The End.

[Art_Critic]

However you might feel, I think what's done is done. Learn from your mistakes and move on.

 

Dating is nothing more than finding out what we want in a partner or rather what we don't want in a partner..

Everybody learns from dating and breakups.

[Els]

I think the email was well phrased and TA did the right thing by being honest about how she felt about him. I don't see it as manipulative at all. She came clean, gave him the information he needed. As a result, she now knows exactly where he stands and doesn't have to wonder anymore.

 

I imagine that even though she will grieve this relationship, last night she must have felt an immense sense of clarity and relief. I'm shocked that people have so little compassion and will continue harping on her over details when she just lost a relationship that was significant to her.

 

I agree completely with this. What's done is done. The best thing that we can all do now is to support TA in moving on as best she can. Which she is already doing a marvellous job with, by the way.

 

I think you did absolutely the right thing.

 

You have followed your instincts to the very end. I also think that his reply was ice cold. You clearly stated that you think you love him and that you feel he doesn't really feel the same way. Have you been wrong on this, he would have fought for you. He would have called you, scratch that, he would have been knocking on your door assuring you that he does feel the same and asking you to work things out. Anything else is LAME and BS.

 

Some women on this thread make me wonder if their expectations of men in their life are so low, that they will clearly allow for someone to treat them like c*ap just so they can continue being in a relationship. It seems to me that their advice reflects that they have never been treated how a woman should.

 

To be fair, what would you have done if you received an email saying what TA did? Would you have fought for him and gone knocking on his door asking to work things out? Wouldn't you have thought that to be desperate of you, and indignified? What would your advice have been to someone on these forums who had received that?

 

And in the end, does it matter what his reaction is? Would it change anything if he had gone knocking on her door? One gallant display will not change the fact that he is and will still remain a stressed, overworked man who is emotionally distancing himself from everyone to cope with things, and unable to give TA the time and lovin' she needs from a relationship. It's best for them both that it end this way.

[tigressA]

Thanks for the support everyone, but I can handle the criticism; I'm a big girl. People will have their opinion of how I'm handling things. It's up to me how to take it and use it to better myself. I'm not excusing my behavior; like Kamille said, I have readily acknowledged that there were things I could have done differently.

 

I did what I had to do for myself. Also like Kamille and LoveLace said, I could not stand to wait in this torturous limbo until he just decided to make time for me. I did what I could with what I had. He wasn't answering his phone; I wasn't about to wait for days or maybe even a week or more to end things just to do it face-to-face, and it seems that everyone who harped on me about that just conveniently forgot that it's an hour's drive between us, and that he would be coming around JUST to hear me dump him.

 

I feel like I've done much of my grieving. I cried so much last week and things weren't even over. I was agonizing over what to do for awhile; I kept going back and forth, and I knew deep down what the right thing was. When I did it there was a huge weight off my back. When I think of him or talk about him I don't even have a pang in my gut. It's like he's just someone I bumped into on the street one day and I happen to know a lot about him.

[Jannah]

I am not sure I understand where the third degree is coming from with regard to Tigress. Yes, of course she could have handled things better on her end, but it looks to be that she made the choice to end things because she wasn't happy with his treatment (or lack there of) towards her.

When a person is being treated from a place of disregard, it becomes a source of frustration for the person on the receiving end.

 

The place of disregard was sourced by him referring to her as a “very very good friend”, his complaint about the drive when he went to visit her, his offer to spend two hours a week together, and spending that time on a business call. Not sure if that was a regular thing for them, but keep in mind, this was in the beginning stages of developing a relationship.

There were other instances Tigress mentioned in earlier threads that weren't positive for the relationship.

 

And then there’s this:

 

He was also working this whole weekend, which is why I couldn't see him--we had planned for me going there for the weekend but then he found out he had to work. And since he's only been back for a week and he was gone for so long, and they're the only reason for him being here in the States...had no choice but to call off that visit.

 

When he was here Wednesday night, he was talking about how he felt. He did say that he should take some time for himself and focus on his work, etc.

He goes on to ignore her for a few days, after she tried to reach him several times, except when he promptly responded to her break-up email with this:

 

"I don't know what to say on this. But I will respect your thoughts.

 

Wish you all of my luck."

 

[LittleTiger]

When I think of him or talk about him I don't even have a pang in my gut. It's like he's just someone I bumped into on the street one day and I happen to know a lot about him.

 

In that case, I'd guess it wasn't 'love'.

