy. They might care more about it during their teens and 20s when they're slutting themselves around town. But when they want to settle down with Pointdexter, the financial stuff is more important than the man's looks and his sex skills.

 

I have to disagree with this. As I mentioned before, you'll see many examples on LS of women prepared to leave their comfortable lives and a partner/husband they love, because of lack of sexual compatibility in their 30s or 40s. Many women become more interested in sex as they mature, not less.

 

Women typically marry someone who makes more money than she does. That doesn't mean that they guy she marries is rich. He's just someone making more than she does.

 

That's because, on average, even in this day and age, men make more money than women - period!

 

You're right. But that doesn't mean that women don't enjoy those free rides in life.

 

I think you'll find that most of these women getting 'free rides' are actually busy bringing up the man's children and looking after his home, as well as going out to work themselves. It's only a very small minority of men who can afford to keep their wives, plus a housekeeper and nanny - so that the woman gets a real 'free ride'.

 

Trust me, I read the question. Love is something I have for my family, for my job, for the money I make, for the people in the military who try to fight off the enemy, for the sports I enjoy to watch, for the times I hang out with friends, for the times I'm having sex with women. Now, if you're talking about being in love with a girl, then that's a little different. Because I can like a girl, but I won't marry anyone. Marriage is not for everyone, and you can include me on that list.

 

Ok, so now I'm wondering why you even posted on this thread. No wonder you are focusing on the first phrase of the title. You have just admitted that you don't even know what romantic love is!

[LittleTiger]

I roll my eyes whenever I read a comment from someone who implies or claims outright that men are more shallow than women. Few men would agree with that claim. Based on my own personal experiences, women are far more shallow than men. Granted, men are generally more visual than women and place more emphasis on overall looks than women tend to do. However, women are far more shallow with respect to everything else.

 

I think you took that one line of mine out of context. I was merely pointing out to FP, the discrepancy in his argument. I don't actually believe men are more shallow than women. I think there are many shallow men and many shallow women and, strangely, there are quite a high number of both here on LS, which I'm pretty sure isn't a true representation of our society. Hopefully the shallow people will find one another, make each other miserable and leave the rest of us to have meaningful relationships.

[LittleTiger]

The example that I gave was simply to illustrate the fact that if you so fear being chosen for your financial wealth, you have complete control over whether that is a factor or not. C'mon, it isn't that hard to get, is it? It's just about balance, depending on your needs and desires. I will dress up if the occasion demands it, but I will wear a tee and jeans to a simple date at the movies because I want to know the real reason the guy is with me. Conversely, you don't need to drive a 1970 junk to pick her up for the date, but you should keep your Porsche in the garage (assuming you own one when that time comes) if you are so afraid of being chosen for your wealth. It's really that easy, unless you're the CEO of Microsoft and everyone knows your name. Chances are you won't be, though.

 

I understand where you're coming from here Elswyth, though I think there's a fine line here that could cross over into dishonesty. If I dated a guy who I thought was Mr Average in terms of wealth and then found out, after I'd fallen for him, that he was rich, I'd be a little concerned about trust. I'm a big believer in 100% honesty. It probably depends on how soon he disclosed his true financial status.

 

I know what you mean about the dressing down thing too. As you know, I met my man online. What you may not know (though I've said it a few times on LS) is that he travelled 12,000 miles to meet me for the first time without even knowing what I looked like. I offered him photos on many occasions and he said he had such strong feelings for me, as a person, that he didn't want to see my face until we actually met.

 

As we're now 'head over heels' he obviously wasn't disappointed by what he saw and I will always have the reassurance of knowing that he loved 'me' first, before my face/body came into the equation.

 

So, even though biology says that women want someone to look after them and men want good looking women, what this discussion tells us is that most of us are very aware of it. The good news is that, being aware of it is what enables us to rise above it and we can all take steps to minimise the risk of ending up in that kind of 'partnership'.

[Eeyore79]

Maybe women do place more emphasis on income when they consider marriage than they do when they consider whether to date someone.

 

Definitely true, in my personal experience. A guy might be good enough to date in the short term, but not good enough to marry. He might be ok as a boyfriend, but you don't want him to be the father of your children.

 

I will however say that looks become much more important when you're thinking about marrying a guy. That's when "Is he attractive enough to have sex with?" becomes "Do I want my kids to have that nose?" Marriage-minded women have a tendency to assess men in terms of their genetic material as well as their income!

[Corporation Lizzie]

Newsflash: People like attractive people and money

 

Can it be true???!!!

 

The mass stereotypes being displayed in this thread are frankly hilarious. Now don't mind me I'm off to get a tan and find myself a lawyer

[SteveC80]

 

I will however say that looks become much more important when you're thinking about marrying a guy. That's when "Is he attractive enough to have sex with?" becomes "Do I want my kids to have that nose?" Marriage-minded women have a tendency to assess men in terms of their genetic material as well as their income!

 

Yeah i mean who cares how good a guy he is or how he treats you or how good your connection is its more important to treat your child whos not born yet like a doll and give it certain traits

 

God you women are goofy:laugh:

[LittleTiger]

FourthPlanet, I did start reading your post, as a matter of courtesy. I rolled my eyes through the entire first paragraph and when I reached the 'for married women the missionary position is all that's needed' I decided to stop wasting my time.

 

I don't know your history, but some woman has obviously done a really good job on you. If you choose to think so badly of women as a whole then so be it, nothing I say will change your mind.

