So your girlfriend comes to you and says she wants to take a pole dancing class…

November 4, 2010

He's punishing you because he's afraid. When you brought the pole dancing class to his attention, you almost broke the barrier that he mentally has in place between the kind of woman that he accepts as a suitable partner and the other kind of woman that he rejects--a distinction based in antiquated notions of sexuality and how it should be expressed. His punishment is reinforcement meant to keep you from ever considering such a transformation again and a way for him to vent his frustration that you even considered it in the first place!

This is so true! Great post.

November 4, 2010

I would agree that it is close to emotional abuse. My ex use to pull it on me when I wanted to try something new. Of course it held me back, because I respected her wants, even though some were unreasonable.

If my girlfriend comes up to me and says she wants to take a pole dancing class, I would say go for it. I would even have a pole installed in our place and if she ever wants to pole dance at home (when I'm around), I wouldn't object

November 4, 2010

He's punishing you because he's afraid. When you brought the pole dancing class to his attention, you almost broke the barrier that he mentally has in place between the kind of woman that he accepts as a suitable partner and the other kind of woman that he rejects--a distinction based in antiquated notions of sexuality and how it should be expressed. His punishment is reinforcement meant to keep you from ever considering such a transformation again and a way for him to vent his frustration that you even considered it in the first place!

That’s a really great point, thanks PratyekaYana.

Now that you mention it, it’s not only the pole dancing class but anything I do or wear which is sexy gets the same reaction. Recently (sorry to keep bombarding you with examples!), I told him I’d like to buy a pair of those booty pop underwears… shhh, I have a flat pancake butt ok! hehe The first and only thing he said, after giving me that all too familiar look that he does was “who are you trying to impress?”. Immediate doubt and paranoia at the mere suggestion.

I was 21 when we met, more or less still a kid, and over the past 6.5 years I have grown into a mature, confident woman, who likes to feel sexy every now and then! I feel almost like he is trying to keep me as that naïve 21 year old I was when we met…

Akeshabelle: You really need to re-evaluate this relationship. You don't deserve to be treated this way, hun. It is wrong on all accounts.

I'm sure you love him, and you have invested 6.5 years into this relationship, but he isn't going to change.

How much of yourself are you prepared to lose?

I know. I guess I have a lot of thinking to do.

Thanks again everyone, so much for your kind words.

November 4, 2010

It's like finding out that your girlfriend is going to get her breasts enlarged even though you were totally against it. Because the question now becomes, Did she do this for me, or did she do this to get the attention from other men?

How bout doing it for herself?

November 4, 2010

Hmmm...I'd probably then go online to see how much it would cost to put a stripper pole in the bedroom.

November 4, 2010

Pretty much can do it at Home Depot for under 50 bucks, presuming a normal 8' ceiling height. I've got all the materials in the shop right now.

November 4, 2010

OH and he is always watching those Girls Gone Wild shows… he loves them!!! Watching girls getting all drunk and loud and naked, but God help me if I ever even contemplated any of that behaviour!!! It’s like I have to be his quiet little good girl and sit in the corner while every other female can do whatever they want. I am not his property!!!!!

I’m so sorry I’m getting so worked up… but thank you for listening to me, it’s been good to vent. :o:o

November 4, 2010

OP, while certainly this issue is a serious one, some of the male poster's relaxed and humorous responses indicate that, for most men, relationships are supposed to be fun and we enjoy making them fun. Myself, I might be wanting to take a ballroom dancing class with my lady, so she can show off the flexibility she's attained in her pole dancing class. See how that works?

My main worry is the balance of attraction versus want. You want this, and it's reasonable, and you appear to be frustrated with his responses, but does that obviate your *attraction* to him? An interesting question to ask yourself is would you be attracted to a man with a mindset like some of the males posting in your thread; a mindset of 'enjoy yourself and I'll make things fun for your here at home too'. Would that kind of man be attractive to you? It's interesting how stuff works

Personally, I'd just go take the class. No rancor, no arguments. What's he going to do? Leave? Wow, OK...