 

Good luck with your next 'relationship' Tigress. I have no doubt we'll hear all about it.

 

(Just teasing )

[Art_Critic]

Next..........................

[tigressA]

In that case, I'd guess it wasn't 'love'.

 

Uh...wow.

 

Wasn't it several people here on this thread that said people grieve in different ways? And of course, there's no one definition of love. Now I'm just waiting for the onslaught of people to tell me I must not really love him because of how I'm feeling now.

[LittleTiger]

Uh...wow.

 

Wasn't it several people here on this thread that said people grieve in different ways? And of course, there's no one definition of love. Now I'm just waiting for the onslaught of people to tell me I must not really love him because of how I'm feeling now.

 

It doesn't matter what anyone else thinks, Tigress, it's how you feel that matters.

 

I said I guess it wasn't 'love' (in inverted commas).

 

That doesn't mean you didn't love him in your own way, but it's my belief that you would feel a little more than what you've described if he was the man you were hoping to spend the rest of your life with. JMO.

 

I'm sincerely not meaning to sound patronising here but I do believe that one day you will understand what I mean.

[tigressA]

I honestly feel so sorry for C now. I feel bad. Now that I know that he's been taking his friends for granted as well and his best friend is on the verge of ending their friendship...

 

On the one hand it's nice to know I'm not the only one he was doing this to; on the other I feel upset that they're going through the same thing I was, and that soon enough C's not going to have anyone close by to go to. I know to a big, big extent C brought this on himself. Yet I still can't help but wish I had had the strength to stick by him. It sounds absurd given all he did, given all I put up with. But I still feel it. I hate to say that there's only so much one can take, even if there's love there, before they've had enough of being neglected. It's true, but I hate to say it...I could weep for him, I really could.

[welikeincrowds]

This thread is such a cluster****. At this point I can't follow a single argument to its conclusion. The same evidence has been spun to support different points, and some of that evidence turned out to not even be correct. And to no fault of her own, TA was not a very reliable narrator.

 

The term "grief" was used in this thread to describe the emotions C may be experiencing given the loss of his uncle. I see it now being used to describe TA in her decision to leave her relationship. Which is not to take away from TA/C's loss, I suppose. I'm sure grief is as appropriate a term as any.

 

What was once just a "very very close friend" is now, unequivocally, the boyfriend. So he was committed after all. Or wasn't he? And did she take it back, or didn't she?

 

This was a relationship between two people who seemed to have shot quite past each other, despite apparently aiming for the same target.

 

The best part about this decision is that it brings some much-needed finality. At least one thing is certain: it's over. I don't mean to be flippant but if I'm losing my mind trying to sort it all out, you must have a long time ago, TA. No wonder you wanted to just end it.

 

Hopefully the time to follow will be enlightening. I'm sure the only way to get a full view of what happened, and what you can learn from it, is with a good amount of distance.

[Star Gazer]

SG.. when you went thru your breakup a while back ago were you not looking for support rather than to have your ass handed back to you ?

 

Then why won't you give her the same support you yourself were looking for when you were going thru your breakup ?

 

1. I DID have my ass handed to me by some of the posters in this thread, remember? To the point where my thread was locked. (No, TA wasn't one of those people) That said, there wasn't any decision I made or any of my behavior up for discussion in my breakup thread; just me sitting there getting beaten up while I grieved my loss. This is very different. But again, THIS IS ABOUT TA...not you or TBF or me. So stop making it personal!!

 

2. Support does not mean coddling or approval of poor behavior. I have been VERY supportive of TA in dealing with C and this relationship. Just read all her other threads, or ask her here about what goes on behind the scenes. Just because I disagree with her actions NOW in THIS thread doesn't mean she doesn't have my utmost support.

 

3. She quickly admitted the way she handled it was wrong. So clearly I'm not a loony toon.

[tigressA]

This thread is such a cluster****. At this point I can't follow a single argument to its conclusion. The same evidence has been spun to support different points, and some of that evidence turned out to not even be correct. And to no fault of her own, TA was not a very reliable narrator.

 

The term "grief" was used in this thread to describe the emotions C may be experiencing given the loss of his uncle. I see it now being used to describe TA in her decision to leave her relationship. Which is not to take away from TA/C's loss, I suppose. I'm sure grief is as appropriate a term as any.

 

1.)What was once just a "very very close friend" is now, unequivocally, the boyfriend. So he was committed after all. Or wasn't he?

