But he'll be different with me

[OWoman]

Why do you think they wont be the same masochist that they are with the person they married and refuse to leave?

 

Because:

 

* he was willing to put in the effort of dumping her and making the change;

* he was willing to put in all the time, effort and motivation to address whatever issues had led to him putting up with all her crap all those years, through IC;

* he was willing to make the changes to his way of thinking, relating, and being, to sustain what he'd discovered in IC;

* he is willing, each day, to do what it takes not to fall into those old familiar patterns;

* he shows me constantly how much he values our R, and how he prioritises it, and how he would not risk it through negligence or carelessness

* he demonstrates his love consistently in so many ways;

* his former life with her had shown him just how bad things can get if you let them - that alone motivates him not ever to go there again!

 

I can go on.... and on.... How many reasons do you want?

[greengoddess]

Because:

 

* he was willing to put in the effort of dumping her and making the change;

* he was willing to put in all the time, effort and motivation to address whatever issues had led to him putting up with all her crap all those years, through IC;

* he was willing to make the changes to his way of thinking, relating, and being, to sustain what he'd discovered in IC;

* he is willing, each day, to do what it takes not to fall into those old familiar patterns;

* he shows me constantly how much he values our R, and how he prioritises it, and how he would not risk it through negligence or carelessness

* he demonstrates his love consistently in so many ways;

* his former life with her had shown him just how bad things can get if you let them - that alone motivates him not ever to go there again!

 

I can go on.... and on.... How many reasons do you want?

 

 

ahhh but owoman what about you? What makes you believe you can change? You do not believe in marrriage and yet you got married. What makes you believe you can stay faithful when you do not believe in the marriage vows you took?

[jennie-jennie]

Because he already is different with me than with his wife. Our relationship is different. It is based on a different value ground, where intimacy and naked honesty is prioritized, not "doing what you are supposed to do".

[jennie-jennie]

That heading should really read "But THEY'LL be different with me"

 

Why do you think those of us who have fallen for the MM/MW think we can change them?

 

Why do we think that they wont be the lying cheating masochists that they are?

 

Food for thought

 

Your guy didn't "refuse to leave" like the opening post says. Different type of guy. Now if you look at the "typical" cheating person, they spin a MILLION different excuses (and they ARE excuses, not reasons) why they "can't" end their marriage.

 

Are you posting on the wrong thread? The OP, which I posted above, says noting about "refuse to leave".

[Mimolicious]

Hi. I was of the 'he won't do it to me' mindset but not really because I thought about it in terms of 'he will change.' Rather I was thinking at first (if I was thinking about it at all at first, LOL, which a lot of the time I wasn't) that there was something wrong with the relationship, not him. Then by listening to his 'complaints' I realized that his wife really wasn't that bad, actually by his own admissions she was a great mother and wife. When I heard about her I thought, wow, she does a lot more for him than I've ever done for any guy, ex., had his kids, stayed at home to raise his kids, helped him through a life-threatening disease, basically made it so that her life revolved around him.

 

So then I thought, well, they must be a bad match, which I do think to some extent they are because he needs adventure and excitement and she is rather boring and routine (which she'd have to be, to accomplish all of the stuff above, which was the ironic thing). She also wasn't very intelligent to put it nicely (I'm not trying to knock her, just give the facts or at least how he told them, or my own perception of things) and they didn't have a lot in common. So I thought well he and I are a better fit and he wouldn't do that to me, but then I thought, hmmm, at one time he was by his own admission madly in love with her, and he married her, and she hasn't really changed that much except for becoming more mature and responsible (which I guess he never did LOL) so now how can he complain about, or even worse, cheat because of the fact that they're not right together?

 

So that left me with the disturbing realization that perhaps he is too demanding, perhaps one woman could never satisfy all his needs. He did expect her life to revolve around him and their kids but then he also wanted adventure and excitement and no dull routines which is the exact opposite. He wanted to go out and drink with me and be wild and crazy yet how could she do that and also be a good mom and role model to their kids? I began to see that his expectations were a bit ridiculous. That maybe he had the problem, not her, because she was just doing what normal adults do when they have kids and grow up, and he was faulting her for nagging at him (really his biggest complaint about her, except he said she was stubborn and couldn't ever admit she was wrong... hmm sounds like him LOL) when really it was him with the issues, not her.

 

When I saw it that way I began to really worry that he would do it to me. Because no matter what I gave him it wasn't enough for him to be with me the right way and no matter what she gave him it wasn't enough for him to be faithful to her. Really there is probably no one thing any one woman could do to keep him happy, he just wants the best of all worlds. So I would rather hold out for the kind of guy who wouldn't cheat no matter what the issues. I know there are people out there and I do think it's a character issue -- some people will cheat if things are going badly (their way of escape I guess) and some will cheat if things are going great (just want more variety or are never happy I guess) and then some won't cheat no matter how great or bad things are because they just aren't wired that way I guess. So why would I want the one who I know is capable of cheating? Especially when things weren't that bad with him and his wife and if they were it was mostly because of his own issues I would think.