November 4, 2010

I think any guy who wants to bang slutty types and then marry a nun is out of his mind.

"Lady on the street, but a freek in the sheets" is the ideal.

November 4, 2010

Now that you mention it, it’s not only the pole dancing class but anything I do or wear which is sexy gets the same reaction. Recently (sorry to keep bombarding you with examples!), I told him I’d like to buy a pair of those booty pop underwears… shhh, I have a flat pancake butt ok! hehe The first and only thing he said, after giving me that all too familiar look that he does was “who are you trying to impress?”. Immediate doubt and paranoia at the mere suggestion.

I was 21 when we met, more or less still a kid, and over the past 6.5 years I have grown into a mature, confident woman, who likes to feel sexy every now and then! I feel almost like he is trying to keep me as that naïve 21 year old I was when we met…

It really does seem as if you guys have outgrown one another. He's of a very traditional mold, and, to please him, you're going to have to curb that expression of your sexuality (as utterly innocuous as that expression might be...). When you were 21 and, I would guess, barely in touch with that aspect of yourself, it was no skin off of your back to conform to his wishes. You're further into adulthood now, and as you discover more of yourself he too discovers more of you that he will denounce. The question becomes, as other posters have pointed out: are you willing to sacrifice to this degree to maintain this relationship...better still, is there a compelling reason to maintain this relationship at all?

I found the example you gave of the girls night out debate pretty interesting. If you put yourself in his shoes, his argument tracks logically:

(1.) Women dress attractively only to attract the attention of men.

(2.) If a woman is in a committed relationship, she has no further need to dress attractively.

(3.) If a woman continues to dress attractively, after having entered a relationship, it is because she is on the prowl for another man.

Obviously, there are a thousand holes in this chain of thought, but he isn't capable of seeing them. Thankfully, you do.

November 4, 2010

An interesting question to ask yourself is would you be attracted to a man with a mindset like some of the males posting in your thread; a mindset of 'enjoy yourself and I'll make things fun for your here at home too'. Would that kind of man be attractive to you? It's interesting how stuff works

Oh yes they most definitely would!

The strange thing is, everything else e.g. me going out with my girlfriends until the wee hours of the morning, he is completely fine with. I stumble in at 5am and the next day he is nursing my hangover and asking me if I had a good night! But anytime I show any personal growth he wants to cut me off at the knees!

November 4, 2010

20 years ago if you said you were pole dancing, nobody would speak to you anymore as it was considered degrading.

I used to dance for a living and I had people ask me why I would degrade myself like that. I never thought it was degrading at all. No I wasn't on drugs, molested, or from a broken home either. I was always proud of my dancing. It is kind of like being a little overweight and you are perfectly fine with it but everyone else is not ok with it and they think there is something wrong with you for being ok with it.

So today it is a cool fitness thing lol! How times change!

It seems to me that the real issue has nothing to do with pole dancing but rather him being controlling and insecure.

November 4, 2010

I found the example you gave of the girls night out debate pretty interesting. If you put yourself in his shoes, his argument tracks logically:
(1.) Women dress attractively only to attract the attention of men.
(2.) If a woman is in a committed relationship, she has no further need to dress attractively.
(3.) If a woman continues to dress attractively, after having entered a relationship, it is because she is on the prowl for another man.

Obviously, there are a thousand holes in this chain of thought, but he isn't capable of seeing them. Thankfully, you do.

I REALLY love your posts, PratyekaYana, thanks so much for contributing to my thread. You seem to understand things very well.

That is precisely what he thinks.

November 4, 2010

Hmmm...I'd probably then go online to see how much it would cost to put a stripper pole in the bedroom.

One of my girlfriends took a class, and enjoyed it so much that one day when her hubby came home from work, he found a newly installed pole in his bedroom. He loves it.