[SteveC80]

I always tell guys who never got women when they were in their teens and 20's to be leery if they start to get women later on in life chances are theryes an alterior motive with the women..

[musemaj11]

Definitely true, in my personal experience. A guy might be good enough to date in the short term, but not good enough to marry. He might be ok as a boyfriend, but you don't want him to be the father of your children.

 

I will however say that looks become much more important when you're thinking about marrying a guy. That's when "Is he attractive enough to have sex with?" becomes "Do I want my kids to have that nose?" Marriage-minded women have a tendency to assess men in terms of their genetic material as well as their income!

In other words, you just want everything.

 

The example that I gave was simply to illustrate the fact that if you so fear being chosen for your financial wealth, you have complete control over whether that is a factor or not. C'mon, it isn't that hard to get, is it? It's just about balance, depending on your needs and desires. I will dress up if the occasion demands it, but I will wear a tee and jeans to a simple date at the movies because I want to know the real reason the guy is with me. Conversely, you don't need to drive a 1970 junk to pick her up for the date, but you should keep your Porsche in the garage (assuming you own one when that time comes) if you are so afraid of being chosen for your wealth. It's really that easy, unless you're the CEO of Microsoft and everyone knows your name. Chances are you won't be, though.

Ya I agree with you.

 

But then again, if I brought my Model T car and she still wanted to date me, then she must be a real keeper!

[Eeyore79]

Yeah i mean who cares how good a guy he is or how he treats you or how good your connection is its more important to treat your child whos not born yet like a doll and give it certain traits:

 

I'm just pointing out that women do think about looks, especially when it comes to having kids with a guy. Not everyone is lucky enough to get an attractive confident man who's also dependable, trustworthy, hard-working, etc. For a lot of women, the best situation they can manage is to get pregnant to a good looking jerk, and then leave him and find a dependable guy to raise the kids. The kids will then be confident and handsome like the jerk, but will have the stable home provided by Mr Dependable. Look around you; you can see it happening everywhere.

 

I'm not saying that all women do this, but I see it often enough for it to be worth pointing out.

[Woggle]

Any dependable man who gets involved with a woman like that is a moron. I am not going back to my woman bashing but women like that are one big walking red flag.

[SteveC80]

I'm just pointing out that women do think about looks, especially when it comes to having kids with a guy. Not everyone is lucky enough to get an attractive confident man who's also dependable, trustworthy, hard-working, etc. For a lot of women, the best situation they can manage is to get pregnant to a good looking jerk, and then leave him and find a dependable guy to raise the kids. The kids will then be confident and handsome like the jerk, but will have the stable home provided by Mr Dependable. Look around you; you can see it happening everywhere.

 

I'm not saying that all women do this, but I see it often enough for it to be worth pointing out.

 

Well women who do that are whackjobs who any decent Man should steer clear of

 

If you choose your partner on what your kids MIGHT look like youre a loon and should seek professional help

Edited November 24, 2010 by SteveC80

[Woggle]

Well women who do that are whackjobs who any decent Man should steer clear of

 

This I agree with but not all women are like this.

[SteveC80]

This I agree with but not all women are like this.

 

I know,ive yet to come acorss anyone that shallow except for some of the loons on here

[Woggle]

I know,ive yet to come acorss anyone that shallow except for some of the loons on here

 

I have come across people like that but I hate when my gender is generalized so I will extend the same courtesy from now on. A man just needs to know the red flags and stay away from women like that.

[Els]

Ya I agree with you.

 

But then again, if I brought my Model T car and she still wanted to date me, then she must be a real keeper!

 

Rofl. Fine line there; I wouldn't say that if I went out in clothes covered with grime and my hair teeming with maggots and the guy still liked me, he was a keeper... I would say that he was effing insane!

[Els]

I understand where you're coming from here Elswyth, though I think there's a fine line here that could cross over into dishonesty. If I dated a guy who I thought was Mr Average in terms of wealth and then found out, after I'd fallen for him, that he was rich, I'd be a little concerned about trust. I'm a big believer in 100% honesty. It probably depends on how soon he disclosed his true financial status.

 

Certainly he shouldn't lie about it. But it isn't inconceivable for a very rich guy to want to drive a modest car around. I know lots of men who do that; and it isn't because they share the OP's fears either. Equally so, it's entirely possible to be rich and not showy without being dishonest.

 

I know what you mean about the dressing down thing too. As you know, I met my man online. What you may not know (though I've said it a few times on LS) is that he travelled 12,000 miles to meet me for the first time without even knowing what I looked like. I offered him photos on many occasions and he said he had such strong feelings for me, as a person, that he didn't want to see my face until we actually met.

 

This is awesome. As a matter of fact, the first time the current bf and I met IRL (as bf/gf, we were RL friends ages ago before he left for NZ) 3 years ago he came up to my apartment and I was there dressed in a baggy home tee and shorts! He still seemed to be unable to keep his eyes off me for even a second though. Ah, good ol' days.

 

As we're now 'head over heels' he obviously wasn't disappointed by what he saw and I will always have the reassurance of knowing that he loved 'me' first, before my face/body came into the equation.

 

So, even though biology says that women want someone to look after them and men want good looking women, what this discussion tells us is that most of us are very aware of it. The good news is that, being aware of it is what enables us to rise above it and we can all take steps to minimise the risk of ending up in that kind of 'partnership'.

 

I agree completely.