 

 

Whoa! Maravilla- You are truly loaded with "Maravilla". (If you know what that means in Spanish). God bless your heart babygirl! You are one brilliant chick. The universe will send you that hot-stud who will treat you the way you deserve.

[Mimolicious]

Wow what an absolutely perfect and insightful view of the proble. A perfect summation of why many people cheat. They want to have fun!!! and not live the day to day responsibilities of married life so they pretend to be working while the spouse takes care of all the mundane house chores and they get to play and party instead of growing up.

 

 

Yep, I know a fool who lives this way. He is called my xH. He is now living at his momma's, broken (in all possible ways), stuck in the 90's, with 2 kids, no biz, no $ and no family. Hey it's all about the FUN and AMAZING! (idiot!)

[maravilla]

Whoa! Maravilla- You are truly loaded with "Maravilla". (If you know what that means in Spanish). God bless your heart babygirl! You are one brilliant chick. The universe will send you that hot-stud who will treat you the way you deserve.

 

Awww thanks Mimolicious!

 

Maravilla = wonder! I love that word.

 

And the universe can send me that hot stud who treats me the way I deserve any time it wants to... I'm waiting... LOL!

[OWoman]

ahhh but owoman what about you? What makes you believe you can change? You do not believe in marrriage and yet you got married. What makes you believe you can stay faithful when you do not believe in the marriage vows you took?

 

This thread is not about me. It's about MM and their ability to change with a new partner.

 

If you're that fascinated with me, I'd suggest you look up the answers I've already given countless times to those questions instead of t/jing other threads.

[pureinheart]

Because:

 

* he was willing to put in the effort of dumping her and making the change;

* he was willing to put in all the time, effort and motivation to address whatever issues had led to him putting up with all her crap all those years, through IC;

* he was willing to make the changes to his way of thinking, relating, and being, to sustain what he'd discovered in IC;

* he is willing, each day, to do what it takes not to fall into those old familiar patterns;

* he shows me constantly how much he values our R, and how he prioritises it, and how he would not risk it through negligence or carelessness

* he demonstrates his love consistently in so many ways;

* his former life with her had shown him just how bad things can get if you let them - that alone motivates him not ever to go there again!

 

I can go on.... and on.... How many reasons do you want?

 

Because he already is different with me than with his wife. Our relationship is different. It is based on a different value ground, where intimacy and naked honesty is prioritized, not "doing what you are supposed to do".

 

These are the recipes that keep it real, that causes the change in all parties for the better (the AP's tranisitioning to a new life).

 

WR, I think this is why I was angry and hurt...because mine was not real...could this be the case with anger and hurt on this board?

Edited November 17, 2010 by pureinheart

[WowReally]

I hear ya WR...both exDM and his W were like that....the thrill of the chase, or catch, meaning who would get caught first:rolleyes:...what a joke, and I was part of that for a time.

 

All of that is over now, and it will be a distant memory for you also...only there for the purpose of understanding others.

 

Your doing really good BTW, I just get concerned when I hear a lot of anger and resentment because I was there many times and sometimes it took me to some very destructive places.

 

Stand in there WR (((((((((((hugs))))))))))

 

Yea well Im going to have some emotions about the whole mess...I'm going through some withdrawl again.

 

I just keep reminding myself that he's run back to the bed he loves to cheat on and he'll never change - nor will his wife. If he truly wanted to change he wouldn't have run back home.

 

They're both in denial and just want the lifestyle that they treasure and it will only exist if they stay together. He's actually told me this in an email.

[TinaniT]

The question is pretty straight forward...I know alot of you still have hope so Im sorry if this question bursts your bubble

 

Why do you think they wont be the same masochist that they are with the person they married and refuse to leave?

 

The question pretty well assumes they DO leave... because whether they will cheat on your marriage or not is a moot point if they don't leave and marry you.

 

 

I am not worried about my love cheating on me because the cheating is not what defines him. It is a mistake in a bad spot when he got hopeless and leaving the marriage seemed so daunting and so inevitable - it was going to happen, but not yet. It is the only time he ever cheated and everything else in his life defines him as a man of integrity and character.

I know a person who cheats once won't necessarily cheat again, because I cheated on my abusive ex husband. I never have cheated before that, and never will again. Never will allow myself to feel that worthless and feel so financially and emotionally trapped.

 

One relationship and the behaviors that existed within it do not continue in all relationships necessarily. Otherwise, all relationships would be the same and there would be no success and failure. Two different people bring different interaction and different behaviors.

 

Though, he did assure me he would not let the things that led to the breakdown of their marriage happen in ours--- we both attended counseling both separate and together (I continue to do so.)