November 4, 2010

One of my girlfriends took a class, and enjoyed it so much that one day when her hubby came home from work, he found a newly installed pole in his bedroom. He loves it.

See, that’s what I don’t get! Most normal, red blooded men seem to love it!

Is he really THAT afraid I am going to leave him that the thought of me taking a harmless pole dancing fitness class is enough for him to think it’s ok to treat me this way??

November 4, 2010

In my past I would have had the same reaction that your BF did, but I realized that if I take a second to think about it, you are actually stopping the person from being who they want to be.

Maybe they dont have the same standards of class or what not, maybe to them pole dancing isnt dirty and its fun.

I would realize that there would be no men you'd be grinding on and in fact it would make you feel better about yourself.

But I realized that eventually when you try to control somebody it always blows up in your face.

Just let them do what they want and if you cant deal with it then you leave

Now personally I would love it if she actually used what she learned in class and showed me her moves It would be a major turn on

November 4, 2010

OP, why are you asking about this again and why on Earth are you still with this guy?

From the old thread:

I have to disagree Sivok. It is not about compromise at all. I am not his 16 year old daughter, I am his girlfriend and a grown woman. If I want to go to a party in nothing but nipple coverers I should be able to do it. This is MY life, MY body. He doesn't gain instant ownership of me the minute we become a couple. Of course I wouldn't want to do something like that, but that's just an example.

We have been together for over 6 years now and I have never even come close to cheating. Protective of me? Saying "even the cops wouldn't jump in if 5 guys were raping you" is protective?? Wow I feel so special.

He did the same thing last year when a girlfriend of mine suggested we take a pole dancing class. I was SO excited as I had heard it is great for you in terms of fitness and a bunch of fun with the girls, but he didn't want me to do it. He told me he would be embarassed if his family found out and he said "only sluts and single moms" particpate in things like that. I tried to explain that I wouldn't be dancing there in my thong in front of a bunch of men, but in a hall in my sweats with other girls but he wouldn't have it. It was tacky and that was that. I didn't even end up DOING the class and nearly a year later he is still punishing me with little remarks and jabs anytime anything about pole dancing comes on tv.

Thanks for your input, kdark. This is something I have been wondering about for a while, and the term passive agressive seems to come up a hell of a lot whenever I ask for advice. The thing that bothers me so much is that this is not some insecure kid, the man is 45 years old.

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t234676/

November 4, 2010

In my past I would have had the same reaction that your BF did, but I realized that if I take a second to think about it, you are actually stopping the person from being who they want to be.

Maybe they dont have the same standards of class or what not, maybe to them pole dancing isnt dirty and its fun.

I would realize that there would be no men you'd be grinding on and in fact it would make you feel better about yourself.

But I realized that eventually when you try to control somebody it always blows up in your face.

Just let them do what they want and if you cant deal with it then you leave

Now personally I would love it if she actually used what she learned in class and showed me her moves It would be a major turn on

I had hoped to show him some of the moves! hehe

He is stopping me from who I want to be... he is. And he of course would argue something like “What? You WANT to be a pole dancing stripper?” and try and make me feel downright dirty and low.

But… I see through his manipulation now. It hurts, but I see it.

November 4, 2010

OP, why are you asking about this again and why on Earth are you still with this guy?

From the old thread:

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t234676/

Oh gosh, I had hoped no one would bring up any old threads. I just… over the past few months I have gone through something and… I can’t explain it, I would have preferred to have just dealt with the here and now, that's all. :(

I'm VERY embarassed right now.

November 4, 2010

Oh gosh, I had hoped no one would bring up any old threads. I just… over the past few months I have gone through something and… I can’t explain it, I would have preferred to have just dealt with the here and now, that's all. :(

I'm sorry for bringing it up, then, and I didn't mean to make you uncomfortable, but I think the other things you wrote in that thread add some perspective to this one.