 

2.)And did she take it back, or didn't she?

 

This was a relationship between two people who seemed to have shot quite past each other, despite apparently aiming for the same target.

.

 

1. He was the boyfriend, yes. We were committed to each other the whole time; he just had a different meaning of the title and didn't want to use it because he felt it was too important for what we were at this stage...after we discussed it though, he acknowledged the title of boyfriend and recognized himself as such. I brought up the terminology he originally used (very very close friend) as a way to trash him and make myself feel better. Typical early post-breakup phase. The posters who said it was "all in my head" and other nonsense clearly did not take the time to read my past threads thoroughly. They were not fully informed and yet they felt they could knowledgeably chime in here about our status. But that's part of the nature of LS.

 

2. I didn't take it back--to him, anyway.

Edited November 8, 2010 by tigressA

[Star Gazer]

I don't understand the criticism about TA not being *more* upset about the breakup. While TA kinda reacted rashly in HOW she ended it, she'd actually been thinking about how unhappy she was for a couple weeks, at least. Most people who breakup usually emotionally check out long before the actual breakup/last straw. I suspect something similar has happened here.

[tigressA]

I don't understand the criticism about TA not being *more* upset about the breakup. While TA kinda reacted rashly in HOW she ended it, she'd actually been thinking about how unhappy she was for a couple weeks, at least. Most people who breakup usually emotionally check out long before the actual breakup/last straw. I suspect something similar has happened here.

 

That is what happened. I mentioned that I had already done all my crying (and it was quite a lot) last week.

 

I really hope C doesn't destroy himself. I think he's been destructive enough already, taking everyone around him for granted to the point that they've cut him out (like me) or are on the verge of doing so (like his friends). I don't want it to turn out that he's lost all those around here who care about him...but at the same time perhaps that's what he needs. An awakening.

[Art_Critic]

1. I DID have my ass handed to me by some of the posters in this thread, remember? To the point where my thread was locked.

 

So clearly I'm not a loony toon.

 

You know what SG.. You are so right.. I went back and looked at that thread..

 

You did get your ass handed to you..

I guess my memory is failing me in my elder years.. .. sorry about that

 

But you also didn't like or agree with that type of support.. no ?.. your thread was locked for that reason.. right ?

 

Your not even close to be loony toons SG and I wasn't trying to say you were..

Edited November 8, 2010 by Art_Critic

[threebyfate]

tigress, how are you feeling?

[tigressA]

tigress, how are you feeling?

 

I'm feeling...this mix of upset and worry and numbness. I don't have the urge to cry; I don't feel "empty", but I am so beyond worried about him. Since getting that message from his best friend last night I feel like he's just destroying all his relationships by taking them for granted.

 

I know it's his problem; I know it's his doing, but I still feel sorry that this is happening to him, and them. I am feeling like I possibly may have even reconsidered my decision if I had known before that his friends were on the verge of cutting him out. I had no idea. I thought I was the only one he was doing it to. I didn't have any clue he's on the verge of finding himself alone until last night. Like I said, I know it's his doing but I still find myself wishing I had been strong enough to stick by him, despite what he's done, so he isn't alone.

[threebyfate]

I'm feeling...this mix of upset and worry and numbness. I don't have the urge to cry; I don't feel "empty", but I am so beyond worried about him. Since getting that message from his best friend last night I feel like he's just destroying all his relationships by taking them for granted.

 

I know it's his problem; I know it's his doing, but I still feel sorry that this is happening to him, and them. I am feeling like I possibly may have even reconsidered my decision if I had known before that his friends were on the verge of cutting him out. I had no idea. I thought I was the only one he was doing it to. I didn't have any clue he's on the verge of finding himself alone until last night. Like I said, I know it's his doing but I still find myself wishing I had been strong enough to stick by him, despite what he's done, so he isn't alone.

This is a combination of regret (from loss) and also, compassion for a loved one, isn't it?

 

Been there before too.

[Els]

I honestly feel so sorry for C now. I feel bad. Now that I know that he's been taking his friends for granted as well and his best friend is on the verge of ending their friendship...

 

On the one hand it's nice to know I'm not the only one he was doing this to; on the other I feel upset that they're going through the same thing I was, and that soon enough C's not going to have anyone close by to go to. I know to a big, big extent C brought this on himself. Yet I still can't help but wish I had had the strength to stick by him. It sounds absurd given all he did, given all I put up with. But I still feel it. I hate to say that there's only so much one can take, even if there's love there, before they've had enough of being neglected. It's true, but I hate to say it...I could weep for him, I really could.

 

I know this isn't going to curry much favour with the NC crowd, but I personally believe that you can remain friends even despite having broken up, if the breakup was mutual and amiable. In your position, I would personally be there for C if he ever needed support with his problems, even if I we weren't together anymore. I've personally done that for my exes, and I don't see anything wrong with it. But it's really your decision and I understand if you don't want to do it because it would prevent you from moving on.

[tigressA]

This is a combination of regret (from loss) and also, compassion for a loved one, isn't it?

 

Been there before too.

 

It doesn't really feel like I am concerned about MY loss of him and our relationship...I feel like I'm done with that. It's about HIS loss of his relationships, and possibly himself. Does that make sense? It's not me, me, me I'm concerning myself with, my feelings, my loss. It's him. Him, him, him.

[threebyfate]

It doesn't really feel like I am concerned about MY loss of him and our relationship...I feel like I'm done with that. It's about HIS loss of his relationships, and possibly himself. Does that make sense? It's not me, me, me I'm concerning myself with, my feelings, my loss. It's him. Him, him, him.

So what do you want to do, if anything?

[LittleTiger]

I don't understand the criticism about TA not being *more* upset about the breakup. While TA kinda reacted rashly in HOW she ended it, she'd actually been thinking about how unhappy she was for a couple weeks, at least. Most people who breakup usually emotionally check out long before the actual breakup/last straw. I suspect something similar has happened here.

 

I think I'm the only one who said anything about the possibility that this wasn't 'love' and it certainly wasn't a criticism. Far from it actually. I was merely pointing out that the feelings she does have suggest he wasn't the man for her in the long term.

 

Tigress herself has said many times how she wasn't sure about her feelings for this guy. In one post, not so long ago, she said something along the lines of 'there could be somebody better, or a better fit, out there for me', which indicates to me that this is/was not 'love' in the romantic 'want to spend the rest of my life with this person' sense. Which, in this situation is actually good news for Tigress isn't it?

 

I'm well aware that grief takes many forms and affects everybody differently. I certainly never said she wasn't grieving. We all grieve, to varying degrees, when we lose something and, in this case, Tigress has lost, at the very least the relationship, whether she loved the guy or not.

[LittleTiger]

It doesn't really feel like I am concerned about MY loss of him and our relationship...I feel like I'm done with that. It's about HIS loss of his relationships, and possibly himself. Does that make sense? It's not me, me, me I'm concerning myself with, my feelings, my loss. It's him. Him, him, him.

 

Tigress, he's a grown-up and he has to deal with his own demons. You can't fix somebody else, they have to fix themselves. YOU are not responsible for the mess that he's making with his own relationships or friendships.

 

Is it possible that you're feeling guilty for 'kicking him when he's down'? I'm not saying that's what you did but it may be what you're feeling.

 

If you want to support him and be his friend, I don't see any reason why you shouldn't do that but I suspect this is more about wanting to 'rescue' him from himself, which probably isn't a good idea for you at this point.

[tigressA]

I don't know what I want to do. Or what I should do.

 

Part of me wants to keep with the back-off and LET him hit bottom so that maybe he can finally see what he's been doing and grow up, and have more fulfilling relationships. This part of me feels like if he continues to have people around, he'll still continue to try and take advantage of them, they'll get fed up and ditch him, and he'll be forced to look at himself and change things.

 

The other part of me wants to reach out and be there for him, doesn't want him to be alone. This part of me feels like if he has no one around to support him then he'll go right on possibly destroying himself.

 

I am curious to know exactly what's been going on between C and his friends, particularly R, to make them feel on the verge of ditching him. I wonder if it's as serious as R has made it out to be--from the way he phrased his message it sounded like this wasn't just recent, like it's been going on for awhile, for perhaps much of the time I've known them. His very first sentence in his response to me told me that my decision was the right one and he "really appreciates that".

 

Edit: I just saw C is online in Gmail. His status message is "2 points can make a line...but never known if it's gonna be a borderline".

Edited November 8, 2010 by tigressA

[threebyfate]

I'd steer clear of societal "shoulds" and seriously consider not only what you want to do but the impacts of each decision, prior to taking any action which includes no action.

 

Interesting gmail message. It can be taken two ways, of which one is highly insulting.

 

Be a'feared of ambiguity.