[Silly_Girl]

The question pretty well assumes they DO leave... because whether they will cheat on your marriage or not is a moot point if they don't leave and marry you.

 

 

I am not worried about my love cheating on me because the cheating is not what defines him. It is a mistake in a bad spot when he got hopeless and leaving the marriage seemed so daunting and so inevitable - it was going to happen, but not yet. It is the only time he ever cheated and everything else in his life defines him as a man of integrity and character.

I know a person who cheats once won't necessarily cheat again, because I cheated on my abusive ex husband. I never have cheated before that, and never will again. Never will allow myself to feel that worthless and feel so financially and emotionally trapped.

 

One relationship and the behaviors that existed within it do not continue in all relationships necessarily. Otherwise, all relationships would be the same and there would be no success and failure. Two different people bring different interaction and different behaviors.

 

Though, he did assure me he would not let the things that led to the breakdown of their marriage happen in ours--- we both attended counseling both separate and together (I continue to do so.)

 

Absolutely love this post. My guy and I were talking this over last night. About his behaviour when he was like a stoopid rabbit in headlights, and my anger and things I said/accused him of in temper. Those things are not what define us. Every set of circumstances is different, there may be themes and similarities but we all get to a place by means of a different route, and that can have an enormous impact on outcomes... Hope things are still going well for you all, T.

[greengoddess]

This thread is not about me. It's about MM and their ability to change with a new partner.

 

If you're that fascinated with me, I'd suggest you look up the answers I've already given countless times to those questions instead of t/jing other threads.

 

You have shared numerous times that you don't believe in marriage. NUMEROUS. This is about what makes you think "cheaters" can change. That was your MO. You were a cheater with married men numerous times and you don't believe in marriage so of course I am very curious from your own personal experience if you believe you have changed? I don't understand why this question bothers you so much.

[jthorne]

One relationship and the behaviors that existed within it do not continue in all relationships necessarily. Otherwise, all relationships would be the same and there would be no success and failure. Two different people bring different interaction and different behaviors.

 

Though, he did assure me he would not let the things that led to the breakdown of their marriage happen in ours--- we both attended counseling both separate and together (I continue to do so.)

I agree and disagree with this post. Unless a person does the work to discover what led to the breakdown in the first M, they take that baggage into the second. Probably a good indicator of why second marriages have much higher odds of D than first ones do.

 

Unfortunately, those that cheat typically do not want to do that work. That's why they cheated in the first place. They do not want to fix what's broken, they want someone or something to fix it for them. It takes a lot of effort and honest introspection to make that change. But those that are truly willing to do it and not just half-azz it-- that are willing to look within themselves instead of blaming others have a much higher chance of succeeding the second time around.

[OWoman]

You have shared numerous times that you don't believe in marriage. NUMEROUS.

 

I'm not sure what bothers you so much that you feel the need to repeat that, SHOUTING!

 

This is about what makes you think "cheaters" can change.

 

No it's not: from the OP:

 

Why do you think those of us who have fallen for the MM/MW think we can change them?

 

Why do we think that they wont be the lying cheating masochists that they are?

 

It's quite clearly about the capacity of the MM or MW to change (or, to be changed by their AP).

 

I have never been a WS. Thus, my ability to change or not is not the subject of the discussion as determined by the OP. If you're that interested in whether or not OWs can change, you're welcome to start a thread on that topic, but this is not it.

 

That was your MO. You were a cheater with married men numerous times

 

OTC I have never been a "cheater". I am always completely honest and transparent in my Rs and all of my partners, past and present, have known exactly where they stand with me. I have never lied to any partner, nor to anyone else about my Rs, so the question does not apply to me.

 

and you don't believe in marriage so of course I am very curious from your own personal experience if you believe you have changed? I don't understand why this question bothers you so much.

 

The question would not bother me if it was on a thread dealing with such matters. It is not - it is very clearly off-topic, as pointed out before and explained above. Your consistent attempts to turn almost any thread on which I post into a discussion about me suggests a preoccupation bordering on an unhealthy obsession, and if you consider my unwillingness to enable that to be a sign that I'm "bothered", you're free to do so. It makes not the slightest difference in my life and I'm hardly going to lose sleep over it

 

I hope you find the answers you're looking for so that you can heal and move on in your life.

[OWoman]

I agree and disagree with this post. Unless a person does the work to discover what led to the breakdown in the first M, they take that baggage into the second. Probably a good indicator of why second marriages have much higher odds of D than first ones do.

 

Unfortunately, those that cheat typically do not want to do that work. That's why they cheated in the first place. They do not want to fix what's broken, they want someone or something to fix it for them. It takes a lot of effort and honest introspection to make that change. But those that are truly willing to do it and not just half-azz it-- that are willing to look within themselves instead of blaming others have a much higher chance of succeeding the second time around.

 

Agree completely! I've seen this work both ways - those who are willing to do the work and make the changes, and those who are not. (And it's not only in an A situation where that happens...)