You have to know that this relationship isn't good for you. He's being controlling and abusive. It would be best for you to let go and get healthy, IMO.

November 4, 2010

I'm sorry for bringing it up, then, and I didn't mean to make you uncomfortable, but I think the other things you wrote in that thread add some perspective to this one.

It’s ok, I just… feel like such an idiot!

That was nearly a year ago and here I am still being foolish.

Edited November 4, 2010 by akeshabelle

November 4, 2010

It’s ok, I just… feel like such an idiot!

You're not an idiot and you shouldn't beat yourself up, okay?

You mentioned that he gets upset when you show any personal growth and that he cuts you off at the knees when he sees that. It's hard to walk away from someone like that. I think he does it because when you show any kind of personal growth, it scares him, and he worries that if you grow in any way, you won't want him around anymore, so he attacks you, your self-esteem, your self-worth, until you feel bad enough to stick around.

You deserve better than that.

November 4, 2010

I think he does it because when you show any kind of personal growth, it scares him, and he worries that if you grow in any way, you won't want him around anymore, so he attacks you, your self-esteem, your self-worth, until you feel bad enough to stick around.

How can someone do that to someone else that they claim to love so much? That's not love. Shouldn’t he, by his age, know how to deal with these kinds of things in a relationship?

If he does this now, I am scared of what he might do if I try and leave his life.

November 4, 2010

How can someone do that to someone else that they claim to love so much? That's not love. Shouldn’t he, by his age, know how to deal with these kinds of things in a relationship?

If he does this now, I am scared of what he might do if I try and leave his life.

I would think that he doesn't love you that much if he keeps attacking your self-esteem. I never put my ex down. I always raised her self-esteem because I loved her and wanted what was best for her.

November 4, 2010

umm.. mate, OP said NOTHING about pole dancing being sexy. Pole dancing for fitness is so good for your body and a fun way to get fit. Just like belly dancing, zumba, samba or anything else. And guess what? If it makes you feel sexy while you're doing it, then that's not such a terrible thing.
UF, this is not pole dancing in a strip club, this is pole dancing in a fitness studio. Way to be judgemental.

So... pole dancing isn't sexy... but it makes her feel sexy? That makes no sense.

Bottom line: Stippers don't salsa, or zumba... they pole dance. Some guys have a thing for strippers... if you like pole dancing... go find a guy that likes strippers.

To me, it's fascinating how there is no stigma towards salsa but there is towards pole dancing for fitness. It's funny because salsa, you are grinding up against a man, pole dancing, against a pole... without any men in the room or even watching.
I'm guessing it's because salsa has been around as a form of 'excercise' longer than pole dancing probably has. IMO, they are both art forms and when done with class, look beautiful.

Ugh... really? You honestly can't see a difference between pole dancing and salsa?

Gee... I wonder why they don't have a pole dancing section of "Dancing With The Stars"?

Salsa in public and people will clap if you do it well... Pole dance in public and someones going to shove money down your crotch. Get the difference?

Thanks for all the great responses, guys.
That’s what I thought! Just the thought of doing it made me feel confident and sexy and wonderful!!! Why he wouldn’t want me to feel that, I don’t know..
He has a very closed mind when it comes to things like this. We got into a debate recently when he said he couldn’t understand why a group of women would dress up and go out dancing unless it was to pick up men. Clearly he has never heard of a “girls only” night out. I told him this may come as a SHOCK, but sometimes women do things – wait for it – for themselves. It’s not always about men, believe it or not.

Seriously... because it's going to make HIM feel like your a cheap stripper!

Why does everything have to be all about you, you, you... only about how you feel? How you act and what you do does affect other people. Just running around doing whatever you like is selfish. So... maybe your BF is a douche... but in this instance... he has a valid point!

As for "Girls Night"... I have seen enough "Girls Nights" at clubs and bars to know about 75% of the women involved are seeking male attention